Archive for Monday, August 15, 2011

Election officials want Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to wait on citizenship requirement

August 15, 2011


— Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach’s proposal to move up the date when Kansans must show proof of citizenship to register to vote is not getting good reviews from the people who run elections.

“If you rush implementation of a policy, you have a stronger chance of mistakes,” said Douglas County Clerk Jamie Shew.

He said voting is a constitutional right, “so you don’t want to make a decision on the fly about who gets to participate and who doesn’t get to participate.”

Here’s the issue: The Kansas Legislature and Gov. Sam Brownback during the 2011 legislative session approved two major changes in state election law:

• One change requires voters to show photo ID to vote in 2012.

• The other requires people registering to vote for the first time in Kansas to show proof of U.S. citizenship. But that provision doesn’t take effect until January 2013.

Kobach wants to move that up to March 2012.

“That way, the bulk of the registrations in the 2012 cycle will be properly analyzed for citizenship,” he said.

He said that will prevent noncitizens from voting. He said he will push for this change in the 2012 legislative session, which starts in January. Critics have argued there is no evidence of any problem with people who are not citizens trying to vote in Kansas.

And Shew said the 2012 election cycle is already shaping up as a “perfect storm” of challenges in administering the election, and the additional proof of citizenship requirement would be a big problem.

First, there will be the new photo ID requirement. Second, 2012 is a presidential election year, which increases turnout. The complexity of administering an election during a presidential year increases because many voters in presidential elections haven’t voted since the previous presidential election, so there are numerous voters who have changed addresses.

Third, 2012 will be the first election after the Legislature changes district boundaries during the redistricting process.

Shew said checking birth certificates and other documents to determine citizenship is a much more difficult and time-consuming process than checking a photo ID.

Don Merriman, Saline County clerk and election officer and president of the Kansas County Clerks and Election Officials Association, also said waiting until 2013 for the citizenship check would be better.

“We have a lot of changes” already on tap for the 2012 election, said Merriman. “We are going to have enough of a struggle.”


deec 4 years ago

Which is exactly the point, to make it difficult and confusing to vote, thus inhibiting citizens voting.

optimist 4 years ago

You're right. Why don't we just implement an American Idol like voting system. You can call or text your vote and do so as many times as you can between 7am and 7pm on election day. Now that's convenient.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Voter fraud is the Democrats' preferred method of winning elections. That's why they're gearing up for it nationwide on the most massive scale ever seen in 2012.

The tables are already stacked in favor of Democrats. J. Christian Adams, a former Justice Department lawyer who quit his job in protest over Eric Holder's biased, bigoted refusal to prosecute purveyors of voter intimidation in Philadelphia, has written an excellent article entitled, "The Left Owns the Election Law Industry." Here's the link:

In May of this year, Wisconsin passed a voter picture ID law. This played a major role in preventing voter fraud in the Republicans' win in the recent recall elections. It can't be enforced to early enough in every state in which it has been passed.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Did you read the article I posted, or simply jerk your knee as usual?

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

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monkeyhawk 4 years ago

''Tend to avoid nutcase sites like freerepublic that has an agenda and lacks common sense reporting skills.'

Please enlighten us all as to which outlets you particularly lean towards. I'm sure they will be golden.

Flap Doodle 4 years ago

Does that stand for Barry Soreto? He happens to be the product of Election Fraud Central, otherwise known at the Chicago Political Machine.

rtwngr 4 years ago

Nice reply. Anything else intelligent you would like to add?

Cait McKnelly 4 years ago

Wow, another freeper. (Rolls eyes.) As for WI, I'd say the Republican's didn't exactly win considering they lost two seats. They didn't lose the one crucial seat that would have lost them their majority and barely hung on by the skin if their teeth. But you do realize that other recall elections are coming down the road as soon as their holders qualify, right? At this point it's more of a draw than a win for either side. But hey, spin it they way that makes you feel good.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

"As for WI, I'd say the Republican's (sic) didn't exactly win considering they lost two seats."

Tell that to the Wisconsin public union goons and their left-wing backers all over the world who poured big, big money into these elections and took it in the shorts.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

You disproved your own contention with this sentence--

"The defendants, who were paid employees and supervisors of ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, concocted the scheme as an easy way to get paid, not as an attempt to influence the outcome of elections, King County Prosecuting Attorney Dan Satterberg said"

So this isn't "voter fraud," it's voter registration fraud. And in the handful of times it happened with ACORN employees, it was ACORN that provided the evidence to local authorities.

