Archive for Thursday, April 20, 2006

Muslim students battle prejudice

I’ve never done anything to anybody’

April 20, 2006

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It was just two days ago that Kansas University student Bazigha Tufail was taunted for being Muslim.

Tufail, 20, stopped at a food court on campus for a bite when she casually made eye contact with a young man. Tufail wore a headscarf as she does wherever she goes.

As the man walked by, he muttered in her direction, "Bombs away."

The words stung. They gave her pause and left a lingering sadness.

"I've never done anything to anybody," she said. "I'm like, 'why?' ... There's no way to counter that ignorance."

KU's Muslim Student Assn. is hosting Islam Awareness Week through Friday to better students' understanding of Muslims and Islam. The aim is to correct stereotypes and encourage tolerance.

"We want to present ourselves as who we are, to educate people," said Fadlullah Firman, a KU student who helped organize the events.

A lecture on women in Islam is planned for tonight. On Friday, students can participate in "A Day in the Life of a Muslim," spending a day with a Muslim student and observing the religion firsthand.

Those who spend the day with a Muslim student may not see too many differences from the lives of those outside the religion, some said.

Tufail, an architectural engineering student, reads novels in English, loves the book "Pride and Prejudice" and spends a lot of time studying. She's planning for a trip to Japan this summer through the Kansas/Asia Scholars program.

"There's nothing I do that's different, really, except for prayers," Tufail said, of the five times per day she prays.



Islam awareness week

¢ "Women in Islam," a discussion, at 7:30 p.m. today, in Parlors A, B, C on the fifth floor of the Kansas Union. ¢ "A Day in the Life of a Muslim," non-Muslim students can shadow Muslim students for the day, Friday. ¢ For more information, visit www.msaku.com.

Tufail grew up in Kansas City, the youngest child to parents from Pakistan. Her parents weren't very religious, Tufail said, until they had children and learned it was up to them to pass their religion on to their children.

Tufail attended the Islamic School of Greater Kansas City for middle school and began wearing hijabs, or head scarves, at 14.

There is no doubt that her religion affects her life and how some perceive her.

Tufail recalled attending Lee's Summit High School in the days and weeks following the 9-11 attacks. Tufail's family feared how students would react to her at school, as Muslims were targeted in many places.

A friend walked Tufail to and from classes. But some still got to her with their hateful words, she said. They called her names and used racial slurs.

Tufail kept her routine as normal as possible. She didn't skip school. She faced the ridicule.

"I have to live my life," she said.

She wrote an article for the student newspaper. She told the students how it felt to be in her shoes and she explained how the terrorists' actions weren't condoned by Islam.

"It was my way of setting the record straight," she said.

The issues at school wouldn't be her last. Tufail said some people automatically think she can't speak English. They talk loudly and slowly to her.

Tufail wears the hijab because it is part of her religion. She is faithful to Islam because it brings a sense of purpose to her life, she said.

"I know I stand out," she said. "I get looks ... I'm just practicing my faith. I'm just like any other person."

Comments

Richard Heckler 11 years, 1 month ago

When a President utters phrases such as "axis of evil" is it any wonder? One fact remains with me is the people of the world are no different than the 99.9% of americans in that no one wants war.

When we have heads of state who spew lies and call others evil as grounds for war, that is unacceptble behavior and those individuals should step down or be removed from office. Are the people of the mideast unhappy with americans in general...NO. Do I believe they may harbor ill feelings towards our heads of state...you bet. Is it the fault of the mideast population that americans are addicted to THEIR oil? Should the oil industry and certain heads of state be using the military to guarantee access to THEIR oil? Absolutely not.

Introducing the study of other cultures into our public education system at the elementary level might help.

cowboy 11 years, 1 month ago

Until Muslims begin to live in at least the recent centuries they will be looked upon with a variety of negative opinions. The repression of women , well documented racist practices, and the disruption of the world with violence will keep them in disrepute.

Im always surprised meeting them here in Lawrence where they think every american is going to steal thier wives from the front porch so they keep them hidden in thier homes. Its a sad little world.

Janis Pool 11 years, 1 month ago

Well, Merrill, I agree with you. It is thru our "chosen" leadership, and our press, that we learn about current foriegn policy. Including the sick notion that all Muslims hate "us". Their government chooses to allow the press to voice the picture of hate. Our government chooses to react back in like style. (Or is it the other way around?) And the ignorant learn from them. Case in point-Conservativeman.

neopolss 11 years, 1 month ago

Cowboy, that attitude exists among many religions here in the states, including Christians & Mormons to name a few. One look at the Phelps compound should tell you that not every common American believes that our modern society is the right way to go. If you think about it, the very term conservative conflicts with the ideals they are fighting. Conservative by nature resists change in order to preserve tradition.

trinity 11 years, 1 month ago

oh for God's sweet sake, quit blaming the average joe/jane in society's lack of manners and their effin' p-poor attitudes on the GOVERNMENT!!! yeah granted the powers that be could definitely take a different tack instead of citing everything they don't like as "evil"; but here you have everyday ordinary people, raising kids and associating in a narrow minded prejudiced environment. and they don't give a WHIT about what the prez or anybody else is saying let alone those attitudes!!!!

nope i'm afraid that the horrid prejudice this Islamic gal is shown is bred right in people's homes, NOT in washington d.c. each parent/family/person has the ability to stop being so damn bullheaded and bigoted-but they won't.

cowboy 11 years, 1 month ago

neoplos , youre not far off there , I was wondering how a cult would be perceived here if they adopted the same customs and beleifs as the muslims , I'll say Saudi's to be more specific. Kind of like polygamists meet the supremacist movement. One curious thing to note is while the women are oppressed the men are out all the time in western attire. When you look at how it is male dominated it is understandable that you have to have a strong hand when you are a repression based culture.

blessed3x 11 years, 1 month ago

""I've never done anything to anybody," she said. "I'm like, 'why?' ..."

You're not alone, miss, I often wonder why factions of your religion want to kill me and my fellow American citizens. I have done nothing against them.

I'm very sorry you must feel this way. Just be glad it's only rude comments. Were I to travel to your country of origin I would probably be be-headed and my burning body left hanging from a bridge.

