Archive for Wednesday, September 9, 2009

Baldwin City police arrest two men on marijuana charges

September 9, 2009


— Baldwin City police arrested two Baker University students Tuesday afternoon after a marijuana-growing operation was found in their home in the 400 block of Eisenhower.

Interim Police Chief Greg Neis said officers obtained information about the operation and executed a search warrant.

“Twenty-eight growing marijuana plants of various heights were seized, along with grow lights and other paraphernalia,” said Neis.

The men — a 24-year-old and a 20-year-old — were arrested on charges of possession of marijuana, possession of marijuana with intent to sell within 1,000 feet of a school, no drug stamp and possession of drug paraphernalia. The arrest was made east of Baldwin Junior High School.


KansasVoter 8 years ago

I'm glad to hear that Baldwin City is so crime-free that the police can waste their time on crap like this.

gogoplata 8 years ago

The streets are now safe.... wait a minute.... a, never mind.

Tax feeders.

timebomb66 8 years ago

Who grows weed and forgets to buy a tax stamp??? I hope these young men were not on scholarship...that would be a HUGE waste.

fonz73 8 years ago

whew! I'll finally get a good night's sleep tonight.

Now one can only hope that the Baldwin Police Deptardment has enough sense to waterboard these guys for information before anyone else gets hurt.

Or the terrorists win.

Evan Ridenour 8 years ago

Oh you have to love the felony for not paying taxes on your drugs.

sinverguenza 8 years ago

cheeseburger - the 1,000 feet law is about as bogus as the tax stamp law. Is there anywhere in Baldwin that isn't within 1,000 feet of a school? How many college kids do you know selling to 13-year-olds? They don't need to and the notion of it in a college town is just silly.

Just a couple of college guys trying their hand at making a buck. With the cost of Baker, they're going to need those dollars some day. They worked it, they got busted, party over, not so excellent. Nothing to get up on the high horse about. The kids are OK.

shockchalk 8 years ago

cheeseburger makes a great point. Instead of immature comments on how lame the cops are, most of you act like this was a big waste of time. I guess as long as it's not your kids, no big deal right? An indoor growing operation so you can sell dope to the rest of the neighborhood is not something Baldwin or any other city needs. This isn't about a couple of poor college students smoking a joint or buying a bag. I'm glad the cops shut them down and I'm sure the residents of Baldwin are as well.

By the way sinverguenza.......most of Baldwin is NOT within 1,000 feet of a school so check the city map before you share your ignorance with the rest of us.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

I'm very happy to see so many comments from people who think that this is a stupid waste of tax payers money. our current marijuana laws are an illegal prohibition. There is no proof that marijuana does any long term damage to anyone. In fact, there is ample proof that marijuana has a lot of helpful qualities. These laws are only in place to continue to drive a revenue source for law enforcement.

It's a damned shame that we can have legal pill pushers in pharmacies and our doctors offices selling poisons that kill thousands upon thousands every year. it's a shame that we have liquor stores and bars in every neighborhood selling poison that kill 10's of thousands every year. and even a bigger shame that every convenience store & grocery store sell poisonous cigarettes which kill nearly half a million people in this country every year. Yet two kids growing some plants which have never killed anyone, will lose most of their rights over this forever.

tell me how this bust and the laws which enabled it are good things.

Evan Ridenour 8 years ago

Hopefully they didn't have any federal student aid they required to attend school. Kiss that good bye!

sinverguenza 8 years ago

shockchalk (Anonymous) says…

"By the way sinverguenza…….most of Baldwin is NOT within 1,000 feet of a school so check the city map before you share your ignorance with the rest of us."

Funny how a stick up your bum totally ruins your ability to recognize exaggeration. Again, how many college dealers do you know selling to 13-year-olds? Smoke a doobie and develop a sense of humor. Maybe work on developing some real sense of priorities, too.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

I invite everyone to educate yourselves on the truths about marijuana laws. the history, the propaganda, and the reality. If you truly look at why marijuana is illegal and the studies done over the years calling for an end to prohibition, an intelligent mind would be appalled at how the government has twisted the reality to continue this illegal war on Americans.

The Union (movie trailer) -

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

Cheeseburger.. if marijuana were legalized and regulated like alcohol & cigarettes, then kids would have a harder time trying to purchase such items.

sinverguenza 8 years ago

cheeseburger (Anonymous) says…

"I'm not on a high horse, but at the first opportunity, you might want to extract your head from the sand! Teens obtain pot, and they get it somewhere - more likely from college kids than old geezers!"

Where do you get your information on where kids are getting weed? Stats or personal experience or what? Can you show me that more kids are getting pot from their friends rather than their friend's parents?

On a side note, a new study from the National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse states kids find weed more readily accessible than alcohol and other drugs. What would stop this? Methinks ending the prohibition on marijuana might help. Really want to keep kids off the ganja? Support its legalization and put it to agencies like ABC to regulate its sell. No ID? No weed.

Of course, the decriminalization, or "grow your own" policy is my favorite plan. Then leave the rest up to sound parenting.

sinverguenza 8 years ago

cheeseburger (Anonymous) says…


"Just where then do the 13-15 year olds get their product? Please, do tell! Your first-hand knowledge could be very helpful to the authorities!"

No problem cheese. In my experience, most 12-18 year olds get their product from friend's parents or their own parents. After age 18, they get it from their college buddies. After college, they get it from other adults (generally old college buddies). I've got no stats though, that's why I asked for yours.

frank mcguinness 8 years ago

Whoo Hoo, We got us here some BIG criminal types.

This is soooo stupid.

I just came back from colorado and they have weed shops on every friggin corner. Now you can even go to the Dr. and get a script to either buy or grow your own weed for stuff like IBS or sleeplessness.

Kansas has iiiignorant folks here. 24 Plants? Really? That is just about enough for the 2 college guys to last them through the school year.

And Cheeseburger nowadays most 13-15 year old kids get their drugs from their parents medicine cabinet.

Sad But true.

