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Did your voting experience go smoothly?

Asked at Massachusetts Street on November 3, 2004

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Photo of Frances Boyer

“Yes. I voted in Johnson County with the touch screen. It was pretty easy. It’s the first time I’ve ever voted.”

Photo of C.B. Whalen

“Yes, it did. It was busy, but it went right through. It was great. Everybody was upbeat and positive.”

Photo of Gretchen Kidd

“Actually I voted prior to the voting date, because I haven’t registered in this county. It was very smooth. I just walked right in.”

Photo of Tim Queen

“Yes. I voted early. No waiting, pretty straightforward. I think that everybody was happy to do it and get it done early. ”


missmagoo 13 years, 7 months ago

i'm just DYING to hear from LuLu today... how bout that John Kerry?? WOO HOO GO W!

Carmenilla 13 years, 7 months ago

I think we all know that the hatred and name-calling come from both sides, Savage.

missmagoo 13 years, 7 months ago

ok, for the last time, Bush said THERE WILL BE NO DRAFT. None. Nada. Comprendo?

missmagoo 13 years, 7 months ago

lulu and shrub go together, that's why

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

jr16250 - I intended to say that "the democrats will NOT discuss this issue because it serves of no political gain. Sorry for the confusion!

Have a good evening everyone!

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

Scuddy - You're correct in stating that not every individual who claims to be a Christian is a good person. I have non-Christian friends that I believe treat others better than some individuals from my old church who claim to be Christians. My whole point is that I believe that there are many more Christians doing for those less fortunate than there are non-Christians. Without Christianity, the world would probably be near full chaos. As for Bush, me and others enforcing morality on the rest of the country - I guess you must not consider murder and theft as morality even though both come from the Bible. Why do you pick and chose when it is a matter of convenience. In a majority of cases, abortion is a matter of continence, period. As for stem cell research, the fact is that President Bush is the ONLY president that has allowed it under certain situations. In addition, the only reason you won't debate me on when life begins is simply because you can't win the debate. It is impossible for any person to prove that an fetus, embryo or zygote isn't alive.

As for me being feel with hate??? How on earth would you know that or can you assume that? Simply because I don't agree with you? I think your stance is ridiculous but I don't think you are a angry person - I just think that you are another crazy liberal person who is trying to make America into a socialist country because you're more worried about your selfish rights rather than society as a whole. Am I right? :o) The hatred in America that you speak of comes from the liberal media, liberal politicians and Hollywood. They are pouting because they didn't get their way! FACT!

As for Bush and support from American's. I believe that a majority of America just gave him an endorsement. Over 50% of the voters gave their vote to Bush. Clinton never got more than 50%. That makes your point of view in the minority.

scuddy 13 years, 7 months ago


If people were responsible and took responsibility for their actions then we would not have the need for abortions and that is the sad truth. We have more forms of birth control available now then ever and people still act like a bunch of idiots. You can be Christian and you can be pro-life-thats your choice but you and Bush and all other others should not legislate "morality" on everyone else. Bush was elected by America, however I don't consider him my president. I am not going to continue on with the "what is a life" argument with you because it is clear that you don't get it and never will. I guess its better to let thousands of people die and suffer from diseases than to use a few embryos for research purposes. You are also clearly a person who is filled with hate. You basically said that Christians are so good for helping people in other countries more than anyone else. You don't have to be Christian to be a good person-lets get that one straight. You aren't better than me because you are Christian. I know you think I am just a tree-hugging liberal and frankly I don't care. The reality is that conservatives and greedy oil-loving crooks like Bush are destroying this planet and it doen't matter what you believe whether you are a Christian, Non-Christian, pro-life or pro-choice- we all have to find some common ground. I have never seen so much hate and selfishness in people as I do today.

scuddy 13 years, 7 months ago


I think the country is pretty divided down the middle on who they wanted for president. It was 51% for Bush and 48% for Kerry so Bush didn't win by a whole lot. I think that most people would agree that they don't remember being an embryo therefore I don't get why so much debate on the subject. An embryo doesn't have the abiltiy to say that it wants to live or die. You want to talk about murder. Lets talk about the murder of the planet! It was interesting how the only band-wagon you could jump on was the stem-cell research/pro-life band-wagon. Out of all the issues I brought up in my first e-mail, that was the only one you could hop on. That is pretty typical of a conservative Christian. Just pull your religious blanket over your head and suck your thumb and everything will be just fine. I know a lot of upset people out there who were pulling for Kerry or at least someone besides lousy W. The only people who are real happy about his re-election are people like yourself who are Christian conservatives who probably make 6 figures. There really is not a thing I could think of that Bush did right in his first term and I don't anticipate anything good could come of the next four years. Clinton was a good president. He was one of the best we have had in a while. I am sure just because of his "personal issues" you think he was a horrible president which I don't understand. The 90's were fat. People had good paying jobs and stable work. America was prospering. Now look at it. People are out of work, environmental policies have been cut way back and lots of hand outs for the rich. I am really concerned about the fate of our country.

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

Scuddy - So your argument for whether or not a human is alive is continuant on whether or not they can remember that time period? Are you serious! Tell me about the first 6 months or maybe even first 18 months of your life. Come on - just one thing. What's that? You can't - darn, maybe you weren't alive since you can't remember it. I guess we should allow parents to murder their 6 month old too.