I'm not saying these things to be hurtful, but rather truthful. I truly am sorry that this poor woman must go through this, but to some degree it must be expected. The muslim factions that desire us dead don't wear team jersey's decrying their "side" and are very vocal of their desire to wipe non-Muslims from the face of the earth.

geekin_topekan 11 years, 1 month ago

KILLER BEES and MUSLIMS? aaaahhhh!!!! iT NEVER ENDS!!!

monkeyhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

Welcome to life in America, Ms. Tufail. Oh, wait a minute, you grew up in America. You surely must know what life is like here, unless you have been locked up. If you weren't wearing a headscarf, chances are you would be ridiculed for something else. Most people have suffered discrimination at one time or other in their lives. You are not in a special class.

paladin 11 years, 1 month ago

I imagine there were many parallel rationales and arguments regarding Native Americans when the invading White Man sought to take their resources away from them.

ksmattfish 11 years, 1 month ago

So, Marion, you don't think it would take about 5 min to come up with similar hate from the Christian bible?

Exodus 32:27-28 "[Moses] he said to them, "The Lord God of Israel commands every one of you to put on his sword and go through the camp from this gate to the other and kill his brothers, his friends and his neighbours. The Levites obeyed and killed about 3000 Men that day.

Exodus 32:29 "Moses said to the Levites, "Today you have consecrated yourselves as priests in the service of the Lord by killing your sons and brothers, so the Lord has given you his blessing.""

Matthew 10:34-36 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law (sic) against her mother in law(sic). And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."

Numbers 31:17 (Moses) "Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him (in other words: women that might be pregnant)."

Deuteronomy 7:1 "When Yahweh your god has settled you in the land you're about to occupy, and driven out many infidels before you...you're to cut them down and exterminate them. You're to make no compromise with them or show them any mercy."

1Samuel 15:1-8 "Now listen to what the Lord Almighty says. He is going to punish the people of Amalek because their ancestors opposed the Israelites... 3-8 : With 210000 soldiers they killed all the men, women, children, babies, cattle, camels and donkeys."

Leviticus 25:44-46 (Take non-Christians as slaves) "Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids. Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession. And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour."

Leviticus 25:48-53 "After that he is sold he may be redeemed again; one of his brethren may redeem him: Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him, or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him; or if he be able, he may redeem himself. And he shall reckon with him that bought him from the year that he was sold to him unto the year of jubilee: and the price of his sale shall be according unto the number of years, according to the time of an hired servant shall it be with him."

All religions have their share of the hate in this world. If people would worry less about the invisible men in th sky, and more about feeding their children, the world would be a better place.

craigers 11 years, 1 month ago

That does suck that this girl has gone through this type of thing but then again it sucks when fat kids are made fun of, or smart kids, among man other things as monkeyhawk has mentioned. I'm not belittling what this girl has gone through and continues to but parents don't even teach their kids to be nice to people that look exactly like them so how can we expect them to respect all other cultures? Trinity I completly agree that parents should teach their kids respect for all, no matter if I agree with their ideas or not.

trinity 11 years, 1 month ago

THANK you craigers, that's what i was trying to say only i was so damn frosted i couldn't; "parents should teach their kids respect for all, no matter if I agree with their ideas or not." this is such a simple concept! sheeesh.

paladin 11 years, 1 month ago

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geekin_topekan 11 years, 1 month ago

Posted by Marion (Marion Lynn) on April 20, 2006 at 8:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)

ksmattfish:

I am not a Christian or a Muslim and don't care for either of them.

Thanks.

Marion.


Then you must be a KILLER BEE!!

christie 11 years, 1 month ago

I'd like to see the Muslim Community march with huge signs saying "Death to Terror", "Death to Bin Laden".

Then most Americans might believe you.

Lose that Burka, you're in AMERICA now.

lamb 11 years, 1 month ago

If you take things out of context, you can probably find aggressive passages in a lot of books. I certainly cannot speak for the Muslim religion, but as for the bible - it is meant to be read as an entire book, not just snippets here and there. The bible's message is one of love, not hate.

justthefacts 11 years, 1 month ago

ksmattfish - please note that the Bible quotes you provide are (all but one) from the OLD Testament - which makes up some of the Koran and in general provides a history of the Jewish people and their laws. The one quote you provide from the NEW Testament does not say Christians should slay other people...It predicts the coming slaughter of Christians by their own families. If you want to find support for any position, you can pick and choose quotes to support that position. Just with anything, taking things out of context provides a lop-sided view point. The Bible, as a whole, and in particular the New Testament teaches that Christians are known by their love and should forgive (not forget) the harm done to them.

I am very sorry this young woman is not being treated nicely by some people. Just as I am very sorry that some people of her faith feel it is their God given responsibilty to kill all Christians or Americans. Neither behavior is in keeping with the true tenets of Christianity - and runs counter to what I have heard about what the Muslim faith teaches.

But one type of conduct is "merely" un-kind and uncomfortable to endure ... while the other is mortally harmful.

Just goes to show that people who are looking to find excuses - reasons - to hate or maltreat others, will find their justification where ever they look.....

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

Fundamentalist islam and fundamentalist christianity are cut from the same bolt. Both deserve the scorn and disrespect of free-thinking, freedom-loving, rational people everywhere.

Criticize islam, and then turn your gaze to chrisitan fundies and where they want to take society. Hmmm.

Religious insanity is just that, whether it be from muslims or christians.

geekin_topekan 11 years, 1 month ago

she's from America dumb@22!! I wasn't aware that there was an official American uniform to be worn.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

You can take verses of the bible out of context to try and prove your point, but by and large it is muslims who riot over cartoons and hold up signs that say "Behead those who insult islam". You can hold up Fred Phelps and his band of crazies, but you don't hear about Christians sending their sons into fast food joints, blowing themselves up and killing 9 innocent people in the process, and then publicly celebrating about it. Seriously, take a step back and think about the bigger picture of islam before you make such comparisons.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 11 years, 1 month ago

assistant1234-- maybe if those muslims didn't live in countries with despotic governments, propped up by our government and the corporations who run it, they might react differently to insults from the west directed at them.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

yourworstnightmare: You need to take your ignorant, coddled, spoiled, moonbat behind over to the middle east for 6 months, or even just 6 days, and THEN tell me that islam and christianity are "cut from the same bolt". Anyone making even a cursory examination of the two religions could tell that your statement is completely ridiculous.

And I love how we are talking about an article where a muslim girl is experiencing prejudice when such prejudice against Christians is widely accepted and even lauded in Lawrence. Sickening.

just_another_bozo_on_this_bus 11 years, 1 month ago

I didn't see anywhere in this article where this muslim woman was demanding that we adopt her religious views as a matter of government policy.

"Christians" in this country do exactly that, and resistance to this imposition of a state religion is what you like to call "prejudice."

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

Actually, Agnostick, he said fundamentalists on his post at 9:11am, and I still disagree. It still doesn't change my point, or invalidate it. Stop nitpicking and come up with a real argument before you post, please.