Jaylee 8 years ago

shockchalk (Anonymous) says…

"An indoor growing operation so you can sell dope to the rest of the neighborhood is not something Baldwin or any other city needs."

i tend to disagree. it is what many communities want, but there are those who, mostly out of ignorance, agree that marijuana is bad to the point that we should jail people and ruin lives and families.

i would laugh to take a look at your circle of friends and family and neighbors and who of them smokes or has smoked pot. just imagining the looks on people's faces when they find out their kin are the very ones they demonize-- like i said, mostly out of ignorance-- is enough for my day.

what a worthless argument to claim: marijuana is harmful.

actually, i will make an argument FOR the harmful people right now. the fear that has been instilled in you of this substance and the possible byproducts of it's existence is quite harmful! it is literally a form of hatred in that you blindly assume evil and despise as a result.

also a government that would willingly jail its own citizens to keep up such a charade is VIOLENTLY dangerous.

otherwise, i can't think of anything.

users would be warring back if they lacked the common sense and truth those on the other side can't seem to find.

frank mcguinness 8 years ago

None2, You just confirmed the arguement that Marijuana is harmless. Lazy and unmotivated? That is the crux of your position?

Alcohol on the other hand contributes to violence.

none2 just won the award for dumbest post on 9/9/09

Practicality 8 years ago

Good job Baldwin police. You are paid to enforce the laws, not pick and choose like many on here would like you to. That belief isn't any different than all the criminals locked up in our prisons. All of you on here who believe you get to pick and choose which laws to follow need to re-examine your sociopathic tendencies. You might just find many similarities to the AIG executives, Bernie Madoffs, and Dennis Raders' of the world that you all despise. They thought they didn't have to abide by certain laws that they didn't like either.

In the early 70's Lawrence was inundated with Marijuana primarily by a bunch of hippie college students that most of you knew or were, and many of you thought that it is an o.k. crime to commit, for you believe you weren't harming anyone. Many of you think of this when you read stories like the one above. But, if you look at the crime destroying our community today, which appears almost daily in our newspaper, most of it found its start in those earlier days when the permissive beliefs concerning substance abuse and the anti-establishment 'down with big brother' ideals were formed and have morphed into the violent, destructive, narcissitic society we see today. Think about it, for your permissive attitude concerning substance abuse and the irresponisble, self-centered ways are directly to blame for many of the ills we see today in our community.

KansasVoter 8 years ago

shockchalk (Anonymous) says… "cheeseburger makes a great point. Instead of immature comments on how lame the cops are, most of you act like this was a big waste of time."

It looks like shockchalk is trying to establish himself as the most ignorant poster here at the LJWorld. This IS a big waste of time by the police and now the court system. If you think that these guys were selling this pot to junior high students you're just as ignorant as I think that you are.

KansasVoter 8 years ago

Practicality (Anonymous) says… "Good job Baldwin police. You are paid to enforce the laws, not pick and choose like many on here would like you to. That belief isn't any different than all the criminals locked up in our prisons. All of you on here who believe you get to pick and choose which laws to follow need to re-examine your sociopathic tendencies. You might just find many similarities to the AIG executives, Bernie Madoffs, and Dennis Raders' of the world that you all despise."

I spoke too soon. Practicality just beat out shockchalk for most ignorant poster. Just when I think that you republican pukes can't get any scummier, one of you pieces of crap always manages to sink just a little bit lower.

frank mcguinness 8 years ago

Woah Practicality, Don't pick and choose? Really?

There are 100's of stupid laws on the books

Don't ever jaywalk,

Don't bring any alcohol over 3.2 to the lake,

And most importantly,

And remember to honk your horn when you enter Lawrence city limits to alert the horses that an automobile is entering town. (that really is still a law)

frank mcguinness 8 years ago


So its a fools drug, it's like masturbating, it makes you lazy and unmotivated?

Wow lets call congress into session right now and deal with this.

Your arguement gets dumber and dumber the more you post.

rbwaa 8 years ago

9 September 2009 at 4 p.m.

Suggest removal

Permalink sinverguenza (Anonymous) says…

"Nothing to get up on the high horse about." ----------- pun intended, right?

Practicality 8 years ago

KansasVoter (Anonymous) says…

" If you think that these guys were selling this pot to junior high students you're just as ignorant as I think that you are."

And we are to believe they weren't because they were obviously community philanthropists and such pillars of the community who were too busy helping old ladies across the street to sell their ILLEGAL drugs to junior high or high school students? Some teens use drugs too. They get them from somewhere. Where do you think kids in Baldwin get their Marijuana, from the Mexican Mafia?

Are you stoned right now KansasVoter?

Steve Jacob 8 years ago

28 plants sounds like a dealer to me. Laugh all you want, you don't start coke without starting with pot. And a pot dealer house for sure is a target of robbery and violence.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


I'll bet money the "potheads" you knew that were "lazy and unmotivated" were lazy and unmotivated before they started using cannabis, and would be so after quitting. I assure you that there are more successful and highly educated marijuana users than there are lazy and unmotivated "potheads". Stereotyping is a very unfair thing to do, you should learn why that is real soon. Perhaps a brownie would enlighten you.

You are being ignorant and stereotypical. I could find 1,000's of "potheads" that are more intelligent, more educated, and make more money than you. So who's lazy and unmotivated now? You are.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


Actually your right about the Mexican mafia. Being from Baldwin I can tell you a large portion of marijuana is schwag that comes into town stuffed into semi's, FROM MEXICO. So yes, these guys were actually philanthropists. If a HS student wants to smoke, they WILL, just like sex. It's better they get high-quality indoor marijuana from these guys, keeping the black market money in the local community, than it is for them to get schwag from Mexico that is mass produced using fertilizers that have been illegal in the US since the 70's.

Please fully educate yourself on an issue before forming an opinion. Thanks!

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


That's odd, almost EVERYBODY I know started off on alcohol, NOT pot. So saying you don't try cocaine without having tried pot is an amazingly ignorant response. We all know alcohol is the number one gateway drug, as well as one of the most dangerous and inebriating.

