Archive for Sunday, October 23, 2011

Occupy Lawrence members energized by rally

October 23, 2011

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It’s always been a “wait and see” game.

Doug Denney thinks so. He’s waited to see how the Occupy Lawrence protests have come along and how their message and purpose have fluctuated as they’ve defied the city’s orders.

He protested against the Vietnam War and the Iraq War, and on Saturday, a few paces behind in the march, with a sign lamenting the death of the American dream, he joined in with the enthusiastic 20-somethings leading the Occupy Lawrence march.

“It’s wonderful to see another generation get involved,” he said.

As they vow to keep going, the occupiers, too, are now waiting — waiting to see what further steps the Lawrence Police Department and the city may take to remove them from South Park’s scattering of tents that have become their camp. They’re not leaving. Or most say they aren’t, at least.

Eight protesters were ticketed just before 2 a.m. Saturday for being in violation of city code 15-208, which states that city parks are to be closed from 11:30 p.m. to 6 a.m.

Their citations come with a mandatory court date — Nov. 15 — and the possibility of fines and court costs, though it’s not clear how much the fines will be. The protesters said Saturday morning that a group of several officers approached them, told them they had 10 minutes to leave if they wanted to avoid the municipal ticket and then proceeded to ticket those who stayed.

They began rallying Oct. 8 and set up camp in the park Oct. 15. They had permission to stay 24 hours but continued to camp after that expired.

Branden Bell, of Bell Folsom, a law firm serving Douglas and Johnson counties, offered to represent any protesters criminally charged, “as long as there’s no violence,” he said.

“Expression of dissatisfaction with the status quo is protected speech,” he said. “Time, manner or place requirements shouldn’t thwart speech.”

Bell said he had not spoken with any of the members who got citations as of Saturday afternoon.

T.J. Campsey was one of those cited. He said he did not think the police action would be detrimental to the group, though fewer might have been likely to stay in the park Saturday night.

Campsey and others continued, their noon rally gathering about 40 people, apparently convinced of their causes. They rallied in front of the U.S. Bank at Ninth and Massachusetts streets and vowed to stay in the park another night, even if it meant arrest.

“We believe our right to peacefully assemble doesn’t end at 11:30,” he said.

Comments

XEPCT 3 years, 6 months ago

In Lawrence they are just preaching to the choir. If they really believe in this stuff they should go to the capital and try to change someone's mind. The idea that they are showing solidarity with the people in New York is a little bit silly, because people from Larryville are way ahead of the curve on this. Solidarity means shopping locally and keeping money here. Which people in Lawrence already do quite enthusiastically. I'm curious as to how many of these folks wrote thoughtful letters to their congressmen about their grievances before setting up camp in South Park.

ljwhirled 3 years, 6 months ago

I disagree. Most members of the Lawrence community send a vast majority of their money to Wall St.

How much of your 401K is invested in Lawrence companies? That's what I thought.

If you own a business here you are invested here. If not, you are likely invested with the Masters of The Universe.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 3 years, 6 months ago

"I disagree. Most members of the Lawrence community send a vast majority of their money to Wall St." ust what the hell is that supposed to mean???

Invest in Lawrence?? With the dysfunctional and clueless city government that allows illegal camping in a city park? With a backwards community attitude that elects these fools that run businesses away rather than assisting them in locating? In a city that spends huge amounts of tax money on vapid European concepts like a roundabout at every intersection?

Who in their right mind would invest here? No one who was anxious to have some reasonable return on their investment. Get real.

XEPCT 3 years, 6 months ago

reading comprehension ... I'm not old enough to have a 401k, so you thought right, for the wrong reasons ... but I do have a bank account ... in a local bank ... and I spend my money at local businesses when I'm in Lawrence. If you think you can defeat the Masters of The Universe in South Park ... be my guest, you aren't wasting my time. And btw spending money at local businesses IS investing in Lawrence ... there's even a name for this sort of thing; it's called microeconomics.

XEPCT 3 years, 6 months ago

reading comprehension ... I'm not old enough to have a 401k, so you thought right, for the wrong reasons ... but I do have a bank account ... in a local bank ... and I spend my money at local businesses when I'm in Lawrence. If you think you can defeat the Masters of The Universe in South Park ... be my guest, you aren't wasting my time. And btw spending money at local businesses IS investing in Lawrence ... there's even a name for this sort of thing; it's called microeconomics.

