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Opinion

Opinion

Faulty reports inflamed reaction to Florida shooting

April 7, 2012

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The tragic shooting death of a Florida teenager by a neighborhood watch volunteer has triggered protests throughout the country and hearings in our nation’s capital and provided fodder for those who want to inject racism into the picture.

The Florida teenager was African-American, and the watchman is Hispanic.

The fatal shooting happened several weeks ago, with the young man’s body remaining in the morgue for several days before his family was notified. Police did not detain the watchman, saying he had acted in self-defense under the “stand your ground” concept. Florida officials have not said whether they intend to arrest or prosecute the watchman.

Unfortunately, but not unexpectedly, the tragic shooting added sparks to an already highly combustible racial tinderbox where some seem to be looking for almost any excuse to ignite dangerous racial reactions.

In far too many situations like this, first reactions, first charges and countercharges and first explanations are based on inaccurate or incomplete information. And, in too many situations, these first reactions can set an inaccurate stage that can spark careless and harmful reactions.

Unfortunately, some of the early news reports of the shooting failed to give an accurate description of the actions of the watchman and the young man or police officers. Whether or not these reports were flawed accidentally or on purpose remains to be determined, but they added to the explosiveness of the situation.

NBC radio officials have acknowledged they edited or censored the initial conversation between the watchman and police officers when the watchman called to tell officers he was following a suspicious-acting individual. Police officers asked if the person was “black, white or Hispanic,” to which the watchman responded, “He looks black.”

The NBC radio report was trimmed, edited or censored to suggest the watchman volunteered to police, with no prompting or question, that the young man was black.

This caused many to claim the shooting was due to racial profiling, which, in turn, resulted in the massive outbursts condemning the watchman and claiming it was a case of racial bias.

It is a clear case of editing or censorship, not likely an accident. The big question is, why? Was someone trying to inject racism or trying to incite the public?

The same could and should be asked about the ABC television report that tried to present a inaccurate picture of the watchman. ABC TV pictures showed the watchman getting out of a police car and waking around in an enclosed garage. TV commentators pointed out there was no sign of a head injury or blood even though a witness to the accident claimed the teenager had punched or knocked the watchman to the ground and pounded his head into the sidewalk. The announcer emphasized they had made a close and careful examination of the pictures and that there was no evidence of injury.

Later, in the same, or very similar television pictures, showing the same scene, viewers could see a bloodied head and were told there was blood on a shirt. Also, reports said the watchman had been cleaned up a bit before getting to the police station.

The point is, the media, this time NBC and ABC, gave an inaccurate report.

NBC spokespeople merely said “an error” had been made in the production process.

ABC hasn’t said what happened in the report that a close, careful examination of their TV picture showed no evidence of blood.

True, mistakes are bound to happen, but in a case so sensitive as a shooting that resulted in the death of a black teenager by a volunteer Hispanic watchman, extra care could be taken to make sure the information presented by the news media is accurate.

There already is enough public skepticism about the media and its accuracy or fairness. Situations such as the NBC and ABC reports on the Florida shooting do nothing but provide added evidence for those who question the honesty of the media.

Some on the print media side will be quick to suggest radio and television are more in show business than news reporting, but instances of inaccuracy and dishonesty cannot be marginalized or tolerated.

Editorials and opinion are one thing, but facts are facts, and what NBC and ABC did was wrong, wrong as can be, and because of this supposed carelessness or deliberate editing, the shooting tragedy has escalated to an even higher, more dangerous level of anger, mistrust and racial tension.

Police and law enforcement officials already face a tough, delicate job in handling this case, but it was made even more difficult by the conflicting news reports. Will their actions be tempered or swayed by the intense pressure now being exerted?

The only way to resolve this situation is for the law to be followed in an open and honest way.

Again, the erroneous initial news reports by NBC and ABC have made this task more difficult.

Comments

Clayton Cosby 2 years, 8 months ago

George Zimmerman killed an unarmed teenager. He shot treyvon multiple times. Was this necessary? Furthermore, when conducting a proper neighborhood watch you are supposed to call the police if you see something suspicious. You are not supposed to run around the neighborhood and play cop while you follow people with a gun. Because Zimmerman chose to act like a mad man he got into a fight. Maybe next time he will stay at home and call the police. Hopefully we can get this nut off the streets before he kills anyone else.

