Advertisement

Archive for Sunday, March 6, 2011

Summit to educate Lawrence community on LGBT issues

March 6, 2011

Advertisement

In the hopes of giving a greater voice to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender issues, a local group will hold a summit this election season.

The first of its kind in Lawrence, the LGBT Summit will bring together members of the LGBT community, school board and City Commission candidates, and others interested in LGBT issues.

“We’ve never taken a proactive approach to getting our voice out there in the community,” said Scott Criqui, vice-chair of the Lawrence/Douglas County Chapter of the Kansas Equality Coalition. “With the coming election, it would be great if candidates could see, here is our voice and here is what is important to us.”

Sponsored by the local Kansas Equality Coalition chapter, the summit will be held from 7 p.m. to 9:30 p.m. March 29 at Maceli’s, 1031 N.H.

On tap for discussion will be the goal of convincing city of Lawrence leaders to include gender identity in its anti-discrimination policy. Such an effort failed in 2010 when the city’s Human Relations Commission voted against the measure.

The commission’s reluctance to change the policy spurred a conversation that a summit was needed.

“How do we educate the community, and specifically community leaders, on LGBT issues to give them more of a scope on what the LGBT community is here?” Criqui said.

The answer was to host a summit.

The summit will also look at school bullying and the positive effects an inclusive community can have on mental health and economic development.

Along with speakers, a candidate mixer will be held.

The summit also will be a chance for LGBT people to learn about steps they can take if they are feeling bullied or discriminated against.

While cities throughout the country have held similar summits, Criqui said he knows of just one other city in Kansas — Manhattan — that has held a summit like this.

He hopes that will change.

“Lawrence is a lot more accepting than other communities,” Criqui said. “Our hope is to be a role model with this event.”

Comments

scary_manilow 3 years, 9 months ago

Sallyone:

Go "yuck" yourself. Seriously, how is this something like this a problem for you?

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

Is this another of those "How I Choose To Have Sex" discussions? Will Prof. Dennis Dailey be there?

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

@sallyone: That's why we need a strong nondiscrimination ordinance. Bias like yours is alive even in liberal Lawrence.

jhawkinsf 3 years, 9 months ago

Over the years, we've learned that the earth is not flat, it's not at the center of the universe and that being gay is just another human condition. It's no different than being left handed or being slightly taller than average. It may be a little different, but values such as good or bad should not be attached to it. It just is. Beyond that, like every other person on the planet, they should each be judged on the content of their character.
For those who can't seem to get around it, next time you denigrate "gay", substitute "left handed". You will quickly see the folly of your argument.

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

Correct: We've learned about life style choices. Just as some in Lawrence choose to be homeless, others choose to have sex in different ways. God or "human condition" doesn't belong in the mix. It's all about choice. Free choice. shrug

jhawkinsf 3 years, 9 months ago

No on chooses to be left handed and there is certainly no benefit I see in being left handed. No one chooses to be gay. I did not choose to be either right handed nor did I choose to be heterosexual. It just is. Asking a gay person to not act upon their "gayness" would be like asking a straight person not to act upon their "straightness". Choice is not part of this equation.

llama726 3 years, 9 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

nepenthe 3 years, 9 months ago

So basically,anyone who disagrees with you is automatically a heterophobe?

oliveoyl 3 years, 9 months ago

How old were you when you decided to be heterosexual?

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

But I'm a minority heterosexual due to the choices I have made relative to certain practices with adults. See, even heterosexuals make choices that aren't "main stream" and we have solidarity with people who choose to have sex with people of their own gender. However, we'd just as soon not advertise what those practices are.

Yup. It's all about choice. Choice is a good thing.

oliveoyl 3 years, 9 months ago

Suggesting that everyone is born heterosexual is naive at best.

nepenthe 3 years, 9 months ago

Nevermind Alceste. He/she/it shows up anytime someone might be thinking about the 'Gay Agenda' to remind us that if we disagree with him/her/it we're heterophobes and against the straight agenda.

monheim 3 years, 9 months ago

The only "choice" that is involved in sexuality for homosexuals is that the ones who are openly homosexual choose to be brave enough to go ahead and live as the person they are despite societal pressure not to.

jhawkinsf 3 years, 9 months ago

I hope my original post was clear. Perhaps my choice of words has made it less than clear. I firmly believe that no one has a choice as to their sexuality. No one chooses to be either gay or straight. That simply are what they are, the same way no one chooses to be left handed, etc. I would hope that in the year 2011 we are able to fully accept everyone as full and complete equals, regardless of their sexuality.

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

I think and believe that people of color, the poor and the disenfranchised, the wretched of our Earth, etc. have got a far worse row to hoe.

