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Letters to the Editor

Population issue

April 12, 2008

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To the editor:

A few weeks ago, I read that the Vatican had come out with some new sins (as if there weren't enough to worry about already). I was heartened, however, to see that one of the new sins was harming the environment. But as I thought about it, it struck me that there may be the teeniest, tiniest bit of internal inconsistency in the Vatican's position on harming the environment and its stand on contraception.

One of the biggest (perhaps the most serious) threats to sustainability is overpopulation. There is ample evidence that adding more humans to the planet will only accelerate global warming, resource consumption and pollution. By insisting that good Catholics refrain from using any form of birth control other than the notoriously unreliable rhythm method, isn't the church also contributing to environmental harm?

Just a thought.

Belinda Holmes,
Lawrence

Comments

paavopetie 6 years ago

While Belinda is correct in that the Catholic Church does not approve of birth control, it's one of the many many rules that Catholics don't even bother following. You know, like fasting on Good Friday or going to Confession. The Catholic Church is sooooo early last century. Maybe by the time 80% of us have contracted HIV/AIDs, they'll condone condom use. But until then, just ignore their silly rules.

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Kat Christian 6 years ago

The bible serves to offer examples of a good life. Obviously the world has changed so much that we couldn't possibly live as they did when the bible was written, BUT we can still practice charity and good will towards men/women. And in doing so we can offer our beliefs in the man who began this movement Jesus Christ. His name has lasted over 2,000 years that in itself should prove something. I am impressed by that alone and how loving and brave a man he was to face the powers that be at the time and go against their commands. How many of you can say you would do this to completion? Not many on this site or not I. I admit I am weak. We are in awe of our winning basketball players because they did a remarkable thing as winning the National championship, yet we fail to recognize what Jesus had given up for the human race to continue in peace. His life. Our world could be worse off. Yes at times horrible things happen, yet we still have a corner of peace and lovingness in this world in spite of the ugliness. We can thank Jesus for this. For Satan only displays the ugliness he revels in it. He's a busy demon. Yet those who know Jesus can recognize that demon and his tricks a lot easier then if you are a lost soul. Satan loves lost souls and plays many tricks to gain them. And that's all I have to say about this...

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Newell_Post 6 years ago

Folks, this is all just the big party at the end of the world. We might as well live it up. Dive gas hogs. Live in mansions. Eat all of the best food. John Maynard Keynes was one of the best students of long-term economics. His theory?: "In the long term, we're all dead."

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i_tching 6 years ago

Many if not most of the calories in the foods we eat come from fossil fuels, and those are in diminishing supply.As food availability decreases, so will human populations worldwide. When petroleum-based fertilizers are gone, our Earth will probably only be able to carry about a billion humans, or some number comparable to pre-Industrial levels.

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Wendy magillicutty 6 years ago

There are only three outcomes in a parasitic relationship: host kills the parasite, parasite kills the host or symbiosis.

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hawkperchedatriverfront 6 years ago

I';m curious about the rhythm method. Does it allow for vibrato and crescendo and is it in march time? Is there anyplace to get demonstrations of the rhythm method in practice?

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Tony Kisner 6 years ago

It appears that the Catholic church has been very quietly working hard in China and India.

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pisafromthewest 6 years ago

JJE007 (Anonymous) says: "You say you're arguing with a 13 year old and you continue to try to bully said 13 year old..."Um, okay. I think we're starting to see the crux of the problem here.I said:"Apparently your comebacks are on the level with your reading comprehension ... which appears to be well below third grade level."JJE007 comes back with:"You say you're arguing with a 13 year old ..."Now, JJE007, maybe your math skills aren't any better than your reading comprehension. But most of us ... apparently not you, but most of us ... were well past the third grade by age 13.But you're right ... as it does seem unfair to pick on uneducated children, I'll leave you to whatever little delusional world you're in that you actually believe you're winning the argument. I wish you luck ... looks like you'll be the only person driving yourself to school in fourth grade (if you can pass your third grade finals this time).

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JJE007 6 years ago

pisa, You is so retorted!~)Good point...I mean NO point.You say you're arguing with a 13 year old and you continue to try to bully said 13 year old...so brilliant and sweet. Should I be impressed with your style? I truly do wish you had an ounce of wit. That would make this worthless exercise in clue provision more amusing. As it is, you have no clue and nothing to bring to the table but the dismissive arrogance of a closed mind. Look up the term finite and practice using it in a sentence. We're done. You are sentenced to your own judgement.

