Letters to the Editor

War costs

March 3, 2008

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To the editor:

In Thursday's Journal-World, a Nobel laureate estimates the cost of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan at $3 trillion when all is said and done. The National Priorities Project has a running total of Iraq war costs (based on Congressional Budget Office estimates) currently at $498 billion. The same site shows the cost of the Iraq war to the citizens of Lawrence as $99 million, our share goes up about $1 per second.

Meanwhile, in Lawrence our public schools need more money, our streets and sidewalks need repair, etc. The National Governors Association meeting last week noted that most states are facing record deficits. Our national debt is skyrocketing; after declining throughout the Clinton administration, it has increased by $3 trillion during the Bush administration.

The president says we can't afford health insurance for our kids and he wants cuts in programs that provide food for the poor, Medicaid and Medicare, basically everything nonmilitary.

Does anyone else see the connection here? This war, which is supposed to make us safer from terrorists, but a recent National Intelligence Estimate declared has done the opposite, is bankrupting this country and preventing us from taking care of business here at home. President Bush has kept us in Iraq despite overwhelming public opinion that we should get out. John McCain says we'll be there for 100 years!

We need to stop stuffing money down this rat hole of a war and fund our priorities in America. Who will you vote for?

Doug Burger,

Lawrence

Comments

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

These Clinton attacks are starting to be just plain hilarious.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 7 years, 5 months ago

All you do is want people to pay more and more. Maybe the City Commission needs to learn to live within their budget.

Yes, like quit resurfacing Wakarusa and Kasold every couple of years. Let the sprawlers deal with the same potholes we deal with in the older part of town.

Richard Heckler 7 years, 5 months ago

Locally our city commissioners may not be doing that much better. Spending $88 million on a new sewage treatment plant will further encourage small town sprawl thus increasing the cost of community services dramatically. Small town sprawl will demand new infrastructure thus expanding our tax dollar debt.

This is what will follow a new sewage treatment plant: water and sewer lines streets and repairs houses public schools fire stations law enforcement manpower sidewalks snow removal Traffic signals Traffic calming developers requesting more tax dollar assistance(new infrastructure) for their warehouses and retail strip malls. In general increases the cost of community services to all taxpayers.

Richard Heckler 7 years, 5 months ago

As the letter writer suggested our older infrastructure is being somewhat ignored which will become more costly to rehab as time goes forward. Why not invest in current infrastructure which pays back to the community instead of extending taxpayer liability on expensive small town sprawl? Maintaining existing resources makes dollars and sense.

What could $ 88 million or less accomplish? Invest in exisiting infrastructure instead of allowing it to go hell due to negligence.

*Repair streets and sidewalks in: Downtown Old west Lawrence Old East Lawrence Barker Brookcreek North Lawrence Oread

*The library needs attention and more space. Build a $17.5 million dollar library across the street from the New Hampshire parking garage in order to avoid a $10 million parking package attached to previous plans thus making use of an under utilized parking garage.

*A downtown high dollar convention center is on the table. Instead let's convert the existing library building into a small town convention center which could save millions upon millions and protect taxpayers from another TIF project battle. When library shelves and office space is removed there is a huge space. Lawrence does not need an extravagant new building. Clean it up,do some remodel and landscape,landscape,landscape... we're set to go. Two large meeting spaces(one downstairs) and two existing smaller places in the current space.

*Provide development funding for a economic growth team in city hall. There is more transparency in City hall.

*Build the east Lawrence hike and bike trail

*Develop a KU/City public transporation system accompanied with an appropriate maintenance facility.

Maintaining and investing in existing infrastructure pays back and is good for business. After all taxpayers have been contributing tax dollars to a maintenance fund which seems is being spent elsewhere.

Stephen Roberts 7 years, 5 months ago

Merrill thinks if you cut and paste the same message over and over that people will listen. Personally, I hate listening to broken records, so I ignore them.

Get the point Merrill?

jonas 7 years, 5 months ago

I admit that it would be interesting to see an ideologue flip on the aspects of blaming previous administrations for existing problems, and others refusing to cede any, even the obvious, blame in regards to those problems.

Richard Heckler 7 years, 5 months ago

Bowhunter/Commuter: So the online cops dictate the rules. Do you not realize how often you all repeat yourselves? So you don't agree with me...so what. Don't waste your time reading what I post. I do not agree with you...so what. It's called freedom of speech.

