Archive for Friday, April 21, 2006

Wal-Mart lawsuit over, will be allowed to build

April 21, 2006

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After years of litigation, City Hall and Wal-Mart today announced a settlement that will allow the giant retailer to build a store on the northwest corner of Sixth and Wakarusa streets.

Under the terms of the settlement:

¢ City Hall will rezone the land to allow a maximum of 128,000 square feet of commercial space, down from 154,000 square feet previously approved. The largest building on the site - Wal-Mart's store - will be limited to 99,990 square feet.

¢ Both parties agree "the project will incorporate enhanced design and construction standards such that the physical appearance of the project will be in keeping with the highest levels of aesthetics and design."

¢ Wal-mart will pay two-thirds the cost of a stoplight at Sixth and Congressional streets, at the southwest corner of the site.

¢ 6Wak Land Investments LLC will repay legal fees that City Hall was forced to reimburse after the company, which owns the site, won an early round of litigation in the matter.

In a joint press release with the city, Bill Newsome, a 6Wak partner, said: "We are optimistic about a successful completion of the planning process and will work with the City to achieve that result."

Mayor Mike Amyx added: "We look forward to the consideration of the proposal advanced by the settlement as we seek to ensure the best development at this location which benefits the community."

Litigation began in 2003, after City Hall denied a building permit for a restaurant, which has not been identified, in spring 2003, saying it was too closely linked to the Wal-Mart proposal. Officials maintain Wal-Mart is a department store, which is prohibited under the terms of the site's zoning. Wal-Mart said it was a "variety store" permitted by the rules.

West Lawrence residents have opposed the project, saying it would create too much traffic on roads traveled by their children, and for students commuting to and from nearby Free State High School.

For more on this developing story, watch 6News tonight at 6 p.m. and 10 p.m. on Sunflower Broadband channel 6, and pick up a copy of Saturday's Journal-World.

Comments

audvisartist 8 years, 12 months ago

Wal-Mart just wants to tear this town apart huh? The construction going on right now around the existing Wal-Mart is ridiculous. Is there even a need for a 2nd Wal-Mart in Lawrence? Is there even a need for Wal-Mart at all?

bmwjhawk 8 years, 12 months ago

Wal-Mart is evil, blah blah. Who cares? Don't shop there.

Sideshow_Bob 8 years, 12 months ago

ReachAround, you should change "tornado" to "microburst".

WalMarts everywhere! I do feel for the people that live around there, just thinking about the traffic at the current Wal-Mart and that level of traffic being up there in northwest lawrence makes me shudder.

kujeeper 8 years, 12 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

nlf78 8 years, 12 months ago

kujeeper - East Lawrence TRASH....that's really lovely, hopefully none of that trash runs into you at the new walmart!

and i'm not a fan of walmart...but it's all my family can afford, if you don't like it, DON'T shop there!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Sometime in the next 5-15 years, when the end of cheap oil makes Walmart's business model obselete, everyone will be lamenting the big-box blight that will litter this and every other city.

KungFuLogic 8 years, 12 months ago

Irrational

more like let west lawrence go up in the flames of cheap goods, low paying jobs, slum and white trash times roll

TheEleventhStephanie 8 years, 12 months ago

kujeeper--Speaking on behalf of "the trash of east lawrence," I say stay on your side of Iowa!

KungFuLogic 8 years, 12 months ago

can't the city pass an ordinance banning dumb, poor white trash people from lawrence so the demand for wally world is nixed?

one solution that might work is to pass an ordinance requiring all private employers within the city limits employing 20 or more people be unionized. Wally would duck and run like the ghost of adam smith was after it.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Glad to see you've decided to keep your title as "Mr. Idiot," Marion. You wear it well.

samsnewplace 8 years, 12 months ago

wtg Wallyworld!! Now bring back K-Mart somewhere in north Lawrence....who needs downtown snobby stores, better yet, who can afford them. I'll take wallyworld and k-mart anyday.

Jeanne Cunningham 8 years, 12 months ago

I think that the big concern about the potential lowering of property values is very telling. It seems to me that the only people who are worried about property values are those who are intending to sell their property and move away anyhow. Those of us who intend to stay and will continue to pay property taxes are NOT so opposed to the concept - as long as it isn't so drastic that it makes our properties less than what we owe on them.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Care to be specific about "everything possible," blue73harley?

lamb 8 years, 12 months ago

Hurrah!! I am for WalMart building there. I don't live very far from that area, and it will be very convenient for me. For the life of me, I do not understand the hostility towards WalMart. I bet most of you shop there when you are looking for good prices.

imagold 8 years, 12 months ago

A Wal-Mart on my way home. I'm glad to see it and tickled to read this news story. Those who live in that area quit your complaining. You're a major cause of traffic increase on 6th and on Wakarusa. Building a high school increased traffic. The turnpike exit increased traffic. New businesses increased traffic. Seems to my little mind that one way to slow traffic is to stop building: houses, businesses, schools, turnpike entrances, etc. Doubt they want to do that.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

"For the life of me, I do not understand the hostility towards WalMart."

Perhaps if your interests extended beyond yourself, you might have a chance of understanding.

average 8 years, 12 months ago

Marion:

What in the name of heck do you see replacing foreign oil? Do you either forsee:

a.) people not moving 1 ton+ of metal at 50 mph to cross the street?

b.) Trillions of barrels of oil somewhere we just haven't looked in the last century.

c.) some other highly portable energy-dense substance to power the traffic jam?

Sigmund 8 years, 12 months ago

TheEleventhStephanie on April 21, 2006 at 10:47 a.m., opined: kujeeper--Speaking on behalf of "the trash of east lawrence," I say stay on your side of Iowa!

Agreed!

KungFuLogic 8 years, 12 months ago

all you captilists see is self-interest at the end of your nose. there's more to life than the almighty greenback. how about a park for our kids to play in, how about a community that is nit together because neighbors know one another, how about giving an opportunity for mom-and-pop to have a slice of the american dream. the american dream has turned into huge monopolisitc corp.'s that sell a community cheap goods in exchange for their souls. but no worries, we'll all have so much cheap junk in our houses and yards from wally world that we will truly be content.

monkeyhawk 8 years, 12 months ago

"6Wak Land Investments LLC will repay legal fees that City Hall was forced to reimburse after the company, which owns the site, won an early round of litigation in the matter."

So, does that mean that the taxpayers did not take a hit for any legal fees or cash settlements?

Dorothy Hoyt-Reed 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm not driving all the way to 6th street or the one out south when I can stop at Checkers. If I pay 10 cents more for my shampoo it saves that much in gas, and even more in stress. If you think you can only afford WalMart, you need to check around. You might be surprised. Don't forget to add in gas and stress.

monkeyhawk 8 years, 12 months ago

"all you captilists see is self-interest at the end of your nose. there's more to life than the almighty greenback. how about a park for our kids to play in, how about a community that is nit together because neighbors know one another, how about giving an opportunity for mom-and-pop to have a slice of the american dream. the american dream has turned into huge monopolisitc corp.'s that sell a community cheap goods in exchange for their souls. but no worries, we'll all have so much cheap junk in our houses and yards from wally world that we will truly be content."