Flap Doodle 2 years, 8 months ago

".. He shot treyvon multiple times..." Not in this reality. Thanks for playing, better luck next time.

skinny 2 years, 8 months ago

Rogers, Your post is full of errors as far as the facts go. How about waiting until you know the whole story before you go running off at the mouth!

50YearResident 2 years, 8 months ago

Another eyewitness has stepped forward. RogersState80. You tell them Rogers!

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

What is it you people saying you must be an eyewitness to know what really happened? Is it laziness, lack of intelligence, deep hatred for the deceased, what?

Good grief!!!! There is so much instant communication to follow and the internet is a source for the news that there is no excuse to be ignorant.

This outcry of the "media" changing a few minor reporting things in this incident is laughable. It does NOT change the basic facts of the case which are indisputable. Funny thing is nobody wishes to talk about that only the "media" is big, bad, and naughty.

Daniel Dicks 2 years, 8 months ago

Watchman? What watchman? You meant "shooter" right Dolph? Or maybe "armed stalker"? Calling Martin a "f*%king C@@n" in the 911 call might cause reasonable folks to suspect a racial motivation here too. But not Dolph!

jhawkinsf 2 years, 8 months ago

The more I listen to media reports, the more information I get, the less I understand what really happened. Your comment highlights my dilemma. I heard one audio "expert" say that the word in question was "coon" while another "expert" said it was "punk" and a third "expert" said it was inaudible, probably because the phone slipped just as the word was being spoken. So what was said? For those of you who wish to believe the word spoken was coon, you have your expert. For those who wish to believe the word was punk, you have your expert. And for those who wish to believe that you can't understand what was said, you too have your expert.
Speaking just for myself, I'll wait before I decide.

Flap Doodle 2 years, 8 months ago

You still pushing the fictional narrative, skippy?

tomatogrower 2 years, 8 months ago

Race or not. How can some big bad guy with a gun get a away with shooting and killing a kid walking down the street!!!! Maybe we shouldn't have made this about race! He could have been my son wearing a hoodie. What did he do that was wrong? Why didn't this jerk wait for the police, like he was told? He should be charged with something. You can't just kill an unarmed person and get away with it. That would open the doors to a whole lot of murders. Neighborhood watch! Not Neighborhood shoot to kill. I wouldn't hire this rent a cop for my security.

Cait McKnelly 2 years, 8 months ago

No matter what the specific word was that Zimmerman called him, he called him something and it wasn't nice nor was it friendly. The "stand your ground" law is for direct attack or home invasion, neither of which Martin was doing. In fact, had the case been reversed and Martin had shot Zimmerman, he would have had a case for that defense as Zimmerman stalked him then got out of his vehicle and confronted him. If Martin attacked him, thinking he was being attacked himself, then Zimmerman provoked that attack and he has no legal standing to be using that law, especially as he was specifically told by police not to leave his vehicle. As it stands, the police chief has stepped aside from the case and the local prosecutor recused himself and turned it over to a state appointed special prosecutor for investigation. Let them handle it. I will only say this; if the state permits Zimmerman to get away with this they are setting a precedent for allowing legalized murder by provocation. Not only do "elections have consequences" so does legislation. and those consequences may not be what was intended.

jhawkinsf 2 years, 8 months ago

Well, the way I've heard it, Zimmerman broke off his activity of following Martin and was headed back to his car, as per police instructions. Zimmerman is claiming that Martin doubled back and attacked him. That's what I've heard, anyway. But I'm still inclined to wait until all the facts are out.

Armstrong 2 years, 8 months ago

We don't need no stinking facts, we have the media telling us what to think.

costello 2 years, 8 months ago

This particular "fact" was Zimmerman's story. It may or may not be true. It's clearly self-serving, so there might be reason to doubt it.

