Democratic caucuses draw big turnout in Lawrence / LJWorld.com

Archive for Tuesday, February 5, 2008

By George Diepenbrock

February 5, 2008, 7:21 p.m. Updated February 6, 2008, 12:27 a.m.

2008 Kansas Democratic Caucus

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An overflow crowd at Abe and Jake's Landing for one of Lawrence's three Democratic caucuses.

Steady rain and blowing winds did not deter 4,872 Douglas County Democrats from caucusing Tuesday as the three sites across Lawrence saw large crowds and overwhelming support for Barack Obama.

Statewide, Obama was set to pick up a majority of the 32 delegates at stake, but the state party leaders had not released that calculation late Tuesday night with a few caucus sites yet to report results.

Obama won 80 percent of the Lawrence vote, compared with 19 percent for Clinton. With 90 percent of Kansas results in, Obama led Clinton 71 percent to 26 percent.

In Lawrence, men and women of all ages stood in long lines outdoors in a turnout that shocked even Democratic organizers, as 1,250 voters registered as Democrats at one site alone.

"They tried to have control, but it was chaotic - due to the weather and the darkness and the crowd," said Gini Wigington, who waited in the rain for at least 40 minutes before entering the caucus at Abe & Jake's Landing, 8 E. Sixth St.

The line outside Abe & Jake's stretched across the parking lot as people waited in the rain and wind. With more than 1,400 participants and a capacity limit of 720 in Abe & Jake's, organizers had to use a backup site, Liberty Hall.

At the largest caucus in Lawrence, the Douglas County 4-H Fairgrounds, 1930 Harper St., hundreds of voters waited more than an hour in a line that snaked outside into the muddy parking lot.

"It's one of the most significant elections in my lifetime. I've been following it closely," said Emi Erekosima, an Obama supporter and Kansas University junior from Rose Hill.

She stood in the dark and rain waiting to go inside and stand in line some more during the caucus.

But organizers said the overflow crowds were a good problem to have.

"I think people here are so hungry for a change in direction that they can taste it, and that's what motivates all the Democrats to show up here tonight," said Douglas County Commissioner Charles Jones, chairman of the fairgrounds caucus.

Organizers said because it was the first significant caucus in Kansas in more than a decade, there was no way for the process to run as a "well-oiled machine," Jones said.

The high turnout also complicated matters, as rules required participants to be in line by 7 p.m. at most sites and 7:30 p.m. at the fairgrounds. Parking and traffic were also a huge concern both downtown and at the fairgrounds.

Glenn Foster was about one minute too late. He searched frantically for a parking spot as he came from work, but he was turned away along with about 30 other people at the fairgrounds site, said Dawn Shew, the check-in coordinator.

"I got here in time, but I was just trying to find a place to park," Foster said.

Gina Westergard, a professor and administrator at KU's Design Department, turned around while in a traffic jam on her way to the fairgrounds at 6:45 p.m. because she thought she wouldn't make it. She was unaware that organizers had moved the deadline back a half hour earlier in the day.

"I wanted my vote to count," said Westergard, adding that she votes in every election. "It is important that everyone gets a chance to vote. It was frustrating, and not planned well."

Because state legislators did not approve funding for a primary election, the state parties put on the caucuses - some passing envelopes through the caucus crowds to collect money to help pay for the events. County party leaders told frustrated voters to lobby legislators to fund a primary election for 2012.

Organizers at the fairgrounds said that overall, participants were in good spirits and enthusiastic, although they acknowledged the registration process moved slowly. Volunteers helped register 1,250 Democratic voters just for the caucus. Shew said 75 percent of those people were KU students who were likely registered somewhere else.

"I just want to make sure I can do something to make sure the president I want to vote for is on the ballot," said Lance White, a KU graduate student from St. Louis.

With a local campaign presence for several months and a huge support generally in university towns, supporters of the Illinois senator said it was no surprise he appealed so widely here.

Obama also has family ties to Kansas and the endorsement of Democratic Gov. Kathleen Sebelius and other elected officials.

"I just think his message is very appealing to me. It's great to see so many young people involved," MaryNell Gleeson said.

At the fairgrounds site, volunteers doled out Obama stickers like hot cakes, and his supporters dominated the caucus floor.

"I like his stance on health care and his lack of tie-ins to big corporations," said Melinda Gaddy, a KU graduate student.

At the fairgrounds, 385 Clinton supporters huddled in a corner, enough to pick up two state delegates.

At one point in the night, Joseph Lomakin, a KU student and Clinton supporter, sat alone in a sparse section of the Clinton side at Abe and Jake's.

"I feel like it's my personal responsibility to resist temptation to vote for image and to vote based on how other people are voting, but to decide for myself. That's why I'm still sitting here," he said.

More than 800 people packed Robinson Middle School in Topeka, where Sebelius urged the crowd to support Obama.

"This race is between the past and the future," Sebelius said. "There is no better candidate for the future than Barack Obama."

But Kansas Secretary of Revenue Joan Wagnon spoke in favor of Clinton. Wagnon noted that many caucus-goers that she spoke with told her it was difficult to pick between the two.