I've never heard of Christians rioting over making Christianity the official state religion of the U.S. There is a difference between that and believing in a universal moral standard. Voting for politicians who agree with your eithics and morals is different than forcing your religous practices on another.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

Last I checked protesting and riots were two different things.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Merrill:

It seems to me that 9/11 has done more to shape western attitudes towards muslims than Bush's "Axis of Evil" statement. Besides... he wasn't referring to Islam when he said that, he was referring to terrorism. I think you are blaming way too much on "The Decider".

This is what happens when there is a war. We tend to create an overly-generalized image in our mind of who the enemy is, then we attack that image. My wife's grandfather fought in WWII (on the Lexington), and with pride. When he was drafted, he told them that the middle initial "A." was just an initial with no name attached to it. His middle name was actually Adolph. It was a shrewed move on his part. He knew what was in the hearts of men.

Kelly Powell 11 years, 1 month ago

All three of the crazy monotheistic desert religions should be outlawed for the sake of the entire world

I propose that from this point on KELLYISM should become a world religion.....It has one simple tenent ...every action should begin with the thought IS IT GOOD FOR KELLY? I guarantee it will make your life easier.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

Case in point: check out the muslim riots in France.

onceinawhile 11 years, 1 month ago

So many of you posters are completely uninformed about Islam. I suggest you take a class on it or read an UNBIASED book about it before you claim to know everything they stand for.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

No thanks, I know all I need to know about Islam from the actions of its followers: 3,000 dead in NYC, beheadings, rape rooms, suicide bombers, cartoon riots, public executions for adultery and homosexuality, etc.

onceinawhile 11 years, 1 month ago

assistant1234:

The riots were a result of the high unemployment and police harassment and brutality in the poorer sections of France, which is also heavily populated with Muslims. They are not inherently evil and violent because of those riots; they are simply mistreated and misunderstood in that country. To say "check out the Muslim riots" like they are just a bunch of animals that can't help but attack and be angry, then you are sadly missing the point.

onceinawhile 11 years, 1 month ago

Note: There IS such thing as Islam and extremist Islam, and unfortunately the only side you like to account for is the extremist Islam. Get to know the people that practice the religion and don't believe in violence at all. Have you even ever talked to a Muslim? I have gotten to know several this year and taken a class on Islam and can proudly say that they are wonderful people and are misunderstood because of what extremists are doing/preaching.

mom_of_three 11 years, 1 month ago

She shouldn't be treated differently because of her religion,heritage, clothing or the color of her skin. She hasn't done anything to anyone. It's racism, plain and simple.
I imagine Japanese Americans or German Americans were treated much in the same way during World War II era. It wasn't right then and it isn't right now.

Janet Lowther 11 years, 1 month ago

Christians and Moslems share a common problem called Triumphalism: The belief that their religion is the right religion for everyone everywhere everywhen.

Liberal Christians have distanced themselves from that part of their religion, as have some Moslem groups.

Unfortunately, there are influential segments in both groups who do not understand that you can not save souls at the point of a bayonet.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

When a Christian goes "over the edge", which I assume you mean something like murder, I think that since Christianity does not condone murder, that perhaps that person is not a Christian, and maybe IS crazy. When a muslim commits murder by suicide bombing, and their religion says "kill the infidels", I think that person is crazy, and has "religous anger" since they are following their religion.

Rationalanimal 11 years, 1 month ago

Welcome to the world of how every American is viewed and treated in virtually every country outside of the US. Sadly, the vogue practice of hating American's is now becoming part of American culture.

assistant1234 11 years, 1 month ago

You know I just want to point out that the some of the above posters and the media point out the few examples of "crazy Christians" (that may or may not be actual Christians) who commit acts of atrocity and expect us to believe they represent Christianity as a whole. But then they find the few examples of "moderate Muslims" (who may or may not be actually embracing all tenents of their religion) and they expect us to believe they represent the majority of muslims, despite the mountain of evidence to the contrary. Well I'm sorry, but I don't buy it.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

KsMattFish:

Most of your quotes lack a key contextual point: These are examples of GOD making specific commands to deal with specific peoples who He has judged to be worthy of extermination. This is not God sending them on a "Spanish Inquisition" style campaign to kill anyone who isn't exactly like them. Do your research and you will see that these are cultures who were into child sacrifice. As God explained somewhere (I don't have it here in front of me at work), God let the Isrealites stay in Egypt for all those years so that the sins of the people in Cannan would reach a point where they would be deserving of extermination. They were horrible people, and the killing of those peoples was GOD's decision, not the decision of a man. Scripture tells us that God said that he would have spared Sodom if he could have found ONE righteous person there. In fact, when God called for the destruction of Jerico, he spared the people who chose Him over the prevailing sinful culture. Rahab (who was a less than perfect person) and her family were spared. That is God's standard. He's not calling for general, indiscriminate killing of anyone who's simply guilty by association.

If the U.S. government can convict someone of a capital crime and send them to the gas chamber, can God have the same authority?

On this site I've read countless posts saying that a man who is found guilty of sex with a child should be given the death penalty. If an entire society EATS it's children, is that not worth the same (or worse) punishment? Any of you who said "kill the peodiphiles!" cannot complain about God's brand of justice against these peoples. History and scripture both tell us that these peoples were bad in ways that we cannot imagine.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Assistant:

You are giving us Christians too much credit. The Spanish Inquisition and the Crusades were not the actions of a few nutcases. Those were the actions of mainstream, organized "believers". We have our history, too.

In fact, it's easy to make the arguement that the prevailing culture in Islam today (the extremists, I mean) get their motivation from their knowledge of what "we" did to them FIRST during the Crusades. When they claim that we wish to kill them all, they have a historic reference to point to for that claim.

God doesn't need you to defend Him by defending Christians. God and Christ, and scripture, are always legitimate; even when their followers are not.

verity 11 years, 1 month ago

Northern Ireland---Protestant Christians and Catholic Christians killing each other.

Former Yugoslavia---Serbian Christians killing Bosnian Muslims.

Those are only two examples of many. Study your history. It goes both ways.

Christians from the West have gone to the Middle East for centuries, trying to control the region for God, for oil---however the current desire for power played itself out. We don't want outsiders invading us or trying to control our country, should we expect others to feel any differently?

