Letters to the Editor

Slaves to history

November 19, 2007


To the editor:

Regarding your story about University of Missouri T-shirts, leave it to the fans of the Black and Gold to come up with something that revels in one of the worst slaughters in U.S. history. This was a slaughter meant to advance the cause of slavery, no less. They must be so proud.

Charles Gruber,



igby 10 years ago

Charles: I would agree with the opposition against the tasteless tee. However, your knowledge of history and claims, I would disagree with. But it sounded good, I would of expected less generalizations from you. Many slaughters in America were common place, 173 dead was not in my opinion one of the worst. Advancing slavery was not the greatest objective the raiders hoped to accomplish, however, anything related to the civil war seems to be put in the light of the slavery issue now because were looking back into history with broad generalizations. However, today, the tee's will be looked upon as in supporting racism I'm sure.

I think a fair generalization would be that the blue Muck tee's are just as tasteless because of the reversed spelling and nonsense message as it would seem that displaying the raid of 1863 on Lawrence; a reverse historically symbolic reminder of an event demonstrating the degree of intended A$$ kicking they will bring. Both tee's, a symbolic reverse in educated logic but acceptable as game play and rivalry has no true borders of fair and politically correct president.

jonas 10 years ago

However, since it's clear that you have never fully understood my motivations in posting, based on your thinking you've made me mad or hurt my feelings, as well as reference to my, as you put it, "hissy fit," if you'd like an actual explanation of what my posts have meant, especially in terms of criticism directed at you, which I know you have a hard time taking gracefully, feel free to post them with your interpretation, and I'll be happy to explain to you why you are wrong in your perception of my thoughts and motivations.

Bill_Quantrill 10 years ago

Dear Charles Gruber:

If you must post messages publicly, please be sure of your facts in advance. Incorrect information makes you look rather foolish. Not one of the boys riding with Captain Quantrill gave a hoot about slavery. Your "fair city" (cough, gag) was destroyed for two reasons: 1.) Your wonderful, righteous Kansas raiders sacked and destroyed Osceola, Missouri without any cause other than to steal and rape and the fact that it was on the Missouri side of the state line. 2.) The Feds allowed the prison to collapse and killed several Missouri women associated with our Partisan Rangers. As a Missourian who had family murdered by Redleggers and family who rode with Quantrill, I am, in fact, proud of the Lawrence Raid.


KUDB99 10 years ago

Ok, seriously, this is ridiculous. No one in Missouri has any workable memory of any first generation witnesses to Quantrill or the Red-legs. Neither does anyone in Lawrence, for that matter. Can't anyone figure out that this is all brought about by a giant marketing machine designed to sell stuff....ie, tickets, shirts, whatever.....

Now, I hope that KU goes to Arrowhead and stomps the Tiggers, but not because "they burned Lawrence", which "they" didn't do at all. That atrocity was done by ruffians 150 years ago. And the Redlegs raided the Platte River valley, once again, 150 years ago, by people who are long since dead.

This is why I can't stand fans....comments like "we're going to destroy you" and "we're going to do blah, blah, blah," being made by pimple faced 125lb idiots who have never played a sport in their life. In reality, these morons have no more impact than a lemur in a cage. "We" aren't going to do anything but root for our team, and "We" will just need to relax a little bit.

and SB's right....MU still sucks....

mom_of_three 10 years ago

Osceola, Missouri was sacked as Lane was chasing General Price. No excuse for it, but it was part of battle. Only 9 were reported killed. Quantrill did sack Lawrence as retribution. I think many more were killed during that raid. but Lawrence was sacked by Missouri ruffians and pro-slavery supporters more than once. May, 1856 the Free State hotel was burned, Robinson's house was destroyed and two free state newspapers were demolished.
Pro slavery shot people, John Brown murdered people, - it was all bad. But to celebrate it on a shirt is more than madness.

kansas778 10 years ago

"173 dead was not in my opinion one of the worst"

To reiterate: prior to the Oklahoma city bombing, Quantrill's Raid was the bloodiest act of domestic terrorism in US history.

Flap Doodle 10 years ago

So far, this thread contains the best use of the word "lemur" in current LJW stories.

Chicken goes "cluck, cluck" Cow goes "moo" Lemur goes "tsch, tsch" How about you?

jonas 10 years ago

I still stand by both of those statements, as I do with any other directed at you, Max. I do admit, though, to being patently amused by the apparent complexity of your personal archives.

beatrice 10 years ago

On page 748 of Henry Shackapopolus's book "Quantrill's Raid Meant to Advance the Cause of Slavery," it says, and I quote, "Quantrill's raid was intended to advance the cause of slavery." So there. It looks like Gruber must have been familiar with this accurate quote. Case closed. Go KU!

beatrice 10 years ago

On page 418, it states, and I quote, "It was well known that Quantrill, using both hands, could rarely find his own backside. He often required the help of others to locate it for him."

kansas778 10 years ago

I see Max, that makes it OK and completely unoffensive to revel in an act of terrorism. Good point.

jonas 10 years ago

On page 148 of Henry Shackapopolus's book, it is also written that he diliberately went with the complicated ghost name Shackapopolous in order to confund internet searches by people challenging his legitimacy.

Charles L. Bloss, Jr. 10 years ago

Incredible, all this over T shirts. Thank you, Lynn

wysiwyg69 10 years ago

wrong lynn.. this is not over just T-shirts it is over a football game... even more stupid

riverdrifter 10 years ago

A distant ancestor, Silas Soule, settled in the Vinland area in the 1850's. I remember well, as a kid, my grandmother, qouting her mother: 'Silas, he largely meant and did well, but I believe he Jayhawked those Missourians mainly for sport.' Now There you go.

riverdrifter 10 years ago

"On page 148 of Henry Shackapopolus's book, it is also written that he diliberately went with the complicated ghost name Shackapopolous in order to confund internet searches by people challenging his legitimacy."

"Confund: A meaningless gooberism sometimes used by pseudo-intellectuals."

Huh? This is about a football game. 'Sport'. FOOTBALL. See. Bill Young is telling his players to get to Jeremy Maclin and knock the snot out of him. Get to Tony Temple and rip his heart out -and shove it down his throat. Get to Chase Daniel and rip his face off, and yes, shove it down his throat. And in Columbia, exactly the same is said. Beyond Thunderdome: "Two Men Enter -One Man Leaves."

riverdrifter 10 years ago

TOB: It's gonna be a dog-fight. And both sides are well-served. I have no idea who is going to win this game. No idea. God...?

jonas 10 years ago

"Confund: A meaningless gooberism sometimes used by pseudo-intellectuals."

Or a typo. But only one option allows you to be spiteful, ne?

jonas 10 years ago

Holy crap that was a long run-on sentence. I should start proofing these things one of these days.

jd 10 years ago

For God's sake people. It's just a game and they were just trying to get your goat and heighten the rivalry. I'd say they succeeded wildly.

jonas 10 years ago

""I'll be happy to explain to you why you are wrong in your perception of my thoughts and motivations." -jonas

No thank you - I've had enough of your famous foaming tirades and Stuart Smalley reenactments."

Yes, thank you for proving my point. Truthfully, it's probably just as well this way.

beatrice 10 years ago

jonas, in addition to Shackapopolus's book I think max should read the tried and true Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People." He seems to be going about it all wrong.

Honestly, his 3:17pm response yesterday and TOB's follow-up comment made me laugh harder than I think I have ever laughed before when reading this board. Truly priceless.

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