Hate may be veiled but it’s still there

September 23, 2012


This is for Vanessa in South Florida.

She emailed me a few days ago after spotting a bumper sticker that read: 2012 Don’t Re-Nig. “Honestly,” she wrote, “I don’t know how to process my outrage, so I’m handing it off to you. I know that President Obama’s race has always been an issue to many people, and perhaps I live a relatively sheltered life in Democratic-leaning Broward County, but I’m still stunned by the sentiment. I’m even more stunned, naive though that may be, by the fact that some people believe it’s appropriate to flaunt that sentiment — and that it’s not a source of shame.”

Vanessa, I’m afraid I’m not nearly as shocked as you. After all, the sentiment that bumper sticker expresses has been part of the Obama narrative since before he took office.

Some of us grapple with a sense of racial and cultural dislocation, the jolting sensation in a changing nation, that their prerogatives as white people, assumptions so ingrained as to have never previously required the slightest thought, are now in question. They want “their” country back. As the great satirist Randy Newman sings in a new ballad:

“I’m dreaming of a white president

“Just like the ones we’ve always had

“A real live white man who knows the score

“How to handle money or start a war.”

But for others of us, it’s not anything so nuanced as a sense of dislocation — just the same old hate as always.

Either way, the world has changed enough that one cannot openly express such things. So instead, it gets hidden in oblique language, false controversies and putative “jokes.”

But Vanessa — when one in four Americans thinks there’s some mystery over the president’s birthplace, while Mitt Romney (son of a man born in Mexico) and John McCain (born in the Panama Canal Zone) face no such scrutiny; when tea partiers denounce health-care reform as “reparations;” when Rep. Lynn Westmoreland calls Obama “uppity,” then-Rep. Geoff Davis calls him “boy” and Rep. Joe Wilson yells out, “You lie!” during a presidential speech; when Rush Limbaugh says Obama’s election means it’s open season on white kids; when Obama is called a terrorist, a “food stamp president” and a “Chicago thug” — why should “Don’t Re-Nig” come as a surprise? It’s just the next logical step.

One cannot openly express one’s hate — right up till the day one can. Though even then, one may have to delude oneself.

When he was asked about that bumper sticker, Billy Smith of Ludowici, Ga., who manufactured it with his wife, Paula, told a reporter: “We didn’t mean it in a racist way.” The driver of that car would likely have said the same. But they do not lie for our benefit. They lie to conscience — and to self.

So this is the paradigm of our age — self delusion on the one hand, a guy trying to govern on the other, while hemmed in by race, defined in crude, stereotypical imagery, yet unable to fight it, talk about it, or even admit he sees it, for fear of compromising his effectiveness, being dismissed as, God forbid — “an angry black man.”

Yet we hope our way forward anyhow.

There hangs in the White House this photo of the president bowing to allow a little black boy to touch his head. The 5-year-old, his brother and his parents were in the Oval Office with Obama and the boy had a question. “I want to know if my hair is just like yours,” he said, so softly Obama had to ask him to repeat himself. He did, and Obama invited him to see for himself. The boy hesitated.

“Touch it dude!” the president said.

The boy did. So, what do you think?” asked Obama.

“Yes,” said the boy, “it does feel the same.”

That child’s name is Jacob. And Vanessa, while some of us are dreaming of a white president, well .?.?. it’s likely Jacob has some new dreams of his own.

— Leonard Pitts Jr. is a columnist for the Miami Herald. He chats with readers from noon to 1 p.m. CDT each Wednesday on www.MiamiHerald.com.


Maddy Griffin 5 years, 4 months ago

News Flash--Obama fully intends to stay Black for at least the next four years. Get Over It!!

jafs 5 years, 4 months ago

I fully expect conservatives on this board to roundly denounce this bumper sticker if they disagree with it.

Or do those rules only apply to Muslims?

deec 5 years, 4 months ago

They'll likely just attack Pitt for discussing race or try to turn the topic of the thread to something else they don't like about the president.

jafs 5 years, 4 months ago

Or simply ignore the column.

I know, but I felt it necessary to point at the issue anyway.

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

Well, I'm not a conservative and I seldom do ritual denunciations, but to quote the great American philosopher Dave Chapelle, "D@mn, that's racist." Billy Smith of Ludowici, Ga., I denounce thee.

