Archive for Friday, September 25, 2009

Understanding Glenn Beck

September 25, 2009

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“They would not listen, they’re not listening still,

“Perhaps they never will.” — Don McLean, “Vincent”

Radio and TV commentator Glenn Beck was mentioned three times in separate opinion columns on the same day and in an article the next day in The New York Times, possibly a record for someone who does not hold elective office.

Oh, and then there’s this week’s Time magazine cover. He’s everywhere. Beck is also the Left’s latest explanation for what is wrong with America. Many on the Left believe that if conservatives would just get out of the way, shut up and allow liberals to re-create America in their image, we would all be better off. But those loud-mouthed cable TV and radio talk show hosts keep uneducated, God-worshipping, flag-waving, NASCAR-loving, country music-fueled trailer trash riled up and prevent their brave new world from being born.

The articles, essays and columns about Beck, and so many others on the Right, drip with the condescension conservatives have come to expect from liberal elites who think because they went to the “right” schools they are better than everyone else.

I had not met Glenn Beck, so last week I visited him in his high-rise Manhattan office. His walls are decorated with black-and-white photographs of people he clearly admires. There are entertainers like Red Skelton and a young filmmaker named Walt Disney. You could watch Skelton on TV and view Disney movies along with your wife and kids, knowing you’d never hear a bad word, including a bad word about America.

Beck has an old Admiral black-and-white TV an aide says they are trying to “make work.” When it did work, it carried programs worth watching, including news broadcasts by real journalists like Edward R. Murrow, whose photo hangs on a wall close to Beck’s office.

Is it Beck who is stirring the pot or has the pot been stirring for some time and it is he, and a few others, giving the masses a voice? Maybe it’s the leadership vacuum in the country that has thrust Beck and Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin (1 million of his latest book sold) and others to the forefront. If Republicans were behaving like Republicans, perhaps there would be less perceived need for them.

If the Left bothered to hang out where conservatives do and take seriously their concerns about a country to which they pay taxes and for which many of them, or their parents, or children have fought, maybe they would understand what has so many upset.

Pollster Frank Luntz understands. In a recent column for The New York Daily News, Luntz reports on his interview survey of 6,400 people, the results of which appear in his new book “What Americans Really Want ... Really.” Luntz discovered that people are angry with the government because of the lack of accountability by our leaders and a lack of progress on anything meaningful in Washington.

The “absence of accountability,” he writes, “ranks No. 1 in the hearts and guts of the average American. Washington spends billions to bail out big business and then can’t explain where the money went. Washington spends $800 billion on a stimulus package filled with earmarks and pork projects. And now Washington is trying to create a trillion-dollar health care experiment when over 85 percent of Americans are satisfied with their health care just as it is.”

As Professor Harold Hill put it: “Make your blood boil? Well, I should say.”

Luntz continues: “This could be forgiven, perhaps, if those elected officials from Washington exhibited even an ounce of respect for the voters who pay their salaries. But the combination of a political class that ignores those with whom they disagree and a business class that ignores the very real suffering of the working class (if they are, in fact, working) while pocketing million-dollar bonuses has convinced the public that no one cares.”

Glenn Beck seems to care and that’s why his ratings are now challenging the godfather of cable, Bill O’Reilly.

I ask if he fears being transformed into another “Lonesome Rhodes,” the politically corrupted main character in Budd Schulberg’s classic film, “A Face in the Crowd”? Beck tells me I am not the first to warn of such a possibility. He says he isn’t worried about yielding to that temptation. Beck believes in God and doesn’t think government is Him. And he’s going to his son’s ball game the next day.

That explains Glenn Beck. Any questions?

Comments

oneforall 5 years, 9 months ago

I LIKE GLENN BECK.I FEEL LIKE HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT AND HE'S FOR THE PEOPLE.I WATCH HIM EVERYDAY.I DO NOT CARE HOW HE ACTS.I TRUST HIM,LIKE I SAY HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT.

Sigmund 5 years, 9 months ago

The only person on TV and radio making more speeches than Glenn Beck is President Obama, although I think I am safe in saying Glenn Beck makes more money and cries more on the air.

puddleglum 5 years, 9 months ago

tommy- you guys were all a' hatin on bush-that's not fair. waaaaaah waaaaaah.

nows it okay to hate on OBAMA... wooww wwwowww wwoooww!

nascar.

I love Cal's wording: liberal elites who think because they went to the “right” schools they are better than everyone else.

that should read: because they went to school, they are better than the g.o.p. (grandpa's ol' party)

Kirk Larson 5 years, 9 months ago

Understanding Glenn Beck? That's easy.:

He encourages shallow, slow thinkers to give their country over to the rich and powerful. The end result: the Rich (including Beck) will get richer. The Poor will get poorer. The Middle Class will get gone.

BrianR 5 years, 9 months ago

Next week, Cal is going to declare Murphy Brown a threat to the American way.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

Cal Thomas says: "The articles, essays and columns about Beck, and so many others on the Right, drip with the condescension"

and we have hit Hypocrisy Factor 9.7.

james bush 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck's bizarre BUT what he says is more truthful than the spin from MSNBC or anything coming from NBC,CBS,ABC .

KS 5 years, 9 months ago

It's interesting to see the comments here. Seems the left side can't say ANTHING nice. It's all slams. Bottom line is that if these folks would listen to folks like Beck, Limbaugh and others for a period of more than five minutes, they MIGHT learn something. They might not agree, but they will learn that there is more to life than their constant criticisms. I get a little tired of hearing the left. It truly shows me their lack of education and class. I have a quarter that says that any comment from the left on this will prove my point.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

KS, excellent point.

Anybody else wonder why the left can't get many talk radio or TV shows to hit it big??

Franken, Whoopi - where do they all seem to go??

Hmmm, no wonder the left wants the "fairness doctrine" in place....

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"Seems the left side can't say anthing nice. It's all slams."

then

"I get a little tired of hearing the left. It truly shows me their lack of education and class."

You owe me a quarter, KS. All of those words are your own but one.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

/no rush, though. I have an easy installment plan with a reasonable 26.54 APR.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Babboy, you couldn’t have described better how many of us feel about Obama's acting job and the people who are STUPID enough to believe in what he is "sprinkling out"...

vega 5 years, 9 months ago

Come on people Glenn Beck is just a clown.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"/no rush, though. I have an easy installment plan with a reasonable 26.54 APR."

At that rate, he'll owe you over $1M in about 65 years. He should pay off sooner, rather than later.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"Come on people Glenn Beck is just a clown."

That's an insult to clowns.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Marian,

How dare you chastise the left for accusing the right of throwing the racist card. Don’t you know it doesn't work that way?!?

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Good one Bozo.

Hey how about Iran not having nukes? Still belivin' that one?

TheYetiSpeaks 5 years, 9 months ago

Lik.e an earlier poster said, Beck is bizarre. However, of all the talking heads on television he is the one I find myself watching. I don't always agree with him and he occasionally induces my eyes to roll but (assuming he is not the greatest actor of all time) he does care immensely about this country. Also, I think labeling him a Republican would be a mistake, see his recent angering of Repubs by claiming that the country may have been worse off under McCain. And he still lambastes Bush often. I find him refreshing compared to some of the other talking heads who would never say anything critical about the party they subscribe to (Limbaugh, Hannity, Olberrman, etc.).

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

"a business class that ignores the very real suffering of the working class (if they are, in fact, working) while pocketing million-dollar bonuses has convinced the public that no one cares.”

