Advertisement

Archive for Monday, August 27, 2012

Kobach likens same-sex unions to drug abuse

August 27, 2012, 10:05 p.m. Updated August 28, 2012, 12:12 p.m.

Advertisement

— Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach isn’t just interested in cracking down on illegal immigration.

Last week, at the Republican Party National Convention platform committee meeting in Tampa, Fla., Kobach argued against an amendment to the GOP’s party platform that would have backed same-sex civil unions.

In speaking against the proposal, Kobach equated same-sex relationships with drug abuse and polygamy. “Our government routinely judges situations where you might regard people completely affecting themselves, like, for example, the use of controlled substances, like, for example, polygamy that is voluntarily entered into,” Kobach said. “We condemn those activities even though they are not hurting other people, at least directly. So this is worded way too broadly for inclusion in the platform.”

Thomas Witt, executive director of the Kansas Equality Coalition, said Kobach’s comments weren’t surprising, but they were disappointing.

“You would think that after spending some time in government, he would know that gay and lesbian people are just people too. We are not criminals,” Witt said.

Kobach denied he was comparing the two, but rather he was arguing against the broadness of the proposal.

"I didn't in any way equate homosexuality with drug use or polygamy," said Kobach.

Comments

Katara 2 years, 3 months ago

I am no longer surprised by these things. This makes me sad.

DanR 2 years, 3 months ago

Please, just keep talking, K.K. Ks SoS, and join your buddy, Akin, on the repulsive lunatic fringe.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

Next week, he'll treat us to his condemnation of miscegenation.

Katara 2 years, 3 months ago

Is you is or is you ain't my constituents?

Mike1949 2 years, 3 months ago

That would be funny if life was a movie, problem is, life isn't a movie!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

I wonder if Kobach and Akin will seek a constitutional amendment to provide breast milk to homosexuals.

riverdrifter 2 years, 3 months ago

Sorry, Harley, but these are not your "fellow Republicans" as you know them. Bob Dole is out, the teabaggers are in.

kusp8 2 years, 3 months ago

Repbulicans are no longer conservatives, plain and simple. That's not to say Democrats are really liberals, but that's a different argument for a different day. Anyways....Republicans have moved away from conservative, if it doesn't effect me I don't care, beliefs to, it may not effect me, but I damn sure don't want you to be able to do that. This is not only sad but is pushing away so many younger voters who tend to align with them on fiscal issues but are so dismayed by their reverence for pushing inane social policy issues which are out of step with mainstream America.

squawkhawk 2 years, 3 months ago

Worse than that, he believes in quadacorns. He's an idiot of the first degree.

nondescript 2 years, 3 months ago

"Kobach equated same-sex relationships with drug abuse and polygamy." "Our government routinely judges situations where you might regard people completely affecting themselves, like, for example, the use of controlled substances, like, for example, polygamy that is voluntarily entered into,” Kobach said.

He did NOT equate them, he COMPARED some examples. There is a difference, people.

The Journal World / Rothschild are really stretching to make Kobach look bad because they don't agree with him. Typical.

fiddleback 2 years, 3 months ago

Nobody has to stretch to make Kobach look bad. That's his specialty, and admittedly this isn't even in the top 5.

I guess polygamy will be the remaining go-to example for relationships between consenting adults that are state-prohibited, esp. now that boneheads like Rick Santorum have repeatedly proven that bestiality and pedophilia are not appropriate even for COMPARISON purposes...

By the way, this is not just some abstract political disagreement, but involves very real rights concerning property, insurance, and hospital visitation. Leave it to the GOP to shun the very compromises, i.e. calling these "civil unions" rather than marriages, that could help them claim a civil rights victory and broaden their appeal. In terms of long-term demographics, they seem to be on a kamikaze mission.

costello 2 years, 3 months ago

"He did NOT equate them, he COMPARED some examples. There is a difference, people."

I agree with nondescript. I'm no fan of Kobach, but this article was misleading. If Kobach can make himself look bad without help from anyone else, then why misrepresent what he said to make him look worse.

Mark Zwahl 2 years, 3 months ago

I thought the same thing initially (and i'm no fan either). But the more I read here and thought about it, I think differently. Sure, the headline is an oversimplification. But he is still saying that same sex marriage is harmful/bad/morally wrong. Frankly, I'm a little disappointed he equated use of controlled substances with polygamy...

