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Archive for Friday, December 26, 2008

Bush mess

December 26, 2008

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To the editor:

It came as little surprise to find out last week that Vice President Cheney (flouting the Presidential Records Act) now says that he’s not required to release ANY records pertaining to what he’s been doing the last eight years.

It’s my opinion that if even 10 percent of what the Bush administration has actually done becomes public knowledge after they leave office, Bush and Co. won’t be “clearing brush” in Crawford, Texas; they’ll be pounding rock in prison.

Brought forth by nonpartisan agencies and groups, there are many, many legitimate suspicions of legal (and constitutional) wrongdoing, perpetrated by the Bush administration. For the sake of our country, investigate what this criminal administration has done in our name. Unfortunately, cleaning up Bush’s toxic mess will take political courage, hence you’ll understand why I’m less than hopeful.

Daniel Patrick Schamle,
Lawrence

Comments

BigPrune 6 years, 1 month ago

I involuntarily rolled my eyes when I was through reading this letter to the editor. Amazing. Don't worry letter writer, Mr. Obama is the messiah. When he gets back from Hawaii and takes over, things will be squeaky clean.Just as soon as his Senate seat gets sold off to the highest bidder, but of course he has been cleared of any wrong doing.

1029 6 years, 1 month ago

I sort of agree with Prune. I was thinking about Christmas and the messiah and realized that it's probably Obama that's the second coming of Him. I don't know that things will be squeaky clean because the rapture will inevitably be inevitable in the end. (Now I just hope it's not in my lifetime. Let my kids see that. lol ;))

Flap Doodle 6 years, 1 month ago

Wonder what the O'dude is smoking these days........

Richard Heckler 6 years, 1 month ago

Courtesy of Admiral "Iran Contra Criminal" Poindexter for GW Bush:http://www.aclu.org/privacy/spying/23279res20051229.htmlcLying to the nation and congress about WMD'sCreating a mideast war for oil control under false pretensesSecret oil and energy dealsIt is better that no prosecutions have taken place due to the pardoning powers of the president. Just maybe prison time could take place. Sweeping white collar crimes under the rugs comitted by elected officials is not working.Think back to Watergate,Iran Contra,Savings and loan scandal to the very bush Bush admin of today seems to reveal a pattern of big time crime philosophy within the republican party.It seems to breed corruption down to our local levels of government as well. Plenty of material within the last two years locally. Jail may be the only tool left to stop such unacceptable behavior. Sweeping matters under the proverbial rug is not working.

Weezy_Jefferson 6 years, 1 month ago

It never ceases to amaze me how some people will defend Bush and his administration no matter what. I guess it's easier to pick on Obama than admit to the stupidity that's been poisoning our country---and the world---for the past 8 years.

Phil Minkin 6 years, 1 month ago

Level of dialog on this board: Somene says "1. Bush lied about getting us into a war and then horribly mismanaged it. 2. Reacted slowly and poorly to Katrina 3. Threatened the environment and ignored science 4. Illegally expanded Presidential Power and eroded the Bill of Rights 5. Degregulated and ignored us into financial disaster".Response: "Oh yeah, well Obama is the Messiah and Bill Clinton got a BJ"

Godot 6 years, 1 month ago

The only connection I can imagine between this letter and Obama is that it would not surprise me if Bush and the RNC had made a deal with the Dems that they would help get Obama elected in exchange for a "by" on the last 8 years. That would explain so many things.....

Compy 6 years, 1 month ago

well, if they were stupid enough to vote for GWB the first time, even before he proved to the country (and world) how inept, imoral, unintelligent, criminal, unpatriotic, and treasonous he is, what makes you think they will start thinking intelligently now?it must really sting to live in a country whose leader is black when you are a rascist, ignorant pig who likes being led on a leash by a white guy who's got you convinced he's a good ole boy just like your wife's cousin's in-laws who got you that cush city job not NOT keeping our streets safe and clean.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

And if "W" had been a Liberal Democrat, all of this would have been OK.

jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

Weezy_Jefferson (Anonymous) says… "It never ceases to amaze me how some people will defend Bush and his administration no matter what."It never ceases to amaze me how mind-numbingly stupid someone has to be to read the comments and then post the above. Hey Weezy, point to the comment where someone is defending Bush. There ain't one! Takin' shots at BO is not defending Bush, no matter which way you wanna spin it. "It came as little surprise to find out last week that Vice President Cheney (flouting the Presidential Records Act) now says that he’s not required to release ANY records pertaining to what he’s been doing the last eight years."As to the LTE, I'd prefer this garbage would just be given a rest. But to the above statement, is Cheney within his rights to invoke the PRA? If so, I imagine you'd be a fool to be surprised he invokes such. And Compy, it might be helpful and lend your diatribe some credence if, when you opt to call others 'ignorant' and 'unintelligent', you spell difficult words like immoral and racist correctly.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"There ain't one! Takin' shots at BO is not defending Bush, no matter which way you wanna spin it."Seriously, where have you been posting for the past year? That is virtually the only way that defending Bush has been carried out since 2004 at least.

jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

"Lying to the nation and congress about WMD'sCreating a mideast war for oil control under false pretenses"Too much turkey or merrill's posts are just making me sick to my stomach. Talk about spreading lies.........Neither of the above statements is remotely true, and have been deemed false by a Democratic led investigative committee into the whole Iraq situation. Too many keep spewing that bile, and it just ain't so. The info on WMD's was commonly held by the CIA, the Brits, and every other reputable agency we trust. Pelosi, Bill, Hillary, Biden, Edwards, Reid, and many others on the liberal side were talking on national political shows about the WMD's in Iraq and how military action was basically inevitable because diplomacy had not worked and Sadaam had breached conditions of the post-Storm resolutions. And that was before Bush even took office!!!But let's not let the truth get in the way of a good hate fest. And for this non-stop conspiracy theory about a war for oil, where is it, merrill? Anyone else? We haven't imported a drop of Iraqi oil, not one. A war for oil? Riiiiight. Take another pill.Bush may be the most inept Prez of all time, time will tell. But he isn't so stupid as to throw trillions of dollars into a war for the sole purpose of commandeering oil that will never equate to the amount spent. "I want that kids sneakers. Go buy me 10 Uzi's and 10 Sig-Sauers so I can get those $100 sneaks".

jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

No offense, jonas, but the above commenters who take shots at BO did nothing in the way of defending Bush. Perhaps you're right as to motivation or rationale, but still doesn't make it a 'defense'.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"Perhaps you're right as to motivation or rationale, but still doesn't make it a 'defense'."Yes, clever isn't it? Use it as a dodge so you don't have to defend something largely indefensible.

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

Bush used terror to fight terror. Every time he wanted something done, he would pull out the wmd threat. Bush has seeded the wind and Obama has inherited the whirlwind. No one thinks Obama is perfect and has not made his share of mistakes. Read his books! But, he has a solid core that will not be shaken by hard times. He knows when to talk and when to fight. He knows that we must communicate with other countries and approach them as friends. They are not all against us. Bush, like Nixon, is driven by inner devils, and found others like him, to help him implement him ideas. I feel sorry for him.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 1 month ago

Bush is clearly the figurehead of the most failed administration in American history.Whining about a BJ, or the fact that America is hopeful after 8 years of pecimism and failure can't change that.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 1 month ago

Poll: 75% glad Bush is doneStory CNN/Opinion Research Corp. poll finds broad dissatisfaction with Bush presidency31 percent say Bush has been good president; 40 percent call his presidency "poor"28 percent rate Bush the worst president ever82 percent say he did not unite the country; 17 percent say he didhttp://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/26/bush.poll/index.html

Kyle Reed 6 years, 1 month ago

All the talk aside, people need to get it straight. Clinton getting a BJ was not the issue. The fact he committed purjury on more than one occasion most certainly was. Aside from that if getting a BJ wasn't a big deal why do you supposed he lied about it?

Phil Minkin 6 years, 1 month ago

Akreed (Anonymous) says… Aside from that if getting a BJ wasn't a big deal why do you supposed he lied about it?I'll assume you aren't married.

Kyle Reed 6 years, 1 month ago

Being married isn't a valid excuse for being a liar under oath. Especially considering you're the President of the United States.

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

If you are willing to break the oath you made when you were married, then you will break the oath you make when you are sworn in as President. Don't make a promise you are not prepared to keep. In what way is Bush a war criminal? I don't get that. He made some really bad decisions, some of which were backed up by Congress and by many of the American people. But, legally? Nixon was impeached because he broke the law.

jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

jonas: "Yes, clever isn't it? Use it as a dodge so you don't have to defend something largely indefensible."Well, otherwise it would be a bit like holding the ocean back with a collander. Point taken, though. You win again, Mr. Bond.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

"anxiousatheist (Clint Gentry) says… “And if “W” had been a Liberal Democrat, all of this would have been OK.” - GuardianWow, your ability to predict what would have happen in an alternate universe is uncanny, it's so awesome that you can actually claim something like this with a straight face. Why don't you put your real name on the site and we'll see what sort of ridiculous statements you come up with…"Nor can you prove it isn't so...It makes as much sense as most of the other excriment being spewed forth.

Kyle Reed 6 years, 1 month ago

"Would you explain then why it's OK for W and the puppet master to refuse to give statements under oath? Other than fact they everyone knows they do not know how to not lie?"This question is completely irrelavent to the common downplaying of Clinton's actions as..."c'mon he just got a BJ". That is what I was addressing.