So to correct your statement, you don't try cocaine without trying alcohol.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

none2 says: Actually, congress doesn't need to do anything, it is already illegal. Thus there is nothing to argue, it is illegal as stands.

now, I've read through these posts, and it's obvious to me that you feel marijuana should remain illegal. I ask you, why should it be illegal? Why is it illegal, and how did it become illegal? The argument of lazy and unmotivated is moot. there is no legal basis for motivating lazy people. If so, our social services departments would be a little less busy.

please respond with your research. you will either change your opinion or remain ignorant to the truth.

igby 8 years ago

Just another public safety bust to keep some real criminals from robbing them at gun point in another armed home invasion. Having pot and ready cash on hand makes them a target for death and destruction from the elements at large.

Saves the tax payers a lot of money because jailing the real criminals that could rob and kill them for 25 years would get costly. It's better to bust them, but we as a public must protect them by busting them before they do kill each other or someone else gets hurt in a robbery.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


Being educated on an the fallacies of our War on Drugs does not mean I use drugs. You're just stereotyping and making assumptions left and right!

I also said nothing about "chemical masturbation" making you more intelligent and more educated. Your logic is horrible! My point was, marijuana doesn't make you lazy, stupid, or more intelligent, YOU DO! Regardless of whether you smoke a joint or eat a brownie in the evening with a glass of wine. I bet you drink, so does that mean your a dirty bum who never showers and drinks liquor from a brown paper bag, I don't think so. So why make the same logical jump regarding marijuana? It's wrong, naive, and ignorant to do so, and you know that.

Judging by your poor logic and reasoning skills, I'd guess you probably have no more than a HS diploma or an Associates. Am I right? You really need to seek out help with your mental processing, make something of your life already!

chevelle1986 8 years ago

so here is to all you *$#@ers that thinkn but is SOOO bad.. For the past 6 years i have owned and opperated 2 small business. as a small business owner i attend meetings with other small business owners whom of which smoke POT. i have family friends that have been close to my family for over 20 years that own and operate the #1 restaurant in that town....guess what.. THEY SMOKE POT... they are a bg part of the community as well. having benifiet dinners supporting local school all kinds of stuff... stop all y9our whinning. just because you dont like pot doesnt mean every person that smokes is a bad person..all you people on here saying how bad it is are probably the same people trying to get all these new laws about banning smoking in public places... driving dodwn the road smoking my cig isnt going to kill you.. infact here is something to think about.. lets put 100 of you in a closed room whiile i smoke a pack of cigs.. NONE of you will die, in fact you even have any long time problems (cancer) no lets put those same 100 people in a room while my car is running. who is going to die now? EVERYONE... if its something the benifiets you you dont give a cr#@ if it kills you or not as long as you can still have it.. all this time and money being spent on anti smoking should be put in the funds to help find better ways to controll emission and other more serious problems the world has.

Practicality 8 years ago

none2 (Anonymous) says…

"If you can count 1,000 potheads then you are obviously steeped in addiction. Attend a NA meeting or seek out a counselor.

You may think that chemical masturbation makes you more intelligent, and more educated. It doesn't. It means you have pot breath, and haven't accomplished anything. Get help for yourself. Make something of your life."

LOL @ post.


I do know many, and I mean MANY, highly educated, wealthy, successful people. None of them got that way by being irresponsible. Although I am sure there are a few that might use Marijuana, as a general rule the people you described wouldn't risk their career over something so asinine as getting 'high' regardless how they felt on the issue. But, I guess it is all dependent on how one defines success. I imagine a pothead, who has a career as a sous chef at a restaurant that doesn't drug test, making eighteen dollars an hour might consider themselves successful, and highly educated (if they went to college) and wealthy compared to their pothead friends who are still on the coach at their parents house. Is that how you feel claro?

If you think that the Mexican Mafia is either selling drugs out of an apartment in Baldwin, Kansas or standing on the street corner selling drugs in Baldwin, Kansas then you must seek help for your obvious drug induced delusions.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


I would consider a Bachelor's or higher AND and income of 60k+ to be successful, and most people would.

I said nothing about the Mexican Mafia selling drugs out of an apartment in Baldwin. I said a large majority of the marijuana in Baldwin is schwag that makes its way there from Mexico, generally by semi.

Seriously, how did you get that from my post? I don't like ppl putting words in my mouth. If I didn't say it, don't say that I said it.

chevelle1986 8 years ago

and the reason that pot isnt legal isnt because its so bad its because if it became legal and was controlled and taxed, it would be on a government level. right now with pot being illegal every city, county and state makes way more money busting all these dime baggers. see if i bought a dime bag that was legal the tax would be about 80 cents. wow big deal. if i get busted with a dime bag you spend hundrads of dollers on the court system. yes alot of that money is for court fees and all but alot of it gets divded and put into other local funds. so there my friends is why its not legal. to much money to be made.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago

It would be nice if some of the anti-marijuana crowd could logically follow some of these statements and actually provide some worthwhile reasoning and input...


Practicality 8 years ago

And so Claro, who then resells that 'schwag' then? Could it be local residents to include Baker Univ. students?

My point, Claro with a Bachelors degree, is that teens, in Baldwin, are getting their hands on Marijuana. And, I dare say that you agreed with my point that they are not purchasing it from the Mexican Mafia, and it is more than highly likely that they bought these drugs from locals in Baldwin who either grew it themselves, (like the two in the article) or re-sell it from someone who got it from someone who got it from the Mexican Mafia.

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


You would be correct, however what does it matter if they directly purchase it from a Mexican thug, or 2 guys down the distribution chain? The money trail still goes back to the grower, and in the case of schwag, that's is usually a large operation south of the border. IF you were going to buy something like marijuana on the black market, would you rather the profits trickle down to Mexico for a drug that has more toxins, or to BU students who are using it to pay for tuition at BU?

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Wow, none2. For a self-identified Christian, filled with the peace and love that so many angry atheists lack, that they hunger for watching you, you sure are a nasty, dismissive, condescending, self-righteous, arrogant little birsk, aren't you? Show us again how Christians are supposed to behave. Jesus would weep at your lack of humanity.