So are the conservatives siding with the liberals on this one? I thought conservatives were all in favor of the big bonuses, and didn't want President Obama telling the CEO's (many who are not good managers) how to run their business. Which is it? And the conservatives have been railing at President Obama, because he demanded accountability for the bail outs. That's why several banks decided they didn't need a bailout after all, and why he set up control over GM. It was their poster boy former President Bush who gave out money with no accountability.
And haven't the conservatives accused liberals of class envy when they protested big bonuses? Yet, now Thomas calls liberals "liberal elites who think because they went to the “right” schools they are better than everyone else." Sounds like class envy to me. Oh by the way, this liberal attended Neosho County Community College, then KU for a degree, then MNU for a masters. Hardly ivy league.

Someone needs to write a book about what conservatives really want. If Cal Thomas represents conservatives, then I think conservatives constantly change what the want and are pretty fickle.

bondmen 5 years, 9 months ago

Mr. Beck is the new Walter Cronkite. Since ABC, CBS, NBC and CNN aren't doing their journalistic jobs, not to mention the big city papers, the void the left left is being filled by citizen journalists and blogs plus a few very talented radio talk show hosts. America wants the news, deserves the news and she will get the news! Quit cryin' the blues.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

They did, it's really short, and begins:

“We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal…”

/except our slaves

Rex Russell 5 years, 9 months ago

Well Cal, I'll say this. Some of the more level headed, reasonable, people out there do not really CARE to understand Mr. Beck any deeper. I fear the layers underneath are just as murky and distasteful as what is on the surface. You try to paint a pretty picture of the man and it falls short. You can put a silk dress on a pig, but it's still a pig. You can dip a cat turd in gold, but it will still smell the same.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

unsavoryagent (Anonymous) says… “Someone needs to write a book about what conservatives really want.”

They did, it's really short, and begins:

“We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal…”

Then are you for or against the CEO's making lots of money on the backs of the people who do the real work? I mean, I agree that all men (and women) are created equal. How is the fact that someone who runs a business into the ground, then gets a huge bonus equal? He's a better crook? Conservatives have been telling me that it's all about capitalism, and that I'm just jealous, because I didn't do the same, and that I shouldn't want the government to step in and stop this theft. But know Beck and Cal are complaining about it? First, he defends these pillars of capitalism, then he complains about their big bonuses? Why don't you tell me what conservatives really believe. Do they support their rich heroes of capitalism, who shouldn't be taxed so their money will "trickle down", or are they for the workers who do the real work, but get stiffed with layoffs, and lousy insurance benefits. It's all sounding pretty hypocritical to me. Do you want accountability with bailouts? Or do you want the government to quit telling CEO's (who are failures) how to run their businesses? Cal is sounding really hypocritical in this column. He is sounding almost socialist.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

" if Beck, O'Reilly, Hannity, Limbaugh, et al are allegedly so irrelevant"

Irrelevant to what, pil? Weren't the "loons" more specific in their criticism than that?

From this loon's perspective, Beck is most certainly not irrelevant to his fan base. While that fan base is considered large in terms of viewer ratings of talking heads on cable news networks, it's rather small, and yes, nearly irrelevant, in terms of political movements. This is compounded by the fact that Beck has no workable ideas for solving any of the problems, real and imagined, that he rants about, and neither do those who idolize him. It's just all whine, all the time.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"The fun you had with Bush, Palin, Cheney, Rove–-Fox News; all over now."

Minus a name or two, you've been saying that for years.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Agno, you'll never get it. I love how you lefties think anybody who may give credit to Beck and others are zombies just soaking it all in. Many of us have a decent education as well, so your attempted sense of humor falls short. Lefty talk show hosts can only survive on the mantra of "it's the right thing to do" and "equality for all" for so long before it also falls short with the educated in this country.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Cal Thomas writes: "Is it Beck who is stirring the pot or has the pot been stirring for some time and it is he, and a few others, giving the masses a voice?"

What an intriguing question, don't you think? I think the answer to that question lies at the very heart of our little debate. Predictably, the argument on this blog has quickly lined-up behind these two characterizations.

How do we figure out which belief tends to be true? Can we measure anything? How about conservative book sales? Perhaps television ratings? Maybe crowd size comparisons? Tea Parties? Town Halls? Polls? Evidence seems to be mounting. What does it mean?

If he and other conservatives weren't being effective, if they truly were the cranks and raving loons they are portrayed to be, I seriously doubt so many folks on the left would be trying to discredit them. If the horse is dead, why does the beating continue? For someone who supposedly cannot be taken seriously, how come so many liberals do? Its pretty obvious Beck and others like him scare the crap out of liberals because they know he resonates with a growing number of Americans. If he ever had Sarah Palin on his show, I think I could go outside and actually hear the howling.

I think Beck is a hoot. While I don't share all of his conclusions, I admire his passion and - between his vaudeville shenanigans - I'm often compelled by his analysis.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

Ok, is there a conservative out there who will answer my question? Beck and Thomas are considered conservative, right? So, they are now ranting about bonuses and on accountability in the government bail outs. Yet, the it wasn't long ago, probably last week, that conservatives were telling me that I have class envy, because I was against the bonuses. And that Bush did right by giving the businesses bailout money without any strings, because he shouldn't interfere with capitalism. And Obama's requirements were "nationalizing" business. Have conservatives changed their mind on this or not?

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Tomato - I (for one) believe what President Bush did with "his" portion of this bail-out insanity betrayed conservative principals, and that's not the only thing he did that was a radical departure from true conservatism during his tenure. You'll not get me to defend him on this point. His is a CINO. Conservatives know (as President Bush should have) that our constitution provides a marvelous, time-tested remedy to people who through greed, or incompetence can't keep their financial house in order: it's called bankruptcy court. The entire premise that there are in fact entities in this world that are "too big to fail" is repugnant.

3crookedhearts 5 years, 9 months ago

Glenn Beck loves America! He's a patriot! Calling the president a racist is good for America! Fear and hate mongering is good for America! Encouraging a new civil war is good for America! America loves Glenn Beck! He's the finest journalistic mind on television! He made over $23,000,000 last year! What a great guy!

I wish we had more people on television and on message boards that were interested in uniting this fine country of ours instead of dividing it. It's both sides, not just fundamentalist libertarians. Oh well.

feeble 5 years, 9 months ago

I understand that Beck spends some time praising Article I, Section 9, Clause 1 of the US Constitution in page 278 of his book "Arguing with Idiots".

Glad to know Glenn thinks slavery is praiseworthy.

Perhaps if the government just taxed all those coyotes bringing illegal immigrants across the border, Beck would praise them too.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

unsavoryagent (Anonymous) says… “And that Bush did right by giving the businesses bailout money without any strings, because he shouldn't interfere with capitalism.”

Who told you that? Let me guess, it's not in print.

I just hear how everyone is upset, because Obama wanted control if the government was going to invest in these businesses. As a taxpayer, I'm not happy about bailing out failures, but these corporations have been allowed to get too big, because the agency (can't remember the name) in control of breaking up huge conglomerates hasn't been doing their jobs for several years now, even during the Clinton years. They broke up AT&T years ago, but AT&T looked like a dwarf compared to the monopolies we have now. So I understand why they had to do what they did. But bailouts made the the government a large investor, so why shouldn't they have a say in it? Beck wants accountability and it's ok. Obama demands accountability, and he's a socialist. What needs to happen now is the law against monopolies needs to finally be enforced. In fact, I understand they are going after the big business that has taken over the farming industry. But what about these financial giants. Someone needs to break them up, so there's some real competition. Real capitalism doesn't have places for WalMart or AIG. That's a different kind of economic system that undermines the middle class.

jimmyjms 5 years, 9 months ago

Glenn Beck = Michael Moore, except Moore is factually correct more often.

If you think Glenn Beck is anything other than an exploitative entertainer, then it's true that you're not very bright.

For your viewing pleasure, some early Glenn "I hate the 9/11 families" Beck!