Any attempt to figure out why people do certain things, be it insults or killing, apparently makes one a soft-headed liberal. But ignorance and spewing hate has never solved anything.

mom_of_three, you are so right and you put it so eloquently. Thank you. And I might add that wearing a head covering does not necessarily mean that a woman is subservient and oppressed. There are many Christians in the U.S., even some in our own community, that wear head coverings and some of them are the strongest women I have ever known.

Rationalanimal 11 years, 1 month ago

Here in America we say mean-spirited things; in Islamic countries they lop your head-off, or round up a couple dozen Isrealis during the Olympics and execute them, take your pick.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Now the gecko is weighing in. I'm going to step away from this thread for now.

jayhawks71 11 years, 1 month ago

Marion is a stubbornite, plain and simple.

jayhawks71 11 years, 1 month ago

auricular.... a MUSLIM is a follower of the religion Islam, on what basis did you determine her religion? Perhaps you meant Middle Eastern?

Isaythis 11 years, 1 month ago

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Confrontation 11 years, 1 month ago

"How can the died-in-the-wool feminist in this country (merrill a female-I don't know but the "color" of merrills' post lead me to believe so) who so proudly wave the feminist flag, exalt a religion who treat woman worse than most Americans treat their pets."

You are such an idiot! Islam encourages men to treat their women with great respect. Any mistreatment of muslim women is due to the local government, NOT the religion. Look at the psycho Christian men who beat their wives and claim it is based on their religion. Anyone can take their religion and twist it to meet their desires. There are a ton of Christian women who are subjected to violence here in the U.S. Get some education! It's really about men wanting to be in control, and they'll even use their religions to justify it.

Rationalanimal 11 years, 1 month ago

OK, Confrontation, America will start modeling the muslim men in how they treat women. You'd be getting spanked right now for having an opinion, assuming you have a man that can tolerate you. It is just beyond logic that any honest feminist would defend the muslim treatment of women. During the Serbian conflict, muslim women that were raped were banished and even stoned to death by their families. The same thing happened to the Kuwait women raped during Irag's first invasion. In Afganistan women were stoned for showing to much skin, and on and on.

Yes, women in America, a Christian nation have been smacked around regrettably, but women in America NOW enjoy more opportunity, freedom of voice, freedom to participate in politics, freedom to burn bras than any other country in the world. Some times when you get in the mode of complaining all the time, even after you get what you want, people stop listening to you. If you think women in muslim countries have it better I'm sure there's some Shiek somewhere willing to add you as one of his harem. American men are wearied by this incessant complaining that they suck.

Next time, let's be honest about reality instead of trying to fit reality within our point of view of the world.

kansas_prairieland 11 years, 1 month ago

Confrontation doesn't have any facts.

Flamethrowing posters never do.

Fatty_McButterpants 11 years, 1 month ago

Organized religion is responsible for most of the greatest atrocities in human history.

kansas_prairieland 11 years, 1 month ago

Confrontation, who are you, really?

I get the feeling that you go by some other name on this site.....and that "Confrontation" is just some sort of "alter-ego" of yours.

If I'm right about that....I doubt you'd admit it......but I just felt like asking, anyway.

StirrrThePot 11 years, 1 month ago

It is everyone's God-given right and freedom to be an ignorant jackass. Since we cannot get rid of these people (or even just give them a painful mental cleansing) without being arrested and convicted of mass murder (or assualt), we should just accept this unfortunate fact and move on.

One of the worst aspects of humanity is the inability to accept diversity. Different is bad, different is wrong, and everyone must be the same or they will be ridiculed (or worse). Sad, but true.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

Reasonable, moderate people everywhere must resist the advances of fundamentalist religion, whether that be islam or christianity.

We are not yet a theocratic fascist state like many islamic countries, but there are tendencies in this country, religiously-insane fundamentalist christian tendencies, to move the country toward theocratic fascism.

us_army_infantry_soldier 11 years, 1 month ago

First, out of all of these post how many of you are actually or have been to Iraq during this war? How many of you have seen your friends blown up or sniped at your feet? How many of you have seen any of this first hand? Probably not many of you so don't go around crying about it if it hasn't directly effected you or your family.

Secondly, most of you that have never been to Iraq do not have a single clue to whats going on. Until you have been there don't believe everything you seen in the News. Yes people are dieing and yes soldiers are being killed.. Thats war. And as a soldier I have accepted that possibility of it happening to me. However, to the comments that all muslims are extremists and terrorists and that the religion of Islam teaches evil and death to all christans and non-believers, you are entirely MISTAKEN! The extremists and terrorists of the Muslim world are extremely small in comparison to the vast population of Muslims. The extremists "take out of context"(as so many of you state) the Koran to kill innocent people including of their own.
Just as those so called christian terrorist that have attacked our country can not be viewed as an over-all personallity of the general popualce of Christians.

I have seen many things here in Iraq and I have met a lot of peole that I would not normally approach back home. And I can not wait to meet other Muslims in Lawrence now that I have a better understanding of their culture.

Thanks.

badger 11 years, 1 month ago

Y'know, we're guaranteed the freedom to pracice religion as we see fit in this country, which means that if a woman chooses to wear a headscarf because her religion says it's appropriate, that's no more 'wrong' than if a Christian woman insists on wearing skirts even when pants would be more convenient, because her religion and her religious advisors say it's inappropriate for a woman to dress 'immodestly' and thus skirts and dresses are the only appropriately modest attire - so she's out in ninety-degree heat moving construction supplies in a full-length skirt and long-sleeved blouse. Were I to point out that woman's oppression and ridicule her refusal to dress comfortably and sensibly for the task and weather, a lot of the people criticizing how Muslim women are treated would be up in arms.

Now, there's also the unwritten freedom (demonstrated by many posters here) to make an ass of oneself and make idiotic comments to others. So, all I can do is apologize to the vast majority of American Muslims, who are moderates, with the explanation, "Some people use the freedom of speech protected by the Constitution to be real morons."

What was said to this young woman is no different than if I walked up to a group of women standing outside a Baptist church and said, "Hey, guys, how's the clinic-bombing business these days? Killed any more doctors lately?" It's stupid, and judgmental, and ignorant, just like a whole lot of the people posting here today claiming that while the violent Muslims are representative of the 'true' Islam, the violent Christians are aberrations and don't represent Christianity at all.

I suggest that fundamentalist wingnuts who believe their god advocates murder are whackjobs no matter which god is telling them to kill people, and that right now, we're in a phase of active Muslim wingnuts, when as little as 10 and 20 years ago we were in a phase of active Christian wingnuts (Northern Ireland and Bosnia, anyone?). The pendulum will swing again, and perhaps it will be Confucianist wingnuts, or atheist wingnuts, 30 years from now.