XEPCT 3 years, 6 months ago

hmm... ljworld why'd it post twice? anyway ..... ljwhirled have you written your congressman?

contodorespeto 3 years, 6 months ago

Looking at the recent developments on the state level, you may realize that writing to our congressmen has not helped us much.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Yea, our congressional representatives are too busy trying to nail down the next contribution from the Koch Bros. to waste any of their time reading thoughtful letters.

uncleandyt 3 years, 6 months ago

Speaking of the Koch Bros., I hear that a march on Koch Industries in Wichita is being organized for next Saturday by kansansunitedDOTorg.

skinny 3 years, 6 months ago

And what you’re doing is helpful?? How do you contribute to society? Do you work or own a home here in Lawrence? Shop here in Lawrence? Buy your new cars here in Lawrence?Invest in the stock market? Send your kids to a private school? Send you kids to KU? Probably none of the above! So what are you doing to stimulate the economy? Nothing!

MarcoPogo 3 years, 6 months ago

Someone's getting into the Halloween spirit by filling a field with strawmen...

Getaroom 3 years, 6 months ago

The participants of Occupy Wall Street(Lawrence) are not silly even if it is preaching to the choir, which it is not in this town. All one needs to do is read this blog to see how many posters there are who have closed their minds and accepted the status quo and believe that public discourse and or civil disobedience is not appropriate and perhaps never appropriate, given how uncomfortable it makes them. We have seen over the years how much Lobbyists(www.followthemoney.org) are influencing policy and lawmaking in order to sway regulations in their favor to either increase profit taking or hold onto already greedy behaviors. How any conscious, thinking, educated citizen can support what has been happening to us(99%) through the actions of big business is truly unreal. Greed is driving the Free Market, which has become void of morality and ethics. How easily it seems we forget just how it was that the Saving and Loan debacle could have happened. Wall Street was allowed to swindle millions of Americans out of their life saving - a fact - and Wall Street is only part of the problem. Giving corporate America greater control over how government is run is going to be our ruin, not Medicare and Social Security. If the media outlets were to begin today calling out the corporations and government leadership today one would immediately see how quickly those media sources would be shut down. Why you ask? Because each of them is controlled by big business. What perhaps began as a Democracy in the New World, has become an Oligarcy or if you will, a Plutocracy. Our experiment of Democracy is a mere shadow of itself although still attempting to be all that it could be. Does anyone care that the flag of patriotism which the Republican Party and others love to wrap themselves in, is a ruse? The general population must stop fooling its collective self and awaken to the fact that most of us have been marginalized to the point of breaking into pieces on everything thing that actually matters most. So you ask, what does all this have to do with "Occupy...?" it has everything to do with it. And those who put it down by questioning why it seems to have no cohesive central message - the reasons are obvious. These gatherings are the outward expressions of the collective frustrations, anger and disappointments of millions of individuals struggling to survive in what appears to be a glass ceiling(the 1%) so impenetrable that life is beginning to feel hopeless. Jobs and manufacturing that have been outsourced, wages, benefits cut to the bone, life support jerked out from under their feet to feed corporate greed. What we see happening right before our eyes is the remaking of America into a third world country. All the markers are already here. A weakened population lorded over by the fortunate few. Now, that is something to be uncomfortable about, not a collection of people camping out to express themselves!

Boston_Corbett 3 years, 6 months ago

This shallow canard is 60 years old and shows nothing but FalseHope is beyond ignorant. Might as well blame the current worlds banking problems on Jews.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 3 years, 6 months ago

Nah, not the Jews, Hitler already ran that one dry. It is the Muslims that are the current whipping boys to our problems. Hatred and viciousness have been aimed at the Islamic faith by a lot of folks who profess to be real good Christians. Just because some of the recent terrorists are Muslim, it follows in the minds of many of the good faith followers of Christ that all Muslims are terrorists and vile individuals. The Oklahoma City Bomb Squad was a clean cut,American veteran boy. Why do they not also attack clean cut American veterans? Many lives were lost in the OKC Murrah Building bombing.