But Wagnon said that whoever won the nomination "we are all going to be together" for the general election in November. With 90 percent of statewide results in at 10:30 p.m., Obama had more votes than Clinton at 31 of the 32 caucus sites that had reported.

Reports came in from across the state of overflowing crowds showing up for caucuses.

Sebelius said that a Democratic caucus in Overland Park had to be moved into the town square because of the size of the crowd.

"I think people have felt left out for years," in the nominating process, said Kansas Attorney General Stephen Six, a Lawrence resident, as he waited in line outside the fairgrounds.

Six supported Obama.

Although it was a new process for Kansas Democrats, things operated smoothly once they got participants inside and ready to be counted.

"I thought it was interesting to see how it worked out," said Meg Gabelman, a Clinton supporter. "It flowed pretty well."

Discussion

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5 February 2008
at 7:22 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Yes, I usually only see the much traffic going east on 19th St. on demolition derby night :)
5 February 2008
at 7:24 p.m.

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friskies25 (Anonymous) says…

I moved away from Lawrence and NOW they have a caucus?! But, actually, I don't think caucuses are always a good reflection of sentiment among voters. Not all people can attend since it is set at a specific time. I am in a state where…for my first experience…our primary did not count.
5 February 2008
at 7:31 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Wife says the caucus at the fairgrounds is PACKED!
5 February 2008
at 7:37 p.m.

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busymom (Anonymous) says…

Wish it would have been a vote instead of a caucus just because of the time restriction I was unable to go.
5 February 2008
at 7:38 p.m.

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Meatwad (Anonymous) says…

Well that was 50 minutes of my life I'll never get back. What an absolutely horribly planned mess. I never made it inside. Horrible traffic jam, no parking, and then a long long long line out in cold rain. If it was an election, I would have dealt with it, but not a caucus.
What stupid planning. There is no reason there couldn't have been more locations, enough to accommodate all who wanted to caucus. I wonder if the people in line even made it inside. Oh well! At least I tried. I suppose next time the KDP will have their crap together a little better.
5 February 2008
at 7:38 p.m.

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friskies25 (Anonymous) says…

I so wish I was there for the excitement! I have attended democratic gatherings at Abe and Jakes in the past…meeting up with friends…good times! (if you forget the past 8 years!)
5 February 2008
at 7:38 p.m.

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chucknoblet (Anonymous) says…

I just went by the armory and it looked like the line was winding around the building, with hundreds of people standing in line with umbrellas. It was so dark I couldn't get a good idea of just how many lines there were. The traffic was crazy and it looked like the Holiday Inn parking lot was full and people were parking on the Holiday Inn's grass, too.

5 February 2008
at 7:40 p.m.

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Meatwad (Anonymous) says…

I'm pretty sure I saw a LOT of cars turning around and giving up. Busymom, be glad you didn't go to this unorganized fiasco.
5 February 2008
at 7:42 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Wife got in line at 7:15, she got in the building at 7:38.
5 February 2008
at 7:49 p.m.

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been_there (Anonymous) says…

Posted this on the other board also.

Tried, gave up and came back home after getting stuck in a parking lot and couldn't get back out. Half a dozen cars had to back out in the dark and pray they didn't hit anyone, there were cars everywhere. Should have known better when I couldn't even get to the roundabout at 19th and Barker. It was backed from there to the fairgrounds. I cut over to 23rd street and got to the fairgrounds but then there was no place to park. Would have been nice to have people to direct or at least tell you that the parking was full. This seriously should have been somewhere MUCH bigger like Allen Field house or the Lied Center.

Can we declare a miscaucus since people tried but could get in? How about a do-over?
5 February 2008
at 7:53 p.m.

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braden_quinn (Anonymous) says…

Awesome.. I work till 8pm so I'm screwed? And the Kansas Democratic Party's Super Tuesday Central web site link is busted on their site.

Sounds like this caucus Sucked!… no pun intended.
5 February 2008
at 8:08 p.m.

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lelly (Anonymous) says…

I caucused at the armory. Stood in line from 6:40 to 7:10 outside was inside for about the same amount of time. Yes, the organization could have been better, but lots of people is a good problem to have. Just chalk up the wait to *really, really* earning your stripes as a citizen in a participatory democracy. Besides, I made some new friends while waiting in line.
5 February 2008
at 8:11 p.m.

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busymom (Anonymous) says…

Since ljworld isn't keeping us updated, can posters that went and are back do any updating?
5 February 2008
at 8:11 p.m.

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been_there (Anonymous) says…

Will be interesting to see the turnout for Saturday.
5 February 2008
at 8:21 p.m.

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yankeelady (Anonymous) says…

I hear Highland Park High in Topeka had over 1000 people.
Great turnout

5 February 2008
at 8:22 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

I'm at the fairgrounds. They just announced that there's 2,200-some-odd people here. Vast majority — I'd say two-thirds— are for Obama.

One longtime pro told me there were probably more people caucusing in this building tonight than did in all of KS for the Dems in 2004. So while the organization could be better, yes, I'm not sure how you prepare for a wave of people that you've never seen before.
5 February 2008
at 8:22 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.
5 February 2008
at 8:23 p.m.