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Daytrader23 6 years ago

They also said that an over abundance of wealth is a sin as well. Which would mean that the church itself is sinning.Does anybody know how much money is in Vatican City?Some estimate it at 1/5 of the entire worlds wealth, enough to end poverty. So, if the Church is one of the biggest sinners than what hope do we have? Think about it.

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pisafromthewest 6 years ago

Wow, JJE007, you had to stay up until 5 in the morning to come up with that retort? (Mommy let's you stay up that late? I'm surprised.) Apparently your comebacks are on the level with your reading comprehension (e.g. "Get rid of the problem pointer and leave the problem."), which appears to be well below third grade level. I can hardly wait for the next example of your repertoire ... what will it be, "I'm rubber, you're glue...?"Perhaps you'd be more comfortable on the KC Star's website ... I hear they have the comics online, where you'd evidently be more comfortable, instead of getting in over your head in an adult conversation.

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nfpteacher 6 years ago

Gotta keep up with the times people! The Rhythm Method is the Model T of NFP! The Church urges people not to pollute their bodies with chemical approximates of hormones or toxic spermicides--it advocates using any of the several modern, highly effective methods of Natural Family Planning. FYI, the Sympto-Thermal Method has the highest effectiveness rating (equivalent to the pill, higher than condoms; Source: "Contraceptive Technology" (18th revised edition), Ardent Media, 2004.) and is taught by many organizations world-wide, SERENA, in Canada, where we live.

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JJE007 6 years ago

pisa...says:If you're overly concerned about overpopulation, by all means do the rest of us a favor and reduce the population by one...this would be an invaluable contribution to the betterment of the gene pool as well. Frikkin' moron---I liked the way you sign your post, Fm!~)Don't be so hard on yourself. You're only following the herd...no shame there...we all need your fertilizer. I do refuse to consider killing you though, even though you apparently want me to ("reduce the population by one"). I am far too sweet...you're too tough and not green enough to be soylent.Don't feel too oppressed now, Fm. The big, bad sustainability people will let you think and say whatever you want. It' the law of the land to cater to your ilk. Eat, drink and be many. Life is more valuable on the supply side of the idiocy. Right? In your language that means...Baaaaaa...

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lunacydetector 6 years ago

gee bozo, my idea is grand but it is also 'smart growth' at its very finest application.

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ReadingSports 6 years ago

Unfortunately, the Catholic Church is possessed of a very large bureaucracy, and bureaucracies have a tendency to produce silly position statements. Coincidentally the first century Jewish priests had also formed very large bureaucracy, and a well-documented tendency toward the silly. There's a well-known first century Jewish rabbi that often addressed those problems.Restating the seven deadly sins is, in my opinion, very, very silly. Of course, being a Christian, and not a Catholic-Christian, I didn't agree with the concept of "seven deadly sins" in the first place, and I'm pretty sure that first-century Jewish rabbi didn't either. There's sin and there's forgiveness. Nothing more, nothing less. My favorite from the new list is "Morally debatable experimentation":If it's morally debatable then how can it be a deadly sin??? For a broader critique try:http://weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/014/949beepp.aspYes, I know, it's from the bad Neo-Con website. Don't worry, the article is funny, and most virus scanners filter out the hypo-rays. :-)

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pisafromthewest 6 years ago

JJE007 (Anonymous) says: "Thanks! That is so reaffirming of idiot speak. Get rid of the problem pointer and leave the problem. Brilliant!"Forgive me for forgetting how many illiterate third-graders there are here, and how explicitly posts have to be worded so they'll understand. While I believe most people had no trouble comprehending the meaning of my post, for the intellect-challenged like jje, I'll spell it out:If you're overly concerned about overpopulation, by all means do the rest of us a favor and reduce the population by one. In your case this would be an invaluable contribution to the betterment of the gene pool as well. Frikkin' moron.

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Gina Bailey-Carbaugh 6 years ago

staff, the JWs believe that 144,000 will be chosen.Puss, I never said this was about the bible. But, then again, you are just interested in Catholic bashing so it doesn't really matter what I said.