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

Regardless what is said, Beck and few of the others are getting information out there that no one else is reporting on. It’s up to the person to decide if it is worth a grain of salt, or worth its weight in gold.

Is there ppl out there that believe everything they see or hear? Yes. This is on both sides. Right and Left.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

Real capitalism allows for competition. When companies become this big there is no one to compete with them. It allows some people to get really filthy rich, while many others are left with no jobs, because workers are no longer valued. They are just in the way of the company making even more money. To these huge corporations, providing jobs and a stable economy is not any concern of theirs. Making as much money as possible in the short term is their only concern. For example, if these large food corporations are allowed to continue you will eventually be totally dependent on these people for your very survival. Right now, they claim their way brings you cheaper food, but if they are allowed to continue to become a monopoly, you'll be paying whatever price they want to charge you. That happened when the large oil companies took over the gas stations. I remember when the locally owned gas stations had price wars, and the consumers came out ahead. That's not happening now, and only the big businesses are coming out ahead.

jimmyjms 5 years, 9 months ago

"Beck and few of the others are getting information out there that no one else is reporting on. "

Yeah - made up bull-****. Super.

The wit and wisdom:

"The most used phrase in my administration if I were to be President would be "What the hell you mean we're out of missiles?"

"I find this guy [father of Nick Berg] despicable. Everything in me says that. The want to be a better person today than I was yesterday says he's a dad, he's grieving, but I don't buy that. I'm sorry, I don't buy it. I think he is grieving, but I think he's a scumbag as well. I don't like this guy at all."

And so on. He's an ass.

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck is certainly a man of his times. He is an entertainer. He will say anything that will make him money. Right now, vitriolic right-wing talk radio is in ascendance and has an audience. Therefore, Beck spews right-wing vitriol.

He is an entertainer who plays for an audience, just like Limbaugh and O'Reilly.

Trouble is, these entertainers, who say things to make money, are what now passes for political leadership on the right.

Beck is a right-wing spewer because it is profitable for him to be so. It is sad that this is the voice of modern "conservatism" and of the GOP.

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

As I said Jimmy, It’s up to the person to decide if it is worth a grain of salt, or worth its weight in gold. However, I don't see how "all" of it could be made up. If the White House response to something that is reported on, (with no investigation) there has got to be at least “some” truth to it. My personal thougth.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"After reading YWN's 11:34, I must query, why didn't Air America, Al Franken and other leftist hate-spewers make it three, four, five and six years ago?"

Because in reality, the only thing the left has in common is that they're "not right." That is their unifier, and that's it. You can't garner numbers when you have no unification.

/it took two tries for "Not Bush" to win an election. That's saying something.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Pilgrim2 nailed it -

"You know, if Beck, O'Reilly, Hannity, Limbaugh, et al are allegedly so irrelevant (according to the loons on the left), despite the fact their listener/viewer/reader ratings kick the crap out of their so-called “progressive” counterparts, the liberals sure seem to be spending a lot of time and effort trying to discredit them. Gee, what could the looney left possibly be afraid of? You don't suppose it could be the truth, do you? Hmmmmmm?"

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Unsavory - you are aptly named. No one else comes close. Thanks for truth in advertising.

Selling Guam? I can't really argue that. Been there many times. Aside from being a pretty nice aircraft carrier that never moves, its a tropical slum we shovel money into. It's a good vacation spot for Japanese who can't afford to go to Hawaii.

jimmyjms 5 years, 9 months ago

"However, I don't see how “all” of it could be made up."

Have you watched the show?

flickr, while I'm super glad that you think Pilgrim "nailed it," lotsa of people watch lotsa stuff. That doesn't make it correct, accurate, right, whatever.

You know what gets watched a lot more than everything on Fox combined in America?

Porno.

Shall we seek the sage advice of the smut industry on the pressing issues of the day because a lot of people watch it?

G_E 5 years, 9 months ago

"Mr. Beck is the new Walter Cronkite."

weeps for humanity

jumpin_catfish 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck is just another conversative trying to save our country from the liberals. It may be too late but we have a change at the mid-term elections to reign in the socialist.

G_E 5 years, 9 months ago

And personally, I think Beck is an irl troll.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

flicker: "Anybody else wonder why the left can't get many talk radio or TV shows to hit it big??"

Simple, largely people on the left don't need their convictions reaffirmed on a continual basis by talking heads. They don't need to be driven to outrage by the faux outrage of someone getting paid a ton of cash to act outraged on television. Clearly based on ratings, more on the right than on the left do need such daily input.

tom, in addition to what I just wrote, I should point out that Air America never took off, and this was well before Obama took office. Dispite this unpopularity with listeners, Al Franken has since been voted by the people to be a Senator. Those of us on the left don't care for the same types of biased "news" reporting as found coming from Beck. I can't stand to watch someone like Keith Olbermann, even when I agree with him. I just find the whole approach annoying, and this is clear of many on the left.

Instead, we prefer making a joke out of the views of the right, hence the popularity of The Daily Show. Different temperments lead to different interests, I guess.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

YWN: Beck is not the voice of modern “conservatism” and of the GOP.

He is but one of a growing number of voices. Thats why progressive liberal statists are terrified of him. It's not Beck's message that scares them, it's Beck's ability to attract and motivate more and more people to speak out against the statist agenda.

You could say Beck is kinda like a community organizer.

BTW, Beck is not a republican, moreover being a republican is in no way synonymous with being a conservative. President Bush is a splendid recent example.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

The reason why liberal talk radio fails is because they try to copy the conservative talk radio format. That format doesn't resonate with anyone, to include liberals, because the format isn't designed for the liberal message. The tedious, pedantic droning about Bush sucks, et all, gets old fast, even for people who believe it.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

Interesting to find that conservatives who dislike the Limbaugh/Beck/Colter approach are getting lumped in with the "looney left" when they criticize these talking heads. I think the Becks out there appeal to the neocon social/religious base, but are doing more harm then good by driving away rational, fiscal conservatives and social moderates. The GOP is digging its own grave by not speaking out more loudly against the hate-speak of tv and radio personalities.

BrianR 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck relevant? I had to Google him after reading this article, I'd never heard of him.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Beatrice, is it fair for me to infer from your comment that you believe Glen Beck uses "hate speech"? Is that a way of saying you believe he is either a racist, or at least someone who trades in racist rhetoric? I hope I'm wrong about this.

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

Yes Jimmy I have watched the show. I draw that conclusion due to the way the White House reacts to certain reports.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

beatrice (Anonymous) says…

flicker: “Anybody else wonder why the left can't get many talk radio or TV shows to hit it big??”

Simple, largely people on the left don't need their convictions reaffirmed on a continual basis by talking heads.


Riiiggghhhttttt - what color, exactly, is the sky in your world bea?

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

LOL Pilgrim.. I think we get the point.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

"Liberty_One (Anonymous) says… tomato, that's factually incorrect. The presence of large firms does not preclude competition from existing. The problem with your scenario where large firms raise prices is that in a free society such profits will bring in new competition because high profits will attract entrepreneurs to enter the market. This will be disasterous for the existing firms because the new firms will have newer technology and capital assets so that they will be in a better position to compete with the older firms, who now also have angry customers who won't quickly forget the high prices the old firm was charging."

So, Liberty, you now disagree with Beck and Thomas, because apparently they now despise the big bonuses and believe that there should be accountability for the bail outs. My head is spinning. Why do their views keep changing? What's the answer to that?

