Archive for Friday, May 4, 2012

Domestic violence victim advocates withdraw bid with SRS

May 4, 2012


— Kansas’ leading organization that advocates for victims of sexual and domestic violence has parted ways with the state welfare agency, saying new requirements imposed by Gov. Sam Brownback’s administration on an assistance program would put victims in greater danger.

Joyce Grover, executive director of the Kansas Coalition Against Sexual and Domestic Violence, said Friday the new requirements “violate the best interests of survivors of sexual and domestic violence.”

Laura Patzner, executive director of the Great Bend Family Crisis Center, was more blunt. “I am not going to put people at risk for dollars. I will not choose to do a contract with someone that I feel is not appropriate and would quite simply be more dangerous,” Patzner said.

The dispute is over a contract between the Kansas Department of Social and Rehabilitation Services and the Kansas Coalition Against Sexual and Domestic Violence to provide services to low-income victims.

The coalition has had the contract with SRS since the program’s inception in 1999 and has provided assistance to about 17,500 victims.

The coalition withdrew its bid for the next fiscal year, which starts July 1.

SRS Secretary Phyllis Gilmore said she was “not surprised KCSDV is backing away from providing services” under the program.

“KCSDV had been struggling to meet our new accountability standards for several months,” Gilmore said.

“We tried to work with them, but in the end the bid that KCSDV submitted did not meet even the minimum performance standards set in the request for bid, and they were the only bidder. As a result of their withdrawal, we have decided to take the program in-house, manage it ourselves and provide direct funding to the community programs,” she said.

The amount of grant funds is $2 million, according to SRS, and is provided by the federal government.

Grover disagreed with Gilmore’s assessment and said the coalition withdrew its bid because of several new contract requirements from SRS.

One would require a victim undergo a psychological evaluation, she said. Grover said the coalition was willing to agree to make referrals for those who would benefit by an evaluation, but making the evaluation mandatory in all cases was unnecessary and could be harmful in some instances.

“The basic assumption that comes out of that requirement is that there is something wrong with the survivor,” Grover said. She also said the evaluations could be used unfairly against victims in divorce or child custody proceedings.

Another requirement said that 90 percent of those served had to be employed within 18 months, Grover said. She said this ignored the myriad of problems that many survivors faced and hurdles to employment.

In addition, there is a requirement that would force advocates to report typically confidential information, Grover said, and establish a “corrective action plan.” That insinuates survivors need to be “corrected,” or “fixed,” Grover said.

Sen. Laura Kelly, D-Topeka, said the SRS action was troubling. “I have serious concerns about dismantling a system for service providers for victims of domestic violence that has been in place for years and has proven to be effective.”

Statewide, the coalition and its subcontractors serve about 1,000 people each year.

Joan Schultz, who is the executive director of The Willow Domestic Violence Center in Lawrence, said the organization would have to assess whether it would contract directly with SRS for the program, which is called OARS and stands for orientation, assessment, referral and safety.

“It is an important program to ensure survivors are able to look at all their options,” Schultz said. In Lawrence, OARS provides $85,000 and pays for 2.5 positions that help abuse victims.

The Willow Center has a shelter that can serve 29 people. It served 137 women and 114 children last year.

Schultz said she would be happy to discuss with SRS officials “about how to move the OARS program forward and to keep these services in the city of Lawrence.”

She added, “I will have to take a look at any contract offer, and the board of directors and I will decide if this contract is mission driven for The Willow. I believe SRS has the best interests of survivors in mind, and we will work with them to the best of our ability.” Schultz also added she believed the Kansas Coalition Against Sexual and Domestic Violence withdrew from the program “in good conscience.”

Schultz said the SRS evaluation requirement of victims was “very problematic.” She added, “Any time you have a state requiring services from a professional, like a mental health professional, then you are going down a slippery slope.”

Sarah Jane Russell, who is executive director of GaDuGi SafeCenter in Lawrence, deferred questions about the impact of the funding issue to The Willow. But she added, “There is an urgency for all people to sit at the table and talk truthfully about where we are going with victims services in this state.”


