Archive for Friday, October 7, 2011

Mom of missing tot says she took lie detector test

Claims cops told her “You did it.”

October 7, 2011, 8:12 a.m. Updated October 7, 2011, 1:15 p.m.

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Kansas City, Mo., police issued an Amber Alert for Lisa Irwin, an infant who disappeared from her Kansas City home overnight on Oct. 3.

Kansas City, Mo., police issued an Amber Alert for Lisa Irwin, an infant who disappeared from her Kansas City home overnight on Oct. 3.

— The mother of a 10-month-old girl who went missing from their Kansas City home said police told her she failed a lie detector test and accused her of being involved in her baby's disappearance.

Deborah Bradley said Friday that police never showed her the results of the test and denied knowing anything about what happened to her daughter, Lisa Irwin. Bradley and the baby's father, Jeremy Irwin, said Lisa was abducted from her crib late Monday or early Tuesday.

"They said I failed (a polygraph test)," Bradley, 25, told The Associated Press. "And I continued to say that's not possible because I don't know where she's at and I did not do this."

Irwin, 28, said he also offered to take a test but that police said that was not necessary.

Kansas City police spokesman Steve Young declined to comment Friday on whether the parents have been tested, citing the ongoing investigation.

Bradley and Irwin, both dressed in jeans and sweatshirts, held hands and teared up several times during the 20-minute interview. They reiterated that their main focus "is to bring Lisa home."

"We need her. We have to have her. She's our link that ties everybody together," Irwin said.

They said police have treated them like suspects and that Bradley in particular has been preparing for the possibility of charges being filed against her. The mother said detectives told her: "You did it. You did it. And we have nothing.'"

Irwin, an electrician, said he returned from work around 4 a.m. Tuesday and discovered Lisa was missing. Bradley said she last checked on the child around 10:30 p.m. and that when Lisa disappeared she was asleep in her bed with her 6-year-old son and a stray kitten they found earlier in the day. The parents said they discovered their front door unlocked, a window open and house lights blazing, lending credence to the theory that the baby may have been snatched by an intruder.

"The main problem I think that we're facing is that everybody (else) has an alibi," Irwin said. "I was at work. I've been cleared. All these other people we were worried about ... the FBI said they've been cleared. The only one you can't clear is the mother that's at home when it happens 'cause there's nobody else there."

On Thursday, police told reporters that Bradley and Irwin were no longer cooperating with authorities in their investigations, but the family later released a statement insisting they had never stopped.

The parents reasserted their commitment to the investigation Friday, saying they are not angry with how things have gone and that they understand police have a difficult job to do.

"Don't get me wrong. I understand why they did what they did," Bradley said. "You see stuff like this everywhere. You watch the TV, and there's some crazy person doing something insane. There's been too many times stuff has happened. They have to assume what's worst ... but it felt like it was taken really, really far."

Bradley said, "I'm still not angry."

The parents also said their three cellphones had been stolen, but Young said the missing phones had not produced any leads.

Investigators focused their search Thursday on a heavily wooded area, sewers and an industrial park. About 100 officers scoured the industrial area and adjacent woods, while others were lifting drain covers and crawling inside.

But by Thursday evening authorities announced they were shutting down the command post about a mile from the family home. Police spokesman Darin Snapp sent out a news release saying authorities believed they had done everything they could "regarding geographic searches."

Lisa has blue eyes and blonde hair, is 30 inches tall and weighs around 28 pounds. She was last seen wearing purple shorts and a purple shirt with pictures of white kittens.

Comments

cthulhu_4_president 3 years, 8 months ago

The polygraph is an antiquated piece of technology that measures 4 basic body parameters, none of which has anything to do with the act of deception, or the intent to lie. The theory that these paremeters are linked to lying and deception is tenuous, and the machine is incredibly easy to beat, if you know how to alter some of the parameters (blood pressure, pulse, breath rate) at the time that the control questions are asked. Basically, your body gives a 'lie' response during the control question, and as a result the machine cannot tell what a 'truth' response is. Of course, factors such as being nervous, tense, or having your freaking child abducted through a window are likely to confound many of these parameters, and the end result is in no way guarenteed to be the truth. There's a reason they're not allowed as court evidence, after all.