Kyle Reed 6 years, 1 month ago

What possible difference could it make if his name is listed after his log in ID? Do you honestly think your points are considered by anybody to be more valid because it says (Clint Gentry) next to anxiousatheist?

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

"anxiousatheist (Clint Gentry) says… “guardian” you still won't put your name on it…"And we know Clint Gentry is your real name because...?

Kyle Reed 6 years, 1 month ago

"You right wingers never get your facts right." Wrong and ridiculous. "Nixon was never impeached."Correct and unfortunate, though his resigning served pretty much the same purpose.

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

I am not a right winger. I consider myself to be liberal and I loathe Bush. Have I ever said otherwise? Could I please ask that when someone disagrees with me or has facts that I do not, that they point this out to me in a polite fashion. Something like, I beg to differ with you Cleopatra, but-" I really prefer that to, "get your head out."I appreciate being corrected. I was guilty of sloppy and lazy thinking. I got on the Internet and found out that:Nixon resigned August 8, 1974 and:"a federal judge rejected President Bush’s claim that his “constitutional authority as commander in chief trumped” the FISA wiretapping law. Judge Vaughn Walker explicitly stated that the President is bound by FISA: Congress appears clearly to have intended to — and did — establish the exclusive means for foreign intelligence activities to be conducted. Whatever power the executive may otherwise have had in this regard, FISA limits the power of the executive branch to conduct such activities and it limits the executive branch’s authority to assert the state secrets privilege in response to challenges to the legality of its foreign intelligence surveillance activities.In other words, when Bush contravened the FISA law by authorizing warrant less wiretaps through the National Security Agency, he broke the law."I stand corrected and I will do my homework next time, you can be sure of that.Bush could still be impeached after he leaves office. Conviction on impeachment charges requires 60 votes in the Senate, and it is possible that Democrats could end up controlling as many as 55 Senate seats, if not more. The split in the House is also likely to widen in favor of the Democrats. Technically, Speaker Pelosi only took impeachment “off the table” for the 110th Congress.Write your congressperson.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

Bush probably would have fared better if he had not crucified Christ, plotted the assassinations of Lincoln, Dr. King, JFK and RFK, kidnapped the Lindberg baby, created and personally distributed the HIV virus, initiated the eruption of Mt. Vesuvius, ordered the bombing of Pearl Harbor and orchestrated the Axis Powers, etc., etc., etc.

jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

"I am not a right winger. I consider myself to be liberal and I loathe Bush. Have I ever said otherwise? "Unfortunately, Cleo, this will happen quite often. I've been referred to as a liberal and a neo-con, a right wingnut and a left wingnut, etc. etc. State anything contrary to one side's heavy bias and it'll happen time and again to ya, darlin'. Stay strong, though, and as you did above admit when you're mistaken and you'll fare better and more sincere than many on these strings. Like your posts and thoughtfulness. Don't give up.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

Maybe so, but that still doesn't negate the fact that those of you who were mesmerized by the False Messiah Elect blame Bush for everything bad in America today, yet whenever anyone takes Slick Willie's name in vain you cry foul. At least I didn't learn my history from a revisionist's textbook.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

portanigra: As I'm sure you know, it won't last. A largely pointless act, like disciplining spoiled children that aren't yours, but I do try and take into consideration other people's feelings and requests.Now I'm gonna sit back and observe on my new theory.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 1 month ago

The right has gone off the deep end, refusing to accept any responsibility for their sound defeat in the last elections and the loss of their own party.Instead, they scream and cry...and lie.Lie lie lie lie lie.Liars, it is pathetic, they are pathetic.I for one am glad to see the moderates take back the republican party. Maybe we can work together to get things done by people who have values instead of simply take sides. People who love America instead people who love their own party.Extreme dems do the same thing, and I denounce them as well...but the extreme right is out of control, here is the lastest list of debunked lies they have tried to pass off as the truth:# President-elect Obama never promised to seek a ban on all semi-automatic weapons, as claimed by some fearful gun owners.# And no, Obama did not propose a Gestapo-like civilian security force as claimed by a Republican member of Congress from Georgia and any number of overwrought bloggers.# Democrats in Congress are not discussing any plan to confiscate the assets in 401(k) retirement accounts, another falsehood spread about by chain e-mails and Internet postings.# House Speaker Nancy Pelosi did not demand a 757-size personal jet, a false claim resurrected when Democrats criticized Big Three executives for flying to D.C. on their own private jets to beg for aid.# And Pelosi's husband doesn't own a $17 million stake in a food company that she may (or may not) have tried to help with an exemption from a new minimum wage law.http://www.newsweek.com/id/176836?GT1=43002