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disgustedagain (Anonymous) says…

i was at the armory. total fiasco. yes it's good that people turned out. they took ONE count manually of a huge crowd of milling people and then we had to leave to let the outside people in. i have no problem with that but how can that be an accurate count??? how are they going to know who is voting twice?? and don't tell me there aren't unscrupulous politicos who would do so. i was so disgusted. all the other primaries made it clear the turnout would be huge. why did they have people from west lawrence, eudora, north lawrence and counties in one small armory. the traffic was dangerous as well. who knows how many people just went home and gave up. so much for Kansas making a difference in this election for a change. the first and probably only time that our democractic votes might matter and the lawrence organizers totally screw it up.

and all the new to the system voters have a wonderful example of our democratic organization.
5 February 2008
at 8:23 p.m.

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SpeedRacer (Anonymous) says…

I'm PO'd. I couldn't find a place to park near Abe & Jake's and traffic was ridiculous. I finally gave up and went home. Now I read that overflow was sent to Liberty Hall. What a mess. I would have much preferred a primary, particulary in light of the hype to get out to the caucus.
5 February 2008
at 8:24 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

This is cross-posted from my blog at here:

http://redblueamerica.com/blog/2008-0…

It is now about 6:20, and things are going slowly at the Douglas County Fairgrounds, which is where Dems in my precinct are caucusing. Why the slowness? Because this place has been inundated with Republicans, independents and newly registering voters - a couple hundred - turning out for there first-ever caucus. An unscientific survey shows that the bulk of these new folks are here for Obama. And so far, the Obama side of the room is much bigger than the Clinton camp. It's not even close.

“We are stunned at the turnout,” said Charles Jones, a county commissioner who is running the caucus.
5 February 2008
at 8:25 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

Continuing

7 p.m. CST: “Stunned” is probably an understatement. There are still hundreds of people lined up outside, waiting to get in.

The vast majority of these people are first-time caucus-goers — and, it's fair to say, they already don't like the rigamarole of caucusing. I spotted an extremely sardonic friend of mine (yes, a first-time caucuser) who was grumpy. “Caucusing makes me feel like living under a Communist regime,” she muttered. She was joking, guys, honest.

But she also asked the following question: Caucus? WTF?

My response:

* The glass half-full theory: Caucusing hearkens us back to the days of direct democracy, when a group of people got together in a room and hashed out the big village decisions. It's part of our heritage that we should retain.

* The glass half-empty theory: Caucuses are designed — with their arcane rules and massive effort required to participate — to frustrate all by the most die-hard party insiders.

My friend was suspecting the glass half-empty theory.

To be fair, tonight's craziness wasn't the fault of Democratic officials in Kansas. The Republican secretary of state decided awhile back to cancel the primary, thinking matters would be settled in both parties by the time Kansas got around to weighing in. That was wrong.

But at least I got interviewed by the MTV street team.
5 February 2008
at 8:25 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

Continuing

7:25 p.m. CST: This might be the greatest night ever in the history of the Kansas Democratic Party. At the other Lawrence precinct, the fire marshal closed the building because there were too many people (or so a TV cameraman tells me). They're searching for a new place.

And back here at the fairgrounds, well, here's what one old pro told me: “There are more people in the building tonight than there were (caucusing for Democrats) in the whole state last time.”

Again: The Clinton supporters are few and far between here. This is an Obama party, pure and simple. Some of that is due to organization — Obama's folks were organized here, whereas the Clinton campaign had a paltry presence at best. But organization alone doesn't explain this. And it makes me think that if Obama wins this thing, Republicans are in more trouble than we even know in November.*

*But stranger things have happened.
5 February 2008
at 8:26 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

8 p.m. CST: Just about everybody's in. I'd say the Obama crowd is about two-thirds of the entire crowd. This being Lawrence, there's a bigger contingent (judging by volume of applause) for Dennis Kucinich than for John Edwards.

Official crowd count: Around 2,200 people.

5 February 2008
at 8:29 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Starting to look like Clinton is doing well nationally. Still close, even after tonight.
5 February 2008
at 8:29 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

Joel, I hate to tell you this but we do NOT live in a “democracy” nor has the USA ever been a democracy.

The myth of “democracy” was promulgated by the administration of FDR.

Prior to that time, we lived in a “Republic” and in a Republic we still live in spite of the Democrat Party's lies to the contrary.
5 February 2008
at 8:31 p.m.

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busymom (Anonymous) says…

Thanks for updates :)
5 February 2008
at 8:32 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

Marion: Democratic Republic. I know the difference. ; )

8:27 p.m. CST: To make it to the second round of caucusing, your candidate needs 15 percent of the crowd. Tonight, here, that's 330 people. Clinton had 355 people in the first round — take away those, and Obama might've taken all the delegates here tonight. He had more than 1,700 people in the first round. (Oh, and: Edwards = 40, Kucinich = 53.)
5 February 2008
at 8:34 p.m.

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Valkyrie_of_Reason (Kathy Getto) says…

yankeelady (Anonymous) says:

I hear Highland Park High in Topeka had over 1000 people.
Great turnout
________________________________________

Just got home from that causus, yankee. It was great.

