Archive for Saturday, October 14, 2006

Faith forum: Is it OK for a person of faith to be friends with an agnostic or atheist?

October 14, 2006

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Embrace chances to spread God's word

The Rev. Bill Hurlbutt, senior pastor, Christ Community Church, 1100 Kasold Drive:

Throughout my years in ministry, I have had many individuals come to me very excited because they have found a new place to work where the majority of their co-workers are Christian. They are excited because of the Christian environment they will now be able to experience on their job, but is that what Jesus would have done? It seems to me the world he came to was anything but Christian.

I have told the congregation of Christ Community several times that if they were to limit themselves to a Christian job environment, they would be missing out on one of the major desires Jesus has for them: sharing their faith with those who do not possess it. In most cases I tell them it would be better to find another position where they can let their faith be seen by nonbelievers.

It is not only right to befriend nonbelievers, it is imperative. If we truly believe that our only hope in this world is in Jesus Christ and what he has done on our behalf on the cross of Calvary, then it should be a priority to initiate friendships with those with whom we can share our faith.

If you are a nonbeliever and need a friend, you can find one at Christ Community. And if you are a Christian working in a totally Christian environment where you feel safe, find another job where you can let your faith light shine in this world.

- Send e-mail to Bill Hurlbutt at p.b@1inchrist.org.

Friends need not agree on all matters

The Rev. Marcus McFaul, senior pastor, First Baptist Church, 1330 Kasold Drive:

This is a question that would not have occurred to Jesus, who befriended just about everyone, especially those considered "off-limits." What is the essential criteria for a friendship? Must there be total agreement on all matters, even something as important as religious faith, in order to be in relationship with someone?

Now to be sure, Christian or faith-based friendships can be rewarding and meaningful because of shared values, purposes and goals (though there, too, is great diversity). Augustine called the church "the company of friends." Certain friendships can go well beyond mutual affection or likability, and such relationships draw us out of ourselves and our tendency to self-centeredness. I believe that it makes a difference who your friends are. It makes a difference who your company of friends is.

However, an implied attitude and posture posed by the question is one of fear and retreat. If one's faith is so fragile it cannot be exercised with another whose beliefs or nonbeliefs are different, what good is it? Henri Nouwen once wrote of the "risk of friendship," the vulnerable aspects that any worthy relationship must acknowledge. The risk is in being stretched by the encounters and conversations with friends.

Ralph Waldo Emerson said, "My friends have come unsought. The great God gave them to me." Perhaps the challenge isn't to demand homogeneity but to see, value and sustain the diverse friendships God has given us.

- Send e-mail to Marcus McFaul at office@firstbaptist.lawrence.ks.us

Comments

Tychoman 8 years, 5 months ago

What a ridiculous question. Why shouldn't someone be friends with an agnostic or atheist? I have many Christian friends, and many of them at once time have tried to share their faith with me. It's a nice gesture, I guess, but it always made me feel uncomfortable having to explain to them why I don't have faith. I agree with McFaul.

Kam_Fong_as_Chin_Ho 8 years, 5 months ago

One has to wonder how could God lead anyone into temptation.

1 Corinthians 10:13 says, "No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it." God doesn't tempt us, but He allows us to be put into situations where our faith is tested and strengthened.

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Hey Patriotman,

Here is a crazy idea. How about you ignore holygrailale. Why do you even respond to Holygrailale's messages. Instead you sit there and you whine and whine like a little baby. You throw your little temper tantrum and then stomp your feet. Big freaking deal. Why don't you sit up and start taking the initiative and MOVE ON. You got something more to say on this subject or are you going to whine some more.....

craigers 8 years, 5 months ago

It all depends on how much they influence you. You can be friends with unbelievers, but don't let them influence you and take you away from Christ. That is the only danger.

prioress 8 years, 5 months ago

Doesn't God teach us to love everyone?

A common theme for all the skygods; a lesson plan most people have trouble mastering.

prioress 8 years, 5 months ago

You can be friends with unbelievers, but don't let them influence you and take you away from Christ. That is the only danger.

If your belief is strong, my brother, nothing can take you away from the TEACHER.