Cutting the medicare/medicaid bugets is the Bush way of saying privatiztion. Privatization = higher cost as the medical insurance providers prove. Privatization = more tax dollars going to corporate america.

Doug Berger has at least 70% of USA citizens supporting the points he makes about the war needing to come to an end.

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

Recent stories I have read say that Humans starting leaving Africa more than 65,000 years ago. Most people believe that we are getting more intelligent but since our fearless Aircraft Carrier landing leader has taken us back there, I beg to differ.

Curtiss 7 years, 5 months ago

Well, how about that right_thinker? He actually contributed something to the fray! Can you imagine!

Yes, the same guy! You know, when you say something like "Over 900 Bush administration lies to lead us into war have been documented," he's the guy who says "It's too bad you're such a rabid Bush hater that you blame him for everything."

The man with hundreds of posts with dozens of ways to say "you're crazy."

Yes! He said something useful! No, really!

What???, you must be wondering. Above, r_t says the new incoming Democratic administration will be like... and then he links to a product called "Colonblow."

Well, I read that page and he is absolutely right this time. Blast yourself with Colonblow a few times, the site says, and you start pooping out junk and crud that's built up for years, restricting the flow and filling your body with disgusting toxins that threaten your health.

r_t, I don't think you or anyone here could have come up with a better analogy of what this country needs, and what the majority of voters desperately hope we'll get this election.

r_t, I join you eager anticipation of next January's Democratic inauguration, when we finally start to blast that crusty crap out of there.

COLONBLOW 2008!

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

right_thinker.

We already did that. We had Bill Clinton for 8 years.

We had a balanced budget and a surplus. Job growth and a very hopeful outlook for the country.

In spite of the fact that the Clintons were hounded by Republican lawyers and smear artists the entire time. I am surprised Bill didn't crack from the strain.

No, I'm REAL happy with your guy.

a_flock_of_jayhawks 7 years, 5 months ago

lacolonia says, "Bush inherited the Clinton-Gore recession"

Wrong. Read the NBER.

"If Clinton had been as interested in pursuing bad guys as he was in pursuing bad girls, our nation would have been safer and the GOP would have had far fewer Clintonscandals to deal with."

Wrong again. Way more scandals with way more far-reaching consequences to our country under W. In fact, there is currently one on the table that W is trying to permanently sweep under the rug.

You can say it as many times as you want, Ferd, but it does not give what you've said there an ounce of truth.

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

Anybody that disagrees with the current administration/Bush cult followers is far Left.

If I followed their logic I would never be able to find my house in Lawrence when I come home from work because I would be in Wichita.

BigAl 7 years, 5 months ago

I thought we were told by Bush/Cheney that the Iraq war would be paid for with Iraqi oil? I guess that went along with being treated as liberators. And "Mission Accomplished"

By the way, is the man that attacked us on 9/11 still out there?

BigAl 7 years, 5 months ago

Wow, lacolania, I hate to break it to you but Clinton has been out of office now for over 7 years. Clinton didn't invade Iraq. And you right wingers continue to ignore the facts that Iraq did NOT attack us, we were not treated as liberators and the war is NOT being paid for with Iraqi oil. I realize that some of you still want to blame Clinton, or the press, or hollywood, but this is Bush's war. It is time to stop hiding your head in the sand and wake up.

Mkh 7 years, 5 months ago

"Who will you vote for?"

Dr. Ron Paul. Anyone else will continue to waste our money and send us into debt.

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

Lindsey reported "But what if the administration had decided to leave Saddam alone and, in turn, he had had WMDs? ... The costs to the world would have been much higher."

So the argument is what, if Saddam had what he didn't have, then imagine what the costs would have been?

But he didn't!

Imagine, if by invading we found out that Saddam didn't have WMDs, but actually was captain of the Death Star, and he decided to blow the world up out of anger! Did we think of the consequences of that happening? Imagine those imagined costs?

There were no WMDs, the current administration went to great lengths to quiet any opposition or questioning of the theory that he did, and they took us into a war without a pre-determined exit strategy for which we are now paying the price. Imagine the savings had we not been so foolish to follow a self-proclaimed "C" student who got through life by the connections made for him by his father and was also an alcoholic until finding God at the age of 40.

Imagine, indeed.

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco: "First, you cannot say for certain that Saddam did not have WMD in 2002 ..." True, it is impossible to prove a negative.