902
180 for Hillary
722 for Obama
5 February 2008
at 8:34 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Yes, I knew it would be a pro-Obama crowd.
5 February 2008
at 8:35 p.m.

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Valkyrie_of_Reason (Kathy Getto) says…

caucus - sorry
5 February 2008
at 8:39 p.m.

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yankeelady (Anonymous) says…

Maybe, finally, things are changing, not just business as usual.

5 February 2008
at 8:40 p.m.

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Valkyrie_of_Reason (Kathy Getto) says…

Lots of young people - very nice to see.
5 February 2008
at 8:42 p.m.

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disgustedagain (Anonymous) says…

“To be fair, tonight's craziness wasn't the fault of Democratic officials in Kansas. The Republican secretary of state decided awhile back to cancel the primary, thinking matters would be settled in both parties by the time Kansas got around to weighing in. That was wrong.” J. Mathis
—So I guess I should just be annoyed with the Republican secretary? Still doesn't explain why they had SO many areas all at a small armory. Why not 5-7 voting places? Is there some 3 site limit?

“At the other Lawrence precinct, the fire marshal closed the building because there were too many people (or so a TV cameraman tells me). They're searching for a new place.” J. Mathis
—Which site? At the armory they just told us to go home which was pretty awful I thought. We “could stay” if we wanted. Even though we didn't fit.

Whatever. At least people are going to vote in this election and that is encouraging.
5 February 2008
at 8:42 p.m.

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Stain (Anonymous) says…

I stood in the rain outside Abe and Jake's for an hour before they sent the people still outside to Liberty Hall. At Liberty Hall the doors were closed before we could get in. There must have been over 2,000 people outside Abe & Jake's - and I don't know how many were inside.

We didn't get to caucus and I'm sure hundred of others didn't get to caucus either. There wasn't parking for everyone, let alone space in Abe and Jake's and Liberty Hall.
5 February 2008
at 8:43 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

8:40 p.m. CST: And the final round of counting is done. It took longer — much longer — to get people in the door than it did to actually caucus. Amazing.

It looks like Clinton's taking the big states, and Obama's taking the little states. I'm not sure why that is, or what it means for the overall race.

And final results in Lawrence?

Clinton gained 30 voters, to 385. Everybody else. That leaves 1,800 for Obama. And for the record, that's 9 delegates to Obama, 2 to Clinton.

And… we're done. Peace out, folks.
5 February 2008
at 8:52 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

Joel wrote:

“Joel (Joel Mathis) says:

Marion: Democratic Republic. I know the difference. ; )

8:27 p.m. CST: To make it to the second round of caucusing, your candidate needs 15 percent of the crowd. Tonight, here, that's 330 people. Clinton had 355 people in the first round - take away those, and Obama might've taken all the delegates here tonight. He had more than 1,700 people in the first round. (Oh, and: Edwards = 40, Kucinich = 53.)”

Marion writes:

Evidently not, Joel!

The USA is and always has been Constitutional Representative Government; never a democracy!

Places like Cuba, East Germany and the old U.S.S.R. were “Democratic Republics”!
5 February 2008
at 8:55 p.m.

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beobachter (Anonymous) says…

Marion. really hate to break it to you, but Joel has a lot more credibility than you. really tend to give more weight to his writing and opinions.
5 February 2008
at 9 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

beobachter(Obsever):

You are demonstrating your near complete and total ignorance of history and lack of knowldege about the government of the country in which you live but I expect nothing less from you!
5 February 2008
at 9:03 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

You folks like Wikipedia, so we'll start there on the matter of the form of the government of the USA:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic

5 February 2008
at 9:06 p.m.

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kthxbi (Anonymous) says…

Marion, did you caucus?
5 February 2008
at 9:06 p.m.

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unklemonkey (Anonymous) says…

Just came back from the fairgrounds. 2,218 people showed up, and the Obama side was packed. He got 9 delegates, Clinton 2.

For full democratic results:
http://politics.nytimes.com/election-…

Republicans:
http://politics.nytimes.com/election-…
5 February 2008
at 9:08 p.m.

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beobachter (Anonymous) says…

Marion, you really need to accept fact that your opinions are meaningless to most forum posters.
5 February 2008
at 9:09 p.m.

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srj (Anonymous) says…

Note this come November. Clinton won big is Missouri, McCain losing to Huckabee. If it's Clinton VS McCain, Clinton have a very good shot there.
5 February 2008
at 9:10 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

beobachter(a.k.a.; Observer, ObservAr):

Article 4 Section 4 of the US Constitution states:

“The United States shall guarantee to every State in the Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.”

A republican form of government refers to government by representatives. We are often referred to as a democratic republic because we elect representatives though a democratic process. In a true democracy, there are no representatives, every action of government is voted on by the people.

beobachter(Observer/ObservAr):

Try again!

The proof:

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/co…

Wanna go for three out of five, “beobachter(Observer/ObservAr)”?
5 February 2008
at 9:18 p.m.

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booze_buds_03 (Anonymous) says…

Marion is eating his own poop….again
5 February 2008
at 9:18 p.m.