It's pretty comical that Fox News Drones want to continue playing the ACORN card, even though several investigations have completely cleared that organization that was the target of the yellow journalism of Fox News and its tragicomical collaborators.

But neither Fox News nor its lackeys ever let facts get in the way of a good smear campaign.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

You could have just admitted that you got punked, and left it at that.

Cait McKnelly 4 years ago

I will when you admit that even more money came into the state from corporate sources. And what about those Republican backed mailers that went out to registered Democrats advising them to file absentee ballots...the day AFTER the election? Not to mention the Republicans in sheep's clothing that filed to run as Dems against the incumbents just to force them into holding primaries. Too bad that little dirty trick went nowhere fast. None of them won.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

The only hysteria I've observed here is from leftists on this forum who fear that requiring proof of qualification in voter registration will hurt Democrats. Q.E.D.

jafs 4 years ago

If most folks who would have a hard time obtaining the necessary documents are in fact those in the most disenfranchised segments of society, and those segments tend to vote Democrat, then it's reasonable to think that might in fact happen.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

A picture ID is that hard to obtain? Anyone who doesn't have a picture ID and doesn't care enough to get one in order to vote shouldn't be allowed to vote in the first place. Good grief.

jafs 4 years ago

A picture ID is not sufficient to register for the first time in a state.

Your attitude is exactly the sort that upsets liberals, who feel strongly that even the disenfranchised, which includes people who are apathetic, don't have a lot of free time or extra money, etc. should be able to vote.

How about this? Anyone who isn't well informed and doesn't care enough to become well informed shouldn't be allowed to vote.

Do you agree with that?

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

You said it, jafs: "Apathetic." People who are too apathetic to take a few simple steps to register to vote shouldn't be voting in the first place.

jafs 4 years ago

That's not your call - where is the justification for making it harder for people to vote? If we want our system to work the way it should, we should be making it easier for eligible voters to vote, not harder.

And, it may or may not be that simple for everybody to get the necessary documents to register.

On another story about this, somebody explained how long and difficult it was for them to help somebody obtain a birth certificate - this was a law abiding American citizen.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Jafs, can you get on an airplane without a picture ID? I'll wager you right now that at least half of the very broad cross-section of Americans I've flown with over the last ten years all have picture IDs and haven't voted, because they're apathetic. Certainly some of them have been much more interested in obtaining whatever ID they need to fly than whatever ID they need to vote. It's called apathy, jafs. While it's laudable that you'd like to reduce apathy here, that's been a chronic problem in a spoiled electorate that lives in the most affluent country in the history of the planet, and there's very little you're going to be able to do about it.

jafs 4 years ago

The picture ID isn't as big an issue as the documents necessary to register, which include things like birth certificates and passports.

Thanks - I hope you're not right about that. When 1/2 of the eligible voters don't even vote, our system isn't working very well.

Kirk Larson 4 years ago

A picture ID with a local address. Kobach wants to make sure students don't vote, lot's of renters don't vote, and elderly people who no longer drive don't vote.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Elderly Kansans who no longer drive are still overwhelmingly Republican throughout the state. That can hardly be his motive.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

"Elderly Kansans who no longer drive are still overwhelmingly Republican throughout the state. That can hardly be his motive."

After Republicans do away with Medicare and SS, that won't be the case. But since they can't vote any more, that'll be no problem for Koch warriors like Kobach.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Actually, Bozo, Republicans have been attempting to save Medicare and Social Security. Without reforms, they'll both be bankrupt all too soon. Liberal Democrats have their collective heads in the sand on this issue.

An act crucial to saving Medicare is to repeal Obamacare, which specifically cuts $500 billion from Medicare in order to attempt to pay for Obamacare.

Jimo 4 years ago

Quite a few people don't have picture IDs. I'm sorry you move in such narrow social circles that this is beyond your comprehension. Maybe if you turned off the propaganda and actually worked in your community you'd gain a more realistic perspective on the lives of the needy.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

My guess is that I've worked way, way more in my community than you have, pal.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

"My guess is that I've worked way, way more in my community than you have, pal."

Which ones-- the select few you identify with, or the 80% of the community you totally despise?

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

The intent of this law is not to prevent fraud, which is already essentially non-existent.

