Archive for Tuesday, August 7, 2012

Conservatives appear to be taking control of state Senate

August 7, 2012

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— Gov. Sam Brownback, the billionaire Koch brothers, Kansas Chamber of Commerce and Kansans for Life combined to help defeat a slew of moderate Republican Senate candidates on Tuesday.

Conservative Republicans appeared ready to take over control of the Kansas Senate.

Fueled by huge donations from Wichita-based Koch Industries, and Wichita oilman David Murfin, the Kansas Chamber PAC reported spending nearly $650,000 on conservative candidates in the last 3 1/2 weeks of the campaign.

And that amount didn't include mailers sent out by Koch-founded Americans for Prosperity, which doesn't have to report expenditures on its political activity because it is a tax-exempt "social welfare" organization.

Moderates received support from teachers, bi-partisan unions and gaming interests.

Incumbent moderates Senate President Steve Morris of Hugoton, Tim Owens of Overland Park, Roger Reitz of Manhattan, Bob Marshall of Fort Scott, Dwayne Umbarger of Thayer, Pete Brungardt of Salina, Dick Kelsey of Goddard, Jean Schodorf of Wichita and Ruth Teichman of Stafford were defeated Tuesday. Two more conservatives won seats held by moderates who are retiring.

The wins by conservatives are likely to overturn a bi-partisan coalition of moderate Republicans and Democrats in the Senate that has been able to thwart some of Brownback's agenda.

The bipartisan coalition in the Senate had prevented conservatives from lessening labor unions' political influence, remaking appellate courts and establishing a 401(k)-style pension plan for new public employees.

Having conservatives in charge of the Senate could mean more restrictions on abortion, anti-labor legislation and a "religious preservation" bill that critics said would have allowed discrimination against gays and lesbians.

Comments

kernal 3 years, 6 months ago

I thought Kansans were smarter than this. Guess I was wrong.

riverdrifter 3 years, 6 months ago

I did not. Sheep. Suckers for the sound byte.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

Cody is a lousy, rotten spammer posting lousy, rotten spam.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

The last sane one out, please turn off the lights.

KS 3 years, 6 months ago

Go for it, but it gets a little cold up there.

Ribs61 3 years, 6 months ago

Not once global warming really kicks in. ;-)

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

The coups d'état continues as kansas' free fall continues. This will all be reversed but the tragedy is how much more damage these selfish anti people right wing thugs will cause for the quality people of the state of Kansas. Time to fight back and take our state back from these thugs.

sourpuss 3 years, 6 months ago

All their money would buy them nothing at all if people wouldn't vote for them. These views have support in Kansas. If you don't like them, you should move elsewhere. Leave Kansas to the crazies and the dust.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Turnout was 12% in Douglas County.

Perhaps the other 88% should be heard.

Matthew Herbert 3 years, 6 months ago

Perhaps the other 88% should have voted if they wanted to be heard. No one to blame but yourself if your voice was silenced

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

I generally agree, and vote myself.

I was responding to the "these views have support in KS" comment.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm always amused at the "chest beating" mentality that if someone doesn't like what you do they can just move. I would hate to be a fire hydrant in your vicinity.

It really draws emphasis to the selfishness that comes with the radical right wing extremists. Moderates would not suggest that if you don't like what they think you should just move. They would try to come up with a compromise in which they would understand that they might have to give something up for all to get along.That brings emphasis to the radical right wings unwillingness to compromise. Your a bunch of hate filled selfish liars.

asixbury 3 years, 6 months ago

How about the religious thugs...I mean conservative republicans... that want to force their beliefs on everyone? As seen in the many religious-based initiatives they have already proposed. Several of which were mentioned in the article above.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

Were going to have a contest as to how many people can guess how many other monikers you have posted under. You are the definition of "troll". 56 posts on this thread and counting out of 300 posts on this thread alone. I know who you are.

Carol Bowen 3 years, 6 months ago

Why so many references to Chicago thugs. Has there been a marathon of Al Capone movies on cable? The only difference between Chicago and elsewhere is that Chicago's history is out in the open.

Clearly4Kansas 3 years, 6 months ago

Just like the liberal newspaper editorials said - this election is a mandate on the Govenor - and Kansans spoke loud and clear. It sounds like the Reagan republicans will win around 28 seats, the rinos around 6 seats and the democrats 6 seats in November.

JayhawkFan1985 3 years, 6 months ago

These are not Reagan republicans. They are closer to Nazis. Yes, I'm mean nazis.

Clearly4Kansas 3 years, 6 months ago

Nazis were a national socialistic party. Socialists. Centralized control. Sounds like the nazis are democrats to me.

tolawdjk 3 years, 6 months ago

And the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is neither Democratic nor a Republic.

question4u 3 years, 6 months ago

The Nazis sent homosexuals to concentration camps. Hitler's anti-communist rhetoric in the 1930s drove Stalin to propose an alliance between the Soviet Union and the West against the Nazis. The Nazis wanted to purify the German population racially. The Nazis were strident militaristic nationalists. In 1943 the Nazis made abortion for Aryan women a capital crime.

So, in your view, are Democrats anti-gay, anti-communists who are against multiculturalism, who wave the American flag with patriotic fervor and who advocate the death penalty for anyone performing an abortion? After all, the Nazis used the word socialismus in their party title.

What's the matter with Kansas? You've illustrated it in a nutshell.

Jim Johnson 3 years, 6 months ago

Typical lib response Clearly4Kansas, they never let the facts get in their way

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

You display complete ignorance about the history of the Nazi Party and their political philosophy.

The only reason they have the word "socialist" in their name is because before they came to power, the true socialists in Germany had many more supporters than the fascists did, and they were just trying to steal their votes. Calling themselves "socialist" is about as honest and accurate as Fox News calling themselves "fair and balanced."

Once they came to power, they adopted purely fascist policies, and thousands of real socialists were jailed and even exterminated in concentration camps.

Not that you're the slightest bit interested in actual facts.

boltzmann 3 years, 6 months ago

Uh, no. Just because someone puts something in their name, doesn't mean it is true. Communist East Germany was the German Democratic Republic, so by your logic they were a democracy. The Nazis put the word "socialists" in their name for propaganda purposes. Under the Nazi regime, socialists, communists and social democrats were persecuted. There was initially a left-leaning faction of the Nazi party, but that was purged during the "Night of the Long Knives".

So you are wrong.

Patricia Davis 3 years, 6 months ago

How much more centrally control can you get with the evangelical idea they have a write to control a woman's uterus?

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

These are not Reagan Republicans. Reagan wouldn't be elected as a Republican in this current philosophical climate. He raised taxes. He expanded the debt. He didn't mind homosexuals. The list goes on.

sourpuss 3 years, 6 months ago

Anyone bragging on Reagan can get out of my car. He was one of the five worst presidents in American history. His economic politics were pure madness, his escalation of the Cold War was idiotic, and he allowed his friends to loot the national treasury. This isn't even a matter of political ideology. Reagan was a BAD president. Period.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

Sageon, jump to conclusions much? I was 18 when Reagan was elected the first time, and remember things quite clearly.

There's no question that Reagan signed into law a tax cut in 1981. There's also no question that in 1982 "The Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act raised an average of $47 billion in each of the four years after it was enacted." http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-16/why-reagan-raised-taxes-and-we-should-too-echoes.html

I recall quite well what Republicans were like in the 1980s versus what they're like now. And they are in no way the same thing. They claim to follow in Reagan's footsteps, but in reality have little of Reagan's smarts, ability to compromise with other political beliefs, and to not be crazed ideologues.