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Craigers,

Kind of curious remark. I guess that means that you agree with the line in the Lord's Prayer that implies that God could lead you into temptation for it says "lead me not into temptation". One has to wonder how could God lead anyone into temptation. It sure does absolve you from any responsibility for your actions doesn't it. You can say God led me astray or in your case that other person led me astray....right?

carolannfugate 8 years, 5 months ago

Enough already! I hope the Gail in Baldwin I know because she is a very decent person, but the topic is.......................

Faith forum: Is it OK for a person of faith to be friends with an agnostic or atheist? and John Lennon.

Peace Love and Hotwings.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

The true meaning of love, as defined in the Bible, has been corrupted in the common usage of our English language and society. Most often, love is confused with infatuation - that elated, "high" feeling we get when we "fall in love." This kind of "love" is something that lasts typically less than a year, and unless replaced by true love, results in broken relationships.

Origin of Love The Bible indicates that love is from God. In fact, the Bible says "God is love." Love is one of the primary characteristics of God. Likewise, God has endowed us with the capacity for love. This capacity for love is one of the ways in which we are "created in the image of God."

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Different Kinds of Love The Greek language (the language of the New Testament) uses two different words to describe and define love. The most commonly used Greek word translated "love" in the New Testament is "agape." This love is represented by God's love for us. It is a non-partial, sacrificial love probably best exemplified by God's provision for our rebellion:

"For God so loved (agape) the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life. (John 3:16)

The gift of God's son as a provision for sin was given to all humans, regardless of who we are. God's love is unconditional.

In contrast, our love is usually conditional and based upon how other people behave toward us. This kind of love is based upon familiarity and direct interaction. The Greek word "phileo" defines this kind of love, often translated "brotherly love." Phileo is a soulish (connected through our emotions) kind of love - something that can be experienced by both believers and non-believers. This is in contrast to agape, which is love extended through the spirit. Agape love requires a relationship with God through Jesus Christ, since the non-regenerated soul is unable to love unconditionally. Agape love gives and sacrifices expecting nothing back in return.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Those who have studied the Bible and know about Peter's character know that Peter was ruled by his emotions and often responded to situations emotionally, rather than thinking before acting. Sometimes this kind of response lead to good things (e.g., Peter walking on the water to meet Jesus - Matthew 14:25-33), whereas at other times, Peter's response was inappropriate (He was interrupted by God while suggesting that he build three tabernacles, one for Jesus, one for Moses, and one for Elijah on the Mount of Transfiguration - Matthew 17:4). Peter was quite proficient at expressing phileo love, and was probably very popular because of his dynamic character. However, God wants us to express both phileo love and agape love. Peter expressed this idea in his first epistle:

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Since you have in obedience to the truth purified your souls for a sincere love [phileo] of the brethren, fervently love [agape] one another from the heart, (1 Peter 1:22)

Believers in the churches of Asia Minor had already expressed phileo love, but Peter was encouraging them to fervently express agape love as well. If you are a Christian, you are encouraged to express both soulish, familiar love and spirit-led unconditional love.

The most famous biblical chapter on love is from 1 Corinthians:

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love. (1 Corinthians 13:1-13)

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

This is a description of apage love. It is described as being patient, kind, truthful, unselfish, trusting, believing, hopeful, and enduring. It is not jealous, boastful, arrogant, rude, selfish, or angry. True love never fails. The description perfectly fits God's love toward us, and should be the way we love each other and God. However, I have never met any person who perfectly fulfills this biblical definition of love. The Bible says that this unconditional love is more important than everything else (a partial list includes oratory ability, prophecy, knowledge, faith, philanthropy and hope). All of these things, which are "good" things, will pass away. Only love is eternal, since love will be the basis of eternal life. In fact, when Jesus was asked what the greatest commandment was, He said,"YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND." (Matthew 22:37)9 He then added that the second most important law was "YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF." Jesus said that the entire law was dependent upon these two commandments.9

If you are not a Christian, I hope you desire to express love as defined in the Bible. However, wanting to do so and attempting to do so in the power of your own will is guaranteed to fail. This kind of love is only possible through relying on the power of God, through faith in Jesus Christ. Even if you are a Christian, you will not succeed if you do not abide in Christ. May the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God and into the steadfastness of Christ.

roger_o_thornhill 8 years, 5 months ago

Does "person of faith" refer only to Christians? I'm not asking in some sort of sarcastic way, it just seems that the Christian view is the only one in the "article"(or was this op-ed?) as well as among the posts.

