Archive for Sunday, January 4, 2009

Protesters decry Gaza Strip bombing

Palestinian supporters march on Mass. Street

Morad Jouhari, of Kansas City, Mo., was among 50 people protesting Israeli action in Gaza, Saturday, Jan. 3, 2008, outside the Douglas County Courthouse. Kansas University student group Voices for Palestine and the Lawrence Coalition for Peace and Justice organized the protest, as Israeli troops entered Gaza on Saturday.

Morad Jouhari, of Kansas City, Mo., was among 50 people protesting Israeli action in Gaza, Saturday, Jan. 3, 2008, outside the Douglas County Courthouse. Kansas University student group Voices for Palestine and the Lawrence Coalition for Peace and Justice organized the protest, as Israeli troops entered Gaza on Saturday.

January 4, 2009

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Lawrence groups denounce Isreal's military escalation

Protesters marched down Massachusetts Street this past weekend to protest Isreal's military escalation in the Gaza Strip. Enlarge video

Diaa Elashkar, left, Overland Park, and Abdul Majeed, Kansas City, Kan., were among 50 people who turned out with Voices for Palestine, a Kansas University student organization, and Lawrence’s Coalition for Peace and Justice at the Douglas County Courthouse on Saturday. They demonstrated against Israel’s bombardment of the Gaza Strip.

Diaa Elashkar, left, Overland Park, and Abdul Majeed, Kansas City, Kan., were among 50 people who turned out with Voices for Palestine, a Kansas University student organization, and Lawrence’s Coalition for Peace and Justice at the Douglas County Courthouse on Saturday. They demonstrated against Israel’s bombardment of the Gaza Strip.

Read more about Israel's offensive

On the street

Would you ever participate in an organized protest or demonstration?

Yeah, if it was for a good cause; something I believed in.

More responses

On the same day that Israeli ground forces entered the Gaza Strip, protesters in Lawrence marched down Massachusetts Street denouncing the country’s military escalation.

Wrapped in or waving Palestinian and Lebanese flags, carrying signs that asked for peace, handing out pamphlets and chanting for a free Palestinian nation, protesters were speaking out against what they said was the killing and harming of innocent civilians by the hand of Israel.

The Lawrence protest followed much larger demonstrations in Kansas City, Chicago, Denver and across Europe.

Eight days of air strikes have left more than 480 Palestinians dead, and four Israelis have been killed by rocket fire, according to the Associated Press.

“I felt personally that I couldn’t sit at home and enjoy my New Year’s while these people are being massacred,” said Joshua Anderson, president of Voices for Palestine.

The local demonstration combined members of Kansas University’s student organization, Voices for Palestine, with those from the Lawrence Coalition for Peace and Justice, a group that was already protesting the Iraq war Saturday afternoon.

Anne Burgess, coordinator with Lawrence Coalition for Peace and Justice, said there were mixed opinions in the group about participating in Saturday’s demonstration.

“We really are opposed to violence of any kind, not just the violence that has been demonstrated by Israel, but by Hamas as well,” she said. “We want the killing to stop. Everybody needs to calm down and negotiate.”

More than 50 people participated in the Lawrence protest, some coming from as far as Kansas City and Manhattan.

A counter protester from the United American Committee, a group whose primary focus is to confront Islamic extremism, also attended Saturday’s demonstration with a video camera in hand.

Pamphlets the protesters were handing out decried Israel for its air assaults on the Gaza Strip and restrictions on access to food, fuel, medicine, electricity and humanitarian aid.

It also condemned the United States for its military aid to Israel.

“There really isn’t much we can do, but what we can do, our voices can be heard,” said Najlaa Fahda, a 20-year-old University of Missouri-Kansas City student who was protesting with her family Saturday.

Orli Gil, the consul general of Israel to the Midwest, said Israel has gone to great measures to prevent civilian casualties. The military has called homes and distributed pamphlets in advance of air strikes asking people to evacuate the area.

“Israel does whatever it takes and whatever is in our power to do as little harm to civilians in Gaza,” she said.

More than 300 truckloads of humanitarian aid have been allowed into Gaza since the attacks started, Gil said. And the World Food Council has said its warehouses are full.

Gil, who is based out of Chicago, is optimistic that conflict will end soon and negotiations with Palestinians will continue.

Comments

palestinereview 6 years, 6 months ago

The author writes "...protesters were speaking out against what they said was the killing and harming of innocent civilians by the hand of Israel." As if there were any doubt!What is going on in Gaza is a massacre! Its a continuation of the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians which began in 1948....and we are all subsidizing it with our tax money. Remember that on April the 15th.The Palestine Reviewhttp://palestinereview.com

repaste 6 years, 6 months ago

Our war of independence was won by men who hid behind trees, ran and hid from traditional battle, and were called terrorists, cowards.

Leslie Swearingen 6 years, 6 months ago

Maybe no one in Lawrence cares about a Jew being killed.If every Jew in Israel packed up and left, and went far, far, away, they would still find a reason to fight. If there were no United States, but only a large sea of water where the land mass is, they would still find a reason to fight.One thing Bush and Obama seem to agree on is that Hamas is a terrorist organization. Yet, it was elected in a legal election by the people. So does that make everyone in Gaza either a, or a potential terrorist?I agree that the radicals show no reluctance to use children and women for their own ends. But, then they believe paradise is the ultimate designation for those that behave the way they do.I say, Obama is a wise and considered man, and after he is elected he will ponder the case and reach a decision. Public protesters who are not directly involved in the issues often know know what they are protesting. They just want to be part of the group.

jayhawker4real 6 years, 6 months ago

Protest all you want, but I have zero sympathy for any palestinian in gaza or the west bank.Perhaps they have forgotten the celebrations and dancing in the streets that the palestinians did on September 11, 2001, but I have not. It remains in my memory as clearly as if it was yesterday.I am not dancing in the streets, but I'm not protesting Israel's action against those filthy Hamas terrorists either.

SMe 6 years, 6 months ago

Well I'm protesting Hamas rockets launched into Israel.

repaste 6 years, 6 months ago

Gaza is one of the most population dense places in the world. The targets are men, not encamped soldiers, they live in their homes, I am not endorsing their sause, I just think this war is creating more terrorists than it kills. 20% kills = children = more "terrorists

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Perhaps they have forgotten the celebrations and dancing in the streets that the palestinians did on September 11, 2001, but I have not. It remains in my memory as clearly as if it was yesterday."What you remember is carefully staged propaganda by the right-wing US media. In other words, your anger is programmed into to you, and you're cheering the slaughter of innocents just to satisfy that programming.

skinny 6 years, 6 months ago

I haven't forgot gotten 9-11-2001 either. I could care less what happens over there.

tunahelper 6 years, 6 months ago

Go Israel! Nuke hamas back into the stone age!hamas is targeting innocent civilians with their rocket attacks while Israel bombs terrorist targets. I hope and pray Israel blows hamas off the planet.The United States should be like Israel where EVERYBODY serves in the military!Go Israel, nuke them stinking hamasters!

Harpo 6 years, 6 months ago

not_so_greek (Anonymous) says… Bozo: What you remember is carefully staged propaganda by the right-wing US media.That's bull-s*** too, Bozo.Instead of remembering people dancing in the streets, people ought to wonder and inquire why these people felt like they wanted to dance in the streets. It is not a short-hand or easy answer, or a comfortable one. And it is very complex. And all who study this won't agree. But until we seek to try to understand why other peoples think as they do, we will not be successful in dealing with these people.Well said, not_so_greek. It seems that bozo may have fallen victim to a bit of "programming" of his own:http://www.snopes.com/rumors/cnn.aspAs you say, there is no easy or comfortable answer. Any solution to this issue (if there is one) is going to require intense and intellegent diplomacy, which must include a fundemental understanding of the historical perspective of all parties involved.

oldvet 6 years, 6 months ago

Let us not forget that the Palestinian people elected Hamas to be their leaders... They elected Hamas to an overwhelming majority and chose to have Hamas represent them... Hamas, who has dedicated themselves to the destruction of Israel... so there is no sympathy for the people who now are suffering because their chosen representatives, fighting like the gutless cowards they are, while hiding behind women and children, suddenly feel the wrath that they have brought upon themselves...