CHANDLER007 5 years, 9 months ago

We're becoming a divided nation, and that's what truly scares me. "A house divided cannot stand". The 9/11 terrorists who wanted to bring America to her knees are succeeding. Democrat/Republican, Red/Blue, Left/Right, Liberal/Conservative, Capitalists/Socialists, Rich/Poor, etc, etc, etc. Can't we all just find a way to get along and co-exist? Like it or not, we all need to find a way or this great nation of ours will become nothing more than a faint memory, and all those who have fought for us and lost their lives defending us and our freedoms will have fought and died for naught.

kugrad 5 years, 9 months ago

Not too bright, a racist, a race-baiter who compared Obama's health care initiative to a watermelon. Got it. Understood.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Meanwhile, Dems prepare to change the laws, again, and hijack a senate seat.

http://apnews.excite.com/article/20090925/D9AUGNB00.html

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

Unsavoryagent. Never thought of it that way. But good point.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

Do you honestly think that someone is going to come along and be able to compete with WalMart or any other big corporation? Do you honestly think that the big corporations don't help to enact laws that will help them keep their power and fortune? Even in our town certain companies do things to keep out businesses, so they don't have any competition for employees. They can go on paying lower wages. Then they turn it around and try to blame it on "progressives".

tkeagleblog 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom. You might be right to some extent. However, it is still more likely to be done under capitalism.

james bush 5 years, 9 months ago

Conspiracy Theory: Obama and Soros ( and their cadre of "truth squad" posters here) are reveling in the chaos created by this administration is promoting the possibility of a 3rd party which will enable Obamabots to be elected in the next election. Think of it.......the Senate and House without Reid and Pelosi at first seems desirable until one considers that they may be replaced by ACORN or totally leftist types. Remember Obama is being held above the fray and presented as a messiah to voters but his apostles are ACORNers and worse-types like , Ayers and Bernadine Dorhn, Van Jones, Mark Lloyd, and a generation of liberal teachers and professors in our schools and universities. While we get upset and shout at the tv, his apostles are indoctrinating/subverting the "American Idol" crowd.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

tbaker, I think Glenn Beck takes part in hate speech through exaggeration and false indignation. He once said on his show: "Hang on, let me just tell you what I'm thinking. I'm thinking about killing Michael Moore, and I'm wondering if I could kill him myself, or if I would need to hire somebody to do it. No, I think I could. I think he could be looking me in the eye, you know, and I could just be choking the life out -- is this wrong?"

Talking about killing someone because he disagrees with that person's views certainly qualifies as "hate speech" in my book. This is just one instance. His comparisons of Obama with Hitler and his speeches with Nazi propoganda are others. However, these have nothing to do with racism. I have no idea if Beck is or isn't a racist, but his comparing Obama's health care reform ideas with a "watermelon," is certainly questionable. Certainly you don't actually believe that Beck is unaware of the historically racist symbolism of invoking watermelons, do you?

I do find it interesting how those who say they are tired of the racist accusations coming from the left would be so quick to back Beck's calling Obama a racist. If you are tired of such accusations, shouldn't that go both ways?

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Beatrice - you are perfectly entitled to think and believe Beck's delivery / style / showmanship / format, etc, etc are "wrong." There are days I agree with that assessment. Some of the techniques he uses offend me personally, but I'm glad to see you don't feel the man is a racist. Bigot perhaps, purveyor of poor taste sometimes, but not a racist.

I'm not doubting you here, but I'd have to view the piece on Michael Moore before I could agree with the "hate speech" label being used in that instance. There is quite a lot of pretty edgy parody and satire going on these days. Not that it's an excuse for Beck to behave inappropriately, but I question why a lot of folks don't approach the things John Stewert, Bill Mauer, Dave Letterman, Chris Rock, etc do with the same disdain they seem to have for Mr. Beck's comedic style. To answer your question yes, it most certainly (should) go both ways.

I think it would be a tad naive not to assign at least part of the reason there is a flap about Beck is because American popular culture is decidedly biased in favor of the liberal political ideology. Beck's growing popularity has allowed him to break into pop culture and I think thats a bit of a shock to the preponderance of the entertainers and pundits who have heretofore not had to compete with people that do not share their ideals.

whynaut 5 years, 9 months ago

I think the conflict of interest between news and entertainment is pretty apparent in the highest rated news sources of our country. Quality journalism is hard to come by from an organization whose executives' salaries are comprised in part by revenues from "Countdown with Keith Olberman" and in part by revenues from "Celebrity Circus". Both shows are teats on the same pig.

The dilution of responsibility and accountability in such mega media outlets as Fox, NBC, ABC, and CBS has led to a dilution of journalistic integrity (not to mention a dilution of entertainment value). For true journalistic integrity, you've got to seek out organizations whose sole agenda is providing meaningful information to the public. And for a healthy world view, it behooves one to seek out such organizations whose socio-political flavors appeal to a wide range of palates.

I think the root of the problem is not so much the rantings of outspoken pundits, but the ratings-driven punditocracy that has come to supplant real journalism as America's news source. It has actually become a chore to seek unbiased truth these days, and it seems like many American's just don't really care all that much, or don't have the time or the energy. The unfortunate side effect of this phenomenon is that the minds of voters and policy makers are becoming preoccupied with sound bites and their official responses to them, rather than education and intellectual insight on real world issues.

And it's a non-partisan travesty. Puppets on the left and puppets on the right are worn by the same gargantuan mediabeast, frothing at the mouth for the tasty attentions of glazed-eyed Americans. All it would take for a positive change is for people to stop paying attention to it; starve the beast. Of course that may be much easier said than done in a country where apparently the only thing more delightful than hurling poo at one another, is watching others hurl poo at one another (as evidenced by the popularity of reality television and the comments section of the LJW).

In any event, I've resorted to getting all my news from the Onion.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

tbaker, Rush Limbaugh has been around for years, so I don't think it accurate to argue that the left's response to Beck is just out of shock that someone with such views could be popular with a segment of the viewing population. In reality, we've all been there and seen that. I think much of the response is more about the substance of what he is actually saying. Calling the President a racist who hates White people warrants criticism. When he is saying these things, he is crossing a line. He is no longer "entertaining," but inciting.

Just an observation, but do you think Beck to be a comedian? Most don't, yet you compare him to Stewart, Mauer, Letterman and Rock, all of whom are comedians. Dennis Miller actually says far more inflammatory things about the left than Beck, but when taken in the context of a comedy routine he doesn't stand out from the others. I'd think a better comparison would be with Olbermann, since he also pretends to be a newsman. The only difference, as others have noted, is that Olbermann isn't nearly as popular with left-leaning viewers.

Now, for something we can agree on, go check out Jon Nicom's article on bad tattoos, then go to the website he discusses. Page after page of bad tattoos. Funny and sad, all rolled into one, and all too stupid for words -- but some of the words written about the bad tattoos are pretty darn funny.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

I was typing before whynaut posted his/her comment. Well said, and I agree completely.

Cait McKnelly 5 years, 9 months ago

"If the Left bothered to hang out where conservatives do and take seriously their concerns about a country to which they pay taxes and for which many of them, or their parents, or children have fought, maybe they would understand what has so many upset."


This sentence just absolutely infuriates me. Because I'm on the left I don't pay taxes? My family hasn't fought in this country's wars? My father and all four of his brothers fought in WW II. I come from a generation that lost a fair percentage of it's males to an undeclared war. I work and pay taxes like any other average person. Who is the elitist in this article? Because it sure as heck isn't me! This is a rank insult. An implication that people on the left are "lazy", "over educated" and "unpatriotic". It's the same swill pushed by Beck, Hannity and Limbaugh. Hey, Cal, stuff it where the sun don't shine.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

"Liberty_One (Anonymous) says… tomatogrower (Anonymous) says…

“So, Liberty, you now disagree with Beck and Thomas,”

  1. Who's Thomas?"

And by the way Liberty, why don't you try reading the articles you are commenting on. This article was written by Cal Thomas. A supposed conservative, who has made some hypocritical comments above that no one wants to face. Some of his comments were downright socialist. So now Thomas is a socialist?