So some now advocate a second "Krystalnacht", the Nazi attack on Jewish synagoges with attacks on mosques and their worshipers. History does repeat itself.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I don't see all that much hatred being directed at Muslims. Pockets here and there, yes, but not overwhelming.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 3 years, 6 months ago

Yes, you are correct, but if this ever got some national news coverave, the comparason to how Hitler made the Jews the scapegoats for the economic and social ;problems in Germany in the 1930's and how a (thankfully) few have tried to make the Muslims the scapegoats for today's problems, it would be big news. Someone I know sent me a post about a piece by Frosty Woldridge (who you can Google) with photos of a decrepit section of a city alleged to be Detroit. There were lots of aaccusations that this decay had been caused by the influx of immigrants and muslims. I think the real truth is that the abandoned buildings pictured were due to white flight because of the influx of black folks. I replied to this person that their prejudice was showing and I have not heard back from them since. No great loss.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

Black, white, brown, all irrelevant. The UAW destroyed Detroit.

Anydaynow 3 years, 6 months ago

Getaroom, this is the best explanation of the whole situation, both local and worldwide. Large corporations, Government "Users", etc. etc. - all for greed. Hope everyone reads your informational comment and think about what these local people are trying to get their point across - and to whom..

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

"We believe our right to peacefully assemble doesn't end at 11:30".

So, let me see if I understand...is it okay to peacefully drive 90mph? Is it okay to peacefully steal from thy neighbor? And is breaking the rules/laws okay for everyone, or just the occupy people? So next weekend me and my rv buddies can all pull into South Park and camp for a week before the police come by and ticket us?

And I'm sorry, but I still don't understand what these people stand for. Even though they "supposedly" are speaking for me...ummm yeah, thanks but I would prefer to speak for myself.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Camping in the park is in no way comparable to "peacefully" driving 90 mph, or theft.

And if you want to make your own statement, I'm sure those in the park would be happy to have you come n down to speak your mind.

But I am curious about what the meaning of parking your RV down there would be. I mean, there are no electrical hookups-- how could you run your widescreen teevee?

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm just curious who gets to make the decisions of what laws and rules can be ignored. And do we all get to decide or just the occupy now folks?

For the record, I don't own a RV. I do however own a wide screen tv, and I have to say that I love it. The point of that was basically if the city starts allowing some people to break the rules, don't they kind of open themselves up to having to allow everyone to break the rules?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

This is civil disobedience, not a crime spree. They're doing it in order to make a statement (or statements, if you prefer.) If the authorities decide to arrest them, they'll put up no resistance, or at most, passive resistance.

They're willing to do this primarily because they see it as the only way to break through the stranglehold that the money of the 1% has on our political and economic system.

If you or anyone else wants to make a statement through similar civil disobedience, I say go for it. But if you just want to be a jerk for its own sake, (such as football hooligans do, or those who pick fights at bars) then I see little to be gained by anyone through that.

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

No one is calling it a crime spree. They seem pretty harmless to me.

But....once again you're missing point, or ignoring it. This isn't about occupy, tea party, white supremacist group, or phelps and his followers. If the city of Lawrence start letting one group get by with breaking the rules/laws, then don't you have to let everyone?

Or do these folks get special privileges? Because to date....they are.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

That's primarily a question for the city authorities. They have to decide whether it's worth clogging up the jails and the legal system with people who aren't really hurting anything or anybody. I'm sure that if the they decide to start arresting people, those getting arrested will respond as I indicated above.

And civil disobedience is qualitatively different from breaking rules/laws merely for its own sake, wouldn't you agree?

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

Nice that there's a politically correct term for it...and no, I wouldn't agree.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

What does that mean? It seems to me folks like to throw out the term "politically correct" when they disagree with something, but can state their disagreement in a coherent and convincing way.

Bottom-line is this-- our economy and our political system are badly broken. People are frustrated. The tea party started out as an expression of that frustration, but it was quickly co-opted by the Koch Bros. and Fox News, and the greed and corruption of 1%'ers it was originally protesting.

OWS is using the only power it has at its disposal, and so far, they've done quite well at resisting being co-opted by either of the 1%'ers two political parties the way the tea party was.