Kung, For many of us, it has nothing to do with Walmart. It is all about the PLC and their rejection of anything that they personally don't like and their Al Gore vision of what our lives should be like. It has to do with power, not low prices.

KungFuLogic 8 years, 12 months ago

if walmart is so great at providing cheap goods, why haven't they gotten into the oil biz? answer: because their fat-cat capitalists that care about one thing, driving small vendors out of biz.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

blue73harley

Keeney is certainly entitled to his opinion, but his statement is mostly just that-- a very biased opinion.

There do need to be very clear rules for developers, but the fact that there are none is a development of many, many decades. Under previous commissions, the lack of clear rules was used as carte blanche by developers.

The PLC has attempted to bring representation of other interests into city government. Many of the business interests who used to do pretty much whatever they pleased are not happy with that situation.

That doesn't make the PLC business unfriendly-- just cognizant that there are other considerations to take into account in running a city.

Jill Ensley 8 years, 12 months ago

Wow. Just....wow. I'm going back over to Lawrence.com.

Mama 8 years, 12 months ago

So many pissy people on a beautiful Friday morning! Cheer up, Charlie!!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Almost all of the real experts disagree with you, Marion. There is no technology on the horizon that will replace our petroleum-based lifestyle.

monkeyhawk 8 years, 12 months ago

"if walmart is so great at providing cheap goods, why haven't they gotten" into the oil biz?"

Kung, The construction currently going on at the Iowa location is preparing for a gas station.

context 8 years, 12 months ago

Great News! It will be right next to Free State ... so our children can learn firsthand about pure capitalism. On west 6th, the traffic is so light, this will allow for more use of the dollars already spent on infrastructure there. Another light just west of 6th and Wakarusa will be a welcome addition for commuters. Now I don't have drive oh so far to south Iowa to participate in the Walton model. Gosh, I hope the Walmart Bank gets the federal approval it's been seeking since July, so it can be added to the 6 & Wak. location. Thanks WalMart for always showing us what's best and teaching us that you belong where you say you belong.

Honestly, thanks to the city for doing your best to listen when we (yes we, the people) said we don't want that type of development at that location. You apparently fought the good fight, but we all saw (smelled) it coming back when they were awarded attorney fees for the remainder of the case.

Like it or not, now we're another step nearer becoming just another generic city ... might as well just call us "City, Kansas" and sell us off the shelf at Super Walmarts.

Noweigh 8 years, 12 months ago

Could we please, for once in this town, allow the free marketplace decide the fate of a business?!
Believe it or not, we actually make proper choices sometimes. Wal-Mart made their fortune providing consumers(real people) real value. That is to their credit and they should apologize to no one. Don't like their "tactics", or policies, don't shop there..they'll be gone very, very quickly.
City Hall changed the rules in the middle of the game in Lawrence and once again, it was overly costly for everyone. If Wal-Mart fails from lack of sales by a consumer boycott or just poor business practices, that is their risk and they will pay for it.
Once the store actually opens it will interesting to see the whining go away as the anti-growth(code for anti-shopping choice) crowd parks their politically correct brands of cars in the new Wal-mart lot.

intransit 8 years, 12 months ago

so why exactly do we need another wal-mart? is there some previously unknown urge in this town to put cheap guns & ammo next to a high school?

justthefacts 8 years, 12 months ago

Regardless of how you feel or what you think about Walmart (in any location on earth) or other similar businesses, the LEGAL aspects of their challenge to the city's decision (change of mind) were so lop sided in their favor as to be almost 100% predicatable that this outcome would result.

In this specific isolated situation, the current Lawrence city officials had only two choices: Let them build now (with a negotiated arrangement) or take it to court and be told by a judge that they had to let them build. A Walmart of some type was going in there at some point (unless the store owners simply decided they'd not make any money putting it there, and thus gave up on their own).

For those people needing someone to "blame" for the new store going in, the people who screwed up were the past city officials. They were the people who (a) drew up the plans in the first place, not making it 100% clear that such buildings were prohibited at this site/location and/or (b) the past city officials who gave it the go-ahead in the first place.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

justthefacts--

That's just too many facts for the knee-jerkers on this board.

merrywidow033 8 years, 12 months ago

and if you REALLY compare things, prices aren't that much less-expensive at walmark. (at least as of late) i'll take cheap target goods over cheap walmark goods anyday. what they needed to do was build a supermarket in eastern lawrence, it's absolutely desolate in terms of grocery shopping.. shrug whatev's.. walmark got their way, big effin surpise... i'm going back to work now.

justthefacts 8 years, 12 months ago

I fear you are correct bozo, but I still have to try keeping things factual...thus the name.

Folks, whether you are for or against THIS particular store at THIS particular site, the decision to let it go there was made YEARS ago. That long ago decision created a vested property right possessed by the individuals who sought, and got, approval to build.

The people who gave that city OK to the building permit aren't in office now (are they?). Their actions (long ago) made this happen.

So if those who are upset want to aim their thoughts & feelings at the correct people who did this awful thing, they should realize that the CURRENT batch of city officials are merely doing what some court/judge was going to eventually make them do any way (because of "silly" things like the Constitutional protections for due process and property rights given to all persons).

The current city officials' had their hands legally tied by the past actions of former city officials/employees!

Brad Barker 8 years, 12 months ago

i hate walmart so so badly. this town already has one too many. now a second one is going to ruin west lawrence. a walmart at that location is going to stick out very badly and be an eye sore. wakarusa is a very nice looking stretch of buildings and lawns and i think a walmart will ruin all of it. not to mention the trailer parks and pay day check advancement loan offices that will surely spring up all around it. i hate you walmart and vow to never step foot in that building.

justthefacts 8 years, 12 months ago

If enough people refuse to shop at any store, it will eventually close. Right?

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

Way to wuss out City Hall. What a sad day for Lawrence. This is just gross. Good luck in your McMansion box store hell west Lawrence. Sorry.

This is a song for the people in the streets, not the people City Hall...

Brad Barker 8 years, 12 months ago

and i agree with merrywidow033, walmart is no cheaper than target. i hope the free market system would take care of this excess walmart, but i am less than optimistic.

bluerose 8 years, 12 months ago

weenies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i DESPISE walmart even more so now. and am so ashamed of my little city...

what a sad day.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

justthefacts--

You left out the fact that those former city officials ignored zoning requirements then in force to give approval to this Walmart. The current commission was merely trying to correct this past wrong, but, alas, it was too late.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

blue73harley,

I don't know that it cost us any jobs. There could be lots of reasons for Keeney making the decision he did, and the statements about PLC are just as likely his attempts to cover his own a**.

Lawrence has never been a major industrial player. The only reasons it is where it is are the University and our proximity to KC and Topeka, and the latter has made us a bedroom community, and since residential really doesn't pay its way, that's why we have many of the problems we are now experiencing. Giving away tax abatements in exchange for low-paying jobs will only make things worse.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Who's squirming, Marion?

