Widow: Gangs weren't involved / LJWorld.com

Archive for Thursday, February 9, 2006

February 9, 2006

There were no gang vendettas or hip-hop feuds involved in the shooting that left a man dead this weekend outside a downtown night club, according to the widow of the man shot and killed.

Instead, LaTonia Coleman said, the shooting happened after a senseless argument between her common-law husband, Robert Earl Williams, and a stranger outside the club who had interjected himself in a family-related dispute.

"I feel like he was shot and killed just from a misunderstanding," Coleman said.

Investigation continues

Coleman spoke out about the case Wednesday as police continued to seek leads in the shooting, which happened shortly before 2:15 a.m. Sunday after a hip-hop concert at the Granada, 1020 Mass. As of Wednesday, no arrests had been made, and police have said they were having a difficult time getting witnesses to talk.

Coleman appealed to any eyewitnesses to come forward with information.

She said she and her husband had been together for 14 years and had recently moved back to Lawrence after living briefly in Denver, where her husband worked as a janitor. He'd been staying with family in Topeka for the past week, she said, and planned to get a job in Lawrence through a temp agency.

Photo by Mike Yoder

LaTonia Coleman and her son, Robert Williams, 7, visit the scene of Sunday morning's shooting, where her husband, Robert Williams, was killed and another man was injured. Coleman, who was with Williams that night, says the shooting happened after a senseless argument between her husband and a stranger outside the Granada night club.

"Our mission was to come here, get work, get a place and be closer to family," she said.

'Not a gangbanger'

The couple went to the Granada show because Williams was a longtime family friend of Doe, the Denver-based hip-hop artist who was headlining the concert, she said.

They were looking for fun, not trouble. Williams was decked out in a suede outfit, $125 shoes and a wide-brimmed hat, she said.

"He looked clean cut," she said. "He's not a gangbanger. The man's 46 years old. ... He's retired from hustling, from the streets."

All the performers in the concert knew her husband, she said, and at one point he was up on the stage with them.

But during the show, she said, her husband began arguing with a female acquaintance of his adult daughter's. Several months ago, she said, Robert Williams and his daughter had a bitter dispute about money related to payment from his father's Social Security checks, and it remains a sensitive topic, she said.

Argument escalates

The argument continued outside the club after the show ended, Coleman said. They were raising their voices and cursing, she said, when a young man who didn't know any of the people involved confronted Williams about the argument, saying "Why are you all up in her face?"

The two men then began arguing. Coleman said her husband "was mad because this man was making a comment on an argument that had nothing to do with him."

Then, she said, the other man pulled his coat aside to show a gun stuffed into his waistband. Coleman said she pulled her husband back and one of the hip-hop performers who was leaving the club came and broke up the fight.

At that point, she said, she and her husband got in their car and drove around to the alley behind the Granada, where they had been told a limousine would be arriving to take the hip-hop artists to an after-party in Kansas City. The couple planned to follow the limousine to the party, she said.

But when they drove around back, they were told the limousine was pulling up in front of the club. So they went back.

Shots fired

Coleman said she dropped her husband off in the crosswalk so that he could approach the limousine and find out the location of the party. She was driving south on Massachusetts Street when she heard five shots ring out.

She looked back and saw her husband running away from the crowd. A 22-year-old man - whom Coleman said she didn't know - also was shot and ran around the back of the Granada.

The 22-year-old was taken to a Kansas City hospital, but no official word was available Wednesday on his condition.

Williams made it halfway across Massachusetts Street and collapsed on the ground.

Coleman got out of the car and ran to him. Police said he was declared dead at the hospital, but Coleman said he died in her arms.

Karl Gehring/Journal-World Graphic

"He said to me, 'I love you,' and took a breath, and he was gone," she said.

Coleman said she didn't see the shooting, but she believes the person who shot her husband was the same person he'd argued with earlier. She described him as a dark-skinned black male about 5 feet 8 inches tall with a short "Afro"-style hairdo and wearing a plain black jacket.

"For us to leave and to drive off and come back, he must have thought that my husband had left to go get a gun," she said.

She believes the other man decided, at that point, to shoot first.

Discussion

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9 February 2006
at 4:56 a.m.

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merrill (Anonymous) says…

Too bad for the family. Concealed weapons in the wrong hands do not produce positive results.
9 February 2006
at 5:56 a.m.

