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13-year-old reports rape

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A 13-year-old girl told police she was taking out the trash at her apartment in north central Lawrence when a 43-year-old male acquaintance pushed her back into her apartment and raped her. The incident happened between 9 p.m. and 9:30 p.m. June 11 but wasn't reported to police until Friday. The suspect, a 43-year-old Lawrence man, was booked into the Douglas County Jail Saturday on suspicion of aggravated burglary and aggravated indecent liberties with a child.

Comments

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Dang. Not good. How can she feel safe, now?

I'm not going to post what I really want to post. Let's just say "the dude messed up, huge". THIRTEEN!

Confrontation 8 years, 7 months ago

This type of disgusting stuff will continue to happen until these types of men receive real punishment.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Often, rape is a true "crime of passion" in that the perpetrator is so motivated by their urges that they aren't even thinking straight. This is why it often doesn't matter if the punishment is severe or not, because when a man is 100% enslaved to an urge (100%!), then he has no thought of the consequences.

This is why so many rapists kill their victims. Up until the point of "sexual release" (an adult reading this knows what I mean), he's only thinking about the urge. Once that "release" happens, he is hit by guilt and fear; and suddenly understands that he's in deep crap. That leads to the panic that causes so many rapist to become murderers, even though it wasn't planned that way.

As a topic of discussion: pretty sickening. I'm so glad she turned him in! What a brave girl! So many girls would have hid the crime to avoid the shame. Now, she has a chance to see him pay and to begin the journey of recovery.

Sigmund 8 years, 7 months ago

If he did it, and if he is found guilty, and if Paula Martin does the sentencing, I wonder if he'll get the 30 days in jail she gave the last group of adults that raped a 13 year old girl?

reginafliangie 8 years, 7 months ago

Kind of a little different situation isn't it Sigmund? That girl was at a party and taking part in drinking and other things. Even though no girl deserves getting raped. She put herself in a dangerous situation where she was probably intoxicated and didn't realize that this type of thing could happen.

This most recent case, the poor girl was just taking out the trash.

Now, in either case nobody should only get 30 days in jail for such a horrible crime. But I think because of the differences in the situations that hopefully this guy will pay dearly for ruining the life of that little gir.

BrianR 8 years, 7 months ago

OldEnuf2BYurDad, OMFG, where do you get your ideas? B

Sigmund 8 years, 7 months ago

regina, correct different circumstances but the same crime, and under the sentencing grid you would predict a similar outcome. The KS Supreme Court told Paula that even if the first girl 'was asking for it' that should not be a mitigating circumstance and not reduce the sentence.

That being said, I am not willing to convict this guy quite yet. If this guy has no history of sexual assault or other criminal activity it seems to me unusual that a 43 year old would out of the blue commit his first rape on a 13 year old neighbor that could identify him. With all due respect to OldEnough, if he could control his urges from 18-43, why would he just snap now?

reginafliangie 8 years, 7 months ago

Well Sigmund you make good arguments. But I think what I was saying about the last case and the easy "time". Was because I feel the judge was sentencing for the situation, not the true crime itself. Wrong as it is. That is how I felt about it. So if that were true, then this next one would be really "bad", since the girl was just taking out the trash. I am just assuming and we all know what happens when you do that.

You do make a good point about this new situation. Whos to say he doesn't have history, he just happened to get caught. Maybe it was consenual between the man and the girl. Either way, it is illegal and he will still have to have a registered sex offender on his rap sheet, if he gets proven guilty.

Steve Jacob 8 years, 7 months ago

If it's true, he will have the "offender" tag on him after a few years away.

optimist 8 years, 7 months ago

I find it interesting that someone has the belief that this case is any different than the previous rape case that Judge Martin heard.

