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Archive for Thursday, January 26, 2012

Bill would allow guns on campus

Regents and KU strongly opposed

January 26, 2012

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TOPEKA — Gun rights advocates on Wednesday pushed for passage of a bill that would allow concealed carry of handguns on college campuses and public buildings, such as libraries, city halls and day care centers in city facilities.

Rep. Forrest Knox, R-Altoona, said after a hearing on House Bill 2353 that he thought his measure would be approved by the Legislature this year. It has won approval before in the House but hasn’t gained traction yet in the Senate.

“Currently any building, public or private, can be posted prohibiting concealed carry regardless of the level of security provided within the building,” Knox told the House Federal and State Affairs Committee.

Patricia Stoneking, president of the Kansas State Rifle Association, said, “We need to understand that criminals will not abide by the law of the signs. These signs are disarming only law-abiding permit licensees.”

But the measure was roundly criticized by the Kansas Board of Regents and representatives of cities and counties. The committee will continue hearing testimony on the bill today.

“The safety and security efforts of these universities would be substantially undermined, if not crippled, by the passage of House Bill 2353,” said Andy Tompkins, president and chief executive officer of the regents.

“It is our firm belief that allowing weapons on campus would significantly increase the risk of violence and harm to students, faculty and others rather than making anyone safer,” Tompkins said. The measure is opposed by Kansas University.

Under Knox’s bill, people who are licensed to carry a concealed gun would be allowed to bring a weapon into a state or city facility unless the building had adequate security measures, such as electronic screening equipment and guards, to ensure that no weapons could be brought in.

Knox has said he thought the gunman who killed 32 at Virginia Tech University in 2007 would have been stopped more quickly if someone else had been carrying a concealed weapon.

Knox said the right to possess and carry a firearm is a fundamental right and was a high priority of the Founding Fathers.

He said, “The benefits of a well-armed society included not only personal security, but national security and security from a tyrannical government as well. This was clearly the intention of the Founders. We still see that this applies today. A well-armed society is a polite society.”

But city, county and regents officials said the requirement to have security systems in place at all entrances would be cost prohibitive.

The bill “bullies us into allowing guns in our public buildings whether our elected officials or our citizens want that or not,” said Mike Taylor of the Unified Government of Wyandotte County and Kansas City.

Under another provision, a city would be unable to prohibit concealed carry in the workplace if the employee was licensed and if the building wasn’t adequately secured. City officials said this was an intrusive reach by the state into employer-employee personnel policies.

Comments

RETICENT_IRREVERENT 2 years, 2 months ago

Then allow legal permitted concealed carry if they can not guarantee no illegal weapons.

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RETICENT_IRREVERENT 2 years, 2 months ago

LeftyHawk, This bill would prevent the operators of public buildings from posting signs at those properties to excluding legal concealed carry unless sufficient and adequate physical security was in place to prevent ANYONE from bringing a weapon inside. The security expectation would apply to the Capitol, Governor's mansion and county courthouses.

All this bill is saying is: You can not exclude legal permitted concealed carry if you can not adequately and sufficiently prevent all weapon entry into a public space / building.

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LeftyHawk 2 years, 2 months ago

Why does the proposed bill not allow concealed weapons in the State House, Cedar Crest, etc.? Change the bill to allow them, drop all the security (saving the State $2 million plus a year?), and let the Gov/legislators defend themselves as needed. I don't see why the campus should be open like the wild west while legislators continue to not get to carry! This is a really bad bill but if they want to do it why stop it short?

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goodcountrypeople 2 years, 2 months ago

I'm hugely turned off by Lawrence's culture of street harassment but cannot even in jest suggest that allowing women and those who feel vulnerable to aggressive country bumpkins to tote a glock will make them feel safer and those who do not understand decent social boundaries do a double take.

