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Archive for Friday, March 7, 2008

Pastor urges school ‘exodus’

March 7, 2008

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— As one group attempts to use California public schools as laboratories to assist children in "coming out" with their nontraditional sexual orientation, another is urging parents to come out from these schools and educate their children with their values at home or in private schools.

Last Sunday, a group called "Exodus Mandate" (www.exodusmandate.org) began placing literature in scores of Southern California church lobbies, urging parents to take charge of their children's education and oppose attempts by activists and politicians to shape the worldview of young people, a worldview that runs counter to what many taxpaying parents believe and teach in their homes and places of worship.

The final straw for some was the decision last fall by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger to sign SB 777 - a bill opponents say will have a long and significant effect not only on California public schools, but also on public schools everywhere. That's because California is one of the largest purchasers of school textbooks, and publishers tend to shape content to reflect the wishes of the state that buys the most books.

SB 777, or the California Student Civil Rights Act, requires "nondiscrimination" against sexual orientation, as well as other characteristics. Opponents take that to mean favorable teaching about homosexuality, bisexuality, gender identity and any and every other form of sexual expression for which there is an advocate.

Dr. Ron Gleason, pastor of Grace Presbyterian Church in Yorba Linda, Calif., is leading the exodus movement in Southern California. In a telephone interview, Gleason acknowledges it is difficult work because he says there is virtually no leadership at the pastoral level with the "big name Christian celebrity" pastors largely remaining silent. "They prefer to build their empires rather than step out and lead," he says. Gleason says 96 percent of his congregation have their children in private schools or educate them at home.

Gleason says SB 777 has resulted in California schools not being allowed to use the words "mommy" and "daddy" anymore. "Children will be taught that sexual orientation and gender are merely a matter of personal choice," says Gleason, "and they will be taught to find what is 'right' for them."

The Web site for Gleason's group argues SB 777 essentially makes it lawful for public schools to "indoctrinate" children as young as pre-kindergarten to accept as normal and morally acceptable homosexuality and "other sexually deviant lifestyles."

Gleason's rationale is simple. "If you're going to send your kids to Caesar, you're going to get Romans back."

He's right. It isn't just the sexual re-programming. That's symbolic of a larger problem. The government schools want to shape a child's mind in ways that reflect a mostly liberal, humanistic worldview.

The tragedy is that too many conservative Christian, Republican parents who want their children to have a different worldview - their own - willingly participate in the destruction of their children's minds by turning them over to a way of thinking that is antithetical to their beliefs. Parents who worship at conservative churches on Sunday willingly send their children to schools five days a week where what they are taught undermines what they learned in church and at home.

Gleason has found it difficult to start a fire among conservative Christians because apathy is like wet underbrush, but he is undeterred. He thinks that like those other fires with which California is familiar, the best time to get out is while you still can.

- Cal Thomas is a columnist for Tribune Media Services.

Comments

World_Vision 6 years, 5 months ago

Exodus Mandate is all part of the Exodus International and Focus On The Family foundation and organizations.

These groups include the exact same set of "facts" about homosexuality that Fred Phelps uses on his website.

Exodus readily quotes "dr" Paul Camron and James Dobson, as their sources on the evils of homosexuality when they try to approach from a different angle then biblical.

Go rent the movies "But I'm A Cheerleader" and "This Is What Love In Action Looks Like", as well as "Jesus Camp" for a good idea of what Exodus Int is all about.

I don't think that anyone, even a conservative Christian, with an IQ about 72 could take schooling and parenting advice from the likes of those running Exodus.

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jafs 6 years, 5 months ago

Public schools are not supposed to teach children right-wing Christian values.

If parents want to do that, it's their right to do so.

Why is it "indoctrination" if the school teaches that it's ok to have same-sex parents, but not if right-wing Christian parents teach that it's not?

Having said all of this, I do think the school may be crossing a line here. Schools should really stay out of "values" education as much as possible.

Let's teach our children how to read, write, do arithmetic, and think in public schools.

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

Mr. Gleason, the right wing zealot's roller coaster jumped off the tracks and slammed into the tilt-o-whirl of his mind.

Gleason says SB 777 has resulted in California schools not being allowed to use the words "mommy" and "daddy" anymore. "Children will be taught that sexual orientation and gender are merely a matter of personal choice," says Gleason, "and they will be taught to find what is 'right' for them."

The Web site for Gleason's group argues SB 777 essentially makes it lawful for public schools to "indoctrinate" children as young as pre-kindergarten to accept as normal and morally acceptable homosexuality and "other sexually deviant lifestyles."