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Kookamooka (Anonymous) says…

Blessings to the survivors. I can't believe people kill each other over words. It's ludicrous. What ever happened to “sticks and stones”?
9 February 2006
at 6:30 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Seems like the guy was provoking Williams so he would have a reason to show his piece off. The problem with concealed weapons is they can create a sense of empowerment which can lead to unneccesary confrontation. Had this guy not been carrying a weapon, chances are he probably would have never contronted Williams.
9 February 2006
at 7:36 a.m.

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sweetpeagj (Anonymous) says…

This is a sad story all around. He died over a fight about money with his daughter. I am not sure I agree with ben-ness though..many men have come to stand up for me when some guy was in my face. It has nothing to do with having a gun. Some men still believe that women should be treated with respect and not fought with. How do we know that this isn't one case where he honestly wanted to help. Yes, he showed his weapon, according to the widow, but they left. When they started driving around and then back again he could have thought just that. I am not defending either party in this. The man shouldn't have been shot for any reason but try to think what this other man thought for just a second. We are so quick to judge without thought of what escalated it. I am not sure why he had a gun in the first place but during the initial confrontation he didn't use it. What would cause him to use it after the driving around the club, then back again? I pray for all the families involved. But then again, the widow could say anything she wanted abut the incident and because it's in the paper it makes it truth. Why didn't she park while he was getting the info? Why drop him back off and leave the scene? If he already had a confrontation with this man why didn't she get out of the car and ask instead of him? Logic has to come into play at some point, and not every story because it is in print makes it truth. It reads well but then again..anything can be said because both witnesses are gone. One passed away and the other is hiding. How do you jump to the conclusion that the only reason was to show his piece? I guess standing up for a woman who is arguing with a man means you are carrying? Sorry, the logic is flawed in that statement.
9 February 2006
at 8:05 a.m.

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smitty (Anonymous) says…

Well that helps explain the loud arguing the limo driver referred to a couple of days ago on ch13.

Widow says Williams and her are not gang members. However she can't speak for the shooter. We don't know yet. But there was a close personal connection to the performers. And a highly disfunctional family situation in the mix.

She said it well when she explained that the shooter probably thought that a gun was brought back into the mix after they left and returned to Mass. Expected gun retribution with calm understanding from her(based on the ch 6 interview also) speaks to the the concerns previously expressed on the forum about guns and violence.

What is up with the evidence found in the alley 3 days after the shooting. Sounds like a bullet or cartridge from the vent of the article. That doesn't sound like all the bullets fired were out front of the Granada area, does it?

A change in LPD priorities? Over the last two days while walking several times down town I've seen two and three LPD cruisers, generally with some one pulled over but not always. There has been a definite increase in police activity during the daylight hours. I can't attest to the night time activity since I've not gone out after dark this week.
9 February 2006
at 8:10 a.m.

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mssking1 (Anonymous) says…

so, after all the talk the past few days about how bad hip-hop/rap are and the people who frequent and perform at these concerts, it finally comes out. It had nothing at all to do with the concert––bad bad Mike Elwell, you should be extremely embarrassed….all of you who assumed it was because of the concert…..what a citizenry we have here in Lawrence—too bad that most of those who made the assumption are actually the ones that seem to run our town. I am truly sorry for the lost life and the family he leaves behind…senseless death
9 February 2006
at 8:13 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

sweetpeagj - Do men get in your face often? I too would step in should it look like a confrontation between a man and a woman was about to turn violent - as any decent man or women would. However, we should also know our limits and know when to mind our own business. The question is, did this confrontation appear that it was going to turn violent or did the alleged shooter just want to show off the fact he was carrying a gun. There is no other reason to carry one in Lawrence as it really isn't a dangerous place. This guy was carrying a gun and he wanted people to know. No offense, sweetpeagj, but i think your reasoning is very flawed, naive, and illogical. I do, however, agree with you that we may never truly know what happened.

9 February 2006
at 8:42 a.m.

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weterica (Anonymous) says…

“This caliber of people would not have been hanging out in the street in front of the granada were it not for the hip-hop concert.”

You are right DonQ! Hip hop = poor quality people. You are so right!

It's kind of like when I was thinking of sending my kid to Veritas, but then I realized the terrible quality of all the people there.

I mean they had a trustee who not only dug kinky bondage sex, but he also killed his wife so he could get with his mistress—with their kids in the house no less!

It just goes to show you—like hip hop concerts—Christian schools and the people who support them are poor caliber!

Don, your intellect and reasoning is totally awesome!
9 February 2006
at 8:51 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

The widow was reflecting on the last night that she spent with her husband. Who cares if she mentioned the price of his shoes. That is one thing that came to mind in her interview. It doesn't matter what kind of shoes he was wearing but that is probably one thing the victim was proud of and one thing the widow thought of as she was being interviewed.