Lawrence already has a dirty, criminal, Bonnie and Clyde culture feel about it, not only because of the rampant street harassers too stupid to know their arses from their mouths, but also because of all the dishonest lawyers and corrupt prosecutors here. Guns will only magnify the problem.

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Oldsoul 2 years, 2 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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Jayhawk_4_Life 2 years, 2 months ago

"A well-armed society is a polite society." - That's a joke, right?

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RomelioBobalinski 2 years, 2 months ago

Every US citizen should have the legal right to protect themselves in any manner they deem appropriate where ever they are. Cowards go to our schools and destroy are most precious gifts and then cowardly take their own lives when confronted. In our schools, we need to have a way to confront them earlier in their deadly rampage to prevent further destruction - we need to have, at the very least, the legal ability to carry concealed. The latest numbers show that out of the 110,000 Douglas county residents 940 have concelaed carry. They don't all carry but at least there is that question of "Who is carrying?" In fact, "Who is Carrying?" is a good question because none of those 940 people have ever been convicted of a felony, have been classroom trained, have shown they can shoot what they aim at, successfully passed the KBI and FBI criminal background checks and paid an exorbitant amount of money to get the "Good Guy Card". They can prove they are the good guys, let them carry in our schools.

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Flap Doodle 2 years, 2 months ago

I don't have the time (or the stomach) to read this whole thread. Has anyone dragged a penis into the conversation yet?

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Dixie Jones 2 years, 2 months ago

Who in their right minds think up these bills? Are they as stupid as they seem?

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thuja 2 years, 2 months ago

Why doesn't someone just make a gun app for my phone?

My Uzi weighs a ton.

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tange 2 years, 2 months ago

Ya know, it's a pain just to have to carry my keys.

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woodscolt 2 years, 2 months ago

Brilliant. We need more guns so people can defend themselves against the guns. A typical cave man argument. Lets lower the level of society to the wild wild west. I guess that is a stop on the road map to lowering society to a cave man level. Now people who would never have a gun have to have one just to be able to have a chance against the a holes that are promoting this game of Russian Roulette.

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jhawkinsf 2 years, 2 months ago

This is my weapon, this is my gun. This is for killing, this is for fun.

This is my weapon, this is my gun. This is for killing, this is for fun.

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Kyle Chandler 2 years, 2 months ago

Personally, being a criminal, i hope this law doesnt pass. I'll be able to rob most anyone and wont have to worry if they are packing legally. Thanks!

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Joe Hyde 2 years, 2 months ago

Future news item:

"Kansas gun rights advocates on Wednesday pushed for passage of a House bill that would allow open carry of hand grenades, machine guns and flame throwers by professors and student aides in college classrooms and campuses; and by municipan employees working in public buildings such as libraries and city halls. Employees of day care centers in city facilities would be authorized to carry and use Tasers to neutralize the unruly behavior of pre-school children."

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pace 2 years, 2 months ago

This is a law that says a place or institution will not have the right to ban guns on their property. Too much government.

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RETICENT_IRREVERENT 2 years, 2 months ago

The issue is a licensed CCW person has to de-holster, and remove that firearm before entering one of these establishments, increasing the potential for a ND., where if they did not have to remove firearm, they would not touch it.

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gudpoynt 2 years, 2 months ago

To all CCW-permit holders: what makes you think all other CCW permit holders, present and future, will be as responsible as you?

I'm sure that you would be perfectly well behaved if you were to hide a fully loaded Glock in your pants and walk into, say, a child's daycare, or the public library during story time, or into a city council meeting when they're having a heated discussion on... whatever.

If you could guarantee that every CCW permit holder would be as responsible as you, always and everywhere, then I would have no problem.

But you can't. Sorry, but you just can't.