And for people who are afraid of change, that's a bit disconcerting, even if they stand to benefit a great deal from that change.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

"I'm just curious who gets to make the decisions of what laws and rules can be ignored"

Everyone makes that decision, probably daily. If you didn't call the police last time you saw someone throw a snowball, you have decided that city ordinance, at least in that instance, should be ignored.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

Would you be OK if I camped out on the sidewalk in front of your house? Perhaps I could have a drum circle at 3am as part of my movement.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

Does it matter as long as I am involved in civil disobedience designed to exercise my 1a rights? Do you propose a content test on someone's ability to peacefully involve themselves in civil disobedience? I hope not.

ceccarp 3 years, 6 months ago

If you truly had a grievance with those in authority, then I would say you have every right to do just that. And I would defend your right do to that.

But if your grievance is just with those of us who are with the Occupy Lawrence group, whom you seem to think are disobeying the law just because we can, and you would be doing it simply to be contrary, then no, you should not. We're making the point that the status quo is skewed by those who have used their wealth to buy political power. I suspect that you would probably not be willing to go to jail simply to make the point that we are a bunch of crazy people (my words).

I would love for you to come down and talk with as many of us as can. You might just discover that we are not crazy, just passionate about our cause.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

Fascinating. So the ability to exercise one's 1A right is dependent upon if one is being contrary?

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

You seem like a nice fellow. You can come do what you want in the street in front of my house. I'd probably come out to enjoy the drum show.

Jimo 3 years, 6 months ago

It is amazing how difficult it is for some people "to understand" when they have motivation to not understand.

Congrats fancy - you just confirmed that a toddler watching Sesame Street can play the 'one thing is not like the other' game with greater dexterity than yourself!!

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

Jimo, So if I don't understand or don't agree, that gives you the right to be a jerk?

Nice! Is that a new game you just thought of, or is it your favorite part of Sesame Street?

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

Technically he probably has the "right" to be a jerk regardless of what you understand. If there was a law against being a jerk, I'd have been in the stripey hole most of my life.

I don't know anything about Sesame Street other than a yellow bird and two closeted homosexuals live on it. And a frog too, I think. Oh, and a monster lives in one of the garbage cans.

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

Okay thanks getaroom! It's becoming clearer. It is basically anti-Republican. Just curious what business do you own in town and how many jobs do you provide. What benefits do you provide to said employees. Oh I see...do as I say and not as I do. Makes perfect sense... So yes, camping in the park is definitely going to "change" everything...at least, we sure "hope" so.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

It is a non-partisan movement. The corruption and takeover of government by corporate interests happens under both parties. The first bailout, for example, happened under a Republican administration while the other two happened under a Democrat.. One survey shows 70% of occupants are independents, 27.3% Democrats and 2.4% Republicans. This survey is based on polling on October 5. If you speak with protesters, or research online, you would be likely to find some folks who voted for Obama, but have been disappointed in his continuation of Bush policies, Many protesters have given up on either party, because the corruption in government and business is so deeply entrenched that it really doesn't matter which party is in charge; they are two arms of the same ravenous beast. Further, the movement is global, because people all over the world realize that they are fighting a global monster. American political parties do not directly affect the governance of Britain, Australia,Spain, Taiwan, et. al. Monetary policy does. Corporate influence over governments does. http://www.occupytogether.org/directory/

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

Actually, many Occupy folks did, but no longer do, support Obama, as he has continued the policies of the previous administration. Again, it is not about party politics. If they were Obama minions, as you believe, why would they begin the Movement under the Obama administration? There are Occupy groups of veteran marines, a group not known for their liberal leanings. http://www.wtop.com/?nid=41&sid=2596037

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

Again, perhaps you'd like to contact occupymarines.org and tell them that.

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

Okay appreciate your take on it. Getaroom sounds like he (or she) feels differently. the line about the flag that the republicans love to wrap around themselves seemed pretty partisan to me.

The way you describe it sounds a little more reasonable to me.

ssteve1 3 years, 6 months ago

My son-in-law and his friends didn't have time to attend the occupy. They're in Afghanistan.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

That was his choice, and it's costing taxpayers at least a $million every year to finance it.

