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Archive for Sunday, September 7, 2008

Flag spat sullies candidates’ vow to stand together at 9/11 site

September 7, 2008

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— On the same day that John McCain and Barack Obama pledged to put differences aside and appear at Ground Zero for the seventh anniversary of the Sept. 11 terrorist attack, the two campaigns were engaged Saturday in a flap over the American flag.

The spat began in this Republican stronghold at an airport rally for McCain and running mate Sarah Palin. Before the Republican presidential ticket took the stage, a radio personality emceeing the event announced that veterans were going to give the crowd thousands of small American flags that were discarded and rescued from Obama's massive Democratic National Convention rally at Denver's Invesco Field at Mile High Stadium.

The emcee, radio host Dan Caplis, told the estimated audience of 12,000 the flags were going to be thrown away or burned. McCain supporters said the flags were found by a vendor at Invesco Field after the convention. The vendor allegedly found trash bags full of flags in and around garbage bins, recovered them and gave them to the McCain campaign.

But the Democratic National Committee and Democratic convention organizers said the flags were snatched - not discarded - from Invesco Field by the McCain camp.

"American flags were proudly waved by the 75,000 people who joined Barack Obama at the Democratic National Convention," Karen Finney, a Democratic National Committee spokeswoman, said in a written statement. She accused McCain's supporters of "a cheap political stunt calling into question our patriotism."

The McCain campaign stood by the story of how it obtained the flags and accused the Democratic National Committee and convention organizers of operating in "crisis control."

Comments

pace 6 years, 1 month ago

Boy, maybe the republicans are desperate, returning to burglery, thought they learned better from watergate.

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tangential_reasoners_anonymous 6 years, 1 month ago

fuel: "Bozo thinks that the American flag is "strips of cloth". Terrific."Anyone know where I can get some American Flag blinders for my conservative acquaintances...?http://liberty.davar.net/Images/Humor/PatrioticBlinders.jpg( Redundant, I know, but it's soooooo hard to shop for the person whowants everything. )

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 1 month ago

" I'm not an American citizen but even I can appreciate the flag as a meaningful symbol, something to be treated with respect."It has different meanings to different people, and for some, it has no meaning at all. What does it mean to you, and how should other people show it the respect you feel it deserves? What if the meaning someone ascribes to it is best expressed by burning it? Is that disrespectful?

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Flap Doodle 6 years, 1 month ago

Hint: left for several days sitting beside a dumpster in Hefty bags.To any reasonable person that sounds like thrown away.

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sdinges 6 years, 1 month ago

I mis-read the numbers. Even more people were there waving flags! Nevertheless, the point still stands. 75,000 people and people are actually sitting there saying "Oh my gosh, discarded american flags?! We would never do that!!!1" Give me a break.

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geekin_topekan 6 years, 1 month ago

If they were discarded they are supposed to be burned are they not?But,the republicans retrieve them to use them as weapons over their own citizen's?That disgusts me.And it should disgust many true Republicans also.

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fuel_for_the_fire 6 years, 1 month ago

Bozo: The flag is a symbol. By this definition alone, the flag represents the United States of America. Therefore, to me (having a clear grasp of the English language), the flag means the USA. Showing it the respect that I, as one person, think it deserves is not relevant. There are already established rules regarding treatment of the flag. Following these rules is respectful. Burning a tattered flag is the proper way to dispose of it. Burning the flag to protest is an act of symbolism meant to represent contempt for the USA. Is an act of contempt disrespectful? Clear, open dialogue between two parties without resorting to actions meant to inflame the other is certainly more respectful.

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dandelion 6 years, 1 month ago

I think they should be arrested for theft. More low life crud from the Republicans. Return the flags or be arrested.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 1 month ago

Is this an example of what a McCain administration would bring? Pettiness over a bunch of strips of cloth?

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tangential_reasoners_anonymous 6 years, 1 month ago

fuel: "Tangential: you do not know me."Likewise... BTW, I was using your post merely as a springboard...no judgment rendered.

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pace 6 years, 1 month ago

I don't believe a thief when he says he found it on a dock, wrapped seperately and that he knew it was going to tossed. I think the guy stole them. Wasn't his, wasn't in the dumpster, was bagged, he grabbed, thief.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 1 month ago

"Bozo thinks that the American flag is "strips of cloth". Terrific."I suppose these particular ones could be strips of plastic."How do you reconcile throwing away thousands of flags, obviously fit for re-use, with a platform of environmental protection?"How do you know they were thrown away, and not stolen?

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fuel_for_the_fire 6 years, 1 month ago

Tangential: you do not know me. I do not align myself with a particular party, thereby forfeiting my ability to think for myself. I have opinions that could be classified as conservative as well as some that are quite liberal. I simply enjoy pointing out the shortcomings of people who post ridiculous items. I'm not an American citizen but even I can appreciate the flag as a meaningful symbol, something to be treated with respect. I do not hide my vision behind the American flag. I see this country, with all of its greatness as well as its hypocrisy clearer than some of its own citizens.

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jaywalker 6 years, 1 month ago

"But,the republicans retrieve them to use them as weapons over their own citizen's"By handing them out to be waved at Ground Zero? Hell of a 'weapon'. Get a grip.fuel: Glad to have ya, have enjoyed every post of yours I've read so far. Nice to have some a rational poster.

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just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 6 years, 1 month ago

"Burning the flag to protest is an act of symbolism meant to represent contempt for the USA. "For some, probably so, for others, who knows? I think for most it represents contempt for the actions of the US, usually military actions, and contempt for those who hide behind the flag in an attempt to arrogate upon themselves the title of "true patriot," when instead what they are is unquestioning, uncritical drones.

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lubyloo 6 years, 1 month ago

Wow, McCain sure is adept at bringing the parties together.