And because you can't, I have to ask the question of which is a more likely scenario? 1) Fully loaded firearm, owned by somebody other than you, is lost or stolen in a public place. 2) Fully loaded firearm, owned by somebody other than you, accidentally goes off in a public place. 3) Fully loaded firearm is used by someone other than you to threaten someone else in a public place. 4) Fully loaded firearm is used by someone other than you to harm or kill someone else in a public place. 5) Licenced CCW permit holder, not you, attempts to stop a crime in progress, but ends up shooting someone or something that they didn't intend to, and does NOT result in stopping the crime. 6) Or... the "good" scenario where YOU save the day by shooting a would-be perpetrator, and are actually successful in stopping a crime in progress.

I'm a numbers guy, and I have to say, the increased safety of having YOU have a concealed, fully loaded handgun in your pants is just not worth the risk of somebody who I don't know, who is NOT YOU, carrying a fully loaded handgun in HIS or HER pants.

Since the only gun I carry in MY pants is not for fighting, but rather for fun, I would just prefer that everybody left their fighting guns at home, or an equally safe location. We can continue to rely on the police for protection against criminals, and if we need to start an armed revolution against the government, I will come to you to for a gun and shooting lessons.

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its_just_math 2 years, 2 months ago

Bill would allow guns on campus Regents and KU strongly opposed

ie, liberals with degrees hanging on their walls disagree, 'cause that's what theyr'e supposed to do.

Given the ratio of nutcases to law-abiding citizens, this makes good sense. If every once in awhile, a crazed gunman blows away 10-15-20 or 50 people, this law is stupid. I mean, the trade-off is not worth it. Just because Jim or Jane, legal carrier, blows away the shooter before he kills his 5th, 6th or 20th victim, so what?

Good story, Mr. R.

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dwendel 2 years, 2 months ago

This bill has nothing to do with gun rights or public safety. Gun makers want to sell more guns. Gun makers give money to law makers to make laws to help sell more guns. Law makers do what gun makers ask. Gun makers sell more guns and make more money. The end. Sadly, your voice doesn't really matter, one way or the other.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

I've seen a lot of rude uncivil behavior on this here unarmed website. But then if we all had a disapearededed button it would be a ghost town . . .

8-)

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thuja 2 years, 2 months ago

Your argument is a Catch-22.

Please explain the logic behind the opposite of the statement:

An unarmed society is a rude and/ or uncivilized society.

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MacHeath 2 years, 2 months ago

I have a carry permit, and rarely carry, because it is a heck of a responsibility. I think folks that have never considered a carry permit realize this fact. Taking this in to account, as well as the age issue, I think this is a moot issue. It really won't make much difference.

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Gotland 2 years, 2 months ago

If you let adults in a public space exercise this constitutional right next thing you know they will want the freedom to gather, and speak freely.

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kernal 2 years, 2 months ago

In response to my 9:50 am comment today, not every state requires a permit to carry concealed plus there is a loophole in the Brady gun act that allows persons to purchase guns without a background check as long as the gun remains in the state where it was made and the buyer is a resident of that state. Every state does not have a permit requirement for CCW as long as you don't take the gun into a bar or restaurant where liquor is served. I'm not sure about the child care center issue. Also, every state does not require that gun sellers be certified.

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Pork_Ribs 2 years, 2 months ago

I had "ap" capitalized (that's Associated Press for the censors at the LJW) and Reading, PA capitalized as well as the last sentence. Why was it auto changed to all lower case? I was not yelling "ap!!" or anything else at anyone. Even if I was...who cares?

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Pork_Ribs 2 years, 2 months ago

Today’s AP: "READING, Pa. – A 65-year-old man shot one teenager dead and wounded another after they pushed him off his bicycle and tried to rob him in Pennsylvania, police said. The man was cycling on a trail in Reading, Pa., shortly before 11:00 am local time Wednesday morning, when a group of teens pushed him off the bicycle and two of them assaulted him, investigators said. The 65 year old then took out a handgun and shot them both, the Reading Eagle reported. One of the teens -- a 16 year old from Reading -- was pronounced dead at the scene at 12:17 p.m. local time. The second teenager was taken to the hospital but his condition was unknown, according to the newspaper. Cops arrested a third boy at the scene and took him in for questioning. The 15 year old was later taken to a county youth center in nearby Bern Township where he was held on unspecified charges. Police decided to release the 65 year old and charge the juvenile after consulting with District Attorney John Adams, who attended the scene with forensic detectives, the Reading Eagle reported. Authorities did not release his name or the names of the teenagers."