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 9 months ago

"After reading YWN's 11:34, I must query, why didn't Air America, Al Franken and other leftist hate-spewers make it three, four, five and six years ago?"

As Jonas hinted, the "left" in america is much more diverse in opinion than the right. There is not one "message" that would appeal to a wide enough audience. The american right seems to be in much more of a lock-step mentality.

The other reason is that those on the "left" do not cotton to lying and exaggeration, whether it it done by those with whom they disagree or agree.

The very medium that Beck represents (exaggerating, distorting, sometimes lying, but always screamed loudly and with certainty) is not appealing to many on the left.

There are many reasons for this, but it seems that those on the american right are in lock step and really take to the shrill, screamy, half-truth distortions of shows like Beck's.

yourworstnightmare 5 years, 9 months ago

I will restate that Beck, Limbaugh and O'Reilly are entertainers who say things to make money. I would throw in Olbermann as well.

The difference is that these clowns are what passes for political leadership on the right and in the GOP these days.

Sad.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

Beatrice, the "bad tatoo's" page was a riot! LMAO! What a great way to start a weekend! Thanks

I also enjoyed your use of the difference between "entertaining" and "inciting." Very insightful. I plan to plagiarize it soon. Fair warning.

Beck, like many others, can't be labeled with any one description. To hear him tell it, he "enlightens and entertains." I believe people in pop culture find it useful from both a marketing, and accountability stand point to not allow themselves to be labeled any one way - which assumes of course somebody is going to make a distinction one way or another. The line between journalist and clown has become very blurry in today's media environment. It reminds me of why I always brought a pocketful of matchbox cars and candy to church, in the hope my kids would behave and at least pretend to pay attention. TV is a lot like that these days. With all the other things competing for your time, they have to give you a good reason to sit there and watch it. You're not there to be informed by just-the-facts journalism anymore. You have the internet for that.

In today's massive and maddeningly ignorant overuse of the word, anyone calling anyone else a racist most certainly warrants close scrutiny, and more often than not, criticism as well. I heard Beck called / inferred the President was a racist. I didn't see it. I need to go look at it. Its highly suspect on it's face simply because I believe the office of the President deserves an extra measure of decorum. Hearing someone call the President a racist bothers me regardless of context - and that goes for all Presidents because like them or not, they are everyone's President. Baseless denigration of the President harms us all, past and present.

james bush 5 years, 9 months ago

That g d Fox!...... just interrupted Beck's program to carry another Obama episode of propagandizing!

james bush 5 years, 9 months ago

Maybe Obama is Messiah.............he's ubiquitous!.......on tv at least. Hope his image does not start appearing on buildings everywhere like Mao or Stalin or Saddam Hussein, etc.

tbaker 5 years, 9 months ago

In explaining why left-wing talk shows didn't survive, YWN says: "The other reason is that those on the “left” do not cotton to lying and exaggeration, whether it it done by those with whom they disagree or agree."

OMG....just when I was finishing a pleasant exchange with Beatrice and looking forward to hitting the mini-fridge out in the shop to start my weekend, I read this.

Please tell me someone has stolen your LJW computer identity and is determined to see you win "the most blindly partisan, completely baseless and moronic statement ever typed on this blog" award.

grammaddy 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck is the new Cronkite?!?!!!Geez, Walter I'm so sorry.

REALLY!!!!

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

tbaker, look no further. Here is a clip of Beck (not the musician) calling President Obama "a racist" and that he believes Obama has demonstrated time and time again a "deep seated hatred of white people or 'white culture'...." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxLJVVhcDqE

The context does not alter the meaning in any way. His hatred of our President is evident. Sad.

I'd like to hear him explain exactly what "White culture" is.

Scott Drummond 5 years, 9 months ago

"After reading YWN's 11:34, I must query, why didn't Air America, Al Franken and other leftist hate-spewers make it three, four, five and six years ago?”

Because their message and shows do not serve the interests of the handful of major media conglomerates that control most forms of media in this country.

headdoctor 5 years, 9 months ago

Marion (Marion Lynn) says… Liberty_One (Anonymous) says… Isn't Beck the guy that called Obama a racist? ” Marion writes: I dunno but Barack Hussein Obama is a racst, so what's the issue?


It takes one to know one.

CHANDLER007 5 years, 9 months ago

unsavoryagent (Anonymous) says…

I think we should all wear the same clothes, too. Maybe a nice chandler-jacket.


I believe you missed my point. We are becoming bitterly divided, when we should be standing strong as "One nation under God". Too many accusations, generalizations directed at one party or another, blaming whichever side you're not on. One of the prior posts had asked what the Liberals are so afraid of. Well, my fear is the major rift growing in our country. We're going to disagree, and that's just a fact of life, but must we always be so stubborn and hateful about it? Just because we disagree, it doesn't mean I'm right and you're wrong or that I'm evil and you're a saint. It's natural to disagree on things but we must find some common ground upon which to stand. When I read on these posts that all Democrats/liberals are crazy socialists or that all Republicans/conservatives are bible-thumping racists, it saddens me. I'm proud to live in a country of such diversity and I would have it no other way; however, I believe we need to try to get along, to co-exist, find some common ground. We each get one chance at Life; don't you think it would be better spent helping one another up than knocking each other down? And before you jump to yet another concluson, I'm talking about being decent to one another, compassion, empathy, understanding, not "take from the wealthy to give to the poor"... I don't want us all to be carbon copies of one another or "wear the same clothes". Try having an open mind for a few minutes. You might just grow as an individual.

MyName 5 years, 9 months ago

Yet another worthless waste of paper and bandwidth by good ole Cal.

"Here's another football for you to punt, Chuck! No really, this article will actually have something worth talking about, I swear!"

And I think it's hilarious how Call is complaining about a leadership vacuum "in this country" when he really means "in the GOP". When the party of Goldwater, Reagan and Buckley has turned into the party of Beck, Limbaugh, and Palin, you know it's in a world of hurt.

jayhawklawrence 5 years, 9 months ago

Everytime I ever tried to listen to Glenn Beck, I found him to be an arrogant blabber mouth with a grandiose self image not supported by the volume of endless wind blowing out of his oversized mouth.

I would very much like to see some intelligent Republicans and hear them speak coherently about current issues but it has not happened for a very long time.

All I have been hearing from that side of the aisle is that Obama is a Socialist, Communist, Muslim, opportunist, liar, mentally ill, etc., etc.

The Republicans are responsible for the hatefulness we are seeing in the political climate in America. We want to see leaders worthy of our respect and we get Beck, Limbaugh, Palen, Cheney, George Bush, Rumsfeld, and on and on.

It is like one bad joke after another, A long long line of endless losers. Who is driving this train?

---An independent

more_cowbell 5 years, 9 months ago

The government screws us no matter which party is in power. Beck and Thomas would have us believe that the "conservatives" are indeed holier than the unwashed masses and have a divine right to lead. Olbermann and Krugman would have us believe that the "liberals" are indeed smarter than the unwashed masses and have a scientifically proven right to lead.

Both big parties are corrupted to the core. How could it be otherwise? They've taken turns feeding at the trough of lobby money while excluding any real possibility of true competition in the American polity. The system is rigged in favor of the duopoly that runs it.

Beck is a loudmouthed, self-righteous, circus act. So is Olbermann. And any of us who watch them are proving P.T. Barnum's dictate...

