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Letters to the Editor

Condemn sin

February 10, 2012

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To the editor:

As a “religious fundamentalist” (who does not fear homosexuals), I would like to commend Anna Slemmer for her letter (Public Forum, Feb. 3).

She points out a real problem in society, i.e., divorce. People take marriage far too lightly today, so when hard times or personal differences arise, more and more often couples simply dissolve their marriages.

Additionally, Anna’s letter was an excellent example of justifying one sin by reference to the acceptance of another. Society has been long defined by just such “thinking.” This kind of rationalizing is largely responsible for the miserable state of culture and society in America today.

I do not condemn homosexuality because I don’t like it. But I do point out that the Bible condemns it. Nor do I think it is my place to confront the “gay community,” because I have my own sins. But I will not agree that, just because I have my own sins, that the sins of others are not wrong. We should condemn sin, our own as well as that of others, not shrug our shoulders and say, “Oh, well …”

Comments

tange 2 years, 2 months ago

Just discovered this tonight...

Can't say I can recommend it.

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Armored_One 2 years, 2 months ago

I know it probably won't get answered, but I still feel teh need to ask a question.

Which religion are we going to base these "Sin Laws" on, by chance? Different religions have different sins.

Oh.

Wait.

That pesky entry in the Constitution prevents us from doing that.

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Peter Macfarlane 2 years, 2 months ago

Man, I haven't seen this much hot air expended on an issue in a long time. The problem with religion is we take it too seriously. For all we know God, god, or whomever it is up there is having quite a laugh at our expense.

Let's expend electrons on something worthwhile.

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Richard Heckler 2 years, 2 months ago

If the divorce rate seems a bit high maybe marriage is the culprit?

Or if IRS and medical benefits were the same for couples simply loving and enjoying the company of one another perhaps divorce rates would not be an issue.

Or why is a governor concerning himself with divorce rates? Is it really any business of the governor? or any politicians?

Perhaps if elected officials did not put so many people out of work there would be fewer divorces?

How come family values Newt is allowed 3 wives without persecution?

Perhaps marriage and divorce is not the business of anyone else? Both seem to require a lot of understanding and effort.

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Cait McKnelly 2 years, 2 months ago

I was late coming to this thread and as I read the responses I found myself bursting out laughing more than once. This is one area where we "progressives" have the other side beat all to hell; we have a true sense of humor. Now, believe it or not, this is important. True humor has a purpose in life; to teach, to make comparisons, to point out faults in others AND ourselves and to do it in such a way that it's non-threatening and makes people smile. Good job, guys. It was enjoyable. Keep it up.

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thuja 2 years, 2 months ago

Sin is a word in English. That's all.

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overplayedhistory 2 years, 2 months ago

Is homosexuality condemned anywhere in the new testament?

let me paraphrase this BS letter: I am not going to judge because I to am not perfect, but I am going to use the non-Christian or at least half Christian part of the bible (you know the books Christians share with Jews) to judge.

What is your sin Todd? Do you fantasize about gay sex too much? I wish there was an infallible test for homosexuality, everyone would have to take. Then all the religious zealots who are in the closet would be exposed. We could then concern ourselves with more important matters other than who is buggering who and in what hole. I just can't believe, regardless of professed faith, that some one who is that obsessed with man on man sex is not at least a little gay, in other words gay. Don't mean to leave lesbians out, but lets face it, Todd is not talking about you.

Don't know if you done and assessment lately, but look around your churches moral bank has had a credit problem lately (thats not just Catholics either).

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Hong_Kong_Phooey 2 years, 2 months ago

As soon as they outlaw divorce, I'll agree with this author.

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verity 2 years, 2 months ago

Seems to me that Mr Getto pretty much nailed it in the second comment on this thread.

"Compassion, moderation and humility." The Golden Rule works pretty well, too.

Everything else is prologue.

As for the usual swipe at atheists---let me enlighten you a bit. I did not choose to be an atheist. As I studied the Bible, other religions, science and logic, among other things, I came to realize that belief in the supernatural made no sense.

If a belief in a god or gods helps someone else live a better life, I certainly have no problem with that, but you don't get to tell me what is right or wrong based on your belief in something I find unbelievable.

I am responsible to myself for my actions. I don't get to do unto others as I would they not do to me and then blame god/gods or the devil for it. I have to learn to live with questions and look for the best answer I can. My world is not black and white, but the colors are so very vivid and interesting and often I learn something new from someone who I least expect to learn from.

This doesn't mean that I don't have very firm and passionate opinions about any number of things, but I hope I am able to listen to and consider other's thoughts.

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Richard Heckler 2 years, 2 months ago

I condemn sin damn near everyday ...... it's called Sam Brownback!