Practicality 8 years ago

Then it stands to reason there would be a direct correlation between busting these two guys at Baker and keeping drugs out of the hands of impressionable kids. Thanks for prooving my point.

And, to answer your question, I do not see the need to have an either/or. Bust them both. Again, good job Baldwin P.D.

sinverguenza 8 years ago

Our point, Practicality, is that you have nothing to back up your claim that Baldwin teenagers, or any teenagers for that matter, are getting their pot from college kids. You've simply got nothing to back that up - unless you want to throw back the chain of delivery, i.e. kids are getting it from kids who are getting it from adults who are getting it from the college kids who are getting it from the Mexican mafia (which, Claro, I also know to be correct).

And even when you do throw that back, it comes down to a matter of who is to be held responsible. Is it the mafia, the college dealers, the adults, the kids' friends or the kids?

Or is it the parents who failed to keep track of where their kids are, what they're doing and who they're doing it with?

When a dealer gets busted, do you think the kids stop smoking pot? No, they just find a new dealer.

Again, read the research. The prohibition of marijuana is not keeping it out of the hands of kids. Their access to marijuana continues to increase. The prohibition of marijuana is only encouraging violent crime, increasing use by kids, and leaving retired LPD, hospital workers, community organizers (oh no!), art dealers, sous chefs and other adults who contribute positively to society overall in fear that their names, careers, etc. might be scarred by the legal repercussions of getting caught smoking something that shouldn't be illegal!

So what do we do about it? Hoorah every bust (I agree, the cops just did their jobs in this case) or work to create a system that really keeps drugs out of kids' hands (if that's your goal)?

Yes, it's a personal choice. As it stands, marijuana is against the law and anyone who chooses to deal it or use it runs a great risk. But wouldn't we all be doing everyone more good if we tackled the real problem rather than sticking our noses in the air and spouting, "I know better than you!"?

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Practicality: "All of you on here who believe you get to pick and choose which laws to follow need to re-examine your sociopathic tendencies. You might just find many similarities to the AIG executives, Bernie Madoffs, and Dennis Raders' of the world that you all despise. They thought they didn't have to abide by certain laws that they didn't like either."

Yes. Also those damned American Revolutionaries. Bastard sociopaths, going against the lawful power of the crown, just because they didn't like it.

(And no, I'm not equating pot-smokers to the American Revolutionaries. Doing so is about as inane and idiotic as comparing them to sociopaths)

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years ago

Bravo, none2!! Such a display of self-righteousness I've rarely seen!!

Christine Anderson 8 years ago

Well, I'm not going to attempt to debate the propriety of this "bust". I can say that I observe some persons who sit on their butts attempting to grow herbs for a means of income, but all they end up doing is wasting money in the effort, while their partner goes to work at a real job every day and busts their butt paying all the bills. Uh, better shut up now.

Sulla 8 years ago

Read who the 'Interim Police Chief' of Holy Baldwin City is and that should explain everything.LOL

jonas_opines 8 years ago

"The problem is you cannot stand someone giving out tough love."


Fine, I'll take back the self-identify. My mistake, what you actually said was this:

"Back to the topic of fanatical obsession against someone with religious beliefs… I would draw the following analogy on a different topic in hopes of getting my idea across without bring up religion:

Imagine that you are in Wisconsin, the dairy state. You go to a picnic, and you notice that many of the dishes brought are dairy based: Ice cream, milk, cheese, etc. — and you are lactose intolerant. Now, if absolutely every dish has dairy, you might be very frustrated. Odds are that there is something there to eat that doesn't have dairy in it so that you can participate Most people can live with that. However, there might be someone who feels they need a podium to announce how horrible dairy is — that it gives gas, that is cruel to the animal, that it is a waste of grain, and who knows maybe they'll even claim that dairy is racist…

They aren't whining based on logic. They are doing it because they cannot stand that anybody else might just be happy. They feel miserable, and they want to make sure everybody else around them is miserable too."

. . . on a thread about a Christian Car Dealership. That would indeed be an assumption on my part.

I see no reason however, to take back any of the other descriptives.

And pontificating to people that you don't know based on absolute assumptions of their lifestyle due to their opinions on whether it is appropriate for MJ to be legal, about their addictive personalities isn't tough love. There's no hint of love in any of your posts. Not at all.

andyk 8 years ago

none2 is right. Drug addiction is not cool. I would know, I've been a multi drug user for a number of years now. I wish I could give it all up sometimes, until I'm reminded of people like none2. Seriously. How can you even go on about how low lived and lazy we are? I'm about to graduate from engineering. I've made it this far not because I'm smart, I'll be honest there. I've made it this far because I'm one of those infinitely curious people, that you've assumed I'm not. I have said for a long time, that I hope to continue smoking weed forever, while still accomplishing something. Mostly to prove to people with attitudes similar to yours, that it really is possible. Anyways, these dude's probably weren't selling to kids. Many people I know (college aged) are way to paranoid about selling to kids. They're dumb. Most weed still comes from Mexico, some from the U.S. Either way it most likely comes from the Mexican gang. The gangs have actually taken out a lot of forest in the south west to start the ops here, no borders. This is all very poor quality smoke, and I wouldn't be surprised to find that it is actually terrible for you. The alternative is to pay out the ass for something not so crap. Obvious solution, grow it yourself. Or better yet, legalize it. Put an end to the gateway drug problem, the crime/trafficking problem, and the over potency problem. And make the government more cash than any gang could ever make.

andyk 8 years ago

Crap. none2, i just realized who you are. I think the only posts I've made on ljworld in the last four years are responses to something you've said on this issue. Therefore, I'm going to end my argument here, because I've argued this before, and it goes no where. I will close by saying this: none2, I respect your choice to never use drugs. I've never pushed them at anyone, and I think it's wrong to do so. All I ask is that I be left alone in my choice to smoke, because it involves no one but myself. I know plenty of people that have drug problems, and have hardly even touched weed. Some of them have almost died (a couple have) from something that probably came from someones medicine cabinet, or prescribed to them by those lovely drug dealers we call doctors, or cooked up in a bathroom. My point, be happy it was a grow op and not a meth house making the news this time.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Speaking of assumptions, none2, why don't you just go ahead and point out where in this thread I have advocated drug use, suggested the police were incorrect to enforce the laws, glamorized the drug life-style, or in general advocated any other opinion other than you being a conceited and arrogant birsk who has mistaken pontificating about their superiority of lifestyle for being tough love. (or that Practicality was incorrect in labeling dissent as sociopathy)