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5SBAuthor 6 years ago

Belinda, I agree that the Catholic Church is contributing to environmental harm by stubbornly sticking to its backward teachings on conception prevention and thus contributing to the over-population problem. The world's population will eventually stabilize one way or another. Either it will happen as the result of a higher death rate or a lower birth rate, or some combination of the two. If you do not favor reducing the birth rate then, by default, you favor a higher death rate. Any child who has ever had a terrarium or aquarium can understand the concept of carrying capacity and that you can't keep stuffing more organisms into the same environment. Our world can support a smaller human population at a high standard of living and quality of life or it can support a large population at a very low standard of living and quality of life. The correct choice seems obvious. Nice post, Belinda. Don't be deterred by those who favor the "hear no evil" approach.Pete MurphyAuthor, Five Short Blasts

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JJE007 6 years ago

pisafromthewest says...If all you fine folks who insist all this planet's problems are due to there being people on it would kindly remove yourselves from the equation, things would probably be a lot better.---Thanks! That is so reaffirming of idiot speak. Get rid of the problem pointer and leave the problem. Brilliant!

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planetwax 6 years ago

Considering we have doubled our population globally since 1960, overpopulation has already reached unsustainable proportions. We are living on one planet with FINITE resources.

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pisafromthewest 6 years ago

Well, I can we can all agree on one thing.If all you fine folks who insist all this planet's problems are due to there being people on it would kindly remove yourselves from the equation, things would probably be a lot better.

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staff04 6 years ago

labmonkey, I thought only 144,000 were getting in...that's a helluva (no pun intended) lot more than 9/10...

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labmonkey 6 years ago

I have mostly Protestant Christian beliefs, but I find it hard to believe that God would shut out 9/10 of everyone who ever lived from going to Heaven just because they were born in the wrong part of the world. The most insightful thing I have heard about God's judgement lately from my wife....and I think I will subscribe to her belief that everyone will be judged by what they know. The Bible is not meant to be taken literally, but as a guide on how to live. Hell, even Jesus taught in parables. If the Bible were meant to be taken literally, it would not contain so many contradictions. As for Belinda's letter....if we start seeing the name of Fuddruckers start to change, then she is on to something.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years ago

Now that's a really practical solution, luny. I can't imagine even one little flaw in such a plan.

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lunacydetector 6 years ago

everyone on the entire planet could live in the great state of texas and form one giant city with a population density less than many of our existing cities, leaving the rest of the world empty! each man, woman and child would have 1500 square feet of living space.

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Marion Lynn 6 years ago

Well, the "Final Solution" to the overpopulation issue can be found here:http://www.vhemt.org/The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement

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Marion Lynn 6 years ago

"First you get down on your kneesFiddle with your Roasaries......"

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JohnBrown 6 years ago

God created the world and everything in it. He used rules. Iron and heavier elements only come from super-novae. Populations that exceed their carrying capacity decline. God also gave us brains, so we can consider the consequences of our actions (like what might happen if we exceed our carrying capacity).As for the environment: remember, God created it, and some people with brains realize that the environment (plus our ability to invent and adapt) determines our carrying capacity.God did not give us an ability to see with clarity far into the future; God only gave us the ability to use logic, and with it we created science which gives us some clarity in some areas and only vague probabilities in others.No one "knows" what's going to happen, but as our science grows our guesses might become better.Unless the rapture happens first.

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Multidisciplinary 6 years ago

I'm so confused!?!?!manbearpig/user?I totally missed this. Sounds just like someone else. WOW.(eye big with intrigue)puss..good posts. I've been working on that, one catholic at a time.

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pusscanthropus 6 years ago

I meant "they" are less than.

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pusscanthropus 6 years ago

Gina, this is not biblical literacy, this is catholic idiocy. I want to know what happened to all those souls in limbo BEFORE the catholic church changed its mind on only "allowing" baptised catholics in to heaven? Did they all fly enmasse to heaven, or did some go to purgatory to cleanse their souls of venial sins, and the ones with mortal sins go to hell? Or, were they all pardoned of all of their sins b/c they lacked catholic indoctrination and therefore could not have known what sins are? And no matter how you try to defend the catholic church, it still considers women unfit to be priests. Little catholic girls grow up being indoctrinated that the are less than.

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Gina Bailey-Carbaugh 6 years ago

The Catholic church no longer states only those baptized by a catholic priest will be allowed into heaven. As long as one accepts Jesus as savior, your good to go.Puss, the bible is not to be taken literally. There are two creation stories, sonhow is that possible? it is a tool - for zealots and samaritans alike

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pusscanthropus 6 years ago

"Adam and Eve set that in stone the day they sinned in the garden of Eden, therefore God told them from hence forth all their offsprings shall be sinners. We are all born sinners. Our only redemption is through Jesus Christ - in believing in him - not only by our good works do we pass. Because in believing in Jesus Christ truly with your heart you'd want to do good works. At least this is what the Bible hopes to convey to us."And you really believe this fairy tale? If it were true, Cain and Abel would have had to scr*w their mom to start the human population. But if you look at the archeological record, you will find that the first ones in the garden of Eden area (Tigris & Euphrates) were Neanderthals, not Homo sapiens. If you want to know how religions have gotten it all wrong, go to http://www.venganza.org/

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Marion Lynn 6 years ago

Yes and do NOT doubt The Word of Manbearpig!