As for Clinton - I think the argument can be made that he profited off the Reagan administration policies during his first four years. As for the second term, if you recall, he left the Bush II administration in a recession. Add to the recession, 9-11 and President Bush did a pretty good job. I judge a man by what I know as fact and we know that Clinton was NOT honest, was more interested in embarrassing his wife and eventually gave pardons to all his criminal friends. President Bush gets into office and puts an immediate end to Enron and other scum executive and Bush gets the blame for their behavior. Come on Scuddy - do you really thing that these executives did all this damage in the short amount of months that Bush was in office. It was going on the whole time that Clinton was in office and he didn't care to deal with it. Clinton spent more tax payer money going after Gates and Microsoft than he did going after OBL. You darn right Clinton's moral standards ticked me off. Teen-age oral sex is at an all time high. After all, it isn't sex, right? Lying is at an all time high and your argument of comparing murder to our environment shows how utterly ridiculous your views are in compared to mine. I'm starting to believe that your another Lulu who is simply trying to get everyones goat by taking a ridiculous stance. Hey - how about Howard Stern as the next Democratic leader? He is right down your alley.

By the way, I think being the first President since Reagan to win a MAJORITY of the votes is quite good and quite encouraging.

How is that for answering your questions? I know, I know - as the true liberal you are, you 'll come back and tell me that I don't have a valid point just so you can avoid being caught for having no valid talking points yourself. You are a true liberal, aren't you!

mrcairo 13 years, 7 months ago

Quite Smoooooth. The number-2 pencil was sharpened nicely. I colored the little circles, and went about my day.

craigers 13 years, 7 months ago

No lines when I went last Thursday. It was a very smooth process.

TheBowman 13 years, 7 months ago

I have just one thing to say: never underestimate the stupidity of the American public.

Savage 13 years, 7 months ago

Scudd(zz)y That's just YOUR view! Scientific and religious points of view don't always coincide with one another. I'm sure most philosophers woulg agree.... Its just your view, that its just larry's view. Easy!

ms_canada 13 years, 7 months ago

well, larry, i am happy for you that you have first hand knowledge of the situation in iraq. but most of the rest of us have no choice but to rely on what we read in the media or see on CNN. why do you insist on taking what i say the wrong way. i was not judging....... no you are right i was judging. you are the ones who should be doing the judging, not us foreigners. we just call it like we see it or read about it in the wash. post and ny times. and the toronto globe and mail. but tell you what i will finish with this subject. you will hear no more from me poking my nose into your affairs. ciao ragazi and in case you know no italian, that is not an insult.

KawValleyGirl 13 years, 7 months ago

Couldn't have been better! Yep and no overgrown children fits to throw either! Victory in this case especially has been very sweet. I read posts on other local forums yesterday that wished for Republicans to be dismembered and beaten in the streets. The Democrats behavior has been a loss all along! Perhaps hating your neighbor isn't popular after all!

Hi_Jinks 13 years, 7 months ago

Oh, sure! My voting experience went very smoothly!

I'm just glad that Bush has won both the electoral vote and the popular vote this time around! ---Now we don't have to hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth over the next four years about how Bush is an "illegitimate president"!

And barring some truly bizzare occurrence in Ohio.........It looks like there will be no states that were "stolen", either!!!!!!!!!!

----Thank God for that!

I was getting so darn sick and tired of the same old refrains from Bush bashers over these last four years.............

Bush stole Florida! Bush stole Florida!

But Bush didn't win the popular vote!

What the hell is the Electoral College anyway?! It's such and old and unfair way to elect a president!

Bush got the Supreme Court to do his bidding!

Bush got his brother Jeb to pull some strings!

Katherine Harris was nothing but a Bush/Cheney puppet!!

Dick Cheney prevented millions of black voters nationwide from entering polling stations by using local cops wielding billy clubs, German Shepards, fire hoses turned up full blast, and by ordering the military to use low-flying, rather menacing-looking black helicopters to intimidate would-be black voters!!

Florida was a conspiracy! It was all a Bush/Cheney conspiracy!

Blah! Blah! Blah!

Reader 13 years, 7 months ago

Mine Went Very Smoothly. Congradulations To The "Winner/s". Right Now, I Know Where I Stand, Physically..........As Far As, My Health Care / Insurance Emotionally.......As Far As, Local / State / National Government Financially.........As Far As, My Job Securities There Are So Many Things To Look At, These Are Just A Few Of My Concerns. I'll Give It Another Year, To See If I Am Better Off Then, Than I Am Today. Only Time Will Tell.

Carmenilla 13 years, 7 months ago

Voting went smoothly. I was pleased as punch to see so many people out to vote. In fact, the people in my line were mostly younger folks. I have never seen so many 20-somethings voting. As far as the Ohio ballots go, we were joking that hopefully, the "four more years" won't be spent finding out the winner! And there was no landslide either way. Hopefully we can find some commonalties despite this country's deep political divide. I wonder....

Savage 13 years, 7 months ago

What... No dem hatred and name calling today? Finally... Peace on the posts for another 3 and a half years. The liberal papers failed, Moveon dot org failed, the anti family values rhetoric failed. The people have chosen the leader of the free world. Long live the king!

me 13 years, 7 months ago

Well all I can say is that I'm disgusted. You republicans have absolutely no right to complain when your job gets "outsourced" to India or Pakistan, the next time you have to pay more than $2 for a gallon of gas, when your brother, son or lover is killed in some foreign sand country or when you can no longer afford prescription drugs or health care benefits. I hope you all feel comfortable in your decision. I mean, whether or not a man gets to marry another man is such a more important issue, isn't it?

jonas 13 years, 7 months ago

Hi-Jinks, Kaw Valleygirl: Well put.

