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Archive for Wednesday, May 15, 2013

Higher education officials say concealed carry on campus probably inevitable in the future

May 15, 2013

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— The Kansas Board of Regents is expected to adopt a temporary resolution to keep in place the current no-weapons policy at the state universities, including Kansas University.

But having guns on campuses in some form in the future is probably inevitable, according to Regents Vice Chairman Fred Logan Jr.

The move comes in response to a measure signed into law last month by Gov. Sam Brownback that authorizes concealed carry licensees to carry a concealed handgun into any state or municipal building except those that have "adequate security measures," such as metal detectors.

But university and municipal buildings can be exempted from the provision for up to four years.

Leaders at KU and other regents universities have said they don't want concealed carry on campuses.

The resolution, which will be considered by the full board on Thursday, would provide a temporary exemption from the new law.

The regents plan to conduct a hearing in September on the issue and study the implications of permitting people to carry concealed handguns and the costs of acquiring the security measures necessary to bar handguns.

"The exemption goes away in four years," Logan said. "What we have here is a delayed implementation date."

He said the regents will probably ask universities to look at each building to determine whether concealed carry should be allowed.

Logan said the board needs to "take a very analytical approach" about concealed carry. "We need to be respectful of those who voted in favor of legislation. There were a lot of legislators who felt this was the appropriate way to go," he said.

The bill was approved in the House 104-16 and the Senate, 31-7.

Higher education officials have said the expense of setting up metal detectors at all doors at the schools would be astronomical.

Regents Chairman Tim Emert said, "That's the advantage they have at the Capitol. They can route everybody to one entrance and we can't."

Comments

Charles L Bloss Jr 1 year, 7 months ago

What the legislature is saying, and correctly so, is if you ban concealed weapons you assume responsibility for the safety of permit holders. You would be depriving them of the right to protect themselves. I agree but I would extend it to cover the safety of not only permit holders, but everyone in that building and on your campus.

Thinking_Out_Loud 1 year, 7 months ago

I don't agree with this interpretation at all. I do not believe the legislature gave it as much thought as you have, Lynn. I believe the legislature was saying "we want people to have their firearms with them, no matter where they are." Although your own analysis has gone deeper than my interpretation, I am skeptical that our legislator's analysis did.

Frederic Gutknecht IV 1 year, 7 months ago

I posit that your speculation is conjecture, but I'm just making this stuff up as I go along.

Lane Signal 1 year, 7 months ago

What the legislature is saying is let's extend this culture of fear and make sure no one feels safe. They want no one to feel safe unless they have a gun. This is like big tobacco pushing cigarettes on teens. The gun lobby wants to bring that culture of fear to the youngest and most impressionable audience possible. If they thought they could make it happen, I bet they would push to allow high school students to carry at school. They could claim it was part of an anti bullying campaign.

Jonathan Fox 1 year, 7 months ago

I don't understand; now that universities have to take down the no-gun signs NOW they want to put up metal detectors?

John Kyle 1 year, 7 months ago

More accidental shootings. Keep your stupid guns at home, nut cases. What happened to my right to go in public without having people with guns around.

Thinking_Out_Loud 1 year, 7 months ago

Good job, queequeg. Using words like "stupid" and "nut cases" really succeeded in advancing the conversation here. We would have had a much less mutually respectful and thoughtful conversation without them.

50YearResident 1 year, 7 months ago

Keep in mind that to obtain a Concealed Carry Permit, you have to be 21 years old or older. This will eliminate a large percentage of students. Most of the permit holders will be Teachers, staff or upper class students. Permits have been available for over 6 years. Can any of you name one incident of injury caused by a permit holder to someone you know personally? Don't count the single accidental injury that has already been discussed in the previous story. Find one that you know personally, not one you have read about. Why are you posters so afraid that the sky is going to fall. Another thing that has not been mentioned yet. Even if all the buildings are equipped with metal detectors and a police supervisor, there is not any restriction for concealed carry holders from driving through or walking in the campus, outside of the buildings. There will be concealed guns on the campus so relax and wait for the sky to actually fall before you start complaining.

elliottaw 1 year, 7 months ago

who also can't be around alcohol while you carry, good thing that isn't popular around colleges. And what happen to business having the right to determine what is allowed or not allowed on their property? If you are so scared stay home in your basement, no one is forcing you out into the real world.

skull 1 year, 7 months ago

"relax and wait for the sky to actually fall before you start complaining" Translation: Wait for someone to get shot accidentally before you start complaining.

Can you name just one person you know personally that has been shot on a university campus in Kansas?

Since the age limit is 21, that would only eliminate at most HALF of the underclassmen, and nowhere near half the student body as a whole. Added safety bonus, they can begin carrying their guns around the same day they can legally drink alcohol.

If you are so afraid of life in this country you need to carry a gun, don't go to the KU campus, you probably don't already.

50YearResident 1 year, 7 months ago

There already is a law on the books that says that it is illegal to consume alcohol while carrying a gun. Less than 5% of all students will apply for and receive a permit, so there is not going to be a gun in every student's backpack.

skull 1 year, 7 months ago

So then you don't know anybody personally that has been shot on a university campus?

