Letters to the Editor

More lies?

May 2, 2008

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To the editor:

The Bush administration told America and the world last week that North Korea helped Syria build a nuclear reactor. Ah, the memories come flooding back:

¢ "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised." - George Bush, March 17, 2003

¢ The Center for Public Integrity has listed 935 lies told about Iraq by Bush administration officials during 2003-2005.

¢ "America does not torture."- George Bush.

¢ A secret Justice Department opinion by Attorney General Gonzales was leaked, which gave Bush explicit authorization for torture (at the same time he was publicly denying it).

¢ Bush signed a presidential order in 2002 allowing the National Security Agency to monitor domestic Americans without a warrant. The day after this shocking abuse of power became public, Bush admitted that he had authorized it.

¢ Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

Did North Korea help Syria build a reactor, perhaps? Unfortunately, when you are a known liar like Bush and Cheney, no one believes you.

Daniel Patrick Schamle,

Lawrence

Comments

fu7il3 7 years ago

Isn't that what they assume already?

Newcomb 7 years ago

It sure is getting hot in here, but at least this hand basket is comfy.

50YearResident 7 years ago

Bowhunter99, I can't believe you are blaming the last 7 years of Bush's blunders on the Democrats just because they are unable to make instant corrections to his idiotic decisions.

staff04 7 years ago

Please deec, bowhunter cannot be bothered with the details...Rush Limpdick didn't tell him that part, so it must not really be the truth.

deec 7 years ago

"...the liberals drive the country into the ground like they've done the past two years..."I assume the poster actually means "the democrats."The democrats weren't the majority in Congress until January 2007. Last time I checked that was a little over a year ago. And apparently the numerous vetoes have nothing to do with Federal policy. Meanwhile Bush's approval ratings stand at 28%.

oldvet 7 years ago

It must be last night's violent weather and low-pressure cells that kicked up the serious BDS already this morning...

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

bkgarner--" Why? Well, if the majority did, where are their peace movements?"They do exist, just as they do in Israel, but the movements don't control the actions of very violent minorities on each side, and violence always gets more press than efforts towards peace."What I do see is dancing in the streets when something terrible happens to the US (remember 9/11???)"Didn't happen, at least not in any major way. Turns out most of the footage that got turned into this urban legend was carefully edited to make it appear that Arabs were rejoicing in the streets, when, in fact, the majority were just as horrified as everyone else in the world."When an Israeli military operation kills a "non-combatant" there is always an investigation and the investigation is announced in the media."Yes, they often have investigations, and sometimes they legitimately done. Sometimes there is little or no investigation, and most often, they are merely perfunctory."When was the last time you saw or heard of a Palestinian investigation into the death of an Israeli due to terrorist activity?"Israel has Palestinians under a permanent state of siege, so there is nothing like a functioning government which could carry out any kind of investigation. Besides, unlike well-armed Israel, Palestine has very few weapons available to them, and they are ones that can generally only be used indiscriminately, so investigations of their attacks aren't really that necessary since they are almost always terroristic in nature. Israel, on the other hand, has a well-organized military and the most modern of weaponry, and they try to use that to claim that their often indiscriminate violence against Palestinians, which is much greater than Palestinian violence towards them, is somehow "clean." "So, if actions do truly speak louder than words, I am forced to conclude that this peace thing runs one way-from Israel to the Palestinians/Arabs/Islamics, but not the other way."If that is true, then how do you interpret the fact that and year in and year out, Israel kills at least twice as many Palestinians, including women, children and other non-combatants, as vice-versa?

LogicMan 7 years ago

"AND so what if they did? What business is it of ours if they have nuclear power?"There was no steam turbine evident in the pictures-- it was only a reactor building. So it was for weapons, not electrical power.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

"21% approval rating"A largely meaningless statistic. The low approval rating is because Republicans don't like Congress because it's (nominally) controlled by Democrats, and Democrats are unhappy because Republicans can block most Democratic initiatives.Now, if you take the average approval rating of each individual congress member within their districts, that would be a more meaningful comparison to Bush's abysmal rating, and that average is likely near or over 50%.

