Topeka — A Kansas legislator Monday urged passage of a bill to allow hunting of mountain lions.
Rep. Mitch Holmes, R-St. John, said mountain lion sightings are increasing — endangering livestock and farmers.
“If I shoot one, I don’t want to be in trouble for it,” Holmes told the House Agriculture and Natural Resources Committee.
But Chris Tymeson, chief counsel for state Wildlife and Parks, said there was no law against shooting a mountain lion on personal property.
“If you want to protect your property or yourself, you can do so,” Tymeson said.
But, he said, it’s illegal to possess a mountain lion carcass. That’s so people don’t actively hunt mountain lions and create what one legislator called a “UFO-type circus atmosphere.”
Tymeson said a live mountain lion was confirmed last year in Trego County, but most sightings were unconfirmed.
Rep. Don Hineman, R-Dighton, said current law was adequate for self-protection. He added, “To some extent they (mountain lions) are doing us a service by helping keep the deer population under control.”
Holmes also added the hunting of wolves to his bill because he said it was just a matter of time before they return to Kansas. But Tymeson said wolves are protected by federal law, and at this point are not in Kansas.
Comments
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kansastruthteller (anonymous) says…
Surprised he didn't add bigfoot too - just a matter of time before bigfoot shows up you know.
HOMETOWNBOY (anonymous) says…
Hey just...you obviously do not know much about wild animals! Every watch the animal planet? Maybe you should take a trip just East of Louisburg to the big cat reserve. You "just" might learn something.
RoeDapple (anonymous) says…
Does happen troll...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6F3qX...
http://www.topangaonline.com/nature/l...
http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cougar#A...
AreUNorml (anonymous) says…
sounds like Holmes just wants to kill something different. I'm surprised one of his quotes wasn't "We have to think of the children"
countrygirl (anonymous) says…
Gee, does this mean that wildlife and parks is finally going to recongize that there are mountain lions in Kansas? They've been denying it for years, despite the reports.
artichokeheart (anonymous) says…
What's really going on here is he wants to keep the pelts. Currently a person can only shoot for protection and they have to turn the pelts in.
wakarusan (anonymous) says…
How does one hunt something that, according to the KDWP doesn't exist in Kansas?
AreUNorml (anonymous) says…
wakarusan, you have to be vewy vewy quiet...
snap_pop_no_crackle (anonymous) says…
Skiapods and mantacores will be next on the open season list.
autie (anonymous) says…
I spotted three prarie squid last Sunday in Woodson County.
labmonkey (anonymous) says…
The current stance is stupid....they don't exist in Kansas, yet if you bring us a carcass, you will be fined and thrown in jail.
My family has a neighbor whose bull had huge scratch marks on its back, and the parks and wildlife person had the gall to tell them that grasshoppers caused it.
They are around and a threat to livestock. Not to go all "Area 51" on you, but they were probably introduced by Parks and Wildlife to work on the deer population. God forbid we have rifle season during the rut.
75x55 (anonymous) says…
"Not to go all “Area 51” on you"...
Of course not - that's called going all "aluminum foil hat-wearing on you".
Why do people feel the need to insist this? They are predators, they follow their prey. We have deer out the ying-yang, therefore they will be along presently. Man's almighty intervention is not required.
labmonkey (anonymous) says…
75x55
Then why the (almost secrative) insistance by KPW that there are no mountain lions in Kansas?
parrothead8 (anonymous) says…
We "civilize" more and more land, thereby taking away more and more of their habitat, and this guy wants to shoot them for coming onto "our" land. Methinks the mountain lion is not the problem here.
headdoctor (anonymous) says…
labmonkey (Anonymous) says…
75x55
Then why the (almost secrative) insistance by KPW that there are no mountain lions in Kansas?
_____________________________________________
One conspiracy theory is the KPW was catching so much flack over the deer population by farmers and vehicle accidents, so they have been trying to restore a natural predator to control the deer population without all the guff about massive controlled hunts.
tolawdjk (anonymous) says…
@labmonkey
Why the secrecy? Most likely because if they were to declare lions to be in Kansas they would then have to do some kind of endangerment finding most likely with the result that lions would be considered at least a threatened species and possibily an endangered one within Kansas.