Please, by all means.

andyk 8 years ago

But wait, to Practicality: Good logic on going with none of the sinful goods for sale. However, considering the amount I pay on alcohol tax (not to mention the extra tax from bars), and the tobacco tax (which is about to go up again), it kind of makes me feel like an a hole for giving that up. I couldn't even guess how much I give to schools and health-care funds every year.

localgirl9 8 years ago


28 plants sounds like a dealer to me. Laugh all you want, you don't start coke without starting with pot. And a pot dealer house for sure is a target of robbery and violence."

Actually, 28 plants belong to a GROWER and that isn't exactly alot of product so it is likely personal or nearly personal...those guys might sell to a few of their friends but they are a drop in the bucket folks...

As for the gateway drug theory, it is complete bunk. The only correlation is the fact that both are black market items. One high is nothing like the other. There is no comparison.

Danimal 8 years ago

Excellent! Two more mouths for the state to feed when we're already broke! Legalize it and tax the h*ll out of it already. Keep it out of kids hands while taking that funding source away from criminal enterprises and redirecting it to our state coffers.

notajayhawk 8 years ago

Ya' gotta' love it.

The whacky college kids of Larryville defending marijuana are just as much a boon to the legalization cause as beer-guzzling rednecks are to concealed carry.

Hey, chevelle1986? Seriously, dude, have someone proofread your comments before you post them (or maybe one of the small businesses you 'opperate' could spring for a computer with a spell checker) - you're serving as a perfect example of the 'benifiets' of marijuana use.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Oh good, Dr. Snide N. Supercilious himself. Wouldn't have been a thread without him.

igby 8 years ago

These doper rants are prof in it's self that everyone should be forced to smoke dope just like the Dems want everyone to drink from the same hog slop on Health insurance or pay a fine. Lol.

Americans need their dope because it gives them a false sense of well being while living the American Dream of lies in a shrinking world economy where your job is hanging by a thread. Your rights will soon vanish like pot smoke. The government needs all the money it can print and rob or launder from the many black markets illegal drugs has created.

Soon there will be no tax money left and the prisons will be closed down except for violent offenders. The dopers have nothing to worry about except deciding to buy food or dope. Now that's a hard one too decide. Pot without munches? Lol.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

none2, i'm still waiting on your understanding of why marijuana is illegal in the first place.

Practicality 8 years ago

"or that Practicality was incorrect in labeling dissent as sociopathy"

I never said or intended that meanting. I implied that anyone who believes they do not have to follow a law and knowingly breaks that law because it interferes in what they want to do, isn't any different than Bernie Madoff, etc. etc. Also, if you care to scroll up, I compared those actions and beliefs with sociopathic tendencies. If someone wants to protest or lobby against a law, that is surely their right to do so, as long as they do not break the law in the process.

By all means Jonas, please do not let anything like factual quoting interfere with your humorous posts, I understand it is much easier to do so when you can just exaggerate.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Oh please, the spin makes my head hurt. An "if - then" conditional? I didn't say that, I just made a three part transitive comparison? Give me a break.

“All of you on here who believe you get to pick and choose which laws to follow need to re-examine your sociopathic tendencies."

"That is because you don't have any backbone. If all you stand for is mush, that is all you can regurgitate."

The level of disingenuity has reached a point where it's obviously pointless to continue.

mistygreen 8 years ago

The police officers were doing their job, I have no gripe about that, but it seems to be a waste of taxpayers money enforcing what is nothing any more different than drinking alcohol. This country needs to wake up and legalize marijuana, and tax it just like beer and ciggys. Just look at all the revenue it could generate. They don't seem to be losing tax revenue on beer and cigs are they?

andyk 8 years ago

I had to come back for a few more words. none2: I don't seriously want to quit. At least not right now. I'm content with where my use is at. If I had to choose between a more adventurous life or weed, I'd choose the former. My point is that I want to continue to prove people with your attitude wrong. You do make valid points though. As for not knowing anybody with mental issues, that's not true. I do see your point. Sometimes I'm not sure if I'm really sane, but that's beyond the point, and not as a result of any drug use. To this however: "As to whether this choice only involves you, ask yourself if you really live in a vacuum? ...." I only partially agree. There is a fine line to be drawn when to say someone is under the influence just because there is THC in there system. Personally, the only wrecks I've been in and things I've screwed up on the job, came at times that I wasn't high. This is the same for many people I know. Not a blanket statement for everybody and all cases, but neither are your statements. Oh, and you're right about my neurons. I nowadays try to conserve those.

bad_dog 8 years ago

"I implied that anyone who believes they do not have to follow a law and knowingly breaks that law because it interferes in what they want to do, isn't any different than Bernie Madoff, etc. etc."

While your statement is valid to the extent it compares individuals who broke certain laws, it is completely invalid as to the matter of degree of societal impact. As you know, the Madoffs and Raders of the world used their positions of wealth and power to break numerous laws and regulations thus enabling their multi-million/billion dollar financial rape of shareholders and investors. The perpetrators in Baldwin-a couple of college kids-grew some pot. Whether it was for personal use or to sell remains to be seen. Opining they were going to sell it to school kids is merely unsupported speculation on your part. Very similar to your multiple posts speculating on Moveon's purported organizational efforts at Rep. Jenkins recent meeting. I'd ask if you typically engage in hyperbole, but I already know the answer.

FYI, Pedro Irigonegary got an acquittal of a defendant in a pot grower trial several years ago. He too, was charged with cultivating/possessing with the intent to sell after being caught with ~ 100 plants. They were able to convince the jury the defendant was growing it periodically, then froze it and personally consumed. Don't know that I would have bit on that argument or if jury nullification was involved, but it happened.

