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Letters to the Editor

Climate reality

June 18, 2008

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To the editor:

The June 12 edition of the Journal-World contained reporting of a record-setting tornado season in the Midwest, record flooding in Cedar Rapids and a drought declaration for western Kansas, a condition extending across the West and responsible for a record number of wilderness fires in that area. This correlates with record atmospheric CO2 levels and record high temperatures for most of the past decade.

Perhaps it is just a coincidence that these violent extremes of weather are exactly what were predicted by climatologists' computer models a decade ago as a likely outcome of human-caused global warming.

In the same newspaper, the Kansas Chamber of Commerce expressed outrage that the refusal of our governor to allow the dumping of an additional 11 million tons of CO2 per year into our already overcharged atmosphere might damage the "business climate" of our state. On June 14, the Saturday Column endorsed that position.

Wake up and smell the coffee! And while you're at it, ask the chambers of Cedar Rapids, Greensburg and New Orleans how business is doing in their cities. How good will business be in western Kansas when the Ogallala aquifer, which is being drained 100 times faster than it is being replenished, finally runs out, turning that region into a desert?

We simply cannot continue to overheat and abuse the planet without paying a price, even if it is "bad for business," and the price our grandchildren will have to pay may be more than they can endure.

Dr. Steven Bruner,

Lawrence

Comments

Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

"I'm not saying the warming doesn't cause problems. Obviously it does. Obviously we should be trying to understand it. I'm saying that the problems are being grossly exaggerated. They take away money and attention from other problems that are much more urgent and more important-poverty, infectious diseases, public education and public health. Not to mention the preservation of living creatures on land and in the oceans."Global warming is already responsible for causing diseases due to encroachment of species into areas which are not able to cope with the bacteria that comes with that species. Global warming has the potential to create the destruction of masses of people in so many ways. If one does not understand the connection between life forms, how everything in some way impinges on everything else, then one can't really comprehend the full consequences of global warming.

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

Stillhavingawonderfulinternetlife.

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Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

bondmen refers to Roy Spencer who is a meteorologist by discipline. Here is a segment of a critique of his book: There is an important graph in the IPCC 2007 report (I'm referring to fig 8.1 in "Climate Change 2007, the Physical Science Basis") which shows how all the available models agree well with the data, but this result is not described in Spencer's book. Maybe he simply doesn't believe it. Spencer says the models leave out things which are not fully understood, such as a possible water-vapor feedback. Spencer asserts that the model-builders are biased and try to conform to each other. I find this hard to believe, but then I wouldn't know. The IPCC 2007 report lists the uncertainties with it's findings. My understanding is that not all the issues are completely settled, but that's why it's scientific research: the answers are not obvious. To amplify his points, Spencer is sarcastic and often disrespectful, and he complains about environmental extremism. He's right that we should avoid hysteria, but I think he misrepresents how science works. Science is a process for finding the truth. On some rare occasions, erroneous "group-think" may occur, but a wrong hypothesis is always proven wrong eventually. I cannot recommend the IPCC 2007 report, as it is too long and detailed; however, a nice short book for the general public which explains the findings is "The Science and Politics of Global Climate Change" by A. Dessler and E. Parson. Overall I found it to be a much more balanced presentation, including explanations of the uncertainties such as those Spencer mentions.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

Lots of unauthorised links around here today!http://www2.ljworld.com/site/rules/" (Not)....to promote other web sites, without our express written approval, or where expressly permitted".

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Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

While intelligent people may go on debating whether the consequences of our pollution include global warming, we know the pollution is harmful to life forms, including humans. That is the main reason Californians are trying to clean up their air. So, it remains important to clean up our air and then if we notice that the global warming problems decline as well, then we know that we did something good for yet another reason. There is no reason to not switch away from fossil fuels, period, end of story.

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bondmen 5 years, 10 months ago

The historical weather facts with great analysis of causes, patterns, cycles and measurement methods are expertly covered here:http://www.weatherquestions.com/Roy-Spencer-on-global-warming.htm

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Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

If you haven't already, check out the Aptera, a three wheeled vehicle coming out of a new company in California, creating new jobs for Americans. GM, Chrysler and Ford did not come up with this. Also, solar chimneys (towers) are being developed and built in Europe and Australia. These towers could be the clean green replacement for nuclear reactors and they have an endless supply of fuel without the terribly adverse effects from mining, transporting and burning of fossil fuels.

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Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

Here is a link to an article by Fred Krupp, who is the president of the environmental defense fund. It demonstrates how 8 coal plants that were planned in Texas were defeated, in favor of using more advanced methods of producing energy. http://www.edf.org/article.cfm?contentID:Mr. Krupp has more than 20 years in looking at alternative forms of energy production. He clearly says that advancements are here. When we stop subsidizing current energy producers and if you factor in the costs of the destruction of the environment caused by carbon based energy, there is no question that clean energy is cost effective and that only clean energy insures that we will be able to continue to have a viable economy. To continue to use the current types of energy production is a form of suicide and the window for taking care of this is imminent. We cannot even afford to stay in denial and persist in present strategies. He shared on Charlie Rose that we have about 1 1/2 years to get a clean program underway. Fortunately, our do nothing president is on the way out and either of the two candidates will do more than he did. Obama will be more aggressive in cleaning up the environment and making use of the new technologies. It so happens that the new technologies will do more to help promote new jobs and improve the standing of the USA in the world, so there really isn't a down side. The new ideas will come from scientists, engineers, techies and small operators, not from entrenched large corporations who naturally want to maintain their status quo hold on the consumers. They are not bad people, just have bad objectives which will not help us now.