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

AjiDeGallina,In a way, you are correct and in a way, you are wrong. I am obviously a staunch conservative. I really do blame the Republican Party, my party, for allowing the Messiah to win. You see, we did not give a Conservative candidate the nod. We ran McCain instead. John McCain was considered a very strong friend and ally to the Liberal side of the government until he ran for President (a la McCain-Feingold). It amazes ne how despised he became by your side when he was your good friend before. I believe McCain was a disposable candidate in 2008 much the same as Dole was in 1996. The spineless of my party didn't want to fight, trying to distance themselves from the President, so they "gave" us an oxymoron, a Liberal Republican. As far as what the Messiah has or has not said in spoken word, I think you will find his voting record on firearms legislation speaks volumes and certainly contradicts your above post.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

I remind you that President Bush also tried to reach across the aisle and end a lot of bi-partisan politics. Look how many times he consulted Kennedy. All your side did was laugh and accuse him of everything under the sun. Bush did what you are asking and you hate him for it. You just never got over the fact he "stole" the election from Gore in 2000. This is the price we Republicans are paying. We will fix that come 2010.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"We will fix that come 2010."Probably not. It's never seemed to me that Republicans are any better at fixing anything than their Democratic counterparts.

Newell_Post 6 years, 1 month ago

Here is the problem faced by the Republican Party: it has devolved into a coalition of two factions that have almost nothing in common: - religious fundamentalist (theo-fascists), and - neo-libertarian financial interestsThe former believe that government should aggressively control the most private aspects of personal lives and the latter believe that government only just barely exist and should stay out of almost everything. This coalition was assembled just to muster enough votes to win elections, but is not sustainable over time due to the fundamentally different world views or the two factions.If the Republican leadership plays aggressively to the theo-fascist faction, the neo-libertarians are alienated and will vote with the Democrats and vice-versa. This time out, they played to the neo-libertarians, and it didn't work. They need a whole new model if they want to win elections in the future.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 1 month ago

Guardian (Anonymous) says…I remind you that President Bush also tried to reach across the aisle and end a lot of bi-partisan politics.***********81% of the nation, Republicans and Democrats alike, find this not to be the case, Guardian.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

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Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

Where are the new generation of Woodward and Bernstein? The truth is hard to get at, people want to present a certain view of themselves, true or not. This is human nature. Some things can not be proved one way or the other. There are conflicting versions, without proof, who do you believe? However, this is happening now, and it is fresh, so some truths should be available. We only know what the media tells us. When I watch the news I think back to the movie, V for Vendetta, and yell bollix at the television.bol·lix also bol·lox (blks)tr.v. bol·lixed also bol·loxed, bol·lix·ing also bol·lox·ing, bol·lix·es also bol·lox·es InformalTo throw into confusion; botch or bungle: managed to bollix up the whole project.[Alteration of ballocks, testicles, from Middle English balloks, from Old English beallucas; see bhel-2 in Indo-European roots.] See, I am learning. Do not put anything on my posting that I cannot properly document. I had no idea I was dealing with such precise and scholarly people.

Jim Phillips 6 years, 1 month ago

Perhaps 81% of the nation. Republicans and Democrats alike, should do more that just listen to the talking heads and investigate for themselves. I do believe Obama is the best thing that could happen to the Conservatives.

Godot 6 years, 1 month ago

The worst thing a president can do is to assume that he, or the Congress, or any agency of the government, can steer the economy. The history of this country shows that the more government attempts to "fix" the economy, the worse the conditions become. Bush's failing is that he focused the attention of this government on preventing physical terrorist attacks, while a form of financial terrorism was going on under his nose. The financial perfidy that had its seeds in the 90's and grew to a behemoth in the last 8 years could have been stopped by diligent enforcement of existing laws, as is the proper role for government with regards to the economy. Since that was not done, and the agencies responsible for oversight failed in their duty, the world economy is near collapse. Bush has made the fatal error of following the advice of the same people who are on president-elect Obama's financial team, to provide taxpayer funded intervention in the markets, in an attempt to "fix" things. This is a disaster.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

PortaNigra (Anonymous) says…katara:When you consider that the vast majority of Americans never serve a day in the military, I think we need to respect any time spent in uniform, regardless if it's 30 years or just 3 years.I met the guy some people said was Wicklow in September. He was not a “lard butt”. I'm guessing he was 6'3” or 6'4” and maybe between 200 and 210. He was obviously in good shape. He was also quite tan, which makes me doubt that he spends much time on forums (unless he's posting from a beach).~~~~~~~~ I'm sure you did. And I guess you've never heard of a tan in a bottle? 'Cause having a tan really proves a lot other than perhaps one is a bit vain about one's appearance. Especially given that "Mr. Wicklow" was particularly focused (and you too, oddly enough) on others' physical features. I'll bet Mr. Wicklow is so vain he probably thought Carly Simon wrote a song about him.And military service is no more deserving any more respect than any other type of service such as public service, social service or community service. We all have a job to do that we chose to do and there is nothing inherent about military service that makes it a more worthy profession than any other. I'm not exactly where your standard of just because the majority of Americans haven't done it, it makes it worthy of respect. That is a bit perplexing. Does that mean if the majority of Americans have not molested a child, then we need to respect child molesters?

