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Archive for Monday, December 12, 2005

Cultural tilts leave Lawrence standing alone more often

December 12, 2005

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It's no secret that Douglas County is a political blue island in a sea of red.

In both of President Bush's national victories, a majority of Douglas County voters supported the Democrat.

But the county is getting more opportunities to prove its blueness in the culture wars.

In April, Douglas County was the only one of Kansas' 105 counties to vote against a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriages. While the amendment was approved 70 percent to 30 percent across the state, it failed in Douglas County, 37 percent to 63 percent.

And in the recent battle before the State Board of Education over the teaching of evolution, a Lawrence Journal-World poll showed Douglas County stood apart from the rest of the state when it came to intelligent design.

In that poll, of those statewide who said they knew what intelligent design was, 54 percent said it should be taught in public schools. In Douglas County, that was 41 percent.

In the Legislature, the Lawrence delegation usually opposes issues on the social conservative radar.

State Rep. Tom Sloan of Lawrence, who is in the minority among House Republicans because he has voted for tax increases for schools, said when the warring wings of the party started firing, he kept his head down.

"I just basically try and focus on public policy-making and constituent services. People of Lawrence look at who the candidate is, and vote for you regardless of party," he said.

John Burch, a Lawrence investor who unsuccessfully tried to persuade the State Board of Education to back off criticizing evolution in public school science standards, said Lawrence politics were different primarily because Lawrence was a university town.

But, he said, the city is "actually a good representation of the mixture that is America."

He said that while Lawrence was often a leader in progressive causes, recent attempts to moderate the social conservative wing of the Republican Party were coming from members of the GOP in western Kansas, who were upset with the education board.

"In this case, Lawrence may become the followers and not the leaders," he said.

Comments

Arminius 8 years, 4 months ago

laughingatallofu:

"So, what's your point? Are you calling the 'average high school graduate' 'not smart'?"

I said just the opposite. I said the average high school graduate is smart enough to know that you don't get out of your car on a rural road after a pickup truck has been tailgating you.

I also would note that the average high school graduate is smart enough to read what I wrote and not determine I wrote something completely different.

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Arminius 8 years, 4 months ago

wendt:

"My methodology with Kevin has been to note contradiction with prior postings or with established fact until he calls a "little turd from Lawrence" or (my favorite and his) 'a funny little man'."

Wouldn't chastising someone for linking to his own web site then promptly linking to your own web site be a contradiction? How about claiming that conservtives are not friends with the truth and then citing conservative Tim Shallenburger as a reference in your KU Med case? (Not to mention that liberal Republican David Adkins serves as KUMC's Vice Chancellor of External Affairs. The A.G. you accuse of participating ina cover-up was also no conservative.)

As far as establishing facts, yesterday you claimed that Republicans called Max Cleland "unpatriotic," mischaracterized my post on Boyles' article concerning Mirecki, cited Al Franken's dubious version of the Wellstone funeral/rally (we've all see the rally with our own eyes on C-SPAN aand Time reported that John Kerry called Trent Lott the following day to apologize for the Democrats who booed Lott and other Republicans at the funeral), lied about "all of our reasons for being there (Iraq) turned out to be false," and lied about al Qaeda not being in Iraq before the invasion. Exactly when have you ever establsihed a fact? Your M.O. here has been to make a bogus claim--such as the Cleland one--and then move on to another bogus claim when someone challenges you on the first.

Your behavior here is fully consistent with the description KU Med offered concerning your demeanor.

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dex 8 years, 4 months ago

does this mean liberals are responsible for good decisions that eventually lead to good things such as a smoking ban that exchanges property rights for ... nothing, roundabout mania and a backflowing sewer?

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laughingatallofu 8 years, 4 months ago

I have elevated my sarcasm to a new level. Time to retire for the night.

Interesting discussion. I'm sure that it won't die soon.

And I believe that ID is "science", too. <<<

Or did I mean... religion---no---science--religion---no---philosophy---no, politics----MYTHOLOGY?---I am so CONFUSED!

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

Naw, that won't work.

My methodology with Kevin has been to note contradiction with prior postings or with established fact until he calls a "little turd from Lawrence" or (my favorite and his) "a funny little man".

Then he has to contradict himself further to attempt to win an argument he has already lost. He realizes this internally but just gets madder with the further application of circular logic.

Then he attempts to ignore me for a couple of call and response cycles in an attempt to demonstrate that I'm not worth talking to.

When this doesn't work, he pulls out KUMC, forgetting that this makes me look good for doing something noble.

See the pattern?

I can describe this, knowing full well that Kevin is reading this, because he will repeat it tomorrow. He has no choice.

It's all he knows. Sophistry. Words without meaning.

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laughingatallofu 8 years, 4 months ago

I am sooo embarrassed! How could I have fallen for this ruse? I am soo naive (oops... sooO). From now on, I will agree with everything that Arminius says.

And I believe that ID is "science", too.

