Archive for Sunday, November 21, 2010

Kobach challenging in-state tuition rates for undocumented students

Former Kansas Republican Party chairman Kris Kobach on Tuesday filed to run for his party's nomination for Kansas secretary of state.

Former Kansas Republican Party chairman Kris Kobach on Tuesday filed to run for his party's nomination for Kansas secretary of state.

November 21, 2010


Students enrolled in fall 2010 under provisions of a Kansas law extending in-state tuition rates to illegal immigrants who meet certain criteria.

Public universities

Emporia State University — 2

Fort Hays State University — 25

Kansas University (including KU Medical Center) — 14

Kansas State University — 15

Pittsburg State University — 1

Washburn University — 1

Wichita State University — 4

Public university subtotal: 62

Community colleges

Allen County — 0

Barton County — 8

Butler County — 63

Cloud County — 0

Coffeyville — 0

Colby — 0

Cowley County — 0

Dodge City — 17

Fort Scott — 2

Garden City — 15

Highland — 0

Hutchinson — 8

Independence — 2

Johnson County — 84

Kansas City, Kan. — 55

Labette — 0

Neosho County — 0

Pratt — 1

Seward County — 68

Community College subtotal: 323

Technical institutions

Flint Hills Technical College — 10

Manhattan Area Technical College — 0

North Central Kansas Technical College — 0

Northwest Kansas Technical College — 0

Salina Area Technical College — 4

Wichita Area Technical College — 14

Technical Institution subtotal: 28

Grand Total: 413

Kansas Secretary of State-elect Kris Kobach is challenging a California law that provides in-state tuition rates to illegal immigrants who qualify under a certain set of rules and regulations.

Though the California Supreme Court upheld the law this week, Kobach told the San Francisco Chronicle he would appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court and said California loses millions of dollars each year because the state doesn’t require undocumented students to pay the out-of-state rate. He called the ruling “very weak.”

Kansas is one of 10 states with such laws that could be affected by the outcome of the case. In all, 413 such students are enrolled this fall at the state’s public universities, community colleges and technical institutions. Kansas University and KU Medical Center have 14 students who receive in-state tuition under the law.

The law, which passed in 2004, allows undocumented immigrants to receive in-state tuition if they:

• Have attended a Kansas high school for three or more years.

• Have graduated from a Kansas high school or obtained a GED certificate in Kansas.

• Have filed an affidavit stating the student — or the student’s parents — has filed an application to legalize the student’s immigration status or for citizenship or will do so as soon as the person is eligible to do so.

The number of students benefiting from the law has risen since 2005, when 221 students were enrolled under the law’s provisions.

Gary Sherrer, chairman of the Kansas Board of Regents, said that it was in the best interest of the state for young people — who came to the state when they were very young — to have access to a good education.

He said it would be “nonsense” to penalize these students for a decision they had no control over.

“I personally find it repugnant that these young men and women who have proven themselves are being batted around for purely political motives,” Sherrer said.

More than three-fourths of the students who benefit from the law are enrolled in community colleges. Only 62 are at the state’s public universities.

Many of those students are caught in the middle and can’t apply for citizenship yet when they apply for college, Sherrer said. When these students do become citizens, Sherrer said, he wants them to have as much education as possible so they can contribute to the state.

Kobach, who is involved in other out-of-state lawsuits involving illegal immigration, also helped draft an Arizona anti-immigration law that gained national attention earlier this year.

He did not respond to calls or e-mail seeking comment for this story.

Jack Martin, a KU spokesman, deferred questions to the regents, who set legislative proposals for the state’s higher education system.

“It’s a state law, so we’re following state law,” Martin said. “It’s not something that’s on our radar as far as changing it.”

At KU, Kansas residents pay $7,875 in tuition for an average yearly course load, while nonresidents pay $20,680.50.


llama726 3 years, 4 months ago

@ Agnostick:

You suggested:

"First offense: Fine of $1 million for each undocumented illegal immigrant on the work site. Five illegal workers means $5 million.

Second offense: Seizure of all holdings and assets of the business, arrest warrants for the business owners. Business closed for 30 days, then auctioned off to highest-bidding, law-abiding citizen. Receipts of auction to Internal Revenue for back taxes owed.