This article from today's AP is all the proof I need that if you can pass the test and the background check...you should be able to carry legally anywhere you like. Thugs don't care where they are at to commit crime. If they know 100% that their prey is not armed, they will not hesitate to act. Only an idiot would say that criminals would not think twice if they knew their target was armed. Now...the article doesn't mention if the 65 year old man was carrying lawfully. He was released after the shooting...so you can make that deduction yourself.

SAYING THAT GUNS KILL PEOPLE IS LIKE SAYING A SPOON MADE ROSIE O'DONNELL FAT.

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voevoda 2 years, 2 months ago

Rep. Knox and other members of the state legislature are rarely on university campuses. Why should they decide? Why not let the university senates on each campus vote and decide whether to allow students and employees to carry weapons on campus? That would be democracy: the people most directly affected get to decide.

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blue73harley 2 years, 2 months ago

Jeez, you can't even buy adult toys in Larryville without running into someone that is packin'.

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bootlegger 2 years, 2 months ago

Where is Wyatt and Doc Holiday at?????

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RETICENT_IRREVERENT 2 years, 2 months ago

I would appreciate having to de-holster less.

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tange 2 years, 2 months ago

Great. Stratify society to a point that you only feel comfortable in public when packin' heat. And, when your horse finally collapses onto you, will ya cuss 'im?

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lawslady 2 years, 2 months ago

LJW - anyone know if/how many other states allow concealed carry on university campuses? And if so, how is it working there. Also, I've been told that even in the military, no one is allowed to carry loaded weapons around just for protection. They have an "ammo room" on base, in barracks, where personal weapons can be stored (must be stored), and you can only get at your gun by checking it out (and back in) from the person in charge of that room.

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Aiko 2 years, 2 months ago

Is this why Angela Davis will be here to speak soon?

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Flap Doodle 2 years, 2 months ago

They took the photo of the bad 'ole mean revolver down?

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DillonBarnes 2 years, 2 months ago

I don't make any claim to what would have happened at V.T. if someone had be carrying. I can't tell you the Tuscon, Arizona shooting would have gone any different had an armed citizen be able to react quicker, it's all hypothetical.

I have no dreams or aspirations of chasing down a armed gunman on campus, why would I put myself in that kind of danger? However, IF something like that ever happened, I sure as hell want something more than a thin particle board desk to protect me from a gunman. I take the responsibility of carrying seriously, and many others I know who carry look at it the same way. We practice and we train to be able to defend ourselves. We want to be prepared, not out of fear, but out of the knowledge that there really is violence out there. Are you a coward because you have emergency supplies in case a serious storm hits? No, you're prepared, and carrying is simply an extension of that some of us choose to do.

Chances are you've been around someone lately who was carrying, and you had no idea. Where you scared of them then? Make a gun-owning friend, and go shoot with them.

Anyone want to learn how to shoot a gun?

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Ken Lewis 2 years, 2 months ago

The least of our worries and needs right now.

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CWGOKU 2 years, 2 months ago

So, what is the aim of this article? Who is the target audience?

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FalseHopeNoChange 2 years, 2 months ago

If you need a hand gun to enter a building. Your best bet to avoid an incident, is not go in there.

(from a source)

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gudpoynt 2 years, 2 months ago

"the bill would allow concealed carry of handguns in day care centers"

we're not allowed to do that now? whoops.

at least they're finally getting around to the stuff that matters.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

Chances are any student, professor or employee of the university with CCW permit and weapon would be in lock down if a shooting were to occur. I would never assume the nearest student or professor with a gun should be the hero of the day, but his or her right to defend by any means should not be compromised.