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

Here's a common definition of "compare."

compare-- to liken to, equate to, analogize to; class with, set side by side with.

nondescript 2 years, 3 months ago

In this context, this common definition of compare is more germane: "to examine (two or more objects, ideas, people, etc.) in order to note similarities and differences: to compare two pieces of cloth; to compare the governments of two nations."

Lane Signal 2 years, 3 months ago

He equated these things. He described a category that included "the use of controlled substances" and "polygamy" and indicated that same sex relationships fall into the same category. So, he described a way that all three of these things are the same. He equated these things. Had he gone on to talk about how these things are different or tired to rate each one on how evil each one is, then you could argue that he compared these things.

nondescript 2 years, 3 months ago

Do we have the entire transcript of his argument? I expect the quoted sentences were not the only ones he uttered. I call: "selective reporting"!

Orwell 2 years, 3 months ago

Call it first, then maybe eventually find out if you know what you're talking about. That's helpful.

notaubermime 2 years, 3 months ago

"He described a category that included "the use of controlled substances" and "polygamy" and indicated that same sex relationships fall into the same category."

An air compressor blows air. Tornadoes and hurricanes also fall into the category of blowing air. Nobody in their right mind would think those two sentences 'equate' air compressors to tornadoes.

Orwell 2 years, 3 months ago

If you say A has a given quality, and B has the same quality, and make no distinction between the two, that's called equating.

Orwell 2 years, 3 months ago

Or maybe Kobach is irresponsible and bigoted, and you just don't like anybody pointing it out. You can't blame the facts on the reporter.

notaubermime 2 years, 3 months ago

I agree with nondescript. The wording in this article exaggerates what was actually said. Kobach listed use of controlled substances (which does not have the same connotation as drug abuse) and polygamy as other examples of illegal activity that only directly affects the individual. This was said as a rationale for why the wording in the proposed amendment was too vague.

I have a extremely negative view of Kobach, but that does not make me have any wish to criticize him for words he did not say. I would expect a journalist to have a better command of the English language than this and consider this article to be an example of poor journalism.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

Kobach's MO is to focus on the most extreme and bigoted currents in the Republican/Tea Party. This is no different.

Orwell 2 years, 3 months ago

Can I get some grilled chicken with that word salad, please?

cowboy 2 years, 3 months ago

Is Kobach on vacation or Ks payroll time for this non sense ?

tolawdjk 2 years, 3 months ago

Im no fan of Kobach, and he could have turned the phrase better, but when you listen to his comment in its entirety, its obvious people are twisting it.

He was commenting that the phrasing of the amendment to the platform was too vague in that it would seem to state that the GOP condoned "all" activity that would not harm others, such as drug abuse and polygamy along with same sex unions.

It was not a direct comment on same sex unions but a comment on the wording of the amendment.

The man does well enough on his own in putting his foot in his mouth, no need to stretch for them.

Sharon Nottingham 2 years, 3 months ago

How are same sex individuals completely affecting themselves? That comment makes no sense. And, yes, he was not equating it with drug abuse and polygamy. Those were examples of his pathetic argument.

Matthew Herbert 2 years, 3 months ago

Ahh the Journal World- don't let the absence of a story keep you from writing the story. Sometimes their journalism reminds me of my days in middle school when I would try and cross out letters of words on a page to make them say bad things.

lunacydetector 2 years, 3 months ago

quite the stretch with this story JW.......another reason to add to re-evaluating paying for the print version of your paper.

drake 2 years, 3 months ago

I would say that this is a new low for Rothschild but we all know that it isn't.

Liberty275 2 years, 3 months ago

I think homosexuality is just like drug use and polygamy. It's none of the governments business what people do with their own bodies. Kobach needs that jesus garbage exercised from his mind and maybe then he will be an acceptable human.

KS 2 years, 3 months ago

I think the LJW just puts this stuff on line just to stir up the natives of Lawrnece. Enjoy yourselves!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

If Kobach didn't say this sort of crap, the LJW couldn't put it on line.