But to set Mr. Pitts' record straight, that old guy from Arizona actually did face such scrutiny, at least one federal lawsuit regarding his eligibility, and had a law professor from UC Davis publish an article called "Why Senator John McCain Cannot Be President: Eleven Months and a Hundred Yards Short of Citizenship" in the Michigan Law Review. The Senate passed a resolution declaring McCain to be a "natural born citizen." http://www.snopes.com/politics/mccain/citizen.asp

Katara 5 years, 3 months ago

I remember McCain's eligibility being questioned because of his place of birth.

Why doesn't the Senate pass a resolution declaring Obama to be a "natural born citizen"? If they can do it for McCain, there really is no reason why they can't do it for Obama.

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

" If they can do it for McCain, there really is no reason why they can't do it for Obama."

Of course they can. They could also pass a law making him a natural born citizen. The whole birther issue is a complete waste of time.

But the point is that Pitts is not even remotely correct in saying that Obama is some lone martyr in this respect, just like the guys who say that no one was ever drawn as Joker like Obama, or no one was ever lied about like Obama. Obama's no martyr and he's no worse treated than any other President. To his credit, he has not claimed such, the accusations of his opponents notwithstanding.

Maddy Griffin 5 years, 3 months ago

Except that McCain is an old white guy who has been in the Senate forever and Obama is not.

ugottabekiddin 5 years, 4 months ago

Excellent article by Mr. Pitts. Thank you. This is just one of a thousand remarks and actions by people who want him out of the White House. Obama is an incredible person to continue with such strength, grace, and focusing on what is right, whereas 99.9% of us would be a bunch of whining babies if we were the target of such immature acts. Barack Obama has set an example to his daughters and ALL OF US as to how to rise above insults and lies and get on with attempting to do good and right.

deec 5 years, 4 months ago

It went back to the shadow. That was quick.

jhawkinsf 5 years, 4 months ago

Or you're just trying to rationalize a comment that should not have been made. Either or.

pizzapete 5 years, 4 months ago

If the guy that made the 2012 Don’t Re-Nig bumper sticker didn't mean it in a racist way, how exactly did he mean it? It doesn't really make any sense otherwise. Does this guy know the meaning of the word renege?

gbulldog 5 years, 4 months ago

Is Obama following Hitler's modle?

Hitler was part Jew. Look what he did to the Jews.

Obama is half white. Look how he is using racism to promote his agenda. What is his true agenda? Divide and destroy anyone who has something he wants?

I was going to say poor and rich, but isn't Obama rich considered rich compared to the rest of us. Michelle sure spends it like he is or is the Gorvernment paying for her and her childrens lavish life style. Just look at the cost of clothing she is wearing. Probably not from a thrift store.

gbulldog 5 years, 3 months ago

How did the slave masters treat their slaves. They lived the "good life" upon the backs of slaves. Now how Obama is reating blacks. Promises. Promises and things get worse for the blacks. Higher unemployment even amoung those with college degrees, hight percentage of blacks in jails, high murder rates for blacks, absentee fatherhood for blacks, etc. You say that you can not say that Obama is at fault, but the Democratic party led by Obama have policies that treat blacks like little children who are unable are smart enough to take care of themselve. Because the Democratic party has failed, they try and shift blame to the Republican and rewrite History. During the 50's and 60's the Republican party was at the forefront of the Civil Right legislative fight (don't believe me - just look at who was filibustering). During the 60s Johnson and the "War on Proverty" tried to help, but most of the programs treated black like little children unable to care for them selves. Yes a lot of black were able to fight the systems and become educated. However a great number became addicted and social life whent to "hell".

So shove your "racist comments" and treat races as capable men and women, who given the the proper treatment and encouragement can achieve great goals for themselves and their families. Remember the men in "Red Tails, George Washington Carver, many artists and performer, and remember those who went to work everyday to support their families, their communities, and their church. May God bless each and every race and grant them the courage to deal with "Horse Pucky" Politicians who use them for political advantage. As for Barry, he reminds me of "tokens' promoted for his color to keep the ACLU from suing you. Well intentions, but illequiped to perform his duties.

Terry Sexton 5 years, 4 months ago

Tell me, Mr. Straw man, how is President Obama using racism to promote his agenda? And while you're at it, let's hear some more about his family's lavish style. A thousand pardons we don't make the President of the United States of America travel on stand-by.

