Archive for Wednesday, June 6, 2007

Phelps’ daughter arrested for son’s actions

June 6, 2007

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— A member of the Kansas church that protests at soldier funerals across the nation was arrested Tuesday after her son stomped on a U.S. flag during a protest in Bellevue.

Shirley Phelps-Roper, 49, of Topeka, Kan., was arrested on suspicion of contributing to the delinquency of a minor.

Phelps-Roper acknowledged that she allowed her 10-year-old son, Jonah, to stand on the flag - an action that she says is protected by the U.S. Constitution.

Bellevue Police Capt. Herb Evers said a 1977 Nebraska statute makes it unlawful for a person to trample on a flag.

Phelps-Roper is a member of Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka. She is a daughter of the church's founder, the Rev. Fred Phelps.

Phelps-Roper said church members have protested at more than 280 military funerals in 43 states since June 15, 2005, and that Tuesday marked her church's first arrest at a funeral.

The Bellevue funeral was for Nebraska Army National Guard Spc. William "Bill" Bailey, who was killed May 25 when an explosive device struck his vehicle in Iraq.

Comments

Linda Endicott 8 years, 2 months ago

While I applaud Nebraska's efforts, I'm afraid they've opened themselves up for a lot of lawsuits by the Phelps cult.

Rightytighty 8 years, 2 months ago

I agree to pretend they are invisible but if you were the family trying to have a day of respect and gratefulness for life of your child I don't think it would be that simple to ignore the so called protesters

Linda Aikins 8 years, 2 months ago

If this sticks, I will forever love everything about the state of Nebraska.

Ragingbear 8 years, 2 months ago

If it's legal to burn a flag in protest, then it would be legal to trample a flag. Eating a flag on the other hand will not be an issue until 3000 during the Zoidburg vs. Earth trial.

coneflower 8 years, 2 months ago

A boy about that age was holding an ugly sign with the Phelps clan in front of the Lied Center when I attended Riverdance with my child last spring.

Heartbreaking, to see such a young child already indoctrinated with hatred and bigotry. Not a thing I wanted my child to see, either.

I'm all for free speech, even for the Phelps clan, but this is child abuse.

perkins 8 years, 2 months ago

Back in the day, Fred was a member of Washburn Law's moot court squad that won lots of contests across the midwest. This was before he turned "crazy." He and most of his family are quite intelligent. They may be considered crazy or immoral, but they are not stupid. At one time I thought that when Fred passed, the sign-carrying movement would die out. But Shirley seems motivated.

I find merit in all the above posters' comments. The family thrives on publicity, so let's not give it to them or give them cause to gain financially from a lawsuit. Yet stomping on a flag in Nebraska..ya gotta expect the authorities to take action. I'm not sure this particular charge is gonna stick, but heck, it's easy to Monday morning quarterback.

blackwalnut 8 years, 2 months ago

If the child broke a law, he is by definition a delinquent.

If the mother encouraged the minor to break the law, she did indeed contribute to the delinquency of a minor.

It seems like a tight case to me, but I'm not a lawyer.

blackwalnut 8 years, 2 months ago

Marion (fellow insomniac), what can you get the Phelps clan for? The free speech is much to precious to chip away at for the sake of this bunch of creeps. As for what probably goes on privately in this church made up mostly of Phelps' extended family, it's probably subhuman but also legal.

I think pretending they are invisible is the way to go. Even talking about them in here is giving them too much credit.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 8 years, 2 months ago

There's abuse going on in that family. It's just that none of the kids are brave enough to speak out yet. When we were attending an event at the Lied Center, one of the protesters asked a little girl, who was walking in with her father if her father had explained "golden showers"(this is a strange sex act, look it up) to her. Many adults don't know what this term refers to. They are teaching their children all about it. I wonder if they demonstate it to their kids. They are sickos.

TheHeartlessBureaucrat 8 years, 2 months ago

I think had they been able to get a "contributing" or "abuse/neglect" case to stick, they would have. CINC (child in need of care) cases are not an easy task. But I think these things are implied and we all know it. I think a fairly large press blitz is now irrevocably attached to this case.

But on a lighter note, when I die, I intend to be cremated. If the Phelps crowd (or someone like them) shows up, I invite all of Lawrence to attend my funeral and get a little baggie of my ashes as a souvenir. I highly recommend the contents of those baggies be dumped all over these protesters. Hey...freedom of expression, right?