Sweatpea, you seem awfully insensitive to the victim's widow. Just kind of caught me off guard since you mentioned before that you are a family friend.
9 February 2006
at 8:54 a.m.

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kujayhawk93 (Anonymous) says…

“If a guy pulled a gun on me, I would either get the attention of a police officer nearby or get out of there.”

I hate to typecast the victim or make assumptions about his past, but I'm guessing he has seen plenty of guns in his life, and was not phased by seeing one more. The widow stated that he was “retired from hustling, from the streets”, so I imagine he was quite familiar with guns and and was much more desensitized to them than you or I would be.
9 February 2006
at 9:05 a.m.

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hockmano (Anonymous) says…

When will you people wake up and see this has nothing to do with hip hop? Someone referred to the”calibur of people” at the concert! Oh right! Everyone who listens to hip hop is a gang banger? And who are you to comment on someone's dysfunctional family? Everyone has had disagreements with a family member whether in public or private. Condolescences to the family.
9 February 2006
at 9:05 a.m.

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Tiamak (Anonymous) says…

“To sweetpeagj, it sounds like you like to incite arguments”. For anyone that thinks this was related to hip hop music you have no clue on life. Everyone is always trying to blame something on hip hop music. Though I don't agree with allot of the styles of hip hop music out there, but to always blame a fight or a shooting on this culture is stupid. Wake up Lawrence, and America. It is the world that we have created I got shot back in 97 at a club here in town and the first thing the press and the city wanted to do was blame it on the music. No it wasn't the music it was because of the acts of a car load boys who thought they where men. It goes back to being disciplined at a younger age and the images that we are subjected to through the means of delivering new and entertainment. You turn on the tv and watch the new and the first 15 minutes of the new is about someone being killed or some other kind of crime. This was a senseless crime because of some punk put his nose in someone elses business. So now he is running around who know where at thinking he is a man because he shot and killed someone. I believe in retribution by all means. If this guy is caught and brought to justice he should have the same fate as Mr. Williams. Yeah, yeah to wrongs do make a right, but it damn sure makes it even. Who knows what the real story is behind this tragic event. The Granada will now be linked to this ordeal until the doors close on it like it did when it was a movie theather. Just like Liquids is linked to two shootings because of its past history. Who know if there is a solution. But and arguement about that all might dollar that people worship more than god will always result into a stupid act of hate. So no mater how you look at this event it was a hate crime, for the simple fact when the punk pulled the trigger he had nothing but hate in the his soul for Mr. Williams.
9 February 2006
at 9:08 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

He probably had seen several guns in his life. If it was me I probably would have screamed and ran if someone showed me that they had a gun but it is different when you grow up around that stuff.

Whatever the motive and whatever happened I am praying for Ms. Coleman, the kids, and the rest of the family. God bless you!
9 February 2006
at 9:10 a.m.

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weterica (Anonymous) says…

Oh I know Don, I totally agree. There have been so many shootings at hip hop shows in Lawrence in the past few years that I'm surprised the Kaw isn't choked with blood from the run-off. It's crazy. I was shot in the leg just thinking about it!

“I'm saying that hip-hop attracts garbage and has more of it in its fanbase than most any other format.”

I love your indesputable facts, Don! They are great! Too bad you didn't have enough time to use endnotes!

It's kind of like the Catholic church attracts more molesters, and has more parents that want their kids to be molested than other groups.

See I can do it too! Don't get mad, buddy. I'm like you, totally reasonable!
9 February 2006
at 9:26 a.m.

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muffaletta (Anonymous) says…

mssking1: I think that people have been talking about the “type” of person hiphop & rap concerts attract. So …. ??

9 February 2006
at 9:45 a.m.

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badger (Anonymous) says…

That poor woman and her child.

I love how any tragedy around here seems to devolve into, “Why didn't person X handle the situation the way hindsight tells me I would have?”

How many people posting here have ever gotten into an argument in a bar? How many people have ever found themselves in a confrontation and not been entirely certain how it played out into you and some guy exchanging shouted insults and punches? How many people here have ever actually had someone pull a weapon on them, to *know* what you would or wouldn't have done, how you'd have handled it?

So she didn't park the car. Maybe she couldn't find a parking space. So he went over to the limo instead of just waiting to follow it. Maybe he's followed people before and knows that it's easier if you know where you're going in case you get separated. So he didn't get a cop. Maybe he just thought it was bluster, and once the tensions had backed down it things could cool off.

I'm sad that this woman has lost her husband and this child has lost his father.

