Archive for Sunday, August 16, 2009

Reform advocates drowned out in uproar

August 16, 2009

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Jenkins talks health care in Topeka

U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins, R-Topeka, took time Wednesday to listen to concerns from area residents about health care issues. The Topeka stop was the first in Jenkins' listening tour. Enlarge video

Jenkins discusses health care

U.S. Rep. Lynn Jenkins, R-Topeka, conducted a forum at the Holiday Day Inn Holidome in Topeka where she discussed health care reform. Enlarge video

Kansas advocates of expanding health care coverage have conceded ground at recent town hall meetings.

Two meetings put on last week in Topeka by U.S. Reps. Lynn Jenkins and Todd Tiahrt, both R-Kan., were dominated almost entirely by opponents of Democratic plans to reform the health care system.

Together the meetings — one at the Holiday Inn Holidome, and the other at the Topeka-Shawnee County Public Library — drew an estimated 600 people and a healthy share of media coverage.

While health care reform was the primary topic of discussion, attendees at the meeting expanded their criticisms to President Barack Obama, his appointees, the federal government, congressional Democrats, socialism, the deficit, illegal immigration, abortion and cap and trade energy legislation.

According to the speakers, the U.S. health care system was the best in the world, private insurance was to be praised and doctors and hospitals needed to be protected from lawsuits and allowed to make as much money as they can.

“We have the best health care that the world has to offer,” Jenkins said. Tiahrt said the same thing, adding that the evidence was that dictators from other countries come to the United States for treatment, as do Canadians who have been denied certain procedures.

But that is a far cry from the stance of advocates for health care reform.

Corrie Edwards, executive director of the Kansas Health Consumer Coalition, who attended one of the meetings, said, “I don’t know how people can believe what they have said once the words come out of their mouths.”

In Kansas, approximately 320,000 people under 65 have no health insurance. In Douglas County, nearly 20 percent of residents under 65 are uninsured, which is 32nd highest of uninsured among the state’s 105 counties, according to Census Bureau information.

Recent hearings by the Kansas Health Policy Authority drew dozens of people who told stories about not being able to afford health care coverage and business owners who said they couldn’t compete because of expensive health insurance.

But Edwards said health care advocates in Kansas have so far decided not to challenge comments at the town hall meetings.

“These meetings have just become crazy,” she said. For example, she cited the numerous times that allegations were made that the main health care bill under discussion — H.R. 3200 — includes government “death panels” that will essentially condemn elderly people to death, based on fiscal reasons.

“We need to be productive and methodical, and sitting in a room and getting beat up by people who think we are going to euthanize old people is, quite frankly, insane,” Edwards said.

She said that’s a shame because the meetings during the congressional recess could have been productive in providing useful information about health care problems, while also allowing people to ask questions about the various proposals before Congress.

U.S. Rep. Dennis Moore, D-Kan., whose district includes east Lawrence, said he wanted to hear from constituents on the issue, but after a couple of threats to his office, he decided not to have town hall meetings.

“This is just not the way we should be acting,” he said. “We should be doing the right thing. This shouldn’t be partisan at all.”

Comments

jmadison 5 years, 9 months ago

President Obama has majorities in the House and the Senate, with 60 Democrat Senators making it a filibuster proof majority. Why has he not been able to bring his bill(s) to passage?

Ann Hamil 5 years, 9 months ago

Perhaps the over a million dollars a day on lobbyists that the "health" care industry as been spending to defeat real reform--on top of the millions they have already spent to buy and sell our elected representatives many times over is a stumbling block?

BigPrune 5 years, 9 months ago

Good point jmadison. Why hasn't the inquiring press asked that question?

Richard Heckler 5 years, 9 months ago

Health care Insurance activity against reform has a budget of at least $100,000,000(million) health care dollars according to mainstream news. The money would be funneled/laundered through a primary coordinator known as the Chamber of Commerce. The Chamber of Commerce is supporting no reform thus increasing the cost to consumers and increasing the cost of doing business.

Why would any business want to belong to the Chamber of Commerce that supports increasing the cost of doing business? Oddly our local Chambers have adopted the same philosophy. Shouldn't they be known as the Chamber of Wreckanomics?

What impact will the reckless spending habits of the health care/insurance industry and the Chamber of Commerce have on the cost of living across the board?