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

Parkay:

If God loves me so much, why did he allow the Devil to sh*t all over Job?

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

Laughingatallofu:

Kevin got you!! He has no point! No point at all.

The assault didn't happen. If it happened, Mirecki wasn't Bruce Lee or that John Brunnell guy from World's Scariest Police Chases. Dr. Mirecki is stupid for calling people (who don't know what religion or science are) stupid. Dr. Mirecki is stupid despite having a PhD from Harvard, tenure and a Department Chairmanship at KU. Dr. Mirecki hates Christianity despite having a PhD in Theology from Harvard.

And round and round it goes.

The point is there is no point.

One could almost call it Zen but Kevin isn't Zen. Kevin is Forrest Gump without the good nature.

Sophistry. That's the word I was looking for. Sophistry.

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Ray Parker 8 years, 4 months ago

Lawrence votes in favor of sodomy and infanticide, and leaves Judge Paula Martin on the bench after she hands out 60-day sentences for gang-raping a child. This is "a good representation of the mixture that is America"? Hardly. This is evidence of brainwashing the voters. But God still loves you and created this universe just for you. Go figure.

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laughingatallofu 8 years, 4 months ago

Arminius,

So, what's your point? Are you calling the "average high school graduate" "not smart"?

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Arminius 8 years, 4 months ago

laughingatallofu:

Mirecki himself acknowledged it was not a smart move.

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laughingatallofu 8 years, 4 months ago

<<< Posted by Arminius (anonymous) on December 12, 2005 at 1:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"Just as I thought....the more educated you are, the better decisions you make. Now, how do we educate the remaining 104 counties?"

That's not always the case. For example, just last week a Harvard Ph.D. got out of his car on a rural road after a pickup truck was tailgating him. I think the average high school graduate would have continued driving into town.

Character assassination apprars to have no limits, does it?

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

Arminius / Kevin:

Remember Kevin, the line is that it didn't happen.

Or if it did happen, Dr. Mirecki hadn't watched enough Jean-Claude Van Damm movies to make the "correct" choices of spinning wheel kick followed by heart punch.

With his shirt off, of course.

They didn't cover "ass-kicking" at Harvard Divinity, where Dr. Mirecki was learning to hate Christianity.

Or was it learning to read Gospels in the original language and then publish books on his findings that Dr. Mirecki was doing at Harvard Divinity?

I'm so confused about this, Kevin......

HAHAHAHAHHAAH

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Baille 8 years, 4 months ago

An anecdote does not an argument make.

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Arminius 8 years, 4 months ago

"Just as I thought....the more educated you are, the better decisions you make. Now, how do we educate the remaining 104 counties?"

That's not always the case. For example, just last week a Harvard Ph.D. got out of his car on a rural road after a pickup truck was tailgating him. I think the average high school graduate would have continued driving into town.

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Marion Lynn 8 years, 4 months ago

heh, heh

he said "psuedoscience"

heh, heh

Thanks.

Marion.

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

kung_pao_chicken:

The reference to Bevis and Butthead was humor.

"Bevis and Butthead" was a cartoon in the Nineties that had two teenagers who behaved in a fashion that indicated that they didn't have a lot going on upstairs, if you know what I mean.

The humor part was based upon the fact that a certain population of this blog was having to defend "knowledge", which should be self-evident, upon inspection, as a "good thing".

A good source of knowledge is "Books".

===

I don't know how the phrase "Idiocies like Intelligent Design / Creationism" suppresses anything.

I'm guessing that you have a problem with the word "Idiocies".

For the umpteenth time: Intelligent Design / Creationism is not science. It is a pseudoscience. If you don't know that, then "idiot" is perhaps strong, but then again, so is trying to screw up my children's school system and trying to get a college professor fired.

By the way, if you declare Intelligent Design / Creationism a religion for the purpose of calling "foul" when someone calls it a pseudoscience, then you confirm your opponent's argument.

If you aren't aware that you are confirming their argument, then you are an idiot.

The shoe fits.

Hence, the urge to dip into Bevis and Butthead for material.

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kung_pao_chicken 8 years, 4 months ago

Wendt, how does, "Huh, huh, You said "Books", huh , huh, huh, huh. Hey, Bevis, pass me the remote, buttmunch!!" advance the argument?

I'm sure you will want to refer me back to your previous post. However, I would suggest that the phrase, "Idiocies like Intelligent Design / Creationism" does more to suppress potential discussion than to advance it.

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Jamesaust 8 years, 4 months ago

Lawrence certainly is liberal but the degree as measured by the state 'gay marriage' vote surprised me. EACH precinct in the city - no matter how 'Republican' in appearance - voted against the measure, not just the city overall.

Using the same election total as a proxy for liberalism in Kansas, it seems to me that liberalism may just as well be the consequence of economic vitality. Even though losing in all other counties, the 'liberal' anti-bigotry vote did quite well in Riley, Saline, Johnson, Lyon, Geary, and Shawnee counties - all dynamic economies (by Kansas standards). In contrast, the race for most bigoted county might have as well been one for most economically backward. Technically, Wichita County near the Colorado border won that race, but the also rans are a 'who's who' of dusty left-behind-ness. (One wonders what the vote totals would have been if they'd included votes from those born in Kansas but moved out-of-state.)