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

PortaNigra (Anonymous) says...katara:Please tell us that you were not serious in your last post.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~About the military not being anymore special than anyone else? Sure I was. As for the determination as to why military service is worthy of respect, you set the standard, bub. Not I. It was a pretty bad standard for you to set, don't you agree now that you have a chance to re-read it?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Mr_Nancy_Boy_To_You (Tom Shewmon) says…But short, fat and bald is not exactly a gift from god either. And editing medical research books is alot safer than a firing .50 caliber machine at Al Qaeda.~~~~~~~~~~~~You shouldn't be so hard on yourself, Tom. I'd have to disagree on your assessment of which is a safer profession there too, friend. One could get a nasty papercut from editing the books and have it infected by MRSA and have a slow painful death. I'd prefer the bullet. Wouldn't you?And what say you about the military personnel that perform medical research book editing? Are you daring to deny them the respect PortaNigra believes they deserve just by the mere fact they served at some point in time in some sort of fashion?

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

Katara, you have the thinking skills of a lobotomized flea. My father was in the army, the Big Red One, and he was killed in Korea. He volunteered to go because he felt strongly that was his duty. So, until I actually meet Wicklow, I am not going to say anything about him. I have great respect for the warrior. I think ours need better leadership both off and on the field.

ASBESTOS 6 years, 1 month ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 1 month ago

of course, nancy, you are a known liar so anything you say should only be laughed at.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"Like Lincoln, history will prove President Bush a great man."Or it won't. Predicting the historical take on Bush from the bias of today sounds just as arrogant and vapid when you do it to praise him as when others do it to unnecessarily vilify him. But Vietnam and the War on Communism is likely a much better comparison with Iraq and the War on Terror than the Civil War. How are the Vietnam presidents generally regarded these days?

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

cleopatra: "So, until I actually meet Wicklow, I am not going to say anything about him."If it helps your thought-process, the above reference on my getting him booted was due to the fact that, while engaged in a rather pointless sniping about how to spell incompetent, and how its mispelling somehow invalidated all of my previous arguments, he got into my myspace profile, where frankly he's not particularly welcome, went through that into my wife's profile, found a picture of her, linked to it publicly on this site, and included a derogatory comment about her appearance and general physical unattractiveness. I have heard that this was not the first time, nor I the first opponent, that he has done this too.And that thread's last comment was Dec. 18th, so over a week ago, and it's been out of most-discussed since then, so the idea of someone just stumbling across it unknowingly is, I must say, difficult to swallow. Especially when included with ludicrous fight talk.But I should probably stop there. I did, after all, promise my wife that I wouldn't talk to him anymore.

christy kennedy 6 years, 1 month ago

Daniel, You're absolutely right. It's pretty simple. Those who break laws are criminals. Those who try to spin reality, or actually don't know the difference between right and wrong or criminal and legal behavior, are merely deluding themselves. And those in positions of power and authority who break the law should be very, very ashamed of themselves -- and at the very least, held accountable like anyone else.

Flap Doodle 6 years, 1 month ago

Fitz investigating the O'dude's staff?"The Illinois House committee investigating a possible impeachment of Gov. Rod Blagojevich won't subpoena two incoming White House advisers, the committee chairwoman said Saturday, shutting down a request from the governor's attorney.In a letter received by the committee Friday, U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald asked the special investigative committee specifically to not subpoena President-elect Barack Obama adviser Valerie Jarrett, incoming chief of staff Rahm Emanuel, U.S. Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. and Nils Larsen, a Tribune Co. executive vice president.Fitzgerald said any such subpoenas "would interfere with the ongoing criminal investigation into the activities of Governor Rod Blagojevich and others."http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/12/27/national/main4687787.shtmlWhat a mess.....