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jonas_opines 2 years, 2 months ago

Finally can read the full thing, I guess I have only one thing left to add.

Natural Law says: "Hell does exist."

I respond: Prove it empirically. Until you can do so, I see no reason for it, or sin, to enter into debate, other than when clearly marked as personal opinion.

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jaywalker 2 years, 2 months ago

'Scuse me, Mr. Wilson, but the Bible condemn's a lot of things that are fairly silly now. Considering that book is a collection of allegories and second hand accounts, and considering some Books of the Bible weren't written until many years after Jesus' passing, and considering the faulty memory that comes with any passage of time, and considering the prejudice of man........ WAKE UP! The fact you hold the same opinion as Iwannajihad and the Phelps clan, one would hope the fog might begin to clear a tad.

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Jane 2 years, 2 months ago

I've always wondered about the validity of the claim of 'homosexual acts' between animals...how does that happen if animals' sex drives are chemical in nature(not of their own choice)?

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jonas_opines 2 years, 2 months ago

Apologies for spelling errors, only have my phone right now

The purpose of sex is to bond and make babies? No, not necessarily. Making babies is a biological reaction to sex, under a certain set of circumstances. Bonding is not even that, necessarily. Purpose is an abstract, a personal interpretation. Someone's purpose in sex may be to procreate, an it also may not. Another purpose might be to bond, but it may not. It may be for purely physical enjoyment, it may not. It may just be to brag to your friends that your number of conquests you've achieved has increased, but it may not. All of those things could be considered to be a purpose for sex in the minds of the doer, none of then are intrinsic. Saying that the purpose of sex is to procreate is the same as saying the purpose of eating is to take a dump. They are potentially fixed biological results, but there are other reasons to engage in them.

Your definition of purpose is poorly constructed, hence it fails. Thus fails your notion that homosexual sex is illogical. If it was true that the only desired reaction to sex was babies then it would true, but that is not true. That is entirely your construct of purpose, and just because it is yours, that does not make it absolute. You cannot prove purpose, only natural reaction. One is opinion, one is natural law. It is erroneous to collate the two.

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BornAgainAmerican 2 years, 2 months ago

The local Lawrence Far Left Extremists have no idea what to do about you Natural_Law...Well Done!!!

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Agnostick 2 years, 2 months ago

Anyone thirsty? How about some Diet Sprite?

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somedude20 2 years, 2 months ago

Sin is to "God" as being bad is to "Santa"....

You are grow adults. Stop with the fairy tales. We are all going to die, don't be so weak minded that you have to believe in a "act 2" (heaven) out of fear of death to live life.

You guys slay me. You won't believe that Obama is a natural born citizen (or that man is affecting the earth's climate) but you know that there is a god. I guess I should be happy that other pieces of fiction from history did not become your false idols of hope.

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downriverdan 2 years, 2 months ago

Will I have the sense to use my purple robe to warm Lazarus and use my linen for his bandages? Or will I leave him to his nakedness and open wounds for it was he who was born into such a state and not I? Someday will I be judged for my self-importance and disregard of some homosexuals own needs? Or judged for my choices of self-aggrandizement and expediency like the wealthy priests of Jerusalem? What judgment will be used against me?

Nay I say, for I love all others just like I do this God that you kneel to. Or in the case of those who do not believe in supernatural beings, I love and care for my fellow inhabitants here on Earth. It is the least I can do for the least of you...

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tange 2 years, 2 months ago

"... there is a difference between condemning sin and condemning people...."

Isn't is just condemnation, once removed?

Regarding moral absolutism, you and I may not be all that far apart. We just have different playbooks; the point at which they truly diverge is beyond human experience.

I tend to depart from so-called moral "relativists." A road to somewhere is paved with moral relativism which, BTW, can be—and frequently is—used to self-justify every variety of hedonistic pursuit. It's the tired old "consenting adults" argument: "Gee, if two or more of us are gathered in my name...."

Condemnation, in my playbook is more closely aligned with: Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it... as are those who cannot learn from the present.

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rockchalker52 2 years, 2 months ago

Old Version: It's in the Bible.

New version: I read it on the internet so it must be true.

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jonas_opines 2 years, 2 months ago

Or perhaps there's no such thing as sin, and it is a fictional concept.

Nor is the concept of sin necessary to construct a moral schematic. Of course, you lose the ability to declare moral absolutes, but there is also the possibility that moral absolutes are a fictional concept. Declaring a moral absolute because God or the Bible says it is so is no different than declaring one because Douglas Adams or the Hitchhikers Guide says it is so. You can always find a source to put your unshakeable faith in.

