Letters to the Editor

Discrimination

August 30, 2011

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To the editor:

As one who has studied American history, I find there were times when the people of America discriminated against Puritans, the Irish, the Catholics, the Jews, the Italians, Indians (both East and American), Chinese, Japanese, Polish, and now, of course, Muslims. Have I left any group out?

Each group brought to the American fabric a new value, a new point of view, new cuisine, new customs and new languages. Some of those customs or cuisines we embraced because it fit our tastes. Yet, we hated them because they were not like us. We mocked them, called them names. Some we didn’t like because of their color, accent or they didn’t pray like the mainstream.

Perhaps those that are ostracized didn’t want to blend in because they wanted to maintain their own style of life or their oneness. Yet we criticize them for their failure to melt into our melting pot. We simply hate them because they aren’t like us. Some we have misquoted their religious texts, saying “they want to kill us because their book commands it.”

Some we enslaved and have kept enslaving though they have every right to be equal.

Why do we have these prejudices and hatred towards them that aren’t us? Why is it that our nature compels us to condemn that which we don’t understand or don’t want to embrace? Have we lost that ability to accept or did we never have it? Who now the price of his dear blood doth owe?

Comments

Mike Ford 3 years, 7 months ago

this person is not tuschie...maybe you should learn something from this letter to the editor... you're the problem....

Jimo 3 years, 7 months ago

Really!

It's difficult to find a post of yours that isn't so inspired. Hatred is what gets some people out of bed every morning.

I believe what you meant to say is that no post of yours belittles anyone solely for their race. Somehow that's supposed to make your sinful behavior a little better.

Richard Heckler 3 years, 7 months ago

Most of the hate messages seemingly come from elected officials who have access to the air waves and other media. Why do citizens tolerate such BS?

When elected officials wanted to resume military action in the oil rich nations the word evil kept coming around. Often we are told other nations or factions despise america because of our democracy.

Maybe other factions or nations dislike the USA government because our military actions are killing their families or corporate america is taking over THEIR natural resources.

Are other factions truly evil and do they truly dislike we americans? I say no. But they might have strong distastes for the Government military actions and they are not alone. Probably about 70% or more of americans do not support the war machine as foreign policy.

People in general no matter what "faction" they supposedly represent seem quite friendly. Not a bad idea.

Flap Doodle 3 years, 7 months ago

"...And there is another type of Caps Lock user who doesn’t capitalize whole sentences but INSTEAD capitalizes a few SPECIFIC words for EMPHASIS. Now read a sentence like that aloud, shouting every time you come to a capitalized word, and tell me you do not sound like an absolute freakin’ lunatic. This method can turn even basic known facts into crazy-sounding gibberish (“The SQUARE of the HYPOTENUSE of a RIGHT triangle equals the SUM of the squares of the OTHER two sides”)..." http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/tips-for-not-appearing-crazy-on-the-internet/

Cant_have_it_both_ways 3 years, 7 months ago

Muslims have carved out a unique place in America.

Cait McKnelly 3 years, 7 months ago

So have Fundamentalist Mormons. Your point?

grammaddy 3 years, 7 months ago

And Catholics have too.Again, the point is?

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

" I find there were times when the people of America discriminated against Puritans, the Irish, the Catholics, the Jews, the Italians, Indians (both East and American), Chinese, Japanese, Polish, and now, of course, Muslims. Have I left any group out?"

Yes, but don't you get it? 'The people of America' are those groups. So it's basically that everyone has trouble accepting other tribes, and that holds true around the world. While Americans like to be viewed as 'enlightened', when it comes down to it we're just like everyone else. We are tribal. We are primitive (national news proves that daily!). It's human nature to seek out "your own", that which makes you comfortable, who look like you or sound like you or think like you. We're animals. Maybe that's why it's always uplifting to see a dog and a cat playing together. "Hey look! Two species interacting!"