The place these "facts" should come out are in a trial. There wasn't going to be a trial because Zimmerman's version was accepted by the DA who chose not to prosecute. This is the reason people are angry. No trial. No forum for each side to have a hearing before a jury. Had there been, it's highly doubtful any of us would ever have even heard of Trayvon Martin.

Cait McKnelly 2 years, 8 months ago

There's also the "fact" that the 911 tape contradicts this along with the eyewitness testimony of four people.

jhawkinsf 2 years, 8 months ago

Cait and Costello, I think you missed my point. There are no "facts" at all. What there is is "I heard this", "you heard that". Those aren't facts. From the beginning, I've advocated we not rush to judgement. Allow the judicial process to play itself out. Let a DA decide if there is enough reason to bring a person to trial. If a local DA can't/won't do that, then bring in a state or federal prosecutor and let them see if there is reason for a trial. Go before a Grand Jury where evidence, under oath, can be taken. Let a jury hear all the evidence and then render a verdict. But until that happens, there are no "facts", one way or the other.

Cait McKnelly 2 years, 8 months ago

And you seem to have missed my own point. From my original post (way up the thread there), "As it stands, the police chief has stepped aside from the case and the local prosecutor recused himself and turned it over to a state appointed special prosecutor for investigation. Let them handle it."

50YearResident 2 years, 8 months ago

Cait48, evidently you were a witness to this shooting because you have positive information as to what happened and who did it. Why don't you go to the police and tell them exactally how everything went down. I am sure they would like to know. While you are at it set the press straight too. Be a good witness now!

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Do you not know the detective investigating the case did NOT believe Zimmerman's story and recommended charges be filed? Yet, he was over ruled by the DA and no charges were filed.

jhawkinsf 2 years, 8 months ago

Might that be explained if there are different standards used for arresting a person and for bringing a person to trial. The police would be working under one standard while the DA is operating under a different standard. Of course, I'm neither a policeman, nor a DA, so I'm just guessing. Maybe an attorney could chime in.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Of course Zimmerman is going to make up some story to his benefit. He killed an unarmed young man and totally unprovoked by said young man. In fact the young man was the one who had every right to defend himself against the stalker and eventually murderer Zimmerman.

50YearResident 2 years, 8 months ago

Keithmiles05 was there too, he knows the facts of this case.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

LOL. Much, much, much information is out there to be had. Only those who are lazy or can't comprehend the facts and come to a reasonable conclusion are left behind.

Liberty275 2 years, 8 months ago

OK, where are the police reports and the official statements/affidavits of the witnesses. I can't find them, and since you obviously have access to them, I'd like a look at them so I can better inform my opinion.

Please try to make your links accurate, no opinion pieces and no blogs. Transcripts of witnesses and law enforcement investigators only.

If you don't care to provide the "facts", I'll retain my neutrality and accept whatever decision is reached by due process of the law.

jafs 2 years, 8 months ago

This is an egregious error by two major news organizations - everybody should be vocally criticizing them for it - the function of news organizations is to present facts to the public.

Of course, this should also apply to Fox News as well.

I predict I will have little agreement on this comment - liberals will apply it to Fox, but not NBC, and conservatives will do the opposite.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

No, what you "heard" is absolute mockery of the truth and that is babbling put forth by those who want to "believe" Zimmerman could not have shot an innocent kid.

The fact is the altercation did NOT take place by his vehicle and street but closer to the houses. The FACT is Zimmerman started the entire episode by not minding his business, trailing Martin, getting out of his vehicle and started stalking Martin and was then expressly told to stop doing that. Numerous reports (per 911) of callers saying they could hear screams and these screams are hear on 911 and they are in fact of a younger person and not older man. Whether or not Zimmerman said a racist comment on the 911 call isn't that relevant. What is relevant this situation would have never, EVER occured had he minded his own damn business! Furthermore, it has been documented Zimmerman had made approximately 45 other 911 calls previously and each and every person he called about was BLACK. Hence, he most certainly had a thing against black people and I wouldn't be suprised at all if he is charged with the federal statue of hate crimes.