Fred Whitehead Jr. 6 years, 6 months ago

Bozo "What you remember is carefully staged propaganda by the right-wing US media. " Yup, that is crap. Every time some bozo disagrees with the truth, it is a right wing/left wing conspiracy. This part of the world has been in flames since the Palestine partition of 1947. The multi-millenium knock on the Jews since the crucifixion of Christ has given history some really stunning events such as Nazi Germany to name one. But the failure of Arab peoples to accept that there are others on the globe besides themselves and Allah underscores the glaring farce of religious fervor. "Kill your enemies, because (name your own deity) commands it." This is the failure of some religious dogmas, " do harm, not good." Think about it.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 6 years, 6 months ago

Oldvet, from one old vet to another, you couldn't have stated the case more clearly and precisely. Thanks!

tin 6 years, 6 months ago

Bozo: What you remember is carefully staged propaganda by the right-wing US media. In other words, your anger is programmed into to you, and you're cheering the slaughter of innocents just to satisfy that programming.All mighty enlightened one, please tell us which news source we can believe?Because a quick search on google or utube will net you Palestinians celebrating 9-11, News source from all over the BBC, CBS, NBC, CNN, FOX, and on and on and on reported this. So please tell me who to believe I'm so confused. NOT!

gl0ck0wn3r 6 years, 6 months ago

I'm waiting for the thinly veiled anti-Jewish post from mimi.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Were there some Palestinians who openly celebrated after the 9/11 attacks? Apparently so.Do the actions of relatively small number of people who happened to be captured on video justify the attacks on Gaza? If your answer is yes, then an attack on Lawrence by Israel is justified by the protests described in this story.And an attack on Lawrence by Hamas would be justified because so many of you are rejoicing at the ongoing slaughter of Palestinians.The simple truth is if one act of violence, or even someone cheering that act of violence, justifies another in response, then we will forever be stuck in a cycle of violence similar to the one that has Israelis and Palestinians stuck in an apparent pact of mutual suicide.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

This off again on again war will only end when one side unconditionally surrenders. To accomplish this many many men, women, and children will have to be killed. The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be. I didn't make the rules so there is no need to complain to me.

tin 6 years, 6 months ago

Again bozo, were can I read unbiased news so I can be enlightened to the truth? Name some sources PLEASE. And please name your new sources, I'd like to understand were you get your reasoning from.

ASBESTOS 6 years, 6 months ago

75,000 rockets. That is the number that Hamas has launch ed from Gaza into Israel since 2005. I think Israel has shown more than enough restraint, ans Hamas just showed it's gall.There will be peace when those that want to "kill all Jews" are gone. End of story.IF you are protesting against Israel, you cannot accurately judge what is "going on in the real world", and your judgement is clouded by a "closed mind".IF these idiots whom are supporting Palestine "want peace", there is a solution:"QUIT LAUNCHING ROCKETS".

Cooky_the_Cook 6 years, 6 months ago

West Tel Aviv.... because of all the Jews...ha ha ha ha... Oh, oh, man, stop, stop.... too funny... What do you call L.A.?

Harpo 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… The simple truth is if one act of violence, or even someone cheering that act of violence, justifies another in response, then we will forever be stuck in a cycle of violence similar to the one that has Israelis and Palestinians stuck in an apparent pact of mutual suicide.Bozo - fair enough. I have no problem with the above statement. I reject any position that rejoices in the death/suffering of civillians on either side. However I do believe that one can attempt to understand events and develop one's own opinion about those events without succumbing to the temptation to demonize those who hold an opposing, or different view. Perhaps that was not your intent. Lord knows you get demonized plenty for expressing your strongly held views. However the implication that the "right wing media" has programmed those of us who tend to have more symathy than you for the Israeli position is just as unfair as the "jew hater" accusations that get hurled at anyone who expresses legitimate criticism of Israeli actions.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Again bozo, were can I read unbiased news so I can be enlightened to the truth? Name some sources PLEASE."There is no such thing as an unbiased news source. Some are much less biased than others, but as humans, we all have our biases.There certainly are news sources who make a concerted effort to understand all the facts of any story, and report on them, even if that reporting is colored somewhat by the biases of the reporter(s) or reporting organization.All I can suggest to you is to seek out a variety of news sources, try to determine what their particular biases are, and consider carefully how much (or how little) their biases affect their reporting of the facts.That's what I try to do, and the conclusion that allows me to draw with regard to the Israeli/Palestinian issue is as follows--The establishment of Israel in 1948 was very ill-considered from the standpoint that it did not consider how people who had lived there for generations, mostly under some form of colonial rule, would react to being displaced by people whose families had mostly lived somewhere else for hundreds if not thousands of years. 60 years of conflict later, and the world is still paying the price for that.Still, Israel is a fact, and Israelis are not going anywhere. The Palestinians, who have been little more than an afterthought for the international community, pawns for the rest of the Arab world, and a thorn in the side for Israelis, are also not going anywhere. Both sides need to accept this, and I think a majority on each side actually has accepted that. But each side is still controlled by a violent, nationalistic and racist minority. Until the sane majorities on each side can wrest control from their insane minorities, the violence will continue-- unfortunately, US taxpayers will continue to pick up much of the cost.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Sigmund said--"This off again on again war will only end when one side unconditionally surrenders. To accomplish this many many men, women, and children will have to be killed. The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be. I didn't make the rules so there is no need to complain to me."Could clarify one thing for me? Should US taxpayers be subsidizing one side or the other in annihilating the other? Is there a rule on that?

I_AM_AN_ANARCHIST 6 years, 6 months ago

At least 4,897 Palestinians and 1,062 Israelishave been killed since September 29, 2000.-The Israeli Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territorieshttp://www.btselem.org/English/Statistics/Casualties.aspChildren Killed Israelis 123Palestinians 1,050http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stats/deaths.htmlAs far as palestinians cheering the 9-11 attacks the US has been funded Israel military operations and provided weapons and tools supplies since just after WWII. And look at all the people on this board cheering the invasion of Palestinian land right now. What do any of you actually know about what is going on over there? Have you talked to people that are from there, have you talked to people that have been there? Do you know what the conflict has done to both side or the christians that live their. Most of what I see on this board is ignorant talking point comments and it is sad that you seem to be able to write off an entire people because you are to lazy to go read and investigate for your selves and instead listen to what your fav tv talking head says is right.http://www.ifamericansknew.org/history/Israel attacked US navy and intersts in congress:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

oldvet 6 years, 6 months ago

"...then an attack on Lawrence by Israel is justified by the protests described in this story."Did I miss the part where the Lawrence protesters were firing rockets into Israel civilian populations...???!!!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Did I miss the part where the Lawrence protesters were firing rockets into Israel civilian populations…???!!!"No, but apparently you missed it when jayhawker4real implied that in his/her mind celebrations by some Palestinians on 9/11 on justified the mass murder of Palestinians today.

TheYetiSpeaks 6 years, 6 months ago

Here's what most of you cheering Israel are not getting: The war against extremism cannot be won on the battlefield. The war on terrorism is a battle for hearts and minds. While I believe that any country has the right to defend itself (including Israel), I believe that this offensive is a mistake. Almost the entire world except for the U.S. is decrying the invasion of Gaza. For each Palestinian killed we add 1,000 to their cause. For those of you he seem to think that the Israelis and the U.S. should exterminate everyone else in the Middle East who do not like us, I don't think you are grasping the gravity of the situation. Israel and the U.S. stand alone and if you think the other superpowers (i.e. Russia and China) will stand with us then you are sadly mistaken. We will not be the ones doing the exterminating. It will be done to us, if we cannot find diplomatic solutions to this "war".