The art of admistering a polygraph test is the art of the scammer, and a good polygraph examiner will always get whatever answers they want. They are used as bullying tools in the court of public opinion, and they should not be used by police departments, since they don't freaking prove anything, other than the person taking the test was nervous.

Also, the basic design of the polygraph has not changed since it was introduced in 1921. How many pieces of unimproved technology from the 1920's would you trust to help you solve a crime?

ku_tailg8 3 years, 8 months ago

Nervous or not. There is a reason basic questions are asked. Does 2+2=4? Yes. Nervous or scared questions like this will give a baseline. Granted, that baseline will be higher in traumatic situations but nevertheless it gives the examiner a place to start.

I agree they can be beaten and most definitely shouldn't be allowed in court but something seems fishy about this case (starting with the cell phones) and the apparent results don't really surprise me.

cthulhu_4_president 3 years, 8 months ago

Agreed, lots of fishy things about the case, but that's why I'm not commenting about the case here, just the polygraphs.

About the baseline, you are correct, the polygraph will successfully detect any response that differs a lot from the baseline. That's why the trick is to have your body give a 'lie' (stressed) response during the control question (2 + 2 = 4), then that goes down as your baseline and the rest of your answers will be meaningless. You can screw up the baseline by flexing one particular muscle as you answer the baseline question. This action causes the contraction of a large vein that spikes your blood pressure and pulse rate as you answer the question. Then, as you answer the first non-control question, you relax this muscle.

What is this wonderful muscle? Well, let's just say you can beat a polygraph by talking out of your a$$.

April Fleming 3 years, 8 months ago

the ramseys were cleared. awful to live for so long with people thinking you killed your own child.

ebyrdstarr 3 years, 8 months ago

I'm not sure that saying, "We're tired and don't want to answer any more questions right now" after 11 hours of talking to police really constitutes "no longer cooperating."

kansasredlegs 3 years, 8 months ago

Mrs. Ramsey died knowing she did nothing wrong but with the police and DA finally admitting after her death that she and her husband had no involvement in the death of Jon Benet.

The Ramseys did the right thing... They lawyered up just as these people will or should have. As soon as the police determine "we can't figure this out" the Mother will be charged with little or just circumstanstial evidence and who wants to have a trial when the media is placing you under the cloud and especially after Casey Anthony

justajoe 3 years, 8 months ago

Hope the missing toddler is found safe and sound. Wish Nancy Grace would disappear.

somedude20 3 years, 8 months ago

I hope the child is still alive and well but I also hope that Nacy disGrace does not jump on this story!! God, I did not like waking up for work and having to hear that pig's voice and the phrase 'tot mom" is really one of the dumbest ever

Stuart Evans 3 years, 8 months ago

why would you wake up to hearing Nancy Grace? If I hated it so much, I'd probably change the channel.

Bobo Fleming 3 years, 8 months ago

Police call the polygraph a "confession box." There is an elaborate ritual attached to it that results in the lead detective saying "this looks bad." "I have never seen one this bad." "You have to start telling us the truth." Believe or not this works and most of the perps are so dumb they fall for it. In this particular case the name "Susan Smith" comes to mind. If you don't know who she is look it up.

Adrienne Sanders 3 years, 8 months ago

So, the mother took one but the father doesn't have to. The baby went missing while the mother was home but the father wasn't. The thing with the three missing cell phones... I hope the baby is safe somewhere but something ain't right.

friendlyjhawk 3 years, 8 months ago

Wow, a polygraph expert who wants to be president took the time to post on this anonymous comment rag! LJW you draw the most exotic posters ever. Let the police do their job. That poor baby is what they are worried about. The hell the with families feelings.

cthulhu_4_president 3 years, 8 months ago

I don't want to be president, as I'm not Cthulhu.

Please feel free to research the polygraph for yourself, and let me know if I've made any mistakes. I can tell you how to beat it, if you want.

Bobo Fleming 3 years, 8 months ago

So this is the situation at present. While dad is at work some unknown perp decides to steal baby. The unknown perp goes in a window ( the only one without a screen) and then turns on the lights in the house. I guess thats so the perp can find the baby. The perp decides that since he or she is stealing the baby he or she might as well take three cell phones at the same time. Then the perp decides its ok to go out the front door since nobody would possibly be watching.