The dismemberment of the war on poverty and the movement for equal rights and justice for people of color occured due to these side, CHOICE related issues. Yup...it's MY choice to look at "our left" thusly.

Oh yeah, and it is simply not possible for a two parent household (with children) to be a two "profession" household and the child(ren) not get the short end of the stick. Not possible.

When you find a real cause, let me know. YAWN

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

Oh, I been around the block a time or two. Me thinks thee doest protest too much.

I'm no liberal. In fact, "the liberal" is a bigger problem than full on Right Wingers: At least you know where they're coming from.

Liberals? You just never know: They can agree on NOTHING amongst themselves and sell each other out like there is no tomorrow. none2, suggest you think about it.....labels and parties....they mean nothing anymore...as if they ever did.

Also, I'm offended at your hate speech towards me: I am NOT a liberal. I am so far to the left, it's almost right. Sit down, please.

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

Right. Seeing as how I am well past 21....even well past 60...and was reared by a Daddy who "turned out" when he was 42 or so (Does that make him "gay" or "bi"???), and then hanging out with he and his associates, I probably have a far keener insight into what is what. I would love to post what my father AND his associates told me to call he and his associates, but it would get censored. It ended, always, with "There is NOTHING "gay" about what we do. We get rolled; beat up by homophobes on the street; the police beat us up; our bars are raided; blah, blah, blah. We are fa** AND proud to be so. Do not EVER call us "gay"!.!

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

....and in honor of my dead Daddy and his friends, who became MY friends, mentors, and even business associates, I never will either (And a LOT of these men DIED as a result of the AIDS scandal that exists in this Nation and across the globe). And, when I'm in public, out of respect to MY choices and MY life and MY family, I'll use whatever darn word I CHOOSE, irrespective if some twit don't like it. I suspect I've been YOUR age....have you been mine? All these hang ups on WORDs rather than on ACTIONS. I really don't care what names people use in my direction; I DO care how they TREAT me. Form over function rules the day. What new word will the Politically Correct dream up next such that MY "inappropriate" vocabulary only grows? Bring it. Good Grief.

scary_manilow 3 years, 9 months ago

I'm convinced that most of the homophobes out there still equate left handedness with witchcraft, so your point may fall on deaf ears.

Gene Wallace 3 years, 9 months ago

Most of us Witches are right-handed. Those that are left-handed still follow the right-hand path. For the right-handed, you put out into the World, give, with your projective right hand. One receives and draws from the World with the left hand. Left handed people receive with the right and give with the left. Wicca, the Craft of the Wise, welcomes people of all gender types. We are very supportive of LGBT people and their equal rights.

booyalab 3 years, 9 months ago

Approval is so un-epic. You must be in awe of their brave and noble lifestyle choice. Heroic even.

Alceste 3 years, 9 months ago

Medal of Honor heroic....that choice that's been made and I get to see the medal every day being worn by the chosen who have made their choice. A bit tacky wearing it everyday, too. It would be one thing if it were simply worn as a piece of art or something, simply pinned somewhere, but NOOOOOOOOOOO.....it has to be worn necklace style. It's just a tad bit grandstanding, but that's yet another choice, eh?

deec 3 years, 9 months ago

Some think it is okay to discriminate against gay people because it is a "choice." If that is the standard one uses to justify discrimination, then it is also permissable to discriminate against any and all religions, since it, too, is a "choice" to follow a given religion.

Gene Wallace 3 years, 9 months ago

LGBT is not a choice. It's gestational. Do the Research!

deec 3 years, 9 months ago

I'm fully aware of that, hence the "some think." I was specifically referring to the posters on this forum, and in real life, who persist in thinking it is a choice. Choice of which version of god/gods to follow, however is a choice, at least in this country today. Innate biological makeup...not so much.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

The anti-discrimination ordinance the LGBT wants -WILL allow a grown man who dresses up like a woman to use a women's public restroom and the City will defend this man to use it - even if he's just a pervert who dresses like a woman in order to look at little girls in the bathroom, right?

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

Yes, you have a good point. Most transgenered people who "identify" themselves as "women" only do so for a day, week, year, or "whatever". Rarely is it a complex life decision.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

What do you mean by utopian goals?

Oh... wait... you mean the goal of securing the exact same rights and privileges of heterosexuals. You're right. Total pipe dream.