It is the same issue CO is going through with wolves. There are reported/potential sightings and evidence of a breeding pack out west there.
Not sure why Holmes thinks he could get away with that kind of legislation, particularly with wolves. It would be decades before they would cross to Kansas, most likely never. Nebraska would have a higher likelihood of a wolf population.
RoeDapple (anonymous) says…
Cougar? It's all in how you prepare it...
http://www.huntingtipsandtricks.com/a...
(uh,oh, here it comes...)
billbodiggens (anonymous) says…
The next thing you know grizzly bears will be moving back out on the high plains. Brown bears have been spotted and tracked a number of times down in the southwest corner of the state. Why wait until someone gets hurt?
50YearResident (anonymous) says…
Can we take this as an official anouncement from Kansas Department of Wildlife and Parks, there are "Cougars" aka "Mountain Lions" in Kansas.
milkman_dan (anonymous) says…
The Eldridge is chock full of Kansas cougars on Martini night.
Cappy (anonymous) says…
Too bad. I thought the headline meant big cats would be allowed to hunt.
dudedog12 (anonymous) says…
There are for sure i have seen them, they have always denied their existence... the "cat" is out of the bag for sure now LMAO !!!
Pywacket (anonymous) says…
What a friggin' idiot--and, whaddaya know, he's a Republican. I suggest that the KS legislature should concentrate on far more pressing issues rather than p*zz away time on this nonsense.
Not to mention, the fool needs to learn some facts about pumas and pass them on to his ignorant constituents. The likelihood of cougars having any meaningful negative impact on domestic livestock must be greatly exaggerated in those constituents' tiny wild-west brains.
KSManimal (anonymous) says…
Our schools are starving, the state budget is a disaster....even to the point that there is talk of releasing prisoners early rather than paying to keep 'em locked up....and this guy's spending his legislative time on bills to allow hunting of animals (wolves) that don't even live here?
What's the matter with Kansas? Give y'all a hint: starts with "R".......
ladyoneill (anonymous) says…
The premise of this bill is that livestock and farmer are in danger and we good citizens of Kansas need to be able to kill big cats menacing them. Livestock is kept on private property. Farmers live on private property. You can already kill the cats on private property.
One more stupid bill in our legislature.
Though getting someone in government to admit that mountain lions exist in Kansas is a plus.
jaywalker (anonymous) says…
"What a friggin' idiot—and, whaddaya know, he's a Republican"
No point reading the rest of that post when it starts out that moronically.
jocknavals (anonymous) says…
mtn lions do kill and eat people...little kids and adults who present themselves in 'prey position', that is, squatted down low, retying a shoe, pumping up a bicycle tire, relieving themselves, etc.
that said, it's no reason to kill them off, they fill a niche, take out excessive deer. if you practice cat awareness behaviors, you will not get attacked. it would cost the state a few thousand dollars a year to compensate farmers and ranchers for the loss of livestock proven to be taken by a mountain lion. north america has large areas where big cats and humans live together. this legislator's 19th century mind set is so retarded.
snap_pop_no_crackle (anonymous) says…
Meow.
1029 (anonymous) says…
We need a bill that allows small-cat hunting. When I was a kid out in the country, small cat hunting was necessary because of all the damage them animals did to the crops. Old lady down the road had about 15 cats and I'll never forget the day my pop had enough and he blasted one with his S&W 10 5/8" Model 29. That thing must have busted into at least 5 pieces. Quite a site to see.
Ricky_Vaughn (anonymous) says…
When I read the headline, I thought it had something to do with KU basketball...
jumpin_catfish (anonymous) says…
You know what they say about guys with bigfeet.
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
i first thought this was about bill self hunting "big cats" such as tigers and wildcats. lol seriously. i'm a dork.
nope, don't want people to shoot big cats or wolves. for what? if its a game you want, can't you do that kind of stuff via a videogame?
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
1029, you're sick.
sustainabilitysister (anonymous) says…
wildland-urban interface sprawl.... poor critters
scott3460 (anonymous) says…
At a time when other government programs are suffering drastic cuts in service due to budget shortfalls, isn't what this fool is proposing that even more of the severely limited resources be diverted from those programs and devoted instead to starting and administering a new hunting program? For sheer, shameless gall, you have to give it to this right winger. Good job, voters of St. John.