Yet again, we're paying the price for the corruption of previous commissions.

And you think that's the model for good government.

Darth_Vader 8 years, 12 months ago

Boooo to Walmart, but I will take the advice given. If I don't like it I won't shop there. Though the store is 99,990 square fee so it's kind of hard to miss, it's almost like saying if you don't like the roundabouts don't drive around them.

shorttrees 8 years, 12 months ago

With all the fussing at our commissioners/city govt. and the screaming about how horrible WalMart is some of the most important people in this debacle seem to have been forgotten--The land owners/developers! What the HE (double toothpick) were they thinking? Money, greed, a "great" anchor for their development, whatever; THEY are the ones responsible for bringing in WalMart at that location, they are the ones who were instrumental in filing the lawsuit, and they are the ones who should have any praise or derision aimed their way. Bill Newsome and Doug Compton are the major partners in this, BTW. Do a search for 6Wak and make your own decision as to their intent. I know I'm not impressed with their commitment to community...

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

I agree, blue73harley.

That's why economic development should become a city position. The Chamber has really dropped the ball on it.

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo, so the city spent over $100,000 to correct "a past wrong", even though the facts, from a legal standpoint, made it obvious the City was going to lose this case? That's just great, shall we applaud them? But we've seen that $100,000 ain't much to this commission based on the numerous consultants and studies they've spent money on.

I'm glad Wal-Mart won...low prices, everyday!

justthefacts 8 years, 12 months ago

"And for justthefacts - if the outcome was so 100% obvious, why did the PLC dig their heels in in the first place?"

Because they didn't like the results and/or knew some of the citizens did not. Just because you are likely to lose a game of legal "chicken" doesn't mean some people aren't willing to try it any way.

" Justthefacts-- You left out the fact that those former city officials ignored zoning requirements then in force to give approval to this Walmart. The current commission was merely trying to correct this past wrong, but, alas, it was too late."

Precisely the point. By the time the current commission decided to try to stop the project, it was far too late (legally) to win it in court.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Sometimes principle counts for something. Unfortunately, in this case, Compton and Newsome already got their buddies on the previous commissions to do their bidding on the principle of stuffing more cash in 6Wak's pockets at the expense of everyone else in the city.

As shorttrees pointed out, if you want to be pissed at someone, be pissed at Compton, Newsom, and 6Wacky.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

You're making me all teary-eyed, auricular_eyes.

Why doesn't the Walmart model work for the Royals?

Amy Bartle 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm so disappointed. It's ironic that Wal-Mart has a recycling center, yet is in the business of producing and selling throw-away merchandise. Who wants to predict how soon the old walmart will close and become an abandoned building, once the new one is built? And who wants to predict how soon the next grocery store in town will close as a result of Wal-Mart coming in? How many jobs will be lost?

BJ 8 years, 12 months ago

We should have made them put the homeless shelter in the same complex. Oops, I didn't say that. Sorry Boooooooooooog.

Jeanne Cunningham 8 years, 12 months ago

  1. If you - or others - are so concerned about your child driving in traffic - WHY do you let them have a car? Tell them to walk. That might be a solution to at least some of the obesity problems, too.

  2. If some of us who have to drive all the way across town to the existing Walmart can just go to the new one, the traffic at the old one might go down. Then, of course, there will be some additional traffic at the new one - but a whole lot of it will be the same people going to the McDonald's with the Playland anyhow. Or, maybe some of us WILL be able to walk because it will be within walking distance?

  3. Sell out now - while your property is still worth a bundle. Then, maybe when (if) the property values DO go down some, an average person can afford to buy a decent place to live. You can go live in "la-la" land and not ever even have to see Walmart. Tell your chauffeur to close the blinds when you pass.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Someday when I grow up I'll be all-knowing and such just like you, oricolor ayes.

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Compton & Co. didn't "force" the city to waste $100K in an unwinnable lawsuit. Wasting $100K of TAXPAYER money for the "principle" of it is not acceptable to me--I feel like that money could have been spent more appropriately.

You anti-Wally World people crack me up. Don't shop there if you don't like it. Start up a better store than Wal-Mart if you are that hell bent to change the world and put Wal-Mart out of business. Good luck!

Ceallach 8 years, 12 months ago

Isn't that the area where the new residences cannot safely flush their toilets??

Reader 8 years, 12 months ago

Thank You, Thank You, Thank You! North Lawrence Just Got "F@KEd" Agian. No Grocery Stores, No Banks, No Retail, No Nothing. Either Way You Look At It We'll Have To Drive Across Town For What We Need. To The South End, Or The West End Of Town. 6th/Wakarusa? What A "Cluster F@K" That Is Going To Be! BTW, Why Did It Take A "Blind And Gifted Child" To Make The City Of Lawrence See What Should Have Been Done Years Ago, In Getting The Bump In The Road Fixed! Thank You Billy! Get Well Soon.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm glad you're angry, Jay Z. I'm sad your anger is so misdirected.

Maybe auricular_eyes could tell you a joke and cheer you up.

brady 8 years, 12 months ago

Follow link below for researched facts detailing how Wal-mart creates a wage-race to the bottom driving down wages by $3 billion dollars a year for our country's poorest workers (while further lining the pockets of Wal-mart execs and the Walton family), how it, as a policy, does not provide health insurance for its employees who, they know, are below the poverty line and will benefit from public health services (costing American taxpayers, and saving Wal-mart, 1.2 TRILLION dollars anually), how it does all these same things to much greater extents in all the foreign factories it uses to bring us our beloved low prices.

Free markets make capital the end-all and dehumanize what is a wholly human interaction: trade. Trade is what sustains us, provides economic wealth and growth that benefits all of humanity. But we can and must demad FAIR trade markets that ensure humanity is considered in the market first, capital second. We obviously cannot trust multi-national corporations and governments to ensure basic human rights in the course of trade therefore we, as consumers, must vote with our dollar AGAINST these unjust practices.

Wal-mart is one of the worst in terms of destroying justice in trade.

There are better ways: http://www.maketradefair.com/en/index.htm.

The facts: http://www.walmartmovie.com/facts.php

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo that is the problem with people like auricular_eyes and Marion... they think that they are all grown up when in fact they are not.

Only children have the luxury of walking through this world in such a state of naivety.

Sam Waltan was a good man. Problem is that he isn't here anymore and his children don't use the same good sense. Nor do they honestly care about the little guy. Why, when you are raised so wealthy would you care to be honest and true? Ahem...Paige Sports Arena.