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overplayedhistory (Anonymous) says…

Oh Marion, if we all just say no one gets it except you will you just go away. Gosh we live in a republic, I had no idea. Don't you ever get tired? When was the last time you got laid? If it was in the last 10 years, did he enjoy it?
5 February 2008
at 9:20 p.m.

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been_there (Anonymous) says…

LJW should do a poll of people that went but could not get in to vote. I really wonder if the same thing happened elsewhere in Kansas. It would be great to hear.

5 February 2008
at 9:25 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

kthxbi wrote:

“kthxbi (Anonymous) says:

Marion, did you caucus?”

Marion writes:

No but I saw the movie!

Although raised as a DemonRat and having campaigned heartily for JFK and Humphrey, I learned the error of my ways and now consider myself to be a true Conservative, in the mould of Barry Goldwater, so I would not be welcome at a DemonRat “caucus”; i.e,; infestation of socialists, communists and anarchists, anad I would be worried about having enough hot water for the extended shower required after association with such parasites should I attend.

As much as I like Joel and I do like him, it is a real shame that the LJW places someone to report on our political process who does not even know the form of our government!

Joel!

Shame on you!
5 February 2008
at 9:34 p.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

Marion:

I don't work for the LJW anymore.

And I'll stick with my understanding, thanks.

J
5 February 2008
at 9:36 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

In the meantime, foxnews is projecting that Obama has won the Kansas caucuses:

http://youdecide08.foxnews.com/2008/0…

You can't fix stupid.
5 February 2008
at 9:48 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

Joel wrote:

“Joel (Joel Mathis) says:

Marion:

I don't work for the LJW anymore.

And I'll stick with my understanding, thanks.

J”

Marion writes:

At last, proof positive that Democrats have no connection with the realities of this world!

Faced with proof that Joel's perception of what our government is , which is in complete and total error, Joel tells us that he will keep and adhere to the misconceptions that he holds so dear and continue to maintain the lie that he wishes to propagandise!

Woo Hoo!

How typical of the DemonRat; to live in a magical world!

How can people who do not even understand what kind of government we have in this country be considered “reliable” to report on the political process?

Beobachter(Observer/ObservAr):

Wanna “spin” your wheel again?
5 February 2008
at 9:53 p.m.

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meanbean101 (Anonymous) says…

I just got back from the caucus (overflow) at Liberty Hall.It was great to see so many people there.It wasn't lack of planning that made things crazy,it was the unexpected turnout which is a really good thing! If we participate, hopefully the large number of people who turnout will influence KS to have a primary. If we make our voices heard, the electoral college just might listen. Obama has won the Caucuses btw.I can tell you that just from being at the event itself. Western KS has few delegates so the caucuses here in lawrence really do matter a lot. What are you talking about Marion?
5 February 2008
at 9:57 p.m.

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dorothyhr (Dorothy Hoyt-Reed) says…

I doubt if Marion will even go to the Republican caucus on Sat. He would have to get away from the computer for too long, and talk to people face to face.

I personally, despite the chaos and standing, enjoyed the caucus process. It was an interesting experience, saw friends and neighbors (and 3 of my former profs), and meet some new, very nice people. When we were driving out everyone was polite and took turns. It might have been smoother if they had gotten the police to direct traffic, but no one was pushy.
5 February 2008
at 9:57 p.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

meanbean wrote:

“What are you talking about Marion?”

Marion writes:

Read the thread!

English!

Do you speak it?
5 February 2008
at 9:58 p.m.

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Stain (Anonymous) says…

Marion weighs in with name-calling.

No surprise there. Yawn.

5 February 2008
at 9:58 p.m.

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justme2 (Anonymous) says…

I was at the armory. Thought I'd take my children for the experience. Probably not the best choice. It was packed, hot and my children were in meltdown mode.

We got there fairly early and got right in. Yes, it wasn't the most organized event, but I really believe they didn't expect so many people.

As we walked in my 4 year old asked what the signs said. I told him that one sign said Obama and the other said Hillary. He looked at me and said if Hillary wins tonight, will HE be president. LOL! Also, during the waiting period when Obama supporters were yelling “Yes, we will!” my 4 year old looked at me with an evil, meltdown look in his eye and said, “NO, we won't!” Perfect, I think I have a budding rebub on my hands.
5 February 2008
at 10 p.m.

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justme2 (Anonymous) says…

that's repub on my hands.
5 February 2008
at 10:01 p.m.

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KLATTU (Anonymous) says…

The US is an Ebaycracy: government by the highest bidder.
5 February 2008
at 10:04 p.m.

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SarahS (Anonymous) says…

I was at 19th and Iowa at 6:30. We left in two cars to to the the fairgrounds - one group went up to 23rd, and my friend and I cut down to 15th and then came back up Harper. We were all there and in line by 6:50. It took about 20 minutes for me to get into building, and another 20 in line inside the building to sign in and go out onto the floor.

Everyone was incredibly kind, respectful, and friendly. The speeches focused on solidarity among democrats - I didn't hear anyone slamming another democratic candidate, either from the podium or in conversation. People applauded the speakers for all 4 candidates, and discussions were respectful of each candidate. It was a really powerful experience for me, to see so many people who were willing to drive through sleet and snow and then stand out in the cold, just to stand up for the candidates they believed in…
5 February 2008
at 10:22 p.m.