Satirical 5 years, 9 months ago

Why wasn't Beck getting as much attention when he was acting the same way when Bush was in office and was highly critical of his policies? Oh yeah, he was in the liberal media mainstream then. Criticizing a Republican is typical for an entertainer, but criticizing the Obama administration will cause the smear tactics to commence. Beck is popular among conservatives so of course the liberal attacks dogs are set loose. No double standard here at all.

I seriously want to know if anyone who has watched more than YouTube clips of Glenn Beck ever watched him when he criticized Bush almost every night while on CNN.

Beck shoots from the hip most of the time and sometimes puts his foot in his mouth (as if you don't), but is a talented entertainer and self-deprecating humor is refreshing in an age of narcissism. Guess what, if you don't like him, don't watch him. And anyone who adopts all of the political opinions of entertainers like Glenn Beck or Michael Moore is an idiot. But that doesn't mean they can't have a valid point sometimes.

Sigmund 5 years, 9 months ago

“After reading YWN's 11:34, I must query, why didn't Air America, Al Franken and other leftist hate-spewers make it three, four, five and six years ago?”

scott3460 (Anonymous) says… "Because their message and shows do not serve the interests of the handful of major media conglomerates that control most forms of media in this country."

Well that and nobody listened to Air America. American media is capitalistic will put anyone's ideology on air as longs as they can attract an audience and sell ads. Nobody wants to buy ad time when nobody is listening, that is what NPR is for.

Satirical 5 years, 9 months ago

Sigmund... "Nobody wants to buy ad time when nobody is listening, that is what NPR is for."

LOL, I actually listen to NPR a lot.

kansasmutt 5 years, 9 months ago

Glenn Beck = Worst waste of airtime on any TV. He and FOX news should be banned from the airwaves. He and Rush should move to an island far far away. ( look out little furry jungle critters )

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"He and FOX news should be banned from the airwaves."

Boo. The level of disinformation they contribute pales to the level contributed by political censorship where it's allowed to thrive.

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

I enjoy Glen Beck and O'Reilly. In fact they are the closest news channel between innings. You just got to go from channel 36 to 39. But when Hannity is on, I go to channel 41.

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

This liberal media conspiracy theory is totally out of whack too. News is comparable to a grocery store. Whatever you like, you can go out and buy it. From what I see there is so much information coming out from both the left and right, it would be incorrect to say there is a liberal media bias. But after weighing everything, my cumulative experience here on this earth tells me that the right is the whackier of the two.

Scott Drummond 5 years, 9 months ago

"American media is capitalistic will put anyone's ideology on air as longs as they can attract an audience and sell ads."

Untrue. Broadcast radio is one of the most pervasive forms of media. The average American listens to something like 19 hours of radio per week. AM talk radio is second only to country music in audience share. Approximately 90 percent of the talk radio programing is conservative & 9 percent progressive. This in a country in which 35-40 percent of the vote is reliably Democratic.

Anyone over the age of 40 can remember the time when media consolidation had not reached current levels and there was a wider variety of local and diverse talk radio. It is undeniable that as media consolidation has placed programming decisions in the hands of fewer and fewer large business entities, the programming offered has trended toward the conservative and then right wing idealology that is supportive of the corporate mindset. Dave Dawson discussing the Kennedy assassination, or Mike Murphy exploring local events or UFOs has been replaced with a steady and constant stream of idiots screeching right wing talking points. When 90 percent of the offerings are conservative talk shows, it is not terribly surprising that conservative talk shows dominate the ratings. An undiverse ownership yields undiverse product offerings. Change the rules on the ownership of the media and you would get different offerings and a different result.

BrianR 5 years, 9 months ago

Who cares about this crap anyway... On the other hand, the Devil Dog coffee rocks -- got some yesterday.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"Nobody wants to buy ad time when nobody is listening, that is what NPR is for."

Well, "nobody listening" isn't NPR's problem--

"NPR's Morning Edition is the second-most-listened-to radio show in America, with an audience just slightly smaller than Rush Limbaugh's. All Things Considered slides in at No. 3. In many cities in the country, the local public radio station tops the local ratings. Nationally:

More than half of NPR's daily audience comes from its two "core" news shows, Morning Edition and the evening All Things Considered. Morning Edition's average daily audience, 7.6 million, is now about 60 percent larger than the audience for Good Morning America on ABC and about one-third larger than the audience for the Today show on NBC."

http://www.najp.org/articles/2009/03/the-npr-squeeze---audience-is.html

So the combined listenership of NPR's two leading programs actually exceeds that of Limbaugh.

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

If you spot someone who says NPR is a lefty program watch out. To me it is just a news show and a good source of information. If conservatives object it is only because NPR is not telling them what they want to hear.

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

Came late to this, but there's little to comment on in the thread. Except for a few salient comments from tomatogrower, liberty_one, beatrice, CHANDLER007 (good 1856, 25 Sep BTW), and others, there are little more than the usual rants, name calling and so on.

Someone raised the question about Cal Thomas' and Glenn Beck's hypocracy regarding accountability and bonuses. Are they for accountability and do large bonuses bother them, or are they against accountability and do large bonuses not bother them? Prior to November they didn't care about accountability and large bonuses didn't bother them. Now, it's the other way around. Which is it? All they've done is show themselves to be entertainers, using "news" and current events as a vehicle. They play to a vocal audience with preconceived opinions who listen to only what they want to hear.

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

It is our ideologies that are so ingrained that we often seek news sources to reinforce our beliefs. And when the two do not reconcile we get the likes of Cal Thomas, and to be fair Olberman. This polarization can really foster a lot of bad things. Just look at Cal's article and see how many times he uses the words left, right, conservative and liberal. This is like a "two sizes fits all" philosophy totally bereft of value.

To expand on the great Twain quote: "Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please". This is nothing new, and it is really what is going on today.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"And what/who's next?"

I think Beck is probably peaking. His hysterical rantings about ACORN and Van Jones managed to derail each, for the moment, but I'll guarantee you that we've not heard the last of either-- quite the contrary. They'll both be back, even if in slightly different roles.

Simple fact is, with Beck, there's just no there there. But he'll probably continue to entertain the fringe-otics at Fox and on squawk radio until he's run off all of his potential sponsors.

"And when the two do not reconcile we get the likes of Cal Thomas, and to be fair Olberman."'

I understand the desire to position oneself "in the middle" by equating two supposed polar opposites. But there is no comparison between Beck and Olberman, other than the fact that neither hesitates to openly declare their political leanings. There is a very big difference in that Olberman bases his commentaries on fairly well-established facts. Beck, not so much.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"like when they failed to report the Spanish judge who was going to go after “The Bush Six” spent eight years in prison for colluding with terrorists–little stuff like that."

And what facts are you omitting in this little blurb, ToM?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

Wikipedia is hardly definitive source (especially considering its frequent conservative bias), but there is absolutely nothing in the article about Judge Baltasar Garzon's supposed prison sentence, Tom. Can you provide a source for us?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltasar_Garzón

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom, I hear what you are saying. Part of the problem is taking a sample of occurence and extrapolating it to the whole set (which the media often does). But sound political philsophy should not be mutually exclusive thus creating two comfortable camps like the left and right. It would be nice if this were the case, but it just ain't so. Unfortunately there are a lot of issues which are not black and white.

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom, I understand Beck really well. He's a talking head entertainer who uses gotcha journalism, slanted "news", and selected current events to play to a particular audience. He's found his niche and he's sticking with it. I won't even mention is "grass roots" 9/12 organization - that was talked about all summer. (I was called everything but a Child of God by children from KC when I said things against Glenn Beck's 9/12 organization. Let's not go through that again, it gets very onerous.)

Regarding Faux News, you're citing viewership numbers taken from their own "unbiased" research. That should say enough there, unless you don't understand bias in research.

BTW, you didn't respond to my statement about hypocracy. I can only assume you agree with me on that subject.