What I can say is that when we went looking for them in 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, and still in 2008, they weren't there. I can also say for certain that we did not catch the mastermind behind the attacks on us on 9/11, Osama bin Laden. He is still at large, while our military might is in Iraq.

As far as intent, now we are justifying going into war based on future intent, which is little more than future desire? Wouldn't that make us go to war with many, many nations around the world that, if they get the means, they intend to some day smite us for being the Great Satan? Just because I intend to reach through this screen and slap you for being a neocon, that doesn't mean I can.

My comments about Bush's past are only pointing out that Americans, especially those in Congress, gave way too much credit to someone who didn't deserve it. Just because I criticize him, that doesn't mean I hate Bush. He is the President of the United States, an office for which I have great respect. What I hate are his policies. I don't believe he has the intelligence to make good decisions, and my beliefs are borne out of his continually making bad decisions.

So 40 is the new 20? Experimenting in youth is not the same when you are still doing so at age 40.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 7 years, 5 months ago

Hmmm, Reagan said just let him try, it won't work to Oscar Arias when he brokered a peace agreement in Central America. He knew that only war would work. He wanted so much to laugh in Arias' face when it fell through. But Reagan, the far right's hero was wrong. We didn't end up having to go to war in Central America. If Obama gets us out of Iraq using diplomacy, and stops the rape of economy by large corporations, what will rightthinker say then. I'm sure he'll try and give Bush credit.

Corey Williams 7 years, 5 months ago

Just a couple of questions for lacolonia:

You say "Of course, the Bush administration inherited the Iraq situation." And how did that happen? Did Clinton start the problems in Iraq? Or was it the first Bush? Or maybe was it Reagan? Maybe when he took Iraq off the list of countries that support terrorism? I didn't realise that Clinton had such far reaching power back in the early 80s.

And you say that Clinton's policies "vis-a-vis Iraq led to 9/11." How does that work when Bush himself said "we've had no evidence that Saddam Hussein was involved with September the 11th"? What leaps do I have to take to keep up with your logic?

(wow, r_t. are you off your meds? one minute you're all "I'm voting for Barry H. O'Bama.", and then the next minute you're "You lefties are a fantastic bunch. Ya' friggin loons." on one story you even posted "And it's_getting_wormier, what kind of perfect life do you lead? I call "a$$hole" on you." in response to the statement "E-mail scam artists prey on stupid people." yet just four hours later you posted "If you fall for a scam, which to date, I never once have and believe me, have had many in my face, you're stupid------p.e.r.i.od......!!!!!!" not that I really care about your mental health, but are you off your meds? I mean, at least some people like lacolonia are rabid right-wing all the time and they can be counted on to make silly statements like how Clinton's policies "vis-a-vis Iraq led to 9/11", but you seem to be swinging like a pendulum. far right one minute, centrist the next. maybe you should get that looked at.)

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 7 years, 5 months ago

RT wants Obama to win, because he thinks he'll screw it all up and some right wing hero will come in to save the day. I'm mean, isn't that what happened when we had a husband who fooled around on his wife? Didn't Bush bring integrity back to the White House. Isn't life so much better now that we have a president who's true to his wife? Of course, I'm just a working stiff without lots of investments in oil companies and Haliburton, so my perspective is somewhat different than money rollers like RT.

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

I'm giving my vote to McCain now that he has accepted John Hagee's endorsement.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=CdroHjMipCk

Apocalypse now!!!

BigAl 7 years, 5 months ago

  1. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.
  2. "Mission Accomplished". 3 This war will be paid for with Iraqi oil.
  3. We'll be treated as liberators.

Right-wingers still spinning history and ignoring the obvious.

kansas778 7 years, 5 months ago

I think RT's hopes are based on our experience in the 1994 elections. From 1994 through 2004 the GOP won a lot of victories at the national level culminating with Bush's re-election. A lot of it due to the Clinton tax increase and the attempt to pass socialized health care. So, have your shot, and we'll see if America still feels the same about these and other issues that are likely to come up under Obama's presidency.

I wish it was Alan Keyes that could have been the first minority president.

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

Bush admits there was no Iraq-9/11 connection and admits there were no WMD's.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=f_A77N5WKWM

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 7 years, 5 months ago

Obviously the bombings in 1998 worked, since there were no WMD to be found after the invasion. Bombing possible manufacturing sites is far more desirable than invasion, the quagmire that we are in now. You can liberate the people of a nation who have been invaded by another. The Kuwaitis were thankful for the intervention, but the liberation of a country from a dictator has to come from the people, or it's chaos.

jonas 7 years, 5 months ago

I think they'd likely be wildly inaccurate, and based on non-factual estimations of costs.