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Bob Hechlor 5 years, 10 months ago

Al Gore's opinion is based on knowledge which he began to get when he was studying science in college. He continued to educate himself about environmental issues. He is not a demon or a communist. He is a concerned person who does not like the idea of our foolish destruction of the planet, at least to the extent that it will no longer support human beings. If you deny global warming is now at a level of alarm, then go ahead and deny it. Provide what you think is evidence to the contrary. Since, there are not really good arguments which haven't already been adequately considered, it is unlikely that those who favor risking more destruction to somehow magically improve the economy, something which hasn't happened during the Bush years, don't expect to be real successful. The typical strategy of Bushies and as you can witness above, those who resist the problems of pollution, is to call names and attack people who have a different view than themselves. There are no real accepted scientific arguments which can provide a reasonable argument to not pursue clean energy policies.

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max1 5 years, 10 months ago

"For some time now the "Global Warming" crowd have used national weather stories as "evidence" of their pet theories" -cato_the_elderAre you referring to McCain_the_eldest?http://blog.pennlive.com/pennsyltucky/2008/06/obama_mccain_launch_first_gene.htmlMcCain's ad, called "Global," focuses what the Arizona Republican senator calls a "realistic plan" to curb greenhouse gas emissions, grow the economy and protect the environment.Besides trying to appeal to those concerned about rising energy costs and global warming, it starts out by noting "John McCain stood up to the president and sounded the alarm on global warming five years ago" Watch McCain's political ad:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kIMku...

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brujablanco 5 years, 10 months ago

Marion wrote:Marion (Marion Lynn) says: dsmith84:Frankly, My Dear, I don't give a darn what you think!KSA 21-4004 was implemented to protect people against malicious attacks and since I can show a continuing pattern of such malicious attacks, the law clearly applies.Beleve me; if they can convict Dave Carson and Ed Powers of violating this law, I'm not going to have any difficulty with it.______OMG - these are the funniest threats from Marion I have seen in a long time!Marion, please read a bit more of the law, and a few pertinent court cases regarding Criminal Defamation before you spout off. First of all sweet cheeks, you can't just file a pro se action and POOF, you have a criminal defamation charge against an anonymous poster practicing free speech. You would have to file a police report, and boy, would I love to be there to see them laugh you out of the police station. What a loon you must be.

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gr 5 years, 10 months ago

"2) CO2 is a greenhouse gas and so far we've added about 1/3 to the amount of this gas in the atmosphere."Proof please.But alarmists don't back up their claims. They think it's not needed because it's a "fact" and therefore doesn't need any further consideration.

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Pilgrim 5 years, 10 months ago

allateup (Anonymous) says:Dr. Bruner:::..I am finding a new doctor! You are a dumbA$$******I dumped this idiot long ago, and every passing day proves that decision to be more and more correct.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

I have seen the Ark with water in it and have pix to prove it!It was wonderful!Maybe 3 ft. deep and flowing with clear, fresh water!Colorado sucks.

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TopJayhawk 5 years, 10 months ago

Actually the lawsuit that is ongoing is one of the things that I agree with Kathleen about. And the aquifer also gets help going dry trying to keep Dallas/Ft Worth in H2O. It does extend that far south.

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TopJayhawk 5 years, 10 months ago

I lived in Dodge City as a young boy, and watched the flood of '65 or whenever it was roll into town from a hill west of town. It is a memory I'll never forget. The river in Dodge has been dry since the late sixties. Your female hero in the Mansion for hire (Ceder Crest) has talked openly about Colorado hoarding water in John Martin resovour. There is indeed water west of it, and it does indeed get sucked up by irrigation. But that does not change the fact that Colorado is holding onto more water than it used to. Recently, there has actually been times when the river in Dodge does have water in it. This is due largely to the lawsuit that is ongoing in the courts.

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Rationalanimal 5 years, 10 months ago

What is to be loved by enviro-Marxists like Steve here is that they ask everyone to accept the "obvious," or unproven theory, as proven science. It is the Marxist faith of the 21st century; it is a matter of post hoc ergo propter hoc--after this therefore because of this. Because two things correlate, assuming there is in fact a correlation, does not prove a causal relationship. Steve here as a man of medicine should be the first to admit that. Other than photo-shoped video of glaciers melting by Al Gore, where is the undeniable immutable scienitific evidence? It's not there, that is why it is demanded we all accept this theory, and by so doing surrender our personal and economic freedom, as science based on faith. In fact, the earth's tempractures have grown considerably colder in the last year. In fact, the earth has historically undergone massive tempature cycles. In fact, the earth's weather is the average of extremes. In fact, unpredictable and extreme weather is typical to the earth's climate. It is laughable to say that because we had a high tornado season this year the world is coming to an end. Global warming is a hoax at best. Sadly, suckers like Steve, while well intentioned, have gobbled the theory up hook line and sinker. A majority of suckers, while creating a subjective reality, does not change objective reality--although, it is mildly entertaining to watch adults, supposedly enlightened in wisdom and knowledge running around saying the world is coming to an end. Global warming is a theory developed by those believing they ought to control every aspect of human, animal and natural life by virtue of their superior intellect. Such people believe that through enough enlightenment and centralized government control, they can actually keep the earth's temprature and natural phenomenon at a constant rate. Frantic and faithless Chicken Littles who would use their fanaticism to control others, nothing more.Put down the Kool Aid Steve and come back to the light of logic.