Eagle_aye 8 years, 12 months ago

Would everyone be so upset and up at arms if it was a Kohl's, JC Penney's or even Target?

thisiknow 8 years, 12 months ago

I, like most east side Lawrence residents, know that the west side residents would not have balked at an uppercrust store being built in the same location. This town needs to unite and quit classing people. I'll shop at Wal-Mart and Target and wherever I can get the better deal. I have really noticed an increase in customers at Aldi's since the price of gas is jumping. All classes go to Aldi's because your dollar stretches further! I was shopping at the Shawnee Mission Wal-Mart not too long ago because of prices. I went there last week and noticed the french bread I had gotten before had risen a quarter in price. The rising gas prices are getting us at the grocery store and the pump!!!!!

jfgibson 8 years, 12 months ago

I can tell you all that I worked at Walmart through all of high school and in their accounting office both for two years after that. They provide great pay and the best benefits I have ever seen. There was not one year that went by that I didn't receive at least $500 every December just from their profit sharing program. Their insurance is awesome and very cheap. This new store will provide many jobs to this town. Even part time employees are offered benefits through Walmart. This is a good opportunity for many unemployed person's in Lawrence. It is also an added conveience for those who live on that side of town. Where else can you go and get your oil changed, grab dinner stuff, and buy some sheets? This is crazy that one store has created such an uproar!

cutny 8 years, 12 months ago

Hey, looks like there's gonna be a new place in town hiring. As long as you don't need to support yourself or make more than $6.50 an hour, it might just be the place for you to get a job!!! Oh yeah, there are no benefits either, so I hope you and your family members are ever ill. Wal-Mart...Let it burn

thisiknow 8 years, 12 months ago

OTTR-i used to say that as well.I have come to find out that the major companies learned they were losing money to stores like Aldi's,so, they repackage their product now for Aldi's. Their pancake mix is the best around! I do not buy all my groceries there but I do buy the majority. You are just buying the most for your money.

b_asinbeer 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm all for it...I can't afford to shop at downtown. Too ridiculously expensive.

Sigmund 8 years, 12 months ago

OK, that settles it! Im buying 100 shares of Wal-Mart. Should have done it years ago ....

Confrontation 8 years, 12 months ago

This cracks me up! All those rich westsiders who didn't want to see a WalMart that close to their overpriced houses can now enjoy it!

noodle 8 years, 12 months ago

I don't shop at the current Wal-Mart but I will shop at the new one. It will be close to my house. Lawrence is a great town and it's not going to change because Wal-Mart has a 2nd location. Why does everyone have to be so negative?

thisiknow 8 years, 12 months ago

I love that I can shop anywhere and everywhere in Lawrence. I do not care who sees me go into any store. That is the beauty of it all. If I am on the west side and need to drop in and buy something at Wal-Mart---I can. If I am shopping downtown so be it. I do not voice a hate for companies and stores and then have to shop exclusively.

Hoots 8 years, 12 months ago

Does Wal-Mart always have the lowest prices...No. They are great at marketing. Often the item that is the bottom end product at the end of the isle is the lowest price you can find. The higher end items down the isle can often be found cheaper at other stores. How often do you buy the bottom of the line?

Granted Wal-Mart has created low skilled jobs. How many higher paying manufacturing jobs have been forced over seas by Wal-Marts buying tactics? They have pushed many American companies to locate to China. That is a fact. So is it worth 10 cents on a pair of socks to put one of you out of work?

How long can the United States send our dollars elsewhere? These dollars are not coming back to us in trade with the countries we do business with. You can only drink out of a glass for so long before it is empty. How long can we buy everything and make nothing?

I watched a segment on Frontline last week showing work conditions and practices in China. In short the goods Wal-Mart sells are made by slave labor. People work 14 hour days and 7 days a week. Many of the workers last 5 to 7 years and are used up by then. They sleep 12 to a room in slums provided by the factory. 750 million people are kept as slaves living in povery to serve a government that profits while they have nothing. Yes, there are people in China doing well...that is if they are connected to the top officials in China in some way. Otherwise they have nothing with little hope of ever achieving anything other than the poverty they have always had. Most dogs live better in the United States.

Wal-Mart isn't the only retailer guilty of promoting these practices but they do it on a larger scale by far. I for one will be more aware of what I buy in the future. I will be aware of where it's made. It is easy to say this is all great having all this cheap crap. But at what price? I guess it's easy to ignore when the impoverished workers don't live in your back yard. They are far away locked in a factory 14 hours a day making very little so we can have socks and toothbrushes that are just a few cents less. Nevermind the suffering and the darkness...I saved a dime at Big Box Mart.

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Well Marion, I'd guess Boog & Co. will choose to ignore reality and continue to live in their fantasy land.....

moosejeffries 8 years, 12 months ago

u need two walmarts in town ! here in topeka we have two stores running now one beeine bulted on us 24 hiway and future store on east side town!!!

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo said, "That doesn't make the PLC business unfriendly-- just cognizant that there are other considerations to take into account in running a city."

That is what the PLC groupies don't understand. It is not the commissioners' job to "run a city." It is their job to run "city government." Now it appears the PLC are not successful at doing either one.

Strike three for the PLC.

staff04 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm really sad to hear that Wal-Mart won out on this one. I just don't see that there was any need for it. Wal-Mart will just continue to destroy local midwestern economies, I guess.

runningscooter 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm really sad to see the post regarding those that live in West Lawrence. Yes, there there may be more money, but it doesn't mean that all on the West side don't care about Lawrence. They care about their neighborhoods and the safety of their kids who will now have to be negotiating through busier streets. It scares me to think about how bad the traffic will become now with new drivers coming and going from FSHS. I moved to Lawrence for the diversity in its population and am proud of each and every neighborhood for what it contributes.

drctrlr 8 years, 12 months ago

I'm anti-entitlement, so this is good news. All US factory workers who thought having a job was something they were entitled to are being rudely awakened everyday, thanks in no small part to Wal-Mart-ization. Maybe some of the former plant workers can find jobs as greeters.

afred 8 years, 12 months ago

I hope there are protests. I will be in the picket line. How democratic was this decision? Should not the community members have the say of what constitutes their community? If the law does not allow for this, then the law should be changed. It really ticks me off when people say we live in a democracy, because we really don't at all. Not on any level of government. Voting every couple of years on a few individuals to make decisions for you is not a democracy. I'm sorry.

But what really chaffes my huevos is how greed has completely assasinated common sense in this case. The bottom line is that we just plain DON'T NEED ANOTHER FREAKING WALMART!!!. No matter how you look at it. Set aside all of the other reasons, whatever they are.

  • Increased traffic problems
  • Lower property values
  • Taking away from local business
  • Contributing to poor work conditions overseas
  • Making the US more dependent on a foreign workforce

No matter how much weight you assign to any of these reasons, you cannot ignore how irrational it is to have another WalMart. The only benefits that I can see are these:

  • WalMart makes more money
  • The average Lawrence WalMart shopper will be no more than ten minutes away from a WalMart while in Lawrence (i guess a maximum of twenty minutes is too long for some)

If anyone in this down would sit down and make a well thought-out decision matrix, I'm guessing that they would come to the conclusion that building another one is entirely unecessary considering the costs.