Brent Garner 7 years ago

Speakout:OK. If you are Israel, located where Israel is located, with limited natural barriers to invasion, surrounded by folks who have been promising since 1948 to exterminate you, what would you do? Would you, if you had the power, expel the Israeli's from Palestine? Would you be willing to stand aside and let a 2nd Holocaust occur? Would you be willing to commit US forces to guarantee Israel's security against hostile neighbors? Assuming Israel has nuclear weapons, and I for one have little doubt on that point, possessing such in the situation they find themselves may actually be somewhat rational from a survival viewpoint. Of course, it comes with some risks, but Israel's existence has been risky for a very long time.As for launching attacks against its neighbors, either you are naive, uninformed, or purposely ignorant. From a military viewpoint, Israel's geographic location is very difficult to defend, especially given the pre-1967 borders. So, Israel can hardly wait to absorb the first blow as that could very well be the last blow. They did so in 1973 with almost disastrous results. Israeli's would gladly live at peace with their neighbors, including the Palestinians. Note, even after Israel forcibly evacuated Gaza, Israel has continue to be subjected to daily rocket and mortar bombardment, attempted infliltrations for terror purposes, and other hostile acts. Even though Israel sends fuel to the Palestinians, the Palestinians attacked the very depot that supplied the fuel. How else should Israel react to such actions?Of course, for all I know you may be nothing more than another Hitler-like anti-semite. Are you?

staff04 7 years ago

"When did the republican mantra become "everyone's fault but mine"?"January 20, 2001

Corey Williams 7 years ago

"Of course, for all I know you may be nothing more than another Hitler-like anti-semite. Are you?"If you say something bad about the country of Israel, why does that automatically make you anti-semite? Why can't I dislike the country without it being assumed that I dislike Jews as well? To me it seems like a diversionary tactic. Just like the post that Bowhunter put up that had nothing at all to do with Israel, but look at how many posts have been written about it. If you criticize Israel, then you are accused of anti-semitism. Then you have to say, "No, no, no, no, no, I'm not anti-semitic." Meanwhile, because of that accusation, any credibility you had is deflated and your argument worthless. You can't be unbiased about Israel because you hate Jews. Is this why it happens? Is this why you brand any who dare criticize Israel as anti-semitic? And "Hitler-like" as well. So if you criticize Israel, not only do you hate Jews, you also want to eradicate their entire population? Is this how you like to start an argument? "When an Israeli military operation kills a "non-combatant" there is always an investigation and the investigation is announced in the media. I know because I read at least two online Israeli media sources each day and believe me, the Israeli Defense Forces are closely scrutinized."Substitute "America" for "Israel" in that statement above. Do you feel as if the American forces in Iraq have fully and honestly investigated events surrounding civilian deaths? Like Haditha? But if you read some American newspapers, you might walk away thinking that they did everything that could have been done. Although if you read some foreign news, you might get a different story. It's always best to read from a foreign source. Something unbiased.But then, if that foreign source is critical of Israel, of course they're just anti-semitic.

staff04 7 years ago

"not responsible for 'anything':."I don't think anyone here was suggesting that they are not responsible for anything.You, on the other hand, would have us believe that the Democrats in Congress, despite extraordinary efforts by both the White House and Congressional Republicans to block any progress and thwart the will of the American public, is responsible for EVERYTHING that has led people to be unhappy with the state of the nation. See where I'm going with this?

vpete69 7 years ago

Speakout says:"The whole world should be nuclear weapons free."================================And after that, we should exchange our cars for flying unicorns.

jafs 7 years ago

As an American Jew, I am not blindly pro-Israel.First, the US and Britain created Israel after WWII. When they did this, they did it without consideration of the Palestinians, who were the current occupants at the time.Why are we surprised that the Palestinians don't want to recognize Israel?Next, there are many documented cases of misbehavior by Israel, both in terms of occupying Palestinian territory, and in terms of violence which is killing civilians.Jimmy Carter, a pro-peace activist for many years, concludes that Israel is not following a good path to peace, which would include withdrawal from any occupied territories, and a fair, equitable split of territory between the Palestinians and Israelis.Without that, I think there is little chance for a lasting peace.

beatrice 7 years ago

We put former oil company bosses in the White House -- what else did we expect? Did people actually believe that they would put the interest of the country before that of the company? (There is a word for people like that, and I understand one is born every minute.)5 years and a day since we celebrated "Mission Accomplished" in Iraq. 5 years and a day.Can we afford four more years of the McSame?