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"Modern comparisons are of little value in an historical contexts."Uh, right, then why did you start that, then?For the rest, I suppose you can blame a huge swath of the population and call them biased, but you're post is rather anemic of facts, long on opinions that are portrayed as facts, and as such perhaps you should consider the possibility that you, yourself, are just as biased as the "hippie scum" that you so openly revile.

jayhawklawrence 6 years, 1 month ago

The events that occurred during the Bush Administration were a perfect storm which reminds me of the punishment God gave to the Israelites in the Old Testament when they became dominated by their sin and foolishness. Ironically, it is the failure of largely Republican ideas and leadership that brought about this perfect storm of failure.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

O_Bugpoo (Anonymous) says… The disdain for the military continues to creep out of the left. Katara has sunk to an all time low for this forum and its rabid, intolerant leftists. Katara believes there is an equity in service between the Postman and the Veteran.~~~~~~~~~~Interesting how one reads disdain into one just simply not deserving more respect simply because one is in the military. Odd. So apparently the Americans who serve in other capacities, such as the police or the firefighters are not worthy of respect according to O_Bugpoo and apparently 80% of all Americans because they did not serve in the military according to PortaNigra aren't either. Interesting. Perhaps they would prefer countries that military service is mandatory? I understand that certain African countries frequently conscript children into the army, perhaps that system would be more to their liking. I like George Washington too. He had a great wisdom. I prefer this quote..."Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism. "~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Ms. Swearingen,I don't disagree that the military needs better leadership. Perhaps now with a change in the administration, we will actually have a leader who cares about making sure our military actually have a fighting chance when sent into combat and will actually provide them support & supplies instead of expecting them to make do & cobble together what they can find to defend themselves. As for your father, he made a choice. It was his choice to make and isn't it great that one lives in a country where one has the freedom to make choices about how to live one's life? About Wicklow? I happen to know several people he has cyberstalked. All used to post here. Emails to workplaces, emails to personal emails, etc. It includes drive-bys of homes and then posting the details on other websites. I am truly sorry you met him and he now knows your identity. You should now be very careful about disagreeing with him online. The man is unbalanced and I will not be surprised in the least if we read about his snapping in the paper in the next couple of years.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Mr_Nancy_Boy_To_You (Tom Shewmon) says…Of course, not seeing one's DD214 and military records makes it a bit hard to judge their performance and/or credibility.~~~~~~I don't recall Wicklow ever once posting his. Are we supposed to take others' word that Wicklow was in fact a marine? If this is the standard for proving that one has served, then why has the man never once posted his? In fact, I do recall Wicklow attacking others about their service but never proving his own. Isn't that a bit disrespectful of the military to question their service if they happen to disagree with you on an online forum? How is that different from spitting on Vietnam vets coming back?

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

Goodness bugpoo, that was an impressively unwarranted and totally fictitious personal attack. When you so obviously see only what you are predetermined to see on this board, it makes me wonder why anyone should believe that you see and think with anymore clarity or rationality when it comes to our president or world politics.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

camper 6 years, 1 month ago

Bush's main fault was the same error that every president since Nixon (not a particulary good one) made. All of them failed to look long-term, and did not realize that energy is the dominant economic function that dominates the US economy, and Bush (like those previous) accomplished very little with regards to diversifying our energy sources. When gasoline prices spiked to $4 a gallon, the extra cost was absorbed for a while, but now we are seeing the results. The rise rise in fuel costs was the first atom split in this chain reaction which has caused the current economic downturn. We obviously learned very little from the 70's energy crisis. If I can fault conservative theory (ie the market will determine consumer demand) is that this is a reactionary method which deserved an agressive and long-term strategy which should have been started in the 70's.Though home ownership was perhaps a goal of Clinton in his 1st term, the Bush team failed to correct the errors of his Democratic predecessor. After all, his men in the treasury and federal reserve were at the wheel when the housing and financial markets collapsed.As far as Iraq.....I was initially against the military option, but was swayed a little because the prospect of replacing him seemed like a decent option. Bush offered amnesty for Sadam (I believe) to avoid confrontation and the dictator foolishy refused. However, the duration of the conflict has led me to believe that the "known quantity" theory would have been the best approach (ie Sadam is bad, but he is contained). Unfortunately, it is very easy to blame Bush for our current affairs, but our collective desire to keep up with the Jones's and speculate beyond our means should share equal blame.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

camper (Anonymous) says…Bush's main fault was the same error that every president since Nixon (not a particulary good one) made. All of them failed to look long-term...~~~~~~~~~~~~~I think that is a very accurate assessment as to why we are where we are both domestically and internationally. Although I think it applies to more than just energy policies.So few think for the long-term, in particular, the ones we select to lead us. It sure would be nice if everyone bothered to think about the long-term ramifications of their actions but I'm sure it is a case of poop in one hand and wish in the other and see which gets bigger for me on this...

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 1 month ago

How did Bush get away with what he did? How did he manage to convince congress to go along with his plans? Was it because they thought the voters back home supported Bush and they were angling for reelection? When Bush is long gone, the men and women who are mangled in body and spirit will still be trying to find a way to put the pieces back together. Anyone see Stop-Loss? I remember vividly when they bought the news to my Grandmother, with whom I was living, that her baby, the darling of her life, had been killed in Korea. Her scream went right though me, and it echoes. I will never forget it. Obama says, let's try talking to each other, and maybe, just maybe, and I say, please God, let it be so.