To those of you who say hip-hop attracts lowlifes and trash: did you say the same thing about metal in December 2004? Did Darrell Abbott and Jeff Thompson die because metal attracts low class losers and violent types? Or are you just attacking hip-hop because you don't like it or the people who listen to it?
9 February 2006
at 9:47 a.m.

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smitty (Anonymous) says…

Arguing inside the club over the family problems(not dysfunctional?), continued arguing outside the venue and onto the public streets.

No ones business but their own?
The arguing is enough to get you ejected from the venue or security or the law called. The loud altercation on the sidewalks is enough to get you arrested for a variety of laws, try disturbing the peace for starters.

It is anyone's business that hears or witnesses the public disturbance be it on the public sidewalk or inside a private residence. Hell, if that loud argument was going on in the next apartment I'd call the law. Then you could explain your loud distubance to the police. Chances are there would be some legally mandated intervention.

Where does this idea come from that it was a personal affair hence requires a hands off by all, none of your business, a private affair? On yeah, that's where the illegal carrying of the guns comes into play. Don't mess with the publically loud and threatening argument or you'll get (shot)? So your preferred method is just let them clean out the gene pool without intervention?

Well that is what ended up happening, isn't it? The public welfare be damned!

BTW, does anyone know if this arguing had anything to do with the early closure of the concert?
9 February 2006
at 9:52 a.m.

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Rossp (Anonymous) says…

Sounds to me the daughter should be in some trouble for starting the argument to begin with…………
9 February 2006
at 9:54 a.m.

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Rossp (Anonymous) says…

Correction: the “female acquaintance”
9 February 2006
at 9:56 a.m.

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weterica (Anonymous) says…

Yeah, there are no hip-hop acts at the Grammies.

Here you go. Bye now!

A few Hip Hop Grammy nominees:

Record of the Year

''Feel Good Inc.,'' Gorillaz featuring De La Soul
''Gold Digger,'' Kanye West featuring Jamie Foxx

Album of the Year
Late Registration, Kanye West

Pop Performance by a Duo or Group with Vocal
''Don't Lie,'' The Black Eyed Peas

R&B Performance by a Duo or Group with Vocal
''So High,'' John Legend featuring Lauryn Hill

Rap Solo Performance
''Testify,'' Common
''Mockingbird,'' Eminem
''Disco Inferno,'' 50 Cent
''Number One Spot,'' Ludacris
''U Don't Know Me,'' T.I.
''Gold Digger,'' Kanye West

Rap Performance by a Duo or Group
''Don't Phunk With My Heart,'' The Black Eyed Peas
''The Corner,'' Common featuring The Last Poets
''Encore,'' Eminem featuring Dr. Dre & 50 Cent
''Hate It Or Love It,'' The Game featuring 50 Cent
''Wait (The Whisper Song),'' Ying Yang Twins

Rap Song
''Candy Shop,'' 50 Cent featuring Olivia
''Diamonds from Sierra Leone,'' Kanye West
''Don't Phunk With My Heart,'' The Black Eyed Peas
''Hate It Or Love It,'' The Game featuring 50 Cent
''Lose Control,'' Missy Elliot featuring Ciara & Fat Man Scoop

Rap Album
Be, Common
The Cookbook, Missy Elliot
Encore, Eminem
The Massacre, 50 Cent
Late Registration, Kanye West
9 February 2006
at 9:59 a.m.

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rednekbuddha (Kelly Powell) says…

seriously, there will never be a ban on a type of music in this town…that is just idiotic. But like the “slab” parties of the 80”(townies know what I'm talking about) eventually some stupid sh!t starts happening at one venue or another…..This is why the police crack down hard for awhile to put the fear of being busted into a crowd……Joe blow with a pocket full of warrants and a chip on his shoulder starts to fear that he will be arrested if he goes to the insane rebel urban youth comedy def jam show, and slowly but surely your average joe audience member starts having a good time again…..The only drawback is for awhile people will get busted for petty things(minor possesion, fake i.d, disturbing the peace)…..This sh!t is cyclic….it happens all the time, hip hop shows are just having their turn in the barrel.
9 February 2006
at 10:04 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Smitty - By circumstance it does become other peoples business if they happen to be in the vicinity; however, unless it appears a violent act is going to be committed or if they are disturbing the peace, then it is, for all intents and purposes, nobodies business other than their own. Everytime you see a couple or Father/Daughter arguing on a sidewalk do you intervene or call the police? I doubt it. Your argument is baseless and tantamount to armchair quarterbacking.
9 February 2006
at 10:12 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

I would think a simple “is everything okay” would be sufficient. That way if it's not one of those who is arguing can speak up or if they don't speak up they know that someone is keeping an eye on them in case things get out of hand. If the gun-toting individual was so worried about the girl who was arguing he could have notified the security guard of the argument. I think he just wanted to flash his gun to someone.