CLARKKENT 2 years, 3 months ago

While i am not a fan of President Obama, I see why the Democrats get votes. With the likes of Kobach, Akins, Jenkins, and our Governor Brownback, there is a reason why I have trouble voting republican. The party has changed, for the worse, over the last decade.

Fossick 2 years, 3 months ago

"I see why the Democrats get votes."

Surely you are not in earnest. The last time I checked, the GOP held both of Kansas' Senate seats, all four Congressional seats, every statewide public office, 32 of the 40 Kansas state senate seats, and something like 85 of the 125 Kansas house seats. If the Democrats get votes, surely the number is barely plural.

That said, I agree with Liberty275 that like "controlled substances" and polygamy, this is none of the government's business. It's also obvious that Mr. Rothschild is merely beating the figurative beehive that is Lawrence with a rhetorical stick, not to inform but to disturb its occupants. Buzz, buzz, buzz.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

The only person I see acting all f*ed up here is Kobach, whose drug of choice seems to be power. Kobach fans are mostly frustrated old guys who don't have enough control over those around them, and who aim to make their will the way of the land. And each day that passes makes them less relevant to the majority ~ just like those who opposed interracial marriage. Kobach is beginning to make Phill Kline look like a master statesman.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

Nope. Our morals do not include bigotry. Kobach is a huge embarassment to the state, and anyone who supports his bigotry also serves to isolate Kansas from the mainstream of the nation ~ which may, considering your comments, SOP, be your ultimate goal. Enjoy being lumped in with Phelps, SOP? Because, that's exactly the case here. Your "huge majority" as seen through your rose-colored glasses of yesteryear is melting away before your very eyes, and there's nothing you can do about it but spew hatred.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

Which God? The one who doesn't want you to judge others? This is America. Not bibleville.

tolawdjk 2 years, 3 months ago

One can "agree with God about what is considered sin". That isn't the problem. The problem becomes when there is the attempt to codify that "sin" into the regulations of man.

If Kobach was true to the ideals of liberty, he would have taken the position that while he personally may not feel that the decisions of others is morally acceptable, so long as those decisions do not impact his personal liberties or the liberties of his electorate, the liberty to make those decisions should not be limited.

Why should it matter to me if Jack and Jill or Jack and Jim decided to get hitched tomorrow or continue living unhitched in the same house? It does not effect my personal liberty either way.

The only thing that Kobach did was demonstrate clearly that he isn't for the liberty expressed by our founding fathers. He's for it up to the point that it doesn't mesh with his own moral code and that it is okay to limit someone else's liberty on the basis of that moral code. And after the fact attempt to justify somehow that even if the founders had the same or similar moral codes but consciously did not place that code within our governing and sacred documents, that they might have had a similar code can be used as a crutch to prop up his beliefs and a club to beat down others.

He's a Marie "let them eat cake" Republican.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

Some folks would rather have scummy hetero neighbors than a kind same-sex couple down the street, who despite treating others well and being good citizens, deserve the wrath of their god and the derision of their neighbors. And that's what we're talking about here. Do you want your neighbors to thrive and do well and prosper over a long time, during which you'll find that often they share the same interests of yourself? Same-sex marriage is about this. Let them thrive.

jonas_opines 2 years, 3 months ago

That's true. I had a ton of beliefs that people kept explaining to me were hatred, despite the fact that my holy book demanded I think that way, so I went and got a faith-based hate exemption card. I only had to wait two hours in line, and now when people say I'm acting in hatred I can just flash my card. You should go grab one.

But be careful, though, to make sure that you're in the right line. The "gays are immoral" hate exempt request line was right next to the "Christians are infidels" hate exemption request line, and we wouldn't want you to get the wrong card.

Glenn Reed 2 years, 3 months ago

"It is not hatred to agree with God about what is considered a sin."

Yes, yes it is. Stating that you agree with a god is simply an excuse for being a hateful bastard.

By your logic, the Taliban are simply agreeing with God about what is considered a sin. Who can blame them?

Glenn Reed 2 years, 3 months ago

The "bible" god and the "koran" god are very similar in shape and form, as in having no shape and form. They are pure imagination. Excuses at best.

Both are excuses for being hateful bastards. To be fair, though, both have also been found to be excuses for being decent people, too.

If you have evidence to the contrary, please share.

tolawdjk 2 years, 3 months ago

Thought we could have a reasonable discussion.