Jimo 3 years, 7 months ago

Hmmmm....I hear they're doing good work with pimozide these days.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

I'm happy to hear you're finally seeking help, Jimo. Now, would you like to converse on the subject or just keep being you?

rtwngr 3 years, 7 months ago

Kum-ba-ya, my Lord, Kum-ba-ya.. hmmhmmhmmhmm

I'm not full of hate but I hate letters like this.

"Why can't we all just get along?" - Rodney King

rtwngr 3 years, 7 months ago

Just kidding, everybody. I couldn't resist this one. hahahahaha

goodcountrypeople 3 years, 7 months ago

Lawrence reeks of patronizing sexist and ableist attitudes. The worst thing about it is most people here have been trained to get up in other people's business and to treat others like second -class citizens who might benefit from intervention by complete morons who obviously get their jollies by complimenting themselves on how nice they are to the total detriment and injustice of other people. I'd rather be shot than "helped" by some of the local incompetents and f-tards.Get a clue: if you don't have half a brain, you likely can't help. You probably rate a zero in mindfulness and awareness. A lot of attempts to"help" end up doing great harm. No one likes being threatened by frighteningly stupid and presumptuous strangers.

Most people just want to be treated like everyone else. It starts with opening doors for strangers. Too many locals are dumb enough that they manage to slam opened doors on people and hurt them. No one likes being subject to aggressive stereotypes. Social attitudes and the offensive, second-rate roles assigned to people are the problem, not differences or limitations: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/30/health/30epilepsy.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&ref=science

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

The entire last paragraph is questions, yet it leaves out one very important one. Is it possible to hate a behavior, or a philosophy and not be a racist, homophobe.....etc?

There are cultures that have different concepts of honesty than mine. Can I say that dishonesty, bribery, is wrong? It is wrong in my culture, but not so much in another culture and therefore I don't like that culture very much. Another culture doesn't value hard work as much as mine. If I say that I don't like that culture and I don't want that culture to influence my culture with laziness......is that an automatic racist card?

How do you say, hey, I don''t like that without being a racist?

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

Racism is the belief that somebody of a certain race is inferior simply by virtue of belonging to that race.

bevy 3 years, 7 months ago

That is strictly speaking, true, but in practice, not so much anymore. Nowadays simply disagreeing with someone else's beliefs or lifestyle is enough to get you called "racist" or "sexist" or "homophobic" or "loony lefty." Civil discourse is a dead art form.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

And the fundamental reason for that, bevy, is that people don't respect anything anymore.
We are innundated by images, sounds and words that are the result of managed, manipulated and packaged promotion. As a result, there are no heroes or villians and everybody is an expert....someone to trust. No right and wrong, just results of studies. SInce most studies are crap, people look at experts as uselsess. Ergo, everything is hyped crap.

No point in discussing anything, you just get links from merrill (who still believes in those). And it's just more crap from an expert who is simply trying to manipulate your ideas until you believe them.

We live in a world of competition for your beliefs. Your world is one big infomercial, and nobody really believes those. Politics, science, lawyers, religion, heck every institution is engaged in full blown P.R. and most of us know it.

How you gonna discuss anything when you are so blanketed by "experts".

How do young folks raise babies today without walking around in a state of perpetual guilt. Nobody does all the things your supposed to do. You can't raise babies the way you're supposed to. There aren't enough hours in the day. Thus, you give up and just raise the kids.

And it works out.

And you don't know who to believe.

And you are afraid to tell anybody....because they will only make you feel guilty. You bad parent, you.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

If you believe somebody is inferior simply because of their race, then you're racist.

MLK said he dreamed that one day, black people would be judged on the content of their character rather than their skin color.

If you feel that Malcolm X's character is inferior to MLK's, or vice versa, that seems to match his dream, if you're truly making the judgement on the basis of character rather than race.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

Your definition relies heavily on the definition of race.
An African American man in the hospital is being cared for by a couple of Nigerian nurses. Wife and mom come in for a visit and demand the nurses be removed because they refuse to have him cared for by those Africans.

Racism, or jealosy?