Brent Garner 7 years ago

To "Another Bozo".First, interesting monicker. Made me laugh. Thanks.Second, I have doubts about the claim that the majority of Palestinians, or Arabs, or Islamics for that matter, being willing to live peacefully along side Israel. Why? Well, if the majority did, where are their peace movements? I don't see any. What I do see is dancing in the streets when something terrible happens to the US (remember 9/11???) or to Israel. When an Israeli military operation kills a "non-combatant" there is always an investigation and the investigation is announced in the media. I know because I read at least two online Israeli media sources each day and believe me, the Israeli Defense Forces are closely scrutinized. When was the last time you saw or heard of a Palestinian investigation into the death of an Israeli due to terrorist activity? So, if actions do truly speak louder than words, I am forced to conclude that this peace thing runs one way--from Israel to the Palestinians/Arabs/Islamics, but not the other way.

Scott Drummond 7 years ago

"We'll just sit here and let the liberals drive the country into the ground like they've done the past two years (oil up by almost 80%, gas up over $1.20 a gallon, record foreclosures, higher unemployment, etc): Because all of it has occurred during the time the democrats have had control of both the US Senate and the House of Representatives:"Quit your lying. Gas and oil are up because of bush's invasion of Iraq and due also to the free trade/pro expansion of China economy policies pushed by his corporate masters over the last 20 years. The housing market problems are the direct result of the hands off approach he and the republitraitors took to regulating the housing and financial industries, not to mention the unmitigated sprawl and over building that "developers" have engaged in during the last 20 years, fueled also by the undercutting of jobs being held by Americans due to the unstemmed influx of illegal, job stealing immigrants. Unemployment, see all of the above, etc..... These things may have happened while the democrats have a slim, slim majority. The cause, however, is largely the fault of the worst President this country has ever endured, aided and abbetted by unchecked republitraitor rule.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

"Israeli's would gladly live at peace with their neighbors, including the Palestinians."The majority of Israelis would like to do so, just as the majority of Palestinians want to do the same. But the sentiments that prevail are those of bigotry and violence, both on Israel's part, and the Palestinians'.Until the violent factions on each side can be contained, there will be no peace, but BushCo have never wanted peace, anywhere. War is just too good for business.

BOE 7 years ago

"High gas prices are a sign of a failed presidency." - Halliburton CEO Dick Cheney, 1998

fu7il3 7 years ago

To be honest I think that is everyone's mantra in this day and age. When was the last time you saw any public official say, "Sorry, my bad."

jonas 7 years ago

Where's balik? Did he get booted again?

yourworstnightmare 7 years ago

7.5 months remaining of Bushco idiocy and lies.The war of choice in Iraq is a disaster, and Bushco has managed to bring the strongest economy in the world to its knees.Anther four years of these failed policies (tax cuts, wars of choice) will certainly end America's role as the strongest nation in the world.

Speakout 7 years ago

AND so what if they did? What business is it of ours if they have nuclear power? The Israelis will violate their air space and blow it up anyway with our weapons. Why are we NOT outraged that Israel has nuclear weapons and they are stolen from the USA? The whole world should be nuclear weapons free. Especially the one government who has launched attacks against several of its neighbors.