“In front of me I have a document from my employer that shows their cost for insurance.

Medical, Dental and Vision for the year 2010 my employer will pay $15,450. I will pay another $2,860 out of my pay check. $18,310 a year for insurance is ludicrous, and we wonder why so many companies are having massive layoffs. It is a real travesty that nothing is going to happen in the near future on health care.”

$18,310 a year is up from $13,000-$14,000 a year.

$18,310 = wreckanomics! Repub thinkers, the medical insurance industry and the Chamber of Commerce are taking americans for fools.

Insurance industry lobbying against medicial insurance reform is at a record breaking $1.4 million health care insurance dollars a day

Part of this $1.4 million health care/insurance dollars a day is likely funding these disruptions so people are getting paid to disrupt.

These same $1.4 million health care dollars a day could supply 519 families of four full coverage medicare insurance each day this reckless spending takes place.

Ahhh yes the Chamber of Wreckanomics...

Matt Needham 5 years, 9 months ago

""...and sitting in a room and getting beat up by people who think we are going to euthanize old people is, quite frankly, insane,” Edwards said."

Or a well organized, well funded plan working just as intended. "They're gonna pull the plug on granny!" has been an effect call to arms for the private health care lobbyists since President Kennedy. It's worked every time; why would they stop now?

Boston_Corbett 5 years, 9 months ago

Some of these "angry attendees" are about as "grass roots" as my arse.

I am not sure how many buses American for Prosperity rents for these, but it is a lot more than one. This Koch-funded group is very active in Kansas. Rothschild knows them.

Also, read up about the 'grassroots firm' of Freedom Works, and Dick Armey who directs it while also working at the D.C. lobbying firm called DLA Piper. Hire one, you get both.

Read up on the rhetoric and background of Betsy McCaughey.

Check out ResistNet.com, and its cousin Grassfire.org, which is represented by D.C.-based P.R. firm Shirley & Banister Public Affairs. Craig Shirley is a very long-time Republican P.R. operative whose resume goes back to the Willie Horton ad.

And it goes on......

Flap Doodle 5 years, 9 months ago

"Perhaps the over a million dollars a day on lobbyists that the “health” care industry as been spending to defeat real reform..." As part of the O'dude's secret deal with the drug companies, they are spending $150 million to help foist this mad scheme on America.

lctchr1 5 years, 9 months ago

Term limits and campaign finance reform now! Our politicians don't work for us, they work for those with enough money to pay them off and keep them in office.

Richard Heckler 5 years, 9 months ago

How many of the vocal minority out there supporting the most expensive medical insurance in the world are employees and/or shareholders? How many are receiving corrupt campaign dollars?

Some of our reps on all sides of the aisle say "Let's slow down a bit". I say consumers have been waiting for more than 60 years how much slower can it go?

60% of insured are currently covered with OUR tax dollars = a big slice of the pie = $1.2 trillion

***What could possibly be more american? Providing americans with the choice of National Health Insurance. HR 676 is the only equitable approach that includes all of us.

HR 676 would cover every person for all necessary medical care including prescription drugs, hospital, surgical, outpatient services, primary and preventive care, emergency services, dental, mental health, home health, physical therapy, rehabilitation (including for substance abuse), vision care, hearing services including hearing aids, chiropractic, durable medical equipment, palliative care, and long term care.

A family of four making the median income of $56,200 would pay about $2,700 in payroll tax for all health care costs.

HR 676 ends deductibles and co-payments. HR 676 would save hundreds of billions annually by eliminating the high overhead and profits of the private health insurance industry and HMOs.

Let's move all of the following into the program bringing those tax dollars with them. • everyone on social security and their dependents • all disabled veterans • all Iraq/Afghanistan veterans • all government employees including active duty military stationed stateside • all currently uninsured

Face it an HR 676 would save large amounts of tax dollars on all city,state and federal employees,vets,Nam/ mideast war veterans and those currently uninsured.

Are Americans ready for HR 676? Of course they are.

Not only that HR 676 makes all Americans more employable.

So many would not venture off to becoming a small business entrepreneur due to the cost of maintaining insurance for their families. Now opportunity knocks. Now we're talking long term wealth building for americans by way of long term employment. YES for small business.