Harpo 6 years, 6 months ago

TheYetiSpeaks - I agree substantially with your characterization of the geopolitical ramifications of this issue. And I believe it is entirely possible that the current offensive will turn out to have been ill-conceived, and will not advance the long- term Israeli goal of peaceful coexistence with the Palestinians. However the question remains; what is Israel to do in the face of ongoing attacks on it's citizens by an organization sworn to destroy it? Build more walls, higher walls? I do not suggest that I have the answers, or that there is any black & white way of viewing the issue. What I do believe is that the US is justified in supporting Israel's fundemental security, even while we must also recognize the legitimate grievances and suffering of the Palestinian people. There is no easy answer, but I do think that we have a moral obligation to aggresively pursue a diplomatic solution. I also believe that the vast majority of Israelis and Palestinians want such a solution, notwithstanding the zealots on both sides.

oldvet 6 years, 6 months ago

"No, but apparently you missed it when jayhawker4real implied that in his/her mind celebrations by some Palestinians on 9/11 on justified the mass murder of Palestinians today."Implied???!!! I read his post from 9:22 today, his only post on this thread, and he made no such claim... so not only do you have access to top secret documents, but now you can also read people's minds... wow, you are really something!!!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Protest all you want, but I have zero sympathy for any palestinian in gaza or the west bank."Reading comprehension problems, oldvet?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

" The innocent people being killed are the victims."Yep, Pink Sock, and by far the majority of innocent people dying happen to be Palestinians.

oldvet 6 years, 6 months ago

"jayhawker4real implied that in his/her mind celebrations by some Palestinians on 9/11 on justified the mass murder of Palestinians today."His statement says absolutely nothing of the sort that you implied!!! The comprehension problem is all in your mind...

ASBESTOS 6 years, 6 months ago

Duplenty there are 11 killed Israelis and now 9 soldiers as well.If you are going to report the "increase" in Palestinian deaths, you need to increase the Israeli "talley" as well.Watch what Barak said:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFbc98...

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"His statement says absolutely nothing of the sort that you implied!!!"Sorry, oldvet, but when someone says that they have no sympathy over the death of innocent people, that is actually much stronger than just an implication, as I previously stated. It's really just another way to say that they deserved to die. And why did they deserve to die? Because jayhawker4real happened to see video of some folks who live in the same area "celebrating" on 9/11.To me, that's no different from the mindset that allows Hamas to launch missiles into neighboring towns and villages. Jayhawker4real, to my knowledge, has just not implemented that mindset other than to cheer while Israelis mirror Hamas, only with much better weaponry.

mommy3 6 years, 6 months ago

WOW! The war in Israel is amazing. Gods hand is in this a a huge way. look at the death toll, tell me God isn't fighting for Israel like he always has????? I pray for peace, but when you start a war...you get what you asked for. Don't throw a punch and then ask to be left alone. Israel wants peace, Hamas asked for a serious butt kicking. Now they will get one.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"There are no innocents at the front."So good that you could conveniently declare that. I'm sure that the Israelis appreciate your absolution of their sins. I'm sure that the non-innocent dead babies deserve your condemnation.

independent_rebel 6 years, 6 months ago

Interesting discussion, but lets get to the only fact that matters.There will be no peace, ever, from groups like hamas, hezbollah, al-qaeda or any other radical islamist nation/group. No peace. Ever."Peace treaties," "cease-fire agreements," etc., are jokes that government leaders roll out so politicians can get their pictures in the paper. Waste of time. Are the weak-minded enablers on the left unable to accept the fact that these radical islamic terrorists will never, ever, stop until Israel is gone? When will people face the facts that once Israel is gone the United States and much of Europe will be the next target of the radical islamic terrorists to wipe off the face of the Earth.Until world leaders get tough and present an all-out war where these cowards can't hide behind the women and children, in mosques and schools, and if they do we go in and wipe them out anyway, then this war will never end.It's never going to end, because "that is what sets us apart from them" and we won't go in and do what is necessary to win the war on terror.It's really pathetic that the peace protesters are now marching about Israel's actions but have yet to ever protest the actions of any islamic terrorist group. Of course, the reason they only protest actions undertaken by the United States, Israel, and Europe is that they know that protesting against islamic terrorists would not do anything to curb the terrorists. They know terrorists don't care about freedom. They know terrorists target the innocent. They know terrorists don't give a damn about peace or any of the kumbaya garbage dished out by the folks marching in the streats holding peace signs.Wake up folks, the 1960s are over. I wish all we needed was love. I wish there was peace on earth. Once the smoke clears, a little thing call radical islam messed up the love-fest. These islamic wackjobs are never going to stop. Ever. The only two things that you and I could do to appease them to stop their terrorism is to either convert to islam or die. Well, since many of the peaceniks are atheists your only option is to die, correct?We need to wipe the islamic terrorists out, all of them, country to country, house to house, room to room. That is the only solution. Sure, it's probably impossible. That is why the next two decades are frightening to envision.Of course, even if we ever accomplished wiping out islamic extremism (and we'll all be dead because we won't), some other religious nut will proclaim their people, too, have been dissed, and it will start all over again.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 6 months ago

For how many years was Israel supposed to just let rockets continue to land in their yard, bombs strapped to women, children, men and people with mental disabilities exploding in their markets and restaurants.I believe they have shown more than enough restraint. I would not let someone bomb me regularly without finally hitting back.The world strongly supports a Palestine state, as do I, so I call on the people of Palestine to push the terrorist out from their Mosques and out of their hospitals and away from their schools and out of Palestine. No country should have a place for terrorists.

TacoBob 6 years, 6 months ago

AjiDeGallina, on this we agree. Well said.

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 6 months ago

Gaza has 450,000 squeezed into 58 square miles, smaller than the size of Washington D.C.. The port, border, and even jobs are controlled by Israel, and Palestinian land doesn't provide any jobs. You may ask, where does all these Palestinians come from? The answer is, the former Israel.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Mandate_PalestineYeap, Palestinians were the occupants after the Jews were rejected from that land. And of course, the British left the area and thus created all that mess. You can blame wars, you can blame rockets, but you cannot ignore history and the fact that most of these Palestinians owned that land before the Jews took it over. The Anti-Semitism that occupied Europe for many years had to be ejected from Europe and planted it in the Arab land. The last one to get the blame is always the colonizer.Today's Hamas is yesterday's Israelis underground.

bearded_gnome 6 years, 6 months ago

I believe they have shown more than enough restraint. I would not let someone bomb me regularly without finally hitting back.---Gallina hey Gallina,I just caught you in a huge inconsistancy! you decry the homicide bombers that went in and attacked Israel for those years. you know why their number dropped off in the past four years? ...wait for it ...because we took out Saddam. one of the stated reasons for taking him out was he was giving the families of homicide bombers $25K - $35k! so, now I guess you support our toppling of Saddam, thanks for coming around! Saddam also harbored other terrorists including Abu Nedal (sp?) formerly of the PLO. Hamas is committed from its organizational formation to destroy Israel.The government of Israel has never had as its goal the destruction of the Palestinians. the Palestinians elected Hamas, they are not to be infantalized, they voted, they got it! and a major disproportionate response actually is in the long run what causes fewer casualties civil and military, because overwhelming force stops the conflict, Clausewitz. a man hides behind women and children shooting out at others. the authorities kill him but kill or injur some of the "human shields " he had. who's fault? the criminal who started the shooting knowing the result, and who chose to hide behind civilians. every Palestinian death is on the heads of Hamas.LCPJ, and voices for Palestine, obviously antisemitic, didn't mind at all that Hamas was firing rockets. Israel gave up the Gaza, it surely didn't get them peace! people like LCPJ and the "voices" only serve to strengthen the evil, and promote the deaths of the civilized.

adfx 6 years, 6 months ago

Message to idiots:Go on, get all 'peace and love' pass that saudi (citi) sponsored pipe are around the room and learn the REAL truth.Gaza is complex. Hamas IS a terrorist organization.Do you like music? Well, there intellectual infants: hamas SHOOTS Palestinian people (yes other muslims) for SINGING and even listening to music at weddings.Watch here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6Wj33diNhUUnder Radical Islam: you won't have freedom and certainly NOT peace oh and your one year old daughter CAN be married off to an old pedophile (no i'm not joking) Watch here: btw this movie is MUSLIM made so no jew bashing. it's the truth: islam is not peace and is not a better system.http://www.thethirdjihad.comif that is your definition of peace and love, then I suggest you ask for your money back from the university and I suggest your parents cut you off, ship you to a sunni warzone (where they fight each other) and go learn what you think you know but you have NO idea.i commend you for good intentions and reprimand you that stand in alliance with hamas for basal, animalistic and most certainly, inferior intellect. Btw: you're welcome. You owe me big time.

laffn 6 years, 6 months ago

Check out the video KCUAC provides. Priceless. Nice work.