I see nothing nefarious about acknowledging that some of the students in school do have two mommies or two daddies or that some of their teachers are gay. It is only historical truth to teach that many prominent and valued inventors, leaders, heroes were gay. It is only a fact that being gay is a common and normal facet of the human condition. If parents want to "indoctrinate" their children to believe otherwise that is their right but don't expect my tax dollars to go toward that hatred.

Children most certainly will not be taught that one's sexual orientation is a personal choice as it is an unchanging characteristic that people are born with. The sooner children are taught that it is unacceptable to tease, bully, harass, discriminate, or otherwise mistreat people who are different from themselves the better. It is too bad that Mr. Gleason wasn't taught that in school.

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

"The tragedy is that too many conservative Christian, Republican parents who want their children to have a different worldview - their own - willingly participate in the destruction of their children's minds by turning them over to a way of thinking that is antithetical to their beliefs. Parents who worship at conservative churches on Sunday willingly send their children to schools five days a week where what they are taught undermines what they learned in church and at home."

To me, this statement is OUTRAGEOUS. For one thing, my kids don't get our values just on Sundays. If his congregation were LIVING their values on a daily basis and having conversations with their children about how not everyone is going to live the same, then they wouldn't be getting back "Romans" but instead salting the earth like Jesus commanded. Are my 2nd and 3rd graders incapable of being a good witness to their peers? If I think my kids' teacher is full of crap, I carefully and respectfully explain to my kids why I don't agree. Cause that's what PARENTS are supposed to do.

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Confrontation 6 years, 5 months ago

I bet Larry Craig supports homeschooling. I'm sure that would have kept him from reaching under the stall.

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

75X55 - Well, that hasn't happened yet. The one thing we've focused on for our kids is that we are consistent an trustworthy. We don't even do Santa Claus or Easter Bunny because we want them to know that we aren't full of crap. We are always talking to them about their views, asking questions to get them to think for themselves and giving them verifiable information. We're not afraid to answer their questions and we treat them as equals. We've never had to force our views, we just share them. I've known LOTS of parents who have kids that never went through a truly rebellious, disrespectful stage and these are the steps they took and so far it's been a remarkable way to interact with our kids. Not to mention, if kids think their parents are full of crap, they usually feel that way about all authority figures, including these "evil teachers" who are trying to "indoctrinate" them.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

75x55---I totally agree with your 9:30 post....just for the record. Scenebooster what private school do you send your children to? "I send my kids to a private school that reflects my worldview and hopes for them. You fundies are more than welcome to do the same." judging by a lot of other posts you have made here.....why waste your money send them to public school...the public school "worldviews" are right in line with yours!

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

allate - not if his values are an exceedingly excellent education with small classroom sizes and special courses not offered in a public school. Or perhaps a less traditional teaching style or each-child-at-his-own-pace philosophy.

There are tons of reasons to home school or send your child to a private school, but fear of public school's worldviews, shouldn't be one of them.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

alm77---my children attend a very small PUBLIC school (classes are 12-18 children) fortunately I'm am not at all scared of my districts "worldviews" as they tend to be very conservative, fiscally, socially and educationally and it has served us well. My point is there are plenty of public schools out there that I think would fit scenebooster well..just not our school! I guess this "fundie" (whatever the heck that is) finds it perfectly ok to send my child to Public school. Being a totally involved parent makes it a better experience.

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

Come on Defender tell us how you really feel. hehe

Actually, I kind of agree with you a little bit (never thought I'd say that!!) Because the more I think about it the more I realize that my parenting "style" is more like the liberal "free thinkers" I know, but my values are absolutely 100% Jesus. I think this may come from the fact that a lot of my Christian mentors were born again hippies....

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

allate - I'm right there with you (fundie, public school, same class sizes). I was just answering your question by saying that there are plenty of reasons other than fear of worldview to choose an alternative.

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

uh, scene? who was I condemning?

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dumas 6 years, 5 months ago

I have to say ... given the fact that there's emphasis on testing still as a result of No Child Left Behind, I don't think there's a whole lot of time for social commentary via teachers to students during a school day.

Gleason and Thomas have managed to build an argument on a slippery slope and, I think, faulty logic. For one, I am in serious doubt that either of them have spent a day in a school in ages. So, until they do that, neither has a right to truly preach on this matter.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

I did not "lambaste public schools as "homosexual indoctrination camps" as your fundie brethren have" I'm saying there are very good well rounded public schools and it's beyond me why you would pay to send your children to a private school who is so obviously (by your post) more liberal than a public school can be? I do not appreciate being called a "fundie". I don't even know what the h e double L it means.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

parkay---I'll be the first to take mine out! That's just wrong!