  • Employers should not be forced to pay up. There are enough tax dollars available in the USA to cover the cost easily:

*60% of insured are covered with OUR tax dollars = a big slice of the pie = $1.2 trillion

*Cut subsidies going to very wealthy industries = Another sizeable slice of the pie. Let's get them off welfare!

Instead use those tax dollars care for keeping americans productive thus attracting NEW industry, NEW jobs while at time creating new wealth locally and across the nation.

  • What a great way to bring OUR tax dollars home by funding OUR own medical insurance with OUR own money.

overthemoon 5 years, 9 months ago

The back room deals didn't happen. The "memo" reported in turned out to be from a dubious source...typewritten on plain paper...that came from a single source that was not checked out before publishing.

If it was on Fox, it is a dubious story anyway.

Richard Heckler 5 years, 9 months ago

Smart Medical Insurance Improves Our Quality of Life And Our Wallets!

Think HR 676

Why support a policy that retains the most corrupt and most expensive medical insurance in the world?

overthemoon 5 years, 9 months ago

Boston.

The unfortunate thing is these 'grassroots' screamers don't realize they are tools of the industry that charges them a private 'tax' of 30% on their health care dollar. They don't realize that their biggest arguments, not increasing the deficit and 'keeping gov't out of health care', are moot. The current health care situation will add to the the deficit and increase their personal medical costs in an uncontrolled upward spiral. And, with the majority of protesters being over 65, they refuse to acknowledge or are just plain ignorant of the fact that their Medicare IS a government program.

They pretend cynicism about the government, yet don't question the outright lies they are being fed by their congresspeople (Lynn Jenkins is right in lockstep with the misinformation campaign), by the drug industry and by the many arms of the GOP. When its all over, these people will be the ones screaming the loudest about the system they helped to keep broken.

For those here who want to obstruct reform...are you willing to forgo medicare to make your point? Are you happy about the fact that you are one claim away from being denied coverage or be 'rescinded' from your insurance provider? Do you like paying a hidden tax to cover uninsured medical expenses? Are you ok that the uninsured person sitting next to you may have a communicable disease they can't afford treatment for? Do you like being lied to so a few can gain at everyone's cost?

NoSpin 5 years, 9 months ago

Blah, blah, blah. Here we go. Just a right wing conspiracy again. They are obstructing health care reform. Boo hoo. The People do want health care reform. They just don't want the kind of reform the Dems are throwing out there. What's the rush? Can we not spend a few months on actually coming up with ways to lower health care instead of trashing the whole system? Would immigration reform lower health care costs? Yes.

overthemoon 5 years, 9 months ago

No spin. Its not that people don't want the reform proposed, they have made it very clear that they don't want ANY proposal from the President. It is only obstructionism for the good of the party of NO.

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

Oh the horrors of it all......conservative groups are organized in their opposition to Obama's health care bill. How quickly liberals forget about ACORN and MoveOn.org and how they protested Bush's policies or shaped the election. Double standard perhaps?

" were dominated almost entirely by opponents of Democratic plans to reform the health care system." Maybe if it wasn't just a democrat plan, but a bi-partisan plan there would be more support for it.

To paraphrase Hillary Clinton, we have right to disagree with any administration.

staff04 5 years, 9 months ago

"Yeah snap, the only two places I've read/heard about Obama's back-room deals with big pharma was in the WA Times and of course, on FNC. And I usually to a quick run-through to see who's saying what."

Tom, the story about the PhRMA deal has been reported everywhere from DailyKos to Huffington Post (who obtained and released the White House memo confirming the deal) to the NYT. If FNC and WaTimes are really the only places you've seen it, I'm suspicious that you stopped looking after you went to those two.

PhRMA deal stinks, but if somebody isn't getting rich then Republicans can't support it...

overthemoon 5 years, 9 months ago

ACORN and MoveOn are political action organizations that help real grassroots interests.

The drivers behind the reform obstruction are the businesses that would like to keep robbing you blind that would have NO support without heavy spending and lie spinning. BIG DIFFERENCE

overthemoon 5 years, 9 months ago

A bi partisan plan would be great. Where's the cooperation from the poor little repugs to make it happen?

Where are their ideas? Lynn says she has a secret plan? Brownback had some pretty decent ideas. Why aren't those in the discussion? Party obstructionism. Plain and simple.