Bossa_Nova 6 years, 6 months ago

hey everybody, just be patient. as soon as the oil runs out over in the middleast, nobody will give a sh*t about the israeli/palestinian conflict and the money for weapons will stop flowing to both the israelis and palestinians and they will decide to make peace as the rest of the world's interests will have whithered away. i also find it interesting how the muslim and jewish communities in the middleast generally have gotten along throughout history except for a few instances and it seems like everytime the christians get involved the jews and muslims wind up hating each other. divide and conquer.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Claiming that Hamas is "hiding" behind civilians is rather meaningless, given that the Palestinian territories (Gaza and the West Bank) are the 13th most densely populated areas in the world, with 667 people per square kilometer (roughly 3 people per acre,) which is more than double the population density of Israel.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population_densityNo matter how "justified" you think Israel is in murdering a few hundred more of its neighbors, it will do nothing to end the cycle of violence. Quite the opposite will be the case, almost certainly.

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 6 months ago

Marion,as long as you call your hero a Holocaust deniar who said it was all greatly exagerated, I will continue to think you anti-semtic.Gnome,If that was the case for war, then that should have been the case for war, if the war was about toppling Sadam, then it should have been presented as a plan to change regimes. If the case for war that Sadam was dictator, then that should have been the case for the war. It wasn't, it was WMD's and Al-Quada and we have since found out that the intelegence to support that never really existed in the first place.It would be an ignoranty lie (from you???how shocking..jajaja) to suggest that becasue many of us believe that for a call to war, there must be truth and honestly prestented to the American people and especially to our brave fighting men and women before we put them into harms way that we supported Sadam.No one did. But I realize that you feel better saying things like that because you can not stand on truth, you can not stand on Constiutional integrety, you can not stand with American values..so you resort to lies, innuendo and sentiment to cover up your anti-patriotic failings.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

The Gaza Strip is actually much more densely populated than the other Palestinian territories.http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761579828/gaza_strip.html"The Gaza Strip has one of the highest overall growth rates and population densities in the world. The 2008 population was 1,537,269, giving the region a population density of 4,270 persons per sq km (11,060 per sq mi). More than half of Gazans live in the region's urban centers, the largest of which is the city of Gaza. Other cities and towns in the Gaza Strip include Khān Yūnus, Rafaḩ, Bayt Lāhiyah, and Jabāliyā."To put that in perspective, the city of Lawrence has a population density of less than 3000 per sq. mile-- which means that there are 4 times as many people packed into every square mile in Gaza as in Lawrence.If Douglas County were as densely populated as Gaza, it would have over 5 million residents (as opposed to the current 113,000.) That's like putting the entire population of Kansas and Nebraska in Douglas County.Also consider that it receives rainfall amounts similar to what sparsely populated W. Kansas gets, it has very little arable land, and Israel and Egypt have had a full blockade on it for decades.So, if you're a poor uneducated Palestinian kid, who's lived under a state of siege your whole life, with no opportunities to do anything with your life, would you find dying as a Hamas martyr at least no worse a choice than your other "options?"How many new potential martyrs have been created over the last week or so? How many Israelis now cheering this act of pure vengeance will find themselves or a member of their family or one of their neighbors dead or injured at the hands of one of these new martyrs?

yazzyyasmeen 6 years, 6 months ago

For all of the uneducated people out there(twosides and skinny for example) What's going on over there has nothing to do with 9-11, so basically what you're saying is that if a convicted killer lives in colorado(example), every single person living in the US is a convicted killer?Because what you seem to be saying is that all people living in the ME are terrorists. A bit of info for you all, i live in the ME and i see the news here, and Hamas has nothing to do with it, the only people suffering are innocent women, men and children. Israel stole their land and they are all too stuck up to admit it. The News in the US puts only what they want you to beleive and see, at least be smart enough to realize that.

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 6 months ago

Hey everyone here... does blaming Hamas, and continuous bombing of Gaza help on anything? Has it bring peace? Has thrashing the Islamic religion and makes it a terrorist religion makes the Middle East a better place? Look deep into the region, understand and then solve the problem. Even we know here in the US, we need to compromise when we want to pass a bill. Israel and Palestinians, no matter how terrorists belong to Hamas, still need to have a middle stand, and Israel needs to recognize Hamas and both must start talking.Given the current solution (keep bombing and retaliation), there can only be one solution: Kill all the Muslims in the world. Then, we'll achieve what these group of people have always wanted.

skinny 6 years, 6 months ago

yazzyyasmeen, Nobody cares what happens over there. That is their problem, not ours!We do not need another Vietnam, we have our own problems to worry about here in the U.S.One of them is getting out of the middle east!

Flap Doodle 6 years, 6 months ago

Does Hamas blaming Israel and shooting rockets and mortars into Israel help on anything?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Does Hamas blaming Israel and shooting rockets and mortars into Israel help on anything?"Not sure what you mean by the "blaming Israel" part, but shooting rockets and mortars is nothing more than a violent and deadly tantrum and completely counterproductive. Israel's actions are equally juvenile and criminal, only on a much larger scale.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

Hamas, the democratically elected Palestinian representatives in Gaza, is dedicated in both words and deed to the total destruction of Israel. This on again off again war will only end when one side or the other unconditionally surrenders. The problem seems to be that neither side is willing or able to kill in sufficient numbers to force the other to sue for peace. To accomplish this many many more men, women, and children will have to be killed. The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be. As soon has Iran has nuclear weapons it will be game over for the state of Israel as they will show no restraint or mercy.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

I repeat my questions from above, Sigmund--"Could clarify one thing for me? Should US taxpayers be subsidizing one side or the other in annihilating the other? Is there a rule on that?"

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Hamas, the democratically elected Palestinian representatives in Gaza, is dedicated in both words and deed to the total destruction of Israel."Another question, Sigmund-- Although Israel never (officially) says that it wants to wipe Arabs or Muslims off the planet, year in and year out they cause much more death and destruction on Arabs and Muslims than vice-versa, and take full possession of more and more Palestinian land. Is that significant at all, and if so, what does it signify? If it's irrelevant, please explain.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

What about the children, Marion? You forgot the children.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

But of course, Marion, we know you couldn't have forgotten the children, being the great humanitarian that you are. That's so noble that you'll be moving to Gaza to adopt all 500,000 orphans you want to create.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "Could clarify one thing for me? Should US taxpayers be subsidizing one side or the other in annihilating the other? Is there a rule on that?”That question is political question for the incoming Obama Administration and above my pay grade. But if I am forced to answer I think Hillary Clinton believes (as does Condoleezza Rice) that US strategic interests in the area are better served by supporting Israel. just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "If it's irrelevant, please explain."It is indeed irrelevant. "Proportionality" or "wars of attrition" have only served to prolong the current conflict for many decades now and has proven not work. There must be a clear winner before the conflict ends and the sooner the better. As for questions on who is "right" or "who committed what atrocities on whom," history is written by the winner.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"US strategic interests in the area are better served by supporting Israel."And what are those interests? Are they really "US" interests, or is that just the usual code-word for the vested interests who like to claim that their interests are the equivalent of "US" interests?" As for questions on who is “right” or “who committed what atrocities on whom,” history is written by the winner."So does that mean that Israel should just go ahead and set up the death camps and get it over with?