Hi_Jinks 13 years, 7 months ago

Bugbear, Hoofy's been banned! Haven't you heard?

tell_it_like_it_is 13 years, 7 months ago

Hey Miss Magoo...heres hoping your job is the next one to get outsourced!! Its a great day for America!! How many more kids are gonna die in the desert now? How long will it take for old Bush to get the draft going (about 6 months I'd guess). How many more people are gonna lose their job? And when is gas gonna hit $3.00 a gallon? And how many people are gonna freeze this winter cause they can't heat their house? Oh yeah its a great day for America! Gods Own Party won.

Lulu 13 years, 7 months ago

I Pity.

I cannot believe the morons who voted for Shrub. It astounds me that the American populace would vote for such a corrupt person. The Southern states should be forced to breakaway from the Republic. They are clueless. This is the reason why I cannot stand competition. Unfortunately WE are all losers having Shrub in the Whitehouse for 4 more years.

I pity the defenseless citizens of the Middle East and the bombs Shrub will reign down upon them for NO reason, other than giving Halliburton another no bid contract so he and Cheney can get rich.

I pity the poor people of Iran who want to live in peace and harmony. It is OUR fault these people hate us so. It is OUR fault the Iranians might want a nuclear bomb. We are next door, and we are the largest harborer of nuclear weapons and biological weapons ever conceived. You can't have it both ways.

I pity the poor defenseless animals who will go to their unwitting destruction in these War for Money battles that the Shrub will engage in. I pity the poor college students who will get drafted into the military for Shrubs industrial complex wars. I pity all the people who get their jobs outsourced. I pity all the people who go hungry in this country and across the globe because of our greedy president filling his pockets with taxdollars his rich friends pay him for their tax breaks.

Keep Hope Alive!

craigers 13 years, 7 months ago

Some people still amaze me. Does anybody wonder why jobs get outsourced? Because the American public doesn't want to pay the high prices for products and goods. And a competitive market means that you are the most profitable if you keep your costs down and revenues up. Well we can't sell things at too high a price or nobody will buy them. And since we can't raise prices, we must lower expenses. That is what all of the companies are doing. Lowering costs so they can be profitable. Maybe Kerry would have made gas and other fuel prices go down and made companies not outsource as much, but then prices of other products would have skyrocketed and nobody would buy them. If nobody buys the products then the stockmarket plummits. There is no one answer to the economy question and each political parties philosophy has its own merits. Quit bashing on Bush for outsourcing jobs. All of us are the reason these companies had to lower costs and outsource jobs. Oh well, I guess we will see what the economy will hold in the next four years. Hooray for 4 more years!

tell_it_like_it_is 13 years, 7 months ago

Newsflash for ya Consumer I've heard several times that if there is another draft their will be no collage deferment this time. No Canada either from what I heard.

Bugbear 13 years, 7 months ago

Ah, excuse me "tell-it-like-it-is"........Just for the record, I'm no big fan of hoof-hearted, okay............but if my memory serves me correct........did you not say to hoofy a few days ago that "come Wednesday morning you'll be crying in your corn flakes"---or words to that effect?


me 13 years, 7 months ago

Bush said there would be no draft? Bush also said Sadaam had weapons of mass destruction. Bush also said he was working hard to control the oil prices. Bush also said he was going to make sure Osama was captured and punished. Bush said....a lot of crap that made no sense. And you're right Craigers, that's exactly why jobs get outsourced. A lot of people complain about that but then be bop off to Wal Mart to buy a bunch of cheap plastic crap that was made in China. I, for one, do not. I spend a lot of time and effort trying to buy only American made, and when possible, Union made goods. It's not so easy anymore. Even my freaking Ford was made in Mexico. I'm so sad I can't even stand it. I can't believe the sheeple in this country. Not an original, open minded thought amongst half of them. :(

staff04 13 years, 7 months ago

Magoo- Why should I suddenly believe him now when I've been systematically lied to for the last four years?

Hi_Jinks 13 years, 7 months ago

jr and OB............

Let's not forget Eminem!!!---Rap's Bad Boy, himself!

"Yo! Yo! Yo! Word to my homies.... Vote up or die y'all! No f**kin' blood for oil, no whut I'm sayin', y'all?!"

tell_it_like_it_is 13 years, 7 months ago

bugbear...not so much crying in my cornflakes as I am deeply concerned that the whole damn country will go to hell in a handbag! Anyways I'm not going to spend any more time thinking about it. Its a done did deal. Ya'll won. Congrats! Time to move on ain't no where to go but forword.

Redneckgal 13 years, 7 months ago

I for one am glad its over! The guy I voted for didn't win. But hey thats the way it goes! We will be okay I think. I got admit as a mom with a kiddo that will be 18 in a few years that draft thing worries me. But we will just have to cross each bridge as we come to it.

missmagoo 13 years, 7 months ago

i am making the first post to the is lulu a real question post...


jr16250 13 years, 7 months ago

I guess I don't really understand why lulu calls President Bush "Shrub". Maybe that's just how you read when you pop a few too many tabs.