The_Original_Bob (anonymous) says…
To those that didn't read past the headline...
"Tymeson said a live mountain lion was confirmed last year in Trego County, but most sightings were unconfirmed."
Kansas has recognized.
KawHawk (anonymous) says…
KDWP hasn't been and has never denied there were cougars in Kansas. They have always asked for definite proof, like a carcass, and not some blurry pictures or vague scratches or the rambling accounts of your typical meth-crazed, mouth-breathing, paint-huffing rural-Kansas-loonie who "....done seen a humonguous black cat in the tomater garden at midnight..."
Outsidelookingin (anonymous) says…
When I read the headline, I thought it was going to be a sports article. Self turning the team loose on K-State.
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
my mom and i were talking about how it is weird to us how people are just NOW saying "oh my goodness, there are mountain lions in kansas!" um.... duuuh. when were they not here? my mom has seen them as a child (chatauqua county), her sister who lives in the country by a river has seen them in the past couple of years (franklin county) and a few years ago there were sightings up by ottawa county. there's this amount of shock all of the sudden as if people are seeing giraffes or something. what the hell?.....
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
no, he said that his father killed someone's pet, comrade. now, i am assuming (and yes, it is a big assumption) that you and 1029 either own or have owned dogs... would you want someone to kill them just for the hell of it-- because they don't like dogs? there are people who do that and i think they are every bit as reprehensible as someone who would deliberately kill someone's pet cat/ferret/hamster/goldfish/iguana....
funkdog1 (anonymous) says…
Um, 1029 claimed that feral cats were killing "crops."
??????
Feral cats tend to keep the mice population down on farms. Those do eat crops.
The_Original_Bob (anonymous) says…
Funkdog -
You tell me you have never seen a posse of feral cats playing with the tassles on corn?
kusp8 (anonymous) says…
Can I shoot the lockness monster if I see her/him in Potters Lake or Clinton Lake? I don't want to eat him/her, I just want to be able to brag to my old college drinking buddies.
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
thank you, funkdog1 (love the screen name, btw).
and, comrade, AGAIN i make the point that 1029 said his father deliberately killed someone's P-E-T. hello?? do you want someone to kill your pets-- and i'm sure they would go crap in someone's yard or tear up the neighbor's newspaper if you let him loose. hell, alot of larger dogs kill squirrels, opossums and *shudders* birds (i know someone whose german shephard loved to catch and eat birds).
other than an animal (which would probably be a dog) mauling someone, i can't really see the logic or rationale in purposely killing someone's pet.
autie (anonymous) says…
I believe the operative term here is feral. Not ferrill or ferrell. It is feral. That means by definition, Honey, that they are not PETS. They are as wild as wild can be. Now all I can do is think of stir fry. Cuz theres a cat in the kettle at the peking moon, it's the little place i go at noon...
This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.
Brak (anonymous) says…
I've killed a few wildcats out by Manhattan, but I wouldn't suggest eating them if they are purple, it means the meat has gone bad.
feeble (anonymous) says…
wait, I thought we were talking about a certain one-schtick comedian?
autie (anonymous) says…
We spotted the loch ness monster in a borrow pit in Woodson County back in early June. I don't know why I always see the oddball things in Woodson County. You'd think I'd be more apt to see the strange ones in Coffey County. Like the nuclear alligators.
honeychild (Mel Briscoe) says…
hey, the loch ness monster is roe's pet-- don't shoot him gotdurnit!!
teacherman (anonymous) says…
Wow, it is amazing to see who/what comes out of the woodwork after a story such as this. I recall a local gal telling me once, in response to stories of jogger attacks in California, that it would be an honor to be "taken" by a cougar. I believe she moved out to the west coast...... (true story)
There is a great distinction to be made between human life and animal life, which seems to have been lost on many. These creatures will attack humans, and being stealthy prowlers, it is not always possible to prevent this. Figure it out.
RoeDapple (anonymous) says…
Too late, served him up this morning!!
