Archive for Sunday, December 5, 2010

Topeka man killed after kicking in neighbor’s apartment door

December 5, 2010

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A 49-year-old Topeka man who forced his way into his neighbor’s apartment was shot and killed by the tenant.

Police say Edward Bowens was found dead just after 3 a.m. Saturday at an apartment complex five blocks southwest of the Kansas Statehouse.

The tenant, who hasn’t been named, was being questioned Saturday morning but had not been arrested or charged with anything.

A resident of the complex said the man who was shot lived across the hall from the apartment he broke into.

The resident said the shooting victim may have been looking for someone he believed was in the apartment where he was shot.

Comments

bullydad1 4 years, 5 months ago

Glad cooler heads prevailed. Guns are great.

Shardwurm 4 years, 5 months ago

And you wouldn't have defended yourself? Perhaps a ball bat to spatter his brains or maybe a knife so you can see the look of surprise in his eyes?

kjellifritt 4 years, 5 months ago

Wow! You really spent some time choreographing this out. Thank you, I did get a kick out of it.

I have to ask a question though. It's very simple, non-offensive, to the point type of question. Okay, well here it goes. WHAT WORLD DO YOU LIVE IN?

"A shoving match, a little jail time, a good ole fist fight"...what in the world? Someone breaks into my home and you want to relive a scene from The Good, the Bad and the Ugly?

What are you, 15 years old? You're too funny my friend, too damn funny! :)

kjellifritt 4 years, 4 months ago

I guess I feel stupid for actually responding to your comment earlier. I thought you were trying to make a serious comment about this story, but after reading this last one of yours, I realized you're not serious. This guy breaks down a door to someones home and you are wanting to see murder charges brought against the home owner? Riiiight! Again, I feel stupid for thinking you were serious. Your last comment gave you away. Sorry...lol. It's pretty sad though that there was a serious situation that happened and we have people like you screwing around on here because you think it's funny.

Oh, and sorry, I couldn't let this one go. Breaking down someones door (by force) is NOT a petty domestic despute. Good try though.

Now, on to the serious comments.

BlackVelvet 4 years, 4 months ago

I don't think bullydad1 was being facetious.

rtwngr 4 years, 5 months ago

Cooler heads prevailed when the guy that kicked the door in was laying on the floor, dead. The moral to this story is, "If you don't want to get shot, don't kick someone's door in!" God bless the right to bear arms!

Steve Jacob 4 years, 5 months ago

Wonder if he was drunk and thought he was at his door, his keys did not work, so broke the door. Not a big fan of guns, but you can sure have the right to protect your home/family.

Danielle Brunin 4 years, 4 months ago

That is exactly what I thought. He lives across the hall, it's 3:00 in the morning and likely drunk, got confused and now he's dead, and the neighbor has to live with it. I can't say that I blame him though, especially in a neighborhood that horrible.

Alceste 4 years, 5 months ago

Guess he really wanted to get in, huh?

pizzapete 4 years, 5 months ago

I would have done the same thing if someone were kicking my door in.

kjellifritt 4 years, 5 months ago

I would too. How could anyone not expect someone to defend themselves? You kick down my door, you better be prepared to face the consequences.

Brent Fry 4 years, 4 months ago

Please people. You had to expect that half of the posters on here would complain about guns and claim they would have invited this guy into their home with milk and cookies. These same people are the reason the homeless population is out of control in this town. They believe it's our job to feed and shelter them.

Had that guy kicked in my door, he'd be in the same place he is today, dead.

kernal 4 years, 4 months ago

According to an update in the Topeka paper late last night, a resident said the victim knocked on the door before he kicked it in. Apparently he assumed no one was at home.

Charlie Bannister 4 years, 4 months ago

You act like an idiot-- then you face the consequences. All part of a little thing called "personal responsibility." I'd have done the same thing. My home is my castle and where my precious family lives. You break down my door, you die. Period. My wife can shoot just as good as I can. Got my concealed carry too, and as far as I am concerned that just makes for a little bit more respectful society. Everywhere concealed carry goes into effect crime goes down. I rest my case.

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

Being armed makes for a respectful society? Sorry, but there are plenty of conceal and carry communities now, and I wouldn't exactly say we are a respectful society today. A more fearful society, perhaps, but not more respectful. Also, you don't need a conceal and carry license to protect your home.

I'm curious if you have any support for the claim that crime goes down where conceal and carry laws are in effect. I find it difficult to believe. For example, on another story here of a stabbing taking place outside of Liberty Hall, people are talking about how crime is on the rise in Lawrence. Those statements don't support your claim.