9 February 2006
at 10:29 a.m.

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slugger (Anonymous) says…

dhill—Get professional help.
9 February 2006
at 10:33 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

wassup slugger!
9 February 2006
at 10:36 a.m.

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slugger (Anonymous) says…

yeah_right—I agree he just wanted to show his gun. If you have no regard for human life then why would you care if a woman was getting yelled at. He wasn't trying to help, he was looking to start something with somebody.
9 February 2006
at 10:39 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

I am glad that we see eye to eye.
9 February 2006
at 10:40 a.m.

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slugger (Anonymous) says…

wassup yeah_right
9 February 2006
at 10:41 a.m.

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glockenspiel (Anonymous) says…

Grammies == Pop Music awards
9 February 2006
at 10:57 a.m.

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Confrontation (Anonymous) says…

This punk with the gun was thinking with only one thing, and that was definitely not his brain. I'm sure he wanted to rescue this “helpless” female and maybe get a chance with her at the after party.

It doesn't surprise me how few people on here show sympathy for the family. If it were, let's say, a white child run over by a minivan, then 90% of the posts would be sympathetic. Too bad it's a young black child who lost his father, since Lawrence is rampant with racism. I hope this mother, child, and the rest of the family can ignore comments from such a rude and racist group of posters.
9 February 2006
at 10:59 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

glockenspiel = Cheesy music from 60's movies

9 February 2006
at 11 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

I mean: glockenspiel = instrument used in music in cheesy 60's movies
9 February 2006
at 11:02 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Does anybody think its funny that Kanye compares himself to Jesus?
9 February 2006
at 11:05 a.m.

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slugger (Anonymous) says…

thank you “Confrontation” Very well said.
9 February 2006
at 11:10 a.m.

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honeydew785 (Anonymous) says…

weterica:
If there were no hip-hop acts at the grammys, what do you call Kayne West (album of the Year). If you ask him…he's straight hip-hop.
9 February 2006
at 11:23 a.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Honeydew - I think weterica was being sarcastic.
9 February 2006
at 11:25 a.m.

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Aiko (Anonymous) says…

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.
9 February 2006
at 11:56 a.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

“…let's say, a white child run over by a minivan, then 90% of the posts would be sympathetic.”

What a ridiculous statement. Go to the posts about the kid killed by the mini-van. 5 posts, not a sympathetic one in the bunch. Also, what does a child getting hit by a mini-van have to do with a man getting shot outside of a club at 2 am?
9 February 2006
at 12:11 p.m.

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bankboy119 (Anonymous) says…

Well, they were both humans and both died…and the color of their blood is red.

9 February 2006
at 12:12 p.m.

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bankboy119 (Anonymous) says…

wet,

DQ was making the point that there were many more black people at the Source awards than there were at the Grammys. It's a different atmosphere. Don't be an idiot.
9 February 2006
at 12:28 p.m.

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Confrontation (Anonymous) says…

wonderhorse: If you have the knowledge, then go back and look at the first few articles on the child who was hit by the minivan. Then, look at those posts. I'm just saying that few people have sympathy for the family of the man who was shot, due to the fact that the family is not white and they listen to hip-hop.
9 February 2006
at 12:35 p.m.

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bankboy119 (Anonymous) says…

There was a lot more sympathy in the first article of the kid that was run over…I would hope there was the same in the first article about the guy being shot. This is now about the 7th article so we can move on from “Sorry he was shot” to “Why was he shot?”
9 February 2006
at 12:41 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

Yes, and from this thread

“Too bad for the family.”

“Blessings to the survivors.”

This just from the first two posts.

I still say your statement is ridiculous. Or at least an overgeneralization.
9 February 2006
at 1:15 p.m.

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aquakej (Anonymous) says…

I went to a hip hop show and I am a 23 year old white girl who has never broken a law in her life. I think hip hop is great because it's original and intellectual. I saw all kinds of people at that show….it wasn't all “low-lifes”. I know hip hop and rap may have stereotype listeners, but here in this town, it's mostly frat boys anyways. This isn't Topeka, ha ha ha.
9 February 2006
at 2:03 p.m.

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lovenhaight (Anonymous) says…

Rap and hip-hop are not the same thing. Old people…geez.
9 February 2006
at 2:11 p.m.

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badger (Anonymous) says…

Rap music and hip-hop music aren't the same thing, no.