THB

trinity 8 years, 2 months ago

where does the article say "child abuse"? i read "suspicion of contributing to the delinquency of a minor". you can't do better if you can't read well.

thanks trinity.

Aileen Dingus 8 years, 2 months ago

Remember- they got Al Capone for tax evasion... maybe this is a start.

peppermint 8 years, 2 months ago

Marion,

A cellar full of fine wine says you've never actually talked with a real liberal. You have no idea what a liberal is.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 8 years, 2 months ago

I want to be at Phelp's funeral too, but I'm not sinking to his level. I'll be carrying a sign of love, not hate.

janeyb 8 years, 2 months ago

I think the picketing started after Fred was disbarred. He was folllowing the judges who filed complaints about him around and picketing them. Anyone who was against Fred was a faggot. He loved the publicity and it grew from there. My Mom said she took a General Psychology class at Washburn with Shirley and Margie in 1974 or 1975, and they were pretty crazy then, but the picketing wasn't going on yet. They both graduated from law school before that started.

yankeelady 8 years, 2 months ago

In '95, when the first Treasures of the Czars exhibit was in Topeka, the organizers expected the Phelpsters to be around. They are drawn to cameras and crowds like moths to a flame. The volunteers were all told how to handle the inevitable questions we would get, they weren't nationally known then. They would be every place that they thought they would be visible, Shrine Circus, sporting events, park or zoo on the weekends. No one would ever stand up to them. So like any bully the rhetoric escalates. Fast forward to Washburn University when the controversial bishop sculpture was there. My daughter was participating in the Christmas Vespers. Out on 17th street there were 2 groups of protesters, the conservative Catholics from St Mary's and the Phelps gang. The kids thought it was cool that they had so many "visitors" and some were pretty upset. The Phelps's seemed in disarray and left fairly soon. The only thing we could figure was that they were afraid passers by would think they were with the Catholics. They have been so outrageous for so long, hiding behind religion and the Constitution, that they are not going anywhere now. The time to stop it was about 15-20 yrs ago. What started the whole thing off anyway? It wasn't AIDS that just got them louder.

Oracle_of_Rhode 8 years, 2 months ago

Anti-Americanism = child abuse? Seems like a real stretch. These people are repulsive cretins, but they do have First Amendment rights under our Constitution. Like it or not, that's part of what makes America the "Land of the Free," folks.

bevy 8 years, 2 months ago

Gootsie - You mean you don't love Nebraska now? What's wrong with you?

I am so sick of hearing about these folks. If the PD of our fair neighbor to the north were gullible enough to fall for this, they deserve what they get. The Phelpses are smart, educated, and they inform themselves about the places they go. You KNOW that she set her son up to do this so they would arrest her, just to give them an excuse to sue someone else. Can't beleive the cops fell for it!!

Ya'll are wrong when you say that they will stop this once the media attention stops. These people are "on a mission from God" in their eyes. I heard (or maybe read, I don't recall) an interview where their church members don't believe Fred will ever die, they are convinced he will live until the second coming.

Though I'd almost like to see that myself. Jesus comes down in a blaze of glory, Fred looks up at him and says "Lord, here I am!" and Jesus says "Depart from me, I know you not."

That'll rock his world. Then he'll probably call the Lord a nasty name...and go back to waving his hateful signs.

denak 8 years, 2 months ago

I gave up long ago trying to figure out why they picket the places they do. (Other than for publicity) I remember when the Harlem Boy's Choir came here a few years ago. They picketed them. It was ridiculous.

As for the issue of child abuse, I agree with all of you who think that there is psychological and quite possibly physical abuse going on.

However as a foster mother, I can tell you from experience that it isn't that easy to remove children from homes especially when there is no immediate danger.

To answer Agnotick's two questions:

Is physical abuse the only type of "abuse" recognized by the courts? No. Child Protective Services works on a two tiered system. Physical and Sexual abuse is the top tier and and Neglect is second tiered. Ideally, if a report is made that a child is being physically or sexually abused and the child is in immediate danger of being physically or sexually harmed, they will be removed within 24 hours. If the child is reported as being neglected, then they will, again ideally, be removed within 48 hous. However, it depends on the level of neglect and the potential for harm.