Martin had every right to defend himself from Zimmerman and this is why the Stand Your Ground law should be used against Zimmerman. The prosecutor had it totally backwards and should have charged him and in fact the detective in charge of the case wanted Zimmerman charged but was over ruled. Sadly, the only person which would be able to give his own account of what happened is dead.

Lastly, for any poster spouting "I don't know what happened" then shame on you! Before saying something dumb like that you need to educate yourself via internet reports, tv reports, print reports, etc. There are thousands of them out there and the basic, undisputable facts point to Zimmerman iniatating the entire episode and it was totally unprovoked and murdering Martin. There are many smaller details but those are filler information only.

At the end of the day this is huge injustice and America must rise up to demand public officials be held accountable. If laws need to change then so be it.

Armstrong 2 years, 8 months ago

Thank you for that informative post. Good sources ABC, NBC. CBS. CNN. HLN, MSNBC, Court TV.....

John Hamm 2 years, 8 months ago

And as already proved the reports you chide us for not knowing - especially those from the liberal media - are intentionally flawed. "A white Hispanic" (as Zimmerman has been called) edited tapes, edited videos, blatant lies all designed to inflame hatred and make white the sob he really is! Get real. Zimmerman reports a "suspicious" individual, follows them IF that individual disappears into a living area before the police arrive who's to fault? Then, of course, there's the great Black leadership - Sharpton, Jackson, Balisdale (sp?) and the President all issuing inflammatory statements. Ah heck, why even try to have a "logical" discourse. Liberals..........

Flap Doodle 2 years, 8 months ago

"...the basic, undisputable facts point to Zimmerman iniatating the entire episode and it was totally unprovoked and murdering Martin..." Self-defense in the face of assault and battery isn't murder.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Thankyou!

Some of the posters here are not very intelligent to look at the basic, undisputed facts with an open mind. I don't understand that sort of thinking.

Richard Crank 2 years, 8 months ago

Yes, the media (all media) and their staff make - and will continue to make - mistakes. I understand the NBC editor responsible for that network's mistake has been fired. ABC apparently did not alter the video they aired so that seems far less egregious to me. Too many mistakes in either judgement or action clearly are present here. But it's obvious the first, largest, and most crucial mistakes (a series of them on his part) were Zimmerman's, and those were fatal.

Cait McKnelly 2 years, 8 months ago

LOL Catch Fox "News" firing someone for doctoring a report.

Richard Crank 2 years, 8 months ago

I wouldn't know. I watched them for about 2 minutes years ago and realized I had to block the channel or (time after time after time) I'd have the same reaction Santorum says he had to the Kennedy speech on separation of church and state.

yourworstnightmare 2 years, 8 months ago

Mistakes were made all around, the first and largest being that Zimmerman shot and killed an unarmed child and the second being that he was not arrested for this murder.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

What very, very little the "news media" changed in the reporting does not take away from the UNDISPUTED facts of the case. Who the hell cares of they said he was black when in fact the 911 person gave him various "black, white, brown" and what does that have to do with the fact so the case? Seriously, give me ONE fact which totally flaws this case. I am listening.

I don't care if the media is perceived as left or right. What happened in this case is an armed started the entire episode and he was unprovoked to do so. That is the key ingriedent and everything which happened after that comes back to this basic fact.

People need to stop the "left and right" name calling and throwing out your political beliefs to justify. Why is it that is more important than the death of an unarmed, unprovoked individual who just happens to be "black" and the murderer happens to be "brown"?????????????????????????

Armstrong 2 years, 8 months ago

Yes we know. Keep drinking the Kool-aid

50YearResident 2 years, 8 months ago

No firearm was ever displayed by Zimmerman until he was sucker punched, fell to the ground and the concealed weapon was exposed while it was still in the holster. Only then did the gun come into the fight.

verity 2 years, 8 months ago

Would you please source that information for us?

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

There is no Kool-aid to drink for me. Are you denying the basic fact that Zimmerman started the entire situation? Are you saying Martin had no right to defend himself?

brewmaster 2 years, 8 months ago

The true, actual events of that night may never be known. Yet, there is one trueth that is known: black leaders and the media, especially NBC, egregiously misrepesented reality.