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brookcreeker (Anonymous) says…

I must say that even though getting to/from the fair grounds was a pain and the wait was long, that caucus was so much fun! It was surely the best party in town with 2200 fellow liberals. Now, if only we had all brought some food and beer… I found the electoral process much more tangible in a room full of mud-covered friends and neighbors! I only wish our government valued citizen participation enough to declare mandatory holidays so that everyone could participate.
5 February 2008
at 10:26 p.m.

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cellogrl (Anonymous) says…

I just got back from the one at Topeka West High school. There were about 1350 people there and it turned out to be about 1000ish for Obama and the rest for Clinton. We had 11 delegates for Obama and 3 for Clinton. They had a lot more people there than they expected. It took us until about 8:15 to actually start the voting process.
5 February 2008
at 10:28 p.m.

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Keith (Anonymous) says…

2 marions, 1 cup.
5 February 2008
at 10:50 p.m.

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lilsuzy (Anonymous) says…

I was at the Armory, and yes I stood in the rain for about an hour, but it was well worth it. Was it some what confusing? yes. Was is a bit unorginized? yes. But to have the opportunity to participate was well worth it, and I had fun talking to other people while waiting. I hope that we can have a primary next time, since the Dems really got out the vote here in Lawrence! Way to go all of the staff and volunteers for both candidates, a job well done.

5 February 2008
at 11:03 p.m.

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oldtimer39 (Anonymous) says…

I second lilsuzy. We were at Liberty Hall and the staff and volunteers did a fantastic job. If it had been 60 degrees outside, no one would be complaining about “lack of organization.” Be happy that so many people were motivated to participate in the electoral process!
5 February 2008
at 11:14 p.m.

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Meatwad (Anonymous) says…

someone wrote: “LJW should do a poll of people that went but could not get in to vote. I really wonder if the same thing happened elsewhere in Kansas. It would be great to hear.”

yes you should ljw. i would love to see the results of that:

Did you caucus successfully: yes /no
Did you attempt unsuccessfully to caucus: yes/no

I tried but did not even get out of my car when I saw the complete chaos at the fairgrounds. Too bad they didn't use Allen Fieldhouse or more locations.
5 February 2008
at 11:44 p.m.

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toefungus (Anonymous) says…

Is Billary going to finally go away?
5 February 2008
at 11:46 p.m.

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texburgh (Anonymous) says…

I went to Abe and Jake's and got in after a long wait. I must say the wait outside was dismal what with the freezing drizzle and the search for parking was … well kind of like parking downtown any night. Okay, a tad worse.

But all of that makes me happy. I thought the weather would depress participation but this is terrific. People really do care and they are passionate about this election.

Look at the posts - the angry people are those who couldn't manage the nightmares of lines and parking because they really wanted to be heard.

No matter who wins in November, this passion is the best thing to happen to the U.S. in ages.

And may I suggest that through this long series of posts, far too many people have given Marion credibility. Why respond to his trivial haggle over whether or not we “live in a democracy?” Need I point out that it is his president (W) that wants to spread American style democracy throughout the middle east? I don't see Marion blasting Bush.

When Marion makes an ignorant comment based on what he learned on Fox news, go at him. When he just wants to pick a fight because he hates Democrats, don't let him bait you. It's a waste of column space.
6 February 2008
at 12:04 a.m.

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Dani (Anonymous) says…

I haven't read through all the comments so I apologize if someone beat me to this but I have two thoughts:

(1) No one ever thought the turn-out was going to be this huge. In 2004 less than 2,000 people caucased in the entire state; that number was topped at every one of the Lawrence sites tonight. Considering the surprisingly large turnout, I'd say things were run as smoothly as possible.

(2) If people want a primary instead, you should tell your state legislators. Both Governor Sebelius and Secretary of State Thornburgh made recommendations that we have a primary and the legislature decided instead not to spend the money and make the parties pay for caucases if they wanted them.

Overall, I am very excited about this election now and really proud of the way Kansas Democrats turned out tonight despite it being a night caucas and the weather being so bad.
6 February 2008
at 12:12 a.m.

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Tiffany (Anonymous) says…

Agree with the others that Kansas should have funded a Presidential Primary. Secretary of State Ron Thornburgh pushed for a primary but the legislature wouldn't fund it.

A quick scan of the legislative journal shows the funding was taken out of the budget in the Kansas House on March 15, 2007. See http://www.kslegislature.org/journals…

Considering almost all but 2 or 3 Democrats voted “yes” to take the funding out, it's interesting that Democratic voters were the ones standing in the snow and waiting to vote tonight.

From the Journal of the House on March 15, 2007 below. An amendment on the House budget by Rep Charlie Roth from Salina and passed 85-34. A “Yes” vote was to cancel the primary. A “no” vote was to keep the primary.