I'm not, then, rewriting history, but rather appreciating it in full, and not selectively, through a partisan lens.

I'd take Reagan over the current ideological radicals any day.

Carol Bowen 3 years, 6 months ago

There were six tax increases under president Reagan and twice checks were sent out to taxpayers in an effort to stimulate the economy.

William Weissbeck 3 years, 6 months ago

You might as well call yourselves Robert Taft Republicans. It's no more accurate than calling yourself a Reagan Republican. For all his bluster, Reagan, like Goldwater, believed in good government, not no government, and most of all they avoided social issues. Goldwater was a classic Western Libertarian. The current crop of Kansas GOP has been infected by all the bad aspects of Carrie Nation, John Brown and Wm. Jennings Bryan. They are simply a radical plague of locusts. Once the crops disappear, so will the locusts, leaving desolation behind.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Reagan also tripled the national debt during his time in office.

And, presided over some serious deregulation that led to the savings and loan mess, which resulted in a nice government bailout for them.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

  1. Absolutely - should we ignore his actual record?
  2. Name calling is a poor substitute for discussion and debate, and if you continue in that vein, I'll just ask you to stop responding to my posts.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Ok - please stop responding to my posts.

I have posted on line for quite a while now, and without resorting to name calling.

For the record, I am not liberal across the board - I believe in some classically conservative ideas, and some libertarian ones, as well as some liberal ideas.

bearded_gnome 3 years, 6 months ago

YES!

sweep out the mooshy moderates.


Moderates received support from teachers, bi-partisan unions and gaming interests.

"moderates" should read "liberals" or "valueless."


and as to "thug" reffed by ranting liberal desperation above, we saw the union thuggery in Wisconsin, and Scott Walker still survived that.

we know the ChicagObama values of thuggery, throwing out race hate by your surrogates, all the while preaching civility.

look in the mirror.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

You have no clue what your ranting about, just beating your chest and showing how shallow you are. It is the lack of intelligence and total disregard for other people that drives you. You and the rest of your evil doers will get your comeuppance but fortunately for you the people you will then have to deal with aren't as mean spirited and hateful as you are.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I've heard Vancouver is nice. You can get directions from MapQuest. Toodles and take bozo and tushehoma with you.

1southernjayhawk 3 years, 6 months ago

Funny.....and I couldn't agree more. Merrill this would be a good time for you to follow your friends out of the state.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

Wouldn't you like for us to give up that easy. As I stated, you and your ilk will get your comeuppance and then those you hate will supply you with your diapers.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

"Wouldn't you like for us to give up that easy."

Why wouldn't you?

"you and your ilk"

My ilk are libertarians. Once we run you off, then we'll work on the conservatives.

chootspa 3 years, 6 months ago

Libertarians have given up personal liberty in order to get some preferred fiscal policies under the mistaken notion it's a good trade-off. I used to dig some the ideas way back when, but now I have no respect for libertarians at all.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

Your definition of "thuggery" has little to do with reality.

bearded_gnome 3 years, 6 months ago

Kansas should have a conservative house and a conservative senate.

its population is certainly majority conservative. just a few pockets of liberal infection sprinkled around. [smirk]

Katara 3 years, 6 months ago

Wow. Each time you come back, you are nastier than before.

What happened that made you so hateful?

verity 3 years, 6 months ago

As I stated below, these are not conservatives.

And perhaps you are the one who should look in the mirror.

average 3 years, 6 months ago

The state and nation continue the walk to the right. Dole and Kassebaum were co-sponsors of a health insurance bill in 1994 that had state exchanges and an individual mandate. Now, even the Democrats in Kansas shy away from that position.

Any chance that, say, Schodorf and/or Abrams end up on a Democratic ticket in a couple of years? It's not like the Democrats have anyone with the tiniest name recognition to run. I'm betting most 'non-Brownback' people in Kansas can't name a single Kansas Democrat, and that includes most of the people who voted for Tom Holland. Their last several 'names' have been exiled 1990s-style-Republicans... probably room for some more.

rtwngr 3 years, 6 months ago

Dole and Kassebaum were part of the problem that we now have. Go along to get along. Spend us into oblivian.

verity 3 years, 6 months ago

Those people are not conservative. Conservative means resistant to change, tending to maintain existing views. Those people want to take us back to the dark ages---reactionary would be a more descriptive word---where the wealthy ruled and controlled pretty much everything and most of the rest lived in poverty and had very few rights and you damn well better belong to the right religion. Church and state intermingled and both were exceedingly corrupt. Sound familiar?

We appear to be getting the best government money can buy. Taking back our power is not going to be easy---we have given it away by not paying attention and not voting. Money rules and the extreme appears to have more incentive to vote. One race in my district was won/lost by 11 votes. There is still the November election. It's not over yet.

The final results appear to be in and moderate Republican Carolyn McGinn has beat Gary Mason 55% to 45% in Senate District 31. He was supported by the entities listed above and lied shamelessly about McGinn's record. She called him on it.

Katara 3 years, 6 months ago

You are so very right about these folks not being conservative. They are not even remotely close to conservative. Reactionary is definitely a much better word to describe them.

parrothead8 3 years, 6 months ago

And Kansas continues its descent into irrelevance.

Armstrong 3 years, 6 months ago

How can this be ? Rothy beating the R's up daily in the paper ( most days multiple articles). The usual suspects daily rants about how horrid the R's are. Yet still the moderates and D's got hammered. The blue dot is getting smaller as reality sets in. November should be brutal

verity 3 years, 6 months ago

This is an anonymous quote from another online news outlet, so I can't attribute it, but it pretty much says it all.

"The radical right have made their choice, and their choice is to support the person most likely to abandon sensible positions, stop working with anyone with even slightly different positions, and pander shamelessly to the most extreme contingencies within his party."

asixbury 3 years, 6 months ago

Examples? I cannot think of any liberals not willing to work with opposing political parties. Enlighten me, please.

Acey 3 years, 6 months ago

I hope you are NOT a Kansas football coach.

JackMcKee 3 years, 6 months ago

A single party dictating political policy has always historically turned into an unmitigated disaster. This is very troubling for the future of the state.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Turnout in Douglas County was 12%.

Topple 3 years, 6 months ago

Keep bringing that up. Are you suggesting the 12% that vote are a misrepresentation of the Kansas population? Only the conservatives are voting so of course they win! Give me a break.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

I will keep bringing it up anytime people say ridiculous things like "the silent majority has spoken", thanks.

Or the "majority of Kansans".

With a 12% turnout, we have no idea really what the majority of Kansas think or want.

However, even R have said that low turnouts favor conservatives, which strongly suggests that KS is a more moderate state.

rtwngr 3 years, 6 months ago

@JackMcKee - You mean like ramming through ObamaCare even though the majority of the country opposed it? It's typical of the left to cry "foul" when the Birkenstock is on the other foot, eh?

Kate Rogge 3 years, 6 months ago

The majority of the country elected President Obama because they wanted health care reform, and we are happy to have it.

Clearly4Kansas 3 years, 6 months ago

Jack - how can democrats rebuild your party? The democrat leadership in KS is more interested in re-registering democrats to help rinos than building up the democratic party. When it comes to building a democratic movement your leadship has disengaged. Democrats need immediate and drastic change.

Bob Forer 3 years, 6 months ago

Come January our state government will be lead by reactionaries, which is quite paradoxical as in my humble opinion, most Kansans, while generally conservative, are moderate and not reactionary.