Stephen Prue 7 years ago

No nukes for kooks and only a kook would nuke his fellow man! I guess that makes the US a kook since its the only country that ever nuked anyone.

deec 7 years ago

Wow. Let's parse just one little bit from this diatribe. "And please stop throwing out the 'mission accomplished' garbage. That banner was meant as a salute for the specific manuevers carried out by the crew of that aircraft carrier, not as a symbol that we'd sewn up the entire conflict.""The landing came just hours before Bush is to tell the nation that major combat operations in Iraq have ended...In his speech to the troops Thursday night Bush will thank the U.S. military for their efforts in Iraq. "Your courage -- your willingness to face danger for your country and for each other -- made this day possible,"http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/05/01/bush.carrier.landing/

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

"If you truly believe that W. and Cheney are evil and that they lied in order to start a war then you're nothin' but a nutball. Noone wants to go to war, not even members of the military."Really? Ever heard of the Project for a New American Century?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

"Pardon me, bozo, should I have specified 'rational' and 'sane' people? There are exceptions to every rule, hence terms like 'extremists' and 'warhawks'. Perspective would be useful here, for the love:"These are the members of PNAC who petioned Clinton to attack Iraq in 1998. Are these folks "rational and sane," or "extremists and warhawks?"Elliott Abrams, Richard L. Armitage, William J. Bennett, Jeffrey Bergner, John Bolton, Paula Dobriansky, Francis Fukuyama, Robert Kagan, Zalmay Khalilzad, William Kristol, Richard Perle, Peter W. Rodman, Donald Rumsfeld, William Schneider, Jr., Vin Weber, Paul Wolfowitz, R. James Woolsey, Robert B. Zoellickhttp://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

I take it you disagree, nutty buddy?If so, perhaps you should work on vocabulary-building exercises. Maybe your language-arts teacher could help you out.

Corey Williams 7 years ago

"I think it's also important for the president to lay out a timetable as to how long [U.S. troops] will be involved and when they will be withdrawn."W, June 15, 1999

Corey Williams 7 years ago

When the banner went up, there were those who truly believed that the war was pretty much over. And the idea that the banner was for the crew of the ship? Not a chance. That thing was huge. The price on the material and printing had to have been at least five digits if not more. And when you look at the theatrics that took place, that banner fits right in. Pulling the carrier within a mile of shore, but pushing back out again so W could land on a jet. A helicopter could still do it even at 30 miles out, but he wanted to make a carrier landing; just like his daddy was trained to do. It was all to show the country that he wasn't a wimp like his daddy was."Ask the Kurds or the Iraqi's that helped us during Desert Storm how they feel about us coming to their aid. Oops, can't. They got massacred and gassed. ... But yes, we must be the bad guys."Are you talking about the Kurds who got gassed in 88? The massacre where the major players in the US government initially (and for several years) blamed it on Iran? The gas attack that was the reason for Saddam's hanging but also the one that no one did anything about for over 15 years? Or are you talking about the massacres that occurred after the rebellions that followed first gulf war? The uprisings that happened because our government said that if there was an insurgency, we would help them overthrow Saddam? The massacres that happened because they took us at our word and started rebellions? Yes, you're right: Not doing anything at either time makes us bad guys.

deec 7 years ago

The families and friends of the thousands of Americans and Iraqis killed due to "house to house fighting of terrorists and Iran-supplied extremists, or to tribal sectarianism," rather than "'major combat operations'" will, no doubt, appreciate the difference. Ditto the million plus displaced Iraqis who are now refugees.

Rationalanimal 7 years ago

How about expanding the discussion to Franklin D. Roosevelt. He and Churchill had discussion after discussion, as confirmed by Joe Kennedy and his Nazi assistant, about how to get America involved in World War II. Turns out FDR ignored intel that resulted in Pearl Harbor, a few thousand dead or so the conspiracy theories go. You extremists on the left have stayed up one too many nights watching the X-Files. Let it go. Living life without constant paranoia is wonderful. Give it a try, you might like it.

deec 7 years ago

Its funny how one side cites their sources and posts quotes and the other side says "yeah, well, you all are a bunch of (insert stock insult here).