I have another question that will probably be taken as sarcastic, but am very serious about: If a person goes to church so that they will go to heaven, is that selfish? I've heard from some that,"no good deeds will get you into heaven, ONLY accepting JesusChrist as your savior will." What does that mean? Is that a fringe belief?

Centrist 8 years, 5 months ago

For me, the "danger" is in anyone trying to "convert" anyone else to anything.

I also fail to understand how someone can "become" religious. I mean, how can you believe in something you didn't believe in before, on that level? How can you suddenly decide, after persuausion, that there is or is not a God, or Allah, or Buddha, or whomever?

I am an agnostic, and I believe there is a PLAN. However, I do not subscribe to any one religion, and never will. I am smart enough to know that I will probably never know why we are here and what our true purpose is. But I have faith that we ARE here for a reason, and that is good enough for me. I don't need anyone to "guide" me.

I have several friends who are, and are not, Christians. I respect their views, and they, mine. I also know some Muslims and I know some Atheists. Each and every one of them is entitled to their opinion when we talk.

Is this a "problem"?

It's high time the Church left people to decide for themselves instead of trying to recruit new members all the time. And that goes for any religion. Some of us can be spiritual without your "help", thank you very much!

Now that I've offended all the right and left-wingers (again), I'm outa here!

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Faith, pistos, is conviction of the truth of anything, trust or confidence springing from that conviction. The original Greek term is "...used especially of the faith by which a man embraces Jesus, i.e., a conviction, full of joyful trust, that Jesus is the Messiah -- the divinely appointed author of eternal salvation in the kingdom of God, conjoined with obedience to Christ." (Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon, p. 511)

The Biblical definition of faith is found in Hebrews 11:1: "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Since hope is desire with expectation (see Romans 8:24-25), there must be some basis or reason to expect a desire to be realized. This basis is faith. Faith is the "substance," hupostasis, i.e., the "thing put under, substructure, foundation." (Thayer, 645) Since the things hoped for are not seen, yet the proof or evidence, elenchos, that they exist is faith.

We are convinced of the reality of things unseen by the truth or confidence we have in God. If someone we love, respect and trust promises us something -- a gift, trip, etc., though we have not seen the promised thing we desire and expect it. Why? Because of the confidence we have in the integrity and honesty of the person who promised it.

What evidence is there that there is a Paris or London, or that George Washington or Abraham Lincoln really lived? Have you seen these places or men? The fact that they are, or were, is accepted by faith. You trust those who informed you.

There is a heaven, etc., and as faithful Christians we expect to go there. The evidence? The basis for hope? God, who cannot lie (Heb. 6:18), has told us. We believe Him.

The Necessity of Faith "But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him" (Heb. 11:6).

Since it is by faith that one obeys God in entering into an approved relationship with Him (Gal. 5:6) and lives a life approved by Him (Gal. 3:11), it follows that faith is necessary to please God (Heb. 11:6; John 8:24). Faith must be in one's heart in becoming a Christian and it must be retained and even augmented throughout his life as a Christian (Rom. 5:1; 2 Cor. 5:7). There is no sin more devastating than the sin of unbelief because it eliminates every phase of usefulness before the Lord (John 3:18). Unbelief, which so easily besets a person (Heb. 12:1), keeps him from fellowship with the living God (Heb. 3:12).

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Trust and confidence comes through a knowledge of God -- His character, love, dependability, sovereignty, etc. -- revealed in Scripture, thus faith comes by hearing the word of God (Rom. 10:17).

Since faith only comes by hearing the word of God, go to the Scriptures, His inspired word, to learn of Him and Jesus Christ, His only begotten Son who lived and died for you. Allow the facts presented in the Bible about them to generate faith in your heart and then manifest that faith by submitting in obedience to the gospel, God's power unto salvation (Rom. 1:16), so that you might have your sins remitted (Acts 2:38); be added to Christ's church, the body of the saved (Acts 2:47); and have the hope of eternal life (1 Pet. 1:4).

Kam_Fong_as_Chin_Ho 8 years, 5 months ago

It's high time the Church left people to decide for themselves instead of trying to recruit new members all the time. And that goes for any religion. Some of us can be spiritual without your "help", thank you very much!