The intent is to suppress voter participation of any sort, because that makes the unlimited big money that the Republican corprofascists can throw at increasingly sham elections all the more effective.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago


rtwngr 4 years ago

Talk about a rant! Chill bozo. Your claims of suppressing the vote are spurious and fabricated in your own head. Voter fraud is a favorite tactic of the left and has been for two centuries in this country. The old saying in Chicago is, "Vote early and vote often." Tell me that machine isn't corrupt.

Ralph Reed 4 years ago


First, the proper use is presenting proof of citizenship when registering to vote.

Second, It appears you're making the assumption that "proof of qualification" will hurt only Democrats. During the last election Republicans as well as Democrats were registered during voter drives. Is it your contention that Republicans won't be hurt and that their voter registrations taken during voter registration drives will be all good (for want of a better term).

Regarding the hysteria you perceive. Is concern about voter suppression hysteria? If not, then why not. I contend that it's not hysteria, rather a real concern about the suppression of rights. Am I wrong? If so, why?

Keep in mind that Kobach's law is in reaction to fear mongering on his part and little else. As I understand it, there have been only 9 or 10 instances of voting irregularity reported in Kansas during the past ten years. Only one was investigated and it was found to be without merit.

Finally, who's going to say whether or not a birth certificate is valid? Most tea baggers and all birthers still question the validity of President Obama's birth certificate. Are you willing for the state to be sued for denying someone the right to register to vote when they did in fact have the proper proof? Kobach is not a legislator and can be sued and charged in court. Wouldn't that be interesting?

snitty 4 years ago

Vote counting fraud is the preferred Republican method of winning elections. The vote counting process should be made to be publicly observable and independently verifiable, and "voting machines" should be illegal.

Sean Livingstone 4 years ago

Nice try Cato. You know the real issue here.... most Democratic voters ain't as enthusiastic as Republican voters, and thus many don't bother to show up during election. Republicans want to keep it that way... if voting is required, Democrats would have won most elections... there are more registered Democrats than Republicans.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

"...most Democratic voters ain't as enthusiastic as Republican voters...."

That says volumes, livingstone.

jafs 4 years ago

Sure - it dovetails nicely with my sense that those who feel left out and disenfranchised tend to vote Democratic.

And, that those are the people more likely to be affected negatively by the new voting requirements.

Which is exactly what bozo and others have been saying all along.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Jafs: You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. At some point individual responsibility needs to kick in. What you're saying, of course, is that Democrats are generally irresponsible, so it looks like we finally agree on something..

jafs 4 years ago


That's not what I'm saying, of course.

thebigspoon 4 years ago

And you know--or can demonstrate--that this law prevented voter fraud? This is like saying that the new Kansas law prevents the massive voter fraud that hasn't happened yet. This is worse than smoke and mirrors--it's simply blowing smoke up you know where.

Erin Graham 4 years ago

So.. funny story about this.

A long time ago.. in the far far away land of rural southern Kansas... A young princess went to cast a vote in an election. The evil person manning the polls said "No, young maiden, you cannot vote". "But why?" said the princess. "Because we don't have you down here in the books" said the wicked witch. "But, m'am, I am listed right here in your book." exclaimed the young lady wishing only to vote. "You have a 'U' by your name, child. Which means you are Unregistered" screeched the batty old hag. "But m'am, the 'U' stands for unaffiliated." ... The young lass and batty old hag disagreed for a good while over this. Eventually, the only way the troll would let her through to vote, was for the young lady to fill out a voter registration card THE SAME DAY AS VOTING and register as a Republican. Shortly thereafter, a complaint was filed.. but the fair young lady's affiliation had not changed in the system, so no one believed her and she assumed the Poll Troll never filed the card. A couple of years later, it was discovered that the princess had, unbeknownst to her, transformed into a Republican. Within the week, with the wave of her magic ink wand, she was once again transformed back to her true self. THE END.

Moral of the story, Cato- Please don't pretend Republicans or Tea Party whackos (or whoever you identify with) are total saints. There are good seeds and bad seeds throughout the political spectrum.

rtwngr 4 years ago

Hey, Erin, why don't you and Charles Gruber get together at the new library, when it opens, and have story time.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Erin, it's "wackos." I'd suggest that you take rtwngr's advice and spend some time at the library.

grammaddy 4 years ago

Because non -citizen voting is sucha big problem, right? Wake up folks.The people that are affected by the new rules generally vote Dem. That's what this is really all about, along with re-districting.It makes it much easier to steal an election if you can keep everyone confused.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

"The people who are affected by the new rules generally vote Dem."

