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Archive for Friday, April 5, 2013

Sweeping abortion bill sent to governor

April 5, 2013

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Kansas legislators gave final passage to a sweeping anti-abortion measure Friday, sending Gov. Sam Brownback a bill that declares life begins “at fertilization” while blocking tax breaks for abortion providers and banning abortions performed solely because of the baby’s sex.

Brownback is likely to sign the bill into law.

The bill passed despite any solid data on how many sex-selection abortions are performed in Kansas. A 2008 study by two Columbia University economists suggested the practice of aborting female fetuses — widespread in some nations where parents traditionally prefer sons — is done in the U.S. on a limited basis.

Abortion-rights supporters contend there’s no evidence of such procedures in Kansas, but abortion foes believe it’s a growing problem because of more sophisticated prenatal testing.

The bill also blocks tax breaks for abortion providers and prohibits their involvement in public school sex education classes. It also would spell out in more detail what information doctors must provide to patients before performing abortions.

Abortion opponents argue the bill lessens the state’s entanglement with terminating pregnancies. Abortion-rights advocates see it as a serious threat to access to abortion services.

The measure also declares as a general principle that life begins “at fertilization.”

That type of idea is embodied in “personhood” measures in other states. Such measures are aimed at revising their constitutions to ban all abortions, and none have been enacted, though North Dakota voters will have one on the ballot in 2014.

But Kansas lawmakers aren’t trying to change the state constitution, and the measure notes that any rights suggested by the language are limited by decisions of the U.S. Supreme Court. It declared in its historic Roe v. Wade decision in 1973 that women have a right to obtain abortions in some circumstances, and has upheld that decision while allowing increasing restrictions by states.

Thirteen states, including Missouri, have similar language to the Kansas bill in their laws, according to the National Right to Life Committee.

Abortion opponents say the “at fertilization” language is akin to a statement of principle and not a legally enforceable ban on the procedure. Abortion-rights advocates are skeptical of that stance.

Comments

Cait McKnelly 1 year ago

One in three women in this country have had an abortion. Let that sink in. ONE THIRD of the women in this country at some point in their life have had an abortion.
Let's do what I like to call a "reality check".
Go to the grocery store and start counting women. Anything above 14 years old is fair game. Count them all; the 35 year old check out clerk, the 25 year old baker, the 70 year old woman tootling through the store on an electric cart, the college girl walking the aisle with earbuds in her ears to her I-phone. Look at them. Seriously LOOK at them. Statistics say that at least one of them has had an abortion. Yes, even the 70 year old could have had one 35 years ago. You don't know WHICH one, but it's almost a given that one of them has.
Here's an even bigger "reality check".
The next time you have any kind of extended family gathering; an annual reunion picnic in the summer, a Christmas dinner, whatever. count the women in your family. Include them ALL. Sisters, aunts, nieces, cousins and yes even your own mother or grandmother. If you're an average size family there will probably be somewhere in the neighborhood of 5 or six women wandering through the living room to the kitchen or heading to the portapotties by the ball field. Statistics say that at least one of them (and possibly two) has had an abortion.
You may not know about it (and given some of the attitudes of people on this board there might be a GOOD reason for you not knowing) but the truth is there.
Just remember this the next time you go to a KU game or a concert at the Lied. You'll either drive yourself insane or realize that, legal or not, it's part of the landscape of being a woman.

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wineguy 1 year ago

It appears Ingrid deleted her account, so if you responded to her threads, your comments may have been deleted as well.

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jafs 1 year ago

If the statistics posted above are right, then more than half of the women seeking abortions have been using birth control.

That's a rather large number, I'd say. They either need some more effective birth control, or they need to use it correctly if they're failing to do that.

I know nothing's 100% effective, but many methods should be more effective than that, shouldn't they?

And, before people get upset with me, I think men should be responsible as well as women, and use effective birth control as well, if they don't want children.

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Liberal 1 year ago

According to the census bureau in 2007 197,000 abortions were completed on married women while 1,013,000 were completed on Un-married..

317,000 women had previously had one abortion another 241,000 had two or more abortions.

Interesting, you would think they would learn about birth control after the first abortion....or are they using abortion as birth control?

http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/cats/births_deaths_marriages_divorces/family_planning_abortions.html

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Leslie Swearingen 1 year ago

Seems to me that there are maybe three people going back and forth on this. No one is going to convince the others of anything. Everything that could be said about this subject has been said a million times squared to infinity.

Stick a fork in it. It's done.

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jjt 1 year ago

I have posted a couple of comments today on this thread and now they are not there any more what is going on. They were in no way rude or offensive.?

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tomatogrower 1 year ago

indrid_cold, you have no idea what these women go through to make this decision. It's not easy. If you get pregnant right as you have made a decision to leave an abusive husband, but you know this will hold you back and keep you connected to the jerk forever, abortion will save your life. If you are raped, everyday a fetus is growing in you seems like more rape. If you just told your boyfriend, who told you that if you really loved him you would have sex with him, that you are pregnant, and he suddenly disappears, an abortion could be your only answer to keep away from a life on welfare. If you already have a Down's syndrome child, and you find out that your fetus is the same way, you choose an abortion to concentrate your care on the child you already have. If you already have 2 children, and you and your husband are barely keeping off welfare, and you have no insurance, then an abortion ends up being your choice. Oh, I guess you could go on welfare, but then you have to suffer the humiliation that people like indrid cold dish out to the "takers". And in Kansas, you still wouldn't get Medicare, because you are working poor, not jobless poor.

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tomatogrower 1 year ago

"Kansas’ abortion laws have been significantly restricted after Brownback took office in January 2011 and called on legislators to create “a culture of life.” "

A culture of life for the unborn, but if you are part of the working poor and none of your jobs offer insurance, well, too bad.

