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Archive for Tuesday, October 26, 2010

Smoking ban advocates voice concern over Kansas governor’s race

October 26, 2010

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2010 Kansas Elections: Governor

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— Kansas public health advocates say they worry about the views expressed by candidates for governor on the new statewide smoking ban.

The candidates haven't called for the law's repeal. But in a recent debate, both Republican Sam Brownback and Democrat Tom Holland said the issue should be left to local governments.

The ban took effect in July, and Tobacco Free Kansas Coalition President James Gardner says it will improve Kansans' health.

He and other public health advocates also say it enjoys broad public support. Some business owners say it's hurting their revenues.

Smoking is barred in most public places, including bars and restaurants — but not in state-owned casinos.

Comments

Lindsey Buscher 4 years, 2 months ago

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. The only compromise i can see for repealing the state ban is that every single municipality has to have there own ban in place before any kind of repeal takes effect.

jafs 4 years, 2 months ago

Any source for the claim that "most people were quite happy with things" before the ban?

The majority of non-smokers that I know, including myself, were not pleased with having to breathe second hand smoke in a variety of indoor settings.

And, I believe that non-smokers are currently more numerous than smokers, so ...

notajayhawk 4 years, 2 months ago

Maybe some of your fellow non-smokers actually took a little personal responsibility and chose not to patronize places that allowed smoking.

jafs 4 years, 2 months ago

As can the smokers, now that there's a ban.

My point was that lawrence's claim is most likely factually incorrect.

uberfreki 4 years, 2 months ago

It's not an equivalent scenario.

To say that smokers can exercise personal responsibility to not patronize non-smoking establishments when smoking is banned is to suggest that smokers shouldn't patronize any establishment.

When smoking was not banned, establishments had freedom of choice to set their own rules on smoking. A boycott of smoking establishments by non-smokers could have forced those establishments to consider changing their rules in regards to smoking, such that a natural balance came about with a mix of smoking and non-smoking establishments. There's no such scenario for smokers to vote with their dollars post-smoking ban, to affect a change within the capitalist system to allow indoor smoking in some establishments.

The closest a smoker can come to that scenario is to opt to go to bars with large outdoor patios, and certainly those businesses have benefitted unfairly from the ban, as bars without the option of creating a patio saw the value of their business drop overnight when the ban was implemented. And there's been no mass influx of non-smokers to offset the drop in business...apparently there's a correlation between people pre-disposed to smoke and people pre-disposed to frequent bars......

You are correct in your point that there are far more non-smokers than smokers, so Lawrence's claim about "most people" may have been inaccurate, and there's no way to validate it. There's no way to validate the counter claim that most people were unhappy with the status quo either, as this is not simply an issue of smokers versus non-smokers, but a larger issue of what the governments role is in dictating what we can and cannot do as citizens and as business owners. You need to consider that there are non-smokers that don't like the government playing nanny and restricting rights of citizens and businesses based on the principle that they know whats best for us. They may not have liked the fact that most bars were smokey environments, but they may be even more displeased at the government intervention. The widespread smoking bans seems to have given governments ever more confidence in playing the role of nanny and we see this evidenced across the U.S. with laws banning transfats, laws adding taxes to sodas to discourage us from drinking them, and laws creating garbage police to fine us if with throw away something recyclable. At what point do we stand up as a society and say enough is enough, the government should be facilitating our ability to live our lives as we see fit, not placing ever more restrictions on us, for our own good...

cayenne1992 4 years, 2 months ago

Those in favor of the smoking ban aren't only "liberal elites", but it probably makes you feel better and warmer thinking that is the case.

Lindsey Buscher 4 years, 2 months ago

Actually i doubt there were any non-smokers that were really "quite happy" being forced to deal with smoke in establishments where smoking was allowed...however, i have quite a few anecdotal accounts of smokers who prefer the smoking ban.