I recall clinton handing Halliburton a no-bid contract in Yugoslavia. Or were you trippin' face when that happened, too? Maybe you were honking for hemp instead of watching the news when Bin Laden tried to blow up the World Trade Center in 1993. I'm glad former President Clinton did something about that.

Who's proposed reinstating a draft in the past year? A Democrat. But maybe we should ask the United Nations if we could reinstate the draft. We do need their approval if in matters of war, right? I mean, who are we to make our own desicions?

Kerry will just have to sit in one of his 7 mansions and realize the he will never be John F. Kennedy. At least he'll still have the same initials.

Maybe now our "Political Advisors" like Ashton Kusher and P. Diddy can get back to making movies and music. Their expert opinions on war and the economy were greatly appreciated. Maybe next time guys. Maybe next time.

Lulu 13 years, 7 months ago

I do not understand why people here question me. It is a matter of understanding the issues. I understand them and you do not. It disturbs me that people call me fake. I am a real person and I have feelings too. This is a free country and I can say whatever I say, I hope, unless Ascroft sticks his nose in here.

I think it is a terrible mistake electing the shrub. John Kerry is the most intelligent politician this country has seen in years.

Everything I say and said is true. Also, I do not take medications like some of you mean spirited shrub lovers contend. If anyone needs meds, it is the conservatives. They can't see reality and think everything is peachy keen. There are real problems with this economy and this illegal war we are waging. John Kerry recognizes our troubles and I know he feels my pain.

At least John Kerry can go back to keep doing his good works.

Rosycheeks 13 years, 7 months ago

So I guess the question of the day is: Why the long face John Kerry voters??? And Lulu... you keep on living up to your name. I am pretty sure John Kerry is going to go back to his country club somewhere in the Hamptons and cry in his overpriced martini his wife paid for, then change his mind about the whole scheme of things, decide to go hug a tree, and hide in one of his undeserved mansions he owns. Frankly I am relieved Bush won. At least he isn't afraid to fight for his country's freedom, nor does he need to stoop so shallow as to get untalented celebrities to stick up for him. Ashton Kutcher is an idiot! Yeah, I said it! Enough said!

me 13 years, 7 months ago

Someone please explain to me how Sadaam Hussein, sitting over there in Iraq, not having weapons of mass destruction is somehow impeding the freedom of Americans? That's what's wrong with republicans. You will believe any crap some idiot politican regurgiates to you, no matter how flimsy or unfounded. You know, for years now, people have been killing each other over in the sand countries and not once has it crushed my freedoms here in America. Morons!

tell_it_like_it_is 13 years, 7 months ago

Hey rosy...Bush not afraid to fight for his country? Hell he didn't even go to war himself. He is just awful brave with sending other peoples kids off to war. Geez!!and they say democrats are stupid.

ms_canada 13 years, 7 months ago

Well, i have wiped my tears and blown my nose and so can comment and not ruin my keyboard. listening to the radio, i know that i am not unique in canada. we are all very sad to think of another 4 years of tragedy. tragedy for innocent iragi children, yankee and british soldiers, innocent beheaded men and perhaps even women soon. lulu - what sort of shrub were you thinking of? a mulberry bush, a thorn bush, a hickory bush or a raspberry bush? a fire bush might be appropriate. as an avid reader of history, i think i understand why the us gov. is so disliked in the world. do you repubs never read? have you any idea what goes on in european countries when the cia and fbi stick their noses into the business of foreign gov. get on line sometime and look what has been done by them in countries like uzbekistan, morocco, jordan, djibouti and the phillippines. there is so much repression of opposition parties in those countries and as soon as the gov cries terrorists the us jumps in and gives aid and the opposition pary leaders are thrown into prison never to be seen again. don't take my word, read about it. you can get foreign papers on line. i get wash. post, n.y.times daily and i read them. brit papers are also available. what you have done to your country as well as the world is worth crying over. GOD help us all.

nicegirl 13 years, 7 months ago

Thank God the right man is still in office! And to those of you that want to call me a "sheeple", moron, part of the ignorant masses or whatever other clever little slam you can come up with, I have one thing to say:

BITE ME!!! We won. You lost! HA HA HA!

Sorry in advance. I'm not usually so mean, but I'm just having one of those moments. I will now return to my usual self.

Hi_Jinks 13 years, 7 months ago


I get the feeling that, for the most part, you and I aren't exactly of the same stripe when it comes to politics

.......I do tend to vote Republican.

However, as unbelievably shocking as this may sound....

I happen to agree with you about Wal Mart! (I once read a previous post of yours a while back about Wal Mart--I think it was you, anyway), and it was very well put! I can't stand Wal Mart! I happen to be a "anti-big business, anti-corporate greed Republican"....which, I guess, makes me something of an oddity! There are too many reasons to list here why Wal Mart bothers me, so I won't. (And when I say "me", I mean me--not you!) :)!

And besides, I know that I'm getting off topic.

But I just felt like throwing that one in there! :)!!!