'The problem is not with the Democratic Party. Historically, democrats have been mostly irrelevant in Kansas, just as Republicans used to be irrelevant in the South. The root cause can be traced back to the Civil War, when the slavers voted Democrat and the anti-slavery crowd, lead by Lincoln, voted Republican. The fact that Southern red necks continued to support the Democratic party for generations, just as Kansans continue to support Republicans, is more a matter of tradition than anything else. . Ever hear of the yellow dog voter?

The reactionaries are very cognizant of this fact. They realize that having an R after your name on the ballot, at least in most areas of the state, pretty much assures victory in the general election. All they have to do is win the primary, and they do this--and quite well--by organizing and getting out their base to vote in the primaries. Thus, even though they are a minority, when only 16 percent of the registered voters cast a primary ballot, the reactionaries, by showing up to vote in large percentages, are able to win against moderate republicans whose more numerous but apathetic base sit on their hands while the right wing thugs take over our state.

So Cleary4Kansas, I respectfully suggest you submit your question to your own party. How can republicans rebuild your party is THE question.

William Weissbeck 3 years, 6 months ago

I will take some exception to your history. Kansas has had the Dockings, Jon Carlson, Joan Finney and Kathleen (she whose name shall not be said). You don't think I'm kidding about Kathleen do you? Before Carlson was governor, he was Speaker of the House - yes the Dems controlled one chamber. What happened? I think it's the Right to Life, Guns for All, no tax crowd merging with the libertarians and the money to slowly squeeze and gerrymander out any moderating voices. Look what has happened with the Congressional delegation. Unless GOP moderates are willing to: one, run as a 3rd party after losing primaries, and two, willing to accept that in some of those races a Democrat may win, then the moderates will have no leverage against the reactionaries. They have to be willing to put the party in jeopardy to save it and the state.

jim7 3 years, 6 months ago

Who ever said that you could not buy an election,only in Kansas where people are blind to what is really going on in the state capitol,

lunacydetector 3 years, 6 months ago

the taliban = so-called moderate republicans/liberal democrats

jhawkinsf 3 years, 6 months ago

So many comments that most Kansans are this or they're not that. The problem is that most Kansans aren't voters. It's true now, it was true a decade ago and a decade before that. And a decade before that.

We're in the process of getting the government we deserve.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

I wondered about the turnout.

But, you and I, and others who do vote aren't getting the government "we" deserve.

That's the real problem - those who don't vote mess it up for those of us who do.

Topple 3 years, 6 months ago

You seem convinced that the 88% who didn't vote consist primarily of democrats.

Carol Bowen 3 years, 6 months ago

While jafs comment was not elaborate, I am sure he had no preconceived conclusion on what the majority of Kansans think. If the voter turnout were larger, all representIves would be more attentive to their constituencies rather than fulfilling vendettas of a few. I would think a leader would want solid backing, especially when their proposed changes are so different from the status auo.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Actually, I think that's extremely unlikely.

But, I imagine there are lots of moderate R in that group.

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

Extremism begets extremism. The country swung too far left with too many social programs, too many attacks on conservatives and their values so the result is a huge pushback.

This is a direct result of moving too far left punctuated by Obamacare.

Homey 3 years, 6 months ago

You caught the brass ring. This election was a reaction to the perception that the country is controlled by liberal extremists.

rtwngr 3 years, 6 months ago

Perception is reality. Funny, I came to the conclusion that President Obama was a socialist the day he uttered the phrase, "spread the wealth around," to Joe the Plumber. Remember that? President Obama points at rich people and then tells poor people that they are poor because the rich people are robbing from them. Funny, that's what Lenin said prior to the Bolshevik Revolution. So save your name calling. Just because I disagree with a politician's ideals and tactics, does not mean I am a bigot. I equally dislike Joe Biden, Harry "The Dirty Liar" Reid, Valerie Jarrett, Debbie "Blabbermouth" Schultz and any number of other lying liberals too numerous to mention.

Cant_have_it_both_ways 3 years, 6 months ago

The silent majority has risen. It is time to demand people who can pay their own way, start paying their own way. Nothing is free, those who mooch take away from those who work. It is time to getting back to the principles of hard work and away from the entitlement system that has been entrenched into our society. If you want it, then get out and work for it.

Michele Dillon 3 years, 6 months ago

That's right that 95 year old widow living on Social Security and Medicare needs to get off her butt.

Cant_have_it_both_ways 3 years, 6 months ago

Not at all, you see, that is why you and people like don't get it. When we create a society of dependency with things like public transportation, 99 weeks of unemployment, free this and free that including free cell phones, there is not money left for that retired widow you drag into this. You see, that woman paid into society during her life and is being kicked to the curb by those of you who choose not to work and demand those of us who do -- pay your bills. So on behalf of that 95 year of widow, screw all of you that take more from the system than you put in!

Mike Hoffmann 3 years, 6 months ago

You are honestly complaining about public transportation?

asixbury 3 years, 6 months ago

It's not empty all day. During peak times, before and after work/school, there are always riders. You are wrong.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Actually, turnout in 2010 mid terms was down by about 1/3 from the presidential election in 2008.

In 2008, it was about a 60% turnout, so that would make 2010 about a 40% turnout.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

What?

You claimed that the "silent majority" spoke in 2010, which suggests more people voted there than previously.

In fact, it's the opposite, more people voted in Obama's election than in the mid-terms.

So, the point is that when more people voted, they voted for Obama.

Facts can't be "distorted" - they simply are true or false. It is false to claim that the mid-terms reflected a "silent majority". 40% is less than half of the eligible voters, so even if they all voted for somebody, it's still a minority. And, when 1/2-2/3 of them do, it's a smaller minority.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

So, you just change the subject, I see.

I suppose that's a little better than repeating false claims.

My prediction is that Obama will win, but by a rather small margin. I expect that turnouts may not be as large as in 2008 as well. Idealists on the left are disappointed with Obama, and may vote third party, or not vote at all, especially the young ones. They certainly won't vote for Romney.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

And when the majority re-elects Obama in 2012, your response will be similar, yes? That the people who matter voted, and they chose Obama? Even if he wins the electoral college and loses the popular vote, Obama will still be re-elected President.

Are you going to be American enough to accept the results according to the rules of the game, or will you turn treasonous?

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

SOP dictates we are all Socialists... I mean Communists... well, same thing you know. Read on!

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

A lot happens in 2 years. It's still the case that Obama has a better chance of re-election than Romney has of being elected.

What will you do if the American people, whence true governmental authority comes, re-elect Obama with turnout greater than that in Kansas this past election? WIll you sing the same tune as you currently are about these Kansas election results? Or will you turn treasonous if your side loses?

rtwngr 3 years, 6 months ago

Well, they were a majority on election day, weren't they Einstein?

LOL @ vertigo

chootspa 3 years, 6 months ago

In what form of math is less than 12% a "majority?"

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

"The silent majority has risen"

These sorts of statements are absurd, given ridiculously low turnouts of 12-13%.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

I'll be quite interested to see how you defend the majority re-electing Obama in November with the same (nasty) gusto you're defending these results.

Or are you purely partisan, and not a patriotic American?

tomatogrower 3 years, 6 months ago

CHBW, that means that once the radicals have cut taxes down to the bone, all roads will have to become toll roads or fall into disrepair. But I guess those of you who live in mommy's basement don't get out much anyway.

Patricia Davis 3 years, 6 months ago

Then you agree that Mitt should pay his fair share of taxes?

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

The country never swung to far to the left. It appears to you that it did because your perspective is so far to the right. The extremist right is fueled by money and lies and when they are outed, which is beginning to happen, the extremism will beget centralism and the extremist like you who view the world from radical right will be viewed as just that, radical right wing extremest.