AAAAAAAAAAAAnd its gone.

Liberty275 2 years, 3 months ago

Kansas, actually Lawrence, morals can be summed up so:

I have never lived in a city that did not have a Martin Luther King Blvd before I came to Lawrence. That doesn't include my time in the service overseas. Yet, Lawrence is by far the most liberal city I've lived in.

Kansas morals in general - grow corn, praise god, grow soy beans.

fiddleback 2 years, 3 months ago

SageonPage, I always chuckle upon seeing your name, and was wondering if you've ever heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%...

Kirk Larson 2 years, 3 months ago

"Kobach equated same-sex relationships with drug abuse and polygamy."

Like if Mitt Rmoney's Grandpa was on crack?

chootspa 2 years, 3 months ago

Or like he moved to Mexico to continue to be gay. Yes, something like that.

classclown 2 years, 3 months ago

nondescript

The Journal World / Rothschild are really stretching to make Kobach look bad because they don't agree with him. Typical.

August 28, 2012 at 1:38 a.m.

============================================

Scott Rothschild is not a journalist. He is a propagandist.

jafs 2 years, 3 months ago

Low turnouts favor conservatives, and we seem to have rather low turnouts in KS.

jafs 2 years, 3 months ago

But, I thought those folks were all busy voting themselves "goodies"?

And, what about the famed "liberal elite", wealthy and powerful?

Fred Whitehead Jr. 2 years, 3 months ago

And agin we are treated to the sewage and viciousness out of the mouth of Kobach. This bigoted, ignorant, offensive, representation of true Republ;ican policy is a total jerk, a dimwit and a total embarrasment to the people of Kansas. The clueless idiots who voted for this moron must certainly be celebrating their great choice for our absentee public official and cheering him on as the greatest stain ever inflicted on the State of Kansas.

JustNoticed 2 years, 3 months ago

Don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel.

jonas_opines 2 years, 3 months ago

No amount of spin or parsing individual words in this headline will change that he is speaking in contravention of limited government, which Republicans like to trumpet that they actually believe in. You can't really get more obvious than “We condemn those activities even though they are not hurting other people, at least directly."

notaubermime 2 years, 3 months ago

Limited government is different from anarchy. While the language Republicans use to defend their views of what should be included in a limited government sometimes contradict their views of what should be excluded from a limited government, the simple fact that their barometer for determining legality does not revolve around a concept of how many people are affected does not inherently contradict a claim for limited government.

jonas_opines 2 years, 3 months ago

"This is more smoke and mirrors from the left for their goal is to defy God and to destroy the institution of marriage."

--This is what some posters actually believe.

"Nuff said."

Agreed.

deec 2 years, 3 months ago

Don't forget adultery, abuse and financial stress. These destroy marriage, too. I bet you'd be hard-pressed to find "someone else's gay marriage" on any list of top ten reasons for divorce.

If conservatives were truly interested in preserving marriage, they'd attack adultery, abuse and financial inequity with the same zeal they exhibit for their mythical quest for freedom from gay marriage. Or maybe the quest isn't really about preserving marriage.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

"The average male Homosexual marriage lasts 1.5 years and in that time they have 8 other sexual partners." Source? Still beats the average Kardashian/Spears/Limbaugh marriage statistics. Must have a weak marriage to be threatened so.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

Your citation has nothing to do whatsoever to current, modern same-sex marriages and has no relevance to this discussion. Your logic is as flawed as your testament, which is as pertinent here as a quotation from the equally-popular Harry Potter novels.

jonas_opines 2 years, 3 months ago

Oh, Pastor Bedtime, it's much worse than you suggest, fyi. It's almost like, when you randomly grab a citation from some right-wing website, you should actually Read at least the first intro paragraphs of the study in question.

Because suddenly, this becomes an examination of the behaviors of homosexual men under the age of 30 in Amsterdam, rather than the behavior of all homosexuals.