I'm not anti-Muslim or anti-Christian. I'm anti-wingnut.

jfgibson 11 years, 1 month ago

I feel sorry for what this woman has gone through in her life. It's unfortunate that there are so many people in this town who are prejudice. She is an american and as an american she has a right to choose what to wear and what religion to practice. How would you feel if someone of a different race came up to you while you were taking your lunch break and said something demeaning to you. It's easy to point fingers and blame our president, our religous beliefs, etc. But it all comes down to treating others with respect. Last I checked it was still socially acceptable to treat others as you wish to be treated.

neopolss 11 years, 1 month ago

Posted by christie (anonymous) on April 20, 2006 at 8:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I'd like to see the Muslim Community march with huge signs saying "Death to Terror", "Death to Bin Laden".

Then most Americans might believe you.

Lose that Burka, you're in AMERICA now.

=========================================

I don't see you condemning the crusades. That's ancient history right? I suppose you could say they were bad, but then again history might not have the same outcome without them.

Perhaps signs that state, "Death to Pat Roberts." I think you'd find quite a few taking offense to it.

"Look, if we call them terrorists, then we don't have to follow the rules of war. YEAH!"

Last I checked, it was guerilla tactics, much like the Vietnamese used. I suppose they were terrorists too.

Terrorist - the best kitch word of the 2000s, and the worst.

Your last statement is among the most ignorant I have heard today.

neopolss 11 years, 1 month ago

Loony liberals and crazy conservatives deserve a place right next to extremist Christians and Muslims. None of these characters deserve to be heard, nor should we involve ourselves in their tug of war game. We get so caught up choosing sides, that we don't see the point to the exercise. It's all a diversion to keep us from focusing on REAL issues.

Last I checked, dressing a certain way does not mean submissive. I suppose there are plenty of Christians though who believe that a wife needs to "submit to her husband" or that he speaks for her. Yes, there are those who follow the doctrine to a T. If dress is a problem, try exploring more of Kansas. Mennonites definately have a dress code, as do the Amish.

Lastly, I alwasy get a chuckle when someone refers to quotes as "from the old testament." Yet, the old testaments quotes are freely given if it concerns say, gay marriage, or homosexuality. Just a matter of conveinance I guess. We pick and choose what parts we wish to follow.

Sandra Willis 11 years, 1 month ago

As a woman who has a 'sister' (who was an exchange student from Egypt - 1984) I have found all the trash spewed in the media against the Muslims totally pointless. No one knows them, or cares to understand them. I just feel sorry for all these people blindly doing whatever Mr. Bush wants. bodan

Kam_Fong_as_Chin_Ho 11 years, 1 month ago

Lastly, I alwasy get a chuckle when someone refers to quotes as "from the old testament." Yet, the old testaments quotes are freely given if it concerns say, gay marriage, or homosexuality. Just a matter of conveinance I guess.

Ummm....no. Corinthians is part of the new testament actually.

smart1one 11 years, 1 month ago

The fact still remains that this girl is being harassed and ridiculed because she's "different." We need to stop blameing everyone else (Mr. Bush for example) and take responsibility of how we treat other people. Someone earlier mentioned how its no different then making fun of the fat kids or the kids who have different skin pigments than mine or yours. We need to become a more tolerant county and stop blaming every single muslim for what happened on 9/11 or whats happening right now over seas.

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Neopolss, that was a messed up statement to make. What's wrong with the world today is our tolerance for the bad stuff we do to each other. She's dressed in traditional muslim clothing. It's not like she's wearing an "I [heart] Bin Laden" button. She should be able to function in Lawrence without feeling unwelcome.

I think Marion has been huffing white-out again.

Linda Endicott 11 years, 1 month ago

Americans who travel to foreign countries are now being told to lie and tell people they're from Canada, rather than admitting to being American. And no, this isn't just in countries where there is a large Islam population. This is in almost all countries, because the rest of the world has such a poor view right now of America.

As for the young woman in the article, she should be able to dress however she pleases, and not have to worry about someone making rude comments. However, since apparently all Americans don't teach their children (or themselves) to show respect for others, it's going to happen.

We have quite a large population of Dunkard and Mennonite people in this area. The men and women of those religions dress much differently than the majority. Same with the Amish. Yet I can go into a store with a Dunkard woman and not hear others making rude comments about her.

But prejudice and discrimination exist, and it probably always will. I see more people harassed and ridiculed on a daily basis because of class differences than anything else. Anything that makes a person look different from the majority causes rude comments.

Face it, we're a nation that contains a lot of rude, obnoxious people. You learn to live with it. What else can you do?

Centrist 11 years, 1 month ago

All you people are missing THE POINT: the point that someone who looks different is given a load of crap every damn day - for no reason .. from a nation that was built on immigration. They're calling her a foreigner, yet she was born here.

Seeing it yet?? Hmm?? Well??

YES - I feel bad for her. It would SUCK.

Centrist 11 years, 1 month ago

WE need to bomb the Middle East with INFORMATION, not weapons ... it worked in Europe in 1989!!!

Harry_Manback 11 years, 1 month ago

Some of the comments on here make me very sad. People on here, like monkeyhawk, etc. basically saying, "If she doesn't want to me made fun of, then take of the scarf" and "your people kill me, so it's ok to make fun of you." How ignorant. I suspect you've never traveled to another country and experienced the way some foreigners feel about us Americans. It's not a pleasant experience to be ridiculed for your culture or on account of your idiot leaders.

I know intolerance isn't just a regional thing in the US, but perhaps there is a reason why the midwest and Kansas gets such a bad rep on things like this.

Centrist 11 years, 1 month ago

Macon - crap like that is why foreigners think Americans are a homogenous group of ignoramuses, instead of a vast group of different people gathered together on this continent. Well done .. clapping

When is the "burning of the books" scheduled? That is, anything but "Amorican" stuff ..

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Macon, if you were my cat, I'd turn the hose on you. Geez, man.

Centrist 11 years, 1 month ago

Macon, she wears what her religion demands. It is clothing that does not "threaten" anyone. She is NOT wearing one of those "aggressive" shirts you mentioned ... use your head, man!

Harry_Manback 11 years, 1 month ago

Don,

I never said I hated anyone. It just makes me sad that other people feel that way, but they're entitled to hold beliefs I don't agree with.

Centrist 11 years, 1 month ago

"" I wouldn't walk into a biker bar dressed in drag.

Is that because I have a problem, or the bikers have a problem?

Use your head, man! ""

Again, are we excusing the bikers for being intolerant, or blaming the victim? No choice, really .. and once again, completely different to everyday attire.