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… “And what are those interests? Are they really “US” interests, or is that just the usual code-word for the vested interests who like to claim that their interests are the equivalent of “US” interests?"What I said was "I think Hillary Clinton believes (as does Condoleezza Rice) that US strategic interests in the area are better served by supporting Israel." Do you disagree with US policy? If so take it up with President-elect Obama. You might start by declaring him a war criminal and throwing your shoe at him.just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "So does that mean that Israel should just go ahead and set up the death camps and get it over with?"Death camps requires taking prisoners which I don't think is really necessary, but I do think that Israel should keep firmly in their minds the last time they faced death camps and realize the costs of defeat are as they prosecute this war.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Do you disagree with US policy?"Most definitely."If so take it up with President-elect Obama. You might start by declaring him a war criminal and throwing your shoe at him."Unfortunately, he looks to be going for a bit too much "continuity" with BushCo policies, especially in the ME, which would put him dangerously close to war criminal territory. But I have no intentions of throwing any shoes at him."but I do think that Israel should keep firmly in their minds the last time they faced death camps and realize the costs of defeat are as they prosecute this war."Do you mean WWII? When the Germans (and much of the rest of Europe) tried to wipe out the Jews, the war ended before they could finish the job. Are you implying that this war might end before Israel can wipe out the Palestinians?

adfx 6 years, 6 months ago

just another bozo:modern musilm reform movement is TIRED OF YOUR LIEShamas women (who are often married to their cousins) are baby factories and you know it's true they have used their own infants as suicide bombershamas is SICK SICK SICK faction of islam

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… “Unfortunately, he (President-elect Barack Obama) looks to be going for a bit too much “continuity” with BushCo policies, especially in the ME, which would put him dangerously close to war criminal territory. But I have no intentions of throwing any shoes at him."Not the "hope and change" you were hoping for? Get used to it because you are in for four years of many more disappointments. You might want to start start practicing now with those size 33 floppy clown shoes.just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… “Are you implying that this war might end before Israel can wipe out the Palestinians?"Not implying anything, I stated it plainly. Perhaps reading it again will make it more clear. "Hamas, the democratically elected Palestinian representatives in Gaza, is dedicated in both words and deed to the total destruction of Israel. This on again off again war will only end when one side or the other unconditionally surrenders. The problem seems to be that neither side is willing or able to kill in sufficient numbers to force the other to sue for peace. To accomplish this many many more men, women, and children will have to be killed. The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be. As soon has Iran has nuclear weapons it will be game over for the state of Israel as they will show no restraint or mercy."

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"As soon has Iran has nuclear weapons it will be game over for the state of Israel as they will show no restraint or mercy.”""Restraint" and "mercy" are hardly hallmarks of Israeli policy, as the past few days (and decades) have shown. And don't you think that Israel's nukes will have some effect on how things go? Perhaps you mean we all need to start planning for the aftermath of nuclear holocaust when you say, " The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be."

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"Even more interesting that some believe that a “peaceful solution” can be imposed from outside the area"Given the billions of US tax dollars invested in Israel's search for a military solution, don't you think that is equally "ignorant arrogance?""As an aside, when will the western media stop being used by combatants that only allow posed or approved images to be released?"Strawman argument. And as an aside, Israel is imposing a news blackout on its invasion of Gaza. "One would think that PA territories are solely populated with hospitals and primary schools."In a territory 1/3 the size of Douglas County, with a population density 4 times that of the city of Lawrence, there are probably lots of hospitals and schools, dontcha think?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"A “military” solution is not, by definition, a “peaceful” solution, so your attempt at equating the “ignorance” only demonstrates your own willful ignorance."I guarantee you I wasn't attempting to equate them. But your contention that "imposing" a peaceful solution from without is "arrogantly ignorant," (or was it "ignorantly arrogant?") is blatantly hollow, given that no such attempt has been seriously made, and the only serious effort from without has been to impose a military solution, to the tune of $billions in military aid. And not just to Israel. $Billions have been spent propping up a rather brutal dictatorship in Egypt, and a monarchy in Jordon, to keep them on the sidelines."Or perhaps you just have an anti-USA bias?"Exactly what is an "anti-USA" bias? Do you get to define that all by yourself, or is it a group project?

AjiDeGallina 6 years, 6 months ago

Marion, the anti Semite,I laugh so hard everytime you ask about warrents. It shows how cheap and pathetic you are, what a liar you are, how empty and hallow you are.You are a racist, you are a liar, you have nothing of value to offer. You are clearly one of the most pathetic cases and I feel such pity for your empty hollow mind and dishonest values.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says… "CIA, “Secret Cable from Headquarters [Blueprint for Fomenting A Coup Climate], September 27, 1970,” in Peter Kornbluh, The Pinochet File: A Declassified Dossier on Atrocity and Accountability"404 Link not found. In fact just exactly how is Abu Ghraib related the current situation between Israel and Gaza? If your point is both sides should take no prisoners and simply kill the enemy on the battlefield, I am in total agreement. Otherwise your point, like the link above is missing.

Bossa_Nova 6 years, 6 months ago

what's happening in the middleast isnt going to end until the oil is gone. then after the unfunded by the west wars have taken their course, whoever is left will want peace. all i have to say to my friends in israel is you better hurry up and try to make friends with your arab neighbors, because after their oil is gone, uncle same and the europeans, the chinese, japanese, etc wont have a use for you anymore. it's unfortunate but it's true. for the sake of your grandchildren, you better come up with a better strategy for peace.

Harpo 6 years, 6 months ago

75x55 (Anonymous) says… "Curious how many people posting here think there is some kind of peaceful solution to this long-running conflict. Even more interesting that some believe that a “peaceful solution” can be imposed from outside the area - such as from the US or the EU."I remember the same being said with regard to Northern Ireland. The U.S. (George Mitchell) certainly played a strong role in helping to broker (not impose) a peaceful solution to that long-running , religiously fueled, violent conflict. Not a perfect analogy, I concede. But I think given the right conditions and right leaders (post Hamas undoubtedly) diplomacy still has a chance to succeed in reaching a viable two state solution. Syria needs to be brought into the mix. They have shown some indication that a "peace for the Golan Heights" deal is still in their interest which the Israelis seem ready to move forward on as well. This could drive a wedge between Syria and Iran and hopefully diminish the funding and arming of the most radical Palestinian groups. This kind of broad strategy, I believe, is the only chance to create an environment in which a negotiated settlement can be reached.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

Bossa_Nova (Anonymous) says… "all i have to say to my friends in israel is you better hurry up and try to make friends with your arab neighbors, because after their oil is gone, uncle same and the europeans, the chinese, japanese, etc wont have a use for you anymore."After the oil is gone (decades at least in the future) the Arab nations will not have the wealth to wage war. Unless camels and sand suddenly become incredibly rare and scarce.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

duplenty (Anonymous) says… "Is everyone in Gaza a part of Hamas? Are the children of Gaza affiliated with Hamas?"Hamas was democratically elected by a majority of the Palestinians. If Egypt wished they could open their borders for refugees but honestly they want nothing to do with the Palestinians nor Hamas. Max1 pointed out that even Iraqi Prime Minister, Nouri al-Maliki, has noted the lack of support by Arab nations for Hamas, but neither is he offering help.

skinny 6 years, 6 months ago

KCUAC, Ask me if I care!!! As far as I am concerned they can all go back home where they can fight for what they believe in instead of crying and marching up and down the streets here in the U.S. Again, nobody cares!! Do you know how many different religions there are? And they believe their god is the only god! Next thing you know they will be believing in Santa Claus too!!