Liberty275 4 years, 2 months ago

I have never smoked and was quite happy going to bars where smoking was allowed. Now all I can do is boycott state-owned casinos for playing by different rules than were forced on commercial businesses That, however, is irrelevant as I find gambling a idiotic passtime.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Smoking has never been a crime, but then we haven't always been a control-freaky Socialist dictatorship, either.

ignati5 4 years, 2 months ago

Nor are we a "control-freaky Socialist dictatorship" now. What this could have to do with the smoking ban I don't know.

ignati5 4 years, 2 months ago

Nor are we a "control-freaky Socialist dictatorship" now. What this could have to do with the smoking ban I don't know.

Jcjayhawk1 4 years, 2 months ago

Why are the state owned casinos an exception?

somedude20 4 years, 2 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Why are the state owned casinos an exception?

Democrat owned and operated

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Oh, wait until they decide what other time immemorial habits they're "allergic" to and so all of society must adjust itself to accommodate their poor, fragile everything-hurts-me lives.

cayenne1992 4 years, 2 months ago

Gotta love the inability of some to see this as non-political. Do you really think the minority of liberals in the great, conservative state of KS somehow pushed through their liberal agenda on this one? You think Johnson Co. only passed a smoking ban because the liberals were "allergic" and therefore convinced the majority to vote in a ban? Either you're stupid, or you cannot accept the fact that a majority of your fellow citizens do not want to subjected to the hot air and smoke coming out of your mouth.

Danimal 4 years, 2 months ago

I say let the localities make up their minds on whether or not they want smoking bans in their towns and cities. Of course, there seems to be a disturbing trend of breaking our federalist system and taking as much power as possible from the hands of local leaders and giving it to the state and Federal level.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Knock, knock, knockin' on Heaven's Door. How stupid is it to not know guns and cars are killing you quicker than anybody smokin' a damn cigarette?

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

You need to watch a loved one die from cancer. Who cares how quickly it kills you. I'd rather get shot and die quick than suffer through cancer.

I smoked for 22 years. Smartest thing I did was quit and the ban was part of the reason I did. If you want to kill yourself slowly, fine. Just don't take me down with you. Being in a room with smokers, I can feel the effects and can't believe I was stupid enough to smoke for so long.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

I think the legislature who passed the current ban with this exemption was under control of Republicans.

I couldn't care less. The Socialist Dims ran with it no matter.

Ira Rott 4 years, 2 months ago

I love the smoking ban, not because I care if you smoke or not, but because non-smokers shouldn't be forced to inhale your garbage when dining out. If you want to feed your nicotine habit in places covered by the smoking ban, use e-cigarettes. That way you can keep "smoking" while not killing everyone else in your immediate vicinity.

StaceyD 4 years, 2 months ago

Andrew Gray doesn't duck hard questions. On his website they posted a comment from one of the smoking ban advocates, and answered the comment publicly as well.

http://kansasproud.com/?p=649

StaceyD 4 years, 2 months ago

Not true.

A vote for Brownback is wasted...he'll win anyway.

A vote for Holland is wasted...he'll lose anyway.

A vote for Andrew Gray changes the political landscape of Kansas forever.

http://kansasproud.com/?p=665

bliddel 4 years, 2 months ago

@BABBOY - how would you feel if your vote didn't count? It sounds to me as though that is exactly what you want. As a Libertarian, I must respect your wishes. If everyone who hates Brownback (but votes for him anyway because they want to pick the winner) would vote for Gray/Davis, I think Gray/Davis would be the winning team, and Kansas would be a better place as a direct result.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Smoking doesn't get me killed driving to some Porker's Party Establishment because I don't go there.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

And I bet you, Guardian_Owl, that when I turn on my TV tonight there will be people who have been shot and killed "for no apparent reason," robbed and killed, killed in a vehicle collision, killed by stray gunfire, killed in hit & run, killed from being beaten, killed driving drunk, killed in a domestic dispute...yada, yada, yada...and then you know what I do after I listen to how dead YOUR stupid world is? I put my cigarette out, take a shower, and I go to bed.

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

cayenne1992 4 years, 2 months ago

killed by gunfire, killed by car accident, robbed, blah blah blah...