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dumas 6 years, 5 months ago

parkay ... that's just lame. it won't be a dress. it'll be an evening gown. duh!

oh yeah ... and your comment is insipid.

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jumpin_catfish 6 years, 5 months ago

I think if I had it to do over I would have sent our kids to a private school although not religious.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

And scenebooster....here's where I guess we agree to disagree...I think those are all very good virtues, absolutely nothing wrong with teaching your kids to be conservative with their money, be nice and respectful of others, and to study hard! and if they're all conservative things then so be it!! Those are my ideas of a conservative schooling.

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

I'm the one who said "100% Jesus"... which is why I thought you were calling me judgmental. And Jesus didn't "back" any legislation so I doubt He'd comment on the matter either way. He tends to be more concerned with individuals than nations and policies.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

scene........sorry but i do believe homosexuality is wrong...i know some homosexuals who don't scream "i'm gay/lesbian" (unlike an on the streeter in today's paper) don't ask/don't tell is the way it should be!!! Again, we'll agree to disagree i'm sure. And, btw, that isn't 100% jesus either!

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moo 6 years, 5 months ago

Allateup, if you believe homosexuality is wrong, I guess you're lucky that you're heterosexual, so you never have to worry about it. Don't ask don't tell is fine, that is, if it goes both ways. You realize of course that this would mean you can never mention or wife/husband, your marriage, your girlfriend/boyfriend. If teachers talking about relationships is what you're worried about, then what about that teacher (and i had many of them) who on a regular basis told stories about their spouse? What if a student were offended by heterosexuality and had been raised to believe it were wrong?

This isn't about some underlying plot to make kids gay. This is about teaching kids to respect one another. Letting them know that it is not ok to beat up the gay kid in class. You still have every right to teach them hatred at home or to pull them out and stick them in an openly prejudiced private school.

Wow, parkay, gonna back up your claim that the governor wants a man in drag in every classroom? Cause otherwise, I'm definitely calling BS on that one.

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SettingTheRecordStraight 6 years, 5 months ago

Awesome. I can't wait to learn more about the good things Exodus Mandate is doing for our children.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

scene.....didn't say i can't be respectful..but don't push it my face......and MOO that is absolutey a ridiculous scenario....being heterosexual is completely natural. And, please don't try to disagree with me you don't even want to go there!

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craigers 6 years, 5 months ago

I think teaching children that it isn't okay to treat others bad because of who they are or choose to be would be a great start in families and public schools.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

Sodomite....do you have children? Check your school library and tell me there is not one book in there about, transexuals, gays/lesbians? What parkay said seems hard to believe, but actually you'd be surprised, it may not be too far away.

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

scene - ahhh, but His "rules" were for believers and followers, not public policy. The only harsh words He spoke were to religious leaders with hard hearts about their hypocrisy. Otherwise, He taught lovingly to people seeking The Way and His words weren't always easy ("eat my flesh, drink my blood", "I am The Way, The Truth, The Life. No one comes to The Father, but by Me."). All that was to the people who were following Him. He never once addressed the fact that He was living in an occupied country, or stated that The Way should be made into law.

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salad 6 years, 5 months ago

Sounds like a good time to get out of the teaching profession.....actually, anytime is a good time to get out of the teaching profession.

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d_prowess 6 years, 5 months ago

I think the posts by MOO and allateup illustrate the broader world we sometimes struggle to live in. One seems to believe that homosexuality is natural and the other that it is not. These are two view points that are each person's right to have, but in complete contrast to each other and probably directly effect their stances on many societal issues.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

exactly d_prowess....I don't want public schools teaching my kids that homosexuality is natural as much as MOO would like the public schools to teach them that it is.

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moo 6 years, 5 months ago

Haha, looks like I struck a nerve. The old "natural" argument. So what? Nudity is natural, but I sure bet you're opposed to that in schools. I personally am a big fan of heterosexuality, but if you discriminate against homosexuals, prepare for them to do the same back (although it's pretty difficult as a minority). Oh and by the way, take a look at bonobo monkeys. Huzzah, perfectly natural homosexuality.

If you want no form of relationship discussion in schools, fine. I can respect that. But allowing homosexual individuals to talk about their significant other in a classroom is not indoctrinating kids to be gay. Not allowing is however, teaching kids that these things don't exist and we're all the same. That is preparing them for serious misunderstanding when they enter the real world.

Oh and presence of a book on transexuality in a school library is not requiring at least one teacher in drag per school.