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Kat Christian 6 years ago

I agree with you Belinda it doesn't make much sense. I think the Pope needs to stay out of the GREEN issue. It's a government conspiracacy anyway along with corporate gimick ideas to make more money. Igby you are also correct to live and breath we are sinners. Adam and Eve set that in stone the day they sinned in the garden of Eden, therefore God told them from hence forth all their offsprings shall be sinners. We are all born sinners. Our only redemption is through Jesus Christ - in believing in him - not only by our good works do we pass. Because in believing in Jesus Christ truly with your heart you'd want to do good works. At least this is what the Bible hopes to convey to us. Read it and try to understand what is it conveying. It doesn't mean you have to become a holy roller. God did give us all a free mind to make our own decisions. However, you must also realize having that free mind or will there are consequances either way for us. Heaven or Hell. Also to help you along you should read a book about Satan to understand the levels of Hell and how you get there. Blessed Be brother, Amen!!

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Multidisciplinary 6 years ago

Do I have to do that leaning backwards thing in limbo?I've been enjoyed by several Catholics, (and they are going straight to hell for it LOL). Does this give me bonus pts?

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pusscanthropus 6 years ago

Bless me father but I have a question. Did the vatican categorize the new sins? Is harming the environment a venial or a mortal sin? Because if you have only venial sins on your soul when you die, you can go to purgatory. But a mortal sin will send you straight to hell (you can't pass go, get $200, nada). Ooops, I forgot--if you haven't been been baptised by a Catholic priest (pedophile or not), you will never make it to heaven--you can only go so far as limbo. Hosanna on high!!! Amen!

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Mkh 6 years ago

The modern day Eugenicists are hard at work. I wonder if Belinda Holmes even realizes who runs the major "environmental groups" like the Seirra Club and the World Wildlife Foundation.

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its_getting_warmer 6 years ago

yea, there are too many seriouscats in this world.Who is gonna tell the pope about this:http://www.unfpa.org/6billion/pages/worldpopgrowth.htm

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i_tching 6 years ago

Overpopulation is secondary to an abundence in the food supply, which of course is absolutely temporary.When fossil-fuel-derived fertilizers are no longer readily available, our agriculture will wither drastically and human populations will decrease significantly.

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seriouscat 6 years ago

Hmmm...seems people always default to saying that too many humans is the problem. Usually they go a step further and cite the particular kind of human of which there are too many. Too many dumb people, too many brown people, too many religious people, dirty people, whatever.Here's some food for thought for the overpopulation zealots out there:1) The amount of pollution and it's nefarious effects on the average person was far worse over 100 years ago during the height of the industrial revolution, when the population of the world was a fraction of what it is today.2) Europe, Japan and the U.S. are the places where the vast majority of the world's resources are being consumed and yet they are also the ones which are actually experiencing a decline in population. (U.S. is experiencing population growth only because of immigration). 3) China is currently cited as the the world's worst polluter, even though it has strictly enforced a one-child only policy for decades. People love to blame religion and especially Catholics for all the world's problems. I posit that this viewpoint is lazy and simplistic, and does nothing to address the real issues that face humanity today. I'm not Catholic, but I believe that maybe, just maybe if folks were to adopt a more 'Catholic' perspective on this world of ours, which values each and every human life as something precious instead of either a commodity or a threat to their own self centered lifestyles, there would be a little more reflection on how each and every one of our own actions affects this planet and all its precious life. Humans included.

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le 6 years ago

But the Vatican says it is still O.K. for catholic priests to molest children!

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uhadmeatsmellthis 6 years ago

Is flushing a condom with a chub good for the environment? One time I saw one in a pond, and I thought it was a Portugese Man-O-War at first.

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igby 6 years ago

Gee! This means your going to hell for sure now.Your sinning by just being alive and breathing. They'll want to add a sin tax now on the air you breathe.Except for Sunday's air, it will be free as long as your breath does not reek of liquor or weed.Just take short shallow breaths now and try to have clean thoughts when you exhale. Lol.

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