Katara 6 years, 1 month ago

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Godot 6 years, 1 month ago

"Though home ownership was perhaps a goal of Clinton in his 1st term, the Bush team failed to correct the errors of his Democratic predecessor. After all, his men in the treasury and federal reserve were at the wheel when the housing and financial markets collapsed."Yes, and Larry Summers, who as Clinton's Treasury Secretary was instrumental in getting Glass Steagall repealed, allowing commercial banks to act as investment banks, and in removing the strict reserve requirements of the banks, will be Obama's economic advisor, and Timothy Geithner, who worked in the Clinton administration, and now is NY Federal Reserve Governor and works closely with current Treasury Sec Paulson, will be Obama's Sec. of the Treasury. Nothing will change, except maybe for the worse.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

bugpoo: What in the hell are you talking about? Since you started this screenname, all I'm going on, I've addressed you on the forum maybe 5 times at the most, and I have neverEversent anybody on this forum a personal email, with one exception being telling a poster I found his entire profile an interesting and illuminating read. Since I don't want to assume that you are lying to somehow discredit me, I am going to suggest that you have me confused with somebody else. I assure you, and I have never deliberately lied on this forum either, I have used two profiles on this forum since 2004, this one and one just titled jonas. (well, a third too but that only got a single post and I think its been removed as I haven't looked at it in 3 years)I will not accept a baseless and dishonest attack on my behavior, if that was your intention, and stay silent about it. I would appreciate it if you would disown that previous comment, explain yourself further, or address the confusion. Otherwise, I will have to assume that you are simply another poster with no ethics, honor, or credibility.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

Bugpoo: If that's your response, then fine. I gave you a quite fair option to recant your untrue statement, and you have rejected that chance. You do not have an email from me, under this user name, so the question will be whether you are mistaken about another user being an alternate face for myself, and you are mistaken, or you are simply lying. I can't possibly comprehend why you'd lie about this, so I suppose I'll give you credit and assume you are simply mistaken. At any rate, feel free to turn in whatever harrassing emails you have recieved. As you have not recieved one from this screen name, it will not get removed. Since this is the only one that I use, I will not suffer from your false accusations, be they unintentional or otherwise.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

Jeezuss. . . . never mind. I don't think I'll give you credit after all. Thanks for making it obvious, I appreciate you saving me the time. Later, then.

Rex Russell 6 years, 1 month ago

Can we stay on subject, instead of personal attacks ? The issue is the mess at hand with the nation as a whole. Much of the situations at hand are due to the attacks more than 7 years ago. Mr. Bush did not directly cause these events. And indirectly through in-action, the blame can be spread over multiple Administrations. What can be laid at his door step however, is the cost in the trillions of an optional war in Iraq. This has gone a long way in bankrupting this country and future generations. Shameful. The oversight of the Wall Street and banking industries, or lack there of. That can be laid at this Administrations feet. Individuals comitted those crimes. But not without the willfull blind eye from de-regulation and lack of again, oversight. The use of secret prisons, kidnapping suspects off the steets around the world, flying them to countries who openly beat and torture, interrogation practices globally accepted as torture, a Vice President who believes he is above the law of the land. You can debate on whether you belive these acts fall under the Commander in Chief at war if you want. What is not debatable is this. If you perceive the role of President as our highest leader, we have had a poor one at best. If you perceive the role of President as the highest civil servant of Americans, he is much worse than that. And please, please, please, stop staying he will be remembered as a hero in 50 years, You can't sugar coat what has gone on with ptatitudes.

Rex Russell 6 years, 1 month ago

No. No personal attacks. Not on you. Not on Mr. Bush or Cheney. I won't take the bait. Simply put, that is an evaluation of their job performance at the end of their tenure.

jayhawklawrence 6 years, 1 month ago

When you consider that Bush appears to have been more of a salesman who relied on others to form his opinions. I don't think he is capable of the kind of conceptual logic that a national leader requires.Cheney and Rumsfeld appear to have been the smart guys calling the shots. Therein lies a large part of the problem. Cheney would have been right at home in the Nixon administration where the end justifies the means and morality and ethics are all relative. I imagine he stills believes we are all idiots.Rumsfeld reminds me of McNamara during the Vietnam Era. A guy too convinced of his own brilliance to realize that he just didn't have a clue. Rumsfeld thought he had all the answers and didn't want to listen to anyone.Seems to me that Clinton left Bush with the best situation possible. So to blame Clinton for the Bush troubles is truly sour grapes. If Bush lacked the judgment to steer the ship in a changing environment, then he was the wrong guy for the job.I think the best thing for the country would be for the Republican party to rebuild itself without the distractions of publicity stunts like Sarah Palin. I don't think the Republicans realize just yet what a farce they have made of themselves.