Yes, I hope there will be protests. Not becuase I have beef with WalMart really. I don't mind that the current WalMart exists. But I do have beef with WalMart's greed. And I have beef with a complete lack of common sense. And I have beef with laws that cater to businesses before individuals (from the US or not). All this beef creates a giant turd-burger that I am tired of chewing on.

In my mind, the idea of capitalism is not to make as much money as possible, but rather to make as much money to satisfy your needs, while doing your part to contribute to a healthy capitalist society that is FAIR TO EVERYONE.

just_another_bozo_on_the_bus makes a good point about the oil market, which is anything but stable at this point. WalMart, will inevitably see some times that are not nearly as profitable as they currently are. Then what? To what extent do you think the WalMart corporation will be held accountable to the community if and when things go south?

topekan7 8 years, 12 months ago

Woo hoo! Lawrence takes a huge leap into the 21st century. How does it feel to finally emerge from the stone age??? By the way...all these negative comments...why didn't you volunteer to pay more taxes on your property to make up for all the taxes that would have been lost had Wal-Mart been denied the right build a store on this property? Think of the benefits this tax revenue will have on city social services. Think of the benefits of having more jobs for entry-level workers. Think of the benefits of lower prices at Dillons and Hy-Vee. Think of the benefits to the poorest among you.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Godot said,

"It is not the commissioners' job to "run a city.""

You're playing semantics-- the expression "run the city" usually does mean "run the city government," and it's certainly how I intended it.

But I'm curious-- if you really believe so, why do you favor returning control of the city commission to narrow business interests who really do want to use it to "run the city," in the broadest sense, for fun and huge private profits?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

So are you doing a Nixon with your enemies list, Marion?

What sort of actions do you expect? Slashed tires, harrassing phone calls, summary execution?

Will you do it all by yourself, or will you gather you posse (comiatatus?)

jfgibson 8 years, 12 months ago

It's funny how I was reading on the message boards how overpriced property is in Lawrence just a week ago. Now everyone is upset that Wal mart is going to lower property values. The bottom line is that another Walmart is going to be built in Lawrence. If you don't like it shop somewhere else.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

If I do, tell the driver to wait up, ok AE? And save me a seat.

jfgibson 8 years, 12 months ago

I agree with the fact that there are not enough "real jobs" in lawrence. I drive from Lawrence to Overland Park everyday. A crazy one hour commute one way to collect my paycheck that I could never get with any job in Lawrence.

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

And thus Lawrence continues its march toward mediocrity. Another WalMart - yipeeee. Now all the northwestern Lawrence residents can exult in the splendor of a Walmart without having to undergo the hassle of driving 10 minutes to the southern edge of town. What progress!!! A dingy environment with dingy customers buying shoddy merchandise.

For all those crowing about all the new tax revenue, get real. Many of us are old enough to remember when the first Walmart cell appeared in town & then the (at the time) new Super Walmart down south of town. Has whatever tax revenue generated by those locations outweighed the costs & hassle that they have created. I suppose that is a question each individual must answer. To me the answer is clearly "no."

But there is little to argue about now. Development will stretch from 6th & Wakarusa all the way to the bypass soon enough and then, no doubt, it will leapfrog the bypass and march unabated to Topuka. Lawrence was once a nice, mid-sized & unique midwestern town. It is none of those things any longer and is much the worse for the so-called "progress" that the developers, speculators, and bland big box corporate enterprises have visited upon us.

topekan7 8 years, 12 months ago

The greater the competition for a skilled work force, the higher the wages. Wal-Mart entering the market with a second SuperCenter in Lawrence will raise the entry-level salaries for all these jobs across the city. Again, the benefits will come to the poorest citizens in your community. Kudos to them! The fact that Lawrence lacks "real jobs" is a separate issue. Having another Wal-Mart does not affect that in any way whatsoever.

Jake Esau 8 years, 12 months ago

This is why I shop at Target and not Wal-Mart. The huge discount stores belong on the south side of town, not at 6th and Wakarusa. Hopefully all the west lawrence residents who get groceries at the Dillons at 6th and Wakarusa or the Hy-Vee at Monterey way and 6th will continue to go there instead of going to Wal-Mart.

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

Even if you accept the findings of the study, that's just the bottom line, fiscal consideration. There are all kinds of social, environmental, and day to day quality of life issues that have to be weighed, as well. Come to your own conclusion, by all means. But my opinion is set. Lawrence was a far better, nicer, more interesting place 10 to 15 years ago before all this cancerous growth around the edges of the place.

lunacydetector 8 years, 12 months ago

I wonder what the rallying cry will be for the Progressives come next election now that they have completely come out the losers on this lawsuit.

after 3 years, business finally gets done in lawrence.

just another example of doing business in lawrence.

lawrence, ks business UNfriendly

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

"lawrence, ks business UNfriendly"

You say that like its a bad thing. Look at "business friendly" Johnson County, or any of the other faceless, bland, nondescript holes across the suburban strips of America and the bland, nondescript fools that live in them. Who would want to live in that sort of environment. Lawrence used to be the antithesis of such places, but, I admit, is being rapidly converted.

Anyway if you want to live in a more business friendly environment, why try to change the weirdos of Lawrence. Makes no sense to me.

monkeyspunk 8 years, 12 months ago

I am very curious why people blame Wal-Mart for problems caused by our trade relations with countries in Asia?

Trade policy allows Wal-Mart to act the way it does. You don't like Wal-Mart? Quit voting for people that have their lips firmly planted on Red China's rear end.

China constantly takes advantage of trade agreements, manipulating their currency and using the fact that they are not a free market to unfairly compete. Yet us, as Americans, continue to put people in office that have no problem with this arrangement. Donkey and Pachiderm alike, love that cheap Chinese loot.

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

"Ah, yes. Another of the "put it in a glass bottle and seal it up" people.

Hint: There is no such thing as the status quo. You're either going forward (growth) or you're going backwards (your idea)."

No, you have it mixed up. Everything changes across time, but constant growth is not the ideal. And explosive and burdensome growth is a bad thing. If you read my prior posts that is my point. It is the explosive, exploitive development of the last 5 years or so that I find objectionable. I am not arguing putting Lawrence in a bottle. But I am saying, keep control of the growth so that we retain more of what makes this place special, rather than turning it in to the sort of place most people hate.

stlcards515 8 years, 12 months ago

It's good that part of the deal is to keep it to the highest physical appearance. Because most wal-marts look dirty on the outside. Look at what wal-mart used to look like. Gray and light green. It looked bad, now it's brick, it look better.

I live on the west side and I don't want it over here. Not because of the traffic and the fact its next to FS and all that. But because it could be in a much better place. Like someone said, why not east lawrence. The people on the west side of the town generally have high incomes than the people on the east side, and that's just a fact. No offense to anyone there. Fox Fire, The Reserve, and sorta Fall Creek. In east lawrence it would simply be put to better use.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

stlcards515, I can't believe you wrote that. But, you did, and there it is: Lawrence is still Snob Hill, at least on the West Side.