Have a pleasant day!

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

MOO---you brought up the word....MINORITY....that's exactly what they are. But, homesexuality is continously shoved down our throats. How in the He** did a minority get such a big voice? (now that statement is going to open a can of worms!) I tend to believe it's an adult thing.....leave MY kids out of it! It is something to be talked about at home. And we are all different in many ways I teach that to my kids everyday but I don't have to bring up homosexuality when I'm doing it.

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

Logic........come up with a more LOGIC rebuttal! LOL

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

EVERYONE knows the earth is not flat. DOH!

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

If homosexuality is so natural....explain to me....perhaps being heterosexual is wrong....if everyone was homosexual...how in the world would we continue on earth without procreation???

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alm77 6 years, 5 months ago

Scene - "If this is true, than those who don't believe are under no obligation to do anything, like discriminate against homosexuals, just because you are a "believer and a follower". - I totally 100% believe that statement.

I have no RIGHT to impose my Christian beliefs on nonbelievers in any way, shape or form. I simply share my experience out love and relationships, PRAY a lot, talk, pray some more and see the result of God working through my witness to change people's hearts and mind to accept Jesus as their Savior first, and then let Him convict people on His time table about the issues He wants them to deal with. I don't make people "see things my way" before they come to Christ and I don't insist they work on the issues I've predetermined. They have to work on the issues God calls them to work on. Now, having said that, if I have a brother or sister in Christ who is making some bad choices (i.e. "sin") then I have an obligation out of love to confront them. But Jesus was very clear about having the right heart when doing this ("remove the plank in your own eye") and doing it in a loving manner.

I have acquaintances who are Christians, and I very well believe to be saved by all accounts that I've seen, but they are making choices that I view as sin. I won't confront them on it because they are simply acquaintances and I don't have that loving relationship with them. They're not in my circle of influence and God isn't going to judge me on their account. They may die in this sinful choice, but I don't think that will exclude them from salvation. They don't recognize this choice as sinful and aren't in blatent rebellion. God has not convicted their hearts, as far as I know. Nor has He sent loving brothers to them who do have influence to bring it up, so I'm guess that its not time for them to deal with that issue.

I do however have several true friends as atheists and agnostics who I will be held accountable for if I become a stumbling block to them coming to Jesus.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to see an awesome Christian band at the bar in KC tonight, so I gotta figure out what to wear!!

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ndmoderate 6 years, 5 months ago

Just a thought:

Heterosexuality and homosexuality are BOTH natural.

Carry on.

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

Allateup, just because something isn't as common as another doesn't mean it isn't natural. Homosexuality happens all the time in the animal kingdom just as in humans. There are such things as dominant and recessive genes. This would explain why it occurs in nature and species still continue. Coal and diamonds are made of the same thing-Carbon. One is common and the other is rare. Both are natural. Gay people are God's diamonds, shining jewels amidst dirty common coal.

When homosexuality occurs in nature, naturally, it would seem unnatural to teach our school children that homosexuality is unnatural. Naturally, it would follow that if homosexuality is part of God's natural creation then it is good naturally.

Why don't you take another read at Leviticus and attempt to understand the context. What you have been taught to take as literal truth is not accepted universally as fact.

My church and many others hold all God's children as precious and is holding an adult education class on March 28th after our 10 AM traditional worship service called what the Bible really says about homosexuality--What those six verses really mean. For more information about Metropolitan Community Church of Topeka www.MCCTopeka.org

For those that prefer a contemporary church service come at 5 PM. Either way there is always a place for you.

I invite you to come and worship Jesus with us. If you have any trouble finding the church just look for the Phelps cult and their signs and turn there.

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beatrice 6 years, 5 months ago

gayokay: "just because something isn't as common as another doesn't mean it isn't natural."

Are you serious? Of course something unusual is also unnatural. That is why we must discriminate against the left-handed. Just today I saw one of these left-handed freaks writing a check with his left hand right in front of children! Disgusting. I can't believe the way he flaunted it like that. People like that should keep their left-handed lifestyle to themselves. Left-handed freaks!

Back to the article, Cal points out that this California law requires "nondiscrimination."

He is against this, which means he is "prodiscrimination." To be writing a column in support of discrimination is pretty much a column in support of hate. But go ahead, supporters, keep your spawn at home, on the compound. Teach them that God loves America and nowhere else, that evolution doesn't exist and that the earth is just a little over 6000 years old, and that discrimination is a good thing.

Just don't be surprised if they don't come around to visit after they leave home.