Hitler's model? Really? You are childish & offensive.

Flap Doodle 5 years, 4 months ago

No more offensive than the disappointed progressives that use the term "Taliban" to describe those who don't agree with their beliefs.

Terry Sexton 5 years, 4 months ago

Agreed. Generalized insults happen all across the political landscape. They're all counter-productive.

pizzapete 5 years, 4 months ago

W. already has a patent on the worst ever shirt.

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

"Is Obama following Hitler's modle?"

In a word, "No."

And for the record, Hitler wasn't Jewish, not even a little. He was not "part Jew," nor a secret Jew, nor a self-hating Jew, nor a Jew-hating Jew. The rumor that he was Jewish (or "part Jew") is wholly without historical basis.

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 4 months ago

Admitting you are a racist must be difficult.

Liberty275 5 years, 3 months ago

Using your antiquated term, "racist", I think the Asian "race" is superior to the European "race".

It's not so bad.

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 3 months ago

Whoa, buddy. That comment was for one who is disappeared.

Armstrong 5 years, 4 months ago

I would go along with Lenny on the majority of what he has to say in this article. You have to figure at some point in time the mullet headed, tattoo covered, toothless white trash is going to chime in on politics. I give them as much attention as the religious bigots posting this morning.

headdoctor 5 years, 4 months ago

Yes, they will chime in on politics. Some think it is entertainment and some are just desperately seeking attention. Not all lower income Republicans are mullet headed, tattoo covered, toothless white trash. There are several that can't stand the sight of a mullet cut or tattoos and they still have most of their teeth. What they are lacking is more income and an education. Of course once they get an education they may not be voting Republican.

tomatogrower 5 years, 4 months ago

Some of them are elected officials, like Akins in Missouri. People like him used to be the nutcase on the corner, now they hold positions of power. That's what's scary.

Paul R Getto 5 years, 4 months ago

Good points. Other countries call names. We need to get to work solving problems and cut out the junior high locker room crap.

esteshawk 5 years, 4 months ago

You never saw that movie, did you? Perhaps you should Do The Right Thing and try to understand before you troll out one-liners

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

"Both Hitler and Obama wrote ghost-written autobiographies"

How does one write a ghost-written autobiography? As for the rest of the rant, seriously Bro, I know it's early but I suggest a bubble bath and a glass of wine. You'll feel better.

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

For the record, LarryNative, I was not responding to you but to an (apparently banned) user named LRonHoover who posted some tripe about Obama and Hitler, and my response got tagged to your post. Sorry for any confusion.

Abdu Omar 5 years, 4 months ago

Arabic refers to a language not a people.

headdoctor 5 years, 4 months ago

Daily Caller, Steven Crowder, and Bill Maher, Really, really?

Getaroom 5 years, 4 months ago

Clearly what WristTwister has to say is simply not true because it was obvious to everyone that it didn't matter in the case of Bush/Palin, universally, they were both disliked by a majority of Americans.

And WristTwister is a prime example of pure unadulterated racism. So much so in fact, it would appear that someone has taken on a new screen name. Always the Pitt's hater and it shows, great job being 'out there' with your Pitt's Hatred! That is something to proud of by golly.

Like Willard Romney and his past taxes.

Armstrong 5 years, 4 months ago

Sounds like WristTwister struck a nerve with the party of acceptance and understanding. Look in the mirror scarecrow

jafs 5 years, 4 months ago

So far, one post clearly denouncing the license plate, but not from a conservative.

And, one post with general support, but no clear denunciation, from a conservative.

I wonder why the rules are so different when it comes to Muslims, who are expected to clearly and strongly denounce actions they find offensive by other Muslims?

If you're conservative, and you find this license plate offensive, and not representative of your views, why is it so hard to just say that?

jaywalker 5 years, 4 months ago

Here's to hoping someone "detaches" that guys' bumper. Not that it needs explanation, but it would be just if it was one of those stickers where the entire face changes when it's moved slightly, and the separate message would be "There's an ass!@$! driving this car."