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allateup 5 years, 10 months ago

Dr. Bruner...........I am finding a new doctor! You are a dumbA$$

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

Freeman Dyson on global warming:"The first of my heresies says that all the fluff about global warming is grossly exaggerated. Here I am opposing the holy brotherhood of climate model experts and the crowd of deluded citizens that believe the numbers predicted by their models. Of course they say I have no degree in meteorology and I am therefore not qualified to speak.But I have studied their climate models and know what they can do. The models solve the equations of fluid dynamics and do a very good job of describing the fluid motions of the atmosphere and the oceans. They do a very poor job of describing the clouds, the dust, the chemistry and the biology of fields and farms and forests. They do not begin to describe the real world that we live in.The real world is muddy and messy and full of things that we do not yet understand. It is much easier for a scientist to sit in an air-conditioned building and run computer models than to put on winter clothes and measure what is really happening outside in the swamps and the clouds. That's why the climate model experts end up believing their own models.There's no doubt that parts of the world are getting warmer, but the warming is not global. The warming happens mostly in places and times where it is cold, in the arctic more than the tropics, in the winter more than the summer, at night more than the daytime.I'm not saying the warming doesn't cause problems. Obviously it does. Obviously we should be trying to understand it. I'm saying that the problems are being grossly exaggerated. They take away money and attention from other problems that are much more urgent and more important-poverty, infectious diseases, public education and public health. Not to mention the preservation of living creatures on land and in the oceans."http://www.umich.edu/news/index.html?DysonWinCom05

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

supertramp:"Yet the article was written in 2006?"So. There is no indication that the author deliberately tried to mislead readers. As of 2003, the statement was accurate. I think it's reasonable to conclude that the author did not have up-to-date information. But since you focused in on that single retraction, I assume you believe the rest of the article is accurate."Olberman lies? Got evidence to back that up? Again is he lying or is he just leaving out part of the truth as Mr. Peter Schweizer (your source) does?"Olbermann deliberately lies. There is an example from just Monday.http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives2/2008/06/020774.phpAnd then there was O'Donnell's lie about Rosie O'Donnell's attack on the troops.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxPkq8TCOJ8

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cool 5 years, 10 months ago

affirm:18 June 2008 at 8:41 a.m.Suggest removalPermalinkautie (Anonymous) says:A. we should do all can to minimize emissions into the atmosphere and become better stewards of all resources.2. there will always be cycles of climatic changes no matter what theory of thought one prescribes to. The current weather patterns are just part of it..records are made to be broken.C. S**T Happens.1 out of 4 barrels of oil sent to the USA is for the Dept. of Defense consumption -- that's a lot of gas/oil folks !

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cool 5 years, 10 months ago

Freeman Dyson on Climate Change:video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTSxubKfTBUsmarter than Al Gore + Tom Waits

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devobrun 5 years, 10 months ago

If there were more Tom Waits' in the world, Al Gore wouldn't have a Nobel Peace prize.

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

Get some Meow Mix in here for Nick Danger!

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beatrice 5 years, 10 months ago

Smoking hot in Phoenix right now, but saw Tom Waits in concert last night and he was nothing but coooool. Life is good.

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supertrampofkansas 5 years, 10 months ago

"It was true as of 2003."Yet the article was written in 2006?Olberman lies? Got evidence to back that up? Again is he lying or is he just leaving out part of the truth as Mr. Peter Schweizer (your source) does?I have already answered the fact that the public records were not falsified. However you ignored the analysis of what exactly was reported. Again what is being reported is a dollar amount for electricity and a dollar amount for gas. That is being used to calculate what the Gores consumption was. This has been shown to be an inaccurate calculation. Again there is no explanation on what specifically the Gores are choosing to pay for in terms of the green power switch (renewable energy sources).Sorry I have to go my friend. I wish you good day and encourage you to always check your sources.

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Marion -I bet your a big Lee Marvin fan, eh?

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Chris Golledge 5 years, 10 months ago

Ogallala aquifer: Spurious connection, it isn't climate change; it's irrigated fields from one horizon to the other and beyond.However, there are easy facts:1) It is getting warmer; look at the trend over several decades and forget single, or even several, year variations.2) CO2 is a greenhouse gas and so far we've added about 1/3 to the amount of this gas in the atmosphere.3) There are no other explanations for the changing climate commonly accepted by the people who know the science.Conspiracy? Get real; scientists are one of the most argumentative groups I know.Here's a scary topic: ocean acidification. Look it up; at current rates of lowering pH (as a result of more CO2 in the biosphere) we've got around 50 years before large chunks of the ocean food web collapse. That's not just speculation. That's observing a long trend, utilizing the science of the solubility of CO2 in water, projecting it forward, and watching the base food chain animals die under the projected conditions. There are already noticeable effects on crustacean shells.Weather is a roll of the dice; climate change loads the dice. You can't tell from any few rolls whether the dice have been loaded. But, if you make enough observations, it becomes plain enough.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

Well, TOB ,since you are at the top of the list, let's go for broke, shall we?I lost my sense of humour as it relates to this matter some time back and as you know, you cannot un-ring a bell and the sense of humour is not recoverable.