Charles L Bloss Jr 8 years, 12 months ago

I like Wal-Mart , but they don't "always" have the lowest prices. Thank you, Lynn

monkeyhawk 8 years, 12 months ago

This kind of reminds me of Tiananmen Square, with the "city fathers and mother" planted firmly in front of the tank. The outcome is a bit different, though.

This Walmart hatred is spurred by politics. That party which relies on keeping folks down and in need of the government's assistance to be able to make it through life rely heavily on union votes. Walmart is not union, therefore evil. Take away all the Walmarts and what do you have? What will the slaves in China do to feed their families and pay for the electricity they need to power the color tv that their parents never had? All made possible by Walmart.

Side note: I was at Walmart yesterday and noticed that the T was parked at the recycling center. Is that a regular stop? If so, all you greenies can take Betty Lou on a bus trip date to dump your cans and plastic.

dex 8 years, 12 months ago

reality_check: i think it's funny that you resort to defining your "uniqueness" by contrasting your hip self against those boring folk who live in the suburbs. so who's the bore, really?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

I take it you prefer the highly effective, self-serving, corrupt snobs, such as those who own 6Wacky.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Are you also the King of France, in addition to Mr. Stupid, Marion?

Tony Kisner 8 years, 12 months ago

Reality classic. "I am so accepting of other, I don't stereotype like others. Therefore I am better than others." You are what you say you despise.

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

Thanks, Reality Check, you nailed the thought and feeling about all these alien zombies that are overrunning the West side. And there is nothing effete or snobbish about the comments.

The problem is, they are not happy keeping their blandness to themselves. You see evidence of that throughout these posts. No, Lawrence must be turned in to some corporate, middle manager's wet dream of suburban drabness. We must be business friendly, we must grow at all cost and constantly, world without end, etc... And soon enough, they outnumber the pitiful few folks that helped to make Lawrence the attractive destination it once was.

These "people" are like a mangy flock of sick pigeons. Flying somewhere new in a group and then soiling everything where they live. What we need to do is scare the flock now and again and hope that they take off somewhere else. How about Honk For Hemp out on the west side. How about some more thumpity thump in the middle of the night as some of the wrong element roll through the manicured subdivisions. You get the picture. Get the pigeons moving along & soon enough all droppings (strip malls, walmarts, Starbucks, etc...) go away too.

Just a thought.

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

Okay this is unbelievable. I am slack jawed.

Marion- get off your high horse. You did nothing here. You personally have no victory. Stop posting names of contributors as if you are going to start some sort of witch hunt. You are a fool. If anything and I mean ANYTHING happens to anyone on that list the Lawrence PD will easily be able to trace this hit list back to you. Jeeze, what are you 12?

Truthlawrence- They "done" didn't spend millions on this. They spent $100k. And it would have been worth it if it would have kept another Wal-Mart abscess out of Lawrence.

And to the rest of you mocking birds...

http://walmartwatch.com/

http://www.henryholt.com/holt/nickelanddimed.htm great chapters where she worked at wal-mart

http://www.walmartmovie.com/

http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/77/walmart.html

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/walmart/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23725-2004Nov30.html

Will you please read something besides Sam Walton's book. (I'm lookin' at you aricular_eyes)

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

My opposition to WalMart has nothing to do with price points available...it has everything to do with the unethical business practices WalMart repeatedly, and deliberately CHOOSES to indulge in. Their very 'attitude' is a blemish to a community such as Lawrence that tries to make decisions that help sustain our small town atmosphere. WalMart simply doesn't care. About anything but making $$$$$$. If people who helped them achieve their bottom line REALLY understood the degree to which WalMart is committed to ANY given community...they would RUN, not walk, to the nearest Target, KMart, Dollar General, or any other store that might offer the same merchandise -- and, surprise! -- yes! often at a LOWER PRICE POINT THAN wally's ....

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

Has everyone forgotten that this eyesore will also be infecting Lawrence?

http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2006/jan/11/new_urbanism_project_approved/?city_local

It is sad. I have had friends for NY, LA, SF, Pheonix and other places come to visit and they are always amazed at Lawrence. It is so different. They go crazy for the down town area. It is like nothing most of them have ever seen before. I am glad that they got to see it when they did because I fear that it's days are numbered.

Maybe we just call ourselves Topeka City now?

Ugh.

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

scott3460--

So do you suggest Lawrence frantically build walls and a moat around the city to stop growth and preserve your imagined utopia? Come back to reality! Lawrence is a desirable place to live, so people move here and things need to be built. It will become an even more desirable place to live now that the downfall of Boog & Co. has began....now some real progress can be made.

Like someone else said, if you don't want change and want to live in a quiet place without the "west side alien zombies", move to McLouth or Oskaloosa. But with that snobbish attitude that you and reality_check present, they probably wouldn't want you there.

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

Jay_Z- put a cork in it. West Lawrence is the suburbs of Lawrence. It just is. It was built more recently. All of the houses look the same. Heck it is even getting it own McDownTown. (see my previous post) Thems the facts man. Can't help it if you don't like it.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

The initial approval of this particular development project, in direct violation of various existing zoning documents, with one of the key partners being a former city commissioner who should know better, would be exhibit A.

bonzo 8 years, 12 months ago

Maybe now we can get on with the SLT that was voted in by the majority oh so many years ago

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

But you are the one who labelled them "enemies," Marion.

Still waiting to hear what you and your posse comiatatus are going to do with your enemies list.

princess 8 years, 12 months ago

I am aware of public record you old coot. Your use of it is what is in question. And you know it.

leechynut 8 years, 12 months ago

The only thing cheap about Wal-Mart are the products. I could go on and on about how evil Wal-Mart is and about how they care nothing about their customers or their vendors or even their employees for that matter; especially their female employees. The new Hell Hole will be close to my residence and believe me I will NOT shop there.

I'm not opposed to Wal-Mart being built over here because I'm a "snob." I just don't want a company who thrives on sexism, racism, and slavery to be a part of my community or ANY community. I could do without both of the Wal-Marts in town.

Monkeyhawk...Do you know that they pay the WOMEN less than 1 dollar a DAY to slave and make some of their "great" products and that they make the women stay within the facility so that they can work all day, AND they make them pay to stay there? I guarantee if your workplace decided to treat you that way, you would not be greatful and you would not be supportive of your company. How can you defend Wal-Mart? They haven't done anything to be proud of other than make tons of money by cheating people.

Tony Kisner 8 years, 12 months ago

OK - Topekan7 - what a tool. Anyone who lives in Topeka with that backwards city government has no room to throw stones.

You guys killed your downtown years ago. Wow what a lovely drive Wanamaker is. Truly Topeka is a model city.

I can hear your local City leaders, Wow that Wanamaker really turned into a pit, what if we build something over by the Governor's place. It needs a little blight. Like South Topeka Ave., Downtown, North Topeka,

The best businesses in Topeka are strip joints, liquor stores, check cashing joints, and on Sunday of course Church.