In Hastings at the checkout counter an African American family is checking out. Mom and dad are buying and little daughter is playing with some stuff on the end of the register.

Mom and dad begin to leave and call to the little girl who is kinda piddling. Nothin' new there. Dad hollers out to the kid to get over here, you.....N-word.

You coulda heard a pin drop. I haven't felt more sorry for a kid in my life. I'm white. What am I gonna say to that dad?


I don't know what racism is, jafs.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

"Racism, or jealosy?"

With the context provided it's impossible to know. And how does jealousy come into play?
Just because two people share skin pigmentation doesn't disqualify one from being racist. There's plenty of white people who don't like jews. Or russians. Or irish.

As to that father: nothing.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

Jealosy because the Nigerian nurses were cute

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

"Your definition relies heavily on the definition of race.c"

That's because you're defining 'racism'. If the hatred or intolerance isn't race-based, it's bigotry.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

And when do principles, ideals, and standards of behavior become bigotry? Am I bigotted to deplore sex with children? Some cultures allow it. Some groups in western society approve it.

Ancient Greeks, Romans, modern day tribals, Nambla.

I don't like it. If I say so, am I a bigot? And if I don't like sloppy dress, sloppy speech, sloppy behavior, and say those people are slobs, am I a bigot? Am I allowed an opinion, or must it be approved? And if so, by whom?


I am a father and I think that my involvement in raising my kids was important. I value that. So when I see people siring kids with no intention of ever caring for them......I cry foul. If the problem is because the male is a lying deadbeat white guy, then my problem with him isn't sexist, or racist, because I am a white male.

If the guy is black, then I am a racist.

If the woman trapped the poor sap of a guy and he wants to help, but she runs away with some other dude and won't let dad anywhere near the kid....then it's mom's fault and I am sexist for judging the woman.

All this is very confusing and the only thing I can clearly determine is that, as a white man (and an engineer at that), I have no valid opinion in this society. Unless it agrees with all the people who have been harmed by angry white males over the centuries. Might as well just sit back, shut up and watch bad things happen and wait for other people to fix them.

Like the family in Hastings. Somebody shoulda said something to dad there. Nobody dared.

We were all white, and therefore wrong.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

You can have whatever opinions you have, as far as I'm concerned.

You can even hold racist or sexist beliefs.

What's your concern exactly?

If you're not judging people based on their skin color, or gender, etc. and simply on traits that you dislike in individuals, you're not racist or sexist.

The main point, as I understand it, is to treat people as individuals, rather than making sweeping generalizations (usually negative ones) about large groups.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

"If the guy is black, then I am a racist." "We were all white, and therefore wrong."

Hooooonk! There we have the fallacy of your argument. First, you're not racist just because you don't agree with someone's behavior or actions or political stance AND that person happens to be of another race. Of course, that last line shows your mindset, to which I would suggest to try to stop thinking that way. Though there are plenty of folks on this particular website that are quick to throw out the racist card for exactly those types of rationality, it simply doesn't make it so. 'Racism' and 'racist' are two of the most misunderstood and ill-defined terms many people choose to throw around like confetti these days. Don't fall into their trap and think you can't have a contrary opinion just because someone doesn't look like you.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

I've told you twice.

There are many things that go on between the races that are unpleasant, but not racist, according to the definition of it.

And, yes, of course, the definition depends on the definition of race, which is not necessarily an easy or straightforward thing, and may in fact be flawed.

How could it be otherwise - the word is "racism"?

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

Cop out? Racisnm is a word that is ill-defined. Welcome to the world of guilt. Am I a racist sexist because I am a white male?

I have a very short fuse when it comes to guilt. I didn't ask to be here. Hence my rejection of religion. And my rejection of "programs" that don't work, but soothe the guilt of white males.

I think it is about time to define the boundaries of racism. At what point is an opinion (which might call for action) not worthy of discussion because it might make an affected group angry? And is that the definition? Because if it is......we'll never talk out our problems.