Do conceal and carry laws actually help lower crime rates? Anybody know?

Oh, and before I get flamed (it will happen anyway), I support conceal and carry laws. All gun owners should demonstrate such responsibility of ownership to get proper training. I'm not afraid of C&C gun owners (except for the ones in Arizona who no longer need a permit of any kind).

Frederic Gutknecht IV 4 years, 4 months ago

You seem conflicted. I don't think the world will ever meet your needs. It's a messy place. Keep up the good work, in any case.

If someone is attempting to break into your home, I would suggest the following: Dial 911. Say someone is in the process of breaking into your home. Leave 911 on the line as you deal with the situation. LOUDLY warn the individual that you are armed, afraid and have 911 on the line. Ask the individual to calm down and go away. Cry. Weep. Moan. Say you will shoot them if they come in. Do whatever you think is right if the idiot proceeds to break in.

If you cannot handle the multitasking, just wail, wait and empty your gun one way or another.

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

Yawn.

It is statistically proven that the odds are much greater of dying by gunshot if a gun is kept in the home than not. I choose not to keep a gun in my home, but that doesn't make me a victim.

Frederic Gutknecht IV 4 years, 4 months ago

You still seem conflicted...and sleepy!~) You support concealed carry but no guns in the home? Go back to sleep. I am not the bad guy. Rest easy.

bullydad1 4 years, 4 months ago

Thank you Hero, you are a true Patriot, don't let them take away your gun just in case you need to overthow the government.

cds 4 years, 4 months ago

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beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

Please show us anyone who has suggested that criminals should be welcomed into anyone's home.

waiting ....

You can't? Gee, and here I thought you were one of the really smart people and not one of the morons at all.

Charlie Bannister 4 years, 4 months ago

Yes Beatrice, in answer to your question---statistics are kept on the fact that crime goes down when concealed carry laws are enacted. NRA keeps all kinds of statistics on every state and major cities. I will back off one thing I said though. I do not have any statistics about whether you have a more respectful society or not. In fact, as I think more about it, we probably don't. When I quit hearing "Sir" and "Maam" out of the mouths of young people, I knew we were in trouble as a society. So I will give you that one.

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

Okay, so statistics are kept by the impartial body known as the NRA. Do they share these statistics, or are they kept in a vault somewhere?

Sorry for my scepticism, but I've not seen the statistics that support lower crime rates after conceal and carry have gone into effect that are outside of the general falling crime rates in all communities across the country over the past few decades.

Again, I choose not to own a gun for various reasons, but I don't care to impose on your right to own. Good for you for getting your conceal and carry permit.

slowplay 4 years, 4 months ago

Beatrice, I've seen stats supporting both sides. As you mentioned it just depends on who is doing the study. I don't like guns, don't own any but I have no problem with concealed carry. I wish every gun purchase was as selective and thorough. I would like to see stricter laws regarding purchases and types of guns but I certainly don't oppose the right to own, carry or conceal.

TopJayhawk 4 years, 4 months ago

Bea We now have concealed carry across the nation. Crime is falling across the nation you say? Hmmmmm.

notanoobhere 4 years, 4 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

patsy a$$? What exactly is a patsy a$$?

I appreciate your not wanting a liberal like me to ever get I gun. Very thoughtful of you, but rest assured you would have to press one into my cold, dead hand. Personally, I hope a young family member of yours doesn't find your gun and accidentally turn it on themself or someone else. Not that such a thing has ever happened, of course.

What is it about some gun owners who think that someone who says they support your right to own but chooses not to own a gun themself makes you act like a five year old who just had your blanky taken away?

pace 4 years, 4 months ago

I am sorry for the family that lost someone, and I am sorry for the person who ended up shooting an intruder. Unlike many the commenters I don't pretend to know the circumstances. A family lost someone and someone shot someone and for me that would be a terrible hard thing. I feel sorry for both, glad no more ended up dead.