Richard Heckler 5 years, 9 months ago

Supporting the most expensive medical insurance in the world aka status quo is simply reckless and stupid. It is also $1.2 trillion medical insurance tax dollars supporting only 60% of those insured instead of insuring all of the USA.

HR 676 is the one that would be best for large and small business plus individuals. It is by far the most practical and comprehensive AND the best bang for the buck.

It should be amended to allow for the choice to be HR 676 or one from the industry. Let the people make the choice.

HR 676 has been been around for years therefore has been tuned up and refined. No matter what number is attached in the end this is what consumers and business should go for.

Why use Medicare? It eliminates reinventing the wheel therefore saves a big bundle of money and time = efficient use of existing resources.

Medicare is in place therefore it is ready to roll which is convenient. The only major change necessary is reimbursement numbers which the author and the 87 cosigners are perfectly aware. They are also very much aware of what the inefficient insurance companies pay out on invoices which is never full invoice. Insurance companies usually pay out about 50%-60%.

The USA needs to STOP being be the most expensive insurance/health care of the industrialized nations if americans want jobs back.

HR 676 Medicare for All insurance coverage is key to creating new wealth for america.

The most expensive health insurance in the world is not the answer for keeping business costs down and keeping our cost of living somewhat in check.

Consider the USA as the only major industrial nation that does not provide health insurance/health coverage for its' people.

Supporting the most expensive medical insurance in the world aka status quo is simply reckless and stupid. It is also $1.2 trillion medical insurance tax dollars supporting only 60% of those insured instead of insuring all of the USA.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

Yes, like our national defense and emergency response systems, right Sunny?

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

What scares me is that Taiahrt and Jenkins want to compare us with countries with dictators, instead of comparing us with developed countries with democracies. Of course dictators come to our country for health care. They are filthy rich, because they don't provide their own people with health care, so they have to come to the US and find a luxury hospital. Why do we even let them in the US? So we can get some of the money back that we give them to maintain their dictatorships?

They won't compare our system to those of developed countries like Canada, France, Japan, and Germany because we fail miserably. Yes, we are better than dictatorships, but not better than democracies who care about their citizens. What an incredibly weak and down right insulting argument against fixing something that is really broke. It's not broke for rich people, so it's not broke.

oldvet 5 years, 9 months ago

"ACORN and MoveOn are political action organizations that help real grassroots interests."

What a joke!!!! These are the farthest things from grassroots as anything can be. Funded by big bucks, run in secret, with far-left liberal objectives... Don't try to lie about the humble grassroots those two well-oiled Democrat organizations.

tomatogrower 5 years, 9 months ago

" This guy just thinks he's got some god-given right to run private enterprise, and this comes as no surprise."

Are referring to GM and the other companies that our tax dollars had to bail out? Oh yes, their CEO's were running their companies so well. Why did we stop their train wrecks? The people who have made it to the top of companies nowadays didn't get their jobs because they were good managers. A good manager looks to the future. They got their job, because they could make themselves and investors filthy rich in a short time, sacrificing the stability of the company. The insurance companies are the same way. They just want to make a quick profit for their managers and investors. The health of people are not their main concerns. They could care less if some people can't afford to buy their policies.

exhawktown 5 years, 9 months ago

No time here, but I'm hearing Obama is saying at this point, he'd support legislation that would include no public option. Anybody else heard this?

lctchr1 5 years, 9 months ago

Sunny, school starts next week. Enroll and shoot for trying to get into the third grade.

We are such a stupid society as a whole. I can't believe we haven't imploded as a country yet. What a joke. Wake up, people.

jimmyjms 5 years, 9 months ago

"furthering their agenda of attempting to make “Republican” a dirty word. "

Nah, you and morons like you have done a great job of that already.

devobrun 5 years, 9 months ago

Complexity, sophistication, obfuscation are the tools of the ruling class. This is true for insurance companies and the government.

The arguments about the health care plan are difficult to follow because the bill is a living document. Changing sections of the bill, changing evaluations of how the bill will be implemented, changing evaluations of what the effect of the bill will be.....no one really knows do they?

Bottom line for me is that we have a system now that has become monstrous and full of sophisticated government/business interconnections. A primary care physician is tasked with dealing with government and insurance rules that rely on protocols for every disease. Usually, the rules are bent. Usually an individual's care doesn't fit neatly into a protocol, so creative diagnosis is the result.