It'll be interesting to see which traitorous coward speaks out against this..."

That's a stiff penalty, and really targets the cause of illegal immigration. Our government will never follow a policy anything like that for two reasons:

1) That is an "anti business" philosophy. It's not really, but it is for the intents and purposes of the people who run businesses in this country who hire illegal immigrants, businesses which are likely greater in number than most people realize. However, all forms of business regulation in the US are callously disregarded as anti business, job killing, or economy destabilizing when they are proposed, making them exceptionally difficult to pass.

2) The solution targets the logical cause of the problem, and our government is composed of the individuals we elect emotionally rather than rationally, so they govern emotionally rather than rationally on hot button issues.


George Lippencott 3 years, 4 months ago


I believe you are accurate. Unfortunately. I prefer to punish the guilty not their offspring.


George Lippencott 3 years, 4 months ago


I guess I will not let your Texas statement stand. The following states do not tax personal income: Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Texas, Washington, and Wyoming. Couple of points. Other than Sunbelt states do not tax income. California, Arizona, New Mexico, Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama tax personal income – they are sunbelt states.

The only data I supplied is that there are a higher proportion of military members claiming residence in Sunbelt state. I have no specific data on Texas. Do you or is your assertion motivated by envy that military members may not pay income taxes if they are resident of states that do not tax personal income and you do???

I also have seen statistical and historic data that reflects that there are a disproportionate number of military personnel from the “heart land” and the south. The data on state residence may simply reflect home of origin and not specifically an attempt to avoid taxes.

I remind you of my statement that most military members are enlisted or lower grade officers the majority of whom do not have children in College.

I restate that it appears to me you are pulling a Koebacb by making an issue out of a limited occurrence event. I have no data on how many military dependents who are legal residents of Kansas (lived here a year) and who graduated from a Kansas High School, actually attend a Kansas institution of higher education. Do you?

To restate my position. I believe that the “"sins" of the father should not be levied upon the son/daughter”. Ax far as I am concerned anybody who graduates from a Kansas High School and who has lived here a year should be considered an instate resident regardless of whether his/her father/mother is a resident of another state or a nonresident of the United States.


coolmom 3 years, 4 months ago

I was born and raised in Lawrence, I attended K.U for 3 years and the hubby graduated 3rd in his class from the school of eng. We accepted the best job we could and moved our small family to California although if there had been good jobs in Kansas we would have stayed. We have a daughter thats a high school senior this year and we dearly wish we could send her back to Kansas to school to be a Jayhawk where she was born. Out of state tuition is over 20,000 and thats not counting room and board or books or anything else for this kid that will either end up as a doc or eng. pretty sad.


Gest 3 years, 4 months ago

It's sad that he even has to fight this battle. It should be common sense for any country/state that wishes to protect its tax payers' interests.


Oracle_of_Rhode 3 years, 4 months ago

Demagogy or demagoguery is a strategy for gaining political power by appealing to the prejudices, emotions, fears and expectations of the public—typically via impassioned rhetoric and propaganda ...


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

Gatekeeper. Huh shrugging shoulders?

Kobach is being groomed for national office after the President Obama years are over.

I spent 2 weeks a year for 18 years working out of Hayward Ca. I know CA. Great state, but the chip owners are calling in for pay.


Agnostick 3 years, 4 months ago

While I agree with a good portion of Kobach's arguments/attitudes towards illegal immigration, I chose not to vote for him. He's greatly obsessed with this one issue, which means he's at a much greater risk of screwing up some other aspect of his duties... overlooking something not related to illegal immigration. Thornburgh will be leaving some massive shoes to fill, and I don't think Kobach will even be in town enough for his staff to remember what he looks like.

As to the issue of tuition rates for children of illegal aliens: We do need to figure out something fair and equitable. Like it or not, it's just not fair to heap punishments and penalties on young people who were either too young to engage in any sort of self-determination when their parent(s) stole their way across the border... or weren't even born yet. Maybe a third rate, or a formula of some type can be used to determine their tuition. Maybe the mid-point between in-state and out-of-state rates? This would be in addition to all the other requirements zstoltenberg pointed out @ 9:37a.m. November 22nd.