Moderate:• (of a person, party, or policy); not radical or excessively right- or left-wing : a moderate reform program.

What will happen is that the republican party will realize what real "conservatism" is and they will move to take their party back in which case the republican party will return to moderation.

The republican party of Kansas has been hijacked by the radical right who now want to redefine themselves as "conservatives" which they clearly aren't. They are the party of "me first" and the party hate and lies.

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

First you have no clue about my political leanings and are just making incorrect assumptions. And perception is reality so if people perceive a move to the left then that is their reality.

The people of Kansas spoke in 2010 and again last night. Those that want to tax and grow government are in the minority.

question4u 3 years, 6 months ago

Perception is reality? What people perceive is their reality?

If you really believe in relativism, why on earth would you bother to post statements like those above? After all, they are only your perceptions of reality and are meaningless to anyone who perceives reality differently. Perception is reality? Then facts are meaningless, reason is irrelevant, and there can never be a distortion or misrepresentation of reality. Who cares whether that position is defensible philosophically? As long as you believe that something's true, then it is true for you. There can be no neutral standards. From your perspective, God is real if you believe in him and is an illusion if you don't. Murder is unethical if that's your perspective but admirable if you perceive it that way. After all, perception is reality. That's why we don't need science. We don't need education either. There's nothing to learn, since one perception is as good as another. If you perceive yourself to be educated, that's true for you. If you perceive yourself to be powerful, that's true for you. There's no possibility of delusion, because perception is reality.

What's the matter with Kansas? Nothing, if you perceive it that way.

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

Lol. You just made my point. Each person does possess a singular reality based on their perception and life experiences. A simple illustration is to expand upon what you said about murder. Those who crashed the planes into the twin towers are viewed as murderers by the US but are viewed as heros by the radical Muslims.

And my opinion is just that my opinion nothing more. No more valid than anyone else's unless it comes from a position of powere. In truth power is the only truth and it constantly changes.

Finally science can referee perception to a point but despite science there are those that still believe the earth is flat and we didn't land on the moon. Is their reality wrong? Of course it is but they will act based upon it just as it is real.

So regardless of whether or not we have moved too far left those that perceive we have will act accordingly.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

Perception is the physiology of reality. How's that for one sentence?

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Really?

What was the turnout in the primaries here?

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

Perception is reality? What people perceive is their reality?freddy

You just defined Fox and why they are so popular. They will also get their comeuppance as well.

"First you have no clue about my political leanings...."freddy

Well, I guess that makes you a troll because the only clue I have about your political leaning is what you post in your comments. Oh, excuse me, your post are only what you perceive not actually factual or otherwise relevent.

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

Ms you really should dispute my points rather than attacking me. It is much more productive and enjoyable. Yes you only can know me from my posts but obviously you have not read them since it is hard to cast me in the far right category when I am pro gay marriage oppose the socalled war on drugs believe we should be tolerant of different views and we must all work together to educate and lift people out of poverty.

Yeah that is me - far right.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

I have only commented on your comments and if you choose to take that as a personal attack than fine, thats on you, not me. You do have some contradictions in your posts, which I have clearly pointed that I disagree with. Your comment about the country has drifted to far to the left is ridiculous and is simply parroting the lies of the right that have been going on for years. They believe it because for one, they are gullible, and two, it is what they want to believe. It is theirs (and yours apparently) perception. Which leads to my second disagreement with you with respect to the distinction "perception" and facts and truths. People don't get to just make up facts, that my friend is reserved for "opinions"

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

Ms. You called me troll. That is a personal attack isn't it?

I agree people don't get to make up facts unless maybe they are Harry Reid. But whether the country has moved left or right is opinion based not fact based. If I am wrong then provide scientific evidence to support your position that it has not moved left?

rtwngr 3 years, 6 months ago

You called someone a name. You lose the argument. You see, that's what people do when they can't compete in the arena of ideas. They call others names like "troll".

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

"They will also get their comeuppance as well."

Why do you keep using that antique phrase? What are you, 90? Say something about whippersnappers next. That will be funny too.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

Unless you have money tied up in a house that isn't going to sell until we get another president, you really really ought to get moving for BC. Do you need help with gas money?

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

Liberty, it might be a little early to spike the football. Just some good common sense advice.

chootspa 3 years, 6 months ago

Says the person who claimed he/she/it was moving to Florida ASAP.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm leaving because this is a podunk city in a podunk state. Politics aren't the reason.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

You keep saying that, but you're still here.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Those who are "moderates" on social issues aren't necessarily "moderate" on all issues. We in the middle reject the notion that if we don't like Obama's methods or results that we must absolutely agree with the extremists who are also in favor of all sorts of interventionist government policies, including those in regard to reproductive freedom. We fall out of lockstep with those who mandate a Christian nation, and we reject those who are outright bigoted toward others.

But in your black and white world we have to take one to have the other, right? We must all march in step with your ideals, or we are "lemmings" and "fence-sitters". So be it.

Michele Dillon 3 years, 6 months ago

My problem with Kansas is that you have to declare a party to vote in a Primary. That leaves an awful lot of voters off the table.

Ribs61 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm a registered independent who voted the republican ballot yesterday. My vote wasn't left off the table.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Didn't they make you register as a R to vote in their primary?

Ribs61 3 years, 6 months ago

They recorded the change on the roster of eligible voters and had me sign that. I don't know if that is the right "procedure" but there was not a separate registration to fill out.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Right, but you're now registered R unless you change it back, I think.

Ribs61 3 years, 6 months ago

I think you are right. My wife is registered R, I saw no need for duplicate mailings from the party. We both vote who we think the best candidate is regardless of party but we lean moderate republican. I can change it sometime in the future. It really only matters during primaries.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

The D party allows unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.

The R requires registration as a R, but you can do it on the day of the primary.

Besides, why would anybody who wants to vote in a primary not just register accordingly in order to do that?

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

And the shoutings and the micturitions of the disappointed progressives did ascend into the firmament. And it was amusing. (from a source)

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Rainbow speedos and killing babies? Really? Is that the best you can do to encourage those to follow your lead? Characterizing those outside your core as "rainbow speedos and killing babies"? Your discourse does nothing more than assure an Obama victory this fall on the national level. When you pander to the most extreme, you lose the moderates on both sides of the aisle.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

And what if the majority of the electoral college does re-elect Obama? Currently, he stands a better chance of winning than Romney, regardless of what you yourself might hope for.

If Obama wins re-election, what will you do then?

riverdrifter 3 years, 6 months ago

I like to wager money on certain things. Would you like to put your money where your mouth (keyboard is)?

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Who you talking to? Moderate Republican here ~ one who rejects the radicals in my party. Looking for a Patsy? Look elsewhere.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

And that's in a nutshell the problem. Why don't you leave my Republican party? My heroes Reagan and Goldwater would appreciate it!

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Reagan was awesome because he could pick and choose which aspects of morality to embrace. He cavorted with socialites, was a divorcee, hung with the hollywood elite and was married to a gal who employed her own personal astrologer. How progessive is that?

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Don't give a rat's patootey whether anyone in Government "fears" their maker. That and a quarter won't get you a cup of coffee, and doesn't make you any more patriotic than the agnostic next to you.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Sorry, but this is America. Not bibleville.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

"God planted the pilgrims here" Good grief, now you're giving us all a bad name. If traditional Christianity is our manifest destiny then why've we selected a Mormon for our party nomination? Seems like Perry or Santorum would have been better....