Eliminating insurance companies will not change the situation. Government clerks dispensing health care will not be different than insurance company clerks dispensing health care.

The mistake was made decades ago when health care decisions wrecked the doctor/patient relationship.

Health care reform will replace insurance with government. Costs won't drop. Officious, bureaucratic, arbitrary, delivery has grown over the years, and will continue.

I think that supporters and opponents will be disappointed with the result of any reform. Top down management doesn't work. Proscription from on high, whether it is government or insurance company isn't working.

Nobody is suggesting a reform that embellishes the rights of the individual. 1984 is 25 years late, but here it is. There will be lots of negotiation, compromise, and ultimately a bill will be produced that cannot be evaluated or implemented to anybody's satisfaction.

We will have more health care mess. My advice is to keep your eyes and ears open for methods to scam the system. The best health care will be delivered to the most cunning.

SettingTheRecordStraight 5 years, 9 months ago

If you have a 401k or 403b, you probably own part of an insurance company. And if you care at all about your return on investment, you should want private insurers to succeed, not be driven out of business by a government plan that pays no taxes and need not maintain a nickel of retained earnings.

63BC 5 years, 9 months ago

Dennis Moore isn't having ANY townhall meetings? Congress has a month off and he's not having ANY? Seriously?

How gutless can you get?

skinny 5 years, 9 months ago

This bill will not pass.

1. We do not have the money to pay out on this type of welfare.

2. The majority of the people in the U.S. that are educated realize this.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 5 years, 9 months ago

This is nothing about health care reform, it is the white cracker opposition to having a black president. I hear it every day from people I work around. They think Obama should be dragged down a gravel road with a log chain and hung in a tree. So much for thoughtful consideration of the president's proposals. The Republicans, the losers at the last election, are not going to cooperate no matter what.

Centerville 5 years, 9 months ago

Moore has come up with a town hall meeting on Sept 1 but you have to register in advance to attend. Call his office on Monday to find out how. It's being run for him by one of those astroturf goon gangs. Oh, and those co-ops? Don't fall for it. It is, as Zippy put it, "just words."

workinghard 5 years, 9 months ago

It looks like Republicans took a lesson from the Phelps group and are using the same tactics.

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

frwent - your term for white people is very racist and offensive. It clearly paints a picture of you just as someone who would use offensive racial terms to describe people of color and it is not a pretty picture. In fact, it is just as vile and disgusting as someone who dons the white robes of the KKK.

jumpin_catfish 5 years, 9 months ago

So what are the demorats afraid of? hmmmm They are in power, as Nancy boy said just ram it down our throat. But they can't bring themselves to be solely responsible for this pile of donkey dukey can they. No they still need the republicans to blame somehow when this goes south. Mid-term elections are coming and we all see Obama and Co. for what some of us knew he was. 2010 the real year of hope and change.

Centerville 5 years, 9 months ago

Dennis Moore hasn't received any death threats, unless having to spend an hour being hectored by Nancy Pelosi counts. Since he's not running again, why does he have to pretend any more?

skinny 5 years, 9 months ago

"You cannot legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the wealthy out of freedom. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it."

Dr. Adrian Rogers

Flap Doodle 5 years, 9 months ago

Another Chicago style deal with lobbyists by the current regime. "ALERT Now it's Let's Make a Deal with hospital lobbyists. First, the President was caught with his principles down, cutting a scuzzy back-room deal with pharmaceutical lobbyist Billy Tauzin to limit drug price savings to just 2% over 10 years (see attached, "Obama on Drugs: 98% Cheney?"), the New York Times today reports that another deal was sealed by lobbyist Chip Kahn of the American Hospital Association. Here are the numbers they don't want you to see: Hospitals will be allowed to hike their prices and revenues by six trillion dollars ($5,853 billion) over the next ten years, only $155 billion less than they had projected before the Obama "reform." In all, the Obama back-room deal will "reduce" our $26 trillion total hospital bill over the next decade by one-half of one percent. Once again, the lobbyists got the gold mine, the public got the shaft. Say it ain't so, Mr. President." http://www.gregpalast.com/obama-on-drugs-98-cheney/

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

It is interesting that the Republicans are getting the blame, but in truth, with a Democrat President and Democrat controlled Congress, it is not the Republicans that are holding up the health care bill; it is members of the Democrat party.