The primary goal of foster care is reunification. So, even if we were able to make a case to take the child from the parents, the system would turn around and try for reunification. That is how the laws are set up. Personally, I wouldn't want to be involved in any way with this case. I feel sorry just thinking about the headaches that the social workers, the therapists, the lawyers and the foster parents would go through. And more than likely, the children would be returned to the parents because the parents are probably smart enough to go to the parenting classes, the therapy and anything else that is required of them.

Can parents be held accountable for intentionally abusing their own children, physically or psychologically? Yes, they are suppose to be but after 3 1/2 years of working in foster care, I can tell you, that in this state, and more than likely this country, you can do ANYTHING short of killing your child and not go to jail. I can tell you horror stories that would sicken you and nothing happened to the parents. We still live in a country that views our children as the parent's property and not as independent human beings who have rights and who are deserving of respect.

The best way to put an abusive parent away is publicity because then the general public wakes itself up from its self-induced state of denial and becomes outraged that a child is being abused and demands that the parents be held accountable.

The Phelps clan loves publicity so in this case, we should give it to them.

Dena

gr 8 years, 2 months ago

"Acts 20:29-30 It should be obvious. Pfred is the antichrist."

Newell, fred may well be controlled or influenced by the antichrist, but I don't see the verses you cited as distinguishing who the antichrist is. Also, there is no mystery of who the antichrist is. He was presented in Genesis - Satan.

===========

As far as child abuse goes, what kind of message does Nebraska send to this kid? I mean, I even have a desire to go up there and stomp on a flag right in front of the judge and whomever. Not because I dislike America. But, because I dislike stupid people telling me I can't do that. This kid will grow up knowing that what his parents told him was true. You don't have freedoms and there is nothing in America worth protecting - they are a bunch of lunatics. The symbol is greater than what it represents.

If that isn't child abuse, indoctrination, and brainwashing, I don't know what is.

If people didn't make such a ruckus over this funeral stuff, it would have died out on its own. They whole thing was illogical. If the soldiers were gay, perhaps it would make sense. But to attempt to indirectly put the blame of one thing on something totally unconnected, is silliness. However, they were basically jabbing at everyone and anything. Like a bully. They got a response. Then they said, hey, we're onto something. Let's go with it.

And their fame soars.

heysoos 8 years, 2 months ago

I'm one of those "secular-progressive loony lefty liberal" types, and I fully believe in this insane family's right to say whatever they want. Does that change the fact that I will pi$$ on his grave? Not one bit.

mom_of_three 8 years, 2 months ago

Imagine if they used their powers for good, not for evil.

Crossfire 8 years, 2 months ago

The Freds probably thing it is just "so cute" when the little one mimic the hate of their elders. Kinda like the cute little Klan Babies lying in the cradles with their cute little hoods.

introversion 8 years, 2 months ago

Hey man, they got Capone on taxes... I'm not saying this situation is equivalent, but it doesn't mean that just because it's not "big enough" to shut these people up for good that we should stand by idly and let them break laws.

What they do is asinine to begin with, and I see no problem in making it more difficult for them, even if it is little pieces at a time.

For a group that's especially aware of it's rights, even if they are ungrateful for the rights they have, I think this is a particularly humorous situation that they've found their way into.

It takes a village to raise a child- since mom isn't doing such a great job, maybe the village can instill some sense of value and respect in this child through this situation.

mom_of_three 8 years, 2 months ago

Has anyone read the article in the Omaha newspaper?

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2798&u_sid=2397014

The county attorney doesn't look like he will be letting this go. maybe he will finally be able to do something that no one else has been able to.

Ghost78 8 years, 2 months ago

I grew up in Topeka, and I've seen their signs on street corners, university events, and shopping malls for over 20 years now. I think most people hope that they will eventually just go away, but its apparent that this family is trying to establish a firm legacy. Can you imagine what it must be like to be universally disliked by everyone that isn't in your isolated group? That fear and anxiety is likely what they use to reinforce their beliefs with their own children. After a few years of that, its hard to imagine that any of them are mentally capable of breaking free or making their own judgements. I don't know if this qualifies as a "Stockholm syndrome" of sympathizing with your captors, but the two concepts don't seem that far apart to me. I think that the Phelps don't understand that when a group is pitied for their beliefs, the message becomes completely disregarded. The methods they use to teach this rhetoric to their children undermine the ability of the entire group to effect any sort of societal pressure. This is a counter-intuitive idea, but if more people showed this group pity instead of anger, I think the conflict that they thrive on would wither, and so too would this group.