On page 35, after line 12, by inserting the following:
(d) Notwithstanding the provisions of K.S.A. 2006 Supp. 25-4501, and amendments
thereto, on and after the effective date of this act, during the fiscal years ending June 30, 2007, and June 30, 2008, no expenditures shall be made from any moneys appropriated for the secretary of state or any other state agency from the state general fund or any special revenue fund for fiscal years 2007 and 2008 by chapter 142 or 216 of the 2006 Session Laws of Kansas, or by this or other appropriation act of the 2007 regular session of the legislature to hold a presidential preference primary.??;
On roll call, the vote was: Yeas 85; Nays 34; Present but not voting: 0; Absent or not
voting: 6.

Yeas (To cut the funding for the primary): Aurand, Ballard, Bowers, Burroughs, Carlin, Carlson, Craft, Crow, Dahl, Davis, Donohoe, Faber, Faust-Goudeau, Feuerborn, Flora, Frownfelter, Garcia, Gatewood, George, Goico, Grant, Hawk, Hayzlett, Henderson, Henry, Hill, Holland, M. Holmes, Hue-bert, Huntington, Johnson, Kelsey, Kuether, Landwehr, Lane, Light, Loganbill, Long, Lu-kert, Mah, Mast, McCray-Miller, McKinney, McLachlan, McLeland, Menghini, Merrick, Jim Morrison, Judy Morrison, Moxley, Myers, Neighbor, Neufeld, Owens, Palmer, Pauls, Peck, Phelps, Pottorff, Powell, Proehl, Rardin, Rhoades, Roth, Ruff, Ruiz, Sawyer, Schroe-der, Schwartz, Sharp, Siegfreid, Svaty, Swanson, Tietze, Treaster, Trimmer, Vickrey, Ward, Wetta, Whitham, Williams, Winn, B. Wolf, K. Wolf, Worley.

Nays (Voting to keep the primary): Beamer, Bethell, Brown, Brunk, Burgess, Colyer, Crum, Dillmore, Flaharty, Fund, Gordon, Goyle, Grange, Hodge, Horst, Humerickhouse, Kelley, Kiegerl, King, Kinzer, Knox, Masterson, Metsker, O?Neal, Olson, Otto, Patton, Powers, Sloan, Swenson, Tafanelli, Watkins, Wilk, Yoder.
Present but not voting: None.

Absent or not voting: Colloton, C. Holmes, Peterson, Shultz, Spalding, Storm.

The motion of Rep. Roth prevailed.
6 February 2008
at 12:32 a.m.

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JHawker (Anonymous) says…

Tonight was my first caucus - and i loved every moment of it. Granted the hour wait in the freezing cold miserable rain in the parking lot at abe & jake's and then right before getting inside, we were sent over to Liberty Hall. Liberty Hall - which provided great comforts that made everything so fabulous, to see everyone there. the young, the old, and everyone inbetween was so awesome. So, although it was miserable outside, i'm still feeling the cold, and things seemed disorganized, i am thankful for all the volunteers that made tonight possible and flowed with the punches to make tonight a possibility for all of us standing in the rain. What a great day to rock the caucus. :-)
6 February 2008
at 1:31 a.m.

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meanbean101 (Anonymous) says…

Obviously I speak English Marion. Stop being a smartass and hiding behind your rude irrelevent comments.

6 February 2008
at 1:53 a.m.

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Joel (Joel Mathis) says…

And here's my wicked awesome YouTube video of the fairgrounds.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=_2ThgNa-oxc
6 February 2008
at 8:36 a.m.

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frazzled (Anonymous) says…

I stood in the rain for about forty minutes at Abe & Jake's before getting in around 7:00. Once inside, I stood next to an Obama sign for two hours with my wife and a couple of friends, listened to the speeches (kudos to the KU medical student who spoke about Kucinich's health care plan), and left before we knew whether Clinton would get enough votes at Liberty Hall to get up to 15%.

Was the whole experience a frustrating pain in the neck? Yes. (And I'm one of the ones who got in.)

Would I do it again? Absolutely. You can't do this in North Korea.
6 February 2008
at 9:35 a.m.

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Agnostick (Anonymous) says…

gypsynatalie is right: We have a Democratic Republic, as opposed to a “true democracy.”

How do I know? President Bartlet told me so! :p
6 February 2008
at 9:37 a.m.

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Agnostick (Anonymous) says…

This was found tacked to the pep squad's bulletin board near the east entrance of the middle school gymnasium…

******************************************************************
for immediate release

February 5, 2008

Contact: Christian Morgan or Corrie Kangas
Morgan Mobile: 913-xxx-xxxx
Kangas Mobile: 913-xxx-xxxx
Office: 785-xxx-xxxx

Kansas Republicans become focus of Presidential Race

Topeka, Kansas The following is a statement from Kansas Republican Party Executive Director Christian Morgan regarding “Super Tuesday” results and the Kansas Republican Caucus.

“Tonight, we saw a clear difference between the Republican candidates for President and the Democrats running for the same office. The Democrats attack each other, but their ideas are the same: higher taxes, government mandated and controlled health care, and retreat from the War on Terror. There is one thing we know about the Presidential race-the Republicans running for Commander-in-Chief are more experienced and better prepared for the challenges facing the Nation.

“The race is a dead-heat with no clear candidate as the front-runner; this is the most exciting presidential primary in recent memory. With the Kansas Republican Caucus just days away, it is clear that Kansas has become an important battleground state to determine the Republican nominee.