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

The surge is working. . .

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/27/AR2008022701078.html?hpid=topnews

Iraqi government leaders on Wednesday rejected a law requiring nationwide elections by the fall, sidetracking a measure that U.S. officials consider a key benchmark for political reconciliation in Iraq.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=4342094

A man in a wheelchair laden with explosives persuaded security guards Monday to push him into an Iraqi operations center, where he blew himself up in an attack that killed the center's deputy commander.

The infiltration, along with a U.S. report that insurgents used an adolescent to carry out a suicide attack against a mosque last week, was the latest indication that al-Qaida in Iraq is expanding its tactics to avoid detection before a bombing.

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco, as I noted above, it is impossible to prove a negative. We have been in Iraq and searched and have not found evidence of existing WMDs, although we have found evidence of the destruction of WMDs prior to our arrival. Can anyone prove that no WMDs still exist - No. Just as no one can prove that little green men don't live on Mars. Sure, we've looked, but have we looked everywhere, all at the same time, including underground??? Is that why Bush wants to go to Mars, to get the Martians and their missing WMDs?

"Imagine that Al Gore had managed to steal the election in 2000. Do you really believe he would have responded to 9/11 and Iraq differently?"

Okay, I can imagine no butterfly ballots in Florida and the votes intended for Gore actually going for Gore. I do believe with my whole being that he would have responded differently. I don't believe he would have invaded Iraq, since Iraq didn't attack us!!!

Then, we would have the Taliban squashed in Afghanistan, al-qeada on the run and scrambling, and still had no fly zones over Iraq.

And under a Gore presidency, the world would be united around a common good and we would have world peace. (You said I should imagine.)

"Barack Milhous Obama" -- now that is funny.

Regarding "Milhous's" past drug use, again, it was in his youth, not when he was a 40 year old man. No spin. I can accept that.

By the way, was Saturday Night Live correct with John McCain's middle name: Nebekanezar?

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

So he wasn't born in the United States, and his middle name is that of an Australia city -- and he is a "III". That is it. Can't vote for McCain.

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

Good enough for Hagee--good enough for me.

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco, "Of course, it is possible to say you have no evidence of something and still believe in that same something."

Are you now trying to build a religion around Bush?

Sorry to point it out, but to invade another country there are many of us who would actually insist on evidence.

By the way, one of the sure costs of the war -- it is going to cost the Republicans the White House in November. In this I believe.

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

The video is a fake. It is obviously a G.W. impersonator.

McCain/Hagee 2009!!!

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

"Hate to keep reminding you liberals of this, but there was a multi-administration, bipartisan, and multinational consensus that Saddam had WMD at the time of the invasion."

Based on falsified "evidence" and a massive fearmongering campaign from the Bush administration. Once the drums of wars start to beat, it is hard for a minority political party to stand in the way. But you are correct in that they failed to stop it.

"Hillary and Obama are not presidential material. "

But G.W. was I suppose?

Logan5 7 years, 5 months ago

Multinational consensus? So 49 countries is a consensus?

On January 29, 2003, the European Parliament passed a nonbinding resolution opposing unilateral military action against Iraq by the United States. According to the resolution, "a pre-emptive strike would not be in accordance with international law and the UN Charter and would lead to a deeper crisis involving other countries in the region".

Whoda thunk it.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 7 years, 5 months ago

"That was not the case in Japan, Germany, and Italy."

They did not consider themselves liberated. They were a conquered people who were relieved that the Allies wanted to rebuild and not punish them like what happened after WWI. Their national unity also evolved over time and wasn't forced upon them. Iraq's borders, on the other, were not formed by the unity of their people. There are many people who id themselves first as their religious sect, not as being Iraqi. Bush thought this would be the French welcoming the liberating army, but what happened is they now have reason to gain the power for their particular sect and seek revenge. If you haven't noticed, like the Bush administration hasn't noticed, this culture does not have the same value of forgiveness. They are still getting revenge for things that happened generations before. We are now caught up in the that cycle, and we may never get out. Differences in culture was not even considered when we invaded. The Arab world understood us wanting to go to Afghanistan, because it was revenge. They resented the invasion of Iraq, because there was no reason to do it. None, except the oil, of course.