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WHY 6 years, 5 months ago

What will be your public school bail-out plan, when Bilious Sebelius' recent queer quota edict for state employees mandates a man wearing a dress to be your child's public school teacher, and to tell him about the joys of sodomy?

Where to begin. Well first, gay men do wear pants (at least the ones I have met). Second, who doesn't like sodomy?

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Godot 6 years, 5 months ago

I can't find it. Where in the constitution does it state that all parents must subject their children to attending a government sanctioned school from age 5 through 18?

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1029 6 years, 5 months ago

"California is one of the largest purchasers of school textbooks, and publishers tend to shape content to reflect the wishes of the state that buys the most"

Cal Thomas is so funny.

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

The Governor's executive order adding sexual orientation to the Kansas Acts Against Discrimination has no quotas or affirmative action. It does not in any way include public schools as they are not staffed with state of Kansas employees.

As for men in dresses being teachers... If it was good enough for Jesus, then it is good enough for me.

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

DollyP, Guys or Gals, it's all the same. Everybody likes sodomy but gahmorrah? Not so much. why is that?

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RedwoodCoast 6 years, 5 months ago

moo (Anonymous) says: "Oh and by the way, take a look at bonobo monkeys. Huzzah, perfectly natural homosexuality."


OK, I really hate to be a devil's advocate here (no pun intended), but I'm not sure how strong a link the bonobo argument is.

Humans, chimpanzees, and pygmy chimpanzees (bonobos) are three separate species who share a common ancestor about 5-6 million years ago. Bonobos and chimps, however, share a common ancestor that diverged about 2 million years ago. So we are, in evolutionary terms, equidistant from both bonobos and chimpanzees. Also, there has been another group of bonobos studied that does not use sex for social bonding and does exhibit male dominance.

Now, this doesn't mean that I don't believe that humans, as a perplexingly complex species, have individuals of our species who are naturally homosexual. I'm just not sold on the soundess of the bonobo-as-human-analogs argument. And lastly, they are "perfectly natural" homosexual great apes, not monkeys.

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

This link to an article is proof of the harm that can come from men in dresses teaching school. Sweet Jesus, the tribulation is neigh!

http://www.cjonline.com/stories/030808/loc_254954121.shtml

If you get caught up in the rapture and I'm stuck here with the rest of the residents of Sodom can I have your stuff?

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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allateup 6 years, 5 months ago

When I was in grade school, 30 years ago, I had no idea what homosexuality meant. So don't go saying that it is in the agenda.

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

Allateup, When I was in school 30 years ago I didn't know what gay meant either. I knew that I was attracted to my other male class mates. Sensing something different about me the other kids began to tease me and call me gay and other slurs. This escalated into bullying and then sexual assault by a bully in the gym showers. The bully identified himself as straight.

Maybe I should have been home schooled where I would have been safer from kids taught by parents to hate people who are different.

The bill that we are discussing "The California Student Civil Rights Act" is a good thing. I wish that it had been around 30 years ago when I was in school.

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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clyde_never_barks 6 years, 5 months ago

So what happens if you take the salt and light out of the dark world. Isn't that part of what "we" are charged with in the commission?

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

Clyde, I agree. As a gay Christian I must let my light shine bright for the world to see. With out salt the world would be not only bland but as one of the first preservatives of our ancestors food or symbolically the world would rot. Just call me a Salty Flamin' Light In the Loafers Homo that enlightens those that would use the holy name of God to justify their own bias.

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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clyde_never_barks 6 years, 5 months ago

gay - notice I don't attack you at all, but you certainly feel the need to pounce all over me. If you would read a little closer - and put down your drink for a minute, you would see that I disagree with the pastor who is urging the "exodus."

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Jason Bowers-Chaika 6 years, 5 months ago

Pull back the claws Clyde,

I can read. I still agree with you. I apologize if my words could have been misconstrued. And thank you for your concern but the good Lord has relieved me of the obsession to drink.

KansasEqualityCoalition.org

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JJE007 6 years, 5 months ago

Did y'all see the Faux News story. "Anti-gay agenda discovered to be main constituent of gay agenda....keeping apparent radical gay activism in the news...members of the clergy, accused of being subliminally gay, believed to be responsible...new Bush League stoning law eliminates the current accused...church-goer Bubba Hoedown of the Minimal Understanding of Christ Church and Grill comments "If we have to kill everybody in the church to sque...squel... git rid of this homersexshal threat, then we'll do it. Beware you samadite...somadites...sadami... gays. We're cocked, locked, loaded and...and... Dang. I sed cocked..." BANG!

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