Lisa Rasor 5 years, 10 months ago

Thank you for standing up for the survivors, Joyce. The new requirements are ridiculous, and are just more examples of the conservatives' war on women.

madameX 5 years, 10 months ago

Does anyone know what, if any, reasoning was given to back up these crazy new requirements? This is an honest question; why does the Brownback admin think that all DV survivors should have to undergo a pscyh eval?

deec 5 years, 10 months ago

State-mandated evidence so abusers can get custody.

madameX 5 years, 10 months ago

I hear you, but surely they haven't actually said that? Usually for the sake of PR the state offers some kind of reason, however lame, for why they made a particular decision. Like with the Lawrence SRS office - it was glaringly obvious (to me, anyway) that "proximity to four-lane roads" is not a valid reason to close an SRS office, but at least they weren't dumb enough to come out and say "we don't care about Lawrence because Lawrence will never vote for us anyway"

That's what I was asking - has the state offered any kind of justification, however lame, for these new requirements and if so, what? LJ World, perhaps you could shed some light on this?

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

EXACTLY!!!! Through SRS the FATHERHOOD INITIATIVES program funding has been increased and it is the new DOMESTIC VIOLENCE (sick and twisted) PROGRAM. Google KS Fatherhood see what SRS is spending DV tax $ on. Today for example: KCSL (under the direction of SRS fatherhood) will be sending abusers and their children to the Yankee's Royals game. I, a survivor, a battered mother who lost custody to the abuser b/c of the above 'scam' am paying for my own ticket to the game.

Thank you KCSDV, Joyce and Laura for not selling us out and down that blood river. Sharia Law is quite prevalent in KS. Soon honor killings will begin and be defended.

-Claudine Dombrowski

Paul R Getto 5 years, 10 months ago

Reasoning? This is a faith-based decision, like most of the others.

jesse499 5 years, 10 months ago

I thing there should be a pscyh eval done before you can run for office.Oh fargot Brownback admin wouldn't pass.

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

SRS went off the deep end under Brownback and his Florida pals. They would set up funding expectations that were utterly absurd.

For example, CROs such as the Recovery and Hope Network (RAHN) here in Lawrence were supposed to demonstrate that our consumers (all of whom have a severe and persistent mental illness) are "more spiritual" than those at Bert Nash!!!

Excuse me?

Plus SRS expected all sorts of other nonsensical "competitive" things.

The problem??? We work primarily with the same consumers of severe and persistent mental illness!!! We work COLLABORATIVELY, not in competition!

Unfortunately, while Brownback's Florida cronies are gone, things at SRS don't appear to have improved all that much. Setting unreasonable, un-achievable "accountability standards" does NOT mean that the problem is with the organization that can't meet those absurd "standards".

I, for one, am soooo grateful that disability services, including mental health services, are being moved to the current Department of Aging come July 1st. It can't come soon enough. We may not being escaping Brownback...but we are escaping the insanity that is SRS nowadays.

CheneyHawk 5 years, 10 months ago

Prince Sam/Herr Brownback earned his money the old fashioned way - he married into it. He has no concept of 'real work' nor 'real world'. Gilmore is a political hack and many good programs for Kansans are falling to the wayside because of the prince's lack of leadership and twisted focus on ideaology.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 5 years, 10 months ago

""The basic assumption that comes out of that requirement is that there is something wrong with the survivor,"

Well... YEAH. If my significant other just beat the crap out of me, I might no longer be in a healthy frame of mind. I know we don't like this languaging, but these "survivors" are also victims of assault. Evaluating them for PTSD, suicidality or depression kinda makes sense.

And, yes, I can see how that might hurt them in court later, but that's about legal wranglings, not about treatment needs.

veggiegirl 5 years, 10 months ago

Just to be clear, you're saying the victim of the assault is the one that has something wrong with them, not the assaulter?

OldEnuf2BYurDad 5 years, 10 months ago

Where did I say "not the assaulter". That'd be idiotic.

deec 5 years, 10 months ago

Victims of all crimes may suffer as well. Why not mandate treatment for them as well?

dabbindan 5 years, 10 months ago

because to be forced to accept a psychological intervention when it's not indicated sends an inappropriate message to all involved. refer only when indicated. it's also a waste of limited $$$. surely you don't think a one size fits all "mandate" is a good idea?

deec 5 years, 10 months ago

No I don't. So why is it being forced on abuse survivors?

Liberty275 5 years, 10 months ago

I think HIPPA precludes that without some sort of warrant. I think it's wrong to force anyone not a danger to himself or others to see a shrink, and that applies here of course.