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco, you are correct, the Dems don't have a viable candidate for the presidency -- we have TWO! Clinton or Obama will make a fine president. McCain lost any chance he had when he admitted to not wanting to get out of Iraq and that America should stay for another 100 years.

I understand that when you get older the years seem to just fly by, but to most of us 100 years is still a long time.

Americans are tired of this war. McCain doesn't get it, despite his being such a liberal on everything else. There is no way a Republican returns to the White House following Bush, not even a liberal Republican.

temperance 7 years, 5 months ago

lacolonia: "If the evidence was falsified, then it was the minority party (i.e., Democrats) who falsified it and passed it on to the Bush administration."

Did grade school just let out? Are you seriously going to float the argument that there were crazy Democrats in charge of the CIA responsible for stove-piping false Iraq intel? Be a man and admit that you threw your support behind a stupid war. No harm in admitting you were stunningly wrong. We're all friend here.

PS: Your buddy Warren Buffett thinks were in a recession: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/03/03/buffett-were-in-a-recession/

Richard Heckler 7 years, 5 months ago

I'd say we cannot and never could afford this war of Bush choice. $3 trillion dollars is a lot of dough.

Thousands of white collar jobs in the financial sector are on the chopping block cuz they say they've lost billions of dollars. If that is true how do they stay open for business,support over paid CEO's and continue to fund golden parachutes? Numbers can be "moved around" to say most anything depending on the objective. These jobs may well be headed for India.

The war needs to stop. Disability pay and trying to support new single moms is going to be a monster.

Meanwhile:

And Those Were the Good Times

"For a while now, there have been plenty of signs that the overall U.S. economy is headed south. Economic growth stalled in the last three months of 2007, adding only 0.6% to output after correcting for inflation. In December, job growth ground to a near halt, and the economy lost 17,000 jobs in January, as construction suffered large job losses. The unemployment rate jumped to 5.0% for the first time in three years, and would be much higher if the labor force participation rate-the fraction of the population either working or actively looking for work-were at the same level as when George Bush took office. On top of that, retail sales tanked in December as worried consumers cut back on holiday spending. Finally, the terminally volatile stock market registered one of its worst Januaries on record, enough to induce a panicked Fed to make an emergency interest-rate cut.

But even leaving these and other recent numbers aside, U.S. economic performance this decade has been nothing to write home about. The economy has now expanded for 74 straight months, from November 2001 to December 2007, far longer than the usual 51-month post-WWII expansion. But economic growth has been the slowest of any post-WWII expansion, averaging just 2.8% a year, far below the 4.3% average posted by earlier post-WWII business cycles of similar length. Worse yet, the economic growth that has occurred has done so little for so many-and so much for so few."

the whole story: http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archives/2008/0108miller.html

temperance 7 years, 5 months ago

lacolonia is confusing the people who created the bad intelligence with the people who voted for the war based on that bad intelligence. I'll concede the stupidity of Clinton and Edwards in voting for the war, but this statement is still on crack: "If the evidence was falsified, then it was the minority party (i.e., Democrats) who falsified it and passed it on to the Bush administration."

Dude's got it all worked out. Saddam had WMD. Clinton created Al-Qaeda. Invading Iraq was a fantastic idea. The surge worked. And Obama is a secret socialist Muslim who's exactly like Hitler. [yawn]
So, Logan5, where can I get me some McCain/Hagee '08 buttons? McCain/Hagee!

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco, Anyone who bangs the war drum for Bush and McCain as loudly as you has some nerve calling me "foolish."

beatrice 7 years, 5 months ago

laco, I'm clearly basing this on the past 7 years, not the past few months. A Republican barely, and I mean just barely, won the past two elections (and on the first election he certainly didn't get the popular vote), and then they proceed totally blow it, from the war on "terror", to national affairs (Katrina), to the economy and the deficit. ... to name just a few.

Sorry, but there is no way John McCain will win, not because he is John McCain, but because he is a Republican. The fact that he is John McCain doesn't help. Reps aren't going to have the financial support, they won't have the evangelicals in the same numbers as past elections, and if it is Obama, there is no way McCain will get anywhere near enough of the minority vote to win. Ain't gonna happen, no way, no how.

Call me a fool now if you want. I have no doubt that in November you are going to be calling me correct.

gogoplata 7 years, 5 months ago

The US economy is in trouble. We can't continue to spend far beyond our means.

Stephen Roberts 7 years, 5 months ago

Sprawl sprawl. Hey Merrill, you house was built in a sprawl area. Since you house costs the city of Lawrence so much- pay an impact fee.