Actually, I enjoy it when other people share their beliefs with me. I'm eager to hear about various types of beliefs; Bhuddists, Muslims, Mormons, Amish, etc. I'm open-minded, so I don't get offended when someone wants to share information with me that they consider to be inspirational. If I don't agree with it, I'll politely let them know why I disagree.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

[Heb.,=repose], in Judaism, last day of the week (Saturday), observed as a rest day for the twenty-five hours commencing with sundown on Friday. In the biblical account of creation (Gen. 1) the seventh day is set as a Sabbath to mark God's rest after his work. In Jewish law, starting with both versions of the Ten Commandments, the rules for the Sabbath are given in careful detail. The Sabbath is intended to be a day of spiritual refreshment and joy. Observant Jews wear special clothes, enjoy festive meals, and attend synagogue, where the weekly portion of the Pentateuch is read with an accompanying excerpt from the Prophets. In the home, the mistress of the house says a blessing and lights two candles in honor of the two biblical verses that enjoin Sabbath rest. Early Christians had a weekly celebration of the liturgy on the first day (Sunday), observing the Resurrection. Hence, among Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox, Sunday is a liturgical feast; Protestants, applying the idea of the Jewish Sabbath to Sunday, forbade all but pious activity. The term "Lord's Day" was used, especially by Sabbatarians, to promote such observance (see blue laws). Some denominations (e.g., Seventh-Day Baptists and Seventh-Day Adventists) replace Sunday with Saturday. In Islam, Friday is the weekly day of public prayer.

Centrist 8 years, 5 months ago

Ease up there Helen. The question does NOT ask you for a sermon.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

2 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all their multitude. 2And on the seventh day God finished the work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all the work that he had done. 3So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all the work that he had done in creation.

Proverbs 17:22: A merry heart doeth good like a medicine: but a broken spirit drieth the bones.

The Sabbath is for regeneration and fellowship it is not a predisposition to eternal life. Religious sects from all beliefs build temples of worship, but the body is the temple of the soul. Exercising the Sabbath is simply caring for one self both physically and spiritually. This can be done in a building, a field or the Link food line serving.

Laura 8 years, 5 months ago

Don't forget, Helen: it's a mitzvah to make love on the sabbath.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

When the Student is ready the Teacher will appear.

opinion 8 years, 5 months ago

Roger,

Good questions. My opinion is that "person of faith" describes most people if not all. Who doesn't have some faith; faith in God, faith that there is no God, faith in self... The difference not the presence of faith, but the Object of faith.

As far as you second set of questions:

"I have another question that will probably be taken as sarcastic, but am very serious about: If a person goes to church so that they will go to heaven, is that selfish? I've heard from some that,"no good deeds will get you into heaven, ONLY accepting JesusChrist as your savior will." What does that mean? Is that a fringe belief?"

Based on what I have learned studying the Bible, going to Church to get to Heaven is not only selfish, it is completly misguided. The Scripture makes it clear that trusting in Jesus, the Christ, is the only way to eternal salvation. I know there are non-believers that just cringe when they hear a statement like that but that is what the Bible says. You may reject that statement, and the Bible for that matter, but you cannot reject that that is what the Bible says.

Is it fringe? Does it matter if it is the Truth?

opinion 8 years, 5 months ago

Holygrailale,

You said "I found that, not only had the monks there read the arguments and liturature of atheism / agnosticism / philosophy to a much greater degree of understanding than I possessed, they had knowledge in "atheistic" writings I never knew existed."

Along that same line, sadly, as a Christian, I find that many times, non-believers know Bible verses better than Christians. They may not know the context but they do know the verses.

Thanks for the insight.

HelenBrown 8 years, 5 months ago

Every moment and every event of every man's life on earth plants something in his soul. For just as the wind carries thousands of winged seeds, so each moment brings with it germs of spiritual vitality that come to rest imperceptibly in the minds and wills of men. Most of these unnumbered seeds perish and are lost, because men are not prepared to receive them: for such seeds as these cannot spring up anywhere except in the good soil of freedom, spontaneity and love.

Thomas Merton

Katara 8 years, 5 months ago

@ Patriotman

Why do you keep referring to Holygrailale as Gale? Are you implying that you know Holygrailale's name? If she hasn't given it to you or hasn't posted using it before, it could be taken as threatening.

I remember another recent ex-poster who did that. It wasn't conservativeman.

Are you a driving instructor too?

Just curious.