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

"I expect 'major combat operations' might refer to the all-out military offensive against an established army. If you think that applies to house to house fighting of terrorists and Iran-supplied extremists, or to tribal sectarianism, you don't really have a grasp on military operations at all, now do ya?"Too bad BushCo gave absolutely no thought to what they would do when the easy part was done, especially since the military's best analysts were telling them that the door-to-door urban fighting would be the biggest challenge that they would face (so, no, the initial invasion and the civil war that has ensued can't be conveniently separated from each other in defining what this war is and has become.)It's pretty clear now that the Iraqi military had no intentions of taking on the US military head on, and the insurgency that has no end in sight is a direct result of that decision. And the idiocy of Paul Bremer and others to disband the Iraqi military only exacerbated things.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

Pretty damning stuff from General Sanchez, buffalo star-- his concluding paragraphs--"That decision set up the United States for a failed first year in Iraq. There is no question about it. And I was supposed to believe that neither the Secretary of Defense nor anybody above him knew anything about it? Impossible! Rumsfeld knew about it. Everybody on the NSC knew about it, including Condoleezza Rice, George Tenet, and Colin Powell. Vice President Cheney knew about it. And President Bush knew about it.There's not a doubt in my mind that they all embraced this decision to some degree. And if it had not been for the moral courage of Gen. John Abizaid to stand up to them all and reverse Franks's troop drawdown order, there's no telling how much more damage would have been done.In the meantime, hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars were unnecessarily spent, and worse yet, too many of our most precious military resource, our American soldiers, were unnecessarily wounded, maimed, and killed as a result. In my mind, this action by the Bush administration amounts to gross incompetence and dereliction of duty."

deec 7 years ago

"U.S. policy should have as its explicit goal removing Saddam Hussein's regime from power and establishing a peaceful and democratic Iraq in its place...Only the U.S. can lead the way in demonstrating that his rule is not legitimate and that time is not on the side of his regime. To accomplish Saddam's removal, the following political and military measures should be undertaken: We should take whatever steps are necessary to challenge Saddam Hussein's claim to be Iraq's legitimate ruler, including indicting him as a war criminal; We should help establish and support (with economic, political, and military means) a provisional, representative, and free government of Iraq in areas of Iraq not under Saddam's control; We should use U.S. and allied military power to provide protection for liberated areas in northern and southern Iraq; and We should establish and maintain a strong U.S. military presence in the region, and be prepared to use that force to protect our vital interests in the Gulf - and, if necessary, to help remove Saddam from power"5/29/08Signed; Elliot Abrams, William J. Bennett,Jeffrey BergnerJohn R. Bolton,Paula Dobriansky,Francis Fukuyama Robert KaganZalmay Khalilzad William Kristol Richard Perle Peter RodmanDonald Rumsfeld William Schneider, Jr. Vin Weber Paul WolfowitzR. James Woolsey Robert B. Zoellickhttp://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqletter1998.htm

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

Do all those strawmen you drag around mean you are never lonely, lucky man?

deec 7 years ago

Heck I'll take the bait. How many people died as a result of a philandering president lying about his adultery? How many (so far) have died as a result of the president lying about Iraq?Oh yeah...where;s Bin Laden?

JHOK32 7 years ago

Bowhunter: Did you even once consider that the reason the entire country booted the Republicans out of Congress last year was because the country is sick of their greed and lies? Bush stood in front of a huge banner that said "Mission Accomplished." That was 5 years ago. Hundreds of our kids in uniform were still alive then. The only accomplishment Bush has made is indebting our kids & grandkids into Trillions of dollars worth of debt (that's with a "T"). Where has all this money gone? (think hard now). I bet if you were an Eskimo I could sell you ice cubes!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

So, are you saying that WWII wasn't the "good war," RA?"Living life without constant paranoia is wonderful. Give it a try, you might like it."Your heroes of BushCo/PNAC would appear to be the paranoids-- they're the ones who had been plotting to overthrow Saddam for what were obviously baseless fears (or was it merely cynical hype to whip up the bloodlust in gullible folks like you?)But what's quite real is that 4000 US service people are dead and thousands more are permanently maimed and disabled, along with as many as a million Iraqi civilian and 4 million refugees, and a civil war that appears to be a decades-long affair, which has already run up a $3 trillion tab, and counting, that will be passed on to yet unborn generations.But sorry to jolt your "paranoia-free" lifestyle. I'm sure there's a good "American Idol" or "reality" teevee episode that will get you back to your sweet spot.

