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Archive for Thursday, October 5, 2006

Signs in sights

Proposed regulations face hearing Tuesday

October 5, 2006

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This sign proposed by the Kansas Attorney General's Office would be posted at businesses that choose to prohibit the concealed carrying of handguns. Officials are accepting comments about the design and proposed rules for the sign's use.

This sign proposed by the Kansas Attorney General's Office would be posted at businesses that choose to prohibit the concealed carrying of handguns. Officials are accepting comments about the design and proposed rules for the sign's use.

People licensed to carry concealed handguns will be able to pack heat while visiting nearly any business in the state next year, unless a sign is posted prohibiting the practice.

The sign proposed by the Kansas Attorney General's Office - based upon the design seen above - is up for a public review during a hearing Tuesday in Topeka.

Each sign would measure at least 8.5 inches by 11 inches, include the required font and logo, be yellow with black print and be "displayed in a conspicuous manner that is clearly visible to the public," according to the proposed regulations.

Tammy Moody, who makes her living selling signs, doesn't even have to see the proposal to know she doesn't like it.

"If I was operating a classy place, I wouldn't want it," said Moody, account manager for Luminous Neon Art & Sign Systems, 615 Vt.

Officials in the Kansas Attorney General's Office welcome such comments and others regarding the design and proposed rules regarding its use. Chuck Sexson, director of the office's Concealed Carry Unit, said a final sign should be approved and ready for use by early November.

The final design will be available at the office's Web site so that businesses can commission signs or print their own. The state plans to issue concealed carry licenses - 2,205 people have applied so far, including 62 in Douglas County - beginning Jan. 1.

Concerns already have surfaced that the sign wouldn't expressly prohibit other weapons, such as knives or throwing stars, Sexson said. The sign remains a work in progress.

"The point is to make it a uniform sign, so that people who are to obey the sign can readily identify it and obey it," he said.

Concealed weapons

Here are regulations proposed by Kansas Attorney General's Office regarding the state's new law that permits the concealed carrying of handguns by people who have secured a state license. The Attorney General's Office plans to issue licenses beginning Jan. 1. View the document »

State Sen. Phil Journey, R-Haysville, doesn't expect many businesses to post signs anyway. Most businesses in the 46 other states that have such laws have opted against posting prohibition signs, he said, because law-abiding gun carriers often would avoid such places, even if they weren't carrying guns.

"They will end up creating a potential for a negative impact on their income," said Journey, who wrote the bill and is a lawyer and chairman of the Kansas Second Amendment Society. "These people will trade with businesses that do not oppose their free exercise of their rights."

Journey chaired a committee that designed the sign regulations, working with the attorney general's office. Other members: Mike Murray, director of governmental affairs for Sprint; Amy Bertrand, chief attorney for the legal section of the Kansas Department of Administration; Jacob Swisher, of the Kansas Sportsmen's Alliance; Doug Wareham, senior vice president for government relations at the Kansas Bankers Assn.; and Dale Wasson, a member of the Kansas Board of Emergency Medical Services.



Have your say

What: Public hearing to review regulations regarding implementation of a law permitting concealed carry of handguns in Kansas. When and where: 1 p.m. Tuesday at the SRS Learning Center, 2600 S.W. East Circle Drive South, Room A, Topeka. Why: The Kansas Attorney General's Office is seeking public input regarding the proposed regulations, particularly the design and rules for signs. E-mail comments to ksagcc@ksag.org or mail written comments to Kansas Attorney General, c/o Julene Miller, 120 S.W. 10th Ave., Topeka 66612-1597, Attn.: Proposed Concealed Carry Regulations.

Comments

BigAl 7 years, 10 months ago

I wonder why Wyatt Earp outlawed the carrying of guns in Dodge City?

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years, 10 months ago

Even without concealed carry, you had the right to carry a weapon-- it just couldn't be concealed. But the reaction of most people when they see someone who isn't a LE officer packin' heat is that they are some sort of vigilante wackjob, and that's what really necessitates legalized concealment. Not even wackjobs want to be seen as wackjobs by the general population.