;-)
riverat (Joe Hyde) says…
If Rep. Holmes wants to make it legal to hunt mountain lions, I hope he realizes that such a development will entail the Dept. of Wildlife & Parks officially designating the creature as a big game animal. Regulations pertaining to fair chase will need to be drawn up, hunting zones identified for management purposes, minimum required weaponry identified, open seasons set, etc.
I would guess that if such a season ever does come into being, the cost of a Kansas mountain lion permit will be extremely pricey. And if you kill one without buying that permit, and you get caught, that'll be even pricier yet.
BrianR (anonymous) says…
If these big kitties are near developed areas, they should be moved if possible. It doesn't appear that there are a lot of them so it makes no sense to hunt them. I think about big cats sometimes when I'm out in the sticks with the dogs, we've been shadowed by something before but it didn't show it's face so I don't know what it was. The dogs heard it too so I know it wasn't a Fig Newton of my imagination. It coulda been anything though...
Wallythewalrus (anonymous) says…
Comrad Red herring: I for one would welcome the hunting of Will Ferrell. Bag'em and Tag'em.
Wallythewalrus (anonymous) says…
euh, euh, euh.... Mr Kotter we could charge a puma permit (tax) of 5 million dollars and pay for our schools.
Wallythewalrus (anonymous) says…
"Rep. Mitch Holmes, R-St. John, said mountain lion sightings are increasing — endangering livestock and farmers."
So just seeing a puma scares the livestock and farmers so badly that farmers and livestock are becoming endangered species???
newbee2 (anonymous) says…
Teacherman said "Wow, it is amazing to see who/what comes out of the woodwork after a story such as this."
You know what is "amazing" teacherman, is that Mountain Lions/Cougars/Pumas have only been confirmed once (since they were exterminated from Kansas) in Kansas and the Wildlife and Parks believe it was someone's pet that was turned loose, not necessarily a wild one.
This is not Colorado, Montana, Wyoming, Oregon, Washington or California, there have been no cases of any Mountain Lions/Cougars/Pumas killing Kansas livestock in Kansas (since they were exterminated from Kansas). There has never been a case of a Mountain Lion/Cougar/Puma attacking or killing a human being in Kansas, period, even when they roamed the State.
Additionally, this bill includes, wolves, a federally protected animal that hasn't been in existence in the State of Kansas since like the late 1800's. The dog like animal running across the Kansas Prairie is a Coyote, which may take chickens and other small livestock, but doubtfully is taking cattle since Coyotes don't run in packs like wolves do.
Now, with all that being said, what you should really be "amazed" about is not who/what is coming out on this forum to discuss this bill, you should be amazed at who or what is in our Kansas Legislature that is wasting Kansas tax dollars and time worrying about a problem that does not even exist (there is no current Mountain Lion or wolf problem in Kansas), instead of worrying about and taking care of the State Budget, and schools and taxes and jobs! This bill is ridiculous, period!
Thinking_Out_Loud (anonymous) says…
Pywacket wrote "...whaddaya know, he's a Republican."
Hardly surprising, given the percentage of the State legislators who are. You can't swing a dead mountain lion without hitting a Republican over there.
The_Original_Bob (anonymous) says…
I believe this guy is up for reelection this year. If so, brilliant PR strategy to bring this up to get name recognition.
BorderRuffian (anonymous) says…
What is with all the hoopla and hyperbole here? People hear the word "lion," or the word "wolf," and all they can do is conjure up images of Little Red Riding Hood (no doubt in KU crimson, edged properly in blue) getting harassed by the big bad wolf, or imagine ferocious lions tearing granny-ladies and little babies to shreds. In reality, there is very little to fear from either creature. Sure - they are and can be deadly predators. BUT!!! IF they are in Kansas (pretty good probability), they have been attracted for exactly one reason. Not the granny-ladies and not the kiddos (delicious as they might seem). If they are moving into the area it is because their staple food supply is already here - deer.
The same pretty little doey-eyed Bambis that look all cuddly and cute, are the same grossly overpopulated herds of deer that so obligingly lie in wait alongside the highways, ready to pounce on unsuspecting cars and trucks, and the occasional motorcycle. OUr deer population is out of control, in part because of all the bleeding-heart Demolibs (you just knew I had to sneak that in there) who refuse to allow hunters in such places as Shawnee Mission Park to come in and attempt to thin the herds to sane numbers.