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

So now you want to victimize them again, do you? Force them to do something against their will...again. Yeah, right. Sure. That is gonna make them feel lots better.

How about you OFFER them the opportunity? You OFFER them the services for free? How about you step back and allow THEM to start getting a sense of control back?

Sorry didn't think this one through carefully enough. (And if you think that SRS wants to require this for the benefit of the victim, think again.)

OldEnuf2BYurDad 5 years, 10 months ago

I'm simply pointing out that victims of violent crimes can benefit from treatment, that victims of violent crimes - especially from a family member - are likely to have a need for treatment.

The DSM has a code specifically for children of abuse, regardless of whether or not the child is exhibiting symptoms or not. The reason why is because it seems a reasonable assumption that those victims are suffering from the abuse, regardless of symptomology. Why not apply the same principles to an adult population?

Also: What is SRS's motivation here? SRS is cash-strapped, so why mandate expensive evaluations (paid for with SRS dollars) for nefarious reasons, as so many of your suggest? Secretary Gilmore is not cut from the same cloth as former Sec. Sideleiki. He was an ax-man (that is known to be true, the reason he was hired), while Gilmore is a well respected member of the mental health community.

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

I hope you've read the later comments and finally realized what you've been missing...and why it's important.

Christine Anderson 5 years, 10 months ago

I cannot adequately describe my loathing for Brownback. I am a survivor of domestic violence. Yes, I have PTSD, and I struggle with wondering if I am "good" enough to deserve to succeed at a job. OldEnuf, I do believe you meant well in your post, but the problem is this. One of the things our abusers use to "whip" us with is, "You're crazy. I never abused you. I would never hit anyone. You're a sh@*@ parent." (Never mind the fact that a police officer had me remove my shirt and she and her partner, and my daughter who was a minor then, saw the physical evidence on me) So, if psych evals become mandatory, it is not "just" legal wranglings. It's your life; it's your childrens' lives, and let me tell you, there will be victims who steer away from domestic violence services ouf of fear of losing their children. There is one particular lawyer in town who represents abusive fathers pro boner because he believes "fathers have been getting a raw deal." One of the things my ex still verbally fires at me is, "You're full of s@!. If I had really hit or hurt you, why didn't you go to the hospital? Huh? Trey said that because you didn't see a dr for your imagined injuries, we could get it thrown out in custody proceedings." Well, my abuser went on to do the same damn thing to his second wife, who is a decent woman.

Jayhawk1958 5 years, 10 months ago

+1. I am truely sorry for what happened to you. Gets to the basic question of does Brownback and SRS really care? I think we know the answer.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 5 years, 10 months ago

Thanks for sharing that. One thing I WASN'T trying to imply was that it was necessary to MANDATE TREATMENT. I was just pointing out the logical value of getting evaluated after being victimized by IPV.

Linda Endicott 5 years, 10 months ago

Do victims of domestic violence need psychological treatment? Yes, usually...but it takes time for them to get to that point, too...

Forcing someone to have a psych evaluation straight out of an abusive relationship is just going to seem like more they still don't have any control over their lives...and if someone suggests they need treatment, they could very well start thinking, "oh, my God, they think I'm crazy, too...maybe I am crazy...maybe my ex was right..."

And maybe, just maybe, that continued feeling of helplessness and hopelessness might send them right back into the arms of their abuser...after all, if SRS and the state of Kansas thinks they're crazy, then who would be strong enough to argue the point?

deec 5 years, 10 months ago

If no current providers can meet the criteria, it sure opens up a nice niche market for for-profits and faith-based programs.

deec 5 years, 10 months ago

If no current providers can meet the criteria, it sure opens up a nice niche market for for-profits and faith-based programs.

Christine Anderson 5 years, 10 months ago

Just because my injury did not require sutures or hospitalization does not mean that the abuse was fabricated. God forgive me for saying this, but I finally have slightly ( and I mean slightly) less fear of my ex's g.d. lawyer because my ex's health is deteriorating so rapidly that even if he decided to try and take me to court, he wouldn't be in a very good position.

I am sickened that the director of Willow believes SRS has the best interests of survivors in mind ! Are you crazy, lady?? You deserve to lose you job over that, and here's why.