And while we're teaching these young people how to properly apply for citizenship and follow the law... we need to start teaching certain employers how to "follow the law," too. Regular raids on construction sites, processing plants, restaurants, all businesses.

First offense: Fine of $1 million for each undocumented illegal immigrant on the work site. Five illegal workers means $5 million.

Second offense: Seizure of all holdings and assets of the business, arrest warrants for the business owners. Business closed for 30 days, then auctioned off to highest-bidding, law-abiding citizen. Receipts of auction to Internal Revenue for back taxes owed.

It'll be interesting to see which traitorous coward speaks out against this...


autie 3 years, 4 months ago

Kobach is nothing more than a grandstander, out there getting his name in the paper. I'm not sure what his agenda is in all this non consequential tuition business other than showing the world Kansas is home to a few grade A racist.


whats_going_on 3 years, 4 months ago

I see absolutely nothing wrong with this law.

I don't think you can complain about people wanting "handouts" while at the same time trying to deny them a college education.

Makes no freaking sense, good job.


lsjogren 3 years, 4 months ago

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lsjogren 3 years, 4 months ago

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Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago hit the nail on the head. Why reward illegal behaviors? Legally here honest green card workers are sent home routinely for doing the right thing. I see no argument here.

gatekeeper..........Why would a conservative constitutional law professor as Kobach draw the ire of your conservative parents? Details please. Perhaps your parents enjoy watching California go bankrupt dealing with the illegal immigration problem now spinning totally out of control. California hospitals closing down, schools not able to teach, and worse the cutting back entitlements to people who paid in often for entire lives.

Furthermore, I do not see how you could drop the R word. It's about law. It's simply about the law. It's about illegal immigration.


gatekeeper 3 years, 4 months ago

Can someone explain to me why conservatives want to scream state's rights when it suits what they want, but then turn around and talk about federal law when it suits them better?

When it comes to any and all immigration issues, which is it? When you say anything about the Arizona law it's all state's rights, blah blah blah. Now Kobach wants to push the federal law.

My parents, true old time conservatives, call Kobach much worse than an idiot. My poor mother asks god to forgiver her before calling him the pet names she has for that low life scum. He is not a good person and uses political office to further his hateful, racist agenda. As my mom says, he is not a Christian.


Zachary Stoltenberg 3 years, 4 months ago

I'm a conservative, not necessarily a Republican, definitely not a TEA partier (not as it is now anyway, the TEA party was grea until they were taken over by that nut-job Palin) and I was an out of state student at KU for six years. My final year before gaining residency I was paying over $22,000 a year to attend the University. I was a sophomore when it was brought about and I had a BIG problem with this change. I cracked off many of the talking points voiced here and was firmly convinced that it was against the constitution of the United States. About a year later I was driving home and heard an excellent debate of the topic on a conservative radio talk show who's guest was an advocate of the change. Over the hour and a half of debate, I found myself agreeing more and more with the guest and less and less with the host. Here was the way it was presented that changed my position.

The individuals (illegals) that qualify to take advantage of this program must meet many different requirements, paramount of which is starting a path to citizenship. Not only them, but their entire families. That's what everyone against illegal immigration seems to want right? If you want government aid (FAFSA) then become a citizen and get it! These families do pay taxes for the most part and don't get anything on a federal return like you and I do. They pay sales tax on everything they buy, property taxes whether they own or rent, the only thing missing from the equation is citizenship and this program closes that gap. Secondly, they must be residents of that state. They must have attended high school in Kansas for three years and they must have graduated in Kansas. Guess what? If I had attended and graduated from a Kansas high school for three years, I would have gotten in-state tuition as well! These individuals must also maintain an eligible GPA to stay in the program and make progress towards citizenship or they risk being removed from the program and risk losing everything they have worked for so-far. As a college student who spent one semester on academic probation (it only took one to get my butt in gear) I probably couldn't have met that requirement. In some senses, these 'illegals' are held to a higher standard that either in-state or out-of-state citizens are.