I'm done with "intelligent debate" .. can't seem to find any. BYE, losers!

OldEnuf2BYurDad 11 years, 1 month ago

Reading the posts on this message board doesn't do much to help a person understand the answers to the problem. However, we've done a good job of demonstrating the root causes of the problem.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

Just who and what are christians? The catholics certainly didn't consider protestants to be christians and vice versa. Many do not consider adventists and mormons to be christians.

What you are doing is redefining christianity to exclude anyone whose actions you are embarrassed by. I'm sure many muslims would say that islamic terrorists are not true muslims.

Tim Mcveigh was a christian of the christian identity movement. Eric Rudolf was a catholic.

It is ridiculous to simply say "They did bad things so by definition they cannot be christians." Idiocy.

Tim Mcveigh was a christian terrorist. Eric Rudolf and other militant pro-lifers who harrass, intimidate, and shoot at doctors who perform abortions are christian terrorists.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

rightstinker can relax. I've found a new posterchild for idiocy who makes rightstinker seem reasonable.

It's, ta-da, moron47.

moron47, how do you manage? I think the lines in your posts are so short and clipped because you lack the mental capacity to breathe and type at the same time, so you need little breaks.

Moron.

Knock knock, Who's there? It's Jesus, and he says "My God this guy's a moron. I wish he would stop defending me".

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

Ok, how do you define a christian, then, smart guys? You are cherry-picking, and it is obvious and unbecoming. I am sorry that some christians do things that embarrass you as a christian, but get over it and deal.

Tim McVeigh also said that he blew up the Murrah building as revenge for torching of the branch davidians and for abortion.

armi-man, you said "This is not the case with Islamic terrorists, who are considered martyrs for their religion"

What bull. Many muslim clerics have denounced terrorism and violence. The point here is that the moderates are not in power, the radicals are. The same could happen with christianity as it has in the past.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

Man, dealing with childish christians in denial is icky. "Ooo, anyone who I don't agree with cannot by defintion be a christian". This is logic discarded by most five-year-olds. Grow up, children.

yourworstnightmare 11 years, 1 month ago

A deceased blogger named moron47 so badly wanted to get into heaven but at the pearly gates St. Peter said, "You will need to wait as our quota of idiots was filled at eleven

Confrontation 11 years, 1 month ago

Is sure is funny how Christians will never believe that Christian men would be abusing women. True Muslims believe that someone who kills women and children are not real Muslims. Spousal abuse is tolerated by the government in places like Iran, NOT by the religion. No one on here would be willing to really get educated on Islam. Just because a government says this abuse is okay and claims it's an islamic right, doesn't make it so. You just turn your tv to Fox News and let them convince you. Look at your "good" Christian men, such at BTK and Mark Miller. Miller used his religion to justify murder (in order to avoid divorce). Yes, there are Christian idiots out there. You don't have to look far. Just take a look around you at church. Just read some of these posts. Education: You should try it.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Obscurer:

"check out crusades, Holy Blood, Holy grail is interestin read. check our Knight Templars and modern dat freemasons."

I've checked them all out Obstipation. Be specific and I'd be glad to hand you your a$$ in any discussion on these topics. Warning: you may want to be a little deeper than Duh-Vinci Hoax, Wholly Blud Wholly Grail and Google. These are reads for the easily misled.

Lets discuss in depth the lineage of the Knights Templar with the Freemasons. Pure myth, if not please provide source documentation of this lineage.

Gosh, I read through source documents (something noticeably missing by the psuedo-fictionists Baigent, Leigh, and Lincoln in Holy Blood and Dan Brown in Duh-Vinci Hoax) that the flag of the Knights Templar passed to the Hospitallers who eventually became the Knights of St John and later the Knight of Malta.

Now if you want a a good read in historically acurate fiction (something you would seem averse to), pick up a copy of "Angel in Iron" by Nicholas Prata.

Dan Brown and the above lunes make a heap serving the Kool Aid to the gulli-bulls.

Drink up!

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Observer writes: "yes it is, pope needed excuse and basically created one. catholic church then was even more corrupt than today. read your history."

I've read a bit of history, please tell us what that excuse was. And please chronicle the exact "corruption" of the Catholic Church in 1095.

I'm all ears Observer.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Expected response from someone whose about toe deep in history, but wants to pretend they know something the masses don't by claiming an absurdity they "read in a book."

I repeat Observer:

"please tell us what that excuse was. And please chronicle the exact "corruption" of the Catholic Church in 1095."

Surprise us all, actually prove something you claim. Have another drink from the pitcher first.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

7.5,

I commend you in your attempt to inject this conversation with actual history. I daresay you won't get any takers as the neo-libs religion teeters precariously on holding and validating specific precious myths.

Thinking the West the provacateur in the Crusades is one of their most cherished.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

C-man,

I prefer Obstipation stay. She is the single greatest saboteur of neo-liberalism.

To paraphrase Bonaparte (Who was actually thinking of Observer when he said it):

Never get in the way of your adversary when she is busily destroying herself.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Rightthinker, nice to meet you. Been around LJW for some time, (loved the old reader reaction, hate the new format) but as of recent months have not posted much.

7.5,

Had an old friend on the Reader Reaction (3 or so years ago) known as Martel732. He's moved to DC. You ought to take his moniker and run with it.

BTW, if you haven't perused it, pick up a copy of Victor Davis Hanson's "Carnage and Culture." He succinctly covers The Hammer's stand at Tours-Poitiers and does a nice job tying the theme of the West's use of heavy infantry (Residual practice from Greco-Roman culture) and its impact on the superiority of the Western way of war. Of course he marks it as the first key battle of East vs. West (post-Rome).

Those who subscribe to the mantra that the West was the agressor against a peaceful high culture by crusading rarely look between the years 632 and 1095.

In 100 years the sons of the prophet went from worshipping rocks in the arabian wilderness, conquered the near East Christians, as well as those parts of Asia Minor and the Balkans that Constantinople couldn't influence, ran across North Africa sacking all Christian settlements, crossed the Iberian and bled out the Spaniard and was well on their way to gay ol' Paree until they met Charlemagne's grandfather on the road between Poitiers and Tours.

But the Christians were the bad guys in the eyes of modern day geniuses like Observer and Duh-Vinci Hoax readers (Have another joint).

After 400 years of bending to the conquest of Mohammed's sons, I suppose we should have just rolled over, circled around a campfire and sang "We are the World" when the Egyptian Caliph ordered the destruction of the Holy Sepulcher in 1009.