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

supertramp:Olbermann lies for a living. I wouldn't use him as a source. And again, the Tennessee think tank got its information on Gore's energy usage from public records. Do you believe those records were fudged?"Also I noticed that last link you gave in the article itself says that one statement about the zinc mines had to be retracted because it wasn't true."It was true as of 2003.

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TheOriginalCA 5 years, 10 months ago

Dr Bruner is a conceded arrogant jerk who does not wash his hands after going to the rest room. This is true.. I saw him walk right straight from the urinal to the door without stopping at the sink at a Lawrence movie theater.

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supertrampofkansas 5 years, 10 months ago

RR,Well tell me what you think RR. Here is another wing nut for you to answer for your wing nut.http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/02/28/olbermann-on-gores-energy-use-setting-the-record-straight/Also I noticed that last link you gave in the article itself says that one statement about the zinc mines had to be retracted because it wasn't true. I also noted that the author also skirts around the green power switch issue by saying "there is no evidence". Please note that all of this data is based on a energy cost being generated and then back calculated to show how much has been used. It doesn't indicate the fact that the Gores are paying a higher cost is due to their switch to the green power. Again "an inconvenient truth" that your over-zealous sources are choosing to overlook.Another article here: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/GlobalWarming/Story?id=2906888&page=3

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Supertramp -Thanks for pointing that out. I'm probably the biggest fan of pointing out politically slanted websites used as sources. --Under advisement of my lawyer (an empty three year old bottle of Sierra Nevada that sits in my garage) and perusing the lastest National Enquirer (Angelina Jolie is having a rumored alien love child!) I would like to ammend my earlier post. Unfortunately, the LJW does not have an edit feature, so my edit is as follows...Rumored spammer. The Original Bob regrets the error and will be more careful in the future. No harm was intended to Mr. Lynn and TOB readily awaits the return of Mr. Lynn's sense of humor. Also, my lawyer points out that Mr. Lynn has violated the statute he is utilizing 171 times against TOB in the past year alone.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

Snap:Not once have I mentioned lawyers.Try again.

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

Thecyber-bullycandishitout,butcriesforalawyerwhensomeonegivesittohim.

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

supertramp:The same think tank took on Gore's massive carbon footprint last year. A Gore spokesperson did not deny the think tank's findings, which were taken from public records. All she would say is, "[T]he bottom line is that every family has a different carbon footprint. And what Vice President Gore has asked is for families to calculate that footprint and take steps to reduce and offset it."http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/GlobalWarming/story?id=2906888The Gores' carbon footprint has only gotten larger since then.This is also an interesting article on Gore's colossal carbon footprint:http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2006-08-09-gore-green_x.htm

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

dsmith84 (Anonymous) says: I'm going to go ahead and consider that defamatory"Marion writes:Well, Whoopty-Doo!

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

I'm going to go ahead and consider that defamatory

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

dsmith84 (Anonymous) says: if you don't care what other people think: why bother with the message boards? surely if you just enjoy reading your own writing you could leave what you have to say to yourself unposted:"Marion writes:I wrote that I do not care what YOU think!You have no real interest or standing in this matter, anyway.

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supertrampofkansas 5 years, 10 months ago

Hmmm, interesting article about Al Gore energy's consumption. As always I do check out the source just to see where this is coming from. So I read this from the website's own info:"The Tennessee Center for Policy Research is an independent, nonprofit and nonpartisan research and educational institute dedicated to providing concerned citizens, the media and public leaders with expert research and timely free market policy solutions to public policy issues in Tennessee."I have a hard time believing that these guys are really "independent". Come on now Al Gore's energy use is a public policy issue? As I was running through several areas of the site, I noticed there seems to be a fairly heavy right wing slant here. However I would guess that this is probably beside the point because I am sure what they are saying is true about Al Gore's energy use. Otherwise I think they would have some legal repurcussions for making such false statements.No I would be more interested in finding out about what they are not saying, things that would make this "hypocrisy" not so hypocritical. For example, I noticed there is a comparison being made between the Gore's place vs the average American home. What if the Gore's do their business out of their own household. I wonder what the average energy consumption of home businesses are. I wonder how many people are operating out of the Gores household. I would suspect there are employees, bodyguards, and other non-family members around. Or how about the use of alternate energy sources. The TCPR never mentions how much of the energy is coming in from solar or wind. I know there are opportunites for people to pay for alternate power known as green power switch. If the Gore's energy consumption is coming from renewable energy sources, then they would be putting out a lower carbon footprint. Of course none of this is mentioned by the article written by a group who claims to offer "clear and unbiased research".As the little ol lady says "Where's the beef?!"

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

if you don't care what other people think... why bother with the message boards? surely if you just enjoy reading your own writing you could leave what you have to say to yourself unposted...

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

dsmith84:Frankly, My Dear, I don't give a darn what you think!KSA 21-4004 was implemented to protect people against malicious attacks and since I can show a continuing pattern of such malicious attacks, the law clearly applies.Beleve me; if they can convict Dave Carson and Ed Powers of violating this law, I'm not going to have any difficulty with it.