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Porter 7 years, 11 months ago

Throwing stars?? Did that make anyone else giggle a little?

"Sorry officer, the sign didn't say anything at all about throwing stars. Is it ok if I keep my ninja mask on?"

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Moderateguy 7 years, 11 months ago

The Kansas permit is for CCH, which relates to Concealed Carry Handguns. A permit only allows the concealed carry of handguns. Ironically, throwing stars etc. would still be illegal to carry concealed by everyone (even permit holders.) I believe knives with blades less than 4" long are legal everywhere. People quick to criticize should first read and understand the statute.

I'm with you Porter. Made me laugh too.

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alpanp 7 years, 10 months ago

I'm in favor of such a sign: Why should a law abiding gun owner give such a business owner free security? It tells armed bandits which places are safe to rob and law abiding gun owners which businesses to boycott. Way to go Kansas!

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Citizen 7 years, 10 months ago

I think its great, if a business wants to put its patrons at risk by disarming everyone in their building, then they should suffer by having a big ugly sign on their doors. Putting that sign up and expecting to keep bad guys with guns out is ignorance, and making a criminal protection zone (by putting a sign up) is dangerous

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unceldaveb 7 years, 10 months ago

The sign needs to be really big, and posted at every building entrance. Unlike most other states, a permit holder that inadvertantly carries in a posted place will face criminal charges, a misdemenor the first time, more serious a second time. I'm concerned that some businesses will put the sign in some obscure location, or have it partially covered with something else. In Missouri, a person is just asked to leave, nothing criminal unless he refuses. Kansas has plenty of ways for a person to get into trouble because of the patchwork of regulations. What's perfectly legal one place, is illegal somewhere else. The only thing "uniform" about Kansas laws if that they are not uniform at all. Lots of people have been nailed in the many poorly marked, non statutory speed zones in Kansas, a classic speed trap, just like Arkansas in the 50's. There's a good chance CCH will turn into yet another "gotcha", only this one is worse, because it's not just a fine, it's a criminal matter.

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prioress 7 years, 10 months ago

I, for one, feel much safer already. I can hardly wait for the "legal lead" to fly. This reminds me in some ways of the recent criticism of police in tragic situations; we are too heavily influenced by television myths. If one pulls a gun on a bad guy, one had better be ready to put a bullet in their heart 1/10 of a second after the "quick draw" is complete. Really bad boys won't run from another with a gun; they'll just take it away or shoot you. As the Army has found, training people to kill without thought is not always easy. I hope our "protectors" do something more than shoot at paper targets on the range twice a year.

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Eride 7 years, 10 months ago

"I think its great, if a business wants to put its patrons at risk by disarming everyone in their building, then they should suffer by having a big ugly sign on their doors. Putting that sign up and expecting to keep bad guys with guns out is ignorance, and making a criminal protection zone (by putting a sign up) is dangerous"

There is almost ZERO need to conceal carry a firearm within most businesses and honestly if I were in a business being robbed by an armed assailant I would much rather the robber leave with the cash then have him get into a fire fight with a bunch of idiotic gun touting hicks. That kind of situation puts everyone's life in danger, despite what everyone who is pro-conceal carry seems to think, arming barely trained individuals with no law enforcement experience so they can carry out vigilante justice makes armed situations MORE dangerous to bystanders not LESS dangerous.

I work in a bank and imagine this situation. Someone walks up to me and points a gun to my chest and demands money, now imagine another customer in the bank pulls out a gun and gets ME shot. Wow thanks, you just got me killed instead of letting the robber just take the insured money out of the freaking bank where he will most likely get caught within the hour. Good job. Now take this situation of an armed robbery and apply it to any other type of business. There is no case where it is better for a bystander to whip out a gun and put everyone's lives in danger then for that person to sit his ass down and let the robber leave.

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