Of course that's what liberals would have done, because in their view all cultures are equivalent and who are we to impose our will upon them (although I suppose in their minds its OK for them to impose theirs upon ours), and today they wouldn't possess the freedom to act as dismissive, tantruming, adolescent know-it-alls while (hypocritically)living off the capital of what men like Martel, Charlemagne, Godfey, Tancred, Lionheart, Barbarossa, LaVallette, Don John, and Jan Sobieski provided them.

BTW, agree there is much in our past that we should be ashamed of, I, as I'm sure you'll agree, just don't know of any culture or civilization that could say otherwise. We are after all a fallen people.

Take care.

bearded_gnome 11 years, 1 month ago

CMan: Lepanto is truly a gentleman, scholar, and american hero. we've interacted before on prior topics; for example we proved how the antiwar protestors are completely willfully ignorant of the history practice and principles of war, they just have their illiterate emotion-driven spewings as antiwar opinions.


lepanto, the Big O (Obfuscator) don't know who he/she/it has tingled with, eh?

bearded_gnome 11 years, 1 month ago

OH LOL, should be "tangled" haha. maybe "tingled" is better anyway...oh whatta ya' know.

us_army_infantry_soldier 11 years, 1 month ago

wow some of you are just pathetic. you make negative comments of another religion but in turn you speak of nothing good of your own? And the anger that some of you speak with about religion reminds me of the insurgents we are fighting. You know who you are. You need to step back and really think about what you are saying.

And for a.._eyes, the military doesn't cause more mental illnesses, its called war.. bombs blowing up your convoys on a daily basis, or having to kill a civillian whether it be a women or a child becuase they are shooting at you and your men. Its crap like that that causes mental illnesses. For someone who knows a lot about the military you sure aren't serving huh? So please don't make comments about the military that fights for you unless you know first hand. You can't blame your country's protectors for the extremists that use their training to kill innocent people. Thanks.

I miss lawrence :)

BOE 11 years, 1 month ago

Posted by unconservitiveperson:

" Hey usinfantry....not everyone is brainwashed like you!! Some of us make a living. We don't use taxpayers money to breed on!!! If, by chance you find your self wounded over there, lying there all bleeding and not so well..... Will you still praise ol GW???? Will you??? "

====

Ever find it ironic, that in being (supposedly) the antithesis of conman, you make posts as stupid as his?

ben_ness 11 years, 1 month ago

What is the big deal about Lepanto1571? And why is he a true American Hero? Just curious.

us_army_infantry_soldier 11 years, 1 month ago

unconservitiveperson:

You bet your life I will still cheer for GW.

One, I am hurt over here.

Two, All of us are hurt over here.

Three, Its not brainwashed. Its patriotic duty to serve my country. Thousands have given their lives for us to be here today. I am doing my part to keep that going. Making posts such as yours just proves that you are more a coward than anyone(and no if you aren't in the military it doesn't mean you are a coward. Just referring to comments like his/hers). People don't have to join the military, they don't even have to like the military, but the least you could do is show some respect for those who do to save your behind. Brainwashed is going around thinking nothing bad will ever happen to you. That nothing bad will ever happen to our country. Obviously that isn't true due to 9/11.
And as long as we take the fight to the enemy you won't have to worry about a terrorist blowing up you car on the way to work in the morning. Or kidnapping your family and sending you a tape of their murders. It may happen in Iraq where the war is but it sure won't happen in your little neighborhood.

And Last but not least, most of us that are hurt will continue to support our president, even if we don't agree with all of his desicions (like gas prices, or $10.4 billion budget increase for a defective ballistic missile shield instead of new equipment for the troops fighting etc..) and our leaders and we will continue to tolerate comments from people like you. Although you say the things you do, you don't make up the majority of America and comming from someone in Lawrence it just seems typical. (not saying everyone from Lawrence says stuff like this individual.)

For everyone that has shown their respect to service members thank you. You don't know how much of a morale booster it is to hear it and know that you appreciate what we are trying to do.

Thanks again everyone.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

us_army_infantry_soldier,

From one old infantry soldier to another,

Don't worry about the nonsense from the ignorati.

They are the same old tired voices that no one heeds anyway.

Feel sorry for them, for they are dealing with personal inadequacy issues that are so deeply ingrained, that they can't control it spilling from their sensitive hearts all over their computer keyboards onto an anonymous discussion board serving only to allow them to humiliate themselves for all to see and show them for the fools they pray they're not.

You're all doing a masterful job and our hearts a prayers are with you for a mission accomplished and a safe return home to your loved ones.

Stay your course, get the job done and don't worry about the neutered aging hipsters, pi$$ed off that the bull$hit they embraced made them the losers they've always known they possessed the aptitude to be, but hoped they'd never become. We'll take care of the adolescents. Go kick a$$!

Many on this board, "know the deal."

Keep your powder dry, head down and Sua Sponte!

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

auricular_eyes, aka Enforcer,

Good to see you can focus on one thing for so long a period of time, stay your course and remain single-mindedly obstinant in your stupidity.

bearded_gnome 11 years, 1 month ago

"die for oil?" and these ignorant people will be the first to scream that GWB is to blame for the price of gas being high!
people who chant the vacuous "no blood for oil" should give up everything in their lives which require petrolium to produce...ooops, that includes bikes w/their tires. many pieces of clothing. shoes. don't eat anything delivered by truck. note, that even the Merc gets products delivered by truck.
so, stop being hypocritical, "no blood for oil," okay live your convictions instead of being a hypocrite! also, what about the electricity necessary to operate your computer? you riding a bicycle-driven generator to power it? watch it, the seat on it might have nylon on it. ooops.
what a bunc of biosolids!

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

auricular eyes,

"Aka nothing,..."

Please accept my sincere apology for identifying you as enforcer. I wrongly leapt to conclusions by your use half-wit platitudes, barely articulated ideas, the singularly identifiable inane babble of an hysterical school girl whose misplaced her gum, and your making about as much sense as she.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

auricular eyes,

"If there were pearly gates oh how I would love to be a fly on the wall to see your disappointment inb the end."

Oh, how I'd love for you to string together a coherent and defensible thought, Enforcer.

unconservativeperson,

Thanks for demonstrating my assertion by displaying your personal inadequacies for us all to see.

It would seem Joker that you are depriving a village of an idiot somewhere.

libertarianman 11 years, 1 month ago

I read this stuff, but most of you make me sick. I'm tired of hearing all the B-I-ching. C-man, never talked to you, but you are funny and kick butt. I had to post after reading the meatheads disrespecting troops. I don't want the troops entangled in other countries business, but I don't want them muslims attacking us either. Muslims, no problem with'em if they stop attacking us.