The folks in S. Park aren't costing taxpayers much of anything.

jaywalker 3 years, 6 months ago

"..costing taxpayers ... to finance it."

Like it's a vacation paradise. And they don't get to choose to go to war, brain trust. Serving your country is the choice.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Didn't say it was a paradise-- merely pointed out the cost to taxpayers.

And while serving the country is probably the intent, I'd say that the protestors in Occupy Lawrence, Occupy Wall Street, etc. are more likely to effect positive change in this country than any soldier in Afghanistan.

jaywalker 3 years, 6 months ago

I realize this is difficult for you, but soldiers in Afghanistan are not trying to effect change in the U.S. But there is a significant difference between the soldiers and the occupiers; one involves sacrifice.

Liberty275 3 years, 6 months ago

I'm pretty sure our soldiers in Afghanistan have prevented civilian deaths in America. That seems at least as significant as complaining about the wrong people in the park.

jaywalker 3 years, 6 months ago

Never said it shouldn't be nor that they don't. I have no problems with the protests whatsoever. I have a problem with morons incessantly belittling our armed forces.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Since you find it difficult to have a discussion with anyone without personal insults, I'll assume that I'm the "moron" to whom you refer.

But for this moron's sake, could you please point out where I in any way belittled our armed forces? (I suspect that you think pointing out cold hard facts constitutes "belittling.")

jaywalker 3 years, 6 months ago

Not 'anyone'. You? Tit for tat, pal.
Show you where? It's your stock in trade. Someone can't post jack about our military, at least not in a positive light, without you poppin' in to be a jerk. And that's exactly what you did here.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

So if I state facts that you don't like, that makes me a "jerk."

Grow up.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

Perhaps you'd like to contact the groups mentioned and express your opinions. I did not introduce the military to the discussion; another poster did. Perhaps you can address why they mentioned the military. I have great respect for those who served, as my father and his brothers served.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

Which was in response to the person who stated their family member was serving. There are marines who support occupy, even if you do not. They do not speak for you, and you do not speak for the marines like the ones to whom I linked.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

Wow, if they are so small and insignificant, as you seem to think, why are you so angry and afraid? And sorry, I will continue to point out that there are veterans, specifically marines, who do support the Occupy movement. If you have a problem with marine veterans supporting the protesters, you should take it up with them. I've provided a few links already to make it easier for you to contact these honorable men and women to facilitate your discussion with them.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

If I were so inclined to research this, which I'm not, it is clear that if I did find such groups, you would proceed to argue they aren't really conservative. However, my initial post was that it is a nonpartisan movement, as in Democrats and Republicans. I posted a source to show that 70% are independents, and 2.3% self-identify as Republican. Republican and conservative are not synonymous, although a great many Republicans are conservative. If you'd like to argue that it is somehow a (insert label) front organization, than by all means do the google search and post the links to the statements of support.

ceccarp 3 years, 6 months ago

The lights in the park would be on from sundown to sunrise whether or not the Occupiers were in the park. And we haven't been able to plug into any outlets at the Rec building due to renovations being done on the building.

Richard Heckler 3 years, 6 months ago

Again...

It could be said that those protesting the protesters are demonstrating their belief in crime,fraud and serving the special interests that in fact perpetrated the fraud on the American people.

Thus encouraging more Reagan/Bush Home loan frauds, Bush/Cheney Home Loan Frauds,Bush/Cheney/Paulson Bail Out Frauds and more crime at the highest levels of government and corporate boardrooms.

It could be said that those protesting the protesters are demonstrating their belief in that it is okay that 11 million more were put out of work as a result of the fraudulent home loan industry in spite of the trillions upon trillions dollars of economic growth being being lost daily as the end result.

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

So break the law protesting crime? Brilliant!!!

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

It could be said that camping in front of your house would be a good way to protest global warming. Would you be OK with that protest?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

Maybe you could just camp in your own front yard, glock.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

I don't use reckless gasoline powered mowers that damage the environment.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

Really? So then one could argue that one shouldn't listen to bozo because his "online identity" is wrapped up in clowns and public transport? Jaywalker's "online identity" is wrapped up in jaywalking? I suppose that sort of classification system makes it much easier for some people. The rest of your post is really too amusing and doesn't merit a response.

independent_rebel 3 years, 6 months ago

Fraudulent home loans. Who pushed for the poor to receive these loans, Merrill? It was Barney Frank and Chris Dodd. It's not Bush/Cheney and Republicans.