Do you even know anybody that spends any time on campus? Why do you care if no guns are allowed on campus? Has there been some jump in crime against non-students on campuses in this state? Because the governing bodies and the students of said campuses have been quite clear in their opposition to guns on THEIR campus.

elliottaw 1 year, 7 months ago

So one in recent history of the over 50,000 colleges, yup seems like a legitimate threat

Lane Signal 1 year, 7 months ago

What about the dorms? Will this allow an 18 year-old to have an assault rife in his/her dorm room under the new law? How safe is that going to make everyone feel?

elliottaw 1 year, 7 months ago

I remember when people had communication skills, knew how to problem solve and interact with people, were held accountable for their actions from birth. Now they always afraid, can't talk out a problem to save their lives, are given free pass after free when they don't act right. Good job Johnny you thru a fit and refused to go onto the field for the game but here is your trophy and participation medal, keep it up. All of this is lead to people who are constantly scared and paranoid and feel they need to "defend" themselves from the world. You didn't have these mass shootings with older generations, there were instances but they were few and far between. But being as the people who raised this generation of people are the ones who are in charge they will again cave in and give the now paranoid people what they want.

50YearResident 1 year, 7 months ago

Where were you when they handed out the communication skills? It must have been on your day off.

yourworstnightmare 1 year, 7 months ago

I imagine many faculty will not be interested in lecturing to a group of 100+ students with concealed weapons on many of the students.

One could argue that this creates a dangerous work environment that the university could do something about, placing metal detectors and security screening at all building entrances, but will not do because of money.

Lawsuits and possible faculty refusing to teach under these conditions might be the result.

Quite honestly, issues such as this as well as general hostility to science and intellectual pursuits in Kansas is what keeps quality faculty away from KU, more so than low salaries and lack of raises.

50YearResident 1 year, 7 months ago

As of February 1, 2013 there were a total of 52,317 permits issued and in effect for the whole state of Kansas. How many of those do you think live in Lawrence or attend KU?

chootspa 1 year, 7 months ago

How many mass shootings were there on the KU campus?

elliottaw 1 year, 7 months ago

And a gun would not have stopped any of these, nor has a gun from a CCW holder stopped a shooting ANYwhere

skull 1 year, 7 months ago

Man stops shooting...dozens die in gun accidents.

MORE GUNS!!!

skull 1 year, 7 months ago

I'm pretty sure many WELL-TRAINED people were armed at Ft. Hood. How many untrained civilians with guns does it take to stop a shooting on an army base?

Never mind, let's just pretend that if EVERYBODY has a gun, we'll be safer. Well, except for those under 21, they don't get the "right to defend themselves."

skull 1 year, 7 months ago

So the largest, most expensive, and most well trained army in the world doesn't trust their soldiers to carry guns around everywhere, but we're supposed to trust any idiot dumb enough to think his life is in constant danger, but smart enough to fill his name in on an application?

Joe Hyde 1 year, 7 months ago

Why would a concealed carry permit holder feel the need to remain armed once he or she enters onto a state university campus? Our universities have long had in place some rather sophisticated security setups, plus they've got state-certified uniformed law enforcement officers on duty who openly carry firearms. Openly carry.

For the benefit of those who may have forgotten, an open carry law enforcement officer is legally pre-cleared to blow away with lethal gunfire violence, if necessary, any person or animal that is threatening to cause imminent death or serious bodily harm to a student, staff member or university grounds visitor?

When university security departments need help, they radio for it. And then lots more state-certified help shows up quick, fast and in a hurry.

Concealed carry on campus. Right. Okay, can we please now re-focus on the threat to university students soon to be done by the legislature having removed income taxation from the state's business owners, some of whom are multi-billionnaires?

gccs14r 1 year, 7 months ago

Maybe it'd be easier to fence the campus and set up metal detectors at the gates.

yourworstnightmare 1 year, 7 months ago

Did_I_say_that wrote: "The Army prohibits soldiers from carrying personal firearms inside Fort Hood and other bases. They want to reduce casual violence among the soldiers."

Exactly. Tacit acknowledgement that even the best trained can vulnerable to using guns in "casual violence".

Allowing CC on campus would increase the chances of guns being used in "casual violence" by students, faculty, and staff.

Jeremiah Jefferson 1 year, 7 months ago

Someone asked for examples

http://www.csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/concerns-about-concealed-carry/homicides-committed-by-concealed-handgun-permit-holders-in-florida

I might add that I own 5 firearms and will never part ways with them. But I have no need or desire to tote around guns.

true_patriot 1 year, 7 months ago

I don't want a bunch of testosterone-laden very young adults with little life experience "defending" themselves against a perceived or even an actual threat by firing weapons into crowded classrooms, concourses, sidewalks, auditoriums thinking that it's like every cop show, movie, video game they've seen or played, which do not reflect the reality of these situations and the incredible level of training required to manage a firearm in a live conflict situation with other people around.

Between this initiative and the one to gets loaded guns into bars where people get drunk and emotional and lose the ability to make rational decisions, any kind of common sense is being thrown out the window.

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