This is a terrible argument that is used over and over. You ever hear that two wrongs don't make a right?

shadowlady 4 years, 2 months ago

Well, I'm a non smoker, and I say each to his own. The smokers already know it is bad for their health, so let them smoke. If the time comes that they want to quit smoking, then it is their choice and all harranging from everyone is not going to change them. I guess what gets me, are the one's that complain about second hand smoke, and I'm betting most of them are drinkers, so your killing yourselves, cause the booze is eating up your liver and doing damage to your kidneys. In the restaurants they had seperate seating for non smokers, but guess that wasn't good enough for the people that want to control how others live. Geez, let everyone live their own life and you just take care of your own.

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

The separate seating for non-smokers - give me an effing break! It wasn't about controling how others live. Even as a smoker, I would not smoke in a restaurant (that was just plain rude). It is so nasty to smell smoke and try to eat. Do you understand that smell is a very important part of taste? If I wanted to eat food that tastes like a stale cig, I would have asked them to empty an ashtray in my dish.

2nd hand smoke is nasty. You are very ill informed about it's effects, which are well proven. Explain to me why heart attack rates decline after smoking bans are put into place? 2nd hand smoke is proven to constrict blood vessels, raising blood pressure, increasing the chance for clots and contributing to cardiac arrest. Drinking in moderation isn't harmful.

I'm not going to tell a smoker to not smoke, but I will tell them to take it outside. I smoked for over 20 years and never had a nasty attitude like I was entitled to smoke where ever I wanted. I don't understand why so many are so freaked out by a law telling them to take it outside. Good gawd, it's just called common respect.

shadowlady 4 years, 2 months ago

LOL!!! Well, that tells me your a drinker. what about the people that gets killed by drunk drivers?? AND if your setting away from the smoke, you shouldn't be tasting stale cigarette smoke, I never have, so it must be your imagination. you know someone is smoking so your antennas are up and ready for the taste. YUM YUM!!and another LOL "freaked out" what about the ones that are freaked out cause someone is smoking?? LOL!! You go gatekeeper. If you want to take your smoking outside, so be it. Like I said to each his own. I need to be more informed?? You judge to easily. And I did not say that smoking was not bad for you, I said the smokers know of the health issues involved, again you judge to easily. LOL!! Take a chill pill!!

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

I am a casual drinker. A few beers a week at the Free State is all and I walk because I live close to downtown. My sister was hit by a drunk driver in 1986, so I'm pretty adament about not drinking and driving and don't think that they are tough enough on those they do bust. And I stand by my previous post that moderate drinking isn't a health hazard - 2nd hand smoke is.

The restaurants would often have the smoking section right by the non-smoking. RARELY was it a separate room. Free State - smoking was downstairs and all the smoke went upstairs to the non-smoking. Remember that? How about Applebees? Smoke at the bar, but the bar is in the middle surrounded by tables. Need more examples?

You are an idiot, shadowlady! Go back into the shadows.

Shardwurm 4 years, 2 months ago

The only logical compromise to this situation is to raise tuition at State universities.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

You need to watch a loved one die from cancer.

I have watched everybody die, Gatekeeper, and when they died they died free, and I'm glad they're not here to see this country today because I may not have those same rights to die.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

But it was never any of your damn business anyway.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Sounds like you need to smoke a blunt instead to chill out your nasty *ss.

Good one, Gatekeeper. Let me just snuff out this cigarette, fire up a blunt and push back that dreaded dyin' day. Maybe I'll get to die in the hoosegow and not in my own bed.

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

Well, find me a study showing the carcinogens in pot? Please, find one. That's right, there aren't any. Of course no smoke is good for the lungs, but a little bit of weed isn't going to kill you. Puffing packs of carcingen laced cigs every day will and you endanger others if you're smoking around us.

My point is that the rest of us don't need to be subjected to YOUR smoke. Smoke what ever you want, kill yourself how every you want. DON"T take the rest of us out because you are too weak to stop your nasty habit.