Corey Williams 6 years, 1 month ago

Groenhagen2 (Anonymous) says…"A better position would have been if Clinton would have taken bin Laden into custody when the Sudanese offered him up on a silver platter..."From the 9/11 Commission Report:"In late 1995, when Bin Ladin was still in Sudan, the State Department and CIA learned that Sudanese officials were discussing with the Saudi government the possibility of expelling Bin Ladin. U.S. Ambassador Timothy Carney encouraged the Sudanese to pursue this course. The Saudis, however, did not want Bin Ladin, giving as their reason revocation of his citizenship. Sudan's minister of defense, Fatih Erwa, has claimed that Sudan offered to hand Bin Ladin over to the United States. The Commission has found no credible evidence this was so. Ambassador Carney had instructions only to push the Sudanese to expel Bin Ladin. Ambassador Carney had no legal basis to ask for more from the Sudanese since, at the time, there was no indictment outstanding." (The 9/11 Commission Report, authorized edition, 109-110)."A better position would have been if Clinton had gone after bin Laden after al Qaeda bombed our embassies in 1998 instead of launching a preemptive attack on Iraq and launching an illegal war of choice against Kosovo."You mean when select air strikes knocked out the rest of Saddam's weapon manufacturing abilities? And by a "war of choice against Kosovo", do you mean the NATO led war in Kosovo? "A better position would have been if Clinton kept his 1992 to end our dependence on foreign oil..."Just like Nixon, Ford, Carter, and both Bush presidents have kept their promise to end our reliance on foreign oil? And as for Clinton "...allowing our vehicles to become the most fuel inefficient since the Carter administration.", maybe that would be a good time to revisit 1994. "In 1994, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) issued a notice of proposed rulemaking to explore raising the CAFE standard for light-duty trucks. Congress included language in the FY1996-FY2001 DOT Appropriations (P. L. 104-50, P. L. 104-205, P. L. 105-66, P. L. 106- 69, and P. L. 106-346) prohibiting the use of appropriated funds for any rulemaking on CAFE, effectively freezing the standards." And when did the republican party take control of congress?

Scott Drummond 6 years, 1 month ago

"Unfortunately, it is very easy to blame Bush for our current affairs, but our collective desire to keep up with the Jones's and speculate beyond our means should share equal blame."Agreed! You are all idiots for allowing him to hold the office.

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

Just advice, but it's somewhat difficult to take you seriously when you give yourself the name tolerance, talk about us needing to open our minds, and then write this:"First, I am a supporter of America. I know that puts me at odds with 80% of you, but be patient and accepting, its new to you but try it."

jonas_opines 6 years, 1 month ago

"Tolerance does not mean that everyone must agree on everything. It requires that one accept that the other has differing beliefs, opinions, and ideas."Yes, which is why I consider it intolerant to accuse 80% of the board of not supporting America, assumedly because they have different views that your own. "Why would you be intolerant of my statement?"Why would you say that I'm being intolerant of it? Because I question it? Sorry, but I think that we've somewhat missed the boat with the Pursuit of Tolerance, regardless of the source, as it's too easy for people to hide behind. "Whether it is right, wrong or a little of both, why MUST it conform to your opinion of a statement?"What does that mean? I assure you that I consider what you wrote to be a statement. "I believe my statement is very tolerant."Then, if you would care to, could you please address how you can tolerantly state that 80% of the people here do not support America?

Rex Russell 6 years, 1 month ago

Hello Tolerance, good to meet you. I both like and dislike your tone in your post. On one hand, you set a civil tone by respectfully introducing yourself to the band of regulars. On the other hand from the onset, you take a not so subtle swipe at a large swath of them. Unfortunately, there is still a great number of people who equate unconditional support of the President (whomever it is) and the actions of his/her Administration. However, it is very easy for me to separate the two. I supported this president with my hopes and prayers. I was mostly met with gross disappointment. Although strikingly different from Mr. Bush, I will support the new president also. But again, unconditional support is not a qualifier to be American. I do not support Mr.Bush's veiws on many things. I did not support Mr. Clinton's obvious lying to Congress. I did not support the first Mr. Bush's illegal activities in the Iran-Contra affair. I did not support the supposed "propping up" of Mr.Reagan during his final couple of years when his mind was failing. I did not support Mr.Carter's general ineffectiveness in office. I do not historically support Mr.Ford's action in pardoning Mr.Nixon.And as far as Mr.Nixon goes, there's plenty not to like. These are just some of the ones in my lifetime. All along I was American and supported the country and the American people. Just the opposite is true. The truest American values started over 200 years ago with those brave men questioning the actions of their government. I continue that American tradition.

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