However, the current rap scene finds a great deal of its roots and origins, as it exists today, in the hip-hop culture and community of the late 1980's.

Thus the confusion among those of us old enough to remember what the hip-hop scene was like pre-1993.

Young people…jeez.
9 February 2006
at 2:21 p.m.

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rohdek (Kyle Rohde) says…

Interesting that a guy who had worked as a janitor in Denver and had no job here, but was hoping to work at a temp agency, wearing a suede outfit, $125 shoes and a wide brimmed hat. That sounds like over $400 in clothing to me. Wonder how he could afford that along with a wife and kid on a janitor's hourly rate.

9 February 2006
at 2:24 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

Suede from head to toe and $125 shoes? Wow. I've had a job my entire life and never spent that much on shoes.
9 February 2006
at 2:43 p.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

Maybe he has had those clothes for a long time. You don't know. Maybe nice clothes is his thing. Maybe this was the outfit he wears when there is something special going on like going to see a long time friend on stage. Who even cares! He died for no reason and his young son has to grow up without his father…the clothes should be the least of your concerns.
9 February 2006
at 2:45 p.m.

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outoftowner (Anonymous) says…

rohdek and lawrencechick - and your point is? Do you know what a Janitor from Denver makes per hour? You may be surprised - even though it's totally irrelevent to this story.
9 February 2006
at 2:54 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

Funniest- people who are so stupid and open minded that their brains fall out.
9 February 2006
at 2:56 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Rohdek & Lawrencechick - Don't you find it just slightly morally offensive that you are attacking the character of a man who was just murdered. However, I would expect no less from individuals who are classless enough to make a public outcry over somebody spending $125 on a pair of shoes.
9 February 2006
at 2:58 p.m.

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egypt (Anonymous) says…

Rohdek,
Thats the exact comment I was about to make.
9 February 2006
at 2:59 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

“…attacking the character of a man….”

I missed this part. Where did they attack his character?
9 February 2006
at 3:01 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Wonderhorse, read between the lines bro, I know you are bright enough not to ask such an ignorant question.

9 February 2006
at 3:01 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

“…public outcry….”?

On the LJW bb? That's a public outcry? Who are you, the LJW PR representative?
9 February 2006
at 3:05 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

This blog is public isn't it. Perhaps outcry was a bit strong, let's just call it a public observation. Lets just say I am somebody who doesn't see anything wrong with buying a $125 pair of shoes, nor understands why it even pertains to this particular situation.
9 February 2006
at 3:07 p.m.

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outoftowner (Anonymous) says…

Well, it's nice to know Topekans are welcome back into Lawrence. ha
This is part of an article taken from cjonline.com

Lawrence city manager Mike Wildgen thinks it isn't fair to typecast Topekans as troublemakers.

Wildgen said Wednesday that Lawrence bar owner Mike Elwell wasn't speaking for the city in general Tuesday when he said it would be “great” if all Topekans stayed away from his business.

“We welcome everybody to come to town, and we want everybody to come back,” the city manager said.
9 February 2006
at 3:11 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

No, I don't understand what $125 shoes have to do with anything, either, but bored people will run with what they have to work with. Look at us.
9 February 2006
at 3:17 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Wonderhorse, I agree. I rather enjoy these blogs.
9 February 2006
at 3:18 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

It really had nothing to do with this poor man's death. I feel for him and his family. But lets cut the crap and stop pretending when we see someone with leather jackets, gold teeth, $125 sneakers…. or big screen TV's and satellite dishes in their trailer you don't think hmm… I wonder what kind of job they have because I'm working my ass off and I can't afford any of that.
9 February 2006
at 3:22 p.m.

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mztrendy (Anonymous) says…

Ok so wait, because he was a janitor in Denver, he can't afford a pair of 125 dollar shoes? Seriously? are you people for real? ok, whose seen his bank statements? who knows what his wife does for a living? How judgemental some of you people can be? I bet she wishes she wouldn't have even said that because of all of you judgemental people. Gimme a friggin break…
9 February 2006
at 3:27 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Lawrencechick - You totally lack class and seem to have the mentality of a highschool sophomore.

9 February 2006
at 3:28 p.m.

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outoftowner (Anonymous) says…

hmmm don't they sell some of those things at the Goodwill store? Sounds like lawrencechick is a bit jealous. You should check out the secondhand stores if u want some of the “nicer” things everyone else has. Although I'm not so sure they have any gold teeth.
9 February 2006
at 3:30 p.m.