What the 13 year old in the previous case was doing is irrelevant. Her mother let her down by not preventing her from being in that situation but never-the-less she was 13 years old and raped by adult men who knew it was a crime. They watched her get intoxicated and when she was clearly inebriated they took advantage of her. She was not old enough to give consent under any circumstances (sober or not). For the Judge to consider the girls intoxication in mitigation is preposterous. The child could not give consent by law. The only real difference between the two cases is the method of persuasion used. In this case physical persuasion was used while in the later case it was alcohol was used.

Centrist 8 years, 7 months ago

No charge of actual "rape" - interesting.

reginafliangie 8 years, 7 months ago

Oh I totally agree optimist. I was just saying I thought the judge ruled as per the situation, not the crime itself. Which was wrong. That was the point I was making. So if the same judge got this case, then I would have to say she would feel differenly towards the accused, given her track record.

And the way the article reads it seems that it might of been consentual sense he was charge with agg indicent lib instead of rape.

Sigmund 8 years, 7 months ago

21-3504. Aggravated indecent liberties with a child. (a) Aggravated indecent liberties with a child is:

  (1)   Sexual intercourse with a child who is 14 or more years of age but less than 16 years of age;

  (2)   engaging in any of the following acts with a child who is 14 or more years of age but less than 16 years of age and who does not consent thereto:

  (A)   Any lewd fondling or touching of the person of either the child or the offender, done or submitted to with the intent to arouse or satisfy the sexual desires of either the child or the offender, or both; or

  (B)   causing the child to engage in any lewd fondling or touching of the person of another with the intent to arouse or satisfy the sexual desires of the child, the offender or another; or

  (3)   engaging in any of the following acts with a child who is under 14 years of age:

  (A)   Any lewd fondling or touching of the person of either the child or the offender, done or submitted to with the intent to arouse or to satisfy the sexual desires of either the child or the offender, or both; or

  (B)   soliciting the child to engage in any lewd fondling or touching of the person of another with the intent to arouse or satisfy the sexual desires of the child, the offender or another.

  (b)   It shall be a defense to a prosecution of aggravated indecent liberties with a child as provided in subsection (a)(1), (a)(2)(A) and (a)(3)(A) that the child was married to the accused at the time of the offense.

  (c)   Aggravated indecent liberties with a child as described in subsections (a)(1) and (a)(3) is a severity level 3, person felony. Aggravated indecent liberties with a child as described in subsection (a)(2) is a severity level 4, person felony.

Sigmund 8 years, 7 months ago

21-3502. Rape. (a) Rape is: (1) Sexual intercourse with a person who does not consent to the sexual intercourse, under any of the following circumstances:

  (A)   When the victim is overcome by force or fear;

  (B)   when the victim is unconscious or physically powerless; or

  (C)   when the victim is incapable of giving consent because of mental deficiency or disease, or when the victim is incapable of giving consent because of the effect of any alcoholic liquor, narcotic, drug or other substance, which condition was known by the offender or was reasonably apparent to the offender;

  (2)   sexual intercourse with a child who is under 14 years of age;

  (3)   sexual intercourse with a victim when the victim's consent was obtained through a knowing misrepresentation made by the offender that the sexual intercourse was a medically or therapeutically necessary procedure; or

  (4)   sexual intercourse with a victim when the victim's consent was obtained through a knowing misrepresentation made by the offender that the sexual intercourse was a legally required procedure within the scope of the offender's authority.

  (b)   It shall be a defense to a prosecution of rape under subsection (a)(2) that the child was married to the accused at the time of the offense.

  (c)   Rape as described in subsection (a)(1) or (2) is a severity level 1, person felony. Rape as described in subsection (a)(3) or (4) is a severity level 2, person felony.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Sig:

Two possibilities, as I see it:

1 - This isn't his first time. There are many unsolved crimes, including rapes.

2 - Everyone starts somewhere. A 43 year old rapist doesn't have to start at 20. He may have been dabbling in kiddie porn, visiting prostitutes, etc in an effort to keep his urges satisfied. A lot of men think (and oddly, a number of so-call sex experts as well) that porn helps to "curb" appetites. It eventually causes the user to become desensitized to it, leaving them needing something more "intense" to fulfill the urge. Not everyone goes from "Nasty Grannies Vol. XII" to raping a child, but for many, that is the eventual result. Maybe he had reached a point where he "burst".