Just read that Obama may abandon the public-option component of the bill and the idea of government controlled health care. This will be interesting in that it may result in health care reform, but is sure to anger the liberal members of his party.

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

@kansastruthteller. re: your 1154. Take a look at this definition. ""White cracker" or simply "cracker" was originally a pejorative term for a white person, mainly used by blacks in the Southern United States. In recent years (as of 2005), the term has gained currency as a prideful self-description. With the huge influx of new residents from the North, the term is now used informally by some white residents of Florida and Georgia ("Florida cracker" or "Georgia cracker") to indicate that their family has lived there for many generations." (http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/white-cracker/)

I would say you don't understand the etymology of the term, "white cracker."


@frwent. re: your 1138. You hit the nail on the head. It appears that everything the Republicans have put out is based on the politics of fear, racism and hatred. Many of the posters here support that form of politics, loudly. There wouldn't be half the derision, slander, inuendo, conspiracy theories (and so on) If President Obama were white. That's the same reason Colin Powell did not run for President - he knew the country was not ready then for a Black President. Given the reaction today, I'm not sure the country is ready for one now. (The Reps consider it simply as a case of, insert you own comment with a curse, the word uppity and the N-word here.)

What will they do when a Hispanic woman runs for and is elected President? Check her papers? Make sure her back is dry? The list goes on and on.

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

Well Ralph, I disagree. Here is my argument that it is a vile and racist term. Also, keep in mind that blacks and gays have embraced racist and homophobic terms used against them, but that doesn't take away the fact that they are still hateful when use as an insult. The term used in the context of the poster here was meant to be insulting.

Cracker (pejorative) From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search For other uses, see Cracker. Cracker, sometimes white cracker, is a pejorative term for a white person, mainly used in the Southern United States, but in recent decades it has entered common usage throughout North America and in some areas of British society

Flap Doodle 5 years, 9 months ago

Do some research, porchie. Your emperor is disrobed.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"Dennis Moore hasn't received any death threats"

I want and believe this to be true, therefore it must be true.

Ralph Reed 5 years, 9 months ago

Vertigo, where do you get that Dennis Moore is not running for re-election in 2010. The last I read he is running for re-election. I know he's not running for Senate, he can't defeat the chosen one.


kansastruthteller. We'll agree to disagree. Although I have been Down South a lot the past two years, and I know a lock of people who are proud to call themselves "Crackers".

Leslie Swearingen 5 years, 9 months ago

This granny says to pass the health care bill. I have had a living will and a durable power of attorney for years. I have discussed with my family what I want. They know I want to be cremated and my ashes put in the cheapest urn. I don't want them to be conned into spending a lot of money mistaking that for respect for me. Respect is paid to the living.

notajayhawk 5 years, 9 months ago

overthemoon (Anonymous) says…

"The unfortunate thing is these 'grassroots' screamers don't realize they are tools of the industry that charges them a private 'tax' of 30% on their health care dollar."

The unfortunate thing is that uninformed morons throw around figures like 30% without knowing where that number comes from or that it is completely false. The average health care plan makes a 3.3% profit - even less than the hospitals they reimburse.

"They pretend cynicism about the government, yet don't question the outright lies they are being fed by their congresspeople"

You mean like that 30% figure, moonie?

"For those here who want to obstruct reform…"

Yeah, that's right, moon, if we don't do it your way we don't want change. Brilliant, if incredibly narrow-minded.

"ACORN and MoveOn are political action organizations that help real grassroots interests."

The definition of "real grassroots interests" apparently being those that agree with YOU.

jonas_opines 5 years, 9 months ago

"The definition of “real grassroots interests” apparently being those that agree with YOU."

Of course.

jaywalker 5 years, 9 months ago

"This is nothing about health care reform, it is the white cracker opposition to having a black president"

Brilliant. And that makes Rush Limbaugh a soothsayer. "If you oppose Obama it's because he's black." Dumb da dumb dumb.

