Archive for Wednesday, September 10, 2008

Thomas reader

September 10, 2008


To the editor:

Why does the Journal-World print Cal Thomas' extreme and insulting beliefs? Probably for the same reason they print everybody's extreme and insulting beliefs. It's called freedom of speech and press. Everyone has the right to his or her opinion.

It's quite noticeable anytime anyone shows even a hint of godly values or beliefs, it seems to really hit a nerve.

I personally like Cal Thomas. Any articles that appear in the paper daily or weekly that I don't like, I just don't read them.

Jean Wright,


David Omar 9 years, 7 months ago

Restore Reason, where did you learn history? In a garbage dump. Your statement is totally untrue! The crusades happened in 1066 and the Christians wanted to gain control of the Holy Land. The expansion of Islam into Europe was under the leadership of the Ottomans and they took power in the 12th Century. Get your facts straight before you show your prejudice against Muslims. By the Way, at the time of the Crusades, Turkey was not a European country and it still isn't, as much as they want it to be.All the charities in this country that were supported by Muslims were deemed terrorist groups by your president. While at the same time, the Christian charities sending funds to the same place are considered perfectly fine.We were talking about bigotry, so I believe your entry into this discussion can bring light on how a bigot thinks.

rtwngr 9 years, 7 months ago

Jean,Never cast your pearls before swine.I.E. The oinkers that immediately replied. :)

jafs 9 years, 7 months ago

Of course, if you don't like him, don't read his columns.However, "anti-Christian bigots" are the worst?If I remember correctly, it was "Christians" who were responsible for the Crusades and the Inquisition, and routinely tell people if they don't believe in Christ, they're going to hell. Oh yes, and of course, gay folks get no respect.Seems pretty bigoted to me.

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

mimis_friend--why is it not surprising that you would claim what you were told of Turkey's history would be more accurate/reliable than our "spin"? People like you are ready to believe that any other country's policies (and propaganda) are more authentic than your own. It would be more reasonable to suspect EVERYONE, rather than be so ready to condemn your homeland!

geniusmannumber1 9 years, 7 months ago

Your reasoning is poor on a number of levels:1) "The most immediate cause" is not a fact. It's analysis.2) "The most immediate cause" implies there is one cause, or a primary cause. This ignores a great many other causes, such as the breakdown of Charlemagne's empire, religious movements among the peasantry, etc. This is likely because you're reading wikipedia and about.com3) Islamic expansionism may have been an immediate trigger for the first crusade. It certainly was not for any of the others, nor can it explain the crusades against the Slavs, Jews, Byzantines, any number of the Balkan peoples.Basically, it appears to me that you are trying to distort what little you know about the era to make your point -- Christians = good, Muslims = bad, throughout all of history -- while conveniently ignoring those facts which do not fit your agenda. Which may make you feel better, but doesn't win you many arguments.

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

The "right" belongs to the newspapers that "sign on" the columnists. They have the right to print what they think some of their readers will want to read. It's a pretty poor paper that will not print anything that might offend someone (within the realm of "relative" good taste and not likely to be considered libelous, of course). Only subjects that no one cares about will NOT have SOME objectors. As Ashley Brilliant says, "The more we disagree, the greater likelihood that one of us is right!"

supertrampofkansas 9 years, 7 months ago

"Your claim that Turkey had never been part of Europe is false."So does that mean the country that calls itself Turkey actually existed in the times of Constantinople?

geniusmannumber1 9 years, 7 months ago

Ah, yes, Constantinople. Let's see, first sacked in 1203. By Christian crusaders.Really, stick to lobbing uninformed religious/secular nonsense at each other. You're all much better at that. I mean seriously, not one of you has had a post where you've gotten the basic facts right -- even with the help of wikipedia -- so in what sense is your analysis at all valid?

geniusmannumber1 9 years, 7 months ago

I disagree to the extent that because Mr. Thomas is "godly" (whatever that means), he can't be criticized for being an ignorant bigot. The majority of the people who dislike Mr. Thomas could care less whether he is "godly." They care -- and rightfully so -- that he is often an ignorant bigot. It's tiresome that people cannot or will not distinguish between criticism of a Christian and criticizing someone for being a Christian. I wholeheartedly agree that if you don't like it, don't read it.And canyon_wren, are you familiar with the concept of "free speech"? Can you please point me to the section of the constitution that gives you the right to be paid to have a syndicated column reprinted in the local paper?