Mike Ford 5 years, 4 months ago

fossick, Adolf Hitler was part Tunisian and Sephardic Jew. The Sephardic Jewish people were chased out of Spain during the Crusades. This information was in an article I read last year. I love how the posters use Daily Caller as a reference on here.....propaganda isn't fact. I'm actually on the Daily Caller's list serve as a Democrat so I can go on there and directly refute this kind of nonsense. I'm not afraid of you or the nonsense some of you speak.....it makes me feel sad for you that you bring up this New Black Panther nonsense when I saw the Klan as a child in Ocean Springs, MS in 1978 collecting donations in boots at the intersection of US 90 and MS 57. I saw the Mennonite Choctaw Church the Klan burned down after the Choctaws told the FBI where the murdered civil rights workers burned wagon was in 1963 near the Choctaw Nunih Waiya mound and the nearby swamps near Bok Chito, MS. This scene was played out in the Mississippi Burning movie I watched last night. As a four year old child my father and I stood at the Lorraine Motel in Memphis, TN where MLK was killed six years after it happened. Some of you are really pathetic arguers with really weak statements. I guess everyone gets fifteen minutes right?

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

"Adolf Hitler was part Tunisian and Sephardic Jew"

No, he wasn't. Hitler was Austrian. His maternal grandfather is unknown, and it is through this that rumors of his Jewish ancestry arose. But as it has never been established who his grandfather was, to state with any certainty that he was a Jew is unsupportable.

It was at one time rumoured that his grandmother worked for a Jewish family is Graz and bore a child through the patriarch, but as is the case with rumors, it turns out that the grandmother was probably never in Graz. There were also no Jews in Graz until the 1860s, making them too late in any case. As The Straight Dope concludes, "chances are it's all a crock." http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/797/was-hitler-part-jewish

Yes, there was an article in Huffington Post about the DNA tests done in 2010, and even it concluded "But the research doesn't seem to be conclusive with respect to which groups Hitler may have descended from." Hitler had the chromosome Haplogroup E1b1b1, which while common in Jews, is not unique to them. Of course, by the time it got to Newser, he was both Jewish and Black: http://www.newser.com/story/98810/hitler-was-jewish-dna-test-reveals.html

While we are all mixed if one goes back far enough, to claim that Hitler was Jewish based on rumours and inconclusive science is pushing the data too far.

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

I do, historians do, Tuschkahouma does. Hitler cared enough to have his own ancestry charted - which perhaps ironically led to the rumours about his grandmother in the first place - and had a law passed stating that he was not Jewish.

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 4 months ago

We are all related, actually. Mitochondrial Eve was our mother. Guess which continent we all come from?

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 4 months ago

What a silly thing to say. By your logic, I can be certain your omittance of mention of the klan suggests to me you are a klan sympathizer.

George Lippencott 5 years, 4 months ago

I sometimes wonder when I read another of Mr. Pitt’s articles bemoaning bigotry in our world whether he is contributing to the solution or aggravating the problem. In my lifetime we have moved from “massive resistance” to a much more diverse and tolerant world. Certainly we are not where most of us would have us be but this process is a journey not an event. Perhaps Mr. Pitts could periodically acknowledge the progress made as a balance to his seeming focus on the road still to go.

Fossick 5 years, 4 months ago

"I sometimes wonder ...whether he is contributing to the solution or aggravating the problem."

Neither, he's using it for political gain. Pitts' objective is to get you to agree to the undeniable - in this case, there's a racist named Billy living in Georgia. From there, he'll try to get you to believe that because racism exists (undeniable) therefore racism is the underlying emotion/motivation/action of his political opponents. A guy in GA says "re-nig" and denies it's racial, so when a guy says "Chicago" or "skinny" or opposes Obama's plan for (whatever) he's lying about it being racial, too.

Pitts' entire gig is to de-legitimatize political opposition by tying that opposition to an irrational emotion. He's not trying to make the problem better, for if it went away, he'd have no tools left in his toolbox.

jonas_opines 5 years, 3 months ago

I agree with at least part of your sentiment there, but stop the line at political gain. I think it's so simple as this is his career, as a writer, and this topic is how he's gained notice and success. Much like Will being erudite, Thomas being evangelical, and Krauthhammar being nationalist, they won't deviate from the formula that has, apparently, brought them attention and success.

Liberty275 5 years, 4 months ago

Hatred is protected by the constitution. Speech based on hatred is protected. You cannot legislate thought.

OTOH, discrimination in some official (and by that I mean not acting as an individual) sense, public or private, based on bigotry is mostly illegal and violence always is - and it's getting a little better all the time. Equality is always on the horizon, we will never get there, but we will get closer.