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

I've said since last summer that Lulu isn't a real person. I've come to the conclusion that Lulu is a KU psychology student who is doing some sort of class project or research on discussion board behavior. Lulu's attitude, beliefs and talking points are too bizarre to represent a sane person.

staff_04 - You're in DC and you didn't know that Rep. Charles Rangel, a DEMOCRAT (I repeat DEMOCRAT) from New York is the one who introduced a bill that would restore mandatory service to the military? I guess the democrats thought that they could scare the American people who don't pay attention to who introduces the bill. Check the records. The bill was voted down 402-2. Even more bizarre is the fact that Rep. Ike Skelton, DEMOCRATE (I repeat DEMOCRAT) from Missouri accused the Republican leaders of holding the vote for political gain. Skelton stated "We have something I haven't seen in 28 years in the House of Representatives - someone bringing a bill to the House they don't support." WHAT? A Democrat introduces the bill, then a Democrat accuses the Republicans of bringing something up that they don't support... Even more bizarre, Rangel wasn't even one of the two that voted for the bill. The two that voted for "mandatory service" were Democratic Reps. John Murtha, PENN and Pete Stark of California. Geezzzz - the Democrats confuse the heck out of me!!!! By the way, check the voting records for the first week of October. I believe this vote was taken around October 5 or so.

jr16250 - You're right. Clinton did use Haliburton, but the Democrats will discuss this issue because it would serve no political gain!

As for the election - the MAJORITY of American's have spoken. They have finally communicated to the leaders of the Democratic Party (A.K.A. -liberal media, the wealthy movie stars and the weirdo, wealthy people that live in the far Northeast) that we're tired of them trying to tell us how we should live (without morals) and what we should think. GOOD JOB AMERICA!!

Hi Hoofy :o) My wife (extremely conservative) thought you were a little vulgar, but I miss ya man! I'll have to recognize you each day that I post as my protest to your removal! I'll continue to fight for freedom of speech within the LJW "On the Streets". ;o)

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

ms canada - for someone who hates America sooooo much, you seem to have a fetish with our great country. Good grief, you read more American newspapers than the average American. If you want to live here so badly, just move on down here. I'll get you a 3 bedroom condo in Johnson County for say, $1,200 per month and that is a great deal.

Same old, same old. You sound like a typical non-American who loves us when your back is to the wall, then hate us when your country is at peace. Think about it! If not for us, the Soviet Union would have invaded your country years ago. Our military, paid for by American tax dollars has protected your country and many others for years. It is getting to the point that the US needs to simply keep all of our food, stop sending over so much foreign financial aid, stop sharing all of our technology advances, all of our advances in medicine and surgery techniques, and all of our resources in America, etc, etc, etc, and say "screw you" rest of the world. But you know what--- we aren't like that! We want everyone to get along and quite possibility have stuck our nose where we shouldn't have a time or two, but we've have to clean up messes created by the rest of the world on two previous occasions. (WW I and WW II). We lost many soldiers on both occasions and cost American tax payers tons of money. Now, we have someone attack us and the rest of the world wants to become critics at the way we are handling a war that only a few TRUE friends/countries have been of any help.

How was that Hoofy? I'm staying clean here so I don't get booted off the site.

staff04 13 years, 7 months ago

Larry- I also know why Rangel introduced the bill. Unfortunately, I don't have all day to post like you do. Rangel wanted to incite real debate, not have the R's throw his bill in under suspension. If I saw you in person, I would bet real money that you'll see Republican efforts to reinstate a draft within the next year.

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

Excuse me staff04? I see that you have checked in on this site and posted several times today, on top of the fact that you immediately responded to my post. Now - true to liberal spinning. Who really has time here?

Again - your response is typical liberal spin and it is ridiculous! Why incite debate? In retrospect, he gets caught and tries to spin his way out. Just like Kerry - after the fact, you guys try to change your tune and make excuses for your behavior. It is getting old and the American people have spoken. How does it feel to know that most of your political views are in the minority?

I'm going back to work. Have a good evening! I'll check back later tonight or tomorrow to catch your response. Since you have such great debate skills and all, I look forward to reading your response. I mean, come on! You didn't get to D.C. because you don't have great debate skills. Right!

Rosycheeks 13 years, 7 months ago

Now, now no need for the name calling just because you guys didn't get your way. And by the way,"other people's kids" going to war is one of the hazards of joining the military. It is the whole point of military training, to create soldiers, DUH! Everyone acts like it is such a crime when they get sent off to fight. They knew that day might come when they decided to join. And if they didn't, well, sorry for them. Now, honestly, what do you think would have happened if Bush didn't decide to wage war after 9/11. We ALL might be dead. "Geez and they say democrats are stupid"... I wonder why??

Hi_Jinks 13 years, 7 months ago

staff04, I think I know where you are wanting to go with Rangel's proposal. (if you had more time to do it)

See if I got this right......... He proposed such an idea so as to shine a light on the idea that:

"Hey, let's get everyones' kids involved in this war---sons and daughters of poiliticians and/or wealthy types!---Not just the sons and daughters of largely middle and lower class blue-collar families. If young people are going to have to go over to Iraq to fight and quite possibly die...Well, then why not make it a truly fair system?"

Rangle knew that his proposal would never pass--nor did he want it to. I believe that he was just trying to make a point. Correct?

Now I'm not sure if there will be a draft or not.......