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Princess--

Sorry, I didn't know it was a FACT that west Lawrence is the suburbs of Lawrence. So do the Lawrence city limits end at Iowa Street? At Kasold? Kinda interesting there are suburbs within the Lawrence city limits!! I'll let everyone know that you are the authority on drawing out the city limits. West Lawrence ain't good enough for you, huh? A bit snobby for my liking--don't put your nose up too high!!

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

Jay Z:

Moving away is hardly the solution. You don't seem to get my point, so I'll boil it down for you.

No moats, but the overwhelming crowds are destroying the reason I loved Lawrence. Quit tripping all overourselves making sprawl easy. Make it HARD to ruin what makes Lawrence great. That's what Boog (a good guy, btw, atleast he seemed to be when he and I attended KU together,) Schauner, etc were trying to do. The pro-growth crowd and the pro-business, big growth at any cost ultimately gives you a place like Wanamaker Road or Metcalf in JC. Horrible, horrible, cancerous blights.

Sorry, this forums available & I will express views. If you don't like it, tough......

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

Hey Pilgrim, what goes around...comes around.... Can you say "Sleep with one eye open?"

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Monkeyhawk wrote: "Side note: I was at Walmart yesterday and noticed that the T was parked at the recycling center. Is that a regular stop? If so, all you greenies can take Betty Lou on a bus trip date to dump your cans and plastic."

ROTFLMAO!!!!!

Scott Drummond 8 years, 12 months ago

Hey, Marion, all those contributions sure look like a pretty solid base of support. And isn't it far more admirable to get 100 $20 contributions, rather than being the tool of a well-connected developer who gives you a thousand, but expects you to perform such sleazy acts?

leechynut 8 years, 12 months ago

Pilgrim-

Give me a break. Of course it's not in this country. People like you are what's wrong with this world and the global economy. If you think that's a fair trade, then that 's what you believe and I respect that. Regardless of the fact that it's other countries, those people are not living well and are not getting by on those wages.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

To sltcards515, please accept my apologies. At least you were delicate in your expression of snobbery. The entrenched snobs of Lawrence, those aggressive ones in central Lawrence, with jobs on the hill, retain claim to the crown of Lawrence elitism.

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

Hey Pilgrim, does the phrase "Big Fish, Small Pond" ring a bell?

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

Hey Pilgrim, you speak as though you've had this problem before? Awwwwwww.....

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Pilgrim, I'd be surprised if Mr. Bozo had any facts....he can't provide any!!

Jay_Z 8 years, 12 months ago

Howard--have a drink man, relax. Or are you already blasted out of your mind--good happy hour?

brady 8 years, 12 months ago

monkeyhawk said:

"Take away all the Walmarts and what do you have? What will the slaves in China do to feed their families and pay for the electricity they need to power the color tv that their parents never had? All made possible by Walmart."

Take away all the Walmarts and replace them with a business that respects human rights and does not treat humans as mere cogs in a money making machine and what do you get? Chinese with dignity and humanity watching the color TV their parents gave them.

THERE ARE OTHER WAYS to achieve economic growth... ways that respect human rights and treat people with dignity. It's appalling that so many people here are so short-sighted, so selfish, that you cannot see the human consequenses of our "free" trade economic system. Granted Wal-mart has become the poster child for this diminutive and abusive system... thus the unbalanced focus on it. But the problem goes much much deeper than just Wal-mart. Does it reall HAVE to be like this? No, it does not. We can achieve substantial and sustainable healthy growth and development without repugnance. THAT, my friends, would be progress.

beatrice 8 years, 12 months ago

"I have no facts to back that up ..." followed by name-calling. Brilliant.

I think that just about sums up the tenor of today's conversation here.

My 2 inflammatory cents: I hope all the people who have their jobs out-sourced to China appreciate the low, low prices coming their way from their good, good friends at Wal-Mart. Now, here is some wood, instructions, and nails. Have fun building your own coffin.

Curtis Lange 8 years, 12 months ago

LMAO. I called this back in 03 when this was just starting. Wal-Mart WILL build a store where they want to build a store. Case in point.

Michael Birch 8 years, 12 months ago

Well, I suppose the Walmart Superstore was

inevitable! Lets just be glad that it is going to be

located out near the city limit. Hopefully, this will set a

trend for future developments. In particular, the

building of more apartment complexes! If more

apartment complexes are going to be built, they will

have to be built in the county. We simply don't have

room for any more of them in town. If the zoning laws

need to be updated, well then lets update them to

accomodate future developments. Lets try to

remember one thing, its not always what you do, its

how you do it that counts. One more thing to

remember is simply that more businesses will mean

more jobs for the citizens of Lawrence! Lets try and look at the

positive side for once people.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

And I always thought it was, "All, all outs in free!"

That often was embellished to become: "Alllleeee, alllleeee, outs in freeeeeeeee!'

And then all who had not already been found by "it" in their hiding places would dash to home place, trying to evade the "it" person. The one who was caught became the next "it."

Long time ago.

Kids probably aren't allowed to play that game now.

LawrenceBoy 8 years, 12 months ago

Wow. What a disappointment. No, not the fact that Walmart is going in at 6th and Wakarusa. Rather, it's so disappointing to see that people are so easily divided, and so eager to verbally cut each others throats. When we read this kind of venim over a Walmart, it's easier to accept that a hurricane could push the city of New Orleans to the brink of anarchy. Wow. God help us.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Marion, complete the circle. List the contributors to all the comissioners' campaigns. Go one step further and list, by name, all their recipients, and amount of contribution. My prediction is that there will be many instances of cross-over. Politically active citizens often hedge their bets. Your list will have to be changed from ,"know your enemies" to "know who is purchasing influence."

Richard Heckler 8 years, 12 months ago

"When you make it your lifes work to defend Wal-Mart....

.....You have completely lost your mind and your soul."

Someone 2006

egypt 8 years, 12 months ago

I think Lawrence has a big enough Walmart, and you dont really need two Walmarts in a town that size. Target is pretty comparable and there stuff actully works and holds together, I will continue to shop at Target. I got a pan set from walmart, and after I heated them up the handels fell off, then I bought jumper cables that didnt work (2 diffrent sets). Thanks Walmart

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

You know, Walmart could have built an 80,000 sq. ft. store, without any concessions to the city, any time they wanted. They spent a sh*tload of money for twenty thousand sq. ft. of floor space.

DaREEKKU 8 years, 12 months ago

Wal-Mart....your source for cheap plastic crap...

Gareth Skarka 8 years, 12 months ago

I think that somebody has a massive overcompensation complex from being named "Marion."