And if any recommendation for a solution to poverty, racism, homophobia, etc is unacceptable from whites, blacks, asians, because they caused them, we'll never solve our problems.It is just a higher level of sophisticated racism. Obfuscating the problem, and thereby masking any solution. One way of building a solution to a problem is confusing the definition of the problem until nobody knows what the heck they mean by anything....and they give up.

Problems aren't being solved these days.

Why?

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

"Cop out?"

Who are you talking to here? No one wrote "cop out", did they?

" Racisnm is a word that is ill-defined. Welcome to the world of guilt. Am I a racist sexist because I am a white male?"

First off, if you feel guilty for anything you have not perpetrated, you need to get a grip. Second, you are not automatically deemed ANYTHING just because you are X-race and/or X-gender. Believing someone is defined that way is exactly where bigotry, racism, ageism, etc. comes into play.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

Believe what you want.

Define what you want.

Discuss what you want.

Recommend what you want.

I would suggest though that the kind of disapproval and anger that you exhibit is generally not a useful place to come from if you want to actually help people.

Compassion and understanding seem to be better for that sort of thing.

If you find people are "tuning you out", and you really want to make a difference, then it would best serve your interests to find another way of communicating.

You're intelligent enough to understand what I've said about racism, sexism, etc. and determine for yourself if you fit into those categories or not.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

Cop out? Racisnm is a word that is ill-defined. Welcome to the world of guilt. Am I a racist sexist because I am a white male?

I have a very short fuse when it comes to guilt. I didn't ask to be here. Hence my rejection of religion. And my rejection of "programs" that don't work, but soothe the guilt of white males.

I think it is about time to define the boundaries of racism. At what point is an opinion (which might call for action) not worthy of discussion because it might make an affected group angry? And is that the definition? Because if it is......we'll never talk out our problems.

And if any recommendation for a solution to poverty, racism, homophobia, etc is unacceptable from whites, blacks, asians, because they caused them, we'll never solve our problems.It is just a higher level of sophisticated racism. Obfuscating the problem, and thereby masking any solution. One way of building a solution to a problem is confusing the definition of the problem until nobody knows what the heck they mean by anything....and they give up.

Problems aren't being solved these days.

Why?

Mike Ford 3 years, 7 months ago

Racism aptly describes fifth and sixth generation immigrants who have benefitted from the free lands and labor their ancestors or ethnic relatives stole, who benefitted from Jim Crow and White Priviledge from the mid 19th to mid 20th century, who began with the Bakke decision to scream injustice after they were the beneficiaries of preference for two centuries. Anytime milestones of racial equality occur these people sound more and more paranoid wanting the racist times of old and justifying their racial superiority by any means possible including religious interpretation and the defunding of programs like what is occuring now. When forced to acknowledge progressive gains these people retreat more and more to political incorrectness and abject stupidity. My parent just rode a passenger train from Kenora, Ontario to Montreal, Quebec City, Ottawa, Toronto, and Windsor. He spent most of his trip being retired clergy speaking to people up there telling them that not everyone in the US is a raging tea party lunatic. These loud dimwits have done a bad PR job for the US in the rest of the world. You should be so proud of your publically defiant ignorance. They have jobs, health insurance, benefits and the like and they can't begin to understand why certain segments of this country's populace are so willfully intolerant. Some of you will flip what I've said like none of you comments of similar attack are a reason for rebuttal. That's a good ole O' Reilly/Limbaugh tactic that gives so many of you away. I was taken to the Lorraine Motel in 1974 by my father and told this is what bad southerners do. The person referencing MLK is speaking good Beck fiction like any U of Beck graduate.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

You seriously need to seek help. Speakin' from the heart, sincerely.

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

How 'bout this one:

"Each group brought to the American fabric a new value, a new point of view, new cuisine, new customs and new languages."

"Yet, we hated them because they were not like us."

How can we accept them for what they are and love some parts, hate other parts, and be indifferent to other parts of their culture? Everybody gets tested, David. What if the Italian culture brings in the Mafia? And I hate it.