As for the Baldwin cops, as noted multiple times above, they received a tip and went and did their jobs. I don't fault them for doing just that.

frank mcguinness 8 years ago

none2 says There was lots of pressure to to give in and do drugs.

Like indian burns, wedgies, and swirlies???

Poor Guy, Wanna Hertz Doughnut?

bad_dog 8 years ago

hey rooster, don't forget pink bellies, ear boxing and toilet dips...
These gateway offenses invariably lead to automatons who waterboard on command. (sarcasm meter pegged)

fastwalker 8 years ago

"If the words "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." - Terence McKenna

ClaroAtaxia 8 years ago


You sure talk a lot about things that aren't explicitly or even implicitly stated in people's comments. I don't completely judge people by a piece of paper or dollar figure, although those are decent metrics to include in an evaluation for sure. Again, all I was saying is that a persons choice to use marijuana responsibly has nothing to do with them choosing to be lazy or motivated, stupid or intelligent, poor or rich. The younger generation isn't falling for the prejudiced stereotyping the older generations have tried so hard to perpetuation, and you're going to have to learn to do the same if you want to be taken seriously in modern society.

Andyk is completely right, and I hope he gets his Engineering degree stoned as hell and becomes YOUR boss none2. But I'm sure that won't happen since he'll spend all of his time stoned eating cheetos right none2? I'm willing to bet money Andyk can do more advanced math stoned than you can sober. Today's stoner isn't a lazy loser living in his mother's basement, today's stoner is your doctor, lawyer, executive, professor, dentist, politician, especially your chemo, MS, alzheimers (which THC prevents btw), glaucoma, anorexic, and even insomniac.

"If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable." ~Louis D. Brandeis

People forget that ending marijuana prohibition is a conservative, less-government argument. Every conservative who is for prohibition and forcing decisions on others is not a true conservative.

ralphralph 8 years ago

Any connection between the illicit activity and the fact that one of these guys is 24 YEARS OLD and still a student at Baker? Whoa! Dude! I got old!

Practicality 8 years ago

People can not use Marijuana responsibly. Smoking Marijuana in itself is irresponsible. For even if you believe it is o.k. to do so, it is irresponsible to knowingly risk your career, legal problems, jail, your possesions, children (if you have any), societal standing, embarassment to your family, all for the sake of smoking dope. Responsible people would not do such a senseless thing.

Practicality 8 years ago

Andyk is an idiot. If he receives his engineering degree he will soon learn that the real world isn't quite like college. People are likely going to demand a drug test prior to hiring employment. No business is going to risk the liability of haveing a druggie as an engineer. Sorry Andyk, that is the real world and the error in your argument. I hope you grow up and straighten yourself out, but I am afraid you will learn the lesson the hard way. It is never to late to change though.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

"People are likely going to demand a drug test prior to hiring employment."

Errr. . . right. No one's ever cheated a drug test. Or, ya'know, cleaned up for as long as it takes to pass one, and then gone back to using. Once your in the door, most employers will not bother with it unless your work starts to suffer. It costs revenue to repeatedly spot-test employees.

"No business is going to risk the liability of haveing a druggie as an engineer."

Only if they know. I'm quite willing to bet that there have been a number of engineers who have smoked pot from time to time.

That is the real world and the error in your argument. (stole that)

But oh well. You've slipped into your litany, and we know that you won't be shaken from it, despite its very tenuous grasp on actual reality.

For the rest. Drop the word "responsible." He's probably right, the definition of responsible is counteracted by the illegality of the substance. Switch to "smart," if you really feel the need to continue. That one is probably somewhat defensable. Even if he's not wired to accept that one either (likely), it's not as likely to lead to definition paradox.

/or just keep living your lives, and if you make it through without problems, you can consider him proved wrong then

andyk 8 years ago

Practicality, good point. This isn't something I've never thought about before. There are ethics that go along with engineering. Don't worry about me from that point, I'm not an idiot. I would quit if it is considerably irresponsible for me to continue at some point. So please don't call me an idiot, you don't know a thing about me. I'm sure as hell not going to be building bridges or designing airplanes regardless. Thanks Defender for backing me up though. And a drug test? Please.

the_captain 8 years ago

I just love these displays of educated ignorance. It never fails, every time I think that maybe I should be more open-minded and explore the liberal side of things, all I have to do is read some of the dribble that liberals express in these commentaries. It always reminds me of why I am a proud conservative.

Matt Schwartz 8 years ago

liberal, conservative...who cares? you just think your better than everyone else....educated ignorance personified.

frank mcguinness 8 years ago

Awesome answer the_captain:

Liberals: support the use of marijuana.

Conservatives: support the mass killings of people in other countries.

You lose.

the_captain 8 years ago

I figured that some out there would get upset about that post. Never could argue with druggers. They are just too wrapped up in their own little worlds and wanting to chemically separate themselves from reality. I feel sorry for you, but sorrier for your family and friends who have to tolerate your selfishness.

phoggyjay 8 years ago

People who have died from consuming cannabis- 0 People who have died from consuming alcohol- not enough room

the_captain 8 years ago

The family of five that I had to help extricate from a car after they were killed by a "high" driver had not inhaled either. You really cannot defend drug abuse of any kind no matter what you say.

Practicality 8 years ago

"Errr… right. No one's ever cheated a drug test. Or, ya'know, cleaned up for as long as it takes to pass one, and then gone back to using."

I agree that many people have cheated drug tests as well as cleaned up long enough to pass one. People also have gotten caught trying to cheat a drug test as well as come up dirty because enough time hadn't passed for the drug to completely leave their system even though the individual thought that it had. Especially when an employer wants a hair sample.

"Only if they know. I'm quite willing to bet that there have been a number of engineers who have smoked pot from time to time."

I agree that it is usually 'for cause' after someone gets hired and I also agree that there probably are a number of engineers who have and do smoke marijuana from time to time. I don't believe it is anywhere close to a majority like some posters would want us to believe but I am sure there are some 'pot-heads' in every profession there is.