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Outsidelookingin 2 years, 2 months ago

Not everyone wants to carry and they are not required to carry. If I have been through the licencing process, background checked and trained, I should be able to carry any where I want. Apparently, the US of A thought I was capable of carrying a firearm and making split second decisions, when I was 18 years old or they would not have sent me over there. I certainly don't want to take a life, but if it comes to a decision of him or me. I'll be prepared to make that decision.

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Steve Swaggerty 2 years, 2 months ago

Have these people never heard of Virginia Tech? This is the most absurd thing I've ever heard!! Just more proof why the rest of the country views BROWNBACKISTAN as a bunch of ignorant,backwoods, hillbillies!!

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yourworstnightmare 2 years, 2 months ago

A government that forces its citizens to arm themselves can also do the opposite.

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kansanbygrace 2 years, 2 months ago

But, with all the firearm violence we've experienced here on campus in the last several years, don't we have to do something to stop it? I mean, just killing the few dozen mass murderers we've had could have saved how many lives? Really, how many?

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voevoda 2 years, 2 months ago

The Constitution does not call for a "well-armed society." It calls for a "well-regulated militia." I'm all in favor of KU having a well-regulated militia. As for any random student who can pass a minimal test carrying a concealed weapon around campus, that seems to be a recipe for a lot of random shootings, either by accident or at the spur of the moment.

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FalseHopeNoChange 2 years, 2 months ago

At halftime festivities, the students could chant the old favorite:

"This is my rifle. This is my gun. This is for shooting. This is for fun"

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DillonBarnes 2 years, 2 months ago

I'm glad to see this bill back up, this is a positive step towards personal safety and 2nd amendment rights.

If anyone wants to have a serious discussion about the bill, feel free to message me.

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profound 2 years, 2 months ago

I'm all for it if no lead is allowed. It's not environmentally correct. Only bismuth projectiles.

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yourworstnightmare 2 years, 2 months ago

Warning! Warning!

Wedge issue.

Gets the gun nuts frothing and the do-gooders wringing their hands.

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Betty Bartholomew 2 years, 2 months ago

Who in god's name is taking a gun into a daycare center? Jesus Christ - you're not gonna be attacked by a gun-wielding 2 year old!

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peartree 2 years, 2 months ago

Yelling at this guy from a town with less that 500 people about what an idiot he is will get you nowhere. Come up with some arguments to convince the Republicans if you want to defeat bills like this. Regardless of your views on gun rights, this is a bad idea financially. Municipalities will scramble to pay for "securing" their buildings, and all Kansas higher eds will suddenly be less attractive to the parents of college students.

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labmonkey 2 years, 2 months ago

That is a pretty gun in the picture... looks a lot like my Ruger GP100. They have it on an 8x11 sheet of paper which means that it has at least a 4" barrel. Nobody in their right mind would carry that thing, but I guess they needed a picture of a scary gun to make a point. Personally, I would carry my S&W bodyguard .380.

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pace 2 years, 2 months ago

I think it is time to lower the permit to carry age to 6. Children have civil rights.

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chzypoof1 2 years, 2 months ago

I won't even begin to try and shoot all of you scared people down. (pun intended). Defending yourself with a firearm is a constitutionally protected right. It shouldn't stop at the school grounds.

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1029 2 years, 2 months ago

People should be allowed to carry guns wherever they want, but they should have to carry them in an exposed holster so that everyone else gets to see who the scared people are.

The only problem with this is that you may get people making fun of the scaredy cats, which could be dangerous since the scaredy cats are armed and are probably not all there mentally (evidenced by the fact that they feel so threatened in a classroom that they need to carry a gun with them).

Furthermore, this could create all kinds of new products, industries, and jobs. Girls might want some fancy holster that matches their shoes, there could maybe be different kinds of KU holsters, etc. I think this "exposed holster" idea deserves more consideration.

