Archive for Friday, July 10, 2009

North Lawrence residents say city is leaving them with inadequate fire protection

They say upcoming road construction will cause long backups

Traffic fills the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection and neighbors are worried the congestion from this intersection closing will lead to delayed emergency responses.

Traffic fills the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection and neighbors are worried the congestion from this intersection closing will lead to delayed emergency responses.

July 10, 2009

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Residents worry about North Lawrence emergency response time

With road construction scheduled for busy a North Lawrence street, some residents are worried emergency response time may be delayed. Enlarge video

Cars zip through the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection, which will last through the winter. The city says to meet North Lawrence resident's requests would require the fire department to pay four hours of overtime per day through the construction process

Cars zip through the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection, which will last through the winter. The city says to meet North Lawrence resident's requests would require the fire department to pay four hours of overtime per day through the construction process

Traffic fills the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection, which will force this traffic onto neighborhood streets. North Lawrence residents aren't satisfied with the city's solution to a possible decrease in emergency response time.

Traffic fills the intersection of North Second and Locust streets Friday morning about 8 a.m. Work is about to start on rebuilding the intersection, which will force this traffic onto neighborhood streets. North Lawrence residents aren't satisfied with the city's solution to a possible decrease in emergency response time.

A pending road project that is expected to snarl traffic in North Lawrence is creating concern and animosity about how fire and medical crews will respond to emergencies in the area.

“This has become a battle,” said Ted Boyle, president of the North Lawrence Improvement Association. “I can tell you that North Lawrence residents and the North Lawrence Improvement Association are really upset with City Hall.”

At issue is how fire and medical crews will be able to timely get through the intersection of North Second and Locust streets once work begins this month to rebuild the section of street that carries 27,000 vehicles per day.

Boyle’s group has asked the city to place a fire engine in North Lawrence for about four hours per day to ensure that a fire and medical crew can quickly respond during times of heavy traffic in the morning and evening.

But Fire Chief Mark Bradford has said he doesn’t think that would be the best use of the city’s resources. Instead, he’s proposing an alternate plan that would involve sending crews from two separate fire stations to improve the odds that at least one crew will arrive in a timely fashion. The city also plans to program an existing traffic light on North Second street to better accommodate emergency vehicles.

Boyle, though, thinks the city is underplanning for an emergency event.

“I always thought you plan for the worst and hope for the best,” Boyle said. “It seems like they do it just the opposite.”

Boyle said he’s concerned that traffic is going to become unmanageable along the city’s designated detour route, especially when vehicles have to stop for one of about 80 trains that run through North Lawrence each day.

The city’s current traffic plan calls for the North Second and Locust intersection to be closed to northbound traffic. Vehicles instead will detour onto Elm Street to Third Street and over to Lyon Street before returning to North Second Street.

The detour includes an at-grade crossing of the busy Union Pacific Railroad line. Boyle said city leaders are underestimating how backed up traffic will become when all northbound traffic is forced to stop for a train.

But Bradford said his office has studied the situation thoroughly. He said he can not recommend taking a fire truck out of the city’s downtown station to place in North Lawrence because call history shows that an emergency is more likely to happen south of the Kansas River.

“All of this is just about risk management,” Bradford said. “I can not look into my crystal ball and say where the calls will be. What I’m trying to do is come up with the best response plan for the entire city.”

Bradford said the only other option is to pay a crew overtime to staff one of the department’s reserve trucks for about four to six hours per day.

“In times like these, that is difficult to pay for,” Bradford said.

Thus far, city commissioners are siding with Bradford.

“Public safety is everybody’s No. 1 concern, but at this point, I have to place my trust in the chief,” City Commissioner Mike Amyx said. “But we’ll monitor it closely. In the first couple of days of construction, we’ll know whether this is going to work.”

Work to rebuild the intersection could begin as early as July 20. Traffic is expected to be restricted to one lane into November.

Boyle said North Lawrence residents will be watching closely.

“You can bet after a few days that city commissioners will be getting phone calls at home, at work, in the middle of the night to chat about this,” Boyle said.

Comments

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

And you know they want their own Wal-Mart.

kmat 5 years, 9 months ago

No we don't. We want a Dillon's or a Walgreens.