Under this set of "facts' the cops are getting a little impatient with the mom. She in turn has decided that the cops are not understanding enough about her situation so she needs to go on network TV which will certainly help find the baby.

I have a bridge in Brooklyn that i'd like to sell. It is more likely that the bridge is really mine than the story the cops are now getting.

doc1 3 years, 8 months ago

I have been thinking the thing same for several days now. The three Cell Phones part of the story is where she messed up. She's involved one way or another.

doc1 3 years, 8 months ago

I have been thinking the thing same for several days now. The three Cell Phones part of the story is where she messed up. She's involved one way or another.

FarneyMac 3 years, 8 months ago

Thanks for the educational lesson, pal. So helpful! Your opinions are valuable, thank you so much for sharing. You have made the world a better place with this comment.

jafs 3 years, 8 months ago

Police are allowed to lie to suspects, legally.

If she did in fact fail the test, why wouldn't they show her the results if she wanted to see them?

If they don't, it's entirely possible that they're lying to her in order to pressure her into confessing.

Also, I agree that the tests aren't infallible - the scientific community has much less faith in them than law enforcement.

avoice 3 years, 8 months ago

The specifics of this case remain to be seen, but the most important thing for We The People to take away from these types of investigations is this: When police are able to infringe on a citizen's Constitutional rights, they call it "cooperating." When a citizen invokes the protection of his or her Constitutional rights, they say the person has "ceased to cooperate with police." This is meant to give the rest of us the message: We, the Police, would rather dispense with your Constitutional rights and we'll go to any lengths, both public and private to bully you into relinquishing them.

Bobo Fleming 3 years, 8 months ago

These police that are "dispensing" with your constitutional rights spend most of their time trying to keep us safe. The cops that you think are infringing on your rights will pull you out of a burning car or risk their lives to protect you and your property. They can get a little overbearing and their are bad ones but in most cases they are really not going after your "rights." They are going after the kind of people who would kill you in a second for your wallet or your car. Spend a little time in the docket call at the Douglas County Courthouse and you will see what the cops deal with on a daily basis. And yes a few there are innocent but most would kill or steal from you in a second if they thought no cop would get them.

doc1 3 years, 8 months ago

I think her changing the story, having a ridiculous layout of events and contradicting herself makes it easy for them to focus on her.

acg 3 years, 8 months ago

I have to admit when I first heard this story I also thought Susan Smith, but the mother's grief seems so genuine. I saw thru Susan Smith the first time I saw her press conference begging for her boys to be brought home. She seemed so fake and her tears and cries were not well acted at all. This woman, though, seems genuinely distraught. Either way I can't imagine how one must feel. I think about what would happen if someone snatched one of my kids and the thought of it makes me unable to breathe. If this were me, I'd need to be sedated heavily or I would literally lose my mind with worry. I hope they find her. She's a cute little thing and she needs to be home with her family.

Deja Coffin 3 years, 8 months ago

I don't know what to believe and just hope that this little baby girl is returned home safe and sound. The lack of evidence leading towards a person is really disheartening. Hopefully somethings comes up and there is some kind of break in the case.

lunacydetector 3 years, 8 months ago

a plausible explanation...perp entered through the window, because the mother is fat, most likely snores - maybe sleep apnea, perp can hear the mother's train wreck snore throughout the house, turns on the lights, finds cell phones, walks out the front door carrying baby....who knows? hope they find baby safe and sound. i saw mother interviewed and she seemed genuinely distraught.

Kendall Simmons 3 years, 8 months ago

Plausible?

It's possible...sure. But it doesn't sound very plausible.

acg 3 years, 8 months ago

You're a jerk! This woman is having the worst time of her life and you have to make snarky little comments about her weight and the sound of her snore? I seriously can't stand people like you. Horrid, hateful, mean and spiteful is what you are. You should be ashamed. You, and everyone just like you, is what is wrong with our society. People don't care about each other anymore. The internet has given you a nice little veil of anonymity so you can show your ass. I hope someone comes along some day and kicks it for you!!!

lunacydetector 3 years, 8 months ago

how am i being hateful? it seems reasonable or probable since most fat people snore..... including myself.

akt2 3 years, 8 months ago

Nancy does know how to rant. I think her and Judge Judy could rule the country courts single handed.

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