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gr 5 years, 10 months ago

"These people would not make such libelous and clearly criminal attacks were they not hiding behind the cloak of anonymity,"So Marion,Why don't you become anonymous so there could be no libelous activity against you, a living person?

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

isn't pursuing action under KSA 21-4004 "tending to deprive such person of the benefits of public confidence and social acceptance;" - as being charged with a misdemeaner can tend to lower your social acceptibility... this sounds cyclical to me...

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

also... to mention something about the Ogallala. if global (or regional) warming occurs affecting Western Kansas the increased evaporation of water from elevated air and surface temperatures will cause more rapid depletion of the aquifer... on a hot summers day when the fields are irrigated a large percentage of the water sprayed on these fields evaporates before it is used by the plants. THEN the moisture moves to the east with the weather patterns and is rained out downstream from us, so we never get it back, which is why the aquifer is depleting MUCH faster than it is filling up in the first place... if this process is expedited the pore spaces where the water sits could compress, making for an aquifer which holds significantly less water if we do ever figure out how to recharge it, and could possibly lead to a catastrophic earthquake due to a rapid sinking of large land areas.in laymans terms: this is bad and we don't want it to happen

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

TOB:I am NOT "threatening" anything, much less a civil action.I am stating quite clearly that it is my intention to pursue action(s) under KSA 21-4004.That is NOT a threat!That is a promise.

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

"21-4004. Criminal defamation. (a) Criminal defamation is communicating to a person orally, in writing, or by any other means, information, knowing the information to be false and with actual malice, tending to expose another living person to public hatred, contempt or ridicule; tending to deprive such person of the benefits of public confidence and social acceptance; or tending to degrade and vilify the memory of one who is dead and to scandalize or provoke surviving relatives and friends."Isn't that a pretty good description of what goes on every day on a certain odious local 'forum'?

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Marion -Simmer down, Hoss. Question... how come sometimes you thank folks for agitating you because it increases your cash flow, yet other times you threaten lawsuits? You are back and forth on this and I honestly was trying to increase your Google hits. You are no fun when you are in lawsuit mode because then it is apparent you aren't enjoying the attention. Let me know when you are back in a good mood and I'll be your foil again. Until then, Ol' Chap, good day.

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Big Al -I was just by John Martin (is it normally that low?) three weeks ago and yes there is water. I was ribbing East Colorado (I'm from SW KS). I'll go with SW KS finished off what East Colorado started. And, yes, there are serious water issues out there. I just didn't like that Dr. Bruner linked that to Global Warming. I probably had a narrow reading of his letter.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 10 months ago

"What a joke!!! The guys who predict weather would be stars in MLB: getting it right 33% of the time with their predictions of what will happen in the next 24 hours: beyond 24 hours, forget it:"So, oldvet, does that mean you're going to start growing rice in Death Valley?

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

blessed3x:"Am I the only one that thinks it's ironic how the story on Al Gore's increase in energy use has been posted twice but no one has commented on it? The prince of global warming hysteria is the biggest hypocrit of all and no one calls him on it?"The liberals are ignoring that because Al Gore's extreme hypocrisy is an Inconvenient Truth. I'm a conservative who just brought dinner inside after it was cooked in my solar oven (unfortunately, the chicken breast needs a bit more cooking because of the cloud cover after 1:30), and Al Gore is consuming more energy than dozens of households. So who's really the environmentalist?My "Practice What You Preach" award goes to a former astronaut and oilman (as least on TV). http://www.larryhagman.com

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

girlfriend, why don't you stay on your own odious 'forum' where you can control things & stay off this forum where you are trying to control things.Oryoucouldjustjumpinthelake.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

dsmith84:Well, you're not me, are you?These people would not make such libelous and clearly criminal attacks were they not hiding behind the cloak of anonymity, which cloak may be removed by a simple filing.I am sick and tired of being called things which I am not; things which the accusers cannot prove that I am and having my reputaion villified all over this forum by anonymous users.

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BigAl 5 years, 10 months ago

Original Bob... I don't think Global Warming has anything to do with the Arkansas River or the Ogallala Aquafier either. And, Colorado is NOT holding back water. There is water in the Arkansas River downstream from the John Martin Reservoir. I have been there many times and there is water in the river east of that reservoir. It is basically irrigation in SW Kansas that is draining the Ogallala Aquafier and has already drained the Arkansas River. Because of these facts, Dr Bruner does not deserve the widespread critizism that he is receiving. Just because "global warming" is a talking point for both political parties, doesn't mean that we don't have serious problems.

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

Marion, I'm not exactly a regular on the boards, but I'm pretty sure I've seen you expose people to contempt and ridicule for their comments that you have disagreed with. I've never been one for namecalling, but I've also never really been one to claim misdemeanor over message board comments...

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Calm down, Girlfriend! Did you read my post? I'll retract!!! I'll retract!!! Don't begin the pursuit of legal action against Ol' Bob. --Good paragraph there, Blue.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

21-4004Chapter 21.--CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTSPART II.--PROHIBITED CONDUCTArticle 40.--CRIMES INVOLVING VIOLATIONS OF PERSONAL RIGHTS 21-4004. Criminal defamation. (a) Criminal defamation is communicating to a person orally, in writing, or by any other means, information, knowing the information to be false and with actual malice, tending to expose another living person to public hatred, contempt or ridicule; tending to deprive such person of the benefits of public confidence and social acceptance; or tending to degrade and vilify the memory of one who is dead and to scandalize or provoke surviving relatives and friends. (b) In all prosecutions under this section the truth of the information communicated shall be admitted as evidence. It shall be a defense to a charge of criminal defamation if it is found that such matter was true. (c) Criminal defamation is a class A nonperson misdemeanor. History: L. 1969, ch. 180, § 21-4004; L. 1992, ch. 239, § 187; L. 1993, ch. 291, § 135; L. 1995, ch. 251, § 14; July 1.