All we really want is the city to plan better. Their detour route is ridiculous and my husband will now be taking I-70 to Iowa, back down 6th St. just to get to work downtown. It will be quicker and safer than the clusterf*ck they've decided to create. Thank gawd I take K32 to work. The city really has no idea what it's going to be like. And, the detour route is allowing semi's on a small residential street that has no sidewalks, lots of on street parking and tons of kids. Are they going to have traffic police on duty to insure the safety of the residents?

gsxr600 5 years, 9 months ago

Assuming just for the northbound, in an average day there will be a car going north every 6.7 seconds. That's 10 cars a minute and probably 30 cars a minute during rush hour. That's a lot of cars going over the train tracks. I predict a train on car collision during this construction period.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

so, I guess the fact that the call history shows more emergency needs on the non-north side of the river is irrelevant here?

I seem to recall NL asking for this intersection to be rebuilt for some time now, and now that it's happening, you're all mad because it's not happening how you want it to?

lgreen17 5 years, 9 months ago

I live in NL and there's an ambulance in our neighborhood once a week because of the elderly population.

Sending two trucks and hoping one will get there in time is just shenigans and by the way, tit akes two trucks out of service at the same time.

Why don't they take one of the old green trucks they HAD to replace and put it at the outlet mall (the city also HAD to have) along with an ambulance? Do they not want to get out of their comfortable new firehouses?

river_rat 5 years, 9 months ago

anyone know where i can catch the bus when thiis starts i get it at that intersection and none of the drivers seem to have a clue?

walkingonwater 5 years, 9 months ago

How does mr boyle complain about city hall, he has supported a majority of those elected. what does the issue say about his selection of city leaders?

kmat 5 years, 9 months ago

edjayhawk - what tax burden? We pay the same taxes everyone else does and rarely get services. NL gets screwed over all the time. Our streets are rarely touched, we're usually last to get plowed in the winter. We don't have much police patrol here (luckily, NL has a very low crime rate compared to the rest of Lawrence). Please explain this tax burden we are to you?

Supercowbellninja - yes, we've needed this intersection fixed for decades. BUT, we expect the city to plan appropriately so they don't endanger everyone. They are diverting traffic (27K vehicles per day) onto a residential street and aren't providing a good solution for emergency vehicles to be able to get through. I have so many elderly neighbors that live by me. Directly next door is an elderly diabetic with many problems who is in and out of the hospital. Should he have to wait for one of two emergency vehicles to TRY to get to him if a life threatening situation arrises?

Go to google maps and google 524 N. 3rd and look at the street view. This street is going to handle 27,000 vehicles per day, including semis, with up to 80 trains stopping all traffic periodically???????

http://maps.google.com/

Do that and you'll understand why the residents over here are pissed.

And we used to be our own town and I would love to go back to that. N. Lawrence is usually forgotten by the city council anyways.

Tammy Copp-Barta 5 years, 9 months ago

Does anyone remember the floods in 1993 and how traffic was? and when they opened up the hole at 2nd and Locust for drainage several years ago? It was a freaking mess! I hope the school district is ready for the kids getting bussed in to be late, cause this too will be a mess.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

KMart: It's not like this project was announced two days ago. Make plans to take alternate routes to avoid the congestion. Just like the commenter above who said her husband was taking I-70 to get to 6th and then downtown.

So you have to take a different route for a few weeks. Boo hoo.

kmat 5 years, 9 months ago

supercowbellninja - you have really poor reading comprehension.

To start, it's kmat.

I am the poster that said my husband will now have to take the turnpike. His drive is only about a mile to work, but he'll have to now drive many miles and pay a toll. I stated in the same post that I luckily take K32 to work.

My issue is safety. Once again, if you could read you'd understand that. I'm wondering how you made it through school if your reading comprehension is that bad.

27K cars a day on a small, two lane, not well maintained, pot hole riddled road that has no sidewalks. 80 trains per day holding up those 27K cars. And no good plan for emergency vehicles, in case there is a life threatening situation (like I explain with my neighbor - but you would have had to read to understand that).

Wanna try another ignorant post, cowbell?

imastinker 5 years, 9 months ago

I have to agree. There are plenty of fire stations south of the river that could carry the load, but the train will not move out of the way for fire trucks. I actually think this would be a very reasonable solution.

Jonathan Kealing 5 years, 9 months ago

river_rat:

Ask and you shall receive. We'll post this as a sound off in the coming days, but for now, here's your answer:

Reconstruction of the intersection in North Lawrence is scheduled to start July 20, and will force the T’s Route 4 to be rerouted as follows, according to Lisa Patterson, city spokeswoman:

• Northbound: Bus will travel east on Elm Street, north on North Seventh Street, west on Lyon Street, then north on North Second and back on route. Passengers wishing to catch the bus along Locust must move south to Elm.