And we really should take the threat of perverts and "un-serious" transgendered men assaulting the city's ladies' rooms much more seriously. Right you are again.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

Yes you are correct. Your definition of "utopian" goals is certainly what the LBGT community must be seeking. The passage of an anti-discrimination ordinance would almost certainly lead to people being able to do whatever they want, whenever they want, with no negative consequences. Thus, you have cemented my opposition to such an ordinance and the inherent lawlessness to which it would lead.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

which privileges and rights are the LBGT community demanding, from which you do not already benefit?

and if you say "the right to use opposite-sex bathrooms", I will ePunch you in the eFace.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

ivalueamerica 3 years, 9 months ago

prune, are you really that stupid, or do you honestly believe that?

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

@BigPrune, Clancy99, gudpoynt: If anything, trans people have more to fear in bathrooms from straight people. I've heard a lot of stories from trans people about unwarranted harassment and violence there. I've NEVER heard a story of a trans person using their status as trans to sexually abuse a woman.

The "man in a dress" objection is another chestnut. If it were true, why are the 30% of Americans who live in jurisdictions with trans nondiscrimination laws not facing a wave of complaints? Protecting trans people against discrimination does not undo sexual predator or peeping laws.

Nor do trans people swap identities day to day. All of the trans people I have known are stable in their gender identity.

These posts are proof of the stigma trans people must unfairly deal with every day--from employment, to housing, to public accommodation, to the LJW forums.

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

don't throw facts and statistics at me joejarvis. Some pervert could put on a dress, walk into the ladies room and start playing with himself right in front of my sister, and if the cops picked him up, he could just say he was "transgendered" and they would have to let him go. I've got a gut twice as big as my head that tells me that this type of scenario would certainly ensue following the passage of a so called "anti-discrimination" ordinance.

OutlawJHawk 3 years, 9 months ago

Are these really the most pressing issues our community, country and world is facing?

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

If you are LGBT, it actually might be. For some, it really is a matter of life and death, depending in what part of the world they live.

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

I wish the LGBT Summit great success!

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

Yes, perhaps they can come to a compromise that wouldn't allow some male pervert from using the women's restroom, then being defended to do so by the City of Lawrence if the ordinance is passed, if he used the excuse he is just a transvestite or a pre-op transexual.

Of course the ordinance would allow men to use the girl's restroom in our local grade schools, middle schools, high schools, sporting events, public functions, the swimming pool etc., etc., and for women to use the boy's restrooms as well.

This IS a legitimate concern. Why should the public's safety be compromised and their compromised safety NOT be defended by the City of Lawrence?

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

Curious, do you have evidence of a single case of a transvestive or a pre-op transexual attacking someone in a bathroom? I've never once read about this. It appears your imagination is running away with itself again.

Wendy magillicutty 3 years, 9 months ago

"they would have to let him go" uhh? Why? Is there some "anti-criminal assault" discrimination law being introduced?? An assault is an assault is an assault. There are perverts in every gender, race, politics, religion and really any group of people. You fear perverts, not these groups. Each descriptor does NOT equal or imply perversion. Thankfully, there is a TINY nbr of perverts worldwide. Theyre NOT everywhere. We really shouldn't have to be so descriptive of who not to discriminate against. It should be the other way around. Cooler heads continually prevail on these topics, with ludicrous amounts of grace, strength and patience. Are you helping or hurting society? Oh, and when you get a chance, check your facts about homophobia and its connection to repressed homosexuality. I have met the enemy and he is us.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

  • so do you think it would be okay if some guy wanted to take a shower in the girls locker room with a bunch of naked girls at the Freestate swimming pool, that he'd be free to do so and the City of Lawrence will defend his right, and the girls or their parents will have no recourse unless they sued and the City of Lawrence would be defending him and his right to take that shower with those girls?

In a nutshell.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

So we've moved from bathrooms to locker rooms. These "where I'm naked" objections to civil rights are a tired meme. With African Americans, they had to be segregated in separate facillities. With the Equal Rights Amendment, opponents said it would force unisex facillities. With gays and lesbians, we'd be showering next to you and unable to restrain our raging deviant libido. Spot a pattern? In reality, most people go about daily life just fine. But we often look back with time and wonder how society could have been so prejudiced.

mbulicz 3 years, 9 months ago

Or we look at the LJ World replies and wonder how society can still be so prejudiced. You're so right, the tired argument is that someone's gonna get raped by [insert minority here]. Sad that some people still spout this nonsense; sadder still that some believe.

Wendy magillicutty 3 years, 9 months ago

again, you use illogic to sound logical. drawing a comparison to a medically supported condition to a pervert and asking if society will protect the pervert. Your premises are wrong so your argument is false.

ivalueamerica 3 years, 9 months ago

actually, Prune.. you are a bold faced liar saying outragous things to try and hide your bigotry and shock people.

The reality is that a man can not just don a dress and use the women´s restroom or shower. Nowhere in any law is that allowed.