We all have the capacity to respect each other as equals, but we are still learning how.

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 4 months ago

I agree with you, but would like to add that racism is a by- product of religion and capitalism. Where do you see an end to capitalism or religion? I have to disagree with Pitts in that the hate is " veiled " , especially since 2008 and through this election cycle.

George Lippencott 5 years, 4 months ago

Religion and capitalism?? Where doers that come from??

jafs 5 years, 4 months ago

I guess I'll have to conclude that the vast majority of conservatives who post on here don't find this offensive, since they have failed to criticize/denounce it.

That's quite unfortunate.

Or, if that's not true, then they have some sort of reasons for not doing that - if that's the case, then they should consider whether Muslims who don't denounce radical Muslims might have some sort of reasons for that as well.

George Lippencott 5 years, 4 months ago

Exactly what are you expecting from conservatives? In this space they are almost a null set.

Mike Ford 5 years, 4 months ago

wristtwister....my comment suggests you're full of it......

Armstrong 5 years, 4 months ago

Must be a slow day in lib land. All the prodding and baiting here to try and start a fight and no takers. Quick, tange go post something clever from youtube ! Go, hurry !

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

We do need to stick with the black one, but not because he is black. It is because he saved the American economy, ended the Iraq war, and killed Osama bin Laden.

It is not good to switch boats midstream, especially if the boat you are on is sturdy and true and the one you could switch to is decrepit and taking on water, having almost ruined the American economy just three and a half years earlier.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

His finger was on the trigger?? I thought a member of our military killed Osama as directed in orders that came from Mr. Obama

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

I have always been in awe of Obama's ability to be the target of direct racism, in his face, and to still move forward constructively with those who spew at him.

I imagine it must be very frustrating for the racists.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Is that term all that is left in your toolbox. Anybody who opposes anything Mr. Obama advocates is a racist?

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

No. People who sport "Don't re-nig" bumperstickers and those who do not condemn them for it are racists.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

How do you condemn it if you are unaware of it.?? When tea party people were generalized as racist why did the liberals not rise up? Perhaps the term is being exploited for political advantage? You think?

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Perhaps you would like to quantify your overwhelmingly broad statement

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

See my above response for a "quantification".

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Where?? Are all conservatives racist? Perhaps 50%? Maybe 10%, Maybe a few wing nuts?

Liberty275 5 years, 3 months ago

I was always sort of impressed at how Bush did what he thought was right in the face of utter hatred day and night. He allowed people their say but never condemned them or made lite of their concerns. He was as tolerant as Obama of those that hated him.

You don't campaign for the position because you want friends. Being hated is part of the job. Obama is as good at it as any other president I've seen.

verity 5 years, 3 months ago

Jafs, I think you made your point. I'm sure we've heard the last of the demand that all Muslims be responsible for what one Muslim does.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Must all conservatives be responsible for what a wing nut in Georgia says?

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

"Are all conservatives racist? Perhaps 50%? Maybe 10%, Maybe a few wing nuts?"

No, just those who sport "don't re-nig" bumper stickers and those who apologize for them.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

And how many is that? How do we know they are conservative? Just maybe they are just plain racist of no particular political persuasion?

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

Observant is correct: the average racist is conservative. But it's because liberals' racism is overlooked by those who count racist beans. If Romney had said some of the things that Joe Biden has said (e.g. Obama is the "first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy, ” or how you can't go into a 7-11 unless you have a "slight Indian accent") or Harry Reid ("light-skinned" and no "negro dialect") he'd be run out of town. And it was not a conservative who said "there's white n!ggers" on TV.

Liberals get a pass on their racism - no matter how racist they are, they're not considered racist by the racist police because they vote right, er, left. That means all the remaining racists are, by definition, conservative.

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

"Racism" is something of a contraction of "racialism," which is Brit and South African of the late 19th century. The current word comes from "racisme" (French) and was applied in the context of German racial theorizing. So it's European, but is wonderfully applied to American politics because of our collective guilt in our crappy treatment of blacks for 3 centuries.

Kathy Theis-Getto 5 years, 3 months ago

Fossick. Dig a little deeper than wiki. I would suggest an etymology dictionary, then some heavy reading. Racism is an intentional social construct to serve specific purposes, religion, capitalism.......