Can I say nothing? Am I precluded from saying that I don't like top-down imposition of authoriity? Am I a racist for saying that I don't like the government, the church, the Mafia, or anybody telling me that I have to pay money to the boss so he won't burn down my business?

No David, sometimes we hated them for bringing in stuff that we hated. How can I say that without being shut up and turned out as a racist?

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

Do whatever you like.

The fact is, the author of the letter makes a good point - human beings seem to have a great deal of difficulty getting along with other human beings who are different from them.

Does that mean that if you don't like Indian food, you're a racist? Of course not.

But, the world would in fact be a better place if we learned to live and let live, and accept that there are many differences between cultures, rather than trying to impose our culture on everybody else.

I understand there are places where deeply held principles come into play, such as some of the ones you mention, and I share some of those. The challenge is in sorting out whether they are truly moral principles or simply cultural artifacts.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

And, do you hate Italians because of the Mafia? Or do you hate the Mafia?

Of course, Italians aren't the only ones with gangs, thugs, etc. as well - I'm sure you know that, right?

Why not hate the behavior rather than the culture?

devobrun 3 years, 7 months ago

So I don't hate blacks, but I hate the fathers who sire babies and have no intention of really being fathers? Yep, and I am against all colors of fathers who are deadbeats....its just that there is a culture that is different from mine that doesn't value fathers so much....and there are almost 50% of babies who are fatherless in the black culture.....and I really don't know how I can help, or why I should feel guilty about it.

I didn't father kids and run out. I can't tell black fathers, or anybody black, not to do that. I am an engineer. I don't like helplessness. I see the culture of the African American, and the poverty, unemployment, shiftlessness.....and I feel like I did in Hastings.

Powerless and witnessing and I feel like crying because death awaits the gangbanger and his girl....the girl who was told she was a ......... And I can't do a damn thing about it. No matter how guilty the LTE wants me to feel.

So LTE writer, fix it. You fix it. You make people value good things and be responsible. You do it. I fix things all day long. I know how to fix lots of things. I don't know how to fix deadbeat dads. You fix that problem. And in the mean time, shut up. I don't want your guilt.

ferrislives 3 years, 7 months ago

Although I agree that there is no current purpose for the NAACP, their formation had merit, and that should not be disrespected and ignored.

NAACP History: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National...

Catalyst for the NAACP: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfi...

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

NO, it's not. I'm white. No gettin' around it. And it ain't racist to say so.

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

Feel whatever you like.

If you don't want to feel guilty, don't.

But it sounds like on some level you do actually care, and want to help - if that's the case, there are any number of things you can in fact do.

Why not try some? I'm sure there are many organizations that are trying to help the folks you mention - I knew a woman who helped kids get their GED's - as a teacher you could certainly do that.

CASA is a group that helps advocate for children - from what I've heard, it's an excellent organization.

There are many others - Big Brothers, etc.

jayhawxrok 3 years, 7 months ago

Racism can only live in the heart of a coward

equalaccessprivacy 3 years, 7 months ago

Kansas, like Mississippi, is really only hospitable to a certain type of people---and I really could have gone such a happy lifetime without meeting 99.999% of Kansans. Never has anyone made the character of bigotry so obvious as the harassers here do. Dang, talk about discriminating against thinking people and aggressively going around imposing dumber than dumb assumptions on the world. Cranio-rectal inversion to the nth degree.

tbaker 3 years, 7 months ago

"Some we enslaved and have kept enslaving..." Name these people who are slaves in the United States Mr. Omar.

"...misquoted their religious texts."

You are wrong Mr. Omar. For example, the Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers.

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

Wise up Mr. Omar. Killing in the name of religion has soaked the Earth in blood for millennia. The western world's problems with militant Islam today are no different than they were 1,000 years ago. There is absolutely nothing being misquoted. These pyschos follow every word to the letter. Watch the Daniel Pearl video and see for yourself.