It's all of them, Merrill. Your rants would be more effective if you went after Frank/Dodd as hard as Bush/Cheney.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Please link to a reputable source that supports your claim that Dodd and Frank pushed for the poor to receive fraudulent home loans.

Or simply provide it so that I can check it out.

Thank you.

independent_rebel 3 years, 6 months ago


.. "Congressman Frank and Senator Dodd wanted the government to push financial institutions to lend to people they would not lend to otherwise, because of the risk of default. .. "The idea that politicians can assess risks better than people who have spent their whole careers assessing risks should have been so obviously absurd that no one would take it seriously." -- Dr. Thomas Sowell, Professor Emeritus, Economics, Stanford University, & African-American

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell093008.php3

http://freedomkeys.com/meltdown.htm

http://www.zimbio.com/Freddie+Mac/articles/423/Barney+Frank+Chuck+Schumer+Role+Fannie+Mae

http://spectator.org/archives/2009/02/06/the-true-origins-of-this-finan

http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/matthew-sheffield/2011/06/22/finally-some-truth-about-freddie-and-fannie

Democrats and some [big-government] Republicans opposed reform in part because Fannie and Freddie were very good at greasing palms. Fannie has spent $170 million on lobbying since 1998 and $19.3 million on political contributions since 1990. .. The principal recipient of Fannie Mae's largesse was a Democrat, Sen. Chris Dodd (D, CT), chairman of the Senate Banking Committee. No. 2 was another Democrat, Sen. Barack Obama (D, IL). .. Mr. Dodd was also the second largest recipient in the Senate of contributions from Countrywide's political action committee and its employees, and the recipient of a home loan from Countrywide at well below market rates. The No. 1 senator on Countrywide's list? Barack Obama

In other words, we as a nation need to realize it's not just the Republicans or the Democrats--it's BOTH.

Douglas_Co 3 years, 6 months ago

If you want to read an extremely articulate and insightful treatise on the Occupy Wall St. Movement, follow this link:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/10/23/how-i-learned-to-love-the-goddamned-hippies.html

pepper_bar 3 years, 6 months ago

From the Occupy Lawrence facebook page: "Update - the Lawrence Police were not our biggest worry Saturday night, as it turned out. We had no interaction at the camp with police. We did have multiple members physically assaulted by Lawrence residents - We have video and have filed complaints with the police department for these events."

Is there anyone else who finds some irony in the campers requesting police protection? I mean, isn't this exactly the kind of public safety issue that the camping ordinance is there to defuse? Not saying "physical assault" is good, but isn't this the definition of wanting it both ways?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

So you're attempting to compare camping with physical assault.

Sorry, there is no comparison.

pepper_bar 3 years, 6 months ago

Where did I compare camping to physical assault? Reread my second paragraph; it explains that urban camping creates public safety issues. That's not equating the two, but rather explaining the connection between them. Hope this helps.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

There are plenty of assaults, drunk driving incidents, robberies, and rapes that occur because large number of drunk college students are wandering around downtown in the early morning hours.

If public safety is your real concern, do you support earlier closing hours for bars/nightclubs?

pepper_bar 3 years, 6 months ago

Not interested in getting into strawman arguments, thanks.

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Not a straw man argument, just because you call it one.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

So you're saying that since you disagree with them, it's OK if they get beat up.

pepper_bar 3 years, 6 months ago

Of course I never said that. You aren't worth my time.

fancy80 3 years, 6 months ago

Is it camping or is it civil disobedience? Because so far today, you've flipped-flopped several times. one time it is simple camping....what could be more wholesome than camping? Then it is civil disobedience, which is totally different than camping.

South Park is not a campground...if they want to camp, go to Clinton, or better yet Perry campgrounds.

Sorry Bozo, you don't get to be the comparison judge today. It is what it is...and it is breaking the law.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

It's both camping and civil-disobedience. And by definition, civil disobedience entails breaking the law. Never said otherwise.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

I'd like to see the LJW do an update on this story on the attacks last night. Thank you.