'Healthcare reform' will make plenty of headway when our elected numbskulls actually focus on the problem. Making 'certain' ev-er-y-one has insurance and offering a "public"/government option is not reform. The high costs of healthcare is THE problem that needs be addressed. Period. Doing something about that would be 'reform'. A universal system of Medicare 1) is not practical nor possible, and 2) would do nothing more than expand the size and role of government into our lives. Medicare only works because it's supported by private insurance. Private insurance makes up the shortfall that Medicare comes with. If we were to go to a universal system of Medicare and eliminate private insurers, there would be rationed care, there's just no way of getting around it. You will hear the advocates of these proposals spout that "there is nothing in these bills about rationing". It doesn't need be written down, it's inevitable fact.
And there is no way....NO way this kind of proposal will work efficiently. Preventive care is not a money saver, don't believe it. For example, it is recommended that everyone over 50 get a colonoscopy every year. What are there, 75 to a 100 million citizens over 50? What would be the costs to the system of 100 million colonoscopys every year versus the small percentage of treatment for those that get rectal cancer? It's admirable to want to protect everyone, it's just not practical or affordable.
The government should not be in the business of making certain we all live for as long as humanly possible. And to the morons like frwent, my dissent has absolutely nothing to do with Obama himself, let alone the fact his complexion is darker than mine. That's as intellectually void as the 'death panel' crappola. Well done.

Centerville 5 years, 9 months ago

For a great laugh, go find the Kiddy Emperor's speech about how any dealing with the drug companies would be shown on CNN.

notajayhawk 5 years, 9 months ago

jaywalker (Anonymous) says…

"The high costs of healthcare is THE problem that needs be addressed. Period."

Wish I'd said that. Once or twice. :)

jaywalker, did you know the average hospital makes more of a profit than the average health plan?

Fred Whitehead Jr. 5 years, 9 months ago

Well, my use of the term "cracker" didn't get me kicked off today. I have heard this used on occasion, although it is a pretty obscure perjoritive. Glad some of you could illuminate the meaning of the word. The defination I have seen is "An ignorant, white, southern man" and that is the context I used it in. Much of the uproar regarding this health insurance issue is the result of ingorance, fear and misconseptions spread about by those who just didn't like it when a black man was elected president. Check out the news reports on the rejuvination of the American Nazi party miliitias that seem to be enjoying a rejuvination in the woods of Michigan and other states. And many people are more than willing to buy into these misconceptions for no other reason than their disdain of the president's race. This has been around since the campaign, noteworthy are Rush Limbaugh's little ditty "Barack the magic Negro" and his "Halfrican" lable for Mr. Obama. Racism is still alive, virulent and apparent in most of this opposition. Many of these people would object to ANYTHING that the current occupant of the WHITE House would propose. And that is so very, very disgusting and wrong.

Flap Doodle 5 years, 9 months ago

The error of hopenchange is already over. We're stuck with a lame-duck Pres for the next 3 1/2 years.

BigPrune 5 years, 9 months ago

This just in....

"By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON – Bowing to Republican pressure and an uneasy public, President Barack Obama's administration signaled Sunday it is ready to abandon the idea of giving Americans the option of government-run insurance as part of a new health care system.

Facing mounting opposition to the overhaul, administration officials left open the chance for a compromise with Republicans that would include health insurance cooperatives instead of a government-run plan. Such a concession probably would enrage Obama's liberal supporters but could deliver a much-needed victory on a top domestic priority opposed by GOP lawmakers."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul

Health insurance cooperatives, hmmm? What a simple idea.

Guess the elitist fillibuster proof Nazis can't get their act together.

jaywalker 5 years, 9 months ago

"Racism is still alive, virulent and apparent in most of this opposition."

Like a dog returns to his own vomit........

gccs14r 5 years, 9 months ago

If there's no public option, they might as well have not even bothered bringing up healthcare. The whole point is to try to get healthcare for the millions who don't have it, and that's not going to happen if the private sector is the only provider.

notajayhawk 5 years, 9 months ago

"Bowing to Republican pressure and an uneasy public, President Barack Obama's administration signaled Sunday it is ready to abandon the idea of giving Americans the option of government-run insurance as part of a new health care system."

As many on these boards are fond of pointing out, there is no such thing as Republican pressure, the administration has a veto-proof majority in the legislature. As far as the public goes, very few voters identify themselves as Republican any more. If it wasn't for substantial Democratic pressure, it would have already been passed and implemented.

(Why do the Democrats want poor children to die? Why are they being such obstructionists and opposing much-needed refrom to our healthcare system?)