All you do is want people to pay more and more. Maybe the City Commission needs to learn to live within their budget. Your PLC buddies were deficit spenders. As the tax revenue decreased, the continued to spend and drain down the cumulative fund.

Since you are so passionate about sprawl, run for city commission. I told you before, you run, I'll give you $100 for your campaign.

As for my comment, I am trying to tell you all of your cut and paste really turns people off. Write some original stuff man.

jonas 7 years, 5 months ago

Logan5 (Anonymous) says:

"Hillary and Obama are not presidential material. "

But G.W. was I suppose?"

Well, since he has the key and apparently only real criteria for being president, namely being not-a-democrat, then sure he was.

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

finding_Uranus:

About the cost of war.

I wonder how many decades it will take to get rid of the resentment that the relatives of almost 150,000 dead Iraqi citizens feel towards me right now.

BigAl 7 years, 5 months ago

Finding_Uranus (Anonymous) says:

Leave it to liberals to quantify war in dollars only-and not grasp the full meaning and cost of waror shrinking from war when needed. Liberals are always willing to dole out the peoples dollars but not for war::but still are counting the dollars:..very odd .


And a lot of Republicans are willing to dole out other people's kids for war, not grasping the realities of what they are doing. Again, all of these war hungry men that never served a day have no problems sending in America's youth. Especially to a country that DID NOT attack us and had NOTHING to do with 9/11.

By the way, this war was supposed to be paid for with Iraqi Oil. Remember that claim? Kinda goes along with "Mission Accomplished" and "We'll be treated as liberators"...

unite2revolt 7 years, 5 months ago

Guess what. We're up some creek with out a paddle with our current system of Medicare + Medicaid and Social Security. The combined cost of those programs last year was over 900 billion dollars. Thats for one year. In less than 10 years Medicare will be broke, and will rely 100% on revenue raised raised annually from tax payers to continue. Social Security has about thirty years left before the taxes it raises will only pay for 75% of the benefits it owes to eligible citizens.

The "war" at this point is really an occupation. The war is over folks. The cost is only nickels and dimes, in the grand scheme of the financial woes of this country.

Rather than asking candidates how they feel about Iraq we should ask them how they plan to solve the 900lb gorilla in the room that nobody but Bush is talking about.

unite2revolt 7 years, 5 months ago

I would also encourage everyone who thinks voting matters to consider for a minute that you live in Kansas. The general election doesn't matter, since the electoral college determines the winner.

The last two elections were not even decided by the electoral college. Gore re-conceded the election to Bush in 2000 after the Supreme Court halted the re-count in Florida. He had conceded beforehand on election night, but called Bush back to say he was rescinding his concession. In 2004 Kerry conceded the election even before the votes were all counted for the first time, despite his campaign pledge. Both Gore and Kerry claimed they were doing it for the good of the nation. Kerry at the time was only two electoral votes behind Bush and neither candidate had enough to win the college.

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 5 months ago

possessionannex:

Don't you realize there were/are 5 wars?

I guess you don't remember Vietnam very well.

They are doing very well now thank you. Despite land mines, and agent orange still causing cancer and a myriad of other diseases not to mention the psychological problems in the aftermath of that miserable war.

When will you fools ever learn?

The problem with you guys is you always come up with a ton of reasons to do things that will never work instead of figuring out that you shouldn't even be there.

Jcjayhawk1 7 years, 5 months ago

Ron Paul is often overlooked yet represents how most Americans feel about the war. Why else do you think he has more campaign donations from the Army,Navy, and Air Force than any of the other candidates?

He's not going to win the nomination but the philosophy and message can continue.

jayhawklawrence 7 years, 4 months ago

Most Americans are sick to death of the petty squabbling that exists between Republicans and Democrats.

In Kansas, the main source of this BS is coming from the Republicans. The image that people have of them is that they are knuckle-heads.

Most voters no longer believe that the Republicans are the party of "God" and most ministers and church leaders have wisened up about this mythology so it is going to be tough to prevent the Democrats from sweeping the upcoming elections. Time to reform the Republican party and get rid of the old has beens.

Jim Phillips 7 years, 4 months ago

All of you Bush-bashing Li'l Libs can continue to keep your heads buried in the sand, believe the world is a happy place, and cry foul anytime your beloved Clinton's name is taken in vain, but history is history no matter how much you try to re-write (deny) it.

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