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

Harpo (Anonymous) says… "I remember the same being said with regard to Northern Ireland. The U.S.(George Mitchell) certainly played a strong role in helping to broker (not impose) a peaceful solution to that long-running , religiously fueled, violent conflict. Not a perfect analogy, I concede. But I think given the right conditions and right leaders (post Hamas undoubtedly) diplomacy still has a chance to succeed in reaching a viable two state solution."It is a pretty good analogy and was a huge success for the Clinton Administration, but Ireland's economy was ready to take off and was going to make both sides prosperous if they could come to a power sharing arrangement in Ireland and end the violence. I also remember both Catholics and Protestants condemning the violence of their radicals. Those conditions do not currently exist nor are they likely in the near future.The Clinton Administration came very close to another foreign policy success in 2000 at Camp David with Israel and the Palestinian Authority but it was eventually rejected by Yasser Arafat.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_Camp_David_Summit

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"I also remember both Catholics and Protestants condemning the violence of their radicals. Those conditions do not currently exist nor are they likely in the near future."Actually, those conditions do exist. Unfortunately, the far-right religious wackos of Israel have a stranglehold on Israeli policy, and with endless funds from the US with which to carry it out, it's not likely to change until we withdraw the funding. I hope Obama realizes this as only the Israelis are in a position to take the first step towards peace. The Palestinians lead such a hand-to-mouth existence, and have been so beaten down by both their Arab brethren on one side and the Israelis on the other, the most violent elements among them are able to call the shots (pun intended.) Taking the Israeli guns from their heads is the only way this endless standoff will change.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "Actually, those conditions do exist."No they don't. There is nothing that can be called a modern economy in Gaza unlike Israel. I have seen no Palestinians calling for a end to the Hamas violence, all I see here is a Palestinian protest of Israel. But if you have links please feel free to provide them.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

"There is nothing that can be called a modern economy in Gaza unlike Israel."Israel has pretty much made sure that couldn't happen." I have seen no Palestinians calling for a end to the Hamas violence,"Then you haven't been looking very hard.

gl0ck0wn3r 6 years, 6 months ago

Ah... "peaceful" pro-terrorist, trustfund anarchists:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwDZspw5zpMContrast the totally rational behavior on one side with the insanity on the other side.I'm sure this woman in Northern California means "a peaceful inner struggle"http://www.daylife.com/photo/01Gk2RO22Bbyd/demonstration_anaheim

gl0ck0wn3r 6 years, 6 months ago

Oh and over in Eurabia:http://www.cphpost.dk/index.php/news/43912-shooting-tied-to-gaza-conflict.html"Two Israeli men were shot and wounded by a Palestinian-Dane on Wednesday afternoon in the Funen city of Odense. Police have no motive for the shooting yet but believe it may be tied to the recent escalation of the military conflict in Gaza.""Police indicated that the stand's employees had been routinely harassed by a group of about ten people since it opened last month."

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Orwell, Blinding Tribalism, Selective Terrorism, and Israel/Gazahttp://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2009/01/04/terrorism/index.htmlby Glenn GreenwaldFormer McCain-Palin campaign spokesman and current Weekly Standard editor Michael Goldfarb notes that Israel, a couple of days ago, dropped a 2,000-pound bomb on a Gazan home which killed a top Hamas leader . . . in addition to 18 others, including his four wives and nine of his children. About the killing of those innocent civilians, Goldfarb writes (h/t John Cole via email):"The fight against Islamic radicals always seems to come around to whether or not they can, in fact, be deterred, because it's not clear that they are rational, at least not like us. But to wipe out a man's entire family, it's hard to imagine that doesn't give his colleagues at least a moment's pause. Perhaps it will make the leadership of Hamas rethink the wisdom of sparking an open confrontation with Israel under the current conditions."That, of course, is just a slightly less profane version of Marty Peretz's chest-beating proclamation that the great value of the attack on Gaza is to teach those Arabs a lesson: "do not f*ck with the Jews."There are few concepts more elastic and subject to exploitation than "Terrorism," the all-purpose justifying and fear-mongering term. But if it means anything, it means exactly the mindset which Goldfarb is expressing: slaughtering innocent civilians in order to "send a message," to "deter" political actors by making them fear that continuing on the same course will result in the deaths of civilians and -- best of all, from the Terrorist's perspective -- even their own children and other family members.To the Terrorist, by definition, that innocent civilians and even children are killed isn't a regrettable cost of taking military action. It's not a cost at all. It's a benefit. It has strategic value. Goldfarb explicitly says this: "to wipe out a man's entire family, it's hard to imagine that doesn't give his colleagues at least a moment's pause." That, of course, is the very same logic that leads Hamas to send suicide bombers to slaughter Israeli teenagers in pizza parlors and on buses and to shoot rockets into their homes. It's the logic that leads Al Qaeda to fly civilian-filled airplanes into civilian-filled office buildings. And it's the logic that leads infinitely weak and deranged people like Goldfarb and Peretz to find value in the killing of innocent Palestinians, including -- one might say, at least in Goldfarb's case: especially -- children.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

I see nothing in the Salon article to indicate there is any real economy in Gaza (other than missiles and homicide bomb belts) that would flourish after ending the conflict nor any Palestinian opposition to Hamas. The conditions are not the same as Ireland. I am sorry, but it just isn't there.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

If anybody would let you near theirs, Marion... I shudder to think.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Perhaps if Israel would stop it's economic warfare on the Palestinians, Sigmund, maybe you could could quit blaming them for not having what they have been actively denied.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

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Sean Livingstone 6 years, 6 months ago

"Marion (Marion Lynn) says…It is my sincere hope that Israel decimates Hamas to the last man and woman."Good only exists because the bad exists at the same time. God exists because devil exists at the same time. Love exists because hate exists at the same time. Israel exists because Hamas exists at the same time. Christians exist because non-Christians exist at the same time. The good can be bad, just as the bad can be good. If your bad cholesterol is too low, it's still not good for you. If you eat too much vegetable, you will still gain weight and fat. Eat in moderation, see the world in moderation, and believe in God in moderation. No one really knows who God is. So no one is smart enough to know why Hamas exist. It's very unGodly to want a group of people to be decimated. Hamas has fired plenty of rockets into Israel, but it has not wiped out Israel like it likes to claim. Your fear and worries are not just pointless, it's emptiness. God Bless you Marion. If someone slap you on your face, let them slap you on the other side. An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth is not God-like.

yazzyyasmeen 6 years, 6 months ago

Skinny,Everyone believes that their god is the only god.Again, you're bringing things into this debate that has nothing to do with it.Santa claus??????

yazzyyasmeen 6 years, 6 months ago

Marion,what do you mean, "the founder of which raped children"?Maybe you should do some reading and find out more before you make a fool of yourself in front of hundreds.Islam forbids such a thing, and muslims take their religion seriously. Maybe you should take a look at the news and see how many rapists are living freely in the us.BTW, Muhammad wasn't the founder of islam. You should thank me for that bit of info so you don't make yourself look more stupid than you already have.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Marion makes comment after comment advocating the murder of children, and my posts are the ones that get removed. Go figure.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "Perhaps if Israel would stop it's economic warfare on the Palestinians, Sigmund, maybe you could could quit blaming them for not having what they have been actively denied."I am not blaming anyone, I am simply stating the facts. I didn't make the facts so there is really no use blaming me for them. There is nothing that can be called a modern economy in Gaza unlike Israel. I have seen no Palestinians calling for a end to the Hamas violence, all I see here is a Palestinian protest of Israel. And it is no use blaming Israel either as the Palestinians seem to be able to get an abundance of rockets and suicide belts into Gaza despite Israeli opposition. So perhaps a Palestinian economy based on less lethal items might be helpful in creating the conditions necessary for peace.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

“Marion (Marion Lynn) says... "It is my sincere hope that Israel decimates Hamas to the last man and woman.”Technically decimate would not be of "every last man or women."dec⋅i⋅mate /ˈdɛsəˌmeɪt/ –verb (used with object), -mat⋅ed, -mat⋅ing.1. to destroy a great number or proportion of: The population was decimated by a plague.2. to select by lot and kill every tenth person of.3. Obsolete. to take a tenth of or from.Perhaps you meant annihilate?an⋅ni⋅hi⋅late /əˈnaɪəˌleɪt/ –verb (used with object), -lat⋅ed, -lat⋅ing.1. to reduce to utter ruin or nonexistence; destroy utterly: The heavy bombing almost annihilated the city.2. to destroy the collective existence or main body of; wipe out: to annihilate an army.3. to annul; make void: to annihilate a law.4. to cancel the effect of; nullify.5. to defeat completely; vanquish: Our basketball team annihilated the visiting team.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 6 months ago

Dance around it all you want, Sigmund, but you're blaming the victims, clear and simple.