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

frwent the race card is old, tired and worn out. Black people alone didn't elect Obama - many white people voted for him too.

It is foolish to suggest that just because someone disagrees with Obama they are doing so because of his race. Do you always agree with Alan Keyes, Clarence Thomas, Bill Cosby, Thomas Sowell, etc.? No, then you must be a racist....see how foolish that argument is?

You decry the opposition to Obama because of his race, but you denegrate an entire race yourself. Instead of stating your opinion in a civilized manner you resorted to knowingly using a pejorative term for white people. Do you really think that only white people disagree with Obama?

Aren't you guilty of the very "crime" you are accusing Rush and others when you resort to using racial terms to demonize those with whom you disagree? If you want respect then you must respect others. Disagree all you want, but do it in a civilized manner. Don't try to dehumanize people by using insulting racial terms. This is what the slave owners did. Did is what the nazis did. Don't you do it too.

Oh, and I bet if I brought your original post to the attention of LJW they would delete it. I just chose to confront you directly instead of running and tattling so I wouldn't boast too much about it not getting pulled.

BlackVelvet 5 years, 9 months ago

"This is nothing about health care reform, it is the white cracker opposition to having a black president. I hear it every day from people I work around. They think Obama should be dragged down a gravel road with a log chain and hung in a tree. So much for thoughtful consideration of the president's proposals. The Republicans, the losers at the last election, are not going to cooperate no matter what."

What an asinine and juvenile thing to say.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 5 years, 9 months ago

kansastruth--As I stated, I hear this crap almost every day. There are no black people working where I do. There used to be and most all were treated as well as anyone else. I would mention that one fellow was a good friend, but I imagine that would elicit some sort of critical response as to my motives. My point was very simple, there are still those white people who continue to denigrate and denounce Mr. Obama for no other reason than he is black and who are not one bit hesitant to make that fact perfectly clear. I cannot use some of the terms I hear, or I would get kicked off again. One person told me she does not listen to the evening news again because "I don't ever want that ----- in my living room again." My reasoning about the cause of some of this dissention we see might be a bit flawed and I will admit that, but I do hear that sort of crap and it disgusts me. And Michael J, you obviously do not work around people who are still quite specific in their never-ending bashing of the Democratic Party and people like Congressman Moore.

BlackVelvet 5 years, 9 months ago

frwent, there is a big difference between "some people don't like Obama simply because he is black" (which I agree, there are still some bigoted morons out there) and your blanket statement. Perhaps you meant "people who are bigots are white crackers" but that's not how it came across. I apologize if I over-assumed your intention. Not all republicans are morons, not all whites are bigots. Yet somestill make blanket statements that imply that is the case.

kansastruthteller 5 years, 9 months ago

frwent - I don't doubt that there are racist people in the world today. Some white, some black, some Aisan and some Hispanic. People hate others simply because of the color of their skin, their religion or their ethnicity. They are ignorant, full of hate and should not be tolerated.

We should not ignore racism, but speak up whenever we see it and that is why I commented on your remark about white people. Not to speak against it would be the same as condoning it. I would do the same if it was directed towards any other race. The way to combat racism is to seek equality for all and not to stoop to the level of those that would discriminate or espouse hate.

lctchr1 5 years, 9 months ago

If there is no public option, what is the point of this healthcare reform? Looks like reform is going up in smoke. Maybe in 20 years, when healthcare spending accounts for 35% of GDP, we will HAVE to reform healthcare.

Flap Doodle 5 years, 9 months ago

Kathy may be going under the bus. The White House is crawfishing on dumping the public option.

Rex Russell 5 years, 7 months ago

One of the major reasons the insurance industry is lobbying so hard to defeat health care reform is, they recognize (correctly) the most money to be made, i.e. - profits- is in the final year of life. This was the rationale for the death panel talk. There were no "death panels". But it made for very good drama. Fear and gloom and doom are great motivators. Lobbyists spread the word that that the government is going to euthanize grandma if the government got their way. Then they instructed their Senators and Congressmen to spread the word as they donated to each of their coffers. Truth is, each one of us should have a living will and have all your wishes and options discussed with our primary physician. That bill would have provided funding for such a thing to happen for all of us. This would reduce a lot of end of life costs for each one of us and in turn reduce profits. This is what the insurance companies feared, loss of profits. That's the whole point.

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