Linda Endicott 8 years, 5 months ago

Most churches will tell you that you shouldn't associate with people who are not of your faith, or especially not of any faith at all. Jehovah's witnesses are good at this one.

Yet, my mother had a dear friend who was a JW, and I continued to have a relationship with her after my mother died. She knew I was never going to convert, or even attend her church, but she still talked to me. Not that it stopped her from trying from time to time to preach to me, but it didn't have the effect that she hoped it would.

I had a good friend in college. She and her family would come spend evenings with me and my family. We were of different faiths, and we just simply agreed not to talk about it when we saw each other. She wasn't going to change my mind, and she knew it, and I wasn' t going to change her mind, and I knew it.

So what was the point in discussing religion?

So no, I don't think religious beliefs, or lack thereof, should be any reason not to associate with people.

carolannfugate 8 years, 5 months ago

I'm a little freaked out by the scientology thing. L Ron Hubbard is a strange person.

xenophonschild 8 years, 5 months ago

I heartily suggest that "a person of faith" quickly find an agnostic or atheist friend to show them the road to reality and common sense.

It is nothing short of flabbergastrous incredulity that grown adults still believe childish superstitions. Reminds me of the tribe in central Africa in WWII that profited tangentially from parachuted supply drops by Allied transport planes. After the war was over and the planes stopped coming, the tribe weaved grass replicas of airplanes, prayed and burned cow dung over them, and had young boys race around the village with the planes in an attempt to make the planes reappear and drop their magic onto the assembled villagers.

Some of us view "persons of faith" the same way we view those poor deluded villagers.

only1voice 8 years, 5 months ago

It Doesnt Matter What Faith You Have as Long as You Have It. If You Dont't Have Faith, You Dont Have anything.

All Gods Lead To One God.

Touchy Subject!.....Feeling Emotional...Musta Got Struck By My Girl VENUS......

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Very curious test agnostic .

Christian Science (Church of Christ Scientist) 100% match

Then after that I think it was in the low 70s for Liberal Quakers, Unitarian Universalists and the Baha'i.

Very curious.....

prioress 8 years, 5 months ago

And this little paranoid drama has what to do with the subject of this article? Ya'll need to grow up a little bit.

Welcome to Junior High Folks. If I were moderator, I'd bump any posts that did not discuss the story at hand, which, if I'm correct, is the purpose of this little sandbox. (Of course, this post would be bounced, now wouldn't it?)

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Did it again and came up with a slightly different answer.

  1. Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (100%)
  2. Unitarian Universalism (96%)
  3. Liberal Quakers (89%)
  4. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (76%)
  5. Theravada Buddhism (76%)
  6. Bahá'Ã- Faith (74%)
  7. Taoism (69%)
  8. Secular Humanism (67%)
  9. Hinduism (66%)
  10. New Thought (66%)
  11. Nontheist (61%)
  12. Mahayana Buddhism (57%)
  13. Neo-Pagan (54%)

craigers 8 years, 5 months ago

The more you hang around somebody the more you will act like them. Whether the change is subtle or very noticeable, the people you hang out with constantly will start to have an impact on your life. That is why it is important for kids to hang out with good kids because if you don't you will end up in more trouble. This is the same for Christians. If you let non-Christians be your most dominant friends then they will slowly alter your behavior and ideas, whether you choose to or not. This is why you should balance your friends and have those that will influence your Christian life positively. Your close friends should be those who you want to have an influence on your life.

craigers 8 years, 5 months ago

And Kodiac, I am not looking for an out on any of my actions or behaviors. We will be held accountable for our actions. That prayer is just saying that we want God's guidance and direction for our lives and we want His will done in them.

opinion 8 years, 5 months ago

Some of the questions stopped short of being completly clear but it was a fun excercise. Thanks Agnostick

  1. Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (100%)
  2. Orthodox Quaker (84%)
  3. Seventh Day Adventist (79%)
  4. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (77%)
  5. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (75%)

yourworstnightmare 8 years, 5 months ago

I'm not sure it is such a good idea for two "peoples of faith" to be friends, if they happen to hold different religious views.

mohammedans/christians catholics/protestants shia/suni

Religious people get very testy with those who do not agree with them and often end up resorting to violence and murder to settle their disputes. Savages.