For example, until recently Trayvon was portrayed as an innocent, weak 12 year old child. In reality he was a 6 foot tall, physically fit, strapping young man of 17. There were no pictures offered of his many gold teeth. In reality that is a "dental look" typically adhered to by gang members. There was no mention of him being kicked out of school multiple times; most recently for drugs. That may indicate he had a history of perpetual bad conduct. There was no mention of his Facebook and Twitter postings that bragged of punching a bus driver and other offensive, swearing posts. That may indicate he was angry and hostile.

Zimmerman was immediately profiled as an aggresive, racist. Yet, the mere suggestion of anything negative about Martin is / was immediately censored and discarded.

50YearResident 2 years, 8 months ago

Good Post, I am sure it will be denied by Cait and Keith as not factual. Remember, they were there!

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Why are you profiling this kid? Good grief, HE is the one shot dead and can't speak yet it is people like you who wish to dig up his past to use against him but you REFUSE to do the same against his murderer? You equate his "dental look" as "typically adhered to by gang members" BS. You say since he was kicked out of school multiple times (a bold face lie...he was expelled once!) that makes him a person to be sought after, stalked, and murdered? Oh, so a peson who swears is more liable to be murdered? Your analogys is disgusting and pathetic.

Once again, why not stick to the facts at hand? None of you supporters of the murderer wish to comment on his 911. None of you wish to look into his past history of making 45 calls to 911 and every one of those was complaining about black people. None of you wish to comment about his beating of a cop. None of you wish to comment on past co-workers saying he had a very quick trigger. None of you wish to comment on his illegal carrying of the weapon on his "patrol" or as Dolph wants to phrase it "watchman" stalking of innocent people.

In this day and age of instant communication there is no excuse for anybody to not know the "facts" as presented and to say otherwise is showing complete ignorance and laziness.

Linda Endicott 2 years, 8 months ago

I doubt that the gold teeth could have been seen at a distance by Zimmerman...and it was dark...as far as gold teeth being used by gang members...apparently so are hoodies, as Geraldo pointed out (and got blasted for mentioning)...yet I wear a hoodie...and I'm a middle-aged white woman...though at night, that might not be so apparent...

Kids frequently brag and talk crap on their Facebook page...kids frequently exaggerate a lot of the stuff they talk about...doesn't neccessarily mean anything...

They did not find drugs on him in school...what they found was an empty baggie, of the type typically used for marijuana...but they found no marijuana (a drug that many, many posters on this board have admitted that they use and think it should be legalized)...

I guess you're just as anxious to assume things about Martin as others are to assume things about Zimmerman...

I don't know what happened...but I remain suspicious of Zimmerman, and don't quite buy his story...and the only other person who could confirm or deny it is dead...

Something I would like to know, and have not read about or heard about on TV anywhere.......exactly what was Martin doing that was "suspicous"? We know it was dark. We know he was carrying a can of Arizona tea and a bag (or box) of Skittles...he was walking through a gated community at night, wearing a hoodie, with the hood up because it was raining at the time...

What exactly was he doing that was considered so suspicious?

liberallibrarian 2 years, 8 months ago

Trayvon martin's supposed gold teeth, marijuana use, and facebook status updates could also be attributed to the fact that he was a 17 year old kid trying to fit in with peers. But, why am I not surprised they're automatically attributed to signs of being in a gang by the people who post on these boards? I have a 17 year old nephew who has been talked to for his hyperbolic facebook posts. (Maybe now those discussions should include, "Don't say that on facebook. A complete stranger who's never seen that post may shoot you and you'll deserve it!) I'm so tired of these "facts" being brought up. What does finding a baggie of pot in his locker weeks prior have to do with him deserving to die? I don't get it. The man that shot him has a record of assaulting a police officer. I'm completely perplexed by the people who are defending him.