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blue73harley 5 years, 10 months ago

"The point is we should all be better environmental stewards, regardless of whether it makes the planet warm up or not. We should strive to live cleaner, greener lives and to leave the planet better than it was before us."Completely agree with this. Completely disagree with Al's camp making money off the hype and trying elevate the issue to a national emergency.

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

also, what does acationable mean?

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

Yep, those pesky typos!"lebibelous" is kinda like "babbleous", which is what some of the posters around here are.Yep, I'm POed and also dead serious about serving notice.I am tired of a few of the posters aournd here and their lies, Ad Hominem attacks and libelous accusations and if they think that I am not serious, just hang around and watch.

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Marion -But we've been getting along so well lately. And on a topic we sort of agree on. If it'll make you happy, I'll retract my post. Hugs and Kisses!--Blessed3x - I think it is generally accepted that Al Gore has been exposed as a Dope and Fraud. By the way, what happened to all those hurricanes he promised us? Has a hurricane even made landfall in the US since his filmed ppt. presentation came out? People are sick of talking about him. I'm sure the next time a hurricane hits the US, he'll come out of hiding and say, "I told you so!!!" If this is another slow to non-existent hurricane season I guarantee that Global Warming will be blamed for it.

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blue73harley 5 years, 10 months ago

Hmmmm...what is a "lebibelous"? It must be really bad because Marion sounds PO'd.

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

"lebibelous"?Slow down,skippy.You'llspillyourvokdaifyou'renotcareful.

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Drew Alan 5 years, 10 months ago

I think unfortunately everybody argues right vs. left and anthropogenic (human caused) vs. natural and completely misses the point. The point is we should all be better environmental stewards, regardless of whether it makes the planet warm up or not. We should strive to live cleaner, greener lives and to leave the planet better than it was before us.

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blessed3x 5 years, 10 months ago

Am I the only one that thinks it's ironic how the story on Al Gore's INCREASE in energy use has been posted twice but no one has commented on it? The prince of global warming hysteria is the biggest hypocrit of all and no one calls him on it?

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

TOB:You have made a lebibelous accusation and I challenge you to prove it.Your accusation, even though posted on a public forum is acationable aand if you do not retract it, I wlll serve proper notice on the LJW to begin the pursuit of legal action.

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oldvet 5 years, 10 months ago

Human civilization is entirely dependent on reasonably predictable weather patterns.What a joke!!! The guys who predict weather would be stars in MLB... getting it right 33% of the time with their predictions of what will happen in the next 24 hours... beyond 24 hours, forget it...

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

Big Al -Yes, the Ogallalalalala is low. It is low because too many people want to grow corn and beans in a climate that really isn't suited for those crops, not because of global warming.The Arkansas was been a wash ditch for at least 30 years, probably longer and that is because Eastern Colorado takes it all. Not because of global warming.Those problems are definately man-made, I will agree with you there, but the letter writer was using the same tired old scare tactics about associating droughts, floods, twisters, etc... and acting like they've never happened before.

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BigAl 5 years, 10 months ago

Hmmmm, and to think that I actually thought that this Dr fellow might be right about the Ogallala Aquafier. But, since that doesn't fit the mold for a lot of you, we will simply condemn his entire letter. While we are at it, let's continue to ignore the fact that the Arkansas River is bone dry in SW Kansas.

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The_Original_Bob 5 years, 10 months ago

"Now, Bob, you know that posting links to external sites is against the TOS of the LJW!" Marion/Girlfriend.No it isn't. Posting links that direct people to sites that are set-up to gather folk's information so you can illegally spam them is against the LJW policy. Linking to other news sources is ok.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

http://www2.ljworld.com/site/rules/" (Not)....to promote other web sites, without our express written approval, or where expressly permitted".

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

"...innocuous missive..." Been into the Roget's, have we?

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

Here's ignati5's second post on this forum:"Great letter. Cal sucks, and it's nice for people to say so."I am appalled to find that even an innocuous column about Barack Obana by a respected columnist can draw dozens of hostile responses from users who sound like refugees from left-wing talk radio call-ins. There certainly are a lot of people who don't have lives out there.

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blue73harley 5 years, 10 months ago

Well, harumph! I am just appalled, shocked and verklempt to find out that I don't have a life because I disagree with Al and his minion Steve.

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ignati5 5 years, 10 months ago

I just started using this comment site . I am appalled to find that even an innocuous missive about Global Warming by a local physician can draw dozens of hostile responses from users who sound like refugees from right-wing talk radio call-ins. There certainly are a lot of people who don't have lives out there. IVK

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malcolm_x_obama 5 years, 10 months ago

I didn't read the story, just the headline. Explain how clamidia change causes global warming?