selene 8 years, 5 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

Tychoman 8 years, 5 months ago

Awesome test, Agnostick. 1. Unitarian Universalism (100%)
2. Liberal Quakers (86%)
3. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (86%)
4. Neo-Pagan (85%)
5. Mahayana Buddhism (78%)
6. Secular Humanism (76%)
7. Theravada Buddhism (70%)
8. Hinduism (69%)
9. Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (68%)
10. New Age (68%)
11. Bahá'Ã- Faith (65%)
12. New Thought (63%)
13. Jainism (60%)
14. Taoism (54%)
15. Reform Judaism (49%)
16. Scientology (49%)
17. Nontheist (47%)
18. Sikhism (47%)
19. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (45%)
20. Orthodox Quaker (43%)
21. Jehovah's Witness (40%)
22. Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (35%)
23. Orthodox Judaism (26%)
24. Seventh Day Adventist (21%)
25. Islam (20%)
26. Eastern Orthodox (16%)
27. Roman Catholic (16%)

I'm thrilled with my results 1-8, not so much to the rest. Haha. What is Baha'i, anyway? I'm flattered about the Taoism :)

xenophonschild 8 years, 5 months ago

Before my ancestors became "Defenders of the Faith," they worshipped oak groves and big rocks on the Emerald Isle.

I think the earlier version made more sense

roger_o_thornhill 8 years, 5 months ago

Oh, I was thinking of that Brittany Spears movie. Wasn't that what it was called too?

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Hey Agno,

Look at marquisdesade results. How the heck do you get Secular Humanism next to Jehovah Witness. That is bizarre. Now I realize what you saying about all your views not being shared by this faith and vice versa but come on, how many common beliefs or views can there be between secular humanism and Jehovah Witnesses?

Kodiac 8 years, 5 months ago

Enough enough enough people. Take your discussions of your victory/defeat to your emails for christsakes. I personally don't give rats *ss about who said what. I am just getting tired of hearing or reading about it. DO THIS IN YOUR EMAILS.

Sorry this comment is specifically directed at Grail and 1571.

The topic here is about faith and whether or not we can be friends.

What about it Grail and 1571. Are ye of different faiths and could you be friends with each other. Can't we all just get along?

xenophonschild 8 years, 5 months ago

holygrailale:

In the movie "Crossroads" (can't remember what year, mid to late '80s) with Ralph Macchio and Jamie Gertz, Vai was the guitarist who dueled with Macchio at the end of the movie for his soul. I remember searching the credits for the dude, and thinking: "Man, this guy can play!"

Lepanto1571 8 years, 5 months ago

Holygrailale:

"That's funny. You and conservativeman played cheerleader to Lepanto1571's losing effort to "quelch the agnostic" on a creationist thread."

Obsess much? Five months since your defeat and your still bouncing off the walls, spinning and obsessing. I hadn't realized I'd driven you over the edge into obsession. Thanks for the compliment! :)

To assuage your bruised ego holygrailale, I do understand. Someone blowing holes in your entrenched worldview is unsettling and you're still limping around wounded and angry. Perhaps you should return to the monastery for counsel and contemplative prayer.

BTW, is that what I was doing? "Quelching the agnostic?"

Hell, most everyone took your diversion, displacement, flailing and extreme aversion to answering questions as me just trouncing you!

Very "Chamberlian!"

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Katara 8 years, 5 months ago

As usual, I am late for the party and not even fashionably so.

  1. Unitarian Universalism (100%)
  2. Theravada Buddhism (99%)
  3. Liberal Quakers (92%)
  4. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (85%)
  5. Mahayana Buddhism (84%)
  6. Neo-Pagan (78%)
  7. Secular Humanism (78%)
  8. Taoism (67%)
  9. New Age (66%)
  10. Jainism (66%)
  11. Bah�'� Faith (63%)
  12. Nontheist (56%)
  13. Reform Judaism (56%)
  14. Orthodox Quaker (54%)
  15. Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (52%)
  16. Hinduism (52%)
  17. New Thought (52%)
  18. Sikhism (50%)
  19. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (42%)
  20. Scientology (41%)
  21. Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (37%)
  22. Orthodox Judaism (34%)
  23. Jehovah's Witness (32%)
  24. Seventh Day Adventist (28%)
  25. Islam (25%)
  26. Eastern Orthodox (12%)
  27. Roman Catholic (12%)

xenophonschild 8 years, 5 months ago

Angelo Bruno. Some things can never be forgiven.

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