Pres. Bush (senior) did place a five year lifetime limit on cash assistance. However, he was compassionate enough to leave some exceptions. One of those is that if you are a survivor of domestic violence or sexual assault, that five year limit does not apply to you. And no, it is not to enable us to be lazy, as some of you hardliners are going to say. It was intended to help us and our children to survive, because so many times we are in danger if we go to work. If we are not in physical danger by going to work, there is the emotional scarring that interferes with being able to succeed in employment. Guess what, everyone? Effective this year, there are no more "exceptions". Victims of domestic violence and secual assault are now left flapping in the wind, and so are our children. So then, Ms.Schultz, would you like to rethink that idiotic statement?

Cait McKnelly 5 years, 10 months ago

Psych evals in Lawrence are problematic in and of themselves. There are almsot no providers of the service. I was referred to LMH's pain management clinic. On my initial visit I was told that before I would/could be accepted into the program I had to have a psych eval with a statement by the provider that I was not an "addictive personality". This ended up being a hellacious problem. The clinic had NO local providers to refer me to. The closest they could come was a provider in Topeka. I wasn't driving due to the pain issues for which I was at the clinic to begin with. Then I found out that my insurance wouldn't cover the cost of the eval. I am on SSDI and the cost of the eval was over 150$ (if I went through the provider in Topeka). The entire thing ended up being such a cluster you-know-what that in the end my doctor threw up his hands and just prescribed my pain meds himself. And he didn't exactly blame me for it. So, that being said, just how does SRS expect these providers to obtain and comply with their "psych eval" BS, much less pay for it? What is the stated purpose by SRS of the psych eval? Do they even give one? What's the point of all of this hoop jumping?

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

You know what their likely reasoning is..."Women lie about being raped all the time. This will weed all of them out and save us money".

Christine Anderson 5 years, 10 months ago

I believe that we have a wackjob in the Governor's mansion, and several in the Ks House and Senate as well. I believe they are making a conscious choice to punish the victim.

pace 5 years, 10 months ago

SRS was in sorry shape, now Brownback's grabbed it and is honing it as a weapon against the people it was originally legislated to help. Did we elect a governor or a despot?

Jayhawk1958 5 years, 10 months ago

Um....Really? That was his true intention? LOL!

question4u 5 years, 10 months ago

Brownback's sense of ethics is rotten to the core, and he has actively infected every state agency and aspect of government that he can. Moderate Republicans must continue to speak out against injustice or the damage that this pathogen of a governor will do to Kansas will take decades to repair.

JackMcKee 5 years, 10 months ago

Kansas has become a hell hole under Brownback. It never had a great climate, mountains or an ocean but it did have great people that acted reasonably. It still has those people but it's a lot harder to get a sense of those old Midwestern values when you have a waste like Brownback as the Govenor. I'm not even sure the guy is technically a Kansan anymore.

Cant_have_it_both_ways 5 years, 10 months ago

Brownback stands for personal responsibility and does not mind helping those who actually need it. He, on the other hand, is just as tired as much of the electorate when it comes to all those who make lousy choices and then stick their hands out to the taxpayer. Anyone with any sense does not need or desire all these so called services and handouts, and they are not authorized by any of our founding documents.

I hope many of those who thrive on these services move to another state and mooch off of their taxpayers for a while. Maybe our property and sales taxes will get back to a normal level.

JackMcKee 5 years, 10 months ago

Let's make sure that people that are at their lowest point know they better hurry up and start feeling better because we're just not going to wait around while they take their own sweet time. Who do these people think they are, anyway?

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

So being raped and beaten is a personal choice??

Oh, I get it. If a woman didn't dress that way...walk by herself...have a drink...go to a born a woman...she wouldn't have been raped. And if a woman didn't egg on the man...allow him to abuse her...stay in the situation even though she had no money/was told he'd kill her/take the kids...she wouldn't be abused.

This "blame the victim" mentality is appalling in its cold-heartedness and ignorance.

As far as Brownback not minding helping those who actually need it? Sorry, but the man keeps coming up with clueless one-size-fits-all "solutions" for serious issues. And he keeps directing SRS bureaucrats to apply those clueless one-size-fits-all "solutions" - and the very people in actual need suffer because of them.

It's soooo easy to say "I want to help people who are truly in need". It's quite another when you DO just the opposite. When you throw the baby out with the bathwater. Like it or not, Brownback does NOT help people actually in need. He's clueless as to the issues they really face.