Abdu Omar 3 years, 7 months ago

I can't respond to Mr. Omar's thoughts on this but let me say this. the quotes you have given are taken out of context and do not contain the real truth. Muslims are not required to kill non-believers unless the non-believers oppress the muslim. It is that simple. There is no commandment to do otherwise. God distroys whom He chooses not Muslims. This is a misquote of the text. Ramadan has just ended for Muslims, the month in which the Quran was first revealed to Muhammad. I have just completed reading it most of the way through and never did I find what you allude to. There are passages that take the situation of where the Muslim is being oppressed and held back by non believers and the Muslim is required to get out of the oppression first by changing it with his mouth, then his actions (moving away or demonstrating) then with his hand (going to war) if the first two fail. But if the oppressors stop oppressing, the Muslim is required to stop fighting. But while the oppressor is killing the Muslim, destroying his house and killing his family he is not to stand by and watch it. It is that simple. Terrorists have misquoted the Quran too, and Muslims fight against this with others who fight terrorists. There is no simple answer to terrorism because their recruiting methods are so very wrong.

tbaker 3 years, 7 months ago

I misquoted nothing. I'd didn't say "Muslims" are required to kill. I said those who follow "militant islam" follow these passages literally. They do. Evidence abounds.

beatrice 3 years, 7 months ago

tbaker, are you suggesting that similar statements can't be found in the Christian Bible?

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12)

Please don't pretend such statements are exclusive to the Quran.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

Sure there are, bea. Only very few act on such literal translations today, and they are generally regarded as lunatics. The same can't be said for Al Qaeda and their like.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

...except the 'lunatic' part.........

Abdu Omar 3 years, 7 months ago

There is no such thing as Militant Islam. There are would-be Muslims who want to kill people and try to use the Quran as a reason but, the Quran doesn't permit this at all so we call them terrorists, which is exactly what they are. Not MUSLIM TERRORISTS because Muslims don't believe in terrorism. But some people want Muslims to be the terrorists because they don't understand what Islam is all about. A Muslim terrorist is like saying a "a saintly murderer" although I wouldn't say Muslims are saints.

Every statement in the Quran commanding Muslims to destroy or kill is in self defense of themselves. The first is about oppression of others against the Muslim. He has a right to defend himself and escape the oppression. Second the Muslims are required to be peaceful and never kill. "Killing a man is like killing ALL of mankind and Saving the life of a man is like saving all of mankind". Good thinking, don't you agree?

bradh 3 years, 7 months ago

Misquote religious texts? Let's see, Qur'an:9:5 "Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war." There are a couple of dozen more along that vein.

None of the other groups you mentioned being ostracized were violent. Muslims flew planes into American buildings, Muslims tossed grenades into their fellow Americans military tents in the name of Allah, Muslims shot their fellow Americans in the name of Allah, Muslims are blowing up or trying to blow up planes, ... One third of Muslims are extremists and the other two thirds refuse to condemn their terrorist acts and celebrate when they commit their atrocities. Muslims in America, or abroad, have demonstrated very little reason for trust. I'm aware of hundreds of instances where Muslims have committed or attempted to commit terrorist acts. I'm only aware of one instance where Muslims have reported terrorist acts being planned so they could be stopped. It will take a lot more of the latter to get people to trust a group whose religious texts command them to kill the unbelievers and whose extremist leaders rant about destroying America without any demurring from local Muslims.

Abdu Omar 3 years, 7 months ago

This is where you are mistaken. You don't believe in the passages you quote because you refuse to read all of it. You quote a small part and then assume the Muslims are killing people. This revelation was made in the 7th Century when many were worshipping blocks of stone. This is offensive to God who told Muslims, Jews and Christians to destroy those idols.

No Muslims flew airplanes into the world trade center. A bunch of men or women did who wanted to destroy Islam and called themselves Muslims. If a person does this, they have acted directly against the Islamic Faith and cannot be called Muslims. But, those who are prejudiced against Muslims drag that to the ground. No Muslim can kill innocent people and be a Muslim!