My point, because I know I am not going to change the mind of a frequent user with a societal impact, family harm, or social responsibility argument, is that in both incidents above, why would any responsible person take the risk? Why would an engineer or anyone for that matter, who sacrificed a great deal to become whatever they become risk it all just to get high? That is terribly irresponsible, especially when you have a family and other people who are depending on you. Sure there are people who get away with it, but there are also people who get caught. Why risk it? So you can have the thrill of getting high? Not a very fair trade when you consider what you have to lose I'm afraid.

All substance abusers start to rationalize and down play their use at some point but in the end, it is a very selfish, irresponsible thing to do with much risk and little gain People just need to be more disciplined in their behavior.

FYI, in my experience dopers never think people realize that they are a stoner, but it is really quite transparent, dopers just aren't together enough to recongnize it.

andyk 8 years ago

the_captain: I'm not sure who you're calling a liberal. Just don't label me one. I don't vote. I can't stand the idea of me helping put any dip**** into office. And you can still defend it. I would say it would be fair to setup some sort of testing procedure for the roads if marijuana was ever legalized. One that would differentiate between those that are high and those that WERE high though.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Practicality: I understand your point well enough. I simply think you are inclined to over-estimate the risk. I'll respond this last time, but I think we know this won't go anywhere.

Dopers are transparent, druggers are transparent, pot-heads are transparent. The thing is, the ones who generally do continue to use, if they are the type to get jobs, have families, etc., would not fit those categories except for in an absolute categorization. The ones that I've known in the past cut down substantially from their use in college, for one thing, and generally alter their habits of use as well. It becomes more of a vacation-thing than a lifestyle thing, every once in awhile as opposed to regular. As a result, they have it together quite fine. I'll psuedo-agree with you: I don't believe any real professional would be able to practically or intelligently maintain the level of consumption talked about above, so the ones who are smart greatly alter their usage habits, and generally none's the wiser.

As to why they take the risk, well for most it's probably a mix of three things, if I had to guess. The enjoyment of the sensation, the enjoyment of a mild form of social deviancy, and the fact that for a very casual user the risk is rather infantisimle. For the reasons brought up above (even with the possibility of misjudging clean-out times etc.), the fact that casual consumption levels of possession are generally non-reportable misdemeanors rather than felonies, and that it really doesn't have any more impact on their lives than casual usage of alcohol.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Whenever someone makes the assumption that only liberals get high, and conservatives don't, it's not worth even bothering with them. The only worthwhile interaction with trolls is just poking them with sticks and watching them grunt and howl.

andyk 8 years ago

thanks jonas. You're right. I'm a stoner now, I don't plan to be next year, though it will probably still be an occasional thing. I don't even think I need to say that again. I don't agree with drug testing in every profession anyways. Shouldn't an employee be judged on the quality of their work, not the possibility that they might have been high the night, weekend, or week before? Practicality: I'm not selfish at all. Many people would argue you that I'm one of the least selfish people they know. That probably has a lot to do with why I'm so poor. I'm always in a position to have to help someone and I always do. If and when I have a family, I would never jeopardize our well being and my job like that. I just wouldn't. I might fail an initial hair test, but generally it's jobs that require clearance that do that, and I do not want a job like that. I don't want to make bombs. And irresponsible? You just don't know me. Believe me when I say that I've done very little to lessen the pride my parents and family have for me. They know I smoke, it doesn't matter to them because they know how responsible I am, and I plan to keep it that way.

I'm not going to change any minds here, and neither is anyone else. This thread is two days old now, I don't want to come back to defend myself anymore, but I will. So please don't keep it going. I know I can't speak for all "dopers", (which I wish you would stop using, it's not the 60's. "Dope" as it's called now days, is much different) but you also can't speak for all the sober ones. No one is perfect, and my imperfections don't have to do with my drug use. I'm sorry you never had the opportunity to meet someone like myself, that doesn't always believe what everyone else says. Jonas is right about everything. I don't care about risks. I have always done what I thought acceptable, despite risks. So far it has worked for me perfectly. I will let you know if and when that changes.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

Practicality (Anonymous) says… People can not use Marijuana responsibly. Smoking Marijuana in itself is irresponsible. For even if you believe it is o.k. to do so, it is irresponsible to knowingly risk your career, legal problems, jail, your possesions, children (if you have any), societal standing, embarassment to your family, all for the sake of smoking dope. Responsible people would not do such a senseless thing.

this is my point Practicality.. why is it illegal if the only risks are associated with it's illegality? There are a lot of things from our history that are laughable laws now. why shouldn't marijuana use be one of them? When enough citizens demand change, it has to change. otherwise, we'd all still be without alcohol, womens' rights, etc. In fact, we'd still be waving the Union Jack had there not been a strong enough calling to get the government off our backs.

When marijuana is legalized for American adults, then all of the risks you mentioned immediately evaporate.

Stuart Evans 8 years ago

and i'm pretty certain I won't be hearing back from None2 about the real reasons marijuana is illegal. but that's ok. I've done my homework, as have many other proponents of legalization in here. It seems that only those who are in favor of retaining these archaic laws have failed to actually do their homework.

kmat 8 years ago

Funny. I'm in L.A. right now. Tons of legal smoking going on. Highways are crowded with these stoners going to their jobs, just like everyone else. Police are actually able to focus on busting real criminals instead of those smoking a J. They're making tax money off the pot.

Was at a concert in Hollywood hills last night. The smoke cloud from the theatre was almost as big as the smoke cloud from the fires burning in the mountains. Funny, those worthless stoners were all successful people that could afford to see the show in Hollywood and drive their BMW's, Mercedes, etc... Stupid Californians able to be productive, make good money, live in nice houses and drive nice cars and smoke the finest of medicinal weed. And they aren't smoking weed that is brought in by Mexico and funds cartels. They buy local and pay taxes on it. What's smarter? Supporting Mexican cartels by keeping it illegal or allowing local growers to sell into their communities and pay taxes? People are going to smoke no matter what the laws are. Decades of prohibition have only increased usage. Make it legal, keep it local and collect tax dollars from it.