• Southbound: After departing I-70 Business Center, bus will continue south on North Second across bridge and back on route. Southbound reroute will bypass the North Lawrence neighborhood. Passengers wishing to catch the bus in the neighborhood will need to do so on the northbound trip.

think_about_it 5 years, 9 months ago

It would resolve a myriad of problems if we just removed the bridges over the river.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

KMart: I'll be sure to re-read all the amazing prose in every comment on here before I write anything.

I still contend that all you North Lawrencians sticking to your guns about this over-taxed residential road should at least consider taking alternate routes to alleviate some of that congestion, especially if the road is in as bad of shape as you say it is. Seems like common sense to me.

As for your jab at my reading comprehension: oh snap!

lawrencian 5 years, 9 months ago

I, for one, am grateful enough that this is finally going to happen that it will be worth all the detouring... The trick here is not to set so many fires, folks! Okay, so I'm being a little sarcastic, but seriously. There aren't that many fires in North Lawrence, you know!

lawrencian 5 years, 9 months ago

I wonder if Elm Street will get a new layer of paving when this project is done? That would sure take care of the destruction that will be caused by the months of extra traffic.

been_there 5 years, 9 months ago

What is the estimated length of time of the project?

been_there 5 years, 9 months ago

While we're turning in orders, can we have a laundromat over there?

lgreen17 5 years, 9 months ago

It will end in November, that's 4 months, a long time to hope no one's house burns down or has a medical problem.

been_there 5 years, 9 months ago

If it gets done on time and no unforseen problems occur

grimpeur 5 years, 9 months ago

Wait a minute: why drive from NL to downtown? Why oh why?

Time to develop some new car habits, people! That goes for everybody in town living less than 2 miles from work, driving alone while complaining about wrecked streets, too little parking, or congestion, not just NL folks. Carpool, bike, or walk.

Will this bring a change, or will we continue to bend over backwards to justify the status-laden single-occupancy lifestyle choices that incur our too-frequent and increasingly inconvenient street repairs? Shoulda started on the former years ago.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

No one is ever going to build a grocery in north Lawrence because it's just not profitable. They would be relying on just those living there. Currently, a grocery like Dillons on Mass can rely on people from NLawrence, the student ghetto and East Lawrence. A Grocer in North Lawrence would rely only on everyone north of the river. If you live south of the river the only reason you have to go North is if you need to get to 70, no one will go there to shop.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

Also, that intersection at 6th and Mass is the worst in town. I don't blame anyone for avoiding it.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

What's ignorant about it? People going from Lawrence to US-24, US-59, and US-40 aren't stopping for groceries. They aren't stopping to buy antiques. They might stop at Burger King. Is there even anything in the outlet mall anymore?

Perhaps you are ignorant to ignore the economics of the situation.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

I think you should have proper fire protection, I am merely responding to the need for a northern lawrence grocer.

Bradley Kemp 5 years, 9 months ago

"Timely" is an adjective, not an adverb, and "cannot" is one word, not two.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

I'm just thankful that there are such sharp thinkers out there like none2 to show me the error of my ways. I always reformulate my opinions based on the anonymous ramblings of Internet thread trolls.

Yes, this is the pot calling the kettle black.

I also love the earlier post suggesting people find new ways - like carpooling and bike riding - to alleviate the congestion.

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

Hey Ted, keep swingin there guy! you're right on!

yes this intersection desperately needs replacing, for like ten years!
the topic of this article wasn't laundromats walgreens or grocery stores. yes, I'd love to have a grocery store in north lawrence and one is proposed for a good location.

at least, it'll be good when n. 2nd and Locust is all put back together.

I don't often agree with Kmat, but she's right here. one small correction, n.3rd has sidewalk on west side between Elm and Locust. the train backups are going to be a disaster with this detour!


River-rat, I saw that reroute for T-bus route 4 in the city's press release. you have to catch #4 northbound it seems.

Staci Dark Simpson 5 years, 9 months ago

Just wish they would wait until county road 1 is done. Getting to work in Lawrence from Leavenworth county is a little tricky when there is construction every way to get into town.

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

But Bradford said his office has studied the situation thoroughly. He said he can not recommend taking a fire truck out of the city’s downtown station to place in North Lawrence because call history shows that an emergency is more likely to happen south of the Kansas River.