However, I do believe that Rangel's point was well taken. (By me anyway!)

ms_canada 13 years, 7 months ago

larry - what ever gave you the idea that i hate americans? my sister is american (montana) just south of alberta. i have cousins in arizona and california, michigan, my parents were born in iowa and minnesota. i think americans, per se, are very fine people. i just think you don't realize what your gov. is capable of inflicting on the world. i have never used the word hate. i use dislike. and whether you like it or not, your gov. is very much disliked throughout the world. yes, your young men and women have fought gallantly in many parts of the world and no one can take that away from them or your gov. GOD bless them. yes your gov dispenses many $$ in aid. and that is commendable. but that does not excuse raiding iraq and killing innocent people along with your young men and women. i know you think i have no business commenting on your kansas run program, well thats freedom of speech for you. i and a lot of other "foreigners" have very strong feelings about the world situation. it is very scary and i just pray to GOD that our fears for the next four years are most unfounded. that's all folks.

jonas 13 years, 7 months ago

Larry: That was what I heard Rangle's motivation as well.

I'll be honest, I don't see what you saw in Hoof-hearted, but I've noticed that you have a soft spot for the jerks and clods, when they share your political leanings. You yourself make coherent, valid points and discourse, but some of the folks you've congratulated have been pretty destructive, at least in my view. Would you have found him funny if he had been a liberal? I agree that he should not have been kicked off (but this is a private site, of course, and free speech need not apply), but he was deliberately hurtfull and abusive. That was all he was, too, there was no further content in any of his posts. Why anyone let his banter get to them, though, is a mystery to me.

Dems: Now's the time to take a deep breath. . . and realize that the world is not going to end. I would rather, I admit, be saying that to the conservative folk, but it holds true either way.

KawValleyGirl 13 years, 7 months ago

Those of you feeling so sorry for the insurgents being sought, how do you feel about them blowing up unarmed people? Americans digging water lines, teaching and providing advanced medical supplies and methods, not to mention the medicine! The people being kidnapped are unarmed and need our prayers and support desperately, positive thinking can go a long way! And now that our President is done doing the election business he can get back to the real priority, making sure the Iraqi's are no longer ruled by force and violence, my gov't hasn't blown any of my family or neighbors to bits. No mass graves around my neighborhood. I mean really our soldiers are there helping and THEY ARE GOOD. I know some personally. We aren't over there just going around killing, that's what the insurgents we are fighting are doing and sometimes, when a big person sees another big person picking on, killing, people smaller than them, the big person might have to take the inititive to make the bully stop! I love this country, home of the free is a true home indeed. Frankly if you hate it here, nobody is stopping you from leaving, just sitting at your computer spewing hate for your country, home, neighbors is just plain cowardly. Our country sent a message to the terrorists last night, we are not backing down and they are now the ones in grave danger, not innocent unarmed people trying to help other people. Want the killing to stop? Support the peacemaking effort, pray and quit hating us because we are the most weathly country in the world that can answer the threat of terrorism. Remember, "Home of the BRAVE!"

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

ms canada -your response makes me think of someone who defines him/herself against being prejudice by stating that "one of my best friends is black"! Maybe the reason that we are so capable of inflicting our beliefs on the world is because the world depends on us for so much. If we're going to send money all over the world and we're expected to defend every country in the world that doesn't want to spend the money on a military, then maybe we deserve to have an opinion that is best for America. Maybe you should be directing your aggression to the United Nations. Bush acts on intelligence information which nearly every government official believed (including Kerry), only to find out later that there aren't any WMB's. Then the UN is involved in a terrible food scandal with Iraq and everyone stands in line to forgive them for something that they knew they were doing from the start. Explain to me where you logic is in saying that America is more of a threat to the world than a corrupt United Nations.

As for our government being disliked throughout the world - I guess that is why Germany, Russia, Great Britain, and (yes) even France have made positive comments today in support of George W. Bush and the American government. In addition, people around the world sure like to take advantage of American hospitality when it comes to education from American universities or allowing American companies to pay for plane tickets to America for people with major medical issues (including the medical costs)! All of these situations are made possible due to our form of government. You don't see China or Russia paying for American kids to be flown to their country for medical care? How about Canada? How often does Canada do this? As I've stated before, America is great when you need something, but any other time, America is considered the bully on the block. These are the facts! I'm proud of my country and I am tired of hearing people bash it.

I would suggest that maybe the media has more to do with the hatred of America than President Bush and his actions. It is funny how a vast majority of the military supports President Bush and our efforts in Iraq. Wouldn't we all like to see a break down of presidential votes from the military? These are the people risking their life and they support President Bush. Ironic, huh!

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

Jonas - I made comments just yesterday that although I may not agree with mrcairo, carmenilla and some other guy, I'll define their right to disagree and debate. In fact, I enjoy it. Your above comments about me only liking the people that agree with me are ridiculous and you know it. A few weeks/months ago, you took a beating on this site for stirring things up by making ridiculous comments. I now understand!

I enjoyed Hoofy because he played off the insecurities of democratic liberals. He would say a few things and "yes" get a bit vulgar, but I took it as sarcastic comedy. He was controlling the behavior of people on this site and some of you guys bite like a tick on a dog.

As for Rangle and the draft. The man introduced a bill, then his colleagues made the statement that the republicans introduced the bill. Did you guys not read that part? RANGLE INTRODUCES THE BILL, THEN A DEMOCRAT SAYS THAT A REPUBLICAN DID IT. There was no mentioning about "bringing it up for discussion" until after the fact. Rangle needs to get to the point! If he wants to discuss it, say so. Don't introduce it, then say the republicans introduced it, then change back to "I just wanted to discuss the issue" after the whole thing blows up in his face. Flip Flop Flip Flop Flip Flop Flip Flop. Unbelievable! I have no idea if you have seen this guy speak before, but if so, you'll know why I think he is a joke. That guy makes absolutely no sense and can't back his statements up. He simply got himself into trouble and is running out the back door.