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

In other words, despite being given the opportunity to pick between two "traditional Christian Americans" we chose a Mormon instead? Seems to indicate a FLAT-OUT-REJECTION of traditional American Christianity.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Or many of us found Perry and Santorum's traditional evangelistic fervor distasteful, and have opted for an "outsider" as the only one capable of defeating Obama, because he's used to working as someone outside the religious mainstream and isn't here to mandate his faith upon all.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

Laughable: "I know you and your ilk would love to have us all walking around in rainbow speedos and killing babies."

You believe that. You don't know it. Knowledge and belief are not the same thing.

If you seriously believe that that's what "liberals" want, you're proceeding based on beliefs which have nothing to do with reality. You're believing your own hyperbole, and that's damaging your ability to think.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I thought the democrats were going to switch to republican and vote for the RINOs. Did that plan not work out?

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Apparently not enough of them, or unaffiliated folks, did so.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Yeah, that worked not so well. Imagine the Dems' response if the GOP announced that it was going to switch over and vote for certain named Democrats. Same results.

It was a plan born of desperation anyway.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

If enough D and moderate unaffiliated folks did it, I imagine it might have an effect.

It is continually surprising to me that moderates don't make their voices heard more in KS, since I believe they are in fact the majority here. Republicans even say that low turnout favors conservatives.

And we had a whopping 12% turnout in Douglas County this year - shameful.

Cant_have_it_both_ways 3 years, 6 months ago

Maybe those in rainbow speedos were out smooching on each other at the Chick-fil-a instead of voting.

Just a thought.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Republicans may in fact NEED moderates come fall. I wonder if we'll remember that they could use a hand then....

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

What's unfortunate is how the Republican party is apparently now the welcome home for any rag-tag band of misfit racists, homophobes, monotheists and other kooks. No matter how extreme your views, we'll use you in our fight against Obama and forced re-education by the liberals. We'll wrap that flag around you real tight to protect against what may be out there, just as long as you sign the party oath.

Jim Johnson 3 years, 6 months ago

Conservatives for Kansas WooHoo. The best part is the libs are saying they are moving, can't get any better than that. Of course they are lying again just trying to get our hopes up.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

"Fueled by huge donations from Wichita-based Koch Industries, and Wichita oilman David Murfin, the Kansas Chamber PAC reported spending nearly $650,000 on conservative candidates in the last 3 1/2 weeks of the campaign." This, of course, makes it sound like a bought-and-paid-for election. those poor moderates never had a chance.

Meanwhile the Washington Post has some other numbers: "The targeted moderate incumbents outspent their conservative challengers, often by margins of 3-to-1 or more and received financial support from the state’s largest teachers’ union and labor groups normally aligned with Democrats." http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/conservatives-win-big-in-kan-senate-primary-races/2012/08/08/bcd5fa4a-e12c-11e1-8d48-2b1243f34c85_story.html

In fairness to Mr. Rothschild, it probably is notable that Conservatives had significant backing, because for years they have fought moderate rainmakers with very little in the way of institutional financial support. That they could whup the moderates while still being outspend 3-1 is indicative more of elections that are no longer bought and paid for than by the opposite.

I did rather enjoy the phrase "bipartisan unions," however, which is about as accurate as saying the "bipartisan NRA."

ProfessorSeamus 3 years, 6 months ago

The Washington Post article reports the incumbents themselves outspent the challengers. However, that is not all that informative in a post-Citizen's United world. The question is how much was spent on each candidate's behalf, not how much the candidate him/her self spent. I know in my district we would receive multiple hit pieces each week, sometime each day, attacking the moderate incumbent. But never from the opponent. Always from the Kansas Chamber,the Club for Growth, Americans for Prosperity, etc. Occassionally we would receive something from the incumbent, although I never remember receiving anything directly from the challanger. So if you look only at what the candidates spent, the incumbent probably spent more. But if you look in total, it was not even close. The challenger buried the incumbent with negative advertising (sorry, not the challenger because these things are not "coordinated" with the candidate, I meant to say the completely unaffiliated interest groups who were not at all coordinating with a specific candidate or set of candidates).

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Correct, it is not all that informative, but it ought to be mentioned anyway. When Rothschild mentions what Koch spent, he ought to mention that casino owner Phil Ruffin's PAC dropped almost $150k for moderates in the final days with the real estate agents spending another $50k. Fair is fair.

Shelley Bock 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm beginning to see the Kansas Chamber of Commerce as something I don't like or respect. I understand that many municipal Chambers are disassociating themselves from the parent group.

Alyosha 3 years, 6 months ago

You're setting yourself up for a grand disappointment should President Obama be re-elected.

What will you do if that happens? Currently, he stands a greater chance than Romney of winning enough electoral college votes to be re-elected.

If the American people again elect Obama, you'll need to rethink your certainties, because they will have been proven to be wrong. I wonder if you're enough of a patriot to accept that your side will have lost at the polls and in the electoral college.

Or will you turn treasonous?

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Alyosha, if I was forced to vote for either Obama or Romney, I would choose Obama, so when or if he is re-elected, I will continue on with my happy life.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

"A habit of the old: they choose the wisest person present to speak to; the long explanations needed by the young are wearying" -- Gandalf

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Moderates like myself should remember these words from Barry Goldwater: "Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them." "I'm frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in "A," "B," "C" and "D." Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?" "I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of "conservatism." " "I think every good Christian ought to kick Falwell right in the ass."

question4u 3 years, 6 months ago

Clearly some in Kansas are happy with an extreme right-wing agenda, and they will get to experience firsthand the effects that it will produce on the state. They may or may not still be happy in the future, but it will be the future that they have created and there can be no scapegoats. Sam Brownback owns the "experiment" that is projected to create a multi-billion-dollar state deficit in five years, but every voter who has endorsed Brownback's radical agenda owns shares in that experiment too.

Will the state prosper through drastic cuts to education, highways, public safety, health and social services? Will it thrive by alienating Hispanics, minorities, homosexuals, non-Christians, and many women? Will it flourish by eliminating state support for the arts, public television and radio, and cultural concerns? Will its national (and international) reputation for right-wing extremism bring it benefits?

If quality of life is unimportant to you and the only factor that matters is economic, there are some unequivocal measures in place to determine the consequences of the "experiment": the poverty index, unemployment rate, deficit, etc.

If things work out well economically, then moderates and liberals can decry the effects of the experiment on education, public safety, and quality of life issues but they will have to admit that those who cared only about economic issues were justified in the path that they chose. If things don't pan out economically, no blame can be placed on Democrats or even moderate Republicans. If the experiment doesn't act like a "shot of adrenaline to the heart"; if businesses don't flock to the state; if employers don't start hiring new employees in droves; if the projected deficit does materialize, then only the worst kind of hypocrite will try to justify the huge risks that Kansas is taking with its future.

It's now time for the extreme right wing to put up or shut up. We'll see who prospers from the "experiment" that no Kansas state government has ever considered viable before. We'll see whether inexperienced state representatives and senators are indeed the wisest.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

"American Christian values" Trying to package a Mormon nominee as a "traditional Christian" is quite a stretch, don't you think? Not much more than making Obama Muslim, I guess.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Whether these tax cuts bring about an improvement in the economy depends entirely on how you define "economy."

Brwonback and the Koch Bros. don't define "economy" by how well the average Kansan is doing. They define it by the bottom-line of the 1% (0.1%, more accurately) and if that bottom-line does better by increasing the unemployment rate in Kansas and the US, and defunding every program that doesn't entail corporate welfare of one sort or another, they'll declare victory and laugh all the way to the bank.