John Burch's observation is apt: Its not Douglas Co. that is out of step with politics, its Kansas out of step with the nation. Since 1920, arguably the high-point of progressive politics in Kansas, the state has lost 40% of its national influence (in Congress and the electoral vote for President). What will be left of Kansas after a similar decline in the 21st century? Who'll listen to Kansas when its last child has moved on to more liberal (a/k/a, economically healthy) regions? When Wichita County (with no more people today than a hundred years ago) falls to less than a thousand residents will it still lead the way to backwardness?

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

bankboy119:

No one here is suppressing your ability to advance an argument.

One of the symptoms of someone who has nothing to say is ad hominem content.

I note this pattern in your postings. Maybe some content to your postings would be well advised if you are to rise above residence in the bullpen of the feverishly incoherent.

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bankboy119 8 years, 4 months ago

"It looks like to me that liberals tend to be better informed, and make smarter decisions."

That was the funniest joke I have heard in a long time.

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one_more_bob 8 years, 4 months ago

Liberal has the Pancake Race. That's 'cultural' and 'creative'.

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average 8 years, 4 months ago

I really do think the educational climate makes a difference. While it may not be as "blue" as Douglas County, Manhattan is more politically moderate and accepting of lifestyle choices than much of Kansas. The College Hill part of Wichita has more "cultural creatives" than the rest of the city. Even Hays is notably more liberal than, say, Liberal or Great Bend.

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Ragingbear 8 years, 4 months ago

It looks like to me that liberals tend to be better informed, and make smarter decisions. No wonder the conservatives want to do things to have Lawrence dissolved into a subdivision of Johnson Co.

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sean 8 years, 4 months ago

I agree with even_money. Look at William Burroughs- could you have imagined him living in Manhattan or Pittsburg, other so-called college towns?

Lawrence is like an oasis with its culture, diversity, places to eat and unique shops. Although I love this big, dumb state I call home, Lawrence is really the only place worth living.

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even_money 8 years, 4 months ago

Travel is also important. I'm not sure of the figures specifically, but a whole lot of folks who've chosen to settle here in the Lawrence vicinity have chosen to do so because they've had a chance to take a critical look at other pastures around the world.

Lawrencians: you're lucky. This is a great place to be.

(asterisk) :)

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mcoan 8 years, 4 months ago

Lawrence has been going against the grain of the rest of the state since 1850. The New England Immigrant Aid Society and others brought in new anti-slavery residents to settle the area. We were surrounded by pro-slavery forces. I think it's reasonable to assume that the original "liberal" attitude of the new immigrants was passed down through generations.

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sean 8 years, 4 months ago

What I find most interesting is that the nicest town in Kansas is also the most liberal.

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

Huh, huh, You said "Books", huh , huh, huh, huh.

Hey, Bevis, pass me the remote, buttmunch!!

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Baille 8 years, 4 months ago

It's not a cultural tilt. It is an educational imbalance.

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classclown 8 years, 4 months ago

This statement bugs me. >>> John Burch, a Lawrence investor who unsuccessfully tried to persuade the State Board of Education to back off criticizing evolution in public school science standards, said Lawrence politics were different primarily because Lawrence was a university town. <<<

Why does everyone try to tie the liberal slant of this area to the fact that there is a university here? There are several other colleges in this state but they appear to be in areas that are decidedly "red". It makes no sense to me that this area is "blue" simply because there is a school here. If that were the case, there would be plenty of other liberal towns across the state.

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bthom37 8 years, 4 months ago

In other news, the sky is blue.

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wendt 8 years, 4 months ago

b_asinbeer:

Good post. You hit the nail on the head.

Idiocies like Intelligent Design / Creationism don't fly in educated environments. They are non-issues. Arguing about the legitimacy of a pseudoscience is as big a waste of time as you can possibly achieve.

The information to be learned itself isn't going anywhere. It exists whether Kansans are aware of it or not.

The change from ignorance to "learned" must come from the Kansans themselves.

Kansans have not felt the impact that ignorance has on their daily lives. Hopefully that revelation will not be too painful when it inevitably comes.

Right now, we are an object of national derision. Some on the blogs express the opinion that they don't care about the drop in State prestige. That is a source of concern.

To paraphrase: "We're stupid and we don't care if you think we're stupid."

Not a good attitude if the State wants to succeed.

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Marion Lynn 8 years, 4 months ago

Well, looking at things around here from a different standpoint, it could be said that Lawrence has more screwballs per square yard than the State Home for The Bewildered.

Thanks.

Marion.

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b_asinbeer 8 years, 4 months ago

Just as I thought....the more educated you are, the better decisions you make. Now, how do we educate the remaining 104 counties?

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