Caesar_Augustus 4 years, 4 months ago

Funny how everyone is thinking only of the guy who kicked down the door, yet no one takes a second to think about the person who was protecting himself and his property and quite possibly a family. He has to live with the fact that he killed someone while protecting himself, yet he is being victimized as the bad person. Only in Lawrence, damn liberals. The pussification of America continues here in this town...

notanota 4 years, 4 months ago

Are you reading a different post than the one I'm reading? I've yet to see someone label the shooter as a "bad person" for defending their home.

pace 4 years, 4 months ago

I didn't read one "liberal" comment that victimized the person who defended his home as a bad person? There were different takes on guns and how they might handle the situation, A couple of people who seemed a bit creepy that they envied the opportunity to shoot someone. I know people who had to defend their family against an intruder, they sure didn't relish the opportunity. they had courage and luck and made it out alive . Nicest guy I know, old, got stabbed in his home with his wife who was ill in bed. They made it. He said Christ was with them. He sorrowed over the death of the intruder, they felt sorrow for the family. They said it was such a terrible waste. They wished the intruder had chosen to not do it. Maybe one of the deleted posted criticized the home defender, if so I was mistaken in thinking you imagined it.

middlemgmt 4 years, 4 months ago

I hate guns but I think having someone kicking in my door would be terrifying and I would want to defend my home quickly with no questions asked. From the sounds of it, I can't blame the guy for shooting.

bearded_gnome 4 years, 4 months ago

Bea: research by John Lott.
book "more guns, less crime" and research since.


your ordinary wooden door isn't much to keep out a determined thug.
I'd insist on wooden doors being replaced by metal doors. and, get deadbolt or chain. but not a chain that just goes to the trim of the door frame. if necessary take that off and sink a wood screw into the doorpost to anchor the chain.

when someone, you don't know who or why, is working over your door, you don't have time to worry if he's just lost, drunk, or whatever! you don't have the time.

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

Thanks for the tip on Lott's book. I will try to take a look at it some day. I agree with the rest of what you have to say, and I don't think you should just wait and let someone knock down your door either. However, I still don't want a gun in MY house. Nobody can deny that deaths by guns are much higher in homes with guns in them than those without. That means to me that more guns kill loved ones than kill intruders. Some might see not have a gun in the home as taking a risk, while I see it the other way. Either way, life is about deciding which risks you care to take.

Ron Holzwarth 4 years, 4 months ago

I wonder how the shooter will view this incident in the olam haba. Was there really no chance for a warning or a warning shot?

pace 4 years, 4 months ago

I personally don't believe warning shots at less than 20 feet are a good idea. It is going to be hard to even hit the target and stop them for an average person. Close quarters aren't good for fancy footwork. . I couldn't imagine an expert well versed with technique trying it. a warning shot when the person is charging. The time for thinking and warning was before one kicks a door in. Don't do it. I have no idea what communication or history occurred so this is pretty wild speculation about a real situation.

Brandon Devlin 4 years, 4 months ago

Where would you like to fire the warning shot? A warning shot is irresponsible, as you really don't know where the round is going. . .out the window? So it can hit someone walking by? Up in the air, through the floor of the apartment above you, so it can hit someone up there?

No sir. . .fire only when you're ready to fire, and only at the target. Center mass preferably.

gphawk89 4 years, 4 months ago

A warning shot anywhere but miles out in the country seems like a bad idea. A warning shot in an apartment complex? No way!

Not wanting to ever have to kill someone, I'd be inclined to get as much distance between myself and the intruder as possible so he has ample time to see that I have a gun pointed at him. But if he saw I was armed and kept charging, I'd have no problem blasting away at him.

Flap Doodle 4 years, 4 months ago

Ron, you've seen too many movies. If a miscreant is breaking thru your door, aim for his center-of-mass and keep shooting until the threat is neutralized.

thebigspoon 4 years, 4 months ago

Defend your home. It is better to be tried by 12 than to be carried by 6...

beatrice 4 years, 4 months ago

A warning shot was not warranted in my opinion. As I see it, the only person responsible for the shooting and the death was the person kicking in the door. Had he not tried to kick in the door, there would have been no need for a reaction. The warning "shot" was the closed door to someone else's home.

I don't care to live with a gun myself, but sometimes they work exactly as they are intended, and this is one of those times.

bearded_gnome 4 years, 4 months ago

beatrice (anonymous) replies …

Thanks for the tip on Lott's book. I will try to take a look at it some day. I agree with the rest of what you have to say, and I don't think you should just wait and let someone knock down your door either. However, I still don't want a gun in MY house. Nobody can deny that deaths by guns are much higher in homes with guns in them than those without. That means to me that more guns kill loved ones than kill intruders. Some might see not have a gun in the home as taking a risk, while I see it the other way. Either way, life is about deciding which risks you care to take.

December 6, 2010 at 8:53 p.m.

---However, in homes where guns are owned by trained gun owners, there is a vastly different story Bea.

the stat you have here probably comes from the antigun people who routinely quote stats out of context or overgeneralize.

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