Archive for Monday, December 8, 2008

Blackwater guards plan Utah surrender

December 8, 2008

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Five Blackwater Worldwide security guards indicted in Washington for the 2007 shooting of Iraqi civilians plan to surrender to the federal authorities today in Utah, anonymous sources have reported, setting up a court fight over the trial site.

The case already is shaping up to be a series of contentious legal battles before the guards can even go to trial. By surrendering in Utah, the home state of one of the guards, the men could argue the case should be heard in a far more conservative, pro-gun venue than Washington.

The five guards, all military veterans, were indicted on manslaughter charges Thursday for their roles in a 2007 shooting in Baghdad that left 17 Iraqi civilians dead.

Comments

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

I guess they think it'll be better to have an all-white, Mormon jury when on trial for murdering Muslim Arabs.They should be sent back to Iraq for trial, and if convicted, maybe they could spend some quality time in Abu Ghraib.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

Indiscriminately firing on everyone in sight in a crowded intersection filled with civilians is murder, though, mike. Although I understand that under your definition of murder, you only only need a superficial definition of "good guys" and "bad guys" to make a determination of guilt.Moronically yours,bozo

1029 9 years, 1 month ago

It was probably really scary not knowing who the bad guys were and who were obedient civilians. I can't really blame the guards. They are just humans and they got scaried and thought that the only way to protect themselves was to kill everyone. They obviously never thought they'd get caught or imagined that anyone would care if they did. It's war. They're just trying to make a few hundred thousand dollars just like everyone else.

Deja Coffin 9 years, 1 month ago

I'm just glad I wasn't in their shoes.

KansasVoter 9 years, 1 month ago

I agree that they should be tried over in Iraq, not America. They're accused of murdering Iraqi citizens, not Americans. I also think that more Blackwater mercenaries should face charges for their crimes committed in Iraq.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

Witnesses on the scene said that the Blackwater guards fired first, including stun grenades, Iraqi police and Army fired back, after which Blackwater shot everyone in sight.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

There's been quite a bit of reporting on the behavior of contractors such as Blackwater, and it has included an attitude of shoot first, and then shoot some more.Would I react the same way if I were in their position? Perhaps, but I'd probably have to be a sociopath to be found in their position.

Jock Navels 9 years, 1 month ago

the ultimate problem here is the privatization of a government military job. the men or women in these shoes should be military, operating under the uniform military code, with a distinct chain of command.if there's ever a bunch of dark sunglass wearing t-shirted macho dudes heavily armed in my neighborhood waving their guns around and checking my papers in a spiteful way....i'm going to shoot a few dead. wouldn't you?

Keith 9 years, 1 month ago

Any bets as to whether madmike knows even 1 Blackwater guy?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

Given your general attitude of shoot first, and then shoot some more, I'm inclined to believe you, mike.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

" Secondly, they are highly trained which means they will follow orders and/or rules of engagement."For Blackwater, rules of engagement appear to be that there are no rules, other than to use the biggest gun you have handy.

moderate1 9 years, 1 month ago

It sounded like they were shooting everything that moved, cars were shot at trying to leave the scene, a rpg was shot into an all girls school, a man was shot standing there with his arms up. If 1 or 2 innocent lives were lost that might be somewhat understandable but 17?

Jock Navels 9 years, 1 month ago

i was in combat, albeit 40 yrs ago. i go on record as being a leftist moron. with these credentials i say: a highly trained special ops guy is not the guy to have in a military police situation. they are generally not highly trained for the situation they were in. they will be "hung out to dry", in the sense that they will and should pay a heavy price for their actions, while the higher and higher than higher ups will skate. But remember, you go mercenary, you take what comes your way. They could have made almost as much money as unarmed truck drivers working for haliburton, or their subsidiary KBR. fact.

RedwoodCoast 9 years, 1 month ago

"By surrendering in Utah, the home state of one of the guards, the men could argue the case should be heard in a far more conservative, pro-gun venue than Washington."So the take-home message here is: pro-gun folks are more likely to be lenient on people who kill other people with guns? Sorry, but that's rather disturbing.

RedwoodCoast 9 years, 1 month ago

But, Mike, why do they feel they cannot get a fair trial? The issue still stands: Are pro-gun folks more lenient on other folks who kill people with firearms? I still find it rather disturbing.

RedwoodCoast 9 years, 1 month ago

So if I want to rob a bank using a gun, I should make sure I do it in a pro-gun state?

dandelion 9 years, 1 month ago

On NPR the other day, they said that the employees of these contractors do not have to swear an oath to uphold the constitution like federal employees, military and civilian have to do. This is a quote from the CNN article: "Slough's attorney, Mark Hulkower, said he is "an honorable young man who served this country with distinction for many years."So Slough, as the others, served their country, but they left the military, probably for 1 of 2 reasons. 1. Money - in which case they prefer money over their country.or2. Restraints - they didn't like the fact that the military must follow orders, and try to limit collateral damage. They can't just shove their weight around and kill innocent people. This motive is for someone who is just into killing.Mercenaries are scum. Plain and simple. If you are a true patriot you will join the US military, not a corporation. They better not play the patriotic card.

Deja Coffin 9 years, 1 month ago

max1, you forgot to add that bounty hunters also wear lots of leather and have mullets.

labmonkey 9 years, 1 month ago

Bozo said:"I guess they think it'll be better to have an all-white, Mormon jury when on trial for murdering Muslim Arabs."Now that is pretty racist and discriminatory. If someone made a comment about a black jury acquitting OJ Simpson, you would be all over them.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 9 years, 1 month ago

"If someone made a comment about a black jury acquitting OJ Simpson, you would be all over them."I don't think that there is much doubt that race played a major role in Simpson's acquittal. Or more specifically, that a black jury would be quite aware that, historically, black men have been arrested and convicted of crimes for no other reason than they happened to be in the neighborhood and/or the first ones arrested and beaten into confessions. A skilled defense attorney like Johnnie Cochran would not likely waste an advantage like that.

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