Maybe instead of "Undercover Boss", we need Brownback to participate in a little "Undercover Governor" he can get an idea of the reality that far too many people face, rather than base his thinking and decisions on negative stereotypes.

Cant_have_it_both_ways 5 years, 10 months ago

Thought you might be smart enough to not play "What if" all day.

Statements are just that statements. No one is against helping those who, in this case was raped. Pull your head out, the sun is a wonderful thing.

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

"What if"??? "Statements are just that statements"??? "...who, in this case was raped..."???

What on earth are you talking about???

YOU are the person who made the irrational claim that "Anyone with any sense does not need or desire all these so called services and handouts".

So it is you who needs to pull your head out...because you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Like it or not, people with "sense" actually have the sense to know when they need help...AND to accept that help when it's available...AND for as long as they need it!

They do not make their decisions based on false pride or on the supposed expectations of others. They make their decisions based on their own circumstances. That's what being a sensible person does.

And sensible people do it in spite of the judgmental expectations of people who don't have a clue what their circumstances are....because people with sense know that your opinion about them or their decisions doesn't count for a single darned thing.

Cait McKnelly 5 years, 10 months ago

"They should just rename the Republican Party the Dominionist Party and get it over with." (From a source.)

JackMcKee 5 years, 10 months ago

What color is the sky in Phyllis Gilmore's world. This is a complete embarrassment for SRS and the State. She should be ashamed.

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

To begin with, O.A.R.S. has ALWAYS been a joke and to the savy public assistance recipient was a key method in avoiding any obligations other assistance recipients are subjected too such as job searching; class attendance (self help; esteem building; GED, blah, blah, blah). The SRS case worker seldom, if ever was given any updates as to how the O.A.R.S. service was going: What manner of progress the proclaimed "domestic violence" (what is that anyway...."domestic violence"? I thought that was what Homeland Security was for.....; battery is battery: We, as a society, trivialize battery by creating a totally seperate INDUSTRY, naming it "domestic violence" and throwing money at it....) victim was making in their "journey" to "being made whole"; blah, blah, blah.

Now then, let it be known Alceste is no supporter of that simple simon head bobbing come out of retirement Gilmore person. She's about as progressive as Sharia law or a rock. Nada. Zero. Zippo. Hack.

O.A.R.S. won't be missed. Truth be told, there has been internal conflict going on within the "domestic violence industry" here in Kansas and Sarah Jane Russell, who is executive director of GaDuGi SafeCenter in Lawrence, and who deferred questions about the impact of the funding issue to The Willow did note: “There is an urgency for all people to sit at the table and talk truthfully about where we are going with victims services in this state.” Ummmm....that's code speak for "Look what you people have done. You've bitten your nose off to spite your faces and now we've got a big fat zero."

Kansas Coalition Against Sexual and Domestic Violence is a shadow organization that has not been compelled to demonstrate accountability for years and years (and that's where O.A.R.S. comes from). Defund them totally.

Psych evals? Let me get this right: We subject little kids to psych evals ALL THE TIME after they've been taken into custody in child abuse and neglect matters and providing such an eval doesn't give the kid (that's the VICTIM in the know....the one who has purportedly been beaten or whatever....) the very real and distinct message "You're messed up!!"?? SRS ought to be compelling the supposed abusing party to the psych eval to find out just how jacked up the beater/neglector is. That'd be too much like right.

So...we can perpetrate the fraud of the psych eval on the kid victim and same doesn't screw with the kids' head, but we can't do it on an adult victim of battery? And that's what it's battery plain and simple (or assault) ain't "domestic violence". Domestic Violence is what Homeland Security is charged with handling.......

JackMcKee 5 years, 10 months ago

you sound like a completely neutral observer.

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

Two problems with your argument, Alceste. (And that's ignoring the bad Homeland Security joke.)

One is that you seem to forget what it used to be like back when "domestic violence" battery happened all the time but police would do nothing, absolutely nothing about it because "it was just a domestic matter". Or because the abused spouse was too afraid to press charges...even when responding officers could see evidence of physical harm.

And, two, "domestic violence" is NOT just about physical violence, NOT just about battery. Rather, it's a pattern of abusive behavior that can also include sexual and/or emotional abuse, intimidation, stalking, neglect, economic deprivation, imprisonment and involuntary isolation...NONE of which can be defined as "battery". Indeed, physical violence isn't even a requirement for domestic violence.