By the way Jonas - why would you consider this a private site. Anyone can join! There are no restrictions or membership fees to be paid. The only thing that keeps you out is censorship which is a huge issue with liberals who don't want to sensor porn sites on the Internet! A little hypocritically, wouldn't you say?

nicegirl 13 years, 7 months ago

Amen Larry! I was talking to a friend of mine from out of state this weekend. He is a Marine and was part of the unit that was the first into Baghdad when the war began. He is extremely supportive of Bush and has no doubt that he is leading our country the right way. If someone who was over there fighting and risking his life can support our president why can't everyone else who is just sitting around posting on a website do the same?

ms_canada 13 years, 7 months ago

Das_ubermime - absolutely right, my opinion has no relevance at all. also true, no other country is any better. there really is no perfect system of governance in this world. but we have to try to do the best we can, is that not true? agreed. there is, no doubt, corruption in every gov. on the face of this earth and i am sure you could point a lot of them out to us all. there is no doubt that the us is the strongest country on this planet. but, does that give them the right to invade wherever they will. i could point out any number of things that have occurred in this senseless invasion of iraq. for instance, $8 million was ear marked for the reconstruction of the country. as of june this year only $400,000 had been spent. the promise of electricity restoration and clean water still has not been fulfilled. jobs in the restoration process were given to bangladeshis and indians flown into the country while iraqi young men were left standing with their mouths hanging open at the airport. you might wonder why they are so angry and throw stones and bombs at your troops. and i won't even address the halliburton thing. if you would care to be enlightened read this book Dick, the man who is president by John Nichols. you will be shocked at what you read. enough said. now you all might be thinking that i am from the middle east and of a certain religious persuasion. i happen to be a wasp of the evangelical persuasion. just so there is no mistake. das should there be an umlaut over the u?

scuddy 13 years, 7 months ago

Wow Larry! You are pretty selfish. Who made your life so important? This "human life is superior" way of thinking and living life is exactly why the earth is in trouble. That is why many species are dying at an unimaginable rate. Let me guess-you are a pro-lifer. An embryo does not have the capacity to feel pain or experience life. It doesn't feel the pain of being pumped full of drugs and needles. You must be one of those people who goes through each day not thinking of a single thing but yourself. I am confidnent that humans will continue to over-fish the oceans, cut down the rainforests and drill for oil any place we can get our hands on. What I was saying when I brought up the stem cell issue was that an embryo is not a life. It does not have the capacity to feel pain. And I am sick of this president trying to inflict his personal beliefs on the future of this country. It doen't matter that stem cell research could benefit many. Bush is a pro-lifer which is his own belief. He should keep his religion and morals to himself. I could go on and on. I really don't want to make an enemy here Larry. You can believe however you want. Thats your choice and I will always respect you for that. All life is valuable and that is exactly why stem cell research makes so much sense.

scuddy 13 years, 7 months ago

I thought the voting process went smoothly and I also thought the turnout was pretty good. However, I am very disappointed that America chose Bush and company for another four. It looks like another four years of the rich getting richer, our soldiers being mistreated and environment suffering continual blows. There is another thing that people seem to be very confused about. Just because someone says they disapprove of the war in Iraq does not mean they don't stand behind our men and women in uniform. People are really getting this screwed up!!! I admire all of our soldiers and am so grateful for all of their sacrifices in the past and now, but I do not have to like Bush. The stem cell research issue is another point I would like to bring up . Bush says he disagrees with it because it is taking a life. But its okay for us to lock monkeys, rats and many other animals up in cages and pock and prod them with needles and experiments to "further medicine." Who gives him the right to draw these lines on what a "life" is? That I will never understand. Stem cell research could benefit so many people, but here we are again with Bush and company inflicting religion and morals on everyone in this country. I am sick of the entire thing. People of this country will continue to drive the biggest SUV's they can find and have as many children as they can and not recycle a single thing. I guess going to church every Sunday will make everything okay though right? Global warming is setting in folks. And if you think I am kidding check out the September issue of National Geographic. Bush and his administration and anyone who thought it was a good idea to re-elect him should take a long look in the mirror.

jonas 13 years, 7 months ago

Larry: Sorry if I micommunicated, but I wasn't saying that you only like people you agree with, only that there are people you wouldn't like, perhaps, if you didn't agree with them. You've always shown me respect, and we disagree, at least on the surface, about pretty much everything. I don't feel there is anything redeemable about Hoof, and I think his intention was to hurt people, or at least to make other people laugh through hurting other people. No one else on this forum, except for Jimmy Olson, perhaps, had that level of venom and vitriol in EVERY SINGLE post that they made. But again, I don't think he should have been booted, just questioning why you thought he was funny, because I did not. You are, of course, entitled to your opinion.

Have to agree with the draft crap. It's just nonsense, though I can't decide whether it's based from a misunderstanding, or a desire to cloud the issue. I choose the former, but I freely admit I generally, when it comes to individual opinions, err on the side of good intentions. Except for conservatives. I know they're out to screw me cuz Jesus said so.