Your posts show you have attitude issues and you do need to chill.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Sounds like you need to smoke a blunt instead ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Good one, Gatekeeper. Let me just snuff out this cigarette, fire up a blunt and push back that dreaded dyin' day. Maybe I'll get to die in the hoosegow and not in my own bed.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

What's the matter JW Thought Police? A little tougher to kill free speech than you were hoping?

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Your posts show you have attitude issues and you do need to chill.

Your posts show that you need to find the right cigarette to smoke to increase your brain power.

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

Oh yeah, that's it. Increased brain power from smoking cigs. You have lost your mind.

Ever heard of anger management. From your posts, its sounds like It would do you good. A sign of nicotine withdrawel is anger, so go puff away. Take the hate away for a few short minutes.

You just don't get it. Your rights aren't being trampled on. You can smoke, just not in closed public spaces. Why is it so terrible that you can't smoke indoors? I know I know, how dare they tell me what I can and can't do. Well, sometimes laws have to be made because idiots will do things to harm others. You can have all the bad habits you want, you just don't have the right to endanger and inflict harm on those around you. You make it seem like the thought police are trying to dictate your entire world. It's not all about you. It's called the common good and if you're a smoker, you are a small minority that doesn't have the right to inflict your smoke on others.

Simple.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

My point is that the rest of us don't need to be subjected to YOUR smoke. Smoke what ever you want, kill yourself how every you want. DON"T take the rest of us out because you are too weak to stop your nasty habit.

Maybe you're talking to the voices in your head because I'm not bothering anybody anywhere at any time. It's that sort of reciprocal respect that I ask for, but I can't have.

pet_serval 4 years, 2 months ago

You are bothering people if you are smoking in a public place where there are non-smokers around. Your smoking is bothering their health, and the health of their children. It is affecting their sense of taste and smell as well as their health while they are out trying to enjoy a nice dinner of food they paid to taste. Is it right that they should all have to suffer through their meal because of a choice you made? If you think so then you really have no respect for yourself or anyone else. I'm a smoker and even before the smoking ban I opted to smoke outdoors. I have never found it right of me to subject others around me to possible health risks just cause I want to inflict my bad habits on myself.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Life is a sentence, Gatekeeper, and nobody gets out alive.

gatekeeper 4 years, 2 months ago

But it's not up to you to inflict the death sentence.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

But I could use a blunt right about now. Kind of a shame that all I've got are these crappy smokes.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

I'm not angry, GK. I can't be angry. I passed angry a long time ago. It's not where I'm at. I'm not afraid to die like so many are. You're giving smokers unwarranted, unrestrained power to say they inflict this death sentence. Come on Keeper. People die. Most folks that I know do, however, choose to live their own lives and let everyone else live theirs.

FYI my friend, I claim no power to kill any one.

IndusRiver 4 years, 2 months ago

Let It Be (Lennon/McCartney)

When I find myself in times of trouble Mother Mary comes to me Speaking words of wisdom, let it be. And in my hour of darkness She is standing right in front of me Speaking words of wisdom, let it be. Let it be, let it be. Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.

And when the broken hearted people Living in the world agree, There will be an answer, let it be. For though they may be parted there is Still a chance that they will see There will be an answer, let it be. Let it be, let it be. Yeah There will be an answer, let it be.

And when the night is cloudy, There is still a light that shines on me, Shine on until tomorrow, let it be. I wake up to the sound of music Mother Mary comes to me Speaking words of wisdom, let it be. Let it be, let it be. There will be an answer, let it be. Let it be, let it be, Whisper words of wisdom, let it be

deskboy04 4 years, 2 months ago

I think the question for me is how much control do I want the government to have? I really think it should be a decision made by the owner of a business. I have no problem with banning smoking in public places. But if an owner of a business wants to let people smoke...why not? I don't have to frequent his/her establishment. I don't have to work in that environment.