What you are confusing is that a transgendered person WHO IS DIAGNOSED, and it can be confusing, I am sure doubly so for someone as constantly confused as yourself. A transgendered person, by all credible scientific minds is, in the case you are discussing, not a perverted man trying to see women, but a woman trapped in the body of a man.

It is a diagnosis that takes time and must be carefully documented. A far cry from someone trying to pop on a dress and walk into the restroom. However, it is very seldom facts suit your arguments anyway.

So, your claim that the law will allow a perverted man to don a dress and pop into the restroom is patently absurd, wrong and ignorant....and as I mentioned, only a thinly veiled attempt to try and justify your bigotry and hatred.

On a related note, here is a study that I feel may be of some help to you.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/files/u47/Henry_et_al.pdf

JustNoticed 3 years, 9 months ago

Sheesh, ya'll are overexcited. I just wanna know if it would be rude to insist on an enema on the first date.

classclown 3 years, 9 months ago

Make it simple. Rename all restrooms from Men and Women to Those that have a penis and Those that don't have a penis.

bad_dog 3 years, 9 months ago

Better a bidet than drinking fountain...

Next up: Con 1 reports on the average depth of Douglas County urinal water.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

Some of you people got my post totally out of context. What I was saying was, if the ordinance is passed, bypassing the human rights commission, and the City Commission passed this law, a guy could take a shower or use the restroom in a public facility for the opposite sex and if he was questioned about it, all he would have to say to get out of troube was he was transgendered or pre-op transexual, and the City of Lawrence would be defending his right to shower with girls at one of our pools, or use the bathroom at any public facility. Now, tell me how I am wrong, please.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

....and IF the only reply is I am a big liar or homophobe (which I am NOT), then back it up and tell me how I am wrong with the proposed ordinance if it were passed.

thank you.

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

You know you are wrong when you are on Fred Phelps's side of the issue.

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

Okay, I'll tell you how wrong you are. You are terribly, terribly wrong. I know it is a matter of degrees and you aren't wrong on a WMDs in Iraq scale of wrong, but I would still say you are terribly, terribly wrong.

If your view is that people should be discriminated against because you have a fear someone else might try to use it as an excuse to see a naked lady, then you completely misunderstand the situation.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

THAT answer is TOTALLY unacceptable for the majority of citizens, because I am right in the assertion that this law will allow what I stated above.

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

Trust me on this Big Prune, you do not speak for the majority of citizens.

beatrice 3 years, 9 months ago

It isn't a legitimate question because it isn't a legitimate concern. It is a strawman argument, setting up bogus scenarios in order to support discrimination. Also, see ivalueamerica's 8:20 am response, which actually does answer the question.

mbulicz 3 years, 9 months ago

Show the part of the law that says this. I want sections and subsections. If you're making this claim, it's time you backed it up.

It's not our responsibility to tell you how you are wrong when you haven't even done the legwork to support your assertion.

ivalueamerica 3 years, 9 months ago

you are a liar.

one can not only state they are transgendered, they must be diagnoses, that means therapy and medical care is involved in the diagnosis.

The information is simple and available on Google, but it does not make as exciting soundbite as your fake claim that any man can don a dress and hop in the girls shower.

That, by definition, makes you a liar.

ivalueamerica 3 years, 9 months ago

the liar stated that a man, without consequence, could simply walk into a womens restroom or shower and if someone called the police simply state they were transgendered and be let go.

That is a lie.

One would be required to produce the diagnosis. It is similar to the Americans with Disabilities act, you can NOT simply request an accommodation, you have to demonstrate that you have a condition that requires it.

ivalueamerica 3 years, 9 months ago

I never said any such a thing.

I said, if someone calls the police on a pervert in the bathroom, the pervert can be prosecuted while a transgendered will not be, totally nullifying the false scenario that Prune is using to try and scare people into supporting homophobia.

pay attention, you miss a lot.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

OK BigPrune, I'll humor your mistaken hypothetical: A man dresses as a woman, goes to a woman's bathroom, and peeps or something. Next, assume the police catch him after women complain. The cops book him under some peeping or sexual predator law and the district attorney prosecutes him. Trans or not, the man has violated the law. The nondiscrimination ordinance is not a shield from sex crime prosecution.