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mztrendy (Anonymous) says…

I'm with you ben_ness. Way to stereotype, Lawrencechick. I'm married with 2 kids, live in a modular (which to you is a trailer) and I have a satellite and a big screen. Wait, I might even have a leather jacket…
9 February 2006
at 3:33 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

” I bet she wishes she wouldn't have even said that because of all of you judgemental people.”

Why should she care what somebody says on the LJW bb? Also, I didn't see where chick made a judgment. Did I miss something again?
9 February 2006
at 3:34 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Thanks mztrendy. I have been in a few modular homes. They can be very nice, comfortable, inexpensive way to live especially if you have a family — except when a tornado is barrelling down on you :)
9 February 2006
at 3:36 p.m.

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mztrendy (Anonymous) says…

its not too bad, i just hang on to the satellite when the wind picks up!
9 February 2006
at 3:37 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

Mztrendy…Do you get any kind of public assistance? Free lunches at school? Do you provide health insurance for your entire family? If you do you're in the minority. Most of the people I encounter that I'm talking about, do not. I find out that I'll be paying for all their medical bills because they can't. But they sure have their big screen.
9 February 2006
at 3:44 p.m.

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mztrendy (Anonymous) says…

uh no actually I don't. I work full time, as does my husband. So because I live in a modular home, my kids need free lunches at school? are you kidding me? Lawrencechick, I don't live in a trailer court. I live on 40 acres in the country. I don't have to live here. I chose to live here. You also realize you are stereotyping? Because someone lives in a trailer and has a bigscreen automatically means they are unemployed and living on welfare? Have you ever been to a small town? Do you not think people live in apartments, houses, condos and have those same problems? Do you realize you can get low income help and live almost anywhere you want in Lawrence? If you want to talk about people having gold teeth, and big screens, and satellites and not being able to afford them thats fine, but what does that have to do with living in trailers is I guess what I don't get about your comment…
9 February 2006
at 3:47 p.m.

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daddax98 (Anonymous) says…

Also, I didn't see where chick made a judgment. Did I miss something again?

well wonderhorse, did her last post clear it up for you?

9 February 2006
at 3:48 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

Of course I'm talking about people who have these things and can't afford them.. that's the whole point. If you can afford 40 acres ,I'm not talking about you. The article said the man was unemployed.
9 February 2006
at 3:48 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Lawrencechick - there you go again. Just proving my point. Plus, what you just wrote makes absolutely no sense. Are people who get public assistance in the minority, or are you talking about another group of peope? A good friend of mine is a Federal Social Security Judge and he has communicated to me many times there are instances when Social Security is abused; however, there are many times when it is neccessary. If you can't afford a $125 dollar pair of shoes I wouldn't worry about it though, chances are you probably aren't paying out that much.
9 February 2006
at 3:51 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

Ben_ness, have you heard the past year that for the first time in history the overall savings rate of Americans was 0%. I have a good job, but I plan on supporting myself in the future and not crying when the government can't support me.
9 February 2006
at 3:55 p.m.

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mztrendy (Anonymous) says…

lawrencechick, do you ever treat yourself and go buy yourself something nice? Have you ever had a friend or family member buy you something nice?
9 February 2006
at 4:01 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Lawrencechick - Your statements exude a persona of self importance and extreme egotism which are typically signs of low self-esteem. For your information my parents had to raise my brother and I on foodstamps for several years because they came on hard times. They are now successful business owners and live on a beautiful 120 acre horse ranch. My brother is an analyst for Quest Diagnostics and I am a very successful businessman in Washington DC and we are both college educated - thanks in part to public assistance. My brother and I, nor my parents wouldn't be where we are now if it wasn't for the help we received.
9 February 2006
at 4:01 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

This has been fun guys but I have to get ready to go to work. Go rent Cinderella Man. There is an example of someone who took only what he needed and then actually gave it back as soon as he could. We need that attitude again.
9 February 2006
at 4:03 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

Lawrencechick - I save money. I must somehow fit into that range below zero. Where did you get that erroneous fact?
9 February 2006
at 4:05 p.m.

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bobsarobot (Anonymous) says…

the plain and simple issue is hip hop shows and the people who attend these shows. rap and hip hop attract a criminal element like rats to a garbage barge. when you consolidate these hip hopsters in one area you should not be surprised when the 5-10% who are thugs and criminals explode in violence. it is not a racial issue, it is an ignorance issue. ignorant and small minded people who aren't secure with themselves and seek an identity through being “hard” and other hip hop images are the ones who ruin it all. lawrence used to be a cool town, now it is being overrun by a hip hop culture which exudes ignorance.