The bottom line is, there really isn't any special or preferential treatment in the program. It isn't an incentive to come here illegally, (don't get me started on anchor babies) in fact it's only incentive is to go back and do it right. You and your family need to become citizens if you are going to take advantage of the education and government assistance this wonderful country affords. When you look at the statistics of what illegal individuals cost us as taxpayers every year, we cannot afford NOT to have this program. Make them go through the process to become legal, help them go to school, and turn them into productive taxpayers. So what's the problem here Mr. Kobach?


George Lippencott 3 years, 4 months ago

Bea and llama

The injustice visited upon me when I was a student and upon my wife when she was a dependent have long been corrected (although not before significant costs to both of us). This all was a test to determine motivation. Some flunked. You too did better.

Fior the record Llama. I did have a GI bill and used it to get my teacher training and a masters degree (kids today have to pay for their GI bill and it is a lot less generous). Dependents like the wife at my time of service fit into the old adage "if the army wanted you to have one they would have issued one." The system (Kolbachs of that day, made it very hard on her and there was no offsetting benefit. That too has been fixed to a significant degree although IMHO teacher certification at a national level is still broken.


Roland Gunslinger 3 years, 4 months ago

Kobach can challenge the ruling all he wants. He'll still lose. The court interpreted the law correctly as it is written.

If Californians don't want illegals to be able to pay in-state tuition rates then they need to change their law to say so. As it is written all they have to do is have graduated from a California HS and had to of been in the California school system for minimum of 3 years in order to receive that benefit.


PortTabacco 3 years, 4 months ago

Why is Plyer vs Doe being used in California when this law was strictly for the state of Texas? Plyer vs Doe stated that illegal alien student could enroll in Texas public school ONLY if the illegal students were not anyway a burden financially to the state of Texas! This was back in 1981! Things have changed today and for the worst!

Illegal aliens are now a burden to each and ever state in the U.S. because we are now in a DEPRESSION!

    Kris Kobach is an American hero and all parasitic illegal aliens should be deported!

Joshua Montgomery 3 years, 4 months ago

My forefathers didn't cross the Atlantic ocean only to see this country overrun by immigrants!

I still have my great-great-grandfather's certificate from Ellis Island proving that I, like Kobach, am a TRUE American.


kernal 3 years, 4 months ago

After skimming the posts, it's still apparent too many people in this state do not have a clear understanding of what the Secretary of State job is, so here you go:


jackbinkelman 3 years, 4 months ago

Good gawd kobach. give it a rest. How do we recall this joker?


somemisfits 3 years, 4 months ago

Did he get beat out by a Mexican for the high school baseball team or something? The dude's definitely got an agenda.


George Lippencott 3 years, 4 months ago

Well Bea, that is exactly the point but not the way you present it. If those supporting in state tuition for illegal aliens have a morale basis for their argument then they would have found it just as abhorrent that the wife and I were charged out of state tuition despite having become legal citizens of the state we were in – even to the point of denying a change of status after a year.

The fact that several people though that it was just fine because we were military and by their argument somehow avoided taxes (which we did not) suggests that all this fuss is a political diatribe about making Democratic Party voters out of illegal immigrants and not about the moral argument of the sins of the parent should not be visited upon the son/daughter or in our case wife.

I restate – a bunch of you are hypocrites or worse.


beatrice 3 years, 4 months ago

Not even in office yet, and he is already more concerned about playing political theater than looking at matters that truly concern citizens. His only goal in making these claims is that he wants people to know that he really, really, really doesn't like illegals.


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

llama, your math is correct if the illegal students were dropped on Kansas by an airplane with food, housing and plenty of money. Of course they are not. I've heard illegal immigrant arguments about paying fair share taxes for decades. This does not exist.