“All of this is just about risk management,” Bradford said. “I can not look into my crystal ball and say where the calls will be. What I’m trying to do is come up with the best response plan for the entire city.”

Okay, we're asking for one engine!

you'd still have what 14-17 south of the river on duty and staffed at any time?

generally I respect you firechief Bradford, but this is plain BS.

putting one engine in north lawrence would not change your response for 99.995% of all calls in lawrence south of the river. plus, heck, you could in a pinch call the north lawrence engine back south. but oh, you're concerned about getting that one back into the rest of the city in a quick way given the traffic?

well, you've just demonstrated why we need one here.

go via the 'pike? how about a turnpike accident, they do happen you know.

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

What is really outrageous is the problem the south-of-the-river residents will have in getting to La Tropicana and El Matador.

What is the city going to do to fix that? I mean this is just beyond the pale. How will we survive?

Maybe Bradford will let the restaurants set up shop in his empty fire house.

Yea.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

none2 (Anonymous) says…

Actually, they did stop for groceries. I knew people that did that because it is convenient to stop somewhere along the route home. It is the same principle as the location of drive-through fast food. But you wouldn't know that because your head is in the sand.

================================

Awesome! Then you should have someone wanting to building a grocer in your area of town any day now. I mean, with all those people just looking for a reason to shop there on their way through and all, there should be plenty of incentive.

What happened to the outlet mall?

number3of5 5 years, 9 months ago

Right now the farmer's turnpike is closed and anyone who usually drives to work in Lawrence using this route from Perry or Lecompton must use either U S 24/59 through North Lawrence or U S 40. So this is putting more traffic than usual on the North Lawrence intersection at the bridges. I know, my husband is one of them. He works for The Shelter Inc. near the Lawrence Memorial Hospital. Now he will be forced to take 40 highway, which is bad enough of a road, let alone with all the extra traffic and h*** bent for leather drivers.

muddfoot55 5 years, 9 months ago

Is there any county /township fire crews on that side of the bridge? If not could that be a movable solution?

Here's a thought: what if you put a toll booth up on the bridge. That would 1) thin out the traffic. I know that some would rather drive 10 miles out of their way to NOT pay a toll. And 2) would generate revenue to do some much needed improvements to the overburdened NL streets after the project is complete. BUT only those that live or work in NL would get a pass/sticker/tag and they would not be charged.

CLARKKENT 5 years, 9 months ago

i guess i will be the one to ask a dumb question--

the north lawrence folks pay taxes just as the rest of lawrence does, don't they????

why is there no fire station and ambulance in north lawrence????????

Stuart Evans 5 years, 9 months ago

a toll booth on the bridge....? toll booths cause traffic snarls. If you think it's going to be difficult to get an ambulance through that detour now, just imagine 100 cars sitting on the bridge waiting to cross. They aren't shutting down all access to North Lawrence, it's a 3 or 4 block detour. Yes, there will be increased traffic through the neighborhood. everyone be alert, drives & pedestrians. This intersection has to be rebuilt. So people will just have to deal with it for awhile.

kolisach 5 years, 9 months ago

I totally agree that, if someone lives in North Lawrence and works downtown, they can bike or walk. My boyfriend does it everyday and he isn't any worse for the wear. NL has some of the best bike/ped facilities in town. Use them.

the bus re-routing is a little troublesome, but they could have just avoided NL altogether, so i guess it's okay.

I am extremely excited about this improvement to traffic flow that will come with the completion of this project. The left turn onto Locust from N. 2nd during the rush hour is a nightmare. This is a great project. Please keep in mind that the funding from this project came from economic stimulus, so the timing wasn't exactly the city of lawrence's choice.

i am going to have to trust bradford's decisions about the fire trucks. i live near the trailhead (and the trailer park), and we have a handfull of emergency vehicles blaring by per week to go to those two destinations. mostly during slow traffic times (late at night or on weekends). it is too bad that there is only one way to get into NL from the south, but it is only 4 months.

i'm sure that, while stuck in traffic trying to get home, i will use some expletives, but hopefully the project will move smoothly and everything will be back to normal soon.

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

Clark Kent:

De-annex North Lawrence and let it reincorporate by itself, if it wants to.

That will show how much they already suck off of south Lawrence taxpayers already. They will immediately find they can not build a fire station OR have an ambulance OR fix their intersection OR spend millions of dollars on drainage systems, etc etc.