Thanks for proving my point.

jafs 4 years ago

It doesn't prove your point.

Jimo 4 years ago

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somebodynew 4 years ago

Here are my thoughts. IF the Dems were actually doing such massive amounts of voter fraud, they must be really, really bad at it based on who won all the elections last time. SO, if they are that bad at it, why would the Reps want to change anything???? It sure seems to me they won most everything last time (at least here in Kansas).

And I just cannot understand why a person here illegally (the "focus" of this law) and who tries to avoid any contact with authorities of any kind, would make an effort to illegally vote and perhaps attact attention to him/her self and get deported.

This is KKK pushing his agenda and furthing BB to be in charge of everything.

andreainkansas 4 years ago

Particularly because a non citizen who votes or even registers to vote commits a false claim to citizenship and thus deportable/inadmissible. A false claim to citizenship is, perhaps with the exception of genocide perpetration or Nazi ties, the ground of inadmissibility/deportability that is by far the most difficult to waive. It results in deportation and permanent bars to re-entry. In non-lawyer-speak, that means it's almost possible to stay legally with a false claim to citizenship and almost entirely impossible to ever return legally or "fix" your papers. No non-citizen is intentionally attempting to register to vote or voting with knowledge that he/she is a noncitizen. It's just not happening, folks. No matter what fairy tales Kobach is trying to tell you.

andreainkansas 4 years ago

Sorry, that's should read almost impossible, not possible.

KS 4 years ago

Gosh! They have months to get this up and running. No wonder the govt is a mess. The private sector would have it up and running next week!

overthemoon 4 years ago

like we'd want a private profit driven business to run our voting process??? right.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

This is just fine as far as KK is concerned. The goal of this law is primarily to keep his name in the news, and this latest bit of controversy accomplishes that.

jafs 4 years ago

I'd like for the organization that monitors elections all over the world to examine ours and certify them free and fair.

As far as I know, we wouldn't currently receive that rating from them.

Ralph Reed 4 years ago



The last I heard the US refused to allow the international election monitoring organizations to monitor our elections.

God forbid they even come the Kansas.

jafs 4 years ago

That's a bit depressing, isn't it?

somedude20 4 years ago

What does it matter anymore? Kobach and Brownback are agents of satan but the "good" people of Kansas love em and give em their full support. I am at a point where I do not blame KKKobach or Butback anymore, rather I blame the dumb imbeciles who support them. KKKansas has jumped the shark, big time!!!!

monkeyhawk 4 years ago

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lunacydetector 4 years ago

why do democrats protest free and fair elections?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

Ah, the old "have you stopped beating your wife?" ploy.

somedude20 4 years ago

why do republicans like hanging chads and cheating?

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

Labeling an insightful piece from a former attorney with the Department of Justice a "freeper link" is the weakest "response" imaginable. Until you provide credible evidence refuting what he says, you're just giving yourself the death penalty.

cato_the_elder 4 years ago

I'm still waiting for the credible evidence, weakling.

optimist 4 years ago

"Critics have argued there is no evidence of any problem with people who are not citizens trying to vote in Kansas."

I don't know that this is a problem or isn't a problem. "Critics" must think the rest of us are fools. Without a mechanism in place to verify that voters are voting legally there is no way of knowing. Some appear to be so concerned with the convenience of voting that they are willing to ignore the potential for fraud in the election system. We as citizens have an obligation to take part even if it isn't convenient. The integrity of the election should be the priority here, not convenience.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

Mechanisms were already in place-- at least enough to prevent people from doing something that they have no incentive to do, and is pretty easily detected if there is ever an organized effort to do so-- the only way it could ever affect the outcome of an election.

But you certainly have bought into the paranoia that's been preached to you.