Camper, your comment, "Part of the problem is taking a sample of occurence and extrapolating it to the whole set (which the media often does)," is very apropos. This is true even here on the unbiased LJW forum threads.

bondmen 5 years, 9 months ago

Weep, cry, whine and lament all you want but Glenn's new book Arguing with Idiots: How to Stop Small Minds and Big Government is currently No. 2 on Amazon.

camper 5 years, 9 months ago

Rove, Rice, Cheney and Bush (sounds like a dish) are people who are doing good and made the decision to step into public persona. This is their bed made and one they must sleep on. They are folks who reached for the wheel and steered the ship. They are doing just fine and they deserve no sympathy from us, probably not wanting it anyway. The fact is though that they made a lot of bad decisions and also took office when the natural rebound of boom and bust economic affairs (which were building up for a long time) kicked them in the butt. In my opinion, they are good people, but open for critique.

true_patriot 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck is a sad case indeed, and hard not to feel sorry for. His lust for celebrity and money have turned someone who probably started out as a decent kid years ago into a national freak show.

boltzmann 5 years, 9 months ago

bondmen (Anonymous) says… "Weep, cry, whine and lament all you want but Glenn's new book Arguing with Idiots: How to Stop Small Minds and Big Government is currently No. 2 on Amazon."

and Bud Light is the best selling American beer, but that still doesn't make it any good.

BrianR 5 years, 9 months ago

2 - a testament to the stupidity of the average American.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

I agree with bondmen. Glenn Beck is indeed #2.

For you South Park fans, he measures highly on the Couric scale.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom: "Again, no sympathy from TS, as I will never forget the hate during the Bush years."

But ... but, Bush!

Sad, especially coming from someone who, when being honest with himself, recognized what a poor job Bush did as President. Sad, and dishonest.

beatrice 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom, on a completely different subject, I know you are a Pink Floyd fan. I saw the Australian Pink Floyd show last night, and it was a lot of fun. They are going to be in KC in a couple of days. You should go. I'm sure you would enjoy it.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Bozo - "There is a very big difference in that Olberman bases his commentaries on fairly well-established facts. Beck, not so much"

Why don't you give us some examples Bozo.

Oh, Iran and the nukes - still nothing??

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

“Weep, cry, whine and lament all you want but Glenn's new book Arguing with Idiots: How to Stop Small Minds and Big Government is currently No. 2 on Amazon.”

Yes, and currently "Cloudy With a Chance of Meatballs" is the tops in the box office. Must be a very insightful movie.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0844471/

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"This administration has done more to HURT race relations in the last 8 months than the previous 2 decades combined helped the efforts."

Flicker. . . please don't be absurd.

/just doing a backcheck

christie 5 years, 9 months ago

Beck and ilk are easy to understand.

They hate America.

BrianR 5 years, 9 months ago

christie (Anonymous) says… "Beck and ilk are easy to understand. They hate America."

Clearly.

I turned the TV to this guy's show last night and was pretty shocked by some of the b.s. coming out of his mouth. If his kind of talk doesn't spark some nutcake from taking a shot at the President, I don't know what will.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"They had no problem with the vile, hateful spew coming out of the far-left blogo and the likes of Olbermann and his Bush-hating, far-left contemporaries."

You're making that up. As you do with most of your assertions.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

/proof is in the pudding, after all. Olberman's prime time show is getting creamed by Beck's nighttime rerun. Isn't that what you, yourself, willingly, brought up not so long ago? What does that say, if not that the left (whoever they are) is not interested in what Olbermann has to say?

/please, tell me what else that could say. I haven't had a laugh this morning just yet.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

jonas_opines (Anonymous) says…

“This administration has done more to HURT race relations in the last 8 months than the previous 2 decades combined helped the efforts.”

Flicker… please don't be absurd.


Actually you would be the one that's absurd if you don't see where even Obama himself has taken race relations in this country BACKWARDS. You choose to ignore what you don't want to see or admit. To be expected though of somebody who pays allegiance to only one side of a party line like yourself.

Corey Williams 5 years, 9 months ago

Some crazy Glenn Beck quotes:

"I'm thinking about killing Michael Moore...I could kill him myself, or…hire somebody to do it...No, I think I could." – 2005

"You know, we all have our inner demons…I’m on the verge of moral collapse at any time. It can happen by the end of the show." – 2006

"Al Gore's not going to be rounding up Jews and exterminating them." – 2007

"The most used phrase in my administration if I were to be President would be ‘What the hell you mean we're out of missiles?’" – 2009

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"To be expected though of somebody who pays allegiance to only one side of a party line like yourself."

That would be the difference between you and me, actually. I checked your comment history for several pages to get an idea of where you stand, and you just make assumptions. I'm a registered independent, I hate both parties, frankly, (which just about everybody here but the wingnut ideologues recognizes at this point) and this level of response to race, from both attackers and counterattackers, has been shown over and over again to simply be inevitable when you have a minority pioneer into a white-dominated field. Like all inevitabilities, it will pass, and we will move on.

If the only race problem you can see in this country from the existence of this administration is from the administration itself (the only part that You have acknowledged, unless I missed a reference in one of your posts) then you are simply blind, and not worthy of further discussion.

I will admit that there have been many cases of people wrongfully bringing in race. Carter's being the most recent and egregious. Will you admit that there have been a great many cases of people being flat racist since Obama was put forth as a candidate? Examples of both are rife looking no farther than just this forum.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

J-O, I've given specific comments on where I stand in regards to racism and again you chose not to cite those. Yes the Carter debacle was yet another one. Why on earth you would choose an articles forum to have a one on one with me speaks for itself. Send me a message if you are somehow internally irked by something I've said to personally offend you or your independent views.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"Actually you would be the one that's absurd if you don't see where even Obama himself has taken race relations in this country backwards."

I agree. Those colored folks have gotten way too uppity, and it's gotten worse and worse ever since the 14th Amendment. Now they went and got one of 'em elected President. It's fully understandable why respectable white folks like you and Glenn Beck are finally saying "enough," flicker.

Scott Drummond 5 years, 9 months ago

Another glimpse in to the mind of Glenn Beck:

Health-care reform and other policies are "transforming America, and they're all driven by President Obama's thinking on one idea: reparations."

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

Yea, you got it Bozo - I'm a white racist that's had enough. Awesome. Perhaps it's just that it's disappointing to see many folks in this country whom you have never even seen talk about racism start to bring it up. Yes J-O there's defintily a segment of the country that is outraged a black man is in the power seat but if you honestly think these people are the ones who write on these boards you are fooling yourself. Too many times BO has played the race card himself (black caucus speaches, Gates incident, want more?) and that's what upsetting many of us who don't want race as a factor in American life. J-O I do hope you are right though in that over time it will pass.

Bozo, Iran and the nukes? Care to retract that one?

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"Yes J-O there's defintily a segment of the country that is outraged a black man is in the power seat but if you honestly think these people are the ones who write on these boards you are fooling yourself."

Errr. . . so tell me, did you actually read the blog Marion wrote that I linked to, and referred to, in multiple posts the last time we had any interaction? There are a few that are pretty obvious for anyone with eyes, even on this board. About as many, I opine, as the other side, like Bozo, who want to take the convenient road of racism for any and every issue here.

"Why on earth you would choose an articles forum to have a one on one with me speaks for itself."

Could you try and restate that, I don't understand. Are you vexed by my backcheck reference, or my actually choosing to argue specifically with you over several posts?

I don't do PMs, especially not for back and forth. Let the comment record remain for all to see and reference if necessary. And you haven't offended me in any way. At this point, that is very hard to do. If I see something that I think is right, wrong, foolish, absurd, etc. I will comment on it. I'm sorry if that somehow displeases you.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"Bozo, Iran and the nukes? Care to retract that one?"