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1029 2 years, 2 months ago

People should be allowed to carry guns wherever they want, but they should have to carry them in an exposed holster so that everyone else gets to see who the scared people are.

The only problem with this is that you may get people making fun of the scaredy cats, which could be dangerous since the scaredy cats are armed and are probably not all there mentally (evidenced by the fact that they feel so threatened in a classroom that they need to carry a gun with them).

Furthermore, this could create all kinds of new products, industries, and jobs. Girls might want some fancy holster that matches their shoes, there could maybe be different kinds of KU holsters, etc. I think this "exposed holster" idea deserves more consideration.

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BigDog 2 years, 2 months ago

beatrice .... Your answer was in the article

Under Knox’s bill, people who are licensed to carry a concealed gun would be allowed to bring a weapon into a state or city facility unless the building had adequate security measures, such as electronic screening equipment and guards, to ensure that no weapons could be brought in.

Tha Capitol Buidling would not be a place a person would be allowed to carry because they have Capitol Police as well as electronic screening equipment.

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Lateralis 2 years, 2 months ago

"I'm not willing to shoot or kill someone. I'm not physically or emotionally capable of doing that. If you are--and you're not police or military or FBI or someone trained to kill in order to protect the general poplulace--I don't want to know you." - Ladyoneill

I'll sure as hell shoot them if they attack myself or my family.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

In reference to guns in high schools. Very few 21 year old are still in high school. I assume the allowance for high schools would include teachers, administrators, cooks, bus drivers and maintenance personnel.

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beezee 2 years, 2 months ago

The post by JohnD1975 sums it up nicely. I'm an instructor in the program and thus far have had NO student go through a class (though I have over the years had SEVERAL faculty and staff). Thus far, the "boo-hoo the sky is falling" crap I'm reading is the same crap served up when the original bill passed some years ago. So, thus far NO street shootouts between licensees; NO drive-bys by licensees; NO stupidity by licensees.

And Stoneking's comment about criminals not caring about what's posted on some door is 100% correct. To a homicidally inclined person, ALL that the sign conveys is "free-fire, victim-rich zone within." The issue is (for the obligately short-sighted hoplophobes) best stated as: Since I have passed the background check and gotten said license, WHY should I leave the gun in my car while going into a building?

And by the way, as the gun is to be CONCEALED, who'd know? So those concerned about wetting their pants at the sight of a gun, relax.

As for why a gun MIGHT be needed in [any] school, there are more than a few examples. One such is at http://www.davekopel.com/2a/othwr/principal&gun.htm

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Laura Wilson 2 years, 2 months ago

There is something no one seems to be mentioning. Just because you have a gun, have a license to carry it, can then carry it onto campus, does that equate with being willing and able to shoot someone? So many commenters are all "mass shootings would be prevented/stopped early if everyone could have a gun" but that doesn't mean anything if someone isn't going to step up and KILL someone.

I'm not willing to shoot or kill someone. I'm not physically or emotionally capable of doing that. If you are--and you're not police or military or FBI or someone trained to kill in order to protect the general poplulace--I don't want to know you.

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beatrice 2 years, 2 months ago

I wouldn't be surprised if this brings about grade inflation. Some professors won't want to take the chance of giving pistol-packin' Bobby a C.

Straight As from here on.

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Bruce Bertsch 2 years, 2 months ago

Va Tech is a good example of why loose state laws don't work. Ask a NYC cop where the guns on the streets come from. the answer will be Virginia and Florida. Intersting factoid for the let 'em conceal and carry crowd, NYC has the toughest gun laws in the US and a shrinking murder and crime rate. If you really think that a criminal takes the time to think, "I better not do this because that person may be packing" you are delusional.

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beatrice 2 years, 2 months ago

I don't have an issue with C&C. People are trained and they have permits. I'm all for that kind of gun ownership.