StaceyD 4 years, 2 months ago

You just might be a libertarian.

http://kansasproud.com/?page_id=221

Andrew Gray for Governor.

bliddel 4 years, 2 months ago

I don't smoke, and don't drink, don't use recreational drugs, don't engage in extramarital sex. I guess you could say I am boring. That said, I also don't want the government telling me I can't do any of those things, any more than I want the government telling me I HAVE to do any of those things. It's called liberty. See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muHg86... if you don't understand the Philosophy of Liberty, or why it is so important to vote Libertarian this election.

Armored_One 4 years, 2 months ago

What is the point of arguing over this issue again?

I could point out numerous E.P.A. reports conducted over the last 10 years that cite a number of things in our modern lives that are more toxic than cigarettes ever managed to be. Cars produce 3600 times more carbon monoxide, for example.

The fact of the matter is that mob mentality once again proved it's unyielding strength in the human psyche.

While it will impact my life just as much as everyone else, I will have to point and laugh when whole states start filing for federal bail outs when those hundreds of millions gained from the insane sales taxes on tobacco products are no longer available.

Sales taxes across the board. Gasoline taxes. Property taxes. Cuts in social services. Cuts in education.

You will have no one to blame but yourselves. Me, I plan on quiting sometime after the first of the year, but I will watch and laugh.

Any mechanic worth his first set of wrenches will tell you that you have to get something operational before you can tweak it at all.

Oh, and I watched one grandparent die of pancreatic cancer, from the day she was diagnosed to the day she died. Primary cause: diabetes. Secondary cause: smoking. Another grandparent died from lung cancer and GASP never smoked a day in his life, nor did anyone in his house.

Having watched both of those very dear people die from cancer, I will still tell you you bite my pasty white [expletive deleted]. Forests and trees. Forests and trees.

TopJayhawk 4 years, 2 months ago

More siiliness from the ultra freaky control nut jobs of the left. If you mean to imply that conservatives were for the smoking ban, you are delusional. It should not even be up to Towns. It should be up to the business itself. Ever hear of personal freedom? How about being able to control what is yours? I know these are novel concepts to a lot of you.

jafs 4 years, 2 months ago

Since the KS legislature is heavily Republican dominated, your post makes little sense.

independant1 4 years, 2 months ago

It just goes to show, a good idea.

We need a law for every good idea don't we?

kansasmutt 4 years, 2 months ago

Choice is a word not known to the do gooders. Cant wait to see the ban tossed out for choice !! Too late for the businesses closing up though, the damage is done. Cant get back the billions in sales tax Kansas has lost either. 3 of the 8 businesses that are going to be gone by Dec 31st have been anounced so far this week. Rumors are a HUGE manufacturer is also going to anounce it is closing up shop. and with it 300 to 400 jobs. Ya gotta love our stste leaders for jumping in and helping out.

Sheila Martin 4 years, 1 month ago

What has brought us down this path is grant money from the people who sell Nicoderm, Nicorette, Nicotrol, Commit, Nicoderm CQ, and Chantix. The over half a billion dollars that they have funded to lobby groups to get smoking bans, (including the Cancer Society, the Heart and Lung Associations, paid doctor speakers, Tobacco Free Kansas, Kansas Health Insittute, Kansas Health Foundation, the Sunflower Foundation) would not have been as effective if they had simply bought advertising. They have discovered that buying Legislators is alot cheaper and more reliable than ads. Not one of these groups will lobby to ban the selling of tobacco products. Since the State made $212,000,000.00 in '09 from the sales of tobacco, THEY damn sure don't want Kansas to be tobacco free! And the lobby groups, calling themselves charities (HAHA) would be out of work if we banned the selling of tobacco. That would end the selling of their nicotine replacement products. Which, by the way, have about a 1% success rate. Just Google "Robert Wood Johnson Foundation" with ANY of these lobby groups, and you will come up with a million links. It's about grant money people, it ain't about health. The studies that are touted by Pro ban are also funded by pro ban. They just leave out the ones that don't promote their agenda. It's called "meta analysis". Real scientists call it BUNK. UInfortunately, the paper will not present the truth and let people decide. Theya re getting a fortune in ad money from pro ban and from Johnson and Johnson "family" of companies for their nico replacement. Have a nice day, you sheep people.

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