RogueThrill 5 years, 9 months ago

none2, you should chill and stop being so confrontational in tone.

Beth Ennis 5 years, 9 months ago

This subject has obviously hit a lot of nerves. My husband and I commute to LV from just south of downtown every day. I imagine we will find another route to come home, however, we leave early enough in the morning that it shouldn't be as much of a problem going out, but only time will tell. One train in the early morning and we will be way off schedule. Even if they move an ambulance/engine up to the outlet mall parking lot for a few hours a day, what will happen if the call for service comes in for North Lawrence, but on the south side of the tracks? There are a lot of houses north of the river yet south of the tracks. (I actually love North Lawrence, my husband and I ride bikes over there all the time). Unfortunately, it is a no win situation all the way around. When there isn't construction, the downtown firestation is so close to North Lawrence that getting there isn't an issue. It is amazing that a city this size only has the one bridge across the river, but that is the way it is. Leavenworth/Lansing also only has one bridge across the Missouri. There are a ton of traffic problems when that bridge is worked on too. Unfortunately, it is just the nature of the beast in this day and age. If I were living in North Lawrence and working in downtown, I think I would ride a bike or walk to work (as long as I didn't need my car during the day) as opposed to driving so far out of my way.
As to the grocery/shopping dilema over there, I have always thought that a super Target or (oh no) a Super Walmart located at the outlet mall would draw folks from North Lawrence, downtown, rural LV county/Tonganoxie, and Jefferson county. With a stop light to get out of the lot, it wouldn't matter which way you were driving. We live south of downtown and I know we would use it a lot on our commute. I would much rather stop somewhere on my way home as opposed to having to go out of my way. When you commute an hour each way you don't do much driving when you get home. The South Iowa Shopping area is further than we want to go, that is for sure. But it would have to be a large store like a Super Target or Walmart to draw in people--just a grocery store or just a department type store wouldn't do it. If you could get almost everything you need/want in one stop, that is what will bring people in. I know folks who live in the Perry Lake area that shop in either Lawrence or Topeka and this would be closer for them for sure.

Beth Ennis 5 years, 9 months ago

RogueThrill, I agree 100%--it's one of the reasons why I don't post very often, it's not a very friendly atmosphere.

Staci Dark Simpson 5 years, 9 months ago

The planning just needs to be better. To many other projects going on already. From Tongie I don't have a convenient way. County road 1 is closed and now HUGE backup to go thru N Lawrence. With Farmers turnpike closed too they are putting to much traffic into an area not ready for that kind of traffic flow. Need to wait and finish some of the other projects first.

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

none2 - I'll bring my tax receipts any time.

My suggestion stands. N. Lawrence receives more than it gives. Now stop your whining. You sound like the people of Lecompton who complained while Lawrence paid for most of their bridge repair.

Danimal 5 years, 9 months ago

North Lawrence should be used to getting the shaft by now and just learn to enjoy it.

workinghard 5 years, 9 months ago

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that there is an elementary school and large preschool in North Lawrence.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

I think the best and only solution here is for none2 and KMart to serve as a traffic cop at the 2nd and Locust intersection for the duration of this project.

Then, in his/her free time, open up that grocery store in North Lawrence that so many on here swear will be/is a sure thing. I'm sure you will outfox the Dillon's and HyVee's and other retail chains with that ace move.

Wait, what happened to the outlet mall again?

workinghard 5 years, 9 months ago

Same thing that happened to the riverfront mall, both of which, if I remember correctly were wanted mainly by the city commission.

Joe Hyde 5 years, 9 months ago

Setting aside the legitimate issue of traffic snarls that will be caused when trains block the detour route crossing, the fact remains that a fairly sizeable population of Lawrence citizens live north of the Kaw. And those citizens deserve better, faster fire and medical response if such is possible.

I would hope that before too many more years pass, a Fire & Medical station will be built in North Lawrence. If that ever happens, North Lawrence will then have the capability of rapid-response fire fighting as well as medical help.

Such a new station would also greatly reduce the response time to fires, and health emergiencies (especially traffic accidents), that occur in nearby rural areas to the north of North Lawrence. That being the case, I wonder if neighboring Jefferson and Leavenworth counties might be interested in sharing the cost of building a new Fire & Medical station that is sited in North Lawrence?