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gr 5 years, 10 months ago

"Translation: Everything is evidence of global warming,"Kansas, as bozo would say, now you're getting it - that is as long as it supports his belief system. Everything else is just your opinion and bad science.Interesting that he's one of the Pascal's wager viewpoint on global alarmism in that it may not be anything, but it's better to do all we can, rather than not doing anything and suffering the consequences. So, if we must do everything, what about the SLT? The shortest distance between two points is a straight line. The straighter the line, the less gas spent. The less gas spent, the less imaginary pollution made. Since everything must be done, then south of the river would be nonconducive to "saving the planet". Every little bit helps. Less oil used to make the road, upkeep the road, and travel on the road.But this doesn't meet his goal, so he'll say hogwash. Wait for it....

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JSpizias 5 years, 10 months ago

Perhaps the good physician should read some of the climate literature so that he can be more knowledgeable about climate. From Nature:Advancing decadal-scale climate prediction in the North Atlantic sectorN. S. Keenlyside1, M. Latif1, J. Jungclaus2, L. Kornblueh2 & E. Roeckner2......."Our results suggest that global surface temperature may not increase over the next decade, as natural climate variations in the North Atlantic and tropical Pacific temporarily offset the projected anthropogenic warming."From Science:Southern Hemisphere and Deep-Sea Warming Led Deglacial Atmospheric CO2 Rise and Tropical WarmingLowell Stott,1* Axel Timmermann,2 Robert Thunell3 ...".Deep-sea temperatures warmed by ~2°C between 19 and 17 thousand years before the present (ky B.P.), leading the rise in atmospheric CO2 and tropicalsurface-ocean warming by ~1000 years. The cause of this deglacial deep-water warming does not lie within the tropics, nor can its early onset between 19 and 17 ky B.P. be attributed to CO2 forcing. Increasing austral-spring insolation combined with sea-ice albedo feedbacks appear to be the key factors responsible for this warming."The Kyoto approach to climate change focusing on CO2 is an abysmal failure. I suggest he read "The Wrong Trousers" by Prins and Rayner.http://www.martininstitute.ox.ac.uk/JMI/News/archive/Discussion+paper+-+The+Wrong+Trousers.htmAs far as trying to assign disasters to global warming he should examine the work of Roger Pielke Jr. (and also his father, Roger Sr.)http://sciencepolicy.colorado.edu/about_us/meet_us/roger_pielke/http://climatesci.org/http://sciencepolicy.colorado.edu/prometheus/archives/disasters/index.html#001391"The hurricane expert, Kerry Emanuel of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, this week unveiled a novel technique for predicting hurricane activity. The new work suggests that, even in a dramatically warming world, hurricane frequency and intensity may not substantially rise during the next two centuries.........The research, appearing in the March issue of Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society, is all the more remarkable coming from Emanuel, a highly visible leader in his field and long an ardent proponent of a link between global warming and much stronger hurricanes."

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Flap Doodle 5 years, 10 months ago

The mass spanking over on larryville this morning raised the local temp a couple of degrees.

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Robert bickers 5 years, 10 months ago

Pdecell: Sorry, that should have read two decades. True, there might not be a connection at all - it was more of a comment on the stupidity of blaming CO2 for all the planet's woes. The GW crowd has killed the conservation movement and scored all the funding that could go towards real problems we can affect.http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/2008/06/08/surprise-earths-biosphere-is-booming-co2-the-cause/

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 10 months ago

Nice try, k778, but your ideological preference will do anything to counter the science produced by climate scientists.

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kansas778 5 years, 10 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says: Actually, it's both, but climate change better describes the fact that the effects of global warming will vary greatly across the planet. But generally speaking, climate change means a combination of greater volatility in weather patterns, which certainly includes the flooding to the north, and dramatic changes in climate patterns- low rainfall in areas which once had more, or vice-versa, along with changes in mean temperatures as well as greater temperature extremes.*******Translation: Everything is evidence of global warming, so it must be true. Oh, and BTW, everything is also evidence that a god exists, so that must be true as well.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 10 months ago

That must mean you have great faith in his ability as a doctor, Kevin.

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RestoreReason 5 years, 10 months ago

If this doctor is going to accept bad science as the basis of an LOE, I have little faith in his ability as a doctor.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 5 years, 10 months ago

"except it's no longer "Global Warming": after record cold winters the name had to be changed to "Climate Change":"Actually, it's both, but climate change better describes the fact that the effects of global warming will vary greatly across the planet. But generally speaking, climate change means a combination of greater volatility in weather patterns, which certainly includes the flooding to the north, and dramatic changes in climate patterns-- low rainfall in areas which once had more, or vice-versa, along with changes in mean temperatures as well as greater temperature extremes.Human civilization is entirely dependent on reasonably predictable weather patterns. Losing this predictability is the very real and serious risk that climate change presents.

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Marion Lynn 5 years, 10 months ago

I rather like the "Pope Prius I" that some wag around here came up with!Can't claim that one but wish I could!

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oldvet 5 years, 10 months ago

except it's no longer "Global Warming"... after record cold winters the name had to be changed to "Climate Change"...or to be more correct "The Universal Temple of Climate Change", reading from the holy book written by the Imperial Wizard AlGore...