“For the first time in over a decade, Kansas is perfectly positioned to be a determining factor in the Republican nomination. Kansas has rich political history as a Republican state and that storied history will receive another chapter on Saturday as we determine who has the most momentum going forward in this exciting presidential race.”

The Kansas Republican Caucus will be held on Saturday, February 9, 2008 at 10:00 AM. Check-in for the Caucus will begin at 9:00 AM in Shawnee, Sedgwick and Johnson counties and 9:30 AM at all other locations. For more information visit about the caucus visit www.ksgopcaucus.org.

###
******************************************************************
6 February 2008
at 10:03 a.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

First, I would remind you of a couple of facts which some of you may find unpleasant but nevertheless, quite accurate and true.

The Gettysburg Address is a political document, lacking in force of law, written to help garner support for what was at the time, a very unpopular war.

President Lincoln was doing anything that he could to keep the Union (Republic) intact and would have kept slavery in force had it been necessary to do so in order to achieve his goal.

In fact, a plan had been formulated by Lincoln and his vice-President, Andrew Johnson to return the slaves to Africa; primarily Madagascar and the area now known as Liberia; a country essentially created for the purpose of repatriating slaves of African lineage.

The name of that nation derives from the world “Liberty” and its capital; Monrovia, is so named in homage to President James Monroe.

Another frequently misunderstood document is The Emancipation Proclamation which was neither a low nor a political document but rather a *military order*, designed again to garner public support for an unpopular war and which actually freed few, if any slaves.

LIncoln commented on slavery in a letter to Horace Greeley:

“My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union.”

The citation:

http://showcase.netins.net/web/creati…

Now, what does all this have to do with the question of what kind of government we have here in the USA?

cont'd:

I
6 February 2008
at 10:04 a.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

cont'd:

I am merely pointing out (Someone else brought up Lincoln, by the way!) that history is often very much misunderstood as for simplification, we often paint it with a very broad brush.

It is incorrect to refer to the government of the USA as a *democracy* because it is NOT a democracy, as even the links some of you posted made very clear.

http://www.lexrex.com/enlightened/Ame…

From the citation:

“A Democracy:

The chief characteristic and distinguishing feature of a Democracy is: Rule by Omnipotent Majority. In a Democracy, The Individual, and any group of Individuals composing any Minority, have no protection against the unlimited power of The Majority. It is a case of Majority-over-Man.

This is true whether it be a Direct Democracy, or a Representative Democracy. In the direct type, applicable only to a small number of people as in the little city-states of ancient Greece, or in a New England town-meeting, all of the electorate assemble to debate and decide all government questions, and all decisions are reached by a majority vote (of at least half-plus-one).

A Republic:

“A Republic, on the other hand, has a very different purpose and an entirely different form, or system, of government. Its purpose is to control The Majority strictly, as well as all others among the people, primarily to protect The Individual's God-given, unalienable rights and therefore for the protection of the rights of The Minority, of all minorities, and the liberties of people in general. The definition of a Republic is: a constitutionally limited government of the representative type, created by a written Constitution—adopted by the people and changeable (from its original meaning) by them only by its amendment—with its powers divided between three separate Branches: Executive, Legislative and Judicial. Here the term “the people” means, of course, the electorate.”
6 February 2008
at 11:55 a.m.

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Marion (Marion Lynn) says…

Yes, Max and most of the countries which use the terms *Democratic* or *Republic* in their nation names are neither democratic or a republic!

In fact, most of those nations are (were) Communist, socialist or out-and-out dictatorships, so named for pruposes of goodwill!

You may find this blog interesting:

http://www.dailypaul.com/node/1958

I think that you folkls have become so hung up on the term “republic” in reference to government because of its similariaty to the word “Republican”, which refers to a political party, that you are willing to set aside the truth of history.

This nation is not, never has been and was never intended to be a *democracy* within the definition of the term although it does indeed incorporate some *democratic* principles.

Even though nearly every politician, teacher, journalist and citizen believes that our Founders created a democracy, it is absolutely not true.

The Founders knew full well the differences between a Republic and a Democracy and they repeatedly and emphatically wrote and said that they had founded a republic.

“We may define a republic to be … a government which derives all its powers directly or indirectly from the great body of the people, and is administered by persons holding their offices during pleasure for a limited period, or during good behavior. It is essential to such a government that it be derived from the great body of the society, not from an inconsiderable proportion or a favored class of it; otherwise a handful of tyrannical nobles, exercising their oppressions by a delegation of their powers, might aspire to the rank of republicans and claim for their government the honorable title of republic.” James Madison, Federalist No. 10, (1787)
6 February 2008
at 2:56 p.m.

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Pogo (Anonymous) says…

For six (6) electoral college votes? Kansas doesn't count for a hill of beans when it comes to the Presidency….and well….much of anything else for that matter.

Obama ain't no innocent. “In addition to a land deal, Sen. Barack Obama's ties to indicted dealmaker Antoin “Tony” Rezko include an internship the senator provided the son of a contributor at the request of Rezko, an Obama spokesman confirmed today….”

http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics…

The people of Illinois can attest to the reality he's just like all of the rest…..