It's typical "lib o guilt" thinking. I wonder how you folks justify a poor Syrian green card worker being sent home, who complies with the law of the land honesty for instance. Yes, what do you think of immigrants who follow our law? Shouldn't we be announcing, "hey man do it illegally and be rewarded."


witchfindergeneral 3 years, 4 months ago

"“I personally find it repugnant that these young men and women who have proven themselves are being batted around for purely political motives,” Sherrer said"

This is truly a shocker. As far as I know, Kobach has no history whatsoever of promoting racially-charged, largely impractical, and highly symbolic legislation to score cheap points in a game of political ping-pong.


camper 3 years, 4 months ago

I'm no expert in the In State tuition requirement, but my take on the provision is that it is about residency status not citizenship. If you are a resident of a state, and therefore paying sales and other taxes in that state, you are eligible. If you are not a resident of the state, you have not necessarily been paying sales and other taxes to that state, and are therefore not eligible.

When I 1st moved to Kansas I was interested in seeking an advanced degree at KU. I was informed that I was not eligible for in state tuition because I had not lived in the state for one-year. I was disappointed, but not outraged, because the requirement seemed reasonable to me. So if this status is revoked for undocumented workers, I would not feel one way or the other, just as I do now under the current provision.

My only complaint is.....why are the legislatures making this a big issue. For crying out loud, this provision applies to 14 students at KU & KU med combined. I say that again 14. This does not strike me as very noteworthy.


justfornow 3 years, 4 months ago

It's wrong people....why can't you see that!!


mr_right_wing 3 years, 4 months ago

Sounds like the right (and "right") person will be taking office as Kansas Secretary of State!!

ObamaCare in Kansas needs to be challenged as well Mr. Kobach.


ksrush 3 years, 4 months ago

Nota and llama - your logic makes good fertilizer, but at least you guys think alot of yourselves


Randall Uhrich 3 years, 4 months ago

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Doppleganger 3 years, 4 months ago

Discussing whether criminals should get benefits for anything that non-criminals cannot get, is an irrelevant excercise. Unless, you are trying to look important.


kubacker 3 years, 4 months ago

"merrill (anonymous) says… Perhaps the U.S. Attorney General needs to keep an eye on this man and his personal agendas."

The current Race-Baiter-General won't be holding that office much longer and I'm sure Kobach is really scared of that incompetent racist idiot.


llama726 3 years, 4 months ago

I want to point out some figures.

414 students.

62 in public universities at about a $5500 difference in cost per semester = $341,000 in tuition differential from instate and out of state tuition..

351 in community colleges and technical schools with about a $510 difference in cost per semester for in state and out of state tuition = $179010.

The cost works out to a little more than $1 million in savings per year in state versus out of state tuition offered to these residents. I can see where the outrage might come from for your average taxpayer. That's a big number every year.

In context, the FY 2011 KS Governor's budget allots about $610 million to public universities. That works out to be 0.16% of the entire state education budget is allotted to the discounts afforded to children of illegal immigrants who are trying to go to college. I can't emphasize enough - these people are trying, in general, to succeed in our system. If they're trying to "get legal," I don't see how anyone should object to that - they are doing what their parents did not.

Let's look at this another way, though. Let's assume that only 25% (104) of those students follow through with their promise, stay in Kansas, earn their degrees, and join the workforce, legally, at about $45,000 per year. Let's assume they all stay in Kansas for at least 10 years. In state income tax alone, not accounting for anything else, the state earns about $301860 in income tax per year. Over the course of 10 years, assuming that we've kept 25% of those graduates (and we likely will have kept more, if memory serves, but I can't find the studies now), we will have earned over $3 million for the state from these 104 now-legal residents. This doesn't account for sales tax or property taxes, either. Tripling your returns on a ten-year investment is sound math. The projection in this paragraph is based upon conjecture and shouldn't be used as a real assessment, but I think it helps to put it in context.

In summary: We're worried about wasteful government spending, but we're targeting fewer than one half of one percent of all of the students in our education system on the basis of what their parents did, despite the fact that they are trying to work through the system legitimately. We're worried about the costs when it constitutes less than two-tenths of one percent of the total education budget for college in Kansas. Finally, we're ignoring the potential gains in terms of income tax, notwithstanding many other peripheral benefits I don't have space to explore.

This seems kind of frivolous, in the end.