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autie 1 year ago

I would say that indrid cold is to abortion; as Dave Trabert is to tax policy. Clerks sent with straw men and fast talk.

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Agnostick 1 year ago

Let's do a quick tally here:

We got the German/Hitler reference...

We got the Guttmacher reference...

All we need now is a crash course on using homeless people as fronts for fake credit card numbers...

;)

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Fred Whitehead Jr. 1 year ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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Agnostick 1 year ago

We've all seen this before folks. Under many other names and aliases... but we've seen it all before...

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wineguy 1 year ago

Cite whatever you want. A bunch of categories developed to fit your argument do not tell the personal story behind each and every woman making this decision.

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UneasyRider 1 year ago

It's a given, anyone can post anything on Wiki and a certain number of people will accept this as fact. How sad.

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indrid_cold 1 year ago

I've now tried twice to post content refuting replies above. Wiki alone provides several independent references/links which all reach the original conclusion...



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autie 1 year ago

How about this for size, if it is not me, not my body, it is clearly none of my business. How about this, government should govern and not stick that nose into the private business of citizens and/or their decisions with a qualified health care provider. And how about this, a fetus is a parasite and not a person, besides that woman is and should be in full control. Go mind your own business.

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indrid_cold 1 year ago

I just grabbed the first Google link; they all say the same thing...

"
WHY ARE ABORTIONS PERFORMED?

On average, women give at least 3 reasons for choosing abortion: 3/4 say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or other responsibilities; about 3/4 say they cannot afford a child; and 1/2 say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner (AGI).

Only 12% of women included a physical problem with their health among reasons for having an abortion (NAF).

One percent (of aborting women) reported that they were the survivors of rape (NAF).
"

Source: http://www.abort73.com/abortion_facts/us_abortion_statistics/

If you can't tell the truth about abortion, then maybe there's something wrong with it.

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yourworstnightmare 1 year ago

Lifestyles. Like the rape mom's fac, the rape and incest mothers league, the my child is brain dead but I was forced to give birth tea club.

These anti abortion zealots want a government small enough to fit in a uterus.

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Leslie Swearingen 1 year ago

To me my daughter was a baby from the moment she was conceived in the womb and never anything else. In full disclosure I did use birth control and had a baby when I decided the time was right. I wanted one child and that is what I had.

I never had any difficulty with either pregnancy or birth and I do understand that other women are not so lucky. It does seem to me that there are women who are more comfortable with using scientific terms as they put a distance between themselves and the baby they are aborting. That is understandable as few of us want to confront death in any form, no matter the cause.

As I see it one of the causes of extreme anti-abortion is a lack of knowledge as to what could go wrong to necessitate such an action. I would like to see an article written by a professional stating just a few of the medical reasons why an abortion would be justified so people would have that information. Don't just tell them to Google it, because they won't do it. They need it in one place all laid out for them.

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indrid_cold 1 year ago

Nevernever: "So tell me, how do you grant full rights to both the mother and the fetus, so that neither of their rights can be trumped by the other."

Rights are hierarchical.


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Gareth 1 year ago

I'm sure this bill will create thousands of jobs for Kansas.

Right?

Can we please drop the fiction that the GOP is about fiscal responsibility and job creation? They're the American Taliban. This is what you've voted for, Kansas. Enjoy it.

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Gandalf 1 year ago

Hey on the bright side everyone will be able to buy booze and guns 9 months earlier. And if you are an expectant mother be sure to claim an extra deduction this year!

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tomatogrower 1 year ago

So, are they going to persecute, I mean prosecute, women who have ectopic pregnancies? Or do they even know what that is? The egg is fertilized, but fails to attach properly. Sometimes the body just aborts it with little consequence, but many times it's life threatening to the woman. Oh I forgot, the radical right could care less about women. Please quit calling yourselves pro-life, and start calling yourselves pro fetus. You are not pro life.

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1 year ago

I've said it before. We have a bunch of dried up old women and men who need blue pills passing legislation adversely affect women's health. Shameful.

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John McCoy 1 year ago

I am sorry to note that Kansas is acting more like Texas every day. This preoccupation with women's uteruses boggles.

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Paul R Getto 1 year ago

The law will contribute to this ongoing tragedy.... Courtesy of the Tea Party Republicans.......

Red States and mortality

http://www.nationalmemo.com/red-state-policies-are-deadly-especially-for...

This map, via health researcher Bill Gardner, shows the change in mortality rate for females in each county in the United States between 1992 and 2006. In 43 percent of counties — all those in red — mortality rates are rising:

The map is part of a research article by David Kindig and Erika Cheng that was recently published in the journal Health Affairs. “Although we are accustomed to seeing varying rates of mortality reduction in states and nations,” Kindig and Cheng write, “it is striking and discouraging to find female mortality rates on the rise in 42.8 percent of US counties, despite increasing medical care expenditures and public health efforts.”

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Cait McKnelly 1 year ago

It's funny that Kansas feels such rivalry with Missouri they even have to be ahead of them in the race to the bottom. Missouri at least had the sense to get rid of Todd Aikin. Aikin was just ignorantly cruel to rape victims. Pilcher-Cook heaped insult on top of it.
Fitzgerald's bombast comparing anti-abortionism to "civil rights" about sent David Haley (of the "Roots" Haleys. He's Alex Haley's nephew.) into a stroke. (Earlier in the week, Haley called the law "Taliban-like".)
If the outcome wasn't so god awful serious, it would almost be amusing watching the Kansas legislature at work.

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autie 1 year ago

Is like that Volstead Act but with women?

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 1 year ago

When will they declare that every sperm is sacred?

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