Sigmund 6 years, 6 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says… "Dance around it all you want, Sigmund, but you're blaming the victims, clear and simple."Since when did stating the obvious facts become "dancing around" the issue? I have stated my belief plainly and nothing, absolutely nothing, you have said changes it. Hamas, the democratically elected Palestinian representatives in Gaza, is dedicated in both words and deed to the total destruction of Israel. This on again off again war will only end when one side or the other unconditionally surrenders. The problem seems to be that neither side is willing or able to kill in sufficient numbers to force the other to sue for peace. To accomplish this many many more men, women, and children will have to be killed. The sooner this is accomplished the better off everyone (including any surviving vanquished) will be. As soon has Iran has nuclear weapons it will be game over for the state of Israel as they will show no restraint or mercy.Perhaps it is you who is having problems dancing around in those silly size 33 clown shoes of yours?

Shane Garrett 6 years, 6 months ago

my religion states I should love the enemy. What does your religion say?

tin 6 years, 5 months ago

The Palestinian propaganda machine at work.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_B1H-1opysSad thing is to many people fall for there lies and misleading media. Many of you have be fooled by the lies of the Palestinians.

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says… "The 1998 arrest of General Augusto Pinochet in Britain brought renewed attention to the dark days of his dictatorship and raised questions about America's role in bringing the General and his henchmen to power."What exactly does this have to do with the Israeli conflict in Gaza with the Palestinians?

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says… "People need to know what the truth is or else they will blindly follow people like you, Sigmund, which can only get more of us killed."If your point is that if people wish to kill us then we should kill them first then I completely agree. People can hate with or without reason. The history of WWII indicates that former enemies can become allies at the end of a war, but only if that war is won. That mean one side wins decisively and the other surrenders unconditionally. That is accomplished by killing so many men, women and children of the enemy that those that remain cannot stomach anymore carnage on their population.If you believe that the conflict between Arab and Israeli or Muslim and Jew is because of the US, then you need to read a few more history books. But if you have some other point please state it clearly so that we can discuss it. Otherwise your posting is really meaningless trivia or at least not relevant to the situation in Gaza.

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Ahh, I see "Chicago School economics" free market economy and decentralize control of the economy, oh the horror! What kind of economics is currently practiced in the Middle East?

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says… "Not sure what it is now because the privatization and deregulation plans have failed in Iraq. The Bush regime realized that it couldn't kill all of the Iraqi people or force them into submission so American corporations have been leaving Iraq since last year, some in 2006."The problems decades old problems between Israel and the Palestinians in Gaza is because the Bush Administration couldn't kill all the Iraqi's so the Chicago Boys could privatize and decentralize Iraq economy because of Pinochet in Chile. Got it. Great point. As I am quite sure no one else has made those connections please be sure to let President elect Obama and Hillary Clinton know of your analysis and recommendations immediately!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

OK, Sigmund, then you're not blaming the victims. You're just wrong.

ASBESTOS 6 years, 5 months ago

If the Arab world wants this to end and to have a "cease fire", then tell Hamas to stop launching rockets.They launched 37 today.The "School" that was hit by Israeli ordinance? They have cockpit footage of them using a mortar in the school yard, and going and getting ammunition from within the school.That is Hamas for you, using a school full of childres as a forward fire control base for light artillery.All they need to do is stop using mortars and rockets, and Israel will stop.It is that simple.

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says… "Give me a break, Sigmund. You show up, I educate you, you leave."I'm back.Windlass (Anonymous) says… "No, Iraq is the latest scenario in the 50-year history of our government overthrowing foreign governments. The overthrow of Allende is the one that began it all. The CIA has overthrown democracies on every continent. The Arab world is the “last frontier” for Friedman-style economic shock therapy.Once again with Chile and Milton Friedman. Once again I ask, what style of economics did any of these countries have prior and what style of economics exists in Gaza that the US wants. I tend to believe that that the current conflict erupted because of rocket attacks into Israel from Gaza from the Palestinians who want to destroy Israel. I'm such a tool.Windlass (Anonymous) says…"Sigmund's just being an idiot."Probably, but for discussing a complex situation with such a simple mind like yours. My IQ goes down every time I read your posts.

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 5 months ago

Marion,"Mohammed was merely the Prophet of Islam who raped children unless the texts of Muslim are to be disbelieved.If a nine-year old “wife” was not a chlld, please tell me waht she would have been!"Your pure ignorance is very appalling to me.

Chris Golledge 6 years, 5 months ago

The Gaza situation is a matter of trust; is it not?The Israelis don't trust Hamas to quit shooting rockets at their women and children and so maintain as much control as they can over what materials flow into Gaza. Hamas doesn't trust Israel to open their borders so that they can have a chance at economic prosperity and so attempt to persuade them with missiles. How you inject trust (and peace) into that mess is quite a puzzle.Few more thoughts:Regarding the outrage over Israel killing civilians, including women and children, sorry, but then, who were the targets of Hamas' munitions?Regarding the claim that Hamas has no choice in from where to fire their weapons - all locations have civilians, if you bring up Google Earth, there appear to be a lot of open ground/fields in Gaza.Seems to me that if you've been hitting a prizefighter in the back of the head with spitballs, you shouldn't act outraged when he turns around and clobbers you.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

"Regarding the outrage over Israel killing civilians, including women and children, sorry, but then, who were the targets of Hamas' munitions?"So what you're saying is that targeting civilians is perfectly acceptable for Israel, but not for Hamas."Regarding the claim that Hamas has no choice in from where to fire their weapons - all locations have civilians, if you bring up Google Earth, there appear to be a lot of open ground/fields in Gaza."Given the disparity in weapons systems between Hamas and Israel, what you are suggesting is tantamount suicide for Hamas. If they are going to be required to commit suicide to save Israel the bad PR of killing civilians, I expect that they would prefer to just to do suicide bombings. And I'm sure that if the US would supply them with $3 billion in military aid every year, they'd be happy to duke it out with Israel with the same F-16's, Black Hawk helicopters and tanks that Israel uses, if you think that would be "fighting fair.""Seems to me that if you've been hitting a prizefighter in the back of the head with spitballs, you shouldn't act outraged when he turns around and clobbers you."This is not a prizefight between two individuals. The civilians getting killed in Gaza didn't hit Israel with either missiles or spitballs.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

More strawman arguments, 75X55-- no one is defending Hamas or its tactics. Quite the contrary, pretty much everybody condemns their actions.Duplenty and I, and others here, just choose to be consistent and condemn Israel for very similar actions which happen to be many times more deadly than Hamas's actions.

wheatridge 6 years, 5 months ago

Bozo - Just curious. Is diplomacy your answer, and if so, would it be the sort of diplomacy that you use so effectively here? How many hearts and minds have you been able to change?

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 5 months ago

75x55 (Anonymous) says…"Nice twist - 'oh, they're just the guys next door…'Sorry - in this incident, the Hamas scum were purposely using a structure sheltering non-combantants ( that's “sheltering”, not “little Jimmy's house”) as a shield, and ammunition storage. IF you care to go look, you'll find that the explosions that killed these innocent victims was not primarily from Israeli ordnance, but the secondary explosions of the Hamas' cache."If a strategy works, why change? If Hamas places itself at a deserted area in Gaza, and allow Israel to shoot at them, I will call that stupid. Israel has some of the best military systems in the world, do you think Hamas didn't know about that? And you think Israel will be that stupid not knowing that the missiles fired from Gaza came from the heavily populated areas? With one of the best military systems in the world, I suspect the Israelis intentionally fired their retaliation rockets into these areas to show the world how "despicable" the Hamas are. Come on! Both Hamas and Israel are not stupid. The only difference is that one side has all the money, and one side has all the human beings. Whatever works babe, whatever works!