Sadly, the sheeple voting for them are like slowly boiling frogs-- (sorry for the mixed metaphor) they'll be dead long before they can realize they've been had.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Your unflagging partisanship can never compensate for your utter and complete ignorance on all things economic.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

You have no knowledge of economics. All you're capable of is reciting talking points that are illogical, petty and mean-spirited. You're a complete zero.

chootspa 3 years, 6 months ago

Yes, just like the giant leap unemployment made after Reagan's tax cuts, just like the giant expansion in government spending under Reagan, and just like all the other things you don't want to believe about your saint who was far, far, far too liberal to get elected today. You'd have primaried him out yesterday.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Yes, but the problem is that many people are so blinded by ideology that they hold onto it, even if/when it fails in practice.

RoeDapple 3 years, 6 months ago

12% turnout? Don't blame me, I voted.

Centerville 3 years, 6 months ago

The moderates started begging to be primaried when they voted for that stupid sales tax two years ago. I mean, talk about "la-la-la-I-can't-hear-you".

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

This is heart breaking.
As of this moment, I know at least 14 people (including their children) who are putting themselves in the position to leave within the next two years. I just want to get my family out. After that, that s**stain of a state can go down the toilet for all I care. It hurts deeply to say this, but I am no longer a Kansan.
My family may eventually have to move to the Pacific Northwest. Here's hoping that, if it becomes necessary, OR, WA, western MT, western ID and northern CA will see their way clear to secede from the union. A rather prophetic novel was written in 1975 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecotopia) about that very event. Given that Brownback and his party and his backers are hell bent on creating Gilead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Handmaid%27s_Tale), It may be my family's only hope.
Oh and by the way, if such an event were to occur, guess who lives there and in all likelihood would not only join the new state but would willingly finance it's economy? That's right, the second richest person in the entire world.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

You can catch a ride with metzidet up to Vancouver. You're gonna want to be there when Romney is elected as the lesser of evils (I think they are equal evils).

I suggest taking a train if you have 14 people to evacuate.

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

I have no intention of leaving the US, L275. Keep dreaming.

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

I don't mooch off of ANYBODY and never have. I worked from the time I was 16 years old and paid into SS my entire life since. If I draw it now, it's MY MONEY that's being paid to me, amadán

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I think you can still get it if you live in Canada.

Brock Masters 3 years, 6 months ago

Cait you bring up an Important issue. Currently if you are unhappy where you live you can choose another state whose policies are more inline with yours. For this reason you and others should support state rights and oppose a national government.

Bob Hechlor 3 years, 6 months ago

The article left out numerous other problems with the Brownbackian agenda. Schools will take out science again and put in Brownbackian, Kochian Christianity, mental health and social service cuts will be preserved due to not allowing the health care reform money to come into the state. Coal fired plants and pipelines and gas wells will be going strong, which will further endaner climate change and additionally weaken our water supply and add to our health problems. Corporate welfare will be at an all time high, so the billionaires will grow fatter on our commonwealth, while the rest of us go begging. Americans and Kansans better wake up. Our democracy has been trashed and the more power we hand over to the corporations and the billionaires, the more they will make us pay for it. Better wake up soon or the options continue to get worse. Doom and gloom, you say. Yes, and it is real.

JackMcKee 3 years, 6 months ago

I've got some sad news for the Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck, Fox News fan Ma and Pa 55 year old country bumpkins that keep voting for these buffoons. Your lifestyle, your community your very way of life depends on gub'ment money. Once the Kochs and their buddies get their tax breaks and run off with the treasury, you'll have served your purpose and you'll be tossed to the curb like a load of yesterday's garbage. Do you enjoy being a tool?

JackMcKee 3 years, 6 months ago

Reagan would be considered a liberal by your standards. Maybe I am a liberal considering I voted for him and Bush 41, twice.

I'm in favor of rational government that works, not this crazy Tea Party nonsense.

Don't kid yourself, you are nowhere near a majority. You've got about the same percentage of supporters as the idiots that still believe that Saddam had WMDs. That number is just about 20%. Considering half the people in the country have below average IQs, this doesn't surprise me in the least.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Yep. But our support for their agenda is taken for granted. "Support us fully or leave the party then" we are told.

Some Republicans want to test just how small their tent can be. Unfortunately, that may have unintended consequenses come fall.

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

A "most popular radio host" that has had over 200 sponsors abandon him and the only reason he's still spouting his filth is because Clear Channel (Oh lookie here! Owned by Bain Capital) keeps bank rolling him.

verity 3 years, 6 months ago

"Once the Kochs and their buddies get their tax breaks and run off with the treasury, you'll have served your purpose and you'll be tossed to the curb like a load of yesterday's garbage."

You are exactly on the spot right.

I've seen that happen in business. Comes as a rude shock when people realize they were only valued for what they could do for the person who they thought was on their side. Their promotion was not because their work was valued (often the incompetent ones, who didn't get promoted otherwise), but because they would support the person who gave them the promotion. Actually, I don't think most of them realized what had just hit them, but they were whacked nonetheless and it was too late to do anything about it.

Biker 3 years, 6 months ago

Stop the hate! Just because someone has a difficult viewpoint than you doesn't mean they are wrong, evil or ignorant. Surely KS is progressive enough to tolerate more than one point of view.

Jayhawk1963 3 years, 6 months ago

I love it !!! Any election that makes the lunatic left whine, cry and complain in great news. You don't like it; then move to CA or NY or better yet France ! Native Kansans have put up with you parasites long enough. It's truly gratifying to see little Scottie squirm and pout.

And, guess what, your messiah, the Obamanation, is going down, hard, in November !!! Thank God for the Koch brothers, Americans For Prosperity and all the other PATRIOTS !

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

A perfect indication of how the "new conservatism" is driven by mindless emotionalism.

Shelley Bock 3 years, 6 months ago

Seventy years ago yesterday my father landed on a little island named Guadalcanal. Spent 30+ years in the Corps and considered himself a Patriot. If he was still alive today, he'd be cussing up a storm at this conservative garbage. He never voted for a Republican.

mycatsrightorwrong 3 years, 6 months ago

Just some questions for the TEA Party people b/c i'm honestly curious... What's the goal? No taxes or fewer taxes, no gov't or less gov't? Is it private schools, private police forces, only nice roads for the rich. If someone doesn't have the skills for a good job, they just shouldn't be able to afford certain things.?. have the poor have had it too good for too long? When does a state tax bill stop being tyranny... when it gets down from $5k to $2k? Stop forcing people to fund projects as a community, like parks, libraries, or projects like Legends in KCK? I guess basically, do you want to shrink government or destroy it, & if its just shrink, do you know how much, or have you thought about that?

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

Small government unless it's in a woman's uterus. Then it's as big as they can make it.

mycatsrightorwrong 3 years, 6 months ago

FHNC, I hate to say this, especially to you, but that's the closest thing I've ever gotten to a coherent answer to that question.

RoeDapple 3 years, 6 months ago

This site is so busy with the whiners complaining it is difficult to log on. If y'all had kept the voting booths this busy maybe you'd have less to complain about.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

I voted, so I maintain the right to complain :-)

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Are you saying that people who post here don't vote? If so, how do you know that?

RoeDapple 3 years, 6 months ago

I was spending my time encouraging friends and family to vote. Regardless of their political leanings. I have no idea how you spend your time. I have noticed several posters saying what a waste it is voting in Kansas. Don't try to speak for me bozo, you'll be wrong.

Stuart Evans 3 years, 6 months ago

hooray for our own little theocratic state! Maybe someday we can live just like the Saudis.

Jayhawk1963 3 years, 6 months ago

A "bi-partisan" union ??? What a joke !!! Keep drinking the Kool-Aid, little Scottie.