Cait McKnelly 2 years, 8 months ago

This is a prime example of something women run into all of the time; don't blame the rapist, blame the victim. Like those women, Williams was , "wearing the wrong thing" and "in the wrong part of town". And like the past sexual history of rape victims, his past associations are brought out for judgment as if those past associations and actions are valid excuses for his death. And by the way, brewmaster, his "drug offense at school" was having a baggie with cookies in it that "smelled like pot". Nor was he "kicked out of school multiple times". Not sure where you got THAT one because the kid actually made pretty good grades and was a pretty successful student. His own principal came out and said that. Either way, your attitude is still a "blame the victim" attitude and I find it a bit irritating.

Lawrence Morgan 2 years, 8 months ago

Thank you, Dolph Simons, for this editorial. What you are speaking about is the role of the media in this, and it is very important. It is very hard to understand why these mistakes were made without invoking either racism and/or the gun laws and what they have produced in this society.

You are speaking about facts, and those are very important. The rest of the issues in the comments below are also about very important things, but they are not part of what you are speaking about in this editorial.

There has to be careful investigation into why ABC and NBC handled things the way they did. Were racism and/or gun laws involved? This is something that must come out in the open.

What made these people, in very high positions in the media, act this way? Were political pressures inside the corporations involved?

The results of this investigation of the media are important, because they affect the whole nation.

tomatogrower 2 years, 8 months ago

It was a kid! He was unarmed. The big tough adult did not have to even go up and talk to the kid. I don't care if the kid did hit him. He had no reason to even talk to the kid. He was wrong, whether race had anything to do with it, or not. He killed a human being who was unarmed. If he'd had a knife or a baseball bat or some other weapon, ok. But the kid only had his fist. Shooting him was wrong, and if it's not against the law in Florida, then they are hopeless immoral people in charge of that state. Is this a libertarian conservative thing? You have the right to shoot whomever you want? He wasn't even trespassing.

jaywalker 2 years, 8 months ago

" I don't care if the kid did hit him. He had no reason to even talk to the kid."

Settle now. So we have the right to hit someone because they talked to us? Pretty sure you'd rail against that if the circumstances were different.

BTW, there are 30 states w/ 'stand your ground' laws. It's not a "conservative" thing; it's a "law" thing.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

But, but, but.............he had a past history of "gold teeth" which are seen with gang members! He was a bad boy and got expelled from school!! Oh, he had some alleged drug usage!!! My goodness........this is enough to MURDER him because he doesn't act and look like what some people on this message board want in America.

Armstrong 2 years, 8 months ago

Falling in lock step with the media created hysteria +10

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Is that all you can say? Do you really believe the media is at fault for this young mans murder? That is pretty shallow thinking and you obviously have no concern for mankind.

Armstrong 2 years, 8 months ago

No, you are a pawn the media is using to sell advertising time. You gobble the excriment sandwich you are being fed by the media as fact. You have recently seen proof the info you are getting is manipulated but choose to ask for seconds, why ? Wait for the real facts to come out in court then you will see what is real and what is crap.

alamohawk 2 years, 8 months ago

Here's a question for you "just math" why aren't you outraged about the 93% of black on black crimes other than just to point it out to make Jesse and Al (two opportunist) look bad. If you did know anything about these 2 other than what they say about them on FOX a large number of their public statements are about Black on Black crime. But since the mainstream media ESPECIALLY FOX could care less about these issues they don't care to interupt your quiet evening to address what Jesse or Al said about these crimes. It appears to me from your post you reallly could care less about the 93% murder rate, Aliyah Shell or the 10 blacks gunned down on St Pats day other than to make a sad political point. So again I ask you... Where is your outrage?

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

She and others like her are only concerned the big bad media is making them nervous. Hence, they can't trust a word they read or hear because it is filthy to their ears. They live in a cave feeling comfortable with their life.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Why don't you stick to THIS case and stop talking about other situations? Is that too much to ask of you? Are you trying to dissolve this case since you feel there are many others as worth while to focus on and therefore denegrate this young mans murder? Where is your moral outrage at this young man's murder and the fact his murderer is still on the streets? Where is your outrage of the many white people who murder other white people? Do you not care about those? Why are you caught up in black on black crime? Are you so insensitive or bigoted you care only to throw stones at blacks but have no concern for the many whites killing other whites?