Another thought, and this was one of my first thoughts: his actions could have been partially influenced by drug use. Drugs can impair judgement.

Brian: Am I supposed to respond to that or was that just a jab? If you must know my source: I go to Ask Jeeves.

BrianR 8 years, 7 months ago

"Hes right Brian."

Wow, rape myths abound.

No, rape is a pure act of violence, passion has nothing to do with it. Rape is to hurt and or humiliate.

adky 8 years, 7 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Brian:

"Passion" has many meanings. By "crime of passion", I assure you that I wasn't trying to imply "amore" or "erotica". By "passion" I meant that it is emotionally driven and impulsive. It is, as you stated, an act of violence and distain. But, that is what indulging in fantasy sex leads to in many cases. The objectification of women and the desensitizing creates a deep distain and eventually a burning hate for the "object" that is "desired". The perversion of what is otherwise a "normal" desire for sexuality becomes so twisted that it leads to violence. Enforcer's comments about "control" help to explain why some men become rapists through fantasy, and some don't.

msturner 8 years, 7 months ago

Twenty eight years ago a man dragged a twelve year old Lawrence girl into the bushes beside a neighborhood pool. He raped her, sodomized her and was in the process of slashing her throat when he was discovered. He served 10 years in prison. The girl suffered a severe case of post traumatic disorder, which triggered a bi-polar disorder and she has been suffering since. She is gorgeous, sweet, kind ... and suffers massive migraines every day of her life. She may be the sweetest woman I ever met ... but because of what happened to her she cannot live anything we would call a normal life. She has children she loves as dearly as anyone loves her children ... but because of that sadist her children are both shamed by her problems and suffer from seeing what she goes through just to try and get out of bed. WOW! He served 10 whole years. She and everyone who knows her has suffered for close to thirty because of him. I don't believe such sick bas***ds can be cured. I think in severe cases like this one the man should be castrated and placed in general prison population with a big CR (Child Rapist) or P (Pedophile) on their chests. There are those who want to rehabilitate in prison - even those who cannot be rehabilitated. That concept is not ancient or old. Rehabilitation is a fairly recent historical concept. No ... prisons historically have been to punish people who committed crimes and to isolate those offenders to protect the population for a period of time. Frankly I think that the punishment and isolation should be a mich larger priority. Monte

ben_ness 8 years, 7 months ago

OldEnuf: I have always understood that "Rape" had nothing to do with passion and everything to do with control and power.

Also, wouldn't it have made more sense to say, "Man, this guy raped somebody, how horrible!" Your statement makes it sound as if the victim were of age it would have been okay.

ben_ness 8 years, 7 months ago

OldEnuf: Can you please cite where you plagerized your last post from. :)

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Ben and Power:

Did either of you read my post? : "By "passion" I meant that it is emotionally driven and impulsive."

So, how did I say that rape was "passionate"?

-

"Your statement makes it sound as if the victim were of age it would have been okay."

WHAT part of my post gave you that idea?!

I don't think either of you took the time to read all my posts, did you?

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

Don't you think, in all fairness, that before someone says "you are not fit for parenting" that a person should know something about them first? You speed read my posts so poorly that you never even understood them, then you fire off with the insults. Being quick on the draw is not something to be proud of. Once again, the anonymity of the web makes it easy for ordinary people to choose to be abusive to others in ways that they wouldn't if they were face-to-face. Not cool. Not warranted. I deserve an apology, but am not holding my breath for one.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

NO, answer me, or we'll just have to admit that you really should have taken some time to READ my posts.

How do you think it feels? Or, are you like so many of the rest, and really don't come here with any regard for kindness?

Honestly, do you have the character to apologize, or will you pretend that you were in the right? "Whatever" is what children say to each other. It's not how adults communicate.

ben_ness 8 years, 7 months ago

I'm out of this discussion, it is getting a little touch for my taste.