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 6 months ago

That's why I don't even call them "anti-abortionists". I call them "forced birthers".

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

Good thing these women have you to look toward as their overlord!

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

'cause it's not the government's business.Solely the concern of the citizen involved, and not something for big brother nanny state to deal with. Remember, the most frightening words, "I'm from the gov't and here to help you."

scaramouchepart2 3 years, 6 months ago

Bloefeld once did not lazer Kansas because no one would notice. He was right. Kansas can lazer itself and still no one will notice.

JackMcKee 3 years, 6 months ago

Far right conservatives have every reason to gloat today. Much like a 10 year old that just successfully lit his own house on fire.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

So you actually believe that that the recently-defeated Moderate Republicans are Communist? Lends much credibility to your perspective.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

I'll take that as a "yes." So there you have it: folks like SOP have deemed all in our land ~ except those goose-stepping in his very footsteps ~ as communist/liberal/what have you. Moderates like Dole are not welcome in his party ~ or his nation, frankly, including those who have voted Republican their whole lives but refuse to subscribe to zealotry. Compromise and discourse are unnecessary, as all good nationals will follow his agenda without question, or face the wrath of their new overlords.

Local actions have national consequenses, and disenfranchised moderates may prove critical to the elections this fall. Remember that..

JackMcKee 3 years, 6 months ago

Yep, this just about says it all about the lunatics that have taken over the future of Kansas.

msezdsit 3 years, 6 months ago

Were going to have a contest as to how many people can guess how many other monikers you have posted under. You are the definition of "troll". 56 demeaning insulting and disparaging posts on this thread and counting out of 300 posts on this thread alone. I know who you are.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Professor Seamus: "The question is how much was spent on each candidate's behalf, not how much the candidate him/her self spent. "

Sometimes that's the question and sometimes it's not. For example: "State Sen. Jean Schordof was a pretty typical victim... Schordof outraised [Wichita city councilman Michael] O'Donnell, $115,000 to $72,000, but the Kansas Chamber PAC spent $36,000 to help the challenger, more than eight times as much as a teacher's union spent to help Schordof. So O'Donnell won, and won easy -- 2,745 votes to 1,897 votes, in a district that's home to around 70,000 people." (from a source) http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2012/08/08/the_great_kansas_republican_purge_of_2012.html

So the moderate raised $115k to the conservative's $72k. The Kansas Chamber gave the conservative $36k, bringing his total to $108k, still less than the moderate. Even with incumbency, a few thousand dollars from the teachers' unions, and doubtless more than a couple of crossover Democrats who voted her way in the primary, the moderate incumbent was still able to garner barely 40% of the vote.

It was not outside money that made this race uneven. In fact, it allowed the race to be decided on some issue other than money. It must have been quite an issue, too. Luckily the opponents of all these new senate candidates have until November to figure out what it might be.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Do not overlook redistricting as a significant factor, not only in the conservatives' wins, but in the fact that moderates hung on as long as they did.

verity 3 years, 6 months ago

One problem with your figures. It doesn't take into account what was spent that doesn't have to be reported.

"And that amount didn't include mailers sent out by Koch-founded Americans for Prosperity, which doesn't have to report expenditures on its political activity because it is a tax-exempt "social welfare" organization."

Americans for Prosperity a tax-exempt social welfare organization---how's that for sucking at the government tit? Why do churches have to stay out of politics in order to keep their tax-exempt status (theoretically speaking, although obviously not in fact) and the Koch's social welfare organization can spend any amount on political activity and remain tax exempt? And exactly whose welfare is this organization benefitting?

And we don't know what else they spent money on besides the mailers or how much.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

But they are not "my" figures, they're Slate Magazine's figures, that right-wing rag. The point and the fact is that everywhere you look closely, no matter how much money you count, the story that the moderates lost because they were outspent falls apart. They were outspent here and there, and they outspent their opponents here and there, and yet they got slaughtered across the board. Losing 40-60 when you spend more than $3 for every vote cast (and $7 for every vote you got) means you have a bigger problem than money. And the faster the left (or the center) figures out what that problem is, the faster they will be competitive again.

It may make them feel better to blame their baby seal whooping on money or fear or Koch or Voter ID or something that is not their fault. But they are not helping themselves by doing that and they'd better get past it quickly. The sooner they take ownership of their loss, the faster they can make the next one a win.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

There's every possibility that there be a line of busses heading out of Lawrence filled up with disappointed progressives leaving the state come November. (from a source)

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

I guess the Republican confidence level must be pretty high to permit such a "cleansing" of the party to take place. Good thing you got all those "communists" out of there. Didn't need their kind of help and dedication to this nation anyway. What's a bit of collateral damage when we're talking right and wrong?

Probably better go after the Log Cabin Republicans, too, since they seem to admire old Honest Abe a bit too much. And anyone else who seems a bit sketchy, too, since this is really the time to prove our point about whose America this nation really is.

lucky_guy 3 years, 6 months ago

Did anyone who voted think the turnout was 12%? Although it has been shown that there is not voter fraud we can't be sure about vote counter fraud. 12% seems a little low.

DaBellaDaBall 3 years, 6 months ago

Golly, I wonder what you self-righteous ultra right-wingers pray for? My bet is your prayers go something like this:

"Dear Lord, please stop government from spending my money on the sick, the elderly and the poor. Please don't spend my money on education for children, improving the state's infra-structure, or keeping the environment clean and safe. It’s my money and I earned it. Nobody helped me. I have guns and don't need the police department. I have enough money to build a new house if mine burns to the ground, so I don't need the fire department. I have a big 4WD truck, so I don't need improvements to roads and highways. My money is for me, although I do like to share it with Governor Brownshirt and I will help the Koch brothers when the EPA tries to force their communist ideas on them. And most importantly, please smite anyone to the left of me. Please Lord, I pray for your kind and loving help. Amen."

Friggin' hypocrites. God-fearing on the surface; fascist atheistic pukes by deed.

Pastor_Bedtime 3 years, 6 months ago

What a pic. Like I said, he was awesome. He could hang with anyone, man! I mean... he was Reaganing - all the time!

Larry Sturm 3 years, 6 months ago

Sounds like corruption to me buying the vote.

Larry Sturm 3 years, 6 months ago

Sounds like corruption to me buying the vote.

Jim Phillips 3 years, 6 months ago

The whiners are out in full force because "entitlements" might go away. Let's face it, It's Bush's fault! Hahahahahahahahahahaha!

Andrew Reeves 3 years, 6 months ago

No. Guardian's referring to the entitlement Ms. Romney got for her horse.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Pigs poised to fly, film at 11. Given that the Dems have not controlled the senate in 95 years and would have to pick up a net of 13 seats - more than 150% of their current totals - during a year where the GOP will carry the state in a presidential election in order to do so, Mr. Rothchild was wise enough to back away from that potential replacement headline.

yourworstnightmare 3 years, 6 months ago

Interesting times.

Will the moderate GOP continue to support a party that has purged them like bosnian muslims from Sarajevo?

Or will the moderate GOP and the democrats align to defeat these warmed over right wing populist anarchists?

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

It will be the former to the extent it will be either. There is no moderate GOP to speak of; there were only a few incumbents who hung on through the advantages of gerrymandered districts, name recognition, and the ability to rainmake lots of campaign donations. As soon as those advantages disappeared, they were revealed to be the second-tier candidates they always were. Oh, there will be a few loud defections, but like Paul Morrison, Cindy Neighbor, and Mark Parkinson, they will be full of sound and fury yet amount to nothing.