I imagine that Timmothy McVeigh was acting as a Christian in your opinion. In mine he betrayed the Christians and no Christian would claim him. His actions are not Christian or Islamic. He put himself outside of his faith.

No Muslims turn in other Muslims who are terrorists? Come on, use your head. Do you think terrorists come to the Mosque on Fridays? Do you think they make their plans in public? Do you think they have a sign on their backs that says "I'm a terrorist"? These men or women are criminals just like the mafia or other organized criminals. They are not public figures that want to be noticed. They are just as clandestine as the KKK or the other racist bullies in this country. Muslims hate terrorists because they have caused so much damage to the Muslim people. Our reputation of being peaceful was brought to an end by those who hijacked planes and the religion for their purpose of destroying both Islam and America.

It is time people realize that Muslims are part of the fabric of America and don't want to destroy their own homes and businesses. They join the military and fight alongside other Americans and patriots. It is time for the American public to know that Muslims are just like other Americans and want for America the success they want for themselves. Get over the fact that there are over 14 million Muslim Americans.

Mike Ford 3 years, 7 months ago

jaywalker...do realize you're one of he reasons the rest of this world thinks the US is full of raging dimwits????

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

I realize everyone who speaks against you is a "raging dimwit" or a "racist", tusch. That alone should give you pause. But you'd have to be rational first. I wasn't kidding, though. Anyone who walks around with that much hate and bile churning in their heads simply can't be healthy. Talking to a professional could seriously help.

somedude20 3 years, 7 months ago

"There is not enough love and kindness in the world to give any of it away to imaginary beings." -Nietzsche

"Reality is what it is, not what you want it to be." - Frank Zappa

beatrice 3 years, 7 months ago

I have to disagree with those claiming it is just our nature to seek out those like ourselves. In my opinion, we are taught to fear, loathe, or just dislike others unlike us. Prejudice against others not like us isn't part of our inherent nature. Put children of different races together, and they will play without prejudice. Only as they get older and are taught prejudice will they display it. You have to learn what makes the Irish so "Irish."

I name my own ethnicity as example, because I don't see prejudice against the Irish in America anymore, and certainly not as it was earlier in our nation's history. How is it that people could be "naturally" prejudice against the Irish at one period of time but it not be present now? Did we evolve?

Claiming it comes naturally is a defense against questioning prejudice. If we call it natural, then we should apparently accept it. I think it would be wrong to just accept prejudice. It isn't natural, it is taught.

MarcoPogo 3 years, 7 months ago

Someone's been drinking...

(totally kidding)

jafs 3 years, 7 months ago

I agree with you about our inherent nature.

But the question of where prejudice comes from is a compact version of the problem of evil, if you believe humans are naturally good - who taught the first prejudiced person to be prejudiced?

It's a problem I haven't been able to really solve - there are some possibilities, though - when people run into difficulties, they tend to get scared and stressed. Some natural tendencies then seem to be to contract psychologically, and seek allies. Also, there's some sort of "identity formation" that happens as people get older in which they start to identify themselves and distinguish themselves from others - ie. I'm "not that". Then there's the projection of the shadow, as Jung pointed out.

Your question about the Irish actually answers itself - as people got to know actual Irish people, they became less foreign, and therefore less frightening.

Don't you tend to gravitate to others who are similar to you? There's some sort of easy comfort with people that we don't have to explain a lot to, and who share some basic similarities.

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

While I agree that prejudice and hatred are often taught or learned, that still doesn't take away from an inherent tribal mentality. Nor do I believe that such a mentality automatically means someone is prejudiced, but merely that we're comfortable with that which we're familiar. Ray Kroc built an empire on that truism. In Atlanta, there are entire subdivisions where the home owners are all Chinese or Korean or Nigerian or Russian. In Germany and Italy I know city blocks where Americans have gathered. It could simply be a matter of language or food, but when it comes down to it a simple feeling of comfort among those we believe we know is a strong draw.

beatrice 3 years, 7 months ago

Good points, both you and jafs. However, it appears it is the stuff -- language, food, etc... - that draws people to one another, not the people themselves. A bit of a chicken / egg scenario I guess.