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Why don't you stick to THIS case and stop talking about other situations? Is that too much to ask of you? Are you trying to dissolve this case since you feel there are many others as worth while to focus on and therefore denegrate this young mans murder? Where is your moral outrage at this young man's murder and the fact his murderer is still on the streets? Where is your outrage of the many white people who murder other white people? Do you not care about those? Why are you caught up in black on black crime? Are you so insensitive or bigoted you care only to throw stones at blacks but have no concern for the many whites killing other whites?

Gareth Skarka 2 years, 8 months ago

You can always spot a Dolph editorial by the headline.

It's so easy now, it's like shooting... unarmed teenagers in a barrel.

dinglesmith 2 years, 8 months ago

We do have one fact in evidence. A news organization doctored the 911 tape to minimally make it more inflammatory and most likely to falsify what was actually said. A second news organization may have simply made an error in reporting no head injury, but the jury is still out on that one. The first one was clearly doctoring.

Dolph asks why. It's quite simple really. News organizations - all of them - survive on advertising revenue. You watch more news when you are scared or angry. Thus, news organizations will always try to scare you or piss you off. Conservative, liberal, libertarian, marxist, totalitarian whatever the political bent of your news, the tactic works really, really well.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

Okay, so there was a little bit of evidence changed, if you want to say that. Does that mean EVERYTHING about this case is suspect? Seriously, are you that close minded to throw the baby out with the bath water?

The basic facts of the case have NOT changed one iota. Zimmerman admitted stalking a 17 year old kid. . This is all on the 911 call. He initiated the entire episode. From that point forward Martin had every RIGHT to defend himself from his subsequent murderer. These facts are undisputable.

For your yahoos who want to say "drinking koolaid by the media" save your breath. You are only showing your ignorance and head in the sand mentality.

Flap Doodle 2 years, 8 months ago

Escalating a confrontation to assault and battery isn't justified under Florida law because you think someone has "dissed" you. Self-defense is not the same thing as murder. You continue to inflame the situation, keith.

jaywalker 2 years, 8 months ago

Spot on editorial. We have no true indication that this incident was racially motivated in any way and major news networks putting those sorts of things out there is beyond irresponsible and should be considered criminal. It's lucky there wasn't more violence due to those "errors."

One thing I haven't heard anyone question or analyze is the full chain of events. When Trayvon was shot they were in someone's backyards; the way it sounds the back of one house faces the back of another. So at some point the conflict went from the sidewalk or street or driveway, where Martin allegedly pounded Zimmerman's head, around a house into the backyard. If one of the witnesses saw just how they ended up in the backyard, it sure could paint a fuller picture of how and why things ended the way they did.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

So, the fact murderer Zimmerman had 45 prior calls to 911 and they all involved black people doesn't shed light to his motive? Get real and be reasonable. LOL

There is a high suspicion murderer Zimmerman is telling the truth the altercation occured at his vehicle on the street. However, there are eye witness reports it did happen as was stated above in the "back" of some houses.

Martin had every right to defend himself from being stalked and provoked. The law is on his side.

jaywalker 2 years, 8 months ago

Nice, Keith. Like so many here you find it best to insert a complete lie to back your position. That's "real and reasonable", huh? Great value system you have there.

Zimmerman's neighborhood had been burglarized multiple times in a very short period. A police spokesman admitted it wasn't an inordinate number of calls due to the high crime rate. There's also NO proof whatsoever that all his calls involved black suspects, though the burglary reports where the perpetrators were seen or confronted involved young black men.

"Martin had every right to defend himself from being stalked and provoked."

Congrats. Not a single factual statement in your whole post. There's a difference between being "stalked" and followed, and the biggest discrepancy in this whole thing is who provoked whom. It's certainly not definitive.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

You don't want to understand because you are sticking your head in the sand. For crying out loud open your eyes and stop the "I don't know" crap. Next thing you are going to proclaim as being "I don't know" is that fact Martin is black and Zimmerman is white/hispanic.

Martin was absolutely being followed, stalked, looked at closely........who the hell cares what words are used? I mean, are you that stuck about the wording that you can't give rise to normal reasoning of what occured? My goodness, that is just awful of you.