How is it that the same people who get their knickers all up in a knot if anyone scares, not to mention dines-on, sweet Bambi, can hardly wait to go out and shoot one of nature's few natural means of keeping the Bambi population under control.
If the cats and wolfies are here now, they are here for the deer, not Mr. & Mrs. Demolib's fat, toady little snivel-nose urchin with an entitled attitude as long as the Kaw.
ralphralph (anonymous) says…
I don't think mountain lions merit a lot of time, given the present finances. However, we are going to have to make some kind of assessment at some time. There isn't any question that mountain lions are present (I tried not to insert this, but yes, I have seen one, about ten years ago, near the Chase/Marion County line in the Flint Hills ... it was unmistakeably a puma, though it could have come from anywhere, and could have been wild or feral or tame-and-escaped). Maybe the assessment has already been made, just by noting the scarcity of sitings, and the conclusion is that there may be a few big cats out and about, but not such a significant population that it calls for any action in the near future. I would agree with the conclusion, I think, especially until the schools are funded.
In the meantime, our legislators ought to be dealing with "real" issues, or they ought to furlough themselves and go home before they cost us any more money.
pace (anonymous) says…
I want open range cattle hunting.
catfishturkeyhunter (anonymous) says…
Many people report seeing them, but if you ask how many real mountain lions they saw before that one, they would probably say none. I'm not saying Kansas doesn't have them, but there certainly isn't a huntable population to speak of. If Kansas does indeed have a small population of mountain lions, its not because they came here from Colorado, New Mexico or Wyoming. Most likely the cougars that are here, are here because someone owned them as a pet and either the cat was illegally released or it escaped. There might be mountain lions here, but they aren't truely wild. However, if there are enough that have escaped or been released, it wont take long untill we have true wild mountain lions running around. If you ask me, thats awesome. I don't think they would overpopulate simply because there isn't enough habbitat for them. Mountain lions dont favor wheat fields and pastures. They like the forest, and rocky environments. Like mentioned before, they would do a great job on deer control. The problem is, the farmers wont stand for it and who could blame them. Cows don't come cheap. Personally, I would love the opportunity to hunt a mountain lion, but Kansas simply doesn't have anywhere close to a huntable population that would warrant an open season on them. If anything, a bill needs to be drawn up to allow hunters to be able to kill ferel pigs that have plauged the south eastern third of the state. Right now the state is spending a great deal of money to fix a problem that indeed needs to be delt with. But why not allow hunters do the dirty work for the state? I can't tell you how many guys would jump at the chance to erradicate some ferel hogs. If the state opened a year round season for ferel pigs, much like they have for coyotes, only requiring a hunting licence and maybe a small fee for a hog tag, they would save a lot of money. As for mountain lions and wolves, I say no hunting or killing unless you or your property are in imminent danger.
lounger (anonymous) says…
This man is a fool! Who is going to protect the top of the food chain-=the mountain lions?? Protect farmers and livestock my butt!! Farmers are smart enough to know when and when not to take matters into thier own hands!! They dont need MORE laws telling them what to do. Mountain Lions are great animals and need not to be hunted. I find this whole thing amusing because its only been very recently that anyone in government admitted they were even here. Please go do some real work Holmes...
kansasmutt (anonymous) says…
They will eat someone one of theese days. They just need to be in the right place and the right time. It will happen. They have to be very hungry to stalk and kill a human. They do it in Colorado and Cali every year. Think that state line to the west is going to stop them ? Suprise, they are here now.
RoeDapple (anonymous) says…
cth - mountain lions mate form Dec to March, producing 2 to 4 offspring with each litter. They have been spotted in Kansas for many years. I spotted one less than two miles from west Lawrence over 15 years ago. Even if these animals were pets released into the wild (I call b.s.) they have had ample time to produce completely wild offspring, several times over. They are here, though not in sufficient enough numbers to be seen often. Primarily nocturnal, the most likely time to see one is at night in the deep woods. Not a great way of meeting one
BrianR (anonymous) says…
Brilliant! That is sure to be a dirty job.