Ray Parker 3 years, 4 months ago

Keep illegal aliens out of our colleges. They don't need a college degree to mow lawns, repair roofs, or slaughter cattle, just a fake driver's license and falsified social security number. Build the dang border fence. Run 'em out.


parrothead8 3 years, 4 months ago

Can anyone challenge a law in a state they don't live in? I don't understand what the Kansas Sec. of State-elect has to do with a California law.


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

Legal immigration made this country. I have nothing but great respect for any legal immigrant.

To make this problem clearer.

It would be nice if a neighborhood or small towns total taxes paid into state/local could be shown dollar for dollar.

A tax scoreboard of sorts. A scoreboard showing how much illegal immigrants really cost. Debit and credit. Put the daily amounts in the LJW.

Baldwin City for instance could be the designated small town which pays the hidden costs of illegal immigrants. If only they could in reality. Nothing else, all Baldwin tax bucks out go to illegal immigration costs. Shown on a scoreboard.

My bet is some eyes would be opened. Of course the entire population of Baldwin City state and local taxes wouldn't make a dent in our fine states actual cost of illegal immigration.

How much money do Kansas citizens pay for illegal immigrants.

Income out of for free and reduced lunch, English as a second language ESL teachers/administrators/supplies/transportation. mental health services, Section 8 housing, food stamps, temp. housing, job training, health care (emergency care) uninsured auto accident insurance coverage, crime/internment, should I go on. Didn't even mention local, and state scholarships for post secondary school.

What is returned to the Kansas taxpayer?

Somebody here stated he or she didn't realize it was such a big deal. Folks, our state is broke.


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

Camper, Post high school education costs are skyrocketing. Our Kansas state universities are all looking high and low to cut services and costs for instance.


notajayhawk 3 years, 4 months ago

Sorry, I have to add this. I am amused, as usual, by all those referring to the people of the state who elected Kobach (rather handily) as 'idiots' and such. Especially given the quality of their arguments in favor of this law:

1) As a couple of others have pointed out, Kobach is not spending time on out of state issues in dereliction of his official state duties, nor is he spending the tax revenues of Kansas citizens - he's not in office yet. Believe it or not, he doesn't get to move into the SecState's office, draw a state salary, and spend state tax dollars starting on election night.

2) The "Supreme Court" made this decision on the California law, yes. The California state supreme court.

3) Kobach lost a challenge to the similar Kansas law, yes. But not based on the constitutional issues. It was dismissed because in the opinion of the court, the plaintiff's lacked standing to sue.

4) There is a federal law that says you can not give in-state tuition rates to undocumented aliens on the basis of residency unless those rates are also available to U.S. citizens without regard to residency (8 U.S.C. § 1623). Isn't the argument of those who rant against the Arizona immigration law that it's up to the federal government to set immigration policy, not the states? Isn't it one of the arguments of those who rant in favor of the health insurance mandate that federal law always trumps state law?

5) The California Court sidestepped that issue by claiming the California law is not based on residency, but on other requirements, e.g. attending state high schools. That is, as Kobach said, a pretty weak argument, since residency establishes where someone goes to high school, unless they're all attending private schools.


michaelclayton 3 years, 4 months ago

Is this really in the purview of duties of the Secretary of State?


RiverCityConservative 3 years, 4 months ago

Undocumented immigrants and their children are and should be welcome to Kansas. Immigration is the primary reason our population has not decreased over the past 25 years. Southwest Kansas in particular would be a true desert if not for the fact that so many have immigrated and settled there, and now we're into second and third generations who are keeping Kansas communities going with their work ethic, belief in the future, and positive contributions to society. This newly elected secretary of state has been failed in court to turn back the Kansas Dream Act since 2004 and obviously was not exactly thinking of "public service" when he decided to run for state office. It is just a new platform for him to continue trying to spread the venom and hatred that he and his ever-dwindling group of intolerant buddies, or let's just call them what they are--neo Nazis--spew. I do think there should be a special category of remedial education for people like him who didn't learn about the ideals of democracy in school the first time through. Secretary of Hate.


notajayhawk 3 years, 4 months ago

I've always been torn on this one. On the one hand, I don't think it's fair to punish children for decisions their parents made.