My post is has factual statements. You are being obtuse and refuse to use common sense and reasoning. That is on you and not me.

jaywalker 2 years, 8 months ago

That's two posts w/ absolutely no substance. Like I said there's a big difference between 'stalked' and 'followed'; you chose the more sinister of the two which speaks volumes about how open your mind is. Who cares what words are used? That's how we converse and relay info, pal, and word choice absolutely matters. Sorry if that's inconvenient. Zimmerman was doing neighborhood watch in a neighborhood that had been burglarized multiple times. If it's a real watch, you don't just stand in your driveway if you see something that makes you suspicious. That may be difficult to understand if you've never owned a home in a specific community. I spoke earlier w/ jafs about how vigilant my neighborhood got after just one burglary; this one had something like 8 in 14 months. That's an awful lot!

I don't know what your "normal" reasoning is supposed to dictate, but I'm using rational, unbiased reasoning. Seems polar opposite. Not so good for you.

And no, your post had nothing factual. You even got the number of phone calls to the police wrong.

I don't know if Zimmerman belongs in jail or not, that's for a judge and jury. Frankly, I'm surprised that charges have still not been filed, but then the police department and the state AG have yet to move so it looks like some evidence must be making them balk. The problem I have with all of this is morons like yourself insisting it's obvious this was racially motivated when there's absolutely no evidence to support such. If it ever comes out this was racially motivated, sobeit, and throw the book at him along w/ the hate crime statute. I feel the same way about racists as I do pedophiles. But your position is complete crap, based on pure assumption and falsehoods. Nice. Good luck with that.

KEITHMILES05 2 years, 8 months ago

As usual you are sticking your head in the sand but that isn't uncommon on this topic.

Oh, forgive me for the past phone calls to 911 which were not exactly 45 but very, very close to that. Again, the point remains and you can not refute it.

Neighborhood patrols in Sanford are forbidden to carry guns and Zimmerman had a gun. Why?

It is up to the judge and jury to decide if Zimmerman is in jail? Where do you come up with that point of law? LOL. It is not up to them but up to the police to recommend charges and the DA to file. That is when Zimmerman would be in jail. Nice try to convict him without going through the judicial process.

To set your mind at ease I own my home and people are attentive to what goes on. In fact, I live on a dead end street so it's easy to see people coming and going. We have had no mischief go on since I've lived here 10 years. We do have lots of dogs in the enclosed yards and no doubt that is a deterient. It's great people are involved in their neighborhood. However, acting like a renagade cop and taking matters into your own hands is absolutely wrong and again any "reasonable" person agree. If you don't find that reasonable then you are out in left field. I am not talking protecting your own home but cruising up and down streets to seek out trouble.

You want to deride me for not using "facts" yet your facts are way, way off base. Get things correct before telling others their position is "complete crap."

jaywalker 2 years, 8 months ago

"Neighborhood patrols in Sanford are forbidden to carry guns and Zimmerman had a gun"

Keep making things up. Really strengthens your argument and credibility.

"It is up to the judge and jury to decide if Zimmerman is in jail? Where do you come up with that point of law? LOL. It is not up to them but up to the police to recommend charges and the DA to file. That is when Zimmerman would be in jail. Nice try to convict him without going through the judicial process."

You're either being intentionally obtuse here or you're severely challenged. I'm hoping, for your sake, it's the former. Please grow up.

"You want to deride me for not using "facts" yet your facts are way, way off base."

You haven't stated ANY facts!!! Supposition and innuendo aplenty, but that's it. Nor have you refuted a single FACT of mine. This concludes our "conversation" here. You're obviously a colossal waste of time and an excellent example of the lunacy surrounding this case.

alamohawk 2 years, 8 months ago

snap, I live in Texas and yes there is outrage about this shooting locally. I hope your not suggesting that we as a country should not be outraged (including you snap) by the senseless shootings of people just out minding their own business. Its sad that we have become a nation that has become immune to the day to day violence that is happening everywhere, yet only use stories like this to try to make a political point instead of being truly outraged at another act of violence... Which I believe was the point of this article. Shame on you if that was your point.

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