Boston_Corbett 3 years, 6 months ago

"no different than the people who would burn down the Hoovervilles during the Depression" .... Then you must be talking about Army Chief of Staff Douglas MacArthur.

Seriously folks, read some history.

waynelsworld 3 years, 6 months ago

Peaceful Assembly is within the law in spite of the ordinance. Assault is not. That is the difference.

kernal 3 years, 6 months ago

BornAgainAmerican asks what conservative groups support OWS as he is of the opinion occupymarines.org does not speak for the U.S. Marines. For starters there is veteransforpeace.org; Karl Denninger, one of the founders of the Tea Party (yep, that one made me pause); the Oath Keepers, which states it is non-partisan, and so on.

BAA, maybe we can keep up with the World once we can all function well on three hours of sleep. :>)

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Of course 99% of the population doesn't support this group.

And, I don't think they're claiming that it does.

Their 99% slogan is that they want policies that would help the 99%, rather than ones that help the 1%.

There are undoubtedly a few different ways to define the top 1% - ie. income, wealth, etc.

deec 3 years, 6 months ago

I never said the Marine Corps supports the movement. You misread my posts what I said was "There are Occupy groups of veteran marines,"; I also said ". There are returning veterans who support Occupy, One group is http://occupymarines.org/ On marine's story: http://www.enewspf.com/latest-news/la... Another' voice: http://abcnews.go.com/US/marine-confr... Veterans in Boston: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/b..." Please refrain from making up falsehoods about me.

gl0ck0wn3r 3 years, 6 months ago

Godwin Award ftw.

I'm curious, would you support similar peaceful protests in the park by the KKK or similarly unpopular groups? Somehow I feel your tolerance level would drop considerably.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

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waynelsworld 3 years, 6 months ago

Curious about this........If the purpose of the citations were to enforce the law consistently why then were the police not back again last night issuing citations to those that were there last night? Hmm......I wonder??
I am sure many of you have a theory on this phenomenum.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

Leaving a tent in one place for several days will kill the grass under it. Killing the grass in killing the planet. Pepper fog and vicious dogs are just the ticket for clearing the squatters.

Godot 3 years, 6 months ago

I like Brandon Bell, and I intend to quote him, and ask for his pro-bono support when my kid has a two week wedding camp-out in South Park. Free Speech For All!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 3 years, 6 months ago

And your kid would be OK if s/he and the blushing bride/groom get ticketed and perhaps arrested?

bearded_gnome 3 years, 6 months ago

so once again the Koch brothers are eeeeevilll! lol! how about the real enemy of american values: George Soros who's put up money through foundations, to get the nongrassroots occupy movement going.

Campsey and others continued, their noon rally gathering about 40 people, apparently convinced of their causes. They rallied in front of the U.S. Bank at

---just 40 people now? the other day AP-kansas reported 50 people. they're shrinking in number looks like.

noise problems reported from the south park squatters. any reports of the occuhippies cursing at people who live near the park like their brethren occupying Wall Street? any reports of vandalism like from their brethren occupying Wall Street? any reports that people who work in the area of South Park have been harrassed, threatened, cursed, etc., as those who work around Wall Street have suffered?

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

Nope.

But there was a report that somebody, or a group of people, beat up some of the protesters.

pepper_bar 3 years, 6 months ago

Please cite to any report about anyone getting beaten up. I sure haven't read it, and I was the first person to post about the "physical assault" stuff here.

The protesters might not understand the difference between assault and battery. The fact they haven't clarified this makes their accusations somewhat confusing.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 6 months ago

In other occupy news: "#OccupyBaltimore Discouraging Rape Victims From Going To Police Instead, they would prefer the victim report the incident to "the Security Committee" which will thoroughly investigate the allegation and ensure both parties will receive proper counseling. The Security Committee is, no doubt, a crack team of highly trained criminal investigators that have had at least 20 or 30 minutes of investigative instruction...." Read the rest, including scans of the memo, at: http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/209837.php

jafs 3 years, 6 months ago

If you read the memo, it includes language that any victims have the right, and the support of the movement in reporting rapes to law enforcement.

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