9 February 2006
at 4:08 p.m.

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ben_ness (Anonymous) says…

James Braddock was very wealthy before the depression. I think you were confusing him with Robin Hood, Lawrencechick. Do you realize the fallaciousness of your last statement. You just said you wished people would do what you just spent the last hour preaching against.
9 February 2006
at 4:17 p.m.

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lawrencechick (Anonymous) says…

He earned his money before the depression, took welfare during the 10 year depression and then went back to the welfare office and paid back his debt… Please don't use words like fallaciousness with me. I'm so uneducated it makes me dizzy!
9 February 2006
at 4:29 p.m.

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MarkyDSaad (Anonymous) says…

Do any of you that posted for this page today actually have day jobs yourself? It would be so ironic if you did not work and were ragging on a dead guy who was looking for a job?

Looking for a job to supposedly be closer to his family.
9 February 2006
at 4:55 p.m.

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wonderhorse (Anonymous) says…

“…ragging on a dead guy….”? Who's doing that?
9 February 2006
at 5:55 p.m.

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Rhoen (Anonymous) says…

Deep condolences, thoughts, and prayers to the widow and all of this man's children. I'm glad that he had a good time on the last night of his life. So sad.
9 February 2006
at 9:33 p.m.

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Confrontation (Anonymous) says…

lawrencechick: It's pretty obvious that you were a spoiled brat who had mommy and daddy pay for your education. You've never had a hard day in your life, thanks to the silver spoon in your mouth. I'm sure your prom dress cost more than this man's shoes, and you most likely were less deserving. It sure is funny how people think those with less money are less deserving of something nice, when they tend to be the ones who most appreciate it. Lawrencechick, enjoy your evening job and please don't have children. We do not want your genes to continue swimming in the pool. Please use a dictionary if this is too difficult to understand.
9 February 2006
at 11:20 p.m.

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adopted (Anonymous) says…

I wonder where Robert Earl Williams is now…eternity lasts alot longer than life on this planet. Where are all you going to spend eternity? In this crazy world we all ought to stop and ask ourselves that question….. are you willing to bet eternity on there not being an eternity? Not me!!!
10 February 2006
at 12:27 a.m.

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Multidisciplinary (Anonymous) says…

I'm told two of these posters actually have day jobs..the posts are written by their stay at home cats. They themselves have no idea what's being done on their computers, they are far too busy to read this stuff everyday!And yes they have big screens, they cats ordered them online. We have recently adopted a St. Rescue kitten. The other day I'm sure he was looking at me like, “You ARE planning on putting the house under MY name instead of your's, aren't you?” I think he took a finance course through parks and rec. Big mistake, he knows way too much for his own good now.

10 February 2006
at 3:06 a.m.

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VoiceOfReason (Anonymous) says…

I won't make any judgements about the murder victim. I've found that snap judgements are almost always wrong. You would think my husband is an unemployed biker thug, based on looks, but he is college-educated and supporting a wife and little girl whom he dotes on and adores. People like to assume things based on appearances, but I have also met some unbelievably nice people whom I would have probably been scared of if I hadn't had the nerve to talk to them.

Several people seem to be implying that concealed carry is a bad idea and using this crime as an example. I think the lesson here is that concealed carry allows honest citizens the ability to protect themselves…or to at least make a criminal have to think twice about the person they're about to mug. Criminals will always carry concealed weapons…as this guy did. We don't have a concealed carry law YET but this guy had one. And I'm just guessing, but I imagine a lot of places like the Granada will have “No guns” signs on their doors when and if the law passes. Again…the honest people will be unarmend and the criminals will have weapons. Laws don't change criminals' behavior, just honest law-abiding peoples'.
10 February 2006
at 7:37 a.m.

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nagene (Anonymous) says…

I am the sister of the widow, Latonia Coleman, And I just want to say that everyone has their opinions on the situaction, and can express it, but it dose not change the fact that a man was killed for no reason. Someone was talking about the little boy who was killed getting hit by a car. Well, the law said it was an accident, this was not an accident. So they should not even be compared.

Our family is trying to deal with a loss, if you ever had something tragic happen in your family you would understand and those who don't understand I hope nothing tragic happens because the feeling is not something I would want to wish on any human being.

No matter how Robert lived his life he did not deserve to be killed. And the person who killed him was less of a man seeing as how he had to shoot him in the back! Now he has taken a life maybe two, and is going to lose his own once he gets caught. tell me how smart that is, and was it worth it?
10 February 2006
at 9:54 a.m.

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yeah_right (Anonymous) says…

I am sorry for your loss, nagene.