After all, citizens of those two adjoining counties have long been served and protected by emergency responses that originate from the city of Lawrence. Hey, it's the neighborly thing to do.

workinghard 5 years, 9 months ago

none2 is correct about the condition of the last grocery store in North Lawrence. It was a pigstye and the food was terrible. At that time Dillons had a store up on 6th street that was not that much farther and much better. It was a sad day for NL when the Dillons store closed.

Leslie Swearingen 5 years, 9 months ago

supercowbellninja Consider this as a virtual slap in the face. It is Kmat, not Kmart, so what is your problem? Do not write Kmart one more time. I don't know about him/her, but you are starting to get one my last nerve. The people who live in North Lawrence have a right to be very, very angry about the way they are treated. They are entitled to have a grocery store, laundromat, and other facilities. Asking someone to walk or ride a bike from North Lawrence over to downtown is just plain stupid. I supposed someone could tote groceries on the back of the bike or maybe on top of their heads like they do in third world countries. Once you get across the bridge, its not like its that far to a grocery store. Right?

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

None2 is indeed correct about that last store in north lawrence.

and I love the treatment of North Lawrence by three or four posters, kinda demonstrates the whole attitude about not putting one engine here, doesn't it.

this article wasn't about grocery store in NL, or even about the fix at north 2nd.

this article is about how many of us in NL feel strongly that one engine should be posted in North Lawrence.
to compare with '93 is just silly. were there turnpike bridge repairs going on then? were repairs going on on other major routes around Lawrence then?
No, and No.

it is not hard to figure that the detour will certainly have traffic backed up several times a day, because N. 3rd is a small little street in poor condition, because 80 trains pass through north lawrence.

fire crews will cross the bridge, and the first right is Elm and immediately they're in the traffic backup.

yes we have a creative solution, Ted Boyle and several of us North Lawrence posters have been communicating it: put an engine in North Lawrence during peak traffic times.

One engine and south of the river there's still a dozen or more engines at the fire stations.

and I don't get Bradford's comment about overtime being required. just take one of his engines already on duty and put it in North Lawrence, personnel already on schedule.

again, this argument seems like BS that overtime would be required.


Travelinggeek, I've probably said hello to you and your hubby while you were biking in North Lawrence. keep enjoying the levee/ boat ramp area. it is a great place.

esteshawk 5 years, 9 months ago

How many fire trucks have to respond to a typical emergency? Probably more than one. Putting one truck in NL would have more of a detrimental impact on south of the river than a positive impact north of the river; I assume this is the conclusion reached by the Chief, who knows more about this than any of y'all. This seems like just an opportunity for NL folks to complain. Granted, NL has gotten short shrift for years, but now that the city is fixing a long standing problem, NL folks should be happy instead of complaining.

esteshawk 5 years, 9 months ago

I wonder how many people belong to boyle's group? seems he's been the "voice" of NL for about 30 years. does his group represent all of NL, or is it a small group of 10 people that get together? Just curious.

workinghard 5 years, 9 months ago

Ted does a great job and keeps on top of things that the rest of North Lawrence isn't even aware is going on until he alerts them. Thanks Ted for your dedication.

Leslie Swearingen 5 years, 9 months ago

Kmat, it is not all that difficult to type. It is a show of respect to call people what they choose to be called. Someone please explain to me what is with the twisting of this name.

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

estes, north lawrence improvement assn is very big, very good participation. I think at the last meeting I attended was 40+ people. for the chilifeed, was more.


yes, more engines usually respond to calls, but the value of one is the quick first responders. ever heard of first aid? and sometimes one crew that gets to a fire very fast can knock it right down.

again, I just love the attitude displayed on here toward north lawrence by members of the rest of lawrence. very demonstrative.

as to retail, we do have retail in North Lawrence.
and this neighborhood certainly is close-knit and friendly. about like east lawrence.
maybe that's what the negative posters above really dislike about North Lawrence. not so many students live here, but KU staff certainly do, because of the neighborhood and cheaper housing costs.

yes, firechief bradford certainly is smarter on these issues than I am. but when do all of the on duty fire aparatus respond to a fire? once a year, if that?

and, like I said, the one posted here ouldn't have to stay here in case of an emergency south of the river.


Oh, would that be a tragedy if Walleyedwhopper chocked on his chicken at the dirty bird's buffet? hmmm.

greenworld 5 years, 9 months ago

If the Grant township ever got a voluteer fire department off the ground they could split calls with the city and that would solve alot of the problems. Right now Lawrence is responding to accidents or fires all the way out to Midland Junction and all the way down past Arnie's Boats on Wellman Rd. So God forbid nothing happens to someone on the corner of Midland and there is slow response.