Rationalanimal 7 years ago

(with finger wagging and looking directly in to the camera) "I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Ms. Lewinsky, I never told anyone to lie."Your man bubba, perfected the art of executive lying.

jonas 7 years ago

Nutty_Buddy (Anonymous) says:"A few comments are typical responses from the unhappy liberals."Oh, but this is more clever than usual by half! Note that now, instead of "These comments are typical," the more elusive "A few comments are typical" is now used. Progression, indeed.

uncleandyt 7 years ago

Good letter Daniel, againAnd, to you folks who think you're on The Team, ...you're not. There is nothing conservative about waste. Slaughter and greed are not family values. Well, maybe in the Bush or Manson familes they are.You are being lied to, daily. Your pill-poppin' hero, Rush Limpbaugh, goes on for three hours a day, five days a week, claiming to know what the enemy is thinking. He tells you what to think. All you have to do is believe. Now you are advanced. Now you are Right, and that means correct. You know what is true. You know what is funny, for he laughed. How could one be more informed? Hannity has a show. O'Really? has a show. Maybe you like to mix in a little Savage. Will one of you geniuses tell me where I can find some of that Liberal Media. Glen Beck? Tony Snow? I see that Karl Rove got himself a media gig. Fare and imbalance935 lies about Iraq, can You believe it?The Hippies are coming, the Hippies are coming!

Corey Williams 7 years ago

"I've more or less been told what to do in essence and have had a hard fast rule about what you think is and is not laid down by two obvious so called liberals."Maybe you need to think about going back to school. You obviously know how to work a computer. Maybe you need to know more about sentence structure because I have no idea what point you are trying to get across.

Mkh 7 years ago

"C'mon, folks, we're not the bogey man. Anyone happen to catch the revelry in the streets when we took down Husseins' regime? If someone invaded the U.S. would our citizens be celebrating and pulling down statues of our leader? Ask the Kurds or the Iraqi's that helped us during Desert Storm how they feel about us coming to their aid. Oops, can't"------------------------------------------What you saw on tv of Saddam's statue coming down was pure phony drama brought to you by the corporate media. It never happened that way, those were not regular Iraqi citizens, those were the old Iraqi Parliament that Saddam had dismantled, the whole thing was staged and set up by the American military, who brought in the ex-Parliament and the tv cameras then guarded the area while the statue was taken down.Oh yeah, and by the way, you are dead wrong that nobody wants to go to war. Perhaps the troops who actually do the fighting don't want to go to war, but the leaders in the military-industrial complex not only want war, but must have it to stay in business.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

" But I taught myself how to read, write, make it on my own, take responsibility"Good job. But you also need to learn to think things through thoroughly, something the BushCo clearly doesn't do well. And unlike you, they also haven't learned to even acknowledge mistakes and bad judgement, which is a prerequisite to taking responsibility for them.But as a citizen, you have an equal responsibility to acknowledge that the politicians you support have taken us down a very wrong path.So don't just mouth/type the words. Your boys have fckd up completely, just as you did in voting for and/or supporting them. Suck it up, and as you say, take responsibility for your actions.

Scott Drummond 7 years ago

"If someone invaded the U.S. would our citizens be celebrating and pulling down statues of our leader?"Well, the person currently in the office of President has the worst approval rating in history. Many of us believe he should have been removed long ago. After 8 long years, yes, I think a large majority of the American public would celebrate the traitor's removal. I know I certainly would.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 7 years ago

" A majority of the U.S. elected W. to office. Twice."Really? The majority of voters who voted for Gore in 2000 would likely disagree with you, although the minority who voted for Bush have shown a great propensity for denial of reality.

Left_handed 7 years ago

cool,Give it a rest. Bush didn't steal the election in 2000. Mr. Gore tried to steal it by getting his Democrat cronies on the Florida supreme court to pretend that Florida election law didn't actually exist. Maybe Mr. Gore would have had a stronger argument if he had managed to win in his home state.

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