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

...and that is what mental health facilities are far. By fractionalizing the definition; by establishing "turf"; all service recipients suffer because the focus is no longer on the's on the $60k per annum salaries people like GaDaGuChi director's get paid.

Get off the touchy feely and get back to real work. Yes, once upon a time law enforcement looked the other way when families were beating each other ain't that way no more and it's past time that social services QUIT it's viewpoint that A.: Competition is bad in social services; B.: That back door deals ARE made by the girls and boys of the "service providers"; and C. That psycho babble solves family problems. The bulk of the problems can all be traced back to socio-economic disparity: Funny how the wealthy buy their way out of "domestic violence" matters; bit more difficult and far more costly to "buy" one's way out of a felony battery beef. shrug

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

Sorry, but I'm not a fan of the "throw the baby out with the bathwater" approach. And I happen to like facts, not angry assumptions. Oh well.

Jayhawk1958 5 years, 10 months ago

The right-wing has declared war on the poor, low-income, and ANY social program to help those in need. And Brownback calls himself a Christian?

Paul R Getto 5 years, 10 months ago

+1. Perhaps, but his jesus is different than the one most understand. Read up on the Family, AKA the C-Street Cult where he got some of his training.

Jayhawk1958 5 years, 10 months ago

I was going to make another comment but the majority of comments made pretty much cover it. And I'm not talking about uncompassiate people like CHIBW or Alceste.

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

I would like to see a psychological evaluation of Gov Brownback. I would like to know what goes through his mind and what he really believes and thinks. Has he really convinced himself that he is being Christian and is doing the right thing for Kansas? My personal feeling is that he has become deeply delusional, but there are other possibilities.

On the other hand, I might be sorry that I wished to know.

JayhawksandHerd 5 years, 10 months ago

I often wonder if he really believes what he says, or if he sees it as a way to pander to a particular demographic simply to garner votes (which, let's face it, he's had considerable success in doing) regardless of whether he's sincere or not. Either way, he's negatively impacting the lives of real people, which is dangerous any way you look at it.

Politicians are certainly interesting creatures...

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

"Politicians are certainly interesting creatures..."

That's a rather nice civil way to put it . . .

JayhawksandHerd 5 years, 10 months ago

Well, if I posted what I really thought about Governor Sam, it's safe to assume it would be removed sooner rather than later. :)

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

Women who are in an abusive relationship are often reluctant to ask for help for any number of reasons, but the main ones seem to be (1) lack of confidence (being made to feel that it is their fault, they deserve it, they wouldn't be able to survive on their own, etc.) and (2) fear. The abuser feeds into both of these as a way of control.

Those of us who haven't been in this situation may find it hard to understand the hopelessness. We should not be making it harder for the victims to get the help they need or putting them in a catch-22 situation, which it sounds like the psychological evaluation could well be if it's being used against them.

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

So SRS's new policy for battered mothers is to promote and fund FATHERHOOD INITIATIVES - the same bad dads who beat the hell out of mommy aka DADDY WELFARE where they 'teach' bad dad via State and Federal funded programs like "how to not kill your children'', send them and their kids to Royals games, BBQ's et el. all on our tax dollars. This is much more important than funding saving lives - this funding generates and creates new jobs for all those ppl who get to 'create Mr. mom/monster. (human experimentation - genocide of battered mothers and her children)

KS has turned Domestic Violence Programs into FATHERHOOD it's ok to beat your wife, we will help you take your children from your victim. We will enable you to further punish her for life by using her children. If you leave I will take your children and KS will help you.

I know this 1st hand, been there done it, assist hundreds of others who are going through it now. STOP THE VIOLENCE!!!! STOP PUNISHING the VICTIMS. Stop it now.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 5 years, 10 months ago

I know the man in charge of fatherhood initiatives at SRS. He would never promote any of what you have so hysterically accused the state of promoting.

"It's OK to beat your wife"? You actually think that's an official policy of SRS, or a hidden agenda of ANY sitting governor? Come on. Are you really being 100% rational when you believe these things?

tomatogrower 5 years, 10 months ago

There needs to be wording in the psych evaluation requirement that says that it can't be used in any future custody dispute. Then it won't seem so threatening. When a woman first leaves, she may not have the best psych evaluation, but then she improves. And the abuser needs to be required to take a psych evaluation. if they refuse their entire paycheck is given to the family for support, and then maybe you won't have to pay any of your precious money to support the woman and her children. That sounds fair to me. Why isn't there a requirement that the abuser take a psych eval.?