David Omar 9 years, 7 months ago

Wren, you stated that the inquisition and crusades are a long time in the past. Mr. President GW Bush clearly said that attacking Iraq was a "crusade" before his military bombed the 'you know what' out of Iraq killing thousands and starting a war for NOTHING.It was the Christians who attacked Poland and expanded their foothold on Europe while killing millions of Jews. It was the Christians who tried to make Muslims in Serbia extinct by a methodical kill of as many as they can before they were stopped, (ethnic clensing).Don't tell me that Christian crusades happened years ago. It is happening now!

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

I'm not saying that there are no Christian bigots. It's just that it seems like people who scoff at religion don't need to be so adamant about it. With very few exceptions, no one is really FORCED to believe anything, including Christians, so it seems to me that it would be as easy to disregard a "pitch" from a "missionary" as it is to turn down someone trying to sell life insurance. I specified "anti-Christian" bigots because, although some people are bigots about ALL religions, most of the posters seem to focus on the Christian religion for their vitriol, while they are fairly tolerant of other religions.I suggest we not dredge up the Crusades, the Inquisition, etc. That gets pretty tiresome and was some time ago, after all. If that is people's excuse for finding fault with Christianity in general, they are not very creative thinkers!

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

The posters who complain about Cal Thomas' columns would be the first, also, to complain about anyone's "free speech" being restricted. What hypocrites! As the writer says, any columns she doesn't like, she simply doesn't read. That doesn't seem too difficult, so why don't you posters who find Thomas so irritating do likewise? As I have said before, there seems to be no one so bigoted as "anti-Christian" bigots.

geniusmannumber1 9 years, 7 months ago

Holy crud, restorereason, you're kidding, right?

David Omar 9 years, 7 months ago

I have to admit, it was 1096 or so when they were launched and there were many, most of which were to continue the onslaught against the Muslims in Jerusalem. You might note that Jerusalem is quite a ways from Bystantium or Istanbul today. A couple year's travel in those days by land. This also shows that Muslims were there then, something the Israelis over look. But, Turkey has never been part of Europe and the Europeans don't claim them. Your statement about Muslim aggression against Europe doesn't hold and that was my main point. The Turks embraced Islam and took over the leadership of the Muslims in the beginning of the Ottoman Empire and retained it until 1918.The Garbage I know comes from working in Turkey for several years before returning to the USA and learning of their history from them, which has always been more accurate than the American spin on things. You prove the spin in one or two posts. Thanks.

Paul R Getto 9 years, 7 months ago

Leave Cal alone; if you don't like his stuff, don't read it. I generally disagree, but at least he tries to argue and not scream like Anal Cyst does. Cal did write one column years ago with which I agreed.....he bagged on the churches for spending money on expensive buildings, perks for the preachers, etc, and not on the poor, which it their essential mission.

KS 9 years, 7 months ago

SouthSide - Go to church and you would learn the difference.

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

duplenty, you are right--there are plenty of narrow-minded Bible-bangers who are 'way too adamant for my tastes, as well. My complaint is that those who strongly dislike religous people lump all believers together. But we all do the same thing with Liberals and Conservatives, etc. I just happen to know so many believers who AREN'T bigoted or Bible-bangers that such an assumption irritates me!I, personally, am a conservative environmentalist and people in both camps think that is an oxymoron. "The truth lies somewhere in the middle."

canyon_wren 9 years, 7 months ago

Webster's defines a bigot as "one obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his own opinions and prejudices." I guess all of us fall in to that category about some things we feel strongly enough, so none of us is in the position to "call names." One person's bigotry is another's strong convictions. It just depends upon what side of the fence you are on.

George_Braziller 9 years, 7 months ago

"It's quite noticeable anytime anyone shows even a hint of godly values or beliefs, it seems to really hit a nerve."It hits a nerve because it is usually being jammed down someones throat or used to justify some sort of discrimination.

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