Ghost78 8 years, 2 months ago

I hope so Agnostick, but I think that a criminal behaviour precedent would have to be set first, so that a DA could explain that the abuse was causing criminal behaviour and that the court should examine and take action against the source. You would have to establish criminal behaviour because none of these children are going to go against their family in court.

Bill Chapman 8 years, 2 months ago

The simplest, easiest way to to REALLY effect the Phelps's and their "followers" is to use the first amendment against them - get a group of people together and picket their funerals, church gatherings, bake sales, etc. see how they like it. Follow ALL the laws to the letter, and do your damnedest to annoy the hell out of them! If you follow the law the cops can't arrest you and they would most likely get a real kick out of seeing the idiots taking some of their own medicine for once.

trinity 8 years, 2 months ago

ya know what dracul, i like that idea!!! you very well may be on to something. i'd participate in such an "event"!

Bill Chapman 8 years, 2 months ago

I've posted it before. I usually try to hint at solutions in my posts.

Probably got lost in all the other complaints.

I've ALWAYS thought that the first amendment could be used both ways (in fact, I believe that was the intent behind it in the first place). If more of the common public would engage in public protests, debates, etc., our government representatives MIGHT just get a better idea how the public feels about things.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 8 years, 2 months ago

Protesting against the Phelps would be great, but the rest of us have a life, unlike the Phelps family. But don't sink down to their hatred. I would carry a sign the reads "We have set a place at our table, will you join us?" I don't think Phelps is salvagable, but the kids need to hear a message of love to turn them away from their brain washing.

Confrontation 8 years, 2 months ago

People who burn the flag or stomp on it should feel free to leave the country. If you don't like things around here, then trade places with some of the illegals. Head to Mexico and see how much fun you have.

Confrontation 8 years, 2 months ago

I'm willing to bet that the clan knew about this Nebraska law before they arrived to protest. This was staged in order to get more attention.

coolmom 8 years, 2 months ago

maybe the police intervened for the safety of the child after people who were getting protested started getting more upset? maybe they were staying within the law but being such jerks the local cops took advantage of anything to help turn the tables? i know that if it was my child laying in a casket after fighting for this country the grief of the day would probably propel me accross the street for a few smacks before the local cops dragged me off. what jerks.

trinity 8 years, 2 months ago

ah, ag, even with the oogey comment about rain etc-i know, you're right. i'd never be able to find enough time to effectively counter-protest that bunch of wingdings.

and dear dorothy, i sure hope you're talking about the really young kids in phreddie's menagerie; shirley et al are lost causes, i believe. carrying on daddy's legacy&whatnot, ya know.

Tom McCune 8 years, 2 months ago

Pfred is the next Jim Jones or David Koresh. Mark my words. He exhibits all the warning signs.

mistygreen 8 years, 2 months ago

yankeelady: What started the whole thing off anyway? It wasn't AIDS that just got them louder.

I think I can answer your question. I lived in Topeka over 30 years. Back in the mid to late '80s Gage Park in Topeka was a known hangout for homosexuals. (I am not making any judgements, but if you are familiar with Topeka, you understand what I am talking about) Fred's home base and church are located near the park. He started these protests to bring attention to the non-family activities that were going on at the park. Unfortunately these protests over the years escalated to the monster that we have today. No one immune from this wacko. My son's Eagle Scout ceremony in Topeka was protested as well as my daughter's recent graduation from Free State High School. As most have suggested, it is just best to ignore them, do NOT draw attention to them for that is what they desire most of all.

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 8 years, 2 months ago

I think Phelphs was trying to protest the LHS graduation; someone saw him over at the stadium. Fortunately they hadn't got the word that the location had changed. They must have figured it out before Free State graduated. Sorry guys.

trinity 8 years, 2 months ago

ok, try as i might i just cannot for the life of me think of a single WHY the clan would protest a high school graduation?? only thing i can think of-is that they're even nuttier than i gave 'em credit for being.