So condemn sin if you like, but please don't make any laws based on sin. If one isn't a Christian, then there is no reason to act based solely on what is said to be sinful.

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Flap Doodle 2 years, 2 months ago

The only sin diappointed progressive believe in is not following the dictates of the hive mind.

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ratfamily 2 years, 2 months ago

Wow, after reading this article and these comments... I took an absolutely huge dump. I'm gonna need a stick to break it up so it will flush....just huge. Thanks.

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FalseHopeNoChange 2 years, 2 months ago

Abandoned ship. "Every man for himself"

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Getaroom 2 years, 2 months ago

Fear not the Gays, but go forth and sin no more! Better bring in The Mitt on these matters of sexual unholiness and crimes of divorce, he was a minister for sometime you know and he is in touch with the little people. Can we settle Abortion today too?
Oh, back to business, how about a special divorce tax(only on the lower and middle classes), that will show them who's boss. There must be something in the Bible about taxing the little people who get divorced. Research that scholars.

Let's settle this once and for all - right here on the LJW blog. Should we use the: Hindu Scriptures, Taoist Scriptures, Buddhist Scriptures, Old Testament, New Testament, Koran, or the Tanakh.... as the rarefied absolute truth in scripture as guided by the hand of God to settle all these puzzles of life and death? What, can't do it, why not? Not enough empirical data? Can't decide who's interpretation of the interpretation of the interpretation to use? Ok, let's begin anew. Well put anything we can prove that Jesus, or any of the other glorified religious leaders said, in red type, and the rest in black type. What do you mean we already tried that and it didn't work, Ok then we will annotate all of it, use tapes, charts, and color pictures and use direct quotes to prove it was GOD talking. What do you mean we tried that already too. OK, if we agree to apply Blind Faith, across the board, it will not matter if we can prove anything, we just believe all of it and all is well on heaven and earth. Ok, does everyone accept that? What, hey you in the back pew there, put your hand down we are not taking any more suggestions right now and maybe never and especially if you are not baptized, circumcised, de-demonized, or pre-crucified by accepting a savior into to your heart. Just pray, do it in school, in a pool, in a cab, in the shower, on the filed. But you must do it!!!. Don't hide your light under a basket(Jesus said that) It is a sin to do otherwise and if you don't, an inquisition and a holy war will be upon you, your children and your children's children. Get it? Ok, let's get back to the love and figuring out which of the scriptures are The Absolute Holiest of the Holy and use that as the LAW OF GOD(S). What there is more than one GOD? No way! Oh yes, there are many gods, the Bible says so(it really does), but there is a twist, you can't put any of the other ones before the Big One and so on and so forth. Guess we are not going to get to Abortion today children - sorry.

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defenestrator 2 years, 2 months ago

Todd (Flanders):

It is not okay for you to stand by and not confront the gay community. Here is what your bible tells you to do: http://bible.cc/leviticus/20-13.htm

Thanks.

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its_just_math 2 years, 2 months ago

Glad to see the Party of Athiest's Affiliates becoming interested in religion---quoting verse etc.

May God Bless.

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jafs 2 years, 2 months ago

This sort of thing is very OT.

Jesus said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone".

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Mercy 2 years, 2 months ago

Who gets to define what is a sin? You? Me? Anyone? That was many think now adays. But the truth is that God defines what sin is whether you believe or not! How can we know what is God's Truth? Inform your conscience by looking to the Church 1st Timothy 3:15. Now which church did Christ found upon the rock Peter and promises to protect it from teaching error in matters of faith and morals? The One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church!!!!!!!

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cowboy 2 years, 2 months ago

judge not lest ye be judged

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Ragingbear 2 years, 2 months ago

Reading this is a sin. It's in the Bible. Don't look, just trust me.

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Ron Holzwarth 2 years, 2 months ago

Gandalf, I think it's rather obvious that you did or are thinking about doing something wrong in many cases, and if you know something is wrong and do it anyway, I think I can step out on a limb and define that as a sin.

There is something basically wrong with you if you don't realize that. There are even two names for people that are like that, because it's considered to be a psychiatric condition. Sometimes the disorders are indistinguishable, at least to me. A friend tried to explain the difference to me a few weeks ago, and it was totally lost on me.

Sociopath, and Psychopath. Those disorders are never amenable to treatment, and it is estimated that about 1% of the population has those disorders. They have a very high genetic propensity, and of course the percentage is much higher in prisons.

It is fundamentally wrong to make a promise and then not keep it, or at least make every effort to do so. But, maybe you are not aware of that, 1% of the population is not. People like that really don't care about what they do to other people or how other people think about them.

And what a marriage is, is a promise.

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Gandalf 2 years, 2 months ago

Oh well! Shrug. Who gets to define sin?

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