Practicality 8 years ago

"Decades of prohibition have only increased usage."

No proof for such an assertion. And, just to be clear, are you advocating every state to bel like California? That is laughable.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

"Jonas is right about everything."

Aiieeee!!!! What a bizarre world that would be.

pissedinlawrence 8 years ago

Wow, cops found some plants. Big F-n deal. Go find that rapist instead.

Practicality 8 years ago

All right Defender, I call your bluff, show me the proof that Marijuana illegality has increased its use in the populace. Good luck with that one, although I really don't expect you to answer that question with any facts.

Maybe you should grow up and find another, less selfish cause than legalizing Marijuana. There really are a lot more important issues going on in the world than whether you can smoke Marijuana legally or not, although most users are too selfish and caught up in themselves and there assinine justifications of their Drug Use to notice. Hence the selfishness.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

"There really are a lot more important issues going on in the world than whether you can smoke Marijuana legally or not."

Well, there are certainly some important issues. But the War on Drugs costs a fortune for no tangible benefits. Some sources suggest (citation starts) that the total number of marijuana arrests far exceeds the total number of arrests for all violent crimes combined, including murder, manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery and aggravated assault.

Since 1992, approximately six million Americans have been arrested on marijuana charges, a greater number than the entire populations of Alaska, Delaware, the District of Columbia, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont and Wyoming combined. Annual marijuana arrests have more than doubled in that time. (cite ends)

A lot of people complain about the high costs of our justice and prison system, its over-crowding, and other issues associated with a glut of these type of offenders that, by and large, are non-violent, and not hurting anybody but potentially themselves (and even that might drop substantially if we get rid of the risks that are only associated with its illegality, as mentioned above)

You are arguing semantics with the correlational/causational nature of prohibition and rates of usage, and of course no one could prove it. You could, easily, prove that prohibition has not caused usage rates to drop, most studies show that they have gone up.

There are also many uses for the plant other than just getting high, and the drug itself is very, very effective in easing pain for a variety of diseases. When my step-dad had cancer back in the 70's, his doctor told him officially that there were any number of drugs that would help ease the discomfort, but then unofficially (ie, not prescription, just suggestion) that if he could find some, MJ would be by far the most effective.

So I guess its how you define importance. Freeing up prison space for violent criminals. Saving us billions upon billions of tax-payer dollars. The gateway aspect of the drug would be eliminated, because the Reason that it's a gateway drug is because it gets people into the sub-culture and gets them connections to the harder drugs that they would not probably otherwise have interest in enough to locate. Studies on legalization in other countries have suggested that when MJ was legalized usage of other drugs like cocaine and heroin dropped.
We would also gain access to the other benefits of the plant. Not to mention that the usage of the drug itself would then be effectively taxable, creating a new revenue source for federal, state, and local governments. Of course, we'd also get several US states worth of people back into circulation and interaction in society, rather than lingering in prison where the only skills they learn are how to be more violent criminals.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

There would, of course, be negatives. But the benefits are quite substantial, if you really think about them.

and of course, if you aren't quite so addicted to your worldview to where you actually consider it. But you'll have to talk to none2 about addictive personalities.

Practicality 8 years ago

"I'm not doing your homework for you, read the news for yourself."

Considering there isn't any such news article that prooves your lunacy, I assume you mean articles concerning people getting caught growing, smoking, selling, etc. etc. Marijuana. That hardly prooves your point, but I do not think you are bright enough to understand that. Surpise, surpise.

"Since I am not doing this, just what are you getting at?" Then what are you advocating for if not for the legalization of Marijuana? Are you so high right now you forgot what we were discussing? That happens a far too often with you I care to wager.

"You're the one that doesn't want consenting adults to be able to smoke a natural plant. Who is selfish? This is WAY too easy, you're an idiot."

There are a lot of things our government says consenting adults can not do, grow up, accept it, and realize that it isn't that important in your life. Sorry if you are not intelligent enough to figure this out. Blame your drug use or your genes. I am not at fault.

andyk 8 years ago

I don't know if use has increase since prohibition, that's tough to say. Numbers lie and I don't buy statistics from more than three decades. What is obvious is that prohibition has done NOTHING for it. I can say the reason I tried it the first time, is because I'd lived for years hearing about how bad it was. I'd always wondered if it's so bad, why would people do it? I think a lot of kids have this idea. DARE is a failure, along with the stupid a@# commercials on TV. Numerous studies have shown they turn kids onto drugs.

What has gone up is the amount of pills in school. It's getting ridiculous nowadays. I hear stories about people falling asleep in their high school class because they took 3 bars of xanax. That is absolutely insane. I know the power of xanax, and how bad it will mess people up. Why isn't this a larger concern? My old roomate was a pill popper. We don't live together anymore. "Xans are fine" he would say, "They won't hurt you". Sure they wont. All the kids believe this now. THAT'S what I'm worried about. Hell, I will be thankful if all my kids get into is a little weed.

andyk 8 years ago

Oh, and one thing to add. When I started smoking, I made this choice COMPLETELY on my own. No peer pressure. Pure curiosity. Maybe it's because my school skipped DARE for my class.

jonas_opines 8 years ago

Thank you, practicality, for helping add another confirmation my hypothesis that no one who actually takes the time to inform themselves on the subject can make an intellectually honest argument on the necessity of its illegality. All they can do is make assumptions and stereotypes, remain ignorant, and blindly stick to tired and generally false arguments.

/or find a litany and cling to it like an addict.

Alexander Neighbors 8 years ago

why were these guys not charged in federal court ?

Calliope877 8 years ago

Gee, I sure do feel safe now that those two pot heads are off the streets! sarcasm Anyone know if the local serial rapist has been caught?

sublime1986 7 years, 9 months ago

anyone in their own mind should rather have people growing their own pot then from purchasing it from dealers who also deal in other trades such as cocaine and meth. everyone who wants to smoke just move to colo. or any other state with prop.215 like laws.

pace 7 years, 9 months ago

End prohibition on Marijuana, tax it, regulate it. End the gangster wars on the the border. Make America safer.

Commenting has been disabled for this item.