My only questions are about where guns can be carried: If signed into law by the Governor, will any of us be allowed to enter the Capitol Building and meet with the Governor or any of the lawmakers who support the bill while carrying, or will we be stopped at the entrance and not allowed if? If not, why are they supporting a law that wouldn't apply to their work place, but they want to make sure it happens in places where others work?

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JohnD1975 2 years, 2 months ago

I don't believe most of the people commenting are aware of the procedure to obtain a concealed carry license. If this law passes, only students over 21 are even eligible for the license. That knocks out over half of KU probably. To obtain a license, you must go through training, (which I've done) and you must prove that you can shoot accurately, you are given hours of training on safety, when it is appropriate to use your firearm to defend yourself or others and when it is not acceptable. After the hours of training are complete, you must take a test and receive a 100% to pass.. Even after this is complete, you must submit your certification to your local law enforcement agency and they will run extensive background checks on the person. If you have something on your record, you aren't getting a license. This procedure can take a few months to complete. I believe most people think after this passes that all of the KU population will be packing heat to class everyday and this is not true. My guess is about 1-2% of KU's students are licensed to conceal carry. So if there is another situation such as Virginia Tech, you won't have a room full of students pulling out guns to take him out, but hopefully 1 trained individual to take him out before he does more damage. All the license does is allow the good guy to protect himself and others, because the bad guys don't get licenses before they go shooting people.

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kernal 2 years, 2 months ago

I don't want a gun and don't want one in my home, but if this "Wild West" law passes, the KS legislature isn't giving me much choice. Unless,the nation outlaws unregulated gun shows, no guns purchased online and requires licensing with a ten day waiting period during which a background check can be done, this is a recipe for disaster.

Ever stop to think that what happened in Tucson might have been averted if AZ hadn't loosened up it's gun regulations?

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autie 2 years, 2 months ago

At least they allow open carry and concealed carry up and down the Kaw River. You never know when you might have to protect yourself from stray windshields or another kayak run amuck. Last time I was up on the bar up river I saw a shredded bowling pin come floating by..being environmentally insane, I tried to sink it.. didn't work.

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Paul R Getto 2 years, 2 months ago

You will know these folks are serious when they allow open and concealed carry in their offices and in the galleries for the Senate and the House. Come to think of it, do you think hearing a few dozen 'concerned' citizens chambering a round in the balcony just before a vote on a critical issue might help the Reps and Senators focus their minds on the task at hand?

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took_the_money_and_ran 2 years, 2 months ago

Do I need a concealed firearm to be safe on the KU campus? Or would my money be better spent on a personal lightning rod? From what I remember, the number of KU students struck by lightning in the last 30 years is greater than the number who have been shot.

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Loki 2 years, 2 months ago

I would be a lot more supportive of C&C laws if the training included some type of real life scenerio to judge how someone would truly react. The majority would fail causing others to b injured or killed or themselves to be injured or killed.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

And once again I ask, "Who among you believe there are no guns on campus?"

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catfishturkeyhunter 2 years, 2 months ago

While I love my guns and it will take a gun fight to take them away from me. There is no reason guns should be allowed on campus. If your going to allow them onto a college campus you may as well allow them onto a high school campus. Some of the high school campuses are more dangerous than a college campus

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autie 2 years, 2 months ago

He said, “The benefits of a well-armed society included not only personal security, but national security and security from a tyrannical government as well. This was clearly the intention of the Founders. We still see that this applies today. A well-armed society is a polite society.”

Is Forrest advocating for an armed uprising against the government sometime soon? I always figured him for being a white supremist type ala Virgil Peck. Yeah, lets just increase campus fees by a few more bucks and then pass out an AK to all new incoming students..that ought to stop all those shooting on campus. Seriously..dumb idea. I think 99%, even if CCL licensed, will poop their pants if they come under fire. Making a school into an armed camp would be akin to giving electric gatling guns to Somalia warlords for Christmas.