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sdinges 6 years, 1 month ago

Is it that outlandish to think that people throw away those cheap american flags? How many do you think go in the garbage after July 4? Why wouldn't the DNC have left overs that someone figured they'd throw out? And do you really expect a crowd of ten thousand not to leave some behind? Even if only one in ten people drop them, toss them or lose them, that's over a thousand flags lying around.Look, I get the whole "respect the American flag" thing, but I think people are being naive if they think people - regardless of political leanings - "treasure" cheap, mass-produced, souvenir flags.It was ridiculous to collect them and use them as a holier than thou stunt, but it's equally ridiculous to assume that Democrats are immune to throwing things away.

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tangential_reasoners_anonymous 6 years, 1 month ago

Just how many little flags waving does it take to obscure the fact that Republican policies continue to undermine the most essential of American values?

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JayCat_67 6 years, 1 month ago

Hmmm, How many without health insurance?, How many jobs overseas?, How many troops scheduled for Iraq now going to Afghanistan? Government taking over Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae? Who cares! Nothing is more important than finding out whether a bunch of little flags were slated for the midden heap or stolen from the hands of babies! Holy Crap! Walter the puppet is looking better all the time.

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fuel_for_the_fire 6 years, 1 month ago

Bozo thinks that the American flag is "strips of cloth". Terrific. Patriotism aside, isn't the environment one of the hot issues in this election? How do you reconcile throwing away thousands of flags, obviously fit for re-use, with a platform of environmental protection?

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Bob Forer 6 years, 1 month ago

Perhaps now is the proper time to invoke Mark Twain's famous quote: "Patriotism is usually the refuge of the scoundrel." .Question: Why s it that only republicans accuse fellow citizen of being unpatriotic.

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Richard Heckler 6 years, 1 month ago

The flag thing is an effort to divert attention from some real issues. McCain and the repub party are not more patriotic than anybody else. That is an illusion.All of the presidents involved in the below escapades were flanked by lots of flags each time they were on camera. Maybe flags do not indicate a true patriot? Maybe actions speak louder than a flag.All of these presidents were flanked by lots of flags each time they were on camera. http://rationalrevolution.net/war/bush_family_and_the_s.htm Iran-ContraSavings and Loan ScandalSub Prime Scandal a lying president which led to the illegal occupation of another country spying on americans at willA republican party president has been lying about social security: Is this patriotic?http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archives/2005/0505orr.htmlImportant issues failed to get discussed when republicans spend so much time and money diverting the discussion away from some issues that matter: Bring all the troops home. The Iraq people know how to rebuild a country and run an oil business. Their oil is not our oil.40,000 disabled troops More than 4,000 dead troops 1,000,000 dead Iraq men,women and Children A WASHED OUT ECONOMY thanks to 20 years of Reaganomics aka voodoo economics Creating new industry that cannot be outsourced through Cleaner Energy Sources National Health Insurance Support HR 676 http://www.hr676.org/5.html Dump No Child Left Behind and start over Lets's demand a new system and vote in Fair Vote America : http://www.fairvote.org/irv/ public financing of campaigns http://www.publicampaign.org/ Reining in the power of the President Restoring the EPA Acts * Restoring the USDA Integrity* Voter Rights NOT special interest rights

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towanda54 6 years, 1 month ago

Here's a ink to an extremist right propaganda blog, with a photo the flags in question. Doesn't look like they're in the dumpster or trash. http://flaggot.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/invesco-field-flags-nothing-but-props/McSame old politics for John McSame.

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pace 6 years, 1 month ago

the thief should be prosecuted, Bush should be prosecuted, they won't do either, too much trouble, because neither is probably poor.

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RedwoodCoast 6 years, 1 month ago

My idea of patriotism must differ from the nationalistic type that the Republicans push, which could also be described as 'wear red, white, and blue and think only what I tell you you should be thinking.' If you don't do what we say you should be doing, then you're just not following the perversion of patriotism that we have defined by our own terms and agenda.

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towanda54 6 years, 1 month ago

You know the American flags on the big screens on the RNC are no longer there. What happened to them? Did some unpatriotic Republican close the file or delete the file? It should have just remained there for all time, right? What about the paper plates with flag sympbols on them. Is that descrecating the flag to eat on them and then throw them away? If the majority of Americans are stupid enough to be swayed by this ridiculous political rhetoric and elect McSame as president, they deserve 4 more years of increasing debt and continuing war. The joint meeting of the two parties on Sept 11 was supposed to signify unity but, of course, the McSame campaign is resorting to the most childish thing I've ever heard of to manipulate this very somber annivesary of a horrible day in our nation's history for political gain. Shame on you, John McCain. Shame on you Republican National Committee!! I'm patriotic, I've had a father, uncles and many cousins serve in WWII, the Vietnam War and our current war. Republicans seem to think patriotism can be displayed in only their proscribed way and they are resorting to dirty politics once again in their latest attempt to keep voters from actually making a decision based on the issues our country is facing.

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RedwoodCoast 6 years, 1 month ago

'Patriotism,' as it is generally used these days, is a concept constructed by conservatives in a way that defines only conservative values as 'patriotic.' Thus, if you want to be a liberal, by definition, you're unpatriotic. It's a straw-man set up by conservatives, the only goal of which is to cast a false light on the so-called "country second" crowd. We don't hold value X, so we're unpatriotic. Hogwash.I've also said before that dissent is what this country was founded upon. True patriots were--and are--dissenters who exercise their personhood as US citizens. Anyone who claims adherence to a dogma disguised as patriotism is, by the definition I understand, unpatriotic.

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Bob Forer 6 years, 1 month ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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pace 6 years, 1 month ago

sceed, one person thinks your numbers are bogus. I just speak for myself.

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