Kim Murphree 4 years ago

See, that's just the issue...the problem is that you are taking away the right to vote from people who don't have i.d.--maybe they are poor, maybe they are disabled, maybe they just don't live in your world of middle classness or even upper lower classness, but they are still citizens of this country. And they should not be prevented from voting or even discouraged from voting by these kinds of policies---that's the problem---the trade off for your "preventative" measures is that we are keeping our fellow citizens from taking part in the democratic process--and that's a price that's way to high. Too many people make judgments about why a person doesn't have an i.d. without walking a mile in that person's may be that voting is one of the few priviledges a person has who has no money and no car...but is still a citizen. The politics are clear--Kobach wants to prevent those who have less from exercising their right to vote because he knows those votes won't be for him---that's an abuse of power...its unethical and should be challenged.

optimist 4 years ago

Okay. There were only 7 complaints over a 5 year period. That doesn't mean that there aren't hundreds or thousands of intentional violations every election that we don't know about. The integrity of the election system or the lack of it will serve more to repress voting than requiring American citizens provide the same documentation required to obtain employment when registering to vote. This is a legitimate role of government which isn't necessarily subject to a simple cost benefit analysis. I only wish liberals would apply cost benefit analysis when government is spending money in ways it shouldn't, say national healthcare.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

"That doesn't mean that there aren't hundreds or thousands of intentional violations every election that we don't know about. "

Actually, that's exactly what it means.

Ralph Reed 4 years ago

So, because you couldn't counter his statement, you chose to attack Jamie directly.

We all can assume then that you agree with what he said. If not, why not?

Ralph Reed 4 years ago

So my saying you attacked Jamie directly is an attack on you? How is that?

Tell us also why his statement is wrong, or why you disagree with it. Asking that is not a personal attack, is it?

irvan moore 4 years ago

I think if you researched mr. Shew you would find that he has put a lot of effort into increasing voter turnout (which is very low) in Douglas county, that includes conservative voters too. having to show a government issued id in order to enjoy the constitutional rights that are granted to us is just another way of taking away those rights.

Keith 4 years ago

Wow, the rain has kept all the right wing nutcases inside at their computers all morning.

Don Whiteley 4 years ago

I'd say there's a very high number of left wing, radical nut cases at work here. It's to the very obvious advantage of the Democratic party to postpone enforcement of the law as long as possible. The more illegal and unregistered voters they can get to the polls, the better they will do.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

"The more illegal and unregistered voters they can get to the polls, the better they will do."

Got any evidence of this, or just Glenn Beck's blackboard?

Jimo 4 years ago

It's useful to keep in mind the underlying cause of this effort to depress voter turnout.

It is no longer possible to election a national Republican candidate without limiting Democratic voting for the simple reason that the core of the GOP--white voters--is too small to be victorious given that roughly 1/3rd of them are left-wing in orientation. And they get smaller day by day.

Republicans long ago consciously chose to abandon a century old position as the Party of Lincoln in return for Southern Dixiecrats (Dixiecans?), failed despite some initial promise to attract Hispanic voters, and even now get no interest in Jewish voters.

In short, Republicans can no longer win a clean election and now must either change (fat chance) or engage in rearguard action to hold back the inevitable for as long as possible.

ferrislives 4 years ago

cato, it's not like the GOP would ever do election fraud: Americans for Prosperity: Wrong date a 'printing mistake' -

And how about those people on the right calling voters with the wrong election date during the last election? It happens on both sides my little partisan.

Jimo 4 years ago

The only documented case of voter fraud in recent years was Mitt Romney, who claimed he was living in his son's unfinished basement so he could vote in Mass.

Like so much else with today's GOP, you have to translate the garden variety term for the real message. When Republican's say voter fraud they merely mean not voting Republican.

So, the next time you see a statement like 'Voter fraud is the Democrats' preferred method of winning elections" translated into English this means "Voting for a Democrat is the Democrats' preferred method of winning elections." Everyone knows that if voters would just vote Republican, Democrats would never win an election.

Sure, it's a juvenile claim but after watching the Tea Party in action who would seriously believe that they're adults?

verity 4 years ago

Since corporations are people, shouldn't they all get a vote/votes? Are they people or a person? Should they each get one vote or allotted votes according to size? Maybe each shareholder should get a vote? (That's besides the one they get as a private person.)

If corporations are people and are not allowed to vote, we are unlawfully suppressing their vote and that is voter fraud.

Kontum1972 4 years ago

during the presidental election i went to vote. I had my voter ID, my DL and my govt ID the bozo running the shop was disputing the validity of my ID's, after a few phone calls i was allowed to vote...all this dude needed was a black comb-over a brown-shirt and a little mustache and he would of won first place.

I took 3 cookies and left...

overthemoon 4 years ago

in 08? These laws weren't in place then and they had no business asking for id, unless you did a provisional ballot if you weren't registered?

Kim Murphree 4 years ago

Keep standing up to those who would deny citizens their right to vote, Jamie! This voter fraud NON-issue is just that...a waste of taxpayer time and money, an agenda to prohibit more poor people from voting, and a grandstand for the neo-con (all he needs is a sheet) Kobach.