Jamesaust 8 years, 2 months ago

Sorry to hear the folks in Bellevue, Nebraska, will be filing for bankruptcy. Oh well. Its a sad day when the Phelps clan gets its funding via punitive damages.

costello 8 years, 2 months ago

trinity says "ok, try as i might i just cannot for the life of me think of a single WHY the clan would protest a high school graduation?? only thing i can think of-is that they're even nuttier than i gave 'em credit for being."

As near as I can figure, they object to the word "Free" in "Free State High School."

"We drove the short distance to picket yet another graduation of the so-called Free State High School. How funny for them to have that name seeing as how they are the spirits in prison and are prisoners to their filthy manner of life! They are bond-slaves to sin!"

Maybe someone else can make some sense of this?

http://www.godhatesfags.com/featured/epics/2007/20070527_lawrence-ks-free-state-high-epic.pdf

Linda Aikins 8 years, 2 months ago

I was hoping you'd post, Jamesaust. I wondered what the law would say.

darn.

Ghost78 8 years, 2 months ago

Trinity - if the graduation displayed an American flag, held a prayer, or had a member of faculty in attendance that is publicly "out", then the Phelps group will take the opportunity to protest. That's just historical criteria, I'm sure they have other reasons as well.

costello 8 years, 2 months ago

Oh, my gosh! I just read that link I posted a little more closely. (It's hard to read at all.) It appears that God is revealing messages directly to Westboro Baptist Church directly now.

"The word that came to Westboro Baptist Church from the LORD, saying, ..."

Have I misread this?

Ghost78 8 years, 2 months ago

Personally, I wouldn't be giving them the web hits, costello.

BigDog 8 years, 2 months ago

Pfred is the next Jim Jones or David Koresh. Mark my words. He exhibits all the warning signs.


The difference between those two and Fred is that the other two could actually attract people other than their family into the cult. It might have something to do with having a personality. Fred and his kids have to reproduce in order to expand their cult. This is why we should consider requiring a license to be able to reproduce ...... maybe something to work toward in the next legislative session? (sarcasm of course)

costello 8 years, 2 months ago

Why do you care about their web counter, Ghost? Someone wondered why they'd protest a high school graduation. I went to see why.

I used to work with some of the granddaughters. If you want to know why they do what they do, just ask them. They'll tell you why. And there's usually some kind of logic to it. In my opinion, they're nuts, not stupid. They love publicity, but they don't make random protests. There's always some reason that makes sense to them.

The Phelpses like to make people angry. They do outrageous things to attract attention. Getting upset with them just gives them what they want. The best way (for me personally) to stop feeling angry with them is to try to understand them. Having spoken with some of them personally helps me see them as people, rather than monsters.

I think Phelps, Sr. is a sick person. For the rest, if you don't go along with the family, you're kicked out. Excommunicated. Damned to hell.

There's a very good unpublished book about the Phelpses from about 1992 called Addicted to Hate. It's available all over the Internet, but here's one copy http://blank.org/addict/.

From Chapter 9: "Sometime around 1975, Phelps began to find his option to beat his family restricted. By then, Mark and Kathy had already rebelled and left, and the other children were fast becoming adults of not inconsiderable size. About a year before Nate left, he remembers an incident which must have put the abusive pastor on notice to find new outlets for his hate. 'One day he was beating mom upstairs,' Nate recalls. 'He'd been doing it for some time. Shirley and Margie and I were in the dining room downstairs, and Margie and I were getting madder and madder. Shirl wouldn't get mad-she'd always start crying and pacing around whenever anyone was getting beaten. Margie finally went and got a butcher knife from the kitchen. The three of us went to the bottom of the stairs. But our voices stuck in our throats. We couldn't call out. None of us. We were so scared."

costello 8 years, 2 months ago

continued ...

"When the raging reverend chased his wife out onto the landing, he saw them. Fred stared down at them: 'Get the hell outta here.' Margie held the knife up where he could see it. 'You've got to stop this,' she told him.

"The pastor slowly descended the steps. His children backed up but didn't leave. For a long moment he glared at them. Then he said quietly: 'Fine, you SOBs.' And he turned and went back to his bedroom. For three weeks after that, Fred Phelps had no contact with his family except at church."