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Tom Shewmon 5 years, 10 months ago

Why doesn't the global warming guru, Al Gore, ever mention the "Maunder Minimum", among several other theories counter to his global warming hoax? Why is Al Gore so wealthy? http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article3022274.ece

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autie 5 years, 10 months ago

A. we should do all can to minimize emissions into the atmosphere and become better stewards of all resources.2. there will always be cycles of climatic changes no matter what theory of thought one prescribes to. The current weather patterns are just part of it..records are made to be broken.C. S**T Happens.

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blue73harley 5 years, 10 months ago

I get deleted because of a reference to Henny Penny! Somebody sure has some thin skin!To reiterate...THE SKY IS FALLING!

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gr 5 years, 10 months ago

Where was Stevie when last year the hurricane season was basically non-existent? He'd be saying one year doesn't mean anything. But yet, when a few tornadoes and storms come through, there is a matching correlation. Wasn't there fewer tornadoes this year compared to the year which all the current conditions were matching up with?"There is no evidence that the increase in crop yields you mention is due to increased carbon dioxide in the atmosphere."Just a fun with correlations, huh, but any storm correlation with CO2 is real? Selective correlations.http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2007/05/fun-with-correlations/#more-433

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devobrun 5 years, 10 months ago

"This correlates with record atmospheric CO2 levels and record high temperatures for most of the past decade."Modern science has computers. Correlations are easy to accomplish on computers. Correlation = Causation is the most abused equation in modern science. Science is test Dr. Bruner. Correlation is used in real science only to indicate where a test should be conducted. Climate studies are not tests. Modern scince has greatly overstepped its ability to test.Global warming is the modern day equivalent of blood-letting, Dr. B.

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Ragingbear 5 years, 10 months ago

I love how everyone and their momma suddenly becomes some sort of scientist after they watch 30 minutes of a 2 hour documentary on the Discovery Channel. There is no real evidence that the low activity in the solar cycle had anything to do with the Little Ice Age. Instead, it was most likely the rapid increase in global volcanic activity during that period, as evidenced by geologist and studies of arctic pack ice. You see, I actually bothered to watch the entire documentary.

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BigAl 5 years, 10 months ago

But, the good Dr does have a point about the Ogallala Aquafier. That thing is being drained dry by the irrigation farmers. The Arkansas River in Southwest Kansas has now been dry for several years due to irrigation.

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Tom Shewmon 5 years, 10 months ago

If nothing else, which is a close approximation of this letter, Dr. Burner certainly seems to have vindicated the esteemed Gov. Sebelius, who now it appears just HAS to be on the cutting edge of global warming cause and effect. I mean, it's not as though probably 8 out of 10 professors are Sebelius supporters or anything! We need those like Bruner, along with a governor with a keen eye for business to help lead us rural folk, a large part of the Kansas population, out of the dense rural woods of ignorance.I think a Kansas slogan could be "Welcome to Kansas, now hand over your wallets and checkbooks please".

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jumpin_catfish 5 years, 10 months ago

Bilions of years of earth history and now we have proof that the current weather is a result of bad humans fouling up things. I'm not convinced.

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Paul Decelles 5 years, 10 months ago

Jimbo,There is no evidence that the increase in crop yields you mention is due to increased carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. That is merely a supposition based on the fact that carbon dioxide is needed for photosynthesis. However, there are other factors that affect crop production and the data on crop yields and carbon dioxide production under real field conditions is ambiguous at best.For example:http://news.mongabay.com/2006/0629-crops.htmlhttp://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2002/11/1122_021125_CropYields.html

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blue73harley 5 years, 10 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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cato_the_elder 5 years, 10 months ago

Interesting header, which might have led one to believe that this letter was grounded in reality instead of myth. For some time now the "Global Warming" crowd have used national weather stories as "evidence" of their pet theories, while vigorously denying that winters like the one we just experienced are inconsistent with their newly-found religion. People of common sense and pragmatic skepticism have caught on to this, many scientists world-wide are vigorously debunking it, the pendulum's swinging back and in the not too-distant future a level of equilibrium will have been reached and the religion will quietly die away. And, by the way, this physician letter writer's use of the title "Dr." before his name when writing about an issue that is not directly related to medicine is offensive. There was a time in the past when respected physicians would have known better - but during those times lawyers didn't advertise either.

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b3 5 years, 10 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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VTHawk 5 years, 10 months ago

Lots of liberals have predicted for years that we would have record hurricane seasons, flooding, tornados, etc as a result of global warming. I am not trying to argue that they are definately not related, but seriously: BAD WEATHER HAPPENS. The idea that humans can observe increases in bad weather is absurd.While I definately feel for the residents of New Orleans, the city was built below sea level. Reminds me that "the wise man built his house upon a rock". Treacherous flooding and tornadic activity is part of life in the Midwest.

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Robert bickers 5 years, 10 months ago

Blame solar cycles for global (actually northern hemispheric) warming, not mankind. We've just entered one that mimics the beginning of the "Little Ice Age."As for the record rainfalls (and extraordinary late snowfalls out west), those are a result of COOLING, not warming. 2008 is experiencing some of the coolest temperatures measured in the last hundred years. Cooler temps + La Nina = heavy precipitation. We'd do well to remember that water vapor makes up most of the greenhouse gasses - CO2 is a trace element in the atmosphere.(BTW: global crop yields have increased 6% in the last decade due to all that evil, nasty CO2 we keep exhaling.)Get rid of pollution in the air, not CO2.

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