Flap Doodle 4 years ago

"The only documented case of voter fraud in recent years was Mitt Romney..." Wrong again, bub.

jesse499 4 years ago

Sure alot of people willing to to let someone from another country vote on their laws and rights.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

I don't wear a kevlar suit 24/7, either. Does that mean I'm allowing someone to shoot me to death?

jafs 4 years ago

Actually, it's decisions like the Citizens United decision by the conservative Supreme Court, that open the floodgates for non-Americans to influence our political process.

Ralph Reed 4 years ago

"Of course, maybe the political activity is only a couple dozen posters who occupy this award-winning site and everyone else doesn't give a R*T's A@@? Comments, anyone, anyone?"

Paul, The polls I've worked sometimes have a less than 10% turn-out. There was one election when the poll had only 8 people come to vote.

jesse499 4 years ago

Your name said it all but anyway they would be voting on a lot more then just school board .And as far as the other you know that spot where the sun doesn't shine.

FloridaSunshine 4 years ago

I don't blame you, tange...a perfect act of rebellion against LJW!!! I took one (a nap) Saturday AND Sunday after I realized there would be no "Faith Forum"...I had emailed Jon (and anyone else "back there" who knows about these mishaps) three times over Saturday and Sunday to inquire about it...and simply decided to rebel by taking naps. So, there, Jon, and the rest of you!!! That'll teach you to not respond to the readers' questions/email...!! We'll take naps!!! That'll teach ya!! Oh, also, I want what I preview to come out exactly as the preview...with capital letters where they should be, etc. Ya got that, Jon?...or I'll just take another nap!! So, there!!!

FloridaSunshine 4 years ago

Leave it to Ben Stein to have the answer to our problems (even as a nation! ha!)'s lack of sleep. Who woulda thunk it?? Now I understand why so many posters on LJW are "grouchy", "fearful", "unwell"....they're either not sleeping enough hours at night...or not napping to make up for the loss!!

I finally HAD to take allergy med last night and have been feeling "sickly" ever since. Maybe I didn't take enough naps over the weekend...I think Ben is right...I'm adding more hours of sleep to my schedule. Thanks again for some great laughs, tange.

Erin Graham 4 years ago

ohhhh wow. I just lawled. +1 , tange. Please make this into a tshirt??? You could sell them at rallys in Topeka ;).. or Lawrence :o)

yourworstnightmare 4 years ago

I agree with Kobach's approach in one respect.

Voting policies and procedures should be made uniform nationally, certainly in national elections. It is crazy that each state and even each election district can have their own policies and procedures. That is where the real fraud can occur.

We should have computer voting and a national voting ID with encoded congressional districts such that anyone can vote anywhere at any time, so long as they have their national voting ID.

Also, voting should be done over a week-long period including a weekend.

Let's join with Kris Kobach to standardize voting policies and procedures nationally.

jhawkinsf 4 years ago

Uniformity in national elections sounds good. But I suspect the cost would be prohibitive. And with technology advancing at breakneck speeds, each election cycle would need new procedures, guaranteeing high costs forever. Other than that, sounds good to me.

ivalueamerica 4 years ago

There have been dozens of studies that shows these type of regulations do a lot more than eliminating a very small amount of voter fraud, they also disenfranchise the poor and minorities. Keeping Americans from voting through regulations written by extreme conservatives is an assault and American Values.

Sigmund 4 years ago

"He (Jamie Shew, Douglas County Clerk) said voting is a constitutional right, “so you don’t want to make a decision on the fly about who gets to participate and who doesn’t get to participate."

Since there is NO affirmative "constitutional right" to vote in the US Constitution (unless it is next to the part that says "from each according to their abilities, to each according to their need" and I haven't gotten to that part), Mr. Shew must be referencing the Kansas Constitution.

Article 5, §1. of the Kansas Constitution clearly gives the right to vote to those who reside in Kansas and are "citizens of the United States." Article 5 § 4 provides "The legislature shall provide by law for proper proofs of the right of suffrage."

Since the legislature is required by the Kansas Constitution to provide by law for proper proofs of the right of suffrage, Mr Shew should be more concerned about fulfilling his duties under the law or find another job he can do. Following the law is hardly "making a decision on the fly."