Satirical 6 years, 5 months ago

Duplenty…All you have provided is evidence there are some innocent victims in this war started by Hamas. Duh!When Hamas uses children as sandbags this is unfortunately going to happen. Hamas is responsible for firing rockets at innocent Israelis and responsible for the deaths of innocent Palestinians.While no one wants these deaths to occur I have not heard a viable alternative than returning firing when you are fired upon. You almost assume that the Israelis are either (1) targeting innocent children/civilians or (2) Don’t care if innocent children die as long as they get their target. However, in all likelihood neither of these are correct. (1) Israel does not target innocent children/civilians, (2) the methods they use to protect themselves and their troops are designed to reduce the number of innocent casualties but unfortunately such is a part of war. Everyone hopes Israel is using tactics and weaponry to reduce innocent deaths, but the difference is I assume they are already doing so, and you seem to assume they are not. Simply because innocent people die isn’t proof one way or another. If there is direct evidence to the contrary then I would question whether that particular engagement was handled correctly, but you will have a hard time convincing me Israel just doesn’t care about innocent lives.

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 5 months ago

"duplenty,The greater point, which I won't debate, is this:I do not value the lives of Israeli civilians above the lives of Palestinian civilians. An innocent is an innocent, regardless of creed or nationality.Being that a far greater number of Palestinian civilians have died, it's interesting that you would raise the spectre of racism against me."Worth per life of the Israelis civilians is far greater than the worth per life of the Palestinians. The population in Gaza is much denser than in Israel, so casualties will definitely be higher in Gaza. The leaderships from both sides are not stupid, probably too smart. My solution: Let both sides kill each other, until both sides get wiped out, then, the Messiah will come! :P Cheers.

Sean Livingstone 6 years, 5 months ago

Satirical (Anonymous) says…"You almost assume that the Israelis are either (1) targeting innocent children/civilians or (2) Don’t care if innocent children die as long as they get their target. However, in all likelihood neither of these are correct. (1) Israel does not target innocent children/civilians, (2) the methods they use to protect themselves and their troops are designed to reduce the number of innocent casualties but unfortunately such is a part of war."Israel has one of the best military systems in the world. They have one of the best military intelligence, and I can even say that theirs are much better than ours. So, don't they know if they retaliate, innocent civilians will be killed?"Everyone hopes Israel is using tactics and weaponry to reduce innocent deaths, but the difference is I assume they are already doing so, and you seem to assume they are not. Simply because innocent people die isn’t proof one way or another. If there is direct evidence to the contrary then I would question whether that particular engagement was handled correctly, but you will have a hard time convincing me Israel just doesn’t care about innocent lives."Religion.... my friend... religion...

Satirical 6 years, 5 months ago

Israel has 3 options when attacked with rockets:(1) Defend themselves and try to stop the rocket attacks. This will temporarily stop the rocket attacks, or(2) Do nothing and let all of their citizens die/ surrender to Hamas, or(3) Give into Hamas’ demands (negotiate a cease-fire). This will temporarily stop the rocket attacks by Hamas until they want more demands met with their ultimate goal of the destruction of Israel. It will also cause other groups such a Lebanon to attack Israel because it sees Israel will give into any demands because they are unwilling to defend themselves (for fear from the international community, or fear of raising a new generation of terrorist). The end result here is the same end result in (2), the destruction of Israel.The next generation of Palestinians are going to hate the Israelis for killing civilians (ignoring the facts, just as many do, that this was accidental), or they will hate the Israelis for same reason their parents were taught to hate them. In the end Israelis will be hated no matter what action they take. The solution in both circumstances is education of objective truth.

Satirical 6 years, 5 months ago

Livingstone…“So, don't they know if they retaliate, innocent civilians will be killed?”Of course Israel realizes innocent civilians will be killed in an attempt to destroy Hamas, since historically Hamas' tactics are to use humans as shields so when innocent people die fools will claim Israel was targeting them on purpose. Israel realizign this uses weapons and tactics to minimize the deaths of innocent; but reducing the number to zero is impossible even with today’s technology given Hamas' cowardly tactics of using children as sandbags. If Israel were targeting civilians or didn’t care if they died, then they wouldn’t be invading the country with ground troops, they would just be pressing buttons from home and wipe out the whole region.Again, what alternative do they have to defending themselves when being attacked? (see my post at 3:11 today)

Bossa_Nova 6 years, 5 months ago

i'm glad obama is going to be president. he might actually try to make peace in the middleast

labmonkey 6 years, 5 months ago

If a Quebec separatist group started firing rockets into the United States and the Canadian government chose to do nothing about it, you could be damn sure we would be invading Canada. This is what you have with Israel. Bossa- every President has tried and failed to make peace in the middle east. The only way the Muslim world will be happy is with the abolition of the state of Israel...which of course will never happen. Israel has every right to defend itself against terrorists who either hide behind, or brainwash/subjugate women and children.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

"If a Quebec separatist group started firing rockets into the United States and the Canadian government chose to do nothing about it, you could be damn sure we would be invading Canada. This is what you have with Israel."That is truly absurd. Hamas is not a separatist group, it is actually the elected government of Gaza. And the United States has not taken over the "separatists'" land, herded them into refugee camps on a small strip of land and held them in a state of siege for more than a generation, as Israel has done.Just a little hint-- next time you want to draw an analogy, you might try finding situations that have at least glimmer of similarity.

gl0ck0wn3r 6 years, 5 months ago

Ok then... if the elected leadership of a Native-American tribe started firing rockets into Lawrence from "tribal land," I am pretty sure the faux progressives in Lawrence might change their minds. Closer?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

Your silly analogies are a waste of time. The only equation that's required to understand this situation is that Israel is just as guilty of being violent, vengeful a$$holes as Hamas is. The only difference is that Israel is more efficient and effective at killing innocent people.Until grownups on each side get control, the cycle of violence will continue, much to the delight of you bloodthirsty children on this forum.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

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Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Windlass (Anonymous) says.. "Chapter 3, p. 104 - The Shock Doctrine." Too bad none of this (nor any of your rantings) has anything to do with the current Gaza, Israel, and Palestinians.

Sigmund 6 years, 5 months ago

Oh by the way windlass, you forgot to end with "Death to America"

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

"Bozo, why is Hamas attacking Israel with rockets?"This is a stupid question, Marion, but what else should I expect from you?The reasons for Hamas's attacks are blatantly obvious. They are the very same reasons Israel has now murdered over 700 Palestinians over the last two weeks. Racist nationalists are in control on each side, and both sides depend politically on maintaining the cycle of violence.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

BTW, just to set the record straight, it was Israel who broke the last ceasefire, not Hamas. They did it first on November 4th when they killed six Palestinians in Gaza and second on November 17th when they killed four more Palestinians.

Chris Golledge 6 years, 5 months ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus (Anonymous) says…“Regarding the outrage over Israel killing civilians, including women and children, sorry, but then, who were the targets of Hamas' munitions?”"So what you're saying is that targeting civilians is perfectly acceptable for Israel, but not for Hamas."No, I'm saying it is the pot calling the kettle black. But, I'm also not convinced that Israel is targeting civilians specifically; so far they've been able to claim a military target was the objective. Yeah, the UN guy says he doesn't think that any Hamas people were at the school/shelter, but I wonder how carefully he was checking the ID of all the people coming to the shelter. Israel specifically named individuals; I don't think you name individuals unless you have some information.As, to the rest, I think you have misinterpreted my meaning. For instance, there is no moral right or wrong associated with being a prizefighter, just a level of fighting ability implied.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 5 months ago

"But, I'm also not convinced that Israel is targeting civilians specifically;"It's impossible to attack a densely populated area like Gaza the way Israel is doing without inflicting heavy casualties on the civilian population. So the decision to carry out such attacks means the civilian deaths can be described no other way than intentional."Yeah, the UN guy says he doesn't think that any Hamas people were at the school/shelter, "Israel has now admitted that there were no Hamas militants in the facility.

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