One, thing, though OldEnuf. Powershopper is right. In the Psych classes I took in College. One of the first things we learned about crimial behavior is that Rape isn't a crime of passion rather all about control.

Passion is just an excuse.

Good night.

i_have_only_valid_opinions 8 years, 7 months ago

Posted by powershopper (anonymous) on June 19, 2006 at 4:14 p.m. (Suggest removal):

"Where are you getting your information from!!?? Or are you just making it up as you go along. Which, would be fairly typical of a clueless Male."

I was just sitting here reading about this terrible event and watching you all badger each other over the term "passion" and thinking that this is yet another discussion gone astray...and then you just start gender bashing. Very mature. I'm not supporting or contradicting any of your comments back and forth to "...Dad", but I tend to listen more to people when they aren't randomly throwing the smack down on genders, races, religion, etc. for no reason. Are you frustrated with the "clueless" man in your life or something?

xenophonschild 8 years, 7 months ago

When I first went to the joint (Lansing) in '74, there were no rapos or child molesters in the inmate population. The cops checked them into PC (protective custody) as soon as they hit the door. Every now and then a dumb ass would insist on being released into the general population; as soon as he was stabbed or piped or paralyzed for life, the rest of them decided to stay put in PC.

That was a good thing, because every convict knew that, no matter what, when you got out, you made sure you left women and kids alone. It was deterrent, in its purest, most effective form.

The molesters filed suit in the late '70, alleging that being put into PC deprived them of their rights. So the cops locked down the joint and sent out circulars to the effect that, should anything happen to anybody coming out of PC, the offending party would be buried in solitary until the walls crumbled.

That was the beginning of the end. The rapos and molesters flooded onto the yard, and there wasn't much we could do but snarl at them occasionally and catch one behind the cell houses with pillow cases and baseball bats.

There are so many of them now that doing time is a trial. Most of the blacks are gangbangers; most of the white "inmates" - not convicts, but inmates - have some kind of sex crime. One hell of a note.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

"control"

That IS emotional. Do you think the rapist is feeling NOTHING when they commit their crimes? The intensity of emotion is "passion" even if it's not "passionate" in the sexual/erotic sense.

I fully explained what I meant by "passion", and that it wasn't "erotic".

You misunderstood me.

I, too, am out of here.

I pray for this child, that she can find healing.

Shane Garrett 8 years, 7 months ago

Sorry to say that this took place in my neighborhood. There seems to be more to the story than is being told. The girls mother was unavailable for several days. The story goes the girl was having boys over. Now there is a charge of rape. It will be interesting to see how the police persue this case. The 43 year old man recently moved here from Mississippi. The "boys" are all over 18 years of age.
Either way, I feel sorry for the 13 year old girl. Because I think it is going to come down to her word against his.

i_have_only_valid_opinions 8 years, 7 months ago

Posted by powershopper (anonymous) on June 19, 2006 at 4:45 p.m. (Suggest removal):

"I have only valid opinions: I am a man, I guess assuming does really make an "ass" out of "u" and "me""

Your posts are truly inspiring. Whether you are male, female, transgendered, whatever...your comment about the "clueless male" was ill-placed in this context.

i_have_only_valid_opinions 8 years, 7 months ago

OldEnuf2BYurDad:

Although I don't know if "passion" is the best choice of descriptors here, I understand the point you are trying to make. I think it's all a matter of semantics. In the end it's all about the need for control that manifests itself in the form of physically forced sex. I believe every case contains both the need for control and the sexual aspect in varying degrees. If it was 100% control related I believe we would see more tortures, kidnappings, and things of that nature where control could be exercised over a longer period of time.

I feel terrible for this girl. How come this guy wasn't charged with rape?

Charles L Bloss Jr 8 years, 7 months ago

Because he was thinking with the wrong head. Thank you, Lynn

BrianR 8 years, 7 months ago

OldEnuf2BYurDad, The more you post the more you demonstrate that you have no idea where you're going with this.