Boyle- You chose to live where you live. If you dont like it you need to move or quit voting for these people that promise you things and dont come through for you. I mean my God the people of N Lawrence are poor,poor people and act like they are suppose to get the same treatment as if they live in Alvamar Heights or Bobwhite Dr way out west. Well last time I checked the last fire station built was out off Clinton and Wakarusa. Now do you know what people im talking about at the voting tables. HA...doesnt take a mental giant to figure all this out. And by the way the new station off Harper was only put there due to the closing of the one of Haskell which was turned into a training facility. But it had to be put there to keep the ISO rating in check.

LadyJ 5 years, 9 months ago

"the people of N Lawrence are poor,poor people and act like they are suppose to get the same treatment as if they live in Alvamar Heights " Are you serious? I thought all Lawrence citizens deserved the same fire and ambulance protection. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you were being sarcastic.

greenworld 5 years, 9 months ago

Yes you are correct, it definately is sarcasm.

Beth Ennis 5 years, 9 months ago

none2 it's not as much what you are saying, it is how you are saying it. Remember, you probably aren't going to change someone's opinion using anger and hostility. I love North Lawrence and do not think it should be de-annexed. In fact, if I couldn't live in my current neighborhood, north Lawrence is where I would want to be. But to answer your question, yes, even if people say things you don't like, you can still talk to them in a more friendly tone. Two wrongs don't make a right.

LadyJ 5 years, 9 months ago

If I was Woodlawn school, I would hold a fire drill the very first day and another the second week just to make sure.

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

bearded gnome writes: "again, I just love the attitude displayed on here toward north lawrence by members of the rest of lawrence. very demonstrative."


Gnome, you are far to harsh with others on these boards in other places to ever play the martyr. Nor should N. Lawrence try to play the martyr here.

I do not support de-annexation of North Lawrence, despite my earlier post.

But I made that suggestion to make a point: That is that N. Lawrence is Not ignored by the rest of the city and actually does quite nicely in any kind of rational analysis of services and support provided to it. The proposition that N. Lawrence community actually pay for the services it receives merely makes that point. Sorry it hurt your feelings.

Although I am sorry for the inconveniences that N. Lawrence will endure, I too am unconvinced of the wisdom of relocating a fire crew to N. Lawrence.

Road construction, or re-construction always results in inconveniences. Generally anyone living next to a river or a coastline will have to pay that price sometime, if not frequently. Because bridges and traffic choke points will always need to be reconstructed. And floods tend to happen near water.

If more retail is what N. Lawrence wants, those in N. Lawrence are fully entitled and enabled to shape, start and finance those opportunities. That is what America is all about.

Fort_Aubrey 5 years, 9 months ago

And I agree with what travelinggeek and Pilgrim2 said.

supercowbellninja 5 years, 9 months ago

wow, I got virtually slapped (whatever the hell that means) and accused of having a terminal illness since I was on here last.

Yeah, I guess my comments really are out of line.......

So asking people to bicycle up to 6 miles one way for basic groceries in an incredibly bike/pedestrian -friendly town is too much? As someone who regularly commutes by bike that distance every day, I can say definitively it is not. Does the T not travel over there, also?

I am sorry for the 16 weeks of car congestion this is causing N. Lawrence, but jeez. I'm starting to get the impression that no matter what the city or a grocer or other business does or brings to North Lawrence, you all will just find something about it to rail on.

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

FA, not trying to be a martyr, just pointing out how many posters are so happy to slam a lawrence neighborhood with a genuine concern.

again, this article wasn't really about whether a grocer came to NL,there is one planned though for the new development. neither was it really about the reconstruction of N. 2nd and Locust itself.

many citizens in North Lawrence are genuinely concerned about how the traffic in the detour backup will impact response times for emergency vehicles.
this is validated in part because the authorities have recognized this problem, they say they will send a double response, one set of vehicles over the bridge, and one set over to North Lawrence via the turnpike. so, the authorities recognize this is a valid concern, we believe their response is inadequate and has weaknesses. that especially since the pike has construction on it, and there certainly can be and have been accidents on the turnpike.


yes, FA, I can be harsh with people on other topics. you will note I have not been harsh here, except with walleyedwhopper, the former Hawk.

and if you refer to Bronzie, I treated him with respect until he started his harrassing PM's.

mdrndgtl 5 years, 9 months ago

North Lawrence is a crime-ridden wasteland packed with undesireables. North Lawrence Improvement Program? What a joke. Toss them another Sonic and pray they don't cross the bridge...