And suddenly, this can't be about marriage anymore, as the date of the study's data (1995-2000 at the latest) all fall before Amsterdam legalized same sex unions, in 2001.

http://journals.lww.com/aidsonline/pages/articleviewer.aspx?year=2003&issue=05020&article=00012&type=fulltext

Ragingbear 2 years, 3 months ago

Hey man ,I got some top quality same-sex union here. The first taste is always free. Yeah, that's the ticket. Get em hooked, then reel them in. Soon we will switch them up to the harder stuff. As soon as I figure out what that is, I will get them hooked on that.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 2 years, 3 months ago

"Soon we will switch them up to the harder stuff."

Maybe polygamist/polyandrist beastiality?

Liberty275 2 years, 3 months ago

You're a lousy pusher. My old guy always had polygamy in stock. The good stuff too, straight from Utah. Latter Day Paradise is what he called it. Speaking of which, do you keep any Northern Appalachian incestuous marriage in stock? I don't want that cheap incest from Arkansas.

Bob_Keeshan 2 years, 3 months ago

equate [ɪˈkweɪt] vb (mainly tr) 1. to make or regard as equivalent or similar, esp in order to compare or balance

Huuuuuge difference between compare and equate. Massive, wide gulf.

I'm confused as to why people are upset with the reporter. Kobach stood up and said same-sex marriage, just like drug use or polygamy, should not be tolerated or given legal recognition.

All of you running away from Kobach's comments agree with him 100%. Why is it every time Scott Rothschild prints your beliefs in the paper, you accuse him of being a liberal journalist?

Be proud of your beliefs.

Pastor_Bedtime 2 years, 3 months ago

Procreation is not a mandatory act, and not a requirement of marriage. And the net effect of every couple, straight or gay, who don't reproduce, is counteracted by the many, many couples who have many, many children.

fiddleback 2 years, 3 months ago

Word up, biggunz. Way to flash that 1st grade science knowledge, and/or nice trolling. So are you an innie or an outtie?

deec 2 years, 3 months ago

We sure do need to worry about making more people. It isn't like there aren't already 7 billion of them already or anything. Oh, wait...

Besides males and females don't have to have a government-recognized civil contract or religious ceremony to procreate. Humanity managed to procreate just fine for many centuries before they invented marriage certificates...or Christianity.

Carol Bowen 2 years, 3 months ago

Kobach could be angling to become the next governor.

bunnyhawk 2 years, 3 months ago

Once again, I don't understand why he isn't in Kansas doing the job he's paid to do. Once again, he's off in another state doing something else. Are we paying for his trip to Tampa? If I become a Republican can I get a free trip to Tampa?

Liberty275 2 years, 3 months ago

The door at the Mons is $20. One dance is twenty dollars. The last ten would last through one stage act.

$50 is not near enough to take to a strip club. We have college educations to pay for. Mandy's gonna be a Veterinarian.

"Any trips to the "Champagne Room" will have to come out of Jack Abramoff's slush fund!"

The "Champagne Room" at the Mons is a UFO on top of the building.

James Nelson 2 years, 3 months ago

More and more Kansans are wishing Mr. Kobach would go take a flying leap in the ocean while in Tampa. He might consider just staying there. Florida needs him far worse than we do, anyway.

After putting two and two together following an article appearing in todays Topeka paper it appears that the same Mr. Kobach is responsible for the car registration mess most Kansans are facing. Oh, I'm sure he would deny it and is so glad people haven't put two and two together before now. In his misguided zeal surrounding illegal voters it became necessary to overhaul the system of issuing drivers licenses for voter ID purposes. The change could not be accomplished without re-doing the car registration system. You have undoubtedly heard that the new drivers license system cannot be used until sometime next year now because of the issues with the new car registration system. This really PO'd Kobach because he wanted to rely on the new drivers license system to, you know, keep all those illegals from voting for Obama in November.

jaywalker 2 years, 3 months ago

Regarding the new car registration system, if one puts two and two together; it would be likely to assume that the new car registration system would equal four. Now, putting two and two together again, and adding to the new car registration's previous total, it seems logical that putting two and two together with the two and two aforementioned would, in all likelihood, equal 8.

Is that clear?

Or correct?

Armstrong 2 years, 3 months ago

Scotty, you're title should read " In my opinion" Kobach likens.... As always short on fact, lots of BS.

Orwell 2 years, 3 months ago

"Great things" if you hate democracy and constitutional rights. Otherwise, he hasn't done anything but blow his own horn on the taxpayer's dime.

Commenting has been disabled for this item.