I recall that elsewhere in the book there's a quote from one of the daughter's that picketing is an activity they can do together as a family. The family that plays together stays together, right?

costello 8 years, 2 months ago

From chapter 9 of Addicted to Hate:

"Margie Phelps admits many in her family have become emotionally dependent on the death-to-gays crusade: 'A lot of us have been able to work through emotional problems because of the picketing,' she says. She explains the bonding and the sense of goals have brought them closer and taken each person's focus off their own personal difficulties. 'It would be very hard for them to give up the picketing now,' she observes, and quotes with some apparent relief the circumstances outlined by her father for an end to his grim campaign: the return of Jesus; the capitulation of all homosexuals; 'or they kill us. Otherwise it will go on.'"

mistygreen 8 years, 2 months ago

Wow Costello, scary but revealing post. No wonder there were defectors from the family.

On a completely different note, here are my thoughts as to why they were protesting Free State graduation. I suspect it had a lot to do with the couples registry in Lawrence. How it pertains to high school students, I have no idea. I'm sure they just wanted to let us know how they feel about public education in Lawrence and make the opinion known about the registry. Just my .02

tvc 8 years, 2 months ago

How about a same sex kiss/hug fest outside his house? Maybe we could even go for a Guinness world record.

Crispian Paul 8 years, 2 months ago

On a totally unrelated manner, my heart dances with glee every time I think about the huge party that will take place across the street from Phred's Phuneral (not to mention around the world) when that lovely day comes.

Well, I would share that sentiment, but unfortunately, there are plenty of other family members and members of the other "founding" families (Hockenbargers and Davis') to keep their particular brand of heate alive.

Crispian Paul 8 years, 2 months ago

"Dracul (Anonymous) says:

The simplest, easiest way to to REALLY effect the Phelps's and their "followers" is to use the first amendment against them - get a group of people together and picket their funerals, church gatherings, bake sales, etc. see how they like it. Follow ALL the laws to the letter, and do your damnedest to annoy the hell out of them! If you follow the law the cops can't arrest you and they would most likely get a real kick out of seeing the idiots taking some of their own medicine for once."

Tried this once....I think their hearts are so full of hate and vile blackness that it has no effect whatsoever. When they protested the "brown bag drag" show at KU several years ago, me and some friends stood across from them holding "God hates bigots" signs, but they hardly noticed....

Crispian Paul 8 years, 2 months ago

BigDog (Anonymous) says:

Pfred is the next Jim Jones or David Koresh. Mark my words. He exhibits all the warning signs.


The difference between those two and Fred is that the other two could actually attract people other than their family into the cult. It might have something to do with having a personality. Fred and his kids have to reproduce in order to expand their cult. This is why we should consider requiring a license to be able to reproduce :: maybe something to work toward in the next legislative session? (sarcasm of course)

BigDog, there are actually a handful of families in the church and that founded that church and they intermarry and breed a lot, so there may be no end in sight,

Crispian Paul 8 years, 2 months ago

There's a very good unpublished book about the Phelpses from about 1992 called Addicted to Hate. It's available all over the Internet, but here's one copy http://blank.org/addict/.

I have read this and you can also access it from wikipedia's pages on the Fred Phelps family....That dude has been psychopathic most of his life, from what this book says....

Crispian Paul 8 years, 2 months ago

tvc (Anonymous) says:

How about a same sex kiss/hug fest outside his house? Maybe we could even go for a Guinness world record.

I'M IN!!!!

purplesage 8 years, 2 months ago

Doesn't picketing Rev. Jerry Falwell's funeral reveal the lengths to which this embasrassment to Kansas and to Christianity will go for attention? Before someone tries to make the equation, though neither endorses homosexual practice, one cared about the people and the other cares about nothing but himself. The difference between Rev. Falwell and Phelps is that Rev. Falwell, agree with him or not, was a true patriot and Christian gentleman. Phelps is no patriot - and though I would not judge, I see no fruits of the Spirit to indicate His divine presence.

I hope they get them in the neighboring state of Nebraska. I applaud them for having the courage to take a stand knowing full well that the Phelps gang is full of lawyers ready and willing to defend themselves and their cronies. Ks and Ne can't agree on water rights; maybe they could work together to silence the Phelps protests.

Tom McCune 8 years, 2 months ago

"Savage wolves will come in among you and will not spare the flock. Even from your own number men will arise and distort the truth in order to draw away disciples after them." Acts 20:29-30

It should be obvious. Pfred is the antichrist.

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