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

We've managed to get by with the previous "proper proofs of the right of suffrage" for 150 years or so, and there is essentially zero evidence of votes by folks not qualified to do so.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

Why is it that those folks promoting and erecting new hurdles to voting can't at least be honest about their motives? After all, there is no fraud, so it can't be eliminated.

TinmanKC 4 years ago

I have been an election worker in Johnson County for the past 12 years. All of Kobach's new rules change the role of an election worker from an administrative role to an enforcement role. In the historical process, voters signed the election book, certifying under penalty of perjury that they were the person listed, lived at the address listed, and had not previously voted. There's never been any fraud proven in that system. In the new process, the election workers will check each ID, verify that the picture matches the person, verify that the address on the ID matches the registration address. If anything doesn't match, the voter will then have to vote a provisional ballot which requires them to fill out a new voter registration form, vote on paper, have that paper ballot counted by hand (one week after the election during the canvass). I'll be interested to see how voters will react to all the extra hoops they will have to jump through to vote - if they forgot to update their drivers license after a move, or the address doesn't match EXACTLY. (Yes, Kris... that's what you have created) Prepare to wait longer in line to vote, pay to have more election workers on hand, and significantly increase the number of provisional ballots and the cost to count those. (Yes, Kris... that's what you have created) With a spike in provisional ballots (which are not counted on election night) also expect to see more races that can not be called on election night. (Yes, Kris... that's what you have created)

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 4 years ago

Yes, but it keeps his name in the news-- something that rarely happened with his predecessors in the Sec. of State's office. Just call him PT Kobach, busy lining up suckers for his next election.

verity 4 years ago

I haven't always voted in every election because sometimes I didn't feel I knew enough about candidates to vote (i.e. school board or city council).

However, I will now vote in every election, no matter how trivial, and most likely I will vote a straight Democratic ticket (Sandy Praeger might be an exception).

Others want to sign the pledge?

Sam and Kris may not be so happy with what they have wrought if the Democrats come out in full force.

Sigmund 4 years ago

TinmanKC (anonymous) says… "I'll be interested to see how voters will react to all the extra hoops they will have to jump through to vote - if they forgot to update their drivers license after a move, or the address doesn't match exactly."

Then they will vote a provisional ballot, as you said.

TinmanKC (anonymous) says… "Prepare to wait longer in line to vote, pay to have more election workers on hand, and significantly increase the number of provisional ballots and the cost to count those."

It's more important to get the results correct than to get them quick.

jafs 4 years ago

As long as you're willing to pay higher taxes to pay for that - are you?

Sigmund 4 years ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (anonymous) replies… "We've managed to get by with the previous "proper proofs of the right of suffrage" for 150 years or so, and there is essentially zero evidence of votes by folks not qualified to do so."

That is not the same as stating there was no fraud, just that it wasn't detected. There is zero evidence of fraud because there was little or no process or procedures in place to detect or prevent fraud. The new requirements are meant to prevent possible frauds in the future and there is absolutely no indications that any political party would be impacted more or less than any other, with the possible exception of the Amish who have no need for a drivers license and are probably members of the TEA party anyway.

Not only are the new laws fully consistent with the Kansas Constitution, they don't even come close to violating the 15th Amendment of the the US Constitution which prohibits deny the vote based upon "race, color, or previous condition of servitude." I would think everyone interested in democracy would be in favor of minimal controls to insure the integrity of elections.

Sigmund 4 years ago

Just how comfortable am I with Jamie Shew who claims it may be too difficult for him to follow current law? Not very. Douglas County should consider replacing him immediately unless he can assure the Commission that current Kansas law can and will be fully complied with.

You know, comrades," says Stalin, "that I think in regard to this: I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this — who will count the votes, and how. Boris Bazhanov, Memoirs of Stalin's Former Secretary

Jonathan Kealing 4 years ago

FYI, the County Clerk is an elected position. He doesn't report to the County Commission.

Sigmund 4 years ago

jkealing (Jonathan Kealing) replies… "FYI, the County Clerk is an elected position. He doesn't report to the County Commission."

I stand corrected Jonathan!

Sigmund 4 years ago

antichristobserver … "Think you just validated how clueless the Tea Party followers are."

While I do see your many your ad hominen attacks on various posters, I completely missed any correction of facts you have made to any of my 5,640 posts.

Sigmund 4 years ago

(Jonathan Kealing) replies… "FYI, the County Clerk is an elected position. He doesn't report to the County Commission."

Could you remind me not to vote for this guy?

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