On the other hand, it's ludicrous to accept an affidavit promising to apply for citizenship in the future. The students in question have been lying to various entities for years as to where they were born - why would anyone believe it would be hard for them to lie on the affidavit? I am NOT saying they are natural liars or people of weak moral standards; I am simply saying that a regular part of their existence has been hiding where they're from, and that particular learned defense mechanism has become ingrained.

And with very few exceptions, this is no longer a child living with the decisions of their parents - by the end of their first semester, they should pretty much all be legal adults responsible for their own actions. Forget the affidavit - if you want the instate rates, bring in the filled-out application. The school will mail it for you.


ivalueamerica 3 years, 4 months ago

i can see the point, but considering that the surpeme court just affirmed it is not unconstitutional, i would rather he spend kansas tax dollars fixing problems, not pandering.


kansastruthteller 3 years, 4 months ago

The law provides an incentive for immigrants to come here illegally. Do away with all perks and you will make coming to the US illegally less desirable. True that the parents were the ones that first violated our law and came here illegally thus making their children "illegal." But if the child is old enough to go to college then they are old enough to start living their own life and part of that would be to obey the laws of our nation. They should seek to become citizens otherwise they are no longer illegal because of their parent's actions, but because of their own.

I say the issue isn't about the tutition rate, but rather admission. No admission to anyone here illegally. And, start with grade school and we won't be having this discussion.


ksrush 3 years, 4 months ago

This is outrageous ! The fact one is given prefrence over another just because of where they are from - outrage is a mild term. Do away with the out of state tuition, if illegals can benefit from a law while out of staters pay above and beyond - thats discrimination. See libs we can play that game too. How ya like it


Tom Wilson 3 years, 4 months ago

Whenever a KU volunteer calls to ask me (an alumnus) for a donation, I simply state the school's policy as it stands now (see the above article) as the main and only reason I stopped giving to KU. If my son has to pay out of state rates to attend KU while an undocumented child of an illegal immigrant only has to pay in state tuition, then KU really doesn't need alumni donations. In all cases, KU volunteers have accepted my reasoning. I have asked them / KU to stop calling me for donations until the law has changed.


kansastruthteller 3 years, 4 months ago

Just an observation. Many people are who railing against Kobach and his initiatives are the same ones that accuse the Republicans of being the party of "no." Shouldn't these people being saying yes to anything our elected officials are proposing if being the party of "no" is wrong?

Of course not, we need people to speak up and voice opposition when they believe the proposals are wrong. Just be consistent and respectful of those that disagree with a politicians agenda.

No need to call names or suggest racist motivations, etc. It is our right to speak out against our elected leaders.


camper 3 years, 4 months ago

Just like the voter fraud issue, all of a sudden we have another contrived problem. Out of state tuition. I never realized how huge of a problem this is.

In reality, if Kobach believes this is a top of the list agenda item, then I would have to wonder about his ability to view things in scale and the materiality of issues. In the real world, these are the types of people who do harm to organizations. They get people zeroed in on things that don't really matter thus wasting resources and time that could be better applied elswhere. They are the kind of people who watch the pennies, but not the dollars.

If this is not the issue, then there might be some other motivation for all of this.


George Lippencott 3 years, 4 months ago

Gee, where were all of you when the wife got to pay out of state tuition while paying taxes because the laws of a number of states precluded military depemdents changing their status. The outcry was - well - absent.

Is this about equity or politics?


jstthefacts 3 years, 4 months ago

As I have posted in the past, Kobach being a part time secretary of state is probably a benefit to kansas. This is just another example of his failure to understand "job descriptions". Fortunately, we have a part time governor as well. Takes a lot of brains to vote for part timers and pay them in full. Wait, thats wasting tax payers money. Guess its ok if you voted for them.


Flap Doodle 3 years, 4 months ago

It's only 917 miles from Topeka to Larado. Put the illegals on a bus now and they could be back in Mexico by supper time.


sunny 3 years, 4 months ago

I want all the benefits the illegals get. I don't want to pay taxes or pay for health insurance! I want free college too!


Boston_Corbett 3 years, 4 months ago

Good grief Mr. Hyland, if you want to write an article about California litigation, and then drop in some facts and quotes about Kansas' law, you've missed it. You left out a significant part of the story for your Kansas readers.