Rebecca Valburg 8 years, 12 months ago

Funny how angry people are about a second Wal-Mart going in, especially since this one will be quite a bit smaller than the Wal-Mart on Iowa was a year ago. We're okay with how many chain grocery stores, clothing stores, convenience stores, restaurants, etc, but oh God, life as we know it is over if a second Wal-Mart is going in. Shall we also drive Dillon's and HyVee out of town and force the entire population of Lawrence to shop at the Merc? Somehow I'm not thinking that 80,000+ people all shopping at one grocery store is going to be real pleasant, nor would the entire population of Lawrence shopping at one Wal-Mart and one Target be real pleasant in 10 years at the current growth rate (remember, the store getting approved doesn't mean it's going to magically be there when you drive by tomorrow). Wal-Mart only accounts for 8% of retail sales in America, so if you don't like the store, take your purchasing power elsewhere. Keep in mind, however, that if you buy the exact same foreign-made items at Target or any other retailer, you're sending your dollars to support the exact same business that you're complaining about Wal-Mart for buying from.

dotteboy 8 years, 12 months ago

Wal-Mart is where white trash people go when they die.

Susan Mangan 8 years, 12 months ago

I really couldn't have cared less about another WalMart...until our City Commissioners decided they have the right to break laws to keep competition away. They would have been stomped in court and they knew it. To avoid an even bigger embarrassment (having to pay fines in addition to court costs next time), someone there finally had a lightbulb moment and realized it's cheaper (and "more legal") to settle.

The only thing I find really amusing now is that, because the City drug their feet and fought for so long, in a fight they were destined to lose, we will now have 2 HUGE WalMarts in town that people can complain about (after shopping there for something they needed at midnight). They could have done the ethical and legal thing to begin with and we would have one big WalMart at 6th and Wak and a relatively small one on Iowa. Now they're both going to be SuperCenters and the city has the exact opposite of what they tried to force.

Leave it to the Progressive "planners". LOL It just has to make you laugh :-)

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

"We can't have the PLC's real agenda coming into the light now, can we?"

Their "agenda" is no secret-- it's to represent a wider segment of the population than just those who would use city government to advance their petty greed. I know that's appalling to people like you who worship greed, but there it is.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

It's pretty simple-- the previous commission had already established that zoning regulations aren't worth the paper they are printed on in this particular project.

That meant that taking a settlement for a much smaller store, with the developers paying for improvements to the intersection, past legal expenses and other concessions, was preferable to going into court to close the pandora's box that Compton and his buddies on the previous commission had opened.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

What's curious is that Pilgrim embraces corruption in action, by not by name.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

"Oh, but I thought the $100K was worth it on principle."

Walmart, Compton, et al brought the suit, not the city. It's just plain twisted being angry at the city for defending itself and trying to clear the water of the pi** left by 6Wacky and their bought and paid for friends on the commission. It was worth the effort, since it did result in some significant concessions on store size and other considerations.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

I think the legislature needs to weigh in on the ethics, even the legality, of the practice of elected and appointed officials and government employees who post, anonymously, on public forums regarding policy issues about which they have knowledge due to their positions.

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

Me thinks a REAL reporter (ie, not like a gimme from the LJW) who isn't afraid of conflict should take a look at what has been said here between the lines and expose a Lawrencian, or two, for what really, really IS corrupt behavior -- admitted to.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

What a convoluted twist on the ad hominem attack, Godot. I take it that you are insinuating that I am a city employee or elected official, which I'm most emphatically not. But I also take it that you are conceding that what I have been saying has been accurate.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo, why did you think I was referring to you? And I have no way of knowing whether what you say is accurate or not. Sadly for me, all I know about this issue is what I read in the JWonline.

Escapee 8 years, 12 months ago

Oh come on boys, let's not be scaredy cats now....

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

hmmmm. Bozo omitted "appointed official" in hisher last post.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

The corruption has been fully exposed already, for those with their eyes open. And that's why the PLC swept the elections of 2003.

Godot seems to have accepted that, given that he's still impying that I'm some sort of government hack with loads of inside info, appointed or otherwise, which I am not.

When are you going to tire of playing ignorant, Pilgrim? Or is it really not an act?

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo: not implying anything. Just making sure you pay attention to detail.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Are you saying that you weren't referring to me, Godot? Or are you just saying that your post was totally irrelevant to the topic of this thread?

More likely you're just trying to change the subject because you know I'm right.

Pilgrim's gullible ignorance really isn't an act.

Rhoen 8 years, 12 months ago

Why would anyone think there would be any other outome. What the money wants, the money gets. So what?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

I guess it's just a matter of how you define corruption, Pilgrim.

I happen to believe that using political connections, especially those that are bought and paid for, for strictly personal financial gain, especially when it means overruling planning/zoning documents to do it, to be corruption.

Your worship of unbridled greed doesn't allow you to classify that as corruption, so I guess we just have no common vocubulary for describing this situation.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo wrote: "More likely you're just trying to change the subject because you know I'm right."

If you are ever right, I will acknowledge it. I just haven't been presented with the opportunity.

angstew 8 years, 12 months ago

ahhhhhh, i'm so tired of hearing all of you bashing each other. its so unproductive. all the name calling is ridiculous. why does it all have to be about the "right" or "left"? you all like to call each other elitists when you are being elitists yourselves. not one of you is better than the other. i'm tired of the hypocracy you all have instilled here.

i used to work for walmart and hated every moment of it, so what did i do? i quit. if you don't want to support walmart, then don't. that simple. if your so worried about walmart hurting our local economy, then i suggest you start shopping locally. yes, it is more expensive. yes, there are not as many options, but its very rewarding knowing you are supporting your mom and pop stores and keeping our money in lawrence. its a choice, so choose. want to support walmart? fine. probably not the wisest decision, but then again that is MY opinion.

as for the people who say that downtown is all snobs, i disagree. yes, we have our little elitist hipsters, but not everyone is like that. i have found that most of the "townies" and workers downtown are some of the kindest people i have met. i feel a real sense of community downtown and i don't really feel that anywhere else. i think that the people who call "townies" snobs (or anyone for that matter) should take a long look in the mirror and ask yourself if its you who's really the snob.

what lawrence needs is a little bit more community. this whole east vs. west (or left vs. right) isn't going to solve anything. everyone means well, we just all have different perspectives.

and no i'm not a hippie, i just think this whole lashing at each other is unproductive.

grow up people.

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Nice segway into the Chamber of Commerce's "shop at home" campaign that kicks off tomorrow!

Godot 8 years, 12 months ago

Bozo seems to have a grasp of the obscure details of the workings of the city council that only an insider would have. Or maybe Bozo simply has an amazingly fertile imagination. I wonder which it is.

Da-da!

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

This answer is pretty obvious to anyone with the slightest knowledge of how the legal system works, Pilgrim. But you seem to be really fond of your ignorance, so I won't bore everyone else with the Idiot's Guide to Civil Law that you are asking for.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Funny, OTTR, it's the westsiders in the NW part of the city who oppose this new Walmart the most vehemently.

Do you suppose they secretly want to live on the east side?

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 8 years, 12 months ago

Do only trashy people choose to live on the east side, OTTR, or does moving there have some mysterious effect that turns someone into trash?

And where is the trash line? Is it Iowa, Tennessee, Mass? Does crossing that line have any inherent risks for the chosen people who live to the west of that line?

Is there any chance for redemption for trashy people? If I move west of the line, will I become one of the beautiful people like you?

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