The real question is whether independents will vote for the new, more conservative GOP, and if they do not, if the overwhelming advantage the GOP holds in voter registration will overcome that. My guess is that the Dems may pick up some seats, but the overall result will be a more conservative legislature. But it's only a guess. No one knows until the votes are counted.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

None2: "Are you aware of what exactly they failed on?"

I can't in every instance, but I can lay out a few factors that influenced the outcome, some more or less depending on the race.

The first is redistricting. I'll use the 13th Senate as an example because the same two guys faced off in the last 2 elections: incumbent moderate Bob Marshall, and conservative challenger Jake LaTurner. for the record, Marshall won by 10 in 2008 and lost by 15 this year. The big deal in that district is that Marshall is well-known and loved in Bourbon County but not known well in nearby Crawford, where LaTurner is better known. Redistricting cut Bourbon in half, putting more of it in Caryn Tyson's district, so while Marshall still won Bourbon handily, it was no longer enough to overcome his Crawford deficit. Anywhere the incumbent inherits territory in which he has not previously been elected erodes his advantage.

Second is demographics: moderates tend to be older than conservatives. In some cases, a lot older. Your average Mainstream Coalition meeting looks like a Gray Panthers rally, while a KFL meeting looks like a day at Worlds of Fun. Over time, that erodes the base of the moderates. I hate ot say this, but many of them campaign like old people - they have lost the fire that got them elected in the first place.

Third is money. Until this race, moderates usually enjoyed a huge funding advantage. This went all the way back to the 80s in Johnson County and the 90s elsewhere. Conservatives have overcome that deficit, which has eroded another moderate advantage.

That plays in because of #4: moderates really are out of step with their party. Back in the 90s, Nancy Brown and Audrey Langworthy and Jan Meyers really did represent a large number of Kansas - and esp, JoCo - Republicans. Today they simply do not. Moderates have been able to overcome that in the past because of advantages in #1 and #3. But competitive financing and new districts combined to wipe them out.

Finally, as you mention, the conservatives are better organized. The alliance of the economic libertarians, the pro-lifers, and the gunners seems unlikely on the surface, but it seems to be working. They have identified a common enemy and frankly destroyed it. A lot of things came together for them this time. Still they cannot count on that in the future.

How do the moderates overcome this? How do the Vikings win the Super Bowl this year? I don't know. Maybe they can't. Maybe the conservatives will screw up epically and give them an in. Maybe they have to approach moderation differently. But unless they are willing to face these facts and attempt to do something about them - rather than just reviling the evil Koch Konspiracy - moderates won't even make the playoffs in the future.

riverdrifter 3 years, 6 months ago

Somebody needs to go hose off their pitbulls. And when they're done hosing them....

Thomas Bryce Jr. 3 years, 6 months ago

When this" experiment" is over , The GOP will own the outcome Lock, Stock, and Barrel.

beatrice 3 years, 6 months ago

No, because in three years they will still be blaming Obama and in five they will be blaming Hillary Clinton.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

None2: "Are you aware of what exactly they failed on?"

I can't in every instance, but I can lay out a few factors that influenced the outcome, some more or less depending on the race.

The first is redistricting. I'll use the 13th Senate as an example because the same two guys faced off in the last 2 elections: incumbent moderate Bob Marshall, and conservative challenger Jake LaTurner. for the record, Marshall won by 10 in 2008 and lost by 15 this year. The big deal in that district is that Marshall is well-known and loved in Bourbon County but not known well in nearby Crawford, where LaTurner is better known. Redistricting cut Bourbon in half, putting more of it in Caryn Tyson's district, so while Marshall still won Bourbon handily, it was no longer enough to overcome his Crawford deficit. Anywhere the incumbent inherits territory in which he has not previously been elected erodes his advantage.

Second is demographics: moderates tend to be older than conservatives. In some cases, a lot older. Your average Mainstream Coalition meeting looks like a Gray Panthers rally, while a KFL meeting looks like a day at Worlds of Fun. Over time, that erodes the base of the moderates. I hate ot say this, but many of them campaign like old people - they have lost the fire that got them elected in the first place.

Third is money. Until this race, moderates usually enjoyed a huge funding advantage. This went all the way back to the 80s in Johnson County and the 90s elsewhere. Conservatives have overcome that deficit, which has eroded another moderate advantage.

That plays in because of #4: moderates really are out of step with their party. Back in the 90s, Nancy Brown and Audrey Langworthy and Jan Meyers really did represent a large number of Kansas - and esp, JoCo - Republicans. Today they simply do not. Moderates have been able to overcome that in the past because of advantages in #1 and #3. But competitive financing and new districts combined to wipe them out.

Finally, as you mention, the conservatives are better organized. The alliance of the economic libertarians, the pro-lifers, and the gunners seems unlikely on the surface, but it seems to be working. They have identified a common enemy and frankly destroyed it. A lot of things came together for them this time. Still they cannot count on that in the future.

How do the moderates overcome this? How do the Vikings win the Super Bowl this year? I don't know. Maybe they can't. Maybe the conservatives will screw up epically and give them an in. Maybe they have to approach moderation differently. But unless they are willing to face these facts and attempt to do something about them - rather than just reviling the evil Koch Konspiracy - moderates won't even make the playoffs in the future.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

None2: "Are you aware of what exactly they failed on?"

I can't say in every instance, but I can lay out a few factors that influenced the outcome, some more or less depending on the race.

The first is redistricting. I'll use the 13th Senate as an example because the same two guys faced off in the last 2 elections: incumbent moderate Bob Marshall and conservative challenger Jake LaTurner. For the record, Marshall won by 10 in 2008 and lost by 15 this year. The big deal in that district is that Marshall is well-known and loved in Bourbon County but not known well in nearby Crawford, where LaTurner is better known. Redistricting cut Bourbon in half, putting more of it in Caryn Tyson's district, so while Marshall still won Bourbon handily, it was no longer enough to overcome his Crawford deficit. Anywhere the incumbent inherits territory in which he has not previously been elected erodes his advantage. He also inherits some "Throw the bums out" people who have no vested interest in him, because he's not their bum.

Second is demographics: moderates tend to be older than conservatives. In some cases, a lot older. Your average Mainstream Coalition meeting looks like a Gray Panthers rally, while a KFL meeting looks like a day at Worlds of Fun. Over time, that erodes the base of the moderates. I hate to say this, but many of them campaign like old people - they have lost the fire that got them elected in the first place.

Third is money. Until this race, moderates usually enjoyed a huge funding advantage. This went all the way back to the 80s in Johnson County and the 90s elsewhere. Conservatives have overcome that deficit, which has eroded another moderate advantage.

That plays in because of #4: moderates really are out of step with their party. Back in the 90s, Nancy Brown and Audrey Langworthy and Jan Meyers really did represent a large number of Kansas - and esp, JoCo - Republicans. Today they simply do not. Moderates have been able to overcome that in the past because of advantages in #1 and #3. But competitive financing and new districts combined to wipe them out.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

(cont) Finally, as you mention, the conservatives are better organized. The alliance of the economic libertarians, the pro-lifers, and the gunners seems unlikely on the surface, but it seems to be working. They identified a common enemy and frankly destroyed it. A lot of things came together for them this time. Still they cannot count on that in the future.

How do the moderates overcome this? Well, how do the Chiefs win the Super Bowl this year? I don't know. Maybe they can't. Maybe the conservatives will screw up epically and give them an in. Maybe moderates have to approach moderation differently. But unless they are willing to face these facts and attempt to do something about them - rather than just reviling the evil Koch Konspiracy - moderates won't even make the playoffs in the future.

Fossick 3 years, 6 months ago

Sorry about the repetitive posting...some weird stuff happening...

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