That part is that Kobach has already challenged Kansas' tuition law, and he lost that challenge, and also lost his appeal on that challenge. This is rather central to trying to connect your lead to the Kansas experience.

Kolbach regularly declares many laws "weak" and "unconstitutional." And many courts have told him he is wrong. Including courts in Kansas. Please include that in your reporting when you want to speculate about the impact of California cases in Kansas.


Clara Westphal 3 years, 4 months ago

There is a federal law that states no non-citizen shall be given something not also granted to a citizen.

If this were enforced, no out-of-state student would be charged more than the illegals who benefit from the lower tuition.


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

Kobach is not in office yet and not using Kansas tax money.

For the folks who dislike Kobach there's a silver lining. Most in the know think he will be in Washington soon enough.

Funny thing, we worry about Kobach using state funds when we pay at times for illegal immigrants health, food, housing, and education.

Kobach is thinking about high taxes, health care and jobs.

There aint no such thing as a free lunch. Think big.


Jimo 3 years, 4 months ago

I've noted before that "constitutional scholar" Kobach seems to know little about the Constitution. He's lost in federal court before on this same scam. It was about Kansas' same policy. Hello!! Editor!! How can you write an article on this topic and not mention the local precedent?

As to appealing to the Supreme Court, surely there are a dozen law professors at KU and several dozen experienced attorneys you could call for a comment to explain how silly and improbable it is that the Supremes have the slightest interest in taking up a podunk issue from a circus barker.


edjayhawk 3 years, 4 months ago

So let me get this straight. Kobach is using our tax dollars to fight something in California? Talk about hypocrite Republicans who are against government fraud and power.


edjayhawk 3 years, 4 months ago

Get a life. We have more pressing issues like jobs, high taxes, health care, etc..


captainzeep 3 years, 4 months ago

Brownback eventually must reel Kobach in to some degree. These are not particularly important or mainstream issues he is pursuing.


cowboy 3 years, 4 months ago

Perhaps Kansas needs a new law that dictates elected officials not have outside interests and dedicate their energy full time to the State of Kansas.


Scott Morgan 3 years, 4 months ago

• Have graduated from a Kansas high school or obtained a GED certificate in Kansas. Or, GED? Is it true even with a GED the student has to attend 3 years at a Kansas school?

Being here illegally is breaking the law.

California was scammed badly by the offer of liberal in state tuition. I maybe wrong, but think they still offer this. If a high school student earns a certain GPA, at least community college is free. New Mexico has a program like this too.

The scam was finding suitable residence for Mexican/other higher level kids seeking a better education in California. Maybe an aunt and uncle, maybe somebody for hire. Then taking advantage of the taxpayer funded education program by illegally sending a child to live.

If you really think about it, add up the costs of high school and college and think of it as theft. Not petty theft either. Kansas taxpayers offer very generous financial aid grants too.


CorkyHundley 3 years, 4 months ago

Profiling lawbreakers for special price treatment is unfair. Cherry picking people by color for special treatment seems unfair as well. Enablers of lawbreakers seems irrational. Excuses to treat lawbreakers with special treatment are endless. It's heartbreaking.



christy kennedy 3 years, 4 months ago

So we're taking about kids who want access to a slightly less prohibitively expensive education who, with that education (though it's no guarantee for any of us), will likely be more self-sufficient and productive, tax-paying members of society? Yes let's try to ream a certain percentage of them who didn't have the foresight to be born on the right side of an imaginary line. Good lord. There are much better ways to save money.


Richard Heckler 3 years, 4 months ago

Perhaps the U.S. Attorney General needs to keep an eye on this man and his personal agendas.


atavism 3 years, 4 months ago

Given I no longer live in Kansas, normally I wouldn't care what agendas and laws a KS state official decides to pursue. However, since it now looks like Kobach may have some national reach, it pains me to think that you idiots elected this nimrod. Well done for proving, once again, that Kansas is a cultural, intellectual and increasingly an economic back water whose only contribution to the rest of the world is wheat and a bunch mean-spirited, greedy white men who fancy themselves as political activists.


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