Soldiers, youre great, you guys kick butt. Kick more butt and come home safe.

Conservativeman, keep making me laugh and I'll use your word: LIBTARDS are socialist pukes, this country doesn't want you anymore. Repubs quit spending our money like its no tomorrow.

Legalize Marijuana

libertarianman 11 years, 1 month ago

Conservativeman

Marijuana should be legalized.

Me and a couple of friends want to make t-shirts with your name on them.

Conservativeman Fan Club KU Chapter (Gamma Sigma Alpha)

What do you think? Can you sponsor us? We'll send you an email.

You should go National.

Conservativeman ROCKS

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Mizz Auricular eyes:

"... this young woman will become educated and grow which is her god given right as a citizen of the United States of America. That is all that really matters and despite the haters she has others who stand behind her 100% in her quest.

AE, I'm pleased to see you take such hard, tangible and decisive action by "standing behind" this young woman "100%." Perhaps you'll chronicle one day what it means to "stand behind" somone.

I'm am delighted to witness you praising the liberty she enjoys in America, which she would never be able to exercise in her own culture; a liberty, I might add, insured and defended in actions a little more definable than merely "standing behind her," by those on this board you despise so unconscionably in your desire to eradicate survivor benefits and accuse of being "haters."

A simple thank you would have sufficed.

Unconservative person:

"lepper1751 wouldn't know the truth if it hit him on the head.....Duh....."

Mr. Unconservative person, I think I speak for all when I say that what you've written here to day are some of the most insanely idiotic things we have ever heard.

At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this board is now dumber for having heard you. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

auricular eyes: "killing does not now nor will it ever create freedom"

It seems names like Lexington, Concorde, Trenton, Saratoga, Bunker Hill and Yorktown would refute you.

Godot 11 years, 1 month ago

Come on, Arminius. A tshirt with a message? jeeez

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Is it just my machine or has auricular eyes' posts disappeared from this thread into cyber-oblivion?

Not overly concerned mind you, just want to know if she got caught by Admin having reached the limit of multiple identities.

Godot 11 years, 1 month ago

I'm sorry. Remind me. What is the topic of thsi thread?

horrific_changeling 11 years, 1 month ago

I was just finally reading this thread and noticed this post

Posted by Lepanto1571 (anonymous) on April 22, 2006 at 9:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Is it just my machine or has auricular eyes' posts disappeared from this thread into cyber-oblivion?

Not overly concerned mind you, just want to know if she got caught by Admin having reached the limit of multiple identities.


They usually pull for an really offensive post, or I've read that perhaps someone can write in about a poster, but I have nothing to back that "posting" up. I've sure seen quite a few really naughty posters be yanked, and sometimes the people they were talking to, who hadn't written anything wrong, but I suspect LJW thought they might have been the same person? I know a friend of mine was yanked in that situation, and it wasn't he who had written anything wrong. He was angry.

conservativeman was being so offensive the other day, everyone was complaining about it in their posts, I thought for sure he would be gone, but they didn't yank his nasty comments or his name. Surprising.

Godot 11 years, 1 month ago

bin Laden reminded us all again today that, whether we want to be or not, we are in the midst of a war between Islam and the western world. Since his latest pronouncement was made public, I have not read or heard of a single American Imam denouncing bin Laden.

Godot 11 years, 1 month ago

What a coincidence that bin Laden's tape is made public the same day that this Islamist protest occurs in New York.

http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=49865

Godot 11 years, 1 month ago

It is a big world, Enforcer. Jeez, Louise, they haven't even found you yet. Go figure. :)

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

Enforcer: "Gosh you guys are so welcoming to new users. Let me be the first to welcome Sybil to the forum. Don't take it personally dear some people simply cannot be kind to those who do not think as they do."

Perhaps Sybil should have tried a different approach for her first post.

Why would you want to fake a welcome to someone who's first post stands in opposition to free speech? I mean really, turn conservative man in for what? Bad manners? That's sort of like handing out traffic tickets at the Daytona 500 isn't it?

I respect and admire people who think differently than I, (for that would be just about everyone on this board as you well know). I just don't pretend that kindness extends to their bad ideas. I respond in "kind," you of all people should know that.

corelladeville 11 years, 1 month ago

Thats why we see so many peoples screen names being distorted. Example observer is called obscurer and others that clearly jab at her/him.

whiteoleander 11 years, 1 month ago

I have seen seemingly tame comments deleted and vial remarks remain.

bearded_gnome 11 years, 1 month ago

from World Net Daily: A New York rally by the Islamic Thinkers Society outside the Israeli consulate yesterday featured chants of "The mushroom cloud is on its way! The real holocaust is on its way!"

The demonstration by the Queens-based group was monitored by the Investigative Project on Terrorism whose members noted signs including "Islam will Dominate" and a picture with an Islamic flag flying over the White House.

The chants were in Arabic and translated by the Investigative Project on Terrorism, headed by Steve Emerson, a former reporter for CNN.

Here are some excerpts from the chants:

Leader (in Arabic): "With our blood and our lives we will liberate al Aqsa!"

[The rest also respond in Arabic:] "With our blood and our lives we will liberate al Aqsa!

Israeli Zionists What do you say? The real Holocaust is on its way"

"Takbeer!"

Response: "Allahu Akbar!"

"Takbeer!"

Response: "Allahu Akbar!"

google_ads_frame frame

horrific_changeling 11 years, 1 month ago

Hey, the power's back on! Lepanto..hang around on the OTS board sometimes, sooner or later say something funny. Someone will usually answer! Try a post like this one:


Posted by Godot (anonymous) on April 23, 2006 at 9:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It was a joke, Jannie, calm down.

This would have people falling out of their seats laughing. Godot knows how to work a crowd! :D

(I just couldn't resist, Godot, that was priceless, where's Drew with the points?)

Lepanto1571 11 years, 1 month ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

Godot 11 years ago

Back to the headline of this article. The fact that non-Islamists view Islamists with caution is not prejudice, it is simply the outcome of the reality of perception. bin Laden, Zarqawi, Moussaui, Ralph Reed, the Janjaweed and Ahmenidinejad embody the image of a violent, vengeful, hateful, world of Islam.

Perception is reality.

Perception could be altered by the appearance of a charismatic, vocal and visible Islamic leader who condemns the actions of the afore-mentioned heroes of Islam.

If you are out there, please speak up. Loudly.

Commenting has been disabled for this item.

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