InspectorJo 5 years, 9 months ago

bearded_gnome has made some really good points. The residents of North Lawrence should be concerned. For all of you posters that are Dissing N. Lawrence SHAME on YOU! You are not concerned because it does not affect you, believe me, if this was happening in your hood you would not be pleased either.

webmocker 5 years, 9 months ago

Irish says:

"They are entitled to have a grocery store, laundromat, and other facilities."

Are people who live in a refugee camp in Somalia also entitled to a grocery store and laundromat in their neighborhood?

"Asking someone to walk or ride a bike from North Lawrence over to downtown is just plain stupid. I supposed someone could tote groceries on the back of the bike or maybe on top of their heads like they do in third world countries. Once you get across the bridge, its not like its that far to a grocery store. Right?"

Right, it's not that far. I walk roughly 4 miles each way to class each day, and I'm doing fine. I buy groceries on the way back every day or two and put them in my backpack. It's not so tough. If I had a bike, it would be even easier and quicker, but the city traffic is a bit dicey, so I walk.

The sense of entitlement of some people is really quite amazing.

bearded_gnome 5 years, 9 months ago

thank you InspectorJo.

personally if it were up to me, I'd keep one PD roll car here in NL during those times too for the same reasons.

Mdrndgtl sure is a happy child. you know, if we're so crime ridden, then maybe we really need that firewagon and police cruiser here. thanks.


if we do have a toll booth on the kaw river bridge, can we tripple the toll for cranky old geeezers like Walleyedwhopper/the former hawk?

Carol Bowen 5 years, 9 months ago

Is anyone concerned that there are areas of the city without adequate emergency coverage? This shouldn't be an issue. Lawrence needs to improve its emergency services.

kmat 5 years, 9 months ago

tumbilweed (Anonymous) says…

kmat, your husband needs to hang up the car keys and walk to work.


You are just an ignorant jerk. My husband has to wear a full suit to work each day and spends a good chunk of his day with clients. He is in the financial industry. Why did you feel the need to attack me? You just felt like looking like a major dick?

So, on these lovely, hot summer days, he's supposed to walk about a mile to work, in a full suit, and look clean and professional when he gets to work? Then in order to visit his clients, he needs to walk back to his car (staying clean and tidy), then go pick up his clients.

Real smart post, tumbilweed.

Don't judge a situation you don't know.

Maybe you can look like sh*t when you get to work. Would you like to be working out commercial loan deals for your business with a sweaty man who walked miles in a suit on 90 degree days? It would be so professional for him to then offer to take them to lunch, only to ask them to walk a good distance so he can actually take them to lunch.

I guess the same goes for winter. Who cares if he has to walk in snow in a suit, ruining expensive suits.

Days when he just has to sit in the office, not a big deal. Days he doesn't deal with clients each month - 3-4.

My husband and I are not the people to give sh*t to about being green. We do walk downtown when we're just going for a bite to eat or shopping. I do take the bus on occasion to the store. We do drive very efficient vehicles. But unfortunately, some people do have professions where a car is needed.

kmat 5 years, 9 months ago

mdrndgtl (Anonymous) says…

North Lawrence is a crime-ridden wasteland packed with undesireables. North Lawrence Improvement Program? What a joke. Toss them another Sonic and pray they don't cross the bridge…


Then explain why we have such low crime rates?

Another ignorant post from someone that has no clue. So many of you are just looking like *ssholes on here.

A little judgemental and uppity, are we?

mdrndgtl 5 years, 9 months ago

I'm not sure a sequined leotard qualifies as a "full suit" Kmart...

Corey Williams 5 years, 9 months ago

mdrndgtl (Anonymous) says…

"I'm not sure a sequined leotard qualifies as a “full suit” Kmart…"

Just because that's what you've been told, doesn't mean that's what it is.

Coming from someone who would also say "North Lawrence is a crime-ridden wasteland packed with undesireables. North Lawrence Improvement Program? What a joke. Toss them another Sonic and pray they don't cross the bridge…" makes you even more of an idiot.

Quit trolling and say something useful, jacka$$

classclown 5 years, 9 months ago

I don't live there, but ever since I moved here I've noticed that North Lawrence gets treated like the red headed step child of Lawrence. Many of the comments here are demonstrative of that.

I never understood why. Could someone explain why that is?

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