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

"1932 as a noun, 1938 as an adjective, from race (n.2); racism is first attested 1936 (from Fr. racisme, 1935), originally in the context of Nazi theories. But they replaced earlier words, racialism (1871) and racialist (1917), both often used early 20c. in a British or South African context. " http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=racist

Sorry, Kathy, if I was any closer to the etymology dictionary, I'd have to pay them a royalty.

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

Racism: a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

Example 1: Obama is smart and a black guy: not racist.

Example 2: Obama is smart for a black guy: racist.

Of course, if you have your own private definition of racism, there does not seem to be any reason the rest of us ought to take that any more seriously than we would take your own personal definition of the color blue.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

What is an average racist? Uses slurs but avoids violence?? Perhaps you can help wiht a source for your fact that the average racist is conservative.

notaubermime 5 years, 3 months ago

White supremacists have a tendency to take strong anti-immigrant stances (especially hispanic immigrants), be against gay rights, and support religion in public discourse. I do not think that it is any stretch to say that this tends to align them more closely with religious conservatives than any other political category.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Lots of broad brush ranting but no one has provided any source for the statement that the average racist is conservative!! Could that be because once again a portion of this space needs to demonize others and in such pursuit hardly considers the accuracy of their charges.

Do we hate conservatives or just consider them misguided??

Fossick 5 years, 3 months ago

"Do we hate conservatives or just consider them misguided??"

Accusations of racism are neither - they are a way to write off opposing opinions without considering them. If you can reduce an opinion to a non-rational cause, the opinion becomes non-rational and thus unworthy of consideration.

For example, if I were to say, "The South had no right to secede in 1861," we could have a rational discussion of the legal theories behind secession, secession's relationship to the 1776 rebellion, and all sorts of other items of interest. However, if you don't want that discussion, the way to avoid it is to respond, "You're only saying that because you're from Boston." To assign my opinion to some factor beyond rationality - my city of origin - means you do not have to consider it. It's a wonderful defensive mechanism for those people who stress when their beliefs are challenged.

Now, bringing it back to race, it's applied in all sorts of manners. Let's say that I propose to eliminate affirmative action in hiring. It's possible that I honestly believe that the best way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race, and we could discuss that rationally. But if you are a proponent of Affirmative Action and wish to get rid of my troublesome opinion instead of discussing it, then the easiest way to do so is to say, "you only oppose Affirmative Action because you are a racist." That changes the discussion from a reasonable one about methods for achieving a social goal to one about my alleged moral shortcomings. And it's a d@mned effective way to shortchange discussion, which is why it's done.

Show me a person who makes every disagreement a moral shortcoming of his opponent, and I'll show you someone who, despite all the protestations, is really not all that interested in rational discussion.

jafs 5 years, 3 months ago

That may be true in some cases, but it's also true that many people still hold racist ideas, I'd say.

Sometimes they're expressed openly, but other times they're expressed in more indirect ways.

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

Yes JAFS but I don't think many of us are arguing against that.

I would suggest that we probably would have real trouble agreeing to what is in fact racist as the example above suggests.

What ever happend to my initial question. Should there not be some acknowledgement of progress made before we again drink from the bitter cup of our failures.

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 3 months ago

Let's remember that we are talking about people who sport "Don't re-nig" bumper stickers and those who defend them, not about those who disagree with affirmative action or the civil war.

Armstrong 5 years, 3 months ago

Did you see my tax returns ??? Happy now ?

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

How many of them are conservative and how many haven't a clue?? I am challenging the argument that the average racist is conservative - where is the source??

Mike Ford 5 years, 3 months ago

I just protested Lynn Jenkins in Baldwin and I can tell you from firsthand experience that conservatives love doing and saying racist things to push people's buttons or to see how much nonsense they can get away with saying before the r word is drawn. One person baited another with code language concerning the ID nonsense and it almost got heated. Why don't conservatives try to win the game fairly.....only cheaters need to win by using ID laws and voting district gerrymandering right Tom Delay???? Poll taxes and ID laws when no real concrete proven fraud exists..... the South in the 1960's and the denial of now.....don't tell me there's a difference.....

George Lippencott 5 years, 3 months ago

At the end of the day we never addressed the question about progress but once again belabored the lack of it

Apparently we hate conservatives as we seem unable to support the contention that the average conservative is a racist. You know one can hate people for many reasons. Hate is hate.

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