Of course, this is a tad late and I doubt either of you will see this response.

equalaccessprivacy 3 years, 7 months ago

Everyone is a little racist song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbud8r...!

All the insufferable Kansans who go around congratulating themselves on their kindness for opening doors for "little old ladies" need to realize stereotypes of all forms are offensive. Likely you are making damaging and limiting judgments about people when you really shouldn't. Most people value their independence and rarely appreciate incompetent persons with a talent for making things worse instead of better getting up in their business.

As soon as such people are asked to respect decent boundaries a large percentage of them show their true inner hatefulness by turning ugly and vindictive. I do see depth, perceptiveness, and soul as widespread Kansan virtues. Most people here just want to spare themselves any effort of thinking by judging others by quick stereotypes. If you were doctors you'd all be sued for malpractice based on the destructive "help" you aggressively impose on others.

Mike Ford 3 years, 7 months ago

jaywalker...I'm rational...I'm a rational person warn out from people having inane discussions that most people in other countries dealt with some time ago. It seems like anytime the old archie bunker culture is about to be walked out the door the archie bunkers rail against change like the luddites they are. They drag anything relevant or not into the conversation to impede the conversation. There's been so much irrelevant bs dragged into the body politic to impede progress that I hold the obstructionist way more responisble for animosity and problems in this country than the president the obstructionists are trying to stymie...btw...to smart people like me...obstructionists are the causes of problems currently. They don't want to accept a minority president...they don't want to accept that in the near future latino and hispanic people will be the majority and they sound like whiners pining for the old days of racism. The more I hear the denial of said people the more I say dimwit. Realize why dumb comments bring out the dimwit designation...it's not an accident...

jaywalker 3 years, 7 months ago

I say again, talk to someone professionally. Your rants cause concern. I can sincerely empathize to any racism you've experienced; and too often lost in your disjointed rants are decent points, i.e. "obstructionists"'. But brother, the vitriol you exhibit with the majority of your posts is exactly how I would characterize the extremists you oppose. Take a page from kings like Gandi or MLK; ease up. Conversation and rational argument change minds; beating people over the head with every act of malice in history no matter the actual subject....spanning history to categorize a broad stroke of people - pigeon-holing a broad group of people as "racists" in a obviously hypocritical manner and labeling such as the mythical "they".....snapping like a viper any time someone dares contradict you.....Well, such behavior deafens any cause you wish to champion.

He who screams loudest, loses.

Mike Ford 3 years, 7 months ago

Daffy I voted for him in 2008 and will do so again in 2012 so you're way off base. Secondly, the people who weren't allowed access to certain water fountains, bathrooms, and places of business were the victims of the people who run from said racist acts and turn logic on it's head and call minorities racist now. I grew up in 1970's Louisiana and Mississippi when busing and integration were all the rage with the majority culture. I saw the Klan in the flesh as a child at the junction of US 90 and MS 57 near Ocean Springs, Misssissippi, in the summer of 1978, going back to Lake Charles, Louisiana, where I lived. I have lived in rural areas, big cities, college towns, blue collar towns excedera in my 41 years. I've observed people since childhood being a PK. Having observed people since childhood I can honestly catagorize many of the cultures I've experienced in my lifetime. I have four markers of racist behavior...One, a desire to omit parts of this countrie's history, Two, attacking the descendants of victims of racial prejudice and blaming them for their treatment, Three, class envy and insecurity, and Four the promoting of reinforcing stereotypes whether it's the southern gentlemen that Ole Miss just got rid off, Stars and Bars, and any Fighting Sioux, Washington Redskins, or Cleveland Indians mascot gear. Who really has the power to maintain these stereotypes??? the majority people with money who shape public opinion.

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