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geekin_topekan 2 years, 2 months ago

"If Virginia Tech allowed teachers to carry a concealed gun, many lives would have been saved." ++++ Speculation and fantasy Rambos do not good-sense make.

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tennesseerader 2 years, 2 months ago

If Virginia Tech allowed teachers to carry a concealed gun, many lives would have been saved. Every place law abiding citizens are allowed to carry concealed firearms the crime rate falls. Only law abiding citizens over the age of 21 with a FBI background check and have successfully completed a firearms safety course are allowed to carry.

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mom_of_three 2 years, 2 months ago

I always laugh when anyone brings up the founding fathers and what they meant by the right to bear arms. The founding fathers were dealing with armed british outside their door, and had to shoot for their food, and to protect their livestock and well being. The revolutionary citizens were forced to house the British soldiers, feed and house them. Then again, there was the Whiskey Rebellion and Bacon's Rebellion, where they killed those "pesky" Indians who insisted the land was theirs.

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rockchalker52 2 years, 2 months ago

Dumbest idea of the year, but it's early yet.

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Flap Doodle 2 years, 2 months ago

Well, golly, look at all the wild west shootouts between people holding concealed carry permits in Kansas. Oh, wait, that didn't actually happen.

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sierraclub 2 years, 2 months ago

We just need to put up more 'NO GUNS' allowed signs. That will stop the criminals.

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question4u 2 years, 2 months ago

"An armed society is a polite society." Why? Carrying guns gives everyone sweet dispositions? Or is an armed society a society of fear? Does anyone really believe that the Japanese have a society less polite than that of the United States? Are the British ruder to one another because they don't carry guns? Will students be politer if they think that their professor has a sawed off shotgun under the podium?

"We need to understand that criminals will not abide by the law of the signs." We also need to understand that the majority of murders are not committed by people who are already criminals. Teenagers, guns, and alcohol are not a good combination. The potential for accidental deaths and impulse killings increases with the increased presence of guns. To deny that would be stupid.

If the law is changed, it should be changed based on careful study of all of the potential benefits and liabilities. Instead, we get Knox and his hot air. Platitudes are as useless in the concealed weapons debate as they are in the debate over abortion. There are real points that can be made for both sides of this issue, but we're not not likely to hear a reasoned argument made by anyone in the Kansas House.

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FalseHopeNoChange 2 years, 2 months ago

Arming Obama's OWS crew is a good idea?

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appleaday 2 years, 2 months ago

Arizona is a well armed society. The person who took the gun away from Jared Loughner was a 60 something unarmed woman.

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Richard Heckler 2 years, 2 months ago

This bill = irresponsible and reckless!

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RedOctober 2 years, 2 months ago

This is so we can have that long awaited Evangelical Conservative Theocracy - "the People" have to be armed and ready

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Robert Rauktis 2 years, 2 months ago

Patricia Stoneking, president of the Kansas State Rifle Association, said, “We need to understand that criminals will not abide by the law of the signs. These signs are disarming only law-abiding permit licensees.”

Ms. Stoneking must understand that these are college students. They step in front of oncoming traffic talking on their cell phones. Their judgment is far worse than the ordinary criminal.

Ms. Stoneking needs a scholarship to Virginia Tech.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

"An armed society is a polite society" is a quote from Robert A. Heinlein's book "Beyond This Horizon" (1948), a scifi thriller about genetic engineering. This was one of the first scifi books I read as a child and the qoute was one of the lasting memories of having read it.

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RoeDapple 2 years, 2 months ago

Does anyone really believe no one is packin' on campus now?

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Mike Gerhardt 2 years, 2 months ago

I have mixed feelings on this. On one hand, I fully support the law abiding citizenry being trained and armed, but on the other hand, a bunch of university students carrying makes me nervous.

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TheStonesSuck 2 years, 2 months ago

"A well-armed society is a polite society." Mr. Knox, Somalia would like a word with you.

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