I say this is a private site because it is: being owned by the LJWorld, a private company. They made it and they run it, and they can set up rules of conduct and behavior if they want to. If there were people complaining, and I'm sure there were, then they can remove the offender if they want to.

Which time we're you talking about, with me getting a beating? Ther've been a couple. My only defense is that satire doesn't come off all the time in print.

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

ms canada - who are you to judge how or when we spend the reconstruction money? You better research your facts about the clean water and electricity. Just spoke to a proud military Momma this morning and when asking about her son, she (as usual) had new pictures to show me. Her son is stationed in Bagdad and he has specifically said that there is more clean water and electricity hook ups right now than available before the war. As I've said before, I will let the soldiers serving in Iraq tell me what to believe and what not to believe. I refuse to base my opinion on what the media tells me, what John Nichols tells us and definitely not someone from Canada. I have personally spoken to numerous soldiers that have served (in the past year) in both Iraq and Afghanistan. They all agree that what we are doing is RIGHT, that the citizens are better off now than before, and most importantly - two recently returning soldiers were very bitter with the media about how the war is portrayed. I personally know these young men and have for over twenty years.Their opinions mean everything.

Scuddy - are you seriously comparing a human life to a rat?

Lulu 13 years, 7 months ago

Scuddy, You are wonderful and brilliant. I wish people would think about things before they spout off. Kerry would be president.

I like you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Savage 13 years, 7 months ago

Ms canada seems to be experiencing all five stages of grief all at the same time today....1. Anger:(some insult in italian) 2. Denial:(said she wasn't judging) 3. Bargaining: (evryone's corrupt right?). 4.Depression:(It will set in soon enough) 5. Acceptance:(keep on reading the "ny times" dear, and the final phase will be complete) Peace.

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

scuddy - How do you define life? Is the grass in your front yard alive? Is the tree in the park down the street alive? How about HIV? Scientists tell us that HIV can only LIVE outside the human body for a very short time. All these things are considered as ALIVE because they can grow when feed with whatever nutrient it needs to survive. Now - I ask you! Can an embryo survive without the nutrients that he/she needs to grow into a fetus? You of course know the answer to this, don't you? This proves that an embryo is indeed alive.

To say that I'm selfish because I don't believe as you do is a typical liberal response. Who made my life so important and yours for that matter? That answer is very easy! God did!

You say that President Bush should keep his religion and morals to himself, yet a majority of the American people just gave him a thumbs up. Did you miss that! Did you miss the fact that Christians are waking up all over America and have started to reclaim our country from these crazy liberals/socialist? Yes - I am a Christian and I am Pro Life. Christians, by far, send more supplies, money, food, etc around this world and this countries poverty stricken areas than non-Christians. Now tell me scuddy - who are the selfish people! The pro choice people who are more interested in a convenient method of birth control or Pro Life people who are largely associated with religion. Please don't come back with the lame argument that pro life Christians are going around bombing abortion clients because we know that those people are an extreme group of nut jobs. In addition, the argument that someone should have the right to abortion due to health reasons, rape, incest may be a valid argument, but it is an EXTREMELY SMALL percentage of reasons for abortions. I seriously doubt that the millions of abortions that have been conducted in this country were the result of millions of rapes, incest and health related problems.

Okay scubby - there you go. I anticipate your rebuttal. I don't want you as an enemy either but I certainly wish to hear your reasoning behind your stance.

scuddy 13 years, 7 months ago


I don't really put a label on myself, but you sure have labeled me and I guess I am guilty of labeling you also. It has been fun debating/talking with you. We differ on almost everything we have talked about and thats cool. I am going to close my conversation with you and its not because I think you are right and I give up. I have run out of reasons to talk with you. We have nothing in common and I am bored with responding. You get on this board soley to argue and mix things up with people and call people names etc etc. I could say the sky was blue today and I am sure you would disagree with that one too. Thats just the type of person you are. I think that I have brought up many valid points. One very VALID point that I have brought up that even you can't debate is that everyone has to start caring for the earth as well as each other. If you take nothing else from our little debates, please remember this one. There is no other way it will work. We need each other and we need this beautiful planet to continue to support us. Its been fun talking with you and take care.

Larry 13 years, 7 months ago

I'm sorry you feel that way scuddy. I felt as if we were debating the issues which is what makes this discussion board fun. It is ironic that you are so concern with caring for the Earth, yet you neglect to show any concern what so ever for a fetus. I say this with no thought of provoking you into an argument but rather trying to understand your point of view. This is something that I will never understand about individuals with liberal stances. Liberals want to save trees and even save prisoners (who have committed murder or even multiple murders) from the death penalty, yet an unborn child with a heart beat is fair game to a doctor and his skull cracking tools. Do you not see the hypocrisy here?

Above you state that I get on this board to call people names, but if you go back through the responses that I have made on this question, you'll find that liberal or crazy liberal was about the only name that I used. You start by calling me selfish and all about myself (see Nov. 3, 11:28) after I asked you a simply question. (see Nov 3 10:20PM). I then respond to you with another questions on Nov. 4, 8:28AM and do state that I think you are a liberal, which I do and I don't think that is name calling. You respond on Nov. 6 - 10:32PM with the statement that "I'm filled with hate". I believe that crazy liberal was the worse thing that I said to you so I certainly don't think that I was any worse than you or any better. Point is, you sign off and take the normal liberal response. You attack my character because you don't agree with me, yet you can't offer an argument to my questions.

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