Let's take your hypo to a greater extreme. Let's say we evaluate the ordinance as if it were some kind of shield (even though it's not). The man's attorney would have to establish that the man was transgender in court to use it. There would be evidence on how he dressed, and behaved, and his statements to others for his life outside the bathroom. A straight pervert is going to have a hard time proving that. And even if he could, why would he? He'd be publicly building a case he was trans when he's not, and I doubt most straight men are comfortable doing that. The only way your hypo works is if you assume a genuine MTF trans person wants to peep/sexually abuse women. I just don't think that's true. If anything, it's evidence of your bias.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

It wouldn't be the straight man's attorney defending him, it would be the City of Lawrence's attorney defending him if he said he was trans. How could it be distinguished, that Terri the 50 year old want to be woman (who used to be Terry the man) is a pre-op transexual who wanted to take a shower in the girls locker room at Free State High, and get naked with the girls? With the ordinance he is free to do so and the City will defend his right (even if it isn't true that he is a pre-op trans). It would be easier for a pervert who wanted to stay out of jail and off the sexual predator list to claim to be a trans then to fess up the REAL truth risking jail time. The best part is the City of Lawrence's attorneys will be defending him in court on the taxpayer's dollar.

Thanks but no thanks. It isn't worth the threat to society to have this ordinance. Perhaps the LGBT should require a separate bathroom (but THAT would be discrimination as well). So what is best for the majority of society?

The issue the LGBT support, they should let it go. I'd think there would be a HUGE public outcry if something like this got passed - even a recall election if your group gets some supporters elected initially.

Criminals are con artists. They will jump at the opportunity to weasle out of a crime and jail time. It's their nature.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

...even if the person was a legit pre-op trans, the psychological ramifications of 13 year old girls seeing a nude 50 year old man taking a shower or being nude in front of them would cause major mental issues that would last for their lifetime.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

It was made up. However, a 13 year old girl seeing some hairy 50 year old man naked in the showers could indeed cause trauma for her for life.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

@bigprune: That doesn't make any sense. Where are you getting that a city nondiscrimination ordinance compels the city attorney to intervene in a sex crime prosecution to defend the defendant?

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

It wouldn't be a sex crime if the City passed the ordinance. After all, it's just a 50 year old man who is or isn't trans who wants to use the girls locker room at the Free State public swimming pool, because he claims to be a woman trapped in a man's body - either real or imagined.

The City will have to defend his right if the ordinance is passed.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

@bigprune: Your arguments seem to waiver between a genuine trans person and a non-genuine trans person who is there to sexually exploit the situation.

So a man dresses as a woman and enters a public bathroom/lockerroom. If that person is genuinely trans, that shouldn't be a problem. As I understand your objection, it's that a trans woman could be in a women's bathroom/lockerroom yet not committing any crime and that's somehow bad. But if they're not there to abuse that access, then trans people deserve to use public facilities! Would you deny them access? Gay and lesbian people share bathrooms and lockerrooms with the sex they're sexually attracted to, yet everyone goes about their business without disruption.

If the man in your hypo is not genuinely trans, then he's there to abuse that access and act as a sexual predator. That's the sex crime hypo we discussed previously. A nondiscrimination ordinance does not undo sex crime laws.

Just so we don't lose sight of the forest for the trees, what if the ordinance exempted bathrooms and lockerrooms. Would you support it (i.e., covered employment, housing, restaurants, bars, gyms, etc.)?

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

You are absolutely correct sir.

Passage of an anti-discrimination act will certainly result in men showering with our city's daughters. Because as far as I know, there are no other laws on any Kansas books that would prevent such behavior.

And we all know, without a doubt, that desperate perverts have been taking cold showers and thinking about baseball for years now, just waiting for the opportunity, upon passage of an anti-discrimination ordinance rife with loopholes, to satisfy their sexually deviant urges by posing as transgendered men and coyly sneaking into the restrooms and locker rooms of our wives and daughters. This is the moment they have all been waiting for.

I feel like you really know how these perverts operate. Just as much as I feel like you really know what a transgendered individual might be thinking.

It's a good thing you came along. I was just about to set aside my irrational fears, take a step back from the situation, and realize that while everybody deserves equal rights, not everybody has them right now. Thanks for snapping me out of that pipe dream.

BigPrune 3 years, 9 months ago

Don't make light of what I am saying, because it will be a REAL situation if the ordinance is passed.

I think the children are more important to protect because the long term psychological ramifications far out weigh the supposed discrimination.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

30-40% of Americans live in jurisdictions with trans protections. Where's the predicted damage?

gudpoynt 3 years, 9 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

Joseph Jarvis 3 years, 9 months ago

There's lots of duality in nature. But what a leap to say that makes homosexuality unnatural.

Wendy magillicutty 3 years, 9 months ago

So I'm to assume that no one has a problem with transgen entering the mens' room in a woman's body? Also that every transgen is a gateway drug to openly allowing perverts to sexually harass others?

Commenting has been disabled for this item.