"Passion' in the context I am framing it is -- I come home to find someone having sex with my parakeet so I gouge their eyes out with a plastic spoon and shove them through a chipper.

Ya with me so far?

That word should never be used in the context of a rape.

Your only out is to stop talking. I didn't mean to slam you it just freaks me out to see rape myths perpetuated.

Disclaimer: No parakeets were harmed in the typing of this post.

Baille 8 years, 7 months ago

"Often, rape is a true "crime of passion" in that the perpetrator is so motivated by their urges that they aren't even thinking straight."

That is SO wrong. The origins of rape have little to do with sexual urges or sexual gratification. There is no "need" being purged. I hope that is not what you meant and I am just misunderstanding your point. If not, step away from Jeeves and go the the reference desk at Watson and start doing some serious research.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

I wasn't making reference to a sexual urge.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 8 years, 7 months ago

I'll stop posting when I think it's in everyone's best interests.

"I didn't mean to slam you it just freaks me out to see rape myths perpetuated."

It's unfortunate that after ALL THESE POSTS you still don't understand what I've written. Nothing I've written is perpetuating a myth (unless of course, someone misunderstands my words). Next time I'll work EXTRA HARD to avoid whatever semantic error I made today.

NO ONE could rape someone without an INTENSE outflowing of NEGATIVE emotions. IN THAT CONTEXT, it is a crime of passion. NOT "passionate", which is not what I'm saying.

Curious 8 years, 7 months ago

pas*sion noun 1) A powerful emotion, such as love, joy, hatred, or anger. 4) An abandoned display of emotion, especially of anger

passion noun 1: strong feeling or emotion [syn: passionateness] 2: intense passion or emotion [syn: heat, warmth] 3: something that is desired intensely; "his rage for fame destroyed him" [syn: rage] 4: an irrational but irresistible motive for a belief or action [syn: mania, cacoethes]

intense, driving, or overpowering feeling or emotion; especially : any violent or intense emotion that prevents reflection -see also HEAT OF PASSION

heat of pas*sion : an agitated state of mind (as anger or terror) prompted by provocation sufficient to overcome the ability of a reasonable person to reflect on and control his or her actions called also heat of blood heat of passion on sudden provocation hot blood sudden heat sudden heat of passion sudden passion -see also MANSLAUGHTER -compare COLD BLOOD, COOL STATE OF BLOOD

As I understand it, passion has nothing to do with love or sexual urges per say. It includes them but is not limited to them. A crime of passion typically involves one person's direct interaction with another person. Robbing a bank is not typically a crime of passion. Unless you hate the bank for some reason.

Watching television and movies and reading books has maybe changed the definition of passion. Wonder if we analyzed the ages of the participants in this conversation, we would find a correlation to the definition of "passion."

Baille 8 years, 7 months ago

Seeking an explanation is much different than seeking justification.

happyone 8 years, 7 months ago

enforcer-- If we know what motivates them we can STOP them. Turning a blind eye and saying they just need stopped will not work.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 8 years, 7 months ago

Enforcer, is ti jerks like you that enabled Hitler to create the Third Reich. Just shoot em. You have no concept of how many people get snared by thefrenzied witch-hunt mentality that currently exists with evening news reports leading with sex offender stories, and newspapers using flashing red headlines. The truth is that stupid trailer-trash are using this dodge to cover their own irresponsibilities and that non-thinking jerks like you will come along, "yeah, yeah, shoot em, shoot em" A lot of innocent people get tagged by our vicious and unprincipled officers looking for a quick and easy grab. These immoral and indecent thugs have no scruples and will jump at a chance to grab an innocent person who "fits the profile" (a quote from a Lawrence Police Officer) and try to spin up some "evidence" to justify their vendetta. Yeah, enforcer, go for it. Sieg Heil!!!! HOpe you never get into any position of any authority, we already have too many nazis in the public employ.

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