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

  1. Who knows what Gov Brownback's agenda is.

  2. It may not be anybody's agenda, hidden or otherwise, but that doesn't mean it's not the outcome. People can be totally misguided in their "helpfulness."

Obviously there's a reason that AngelFury feels the way she does and uses the handle that she does. Until you have walked in her shoes, perhaps you shouldn't call her hysterical. Women are too often dismissed with that word.

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

My name is Claudine Dombrowski, my web site is

This site has not yet allowed me to change to my name. perhaps because I am on the States Address confidential program as survivor of DV still in danger!

I am a ghost for all intent purposes. I live in a box. And it sux. TY Verity!

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

Unfortunately, the only reason the Governor and SRS are pushing fatherhood initiatives is that involved fathers are more likely to financially support their children than those fathers who are not involved.

SRS expectations regarding fatherhood initiatives have been set up for all types of organizations providing all types of services to all types of people. There's often no rhyme nor reason to them. I mean, expecting a non-profit to provide fatherhood skills training when they don't serve any fathers??? How logical is that?

Or expecting agencies that provide complementary services to the same people to be able to demonstrate that "their" same exact fathers show more improved fatherhood skills than the other agency's same exact fathers??? Gimme a break.

I'm all in favor of RESPONSIBLE fatherhood initiatives. Programs designed to promote HEALTHY families. That has NOT been the SRS focus so far. It's been "fatherhood initiatives" and "faith-based initiatives" regardless of how appropriate such initiatives are in particular circumstances. It''s unintelligent, poorly-thought-out planning.

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

SRS runs its-- they get all the funding and dole it out-- there was a class in Pittsburg, KS 'daddy day care' that through KCSL (SRS's 2nd line of RFP funding) were teaching classes on 'how to not kill' your child.

Google KS Fatherhood Initiatives

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

Unfortunately that's not a sufficient Google search phrase to get to anything supporting your claim about classes on 'how not to kill' your child.

Why not simply provide us with the link you want us to see????

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

Look we don't need daddy welfare. So tell ur friend to stop sending all these 'abusers dads' to royals games trying to teach them to be good dads. MANDATED EVALUATIONS, COUNSELLING to ENCOURAGE Battered Women to return to abuser to maintain the two parent (heterosexual) families.

At the center of criticism

A proposed SRS contract contains two controversial sentences: “The vendor will be encouraged to work with faith-based and community supports to increase the unification of two (2) parent families and promote pregnancy prevention through abstinence based programs.”

“The Contractor shall administer TANF funds to promote healthy families, parenthood initiatives and pregnancy prevention through abstinence based program services to encourage the formation of two parent families

Read more here:

tomatogrower 5 years, 10 months ago

I was a victim of abuse, but my ex wasn't very good at it. He liked my extra income too much. Most abusers will not allow the woman to work outside the home, so they are too poor to leave. They are control freaks. When I left, I had a job and didn't need a shelter, which was good, since there weren't any back then. I also had supportive family and friends. They stood by me even when my ex tried to chase them away.

Abusers take away the abused sense of control and self worth. When they get up enough strength to leave, they do not need to someone else controlling them. They need to regain control of their lives. Providing job training, child care, etc. should be important. Giving them options is most important, but they need to make the decision. Then they can rise above victimhood and become stronger.

That being said, I think that if a victim is still unable to function without SRS after so many years, and refuses to get treatment, then I would guess they are playing the victim card, and maybe should be required to seek help. Of course, forcing a drug addict into rehab doesn't usually work, so I'm not sure if this would. I don't consider myself a victim any more, but a survivor. Help is sometimes needed for the abused get past the victim stage.

I'm not sure what should happen here if there are children involved. An abuser or a mother who is non functional and refuses to get help? Doesn't sound like either place is good for the children. However forcing someone to have a psych evaluation seems a whole lot like the state control most conservatives rail against.

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

I do not know of any survivors who have been so traumatized by leaving abuser safely with her children who have not flourished.

Its a set up to loose your children. So if you do not go back, then it is used against the DV victim in custody litigation.