What am I supposed to retract?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"About as many, I opine, as the other side, like Bozo, who want to take the convenient road of racism for any and every issue here."

I disagree with this statement. I really don't know if politicians like Joe Wilson or talking heads like Beck are really racists or merely opportunists and demagogues tapping into barely latent racist sentiments within their constituencies and viewing audiences.

However, that level of cynicism is really just as bad as racism, isn't it?

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"I disagree with this statement."

Yes, I'm sure you do.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

As I've said before, jonas, just because you try to stake out the middle ground doesn't mean you're always right.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

Yes, I'm sure that's true. There is, after all, a reason that I use the present-tense colloqial term for "to express an opinion" as part of my name.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

Fair enough, but I'll object to your opinions when you use me as a foil in staking out the middle ground.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

For the record, jonas, while we don't always agree, I generally find you to be one of the more thoughtful posters on this forum (and I don't mean that as a back-handed compliment.)

Boosh 5 years, 9 months ago

Television executives have a really, really, really hard time supporting anything original. So they go the safe route and market copycat shows. These are what Beck, Olbermann et al are. I'll stick with the Daily Show thank you very much.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

I'll take the compliment as it is, Bozo, but to be honest I try to simply evaluate things as equally and unbiasedly as I can, rather that deliberately staking out the middle.

I'm sure I fail at that from time to time to, but if I was omniscient I'd also be omnipotent, and then none of this would be an issue.

Regardless, I stand by the statement that you have been overusing the race card. Frankly, even when I've been defending some specific examples, I think it would be better if it was just let go, except perhaps in the most obvious examples, such as whatever profile Invictus is using to date or Marion.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

Poor right-thinker, something other than constant negativity based on partisan politics just blows some fuses in your mind, doesn't it?

/"Who's right-thinker?" //just some guy //preemptive

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

I tend to save my blogs for less obvious things.

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom, After looking through several posts since I asked about hypocracy and finding no reply, salient or otherwise, I can only assume you agree with me at some base level you can't deny.


Jonas, your 1127, "Poor (insert name), something other than constant negativity based on partisan politics just blows some fuses in your mind, doesn't it?" can apply to any number of posters on these forums on both sides of the fence. Excellent observation.


Just an observation, but this thread seems to have run its course. It's no longer a discussion of Cal Thomas' article. Rather it has degenerated into a clash of diametrically opposed viewpoints accompanied by rants, taunts and potshots across the walls. Took two days though, I'm impressed.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"can apply to any number of posters on these forums on both sides of the fence."

Oh yes.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

Glenn Beck is just another guy/person like Limbaugh or Malkin who is trying to make a buck off of white rage.

They aren't running for office. They aren't trying to change the system. They are trying to selling advertising spots and sign contracts.

They aren't in the front lines. They aren't leading the protest. They aren't taking up a rifle and leading the resistance.

They are just trying to make a buck by latching onto populist sentiments. If you look at it from that perspective it's much more difficult for them to piss you off.

flicker 5 years, 9 months ago

J-O – Um, I mean Mr. Independent, it sure is nice to have somebody on here as bright and intelligent as you are with an unbiased middle of the ground outlook on topics. We sure are lucky (enter sarcasm here).

I do wonder why, in this blue county that we live in, why we have never seen an article, or an overabundance of comments, written about "Understanding Keith Olbermann" or "Understanding Rachel Maddow". Probably not going to happen since the majority of media outlets do lean to the left.

J-O, as much as you rip Fox News being an Independent is a little hard to believe. If you were a true independent you would listen to ALL news sources and evaluate what is B.S. and what is not with each of them. They all have B.S. mixed in with some level of truths and to get the most realistic interpretation of what’s going on in this country one has to listen to them all – not to the ones who just preach what you want to here. Anytime I hear somebody get all uppity about a particular news outlet (leaning to the left or right) I usually lose the respect for their opinions fairly quick.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 9 months ago

"Regardless, I stand by the statement that you have been overusing the race card."

Perhaps so, but I'd need more specific examples to really evaluate your opinion. I'm sure we each have better things to do.

Regardless, I see racism, latent, overt or otherwise, as an especially ugly symptom of the underlying pathology-- the fear and incuriousness of the unknown, and the retreat into that which is comfortable, whether it's narrow tribalism, or an ideology or religion, particularly a conservative one. So even if someone considers themselves colorblind, if they are generally of a reactionary bent because of a desire to preserve the status quo, the net result is the same, even if somewhat unintended.

Scott Drummond 5 years, 9 months ago

"They aren't running for office. They aren't trying to change the system. They are trying to selling advertising spots and sign contracts."

Beck is the subject of a pretty well known advertiser boycott and has bled most of his significant advertisers. And yet, the owners of CNN continue to keep him and his message on the air. Why?

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

“They aren't running for office. They aren't trying to change the system. They are trying to selling advertising spots and sign contracts.”

Beck is the subject of a pretty well known advertiser boycott and has bled most of his significant advertisers. And yet, the owners of CNN continue to keep him and his message on the air. Why?

=========

He's not on CNN anymore. He's on Fox.

And he's on Fox because he makes them money.

mmather 5 years, 9 months ago

Fox and Glenn Beck have found a motherlode in the big lie technique. Death Panels et.al. provide easy codewords to people that are easily made afraid of change. The fact that Obama is Black helps their cause. The cesspool that Bush walked away from is not going to be fixed overnight. Beck is quick to criticize but offers no solution of his own. 8 years of Bush may take 20 years to fix and Americans want eveything now. That Beck surrounds himself with '50s TV fantasies indicates his delusional state. That Disneyesque and Leave it to Beaver world existed only on television. Korea, The CIA in the Banana Republic wars, the Cold War, atom bomb drills for children, de facto segregation, locally the Greenlease abduction and murder, McCarthyism and wife beating with little recourse were also part of the 50's. Beck benefits from a strong enforcement of the first amendment but sometimes veers toward yelling Fire! in a crowded theatre.

Corey Williams 5 years, 9 months ago

Mr_Nancy_Boy_To_You (Tom Shewmon) says… "Corey demonstrates on behalf of the left that the left has no sense of humor. Beck is also a comedian, but takes his politics seriously."

So you don't think I have a sense of humor? If you knew me, you would find that I have a pretty varied sense of humor. But I am really, really glad that you don't know me, and vice versa. How is Beck a comedian? Was it a comedy routine when he showed how he would like to poison Pelosi, the third in line in the chain of command? Is that what passes for comedy in your sick, twisted little brain? I guess Fox viewers like you are the reason the "1/2 Hour News Hour" didn't last more than 13 episodes.

"Like Palin, and Rush, and O'Reilly, and Coulter, Beck is a threat and the left cannot stand it."

Palin is a quitter who had to go to five schools in six years before she got a degree; Rush is a thrice divorced, fat, recovering junkie; O'Reilly only missed out on a sexual harassment conviction by paying off the woman; Coulter is a man; and Beck is an insane recovering alcoholic and junkie.

"I think therefore I am not a republican."

(ps, did you get the joke about Coulter? Although she does have a prominent adams apple and has never been married after being around for over forty years...heck, she might just be a man!)

(Did you get that joke, Tom?)

And how could I leave this out?

Mr_Nancy_Boy_To_You (Tom Shewmon) says… "I think Todd Palin is pretty hot."

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

Tom. Oh my, a simple spelling error gives you an out so you can't answer a question. Why doesn't that surprise anyone? You know exactly what I meant. You just can't provide an answer supporting myopic tunnel-visioned views.

KS 5 years, 9 months ago

This is an old story. I guess the LJW is trying to set a new record of 2,000,000!

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