At which point the Responsible Fatherhood Programs (RFP) 100% funded through SRS then funds those abusers attorneys etc to further litigate basically never letting his victim go. The next best thing to killing her - is to take away her kids.

Christine Anderson 5 years, 10 months ago

AngelFury, it has been several years since the physical part of my abuse happened, so I may not be fully informed as to what is happening right now. What do you mean, if we DON'T go back, it is used against us in custody litigation? Btw, what you say about the Fatherhood Initiatives is true. Thank you for speaking so bravely.

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

Thank you for the comment.

Yes, the evals are being used against battered mothers, when she dares to leave her abuser, when abusers seek custody they get custody via the fatherhood initiatives and funding. Battered mother must pay for their own lawyers while RFP's pay for lawyers for the abusers (fathers) who seek custody of their victims children.

For more information see:

Also see the PBS Documentary Breaking the Silence Children's Stories in its entirety here:

As well several other documentaries that address the (hidden issues) here:

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

Gilmore is nothing more than a joke; a sad one at that. She'll NEVER differ with Gov. Brownback on anything....and she most certainly will implement anything coming out of his office.

The people of Kansas are getting just what they voted for. Amusing stuff, eh>?

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

Not amusing? Really? What are you doing to change the voting publics' desire to first have Sam Brownback as a U.S. Senator from Kansas and then straight away put him in a governor?

Alceste's fortune bets that "verity" is doing nothing other than posting on an internet message board! Has "verity" written to Sam Brownback? Has "verity" written to Gilmore? Has "verity" written to the legislators from this area? Heck, has "verity" even bothered to phone these ELECTED hacks.

Tyranny of the majority baby....think about it.....Democracy is a "great thing", eh? "Voting" solves everything, right?! hahahahahahahahahaha......shrug

Kendall Simmons 5 years, 10 months ago

Well, in my reality, it's pretty darned difficult...indeed, downright "change the voting public's desire" after-the-fact.

And, at least in my reality, I wonder how the voting public's desire is gonna be changed by writing directly to the governor or legislators or to an SRS official?

Indeed, it seems to me that forum posts and letters to the editor would at least reach some of the voting public being referred to. But, again, that's just in my reality.

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

No wonder the guy keeps getting elected if "acornworks" system/way of "participatory democracy" is practiced by the majority. I guess we pretty much deserve what we get, eh? shrug

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

My dear Alceste,

Yes, I have written to the governor. I have also written to my congresspeople, both state and national. I spend quite a lot of time researching and composing letters that support my reasons for thinking as I do.

I also vote---and educate myself before voting.

I agree with Kendall Simmons---I hope that my posts on this forum will cause some people to think and educate themselves, whether they agree with me or not. I consider this, among other things I am involved in, as voter education.

You can contact me through LJW to hand over your fortune.

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

Really? Was that last "letter" sent back in 1984 or something? Was it a pre-prepared letter that you simply copied?

verity 5 years, 10 months ago

That's all you've got?

I didn't expect you to make good on your wager, but I expected to at least be entertained by a snappy comeback.

Alceste 5 years, 10 months ago

I have a LOT more....but the LJWorld wouldn't like it. My wager is full on good provided you produce what you've done.

Just this day Alceste received an AARP generated "letter" to send in......; understand Alceste's viewpoint on them that says they "send letters" and faxes?

Irrespective, verity and that ugly rose'll be disappointed on her earnings from the wager......

Stupid is as stupid does....

AngelFury 5 years, 10 months ago

At the center of criticism

A proposed SRS contract contains two controversial sentences: “The vendor will be encouraged to work with faith-based and community supports to increase the unification of two (2) parent families and promote pregnancy prevention through abstinence based programs.”

“The Contractor shall administer TANF funds to promote healthy families, parenthood initiatives and pregnancy prevention through abstinence based program services to encourage the formation of two parent families...

The controversial language could end up pushing more women to stay in abusive relationships, having the unintended consequence of endangering them and their children, critics say.The same contract – which also would provide services to sex-assault victims – calls for abstinence-based programs. Critics say it would be insulting to tell a woman who has been raped that abstinence is part of the solution

. Read more here:

JayhawkFan1985 5 years, 10 months ago

Brownback and his administration are incompotent buffoons that are damaging the social, economic and physical infrastructure of this state. It will take decades to recover just as if we had been hit by a hurricane, tornado or flood. These clowns are unbelievable.

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