Dec. 19, 2013 |
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Let me see if I have this correct. The more people there are, that are carrying guns, the safer we all are. RIGHT. Would that work for countries and Nukes?
Nukes make us all safer. Statistics show us time and again that the more nukes per person a country has, the lower its crime is ... oh wait. Never mind.
How many Countries have been Nuked since 1945? Name them here................
United States has more Nukes than any other country. They only used 2 of them so far. It must be working!
Ha — how many thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of people have died and suffered since 1945 in the name of acquiring nuclear weapons? Yeah ... great logic!
Unknown. There's been a lot of scholarly debate on the subject. Japan was already close to surrender at that point. Part of the reason the nukes were dropped was to see what they would do in the field.
Worked all through the cold war.
Maybe just like nukes, if the bad guys have them the good guys should have more.
I guess the people of Kansas will have to stop saving land of the free and home of the brave, now they can say land of the over taxed home of the paranoid
No it is "my" side that knows that there is not millions of bad guys waiting behind every corner waiting to kill me. "My" kind can enjoy an evening in the real world without fear.
Rattlesnakes exist, too. That doesn't mean I need to carry a snake bite kit with me everywhere I go.
But if you are going into rattlesnake territory then it would be prudent to do so.
Is the public library rattlesnake country?
It's not the inanimate that bothers me. Lay a loaded and cocked firearm on a table. It will not discharge all on it's lonesome by internal decision.
It's the weekend warriors, the ones with little man syndrome, and the scared to exist human beings operating and carrying those inanimate objects in public that bother me.
Just as was touted repeatedly by the NRA< despite defeating a bill that would have created just such a database, there is NO way for the licensing board to determine if the person filling out the application is of normal brain functionality. There is no database of who is taking what anti psychotics, or anti depressants, or basically any other pharmacological add-ons.
How many Adam Lanza's were just issued a permit, will stock up, and repeat that scenario in one form or another?
The answer unable to be calculated, but you have better odds of picking the winning powerball numbers three drawings in a row than encountering said mentally unbalanced and armed person.
Hence the paranoia part.
The greater than sign was a mistake. Sorry if it confused anyone.
I might be off the mark on this, and apologize in advance if I am, but I get the feeling that you haven't dealt with many, if any at all, people with any kind of a mental health issue beyond mild depression.
The stronger the medication, the worse it is on your brain chemistry. Eventually, at any given dosage, the brain simply plateaus and is not longer nearly as effected by the medication as it once was. To offset that, the medication dosage is upped over and over again, and frequently, to an almost toxic level. At that point, all medication has to be halted so the body can process the excess and expel it from the body. That can take upwards of 4 to 6 weeks, depending on the meds. At that point, they are usually prescribed an entirely different medication, requiring an adjustment period with multiple side effects that range in severity and in duration.
But you see, Kansas has absolutely no provision in any of the laws pertaining to obtaining a C&C license preventing such an individual from carrying a firearm. One momentary psychotic break, which happen without warning in nearly every case... well, you know the rest of the story, to paraphrase Paul Harvey.
Wow. You mean to protect us from psychotic breaks? That is, quite literally, crazy.
Remember... Only an individual with a gun experiencing a psychotic break can protect you from another individual with a weapon experiencing a psychotic break.
I figure that, since we're being all crazy up in this hood, I should join in.
If you can determine who will be having a psychotic break, then have at it. Don't waste your time here, where people are likely to think that you're ridiculous. If your psychotic break prediction methodology is that miraculous, then get out there and save the world from psychotic breaks...instead of insulting people on this forum with your "weekend warrior" and "little man syndrome" balogna.
God made men, and Colonel Colt made them equal.
Do you remember that saying, because I remember studying it in middle school and high school.
We are not in a state of perpetual war preparedness, like Israel, for example. Estimates put the number of gun deaths in 2011 at 30-32 thousand. The U.S. population exceeds 300 million. Do I have to do the math to show you how infinitesimal a percentage that is? That means 30-32 thousand people, assuming you include things like suicide and what not, killed another person, or themselves, with a firearm. In base mathematics, that is roughly 1 in 100 thousand people did something naughty with their gun.
That's like saying one person in Lawrence sometime this year will commit murder or suicide with a gun. Does that sound like odds that puts you in any severe amount of jeopardy?
Guns, however, have always and forever been linked with masculinity. To prove it, I can cite at least a dozen role models that are inexorably linked to guns, for example Bill Cody or John Wayne. Rap artists looking for 'street cred' frequently involve firearms with their attempts at gathering said affirmation. How many gangs do you know that aren't known for gun violence?
If Sam Colt created the Great Equalizer, thus putting little guys on par with big guys, then little man syndrome is appropriate.
Little man syndrome is as appropriate with regard to words as it is to guns. Education never, necessarily, fixes that.
Do you believe that all men are "created equal"?
Do you believe that life is a right or a fight?
There is black and white and grey in our world. Little is definitively right or wrong. It seems to depend upon how "big" one is in our society. It's a sad world. It's a world where every attempt to create equality should be appreciated by all...except for the elite "babes in the wood" who insist upon living in denial.
All men are created equal.
Five very important words from the Declaration of Independence. The only problem is that it's taken out of context and out of character. Those that founded this nation, not just the authors of the Declaration and the Constitution, came from lands where they had little to no say in the government. The vast majority also didn't have fair and equal footing in the eyes of the law.
The authors of the Declaration and Constitution were adamant, above and beyond anything else, that the law be fair. That it be just. That it applied to all people equally. Granted, slavery was in high gear at the time, so in retrospect, that concept has to be taken with a grain of salt, but evolving times require evolving perspectives.
If you don't mind my asking, but let's assume that you end up ina situation that you have to draw your firearm. How do you know that you are not making a bad situation worse? Let's say it's a bank robbery. Two guys, one with a handgun and one with a shotgun, for the sake of argument. They have already disarmed the security guard, and, just for the heck of it, the silent alarm has been rung as well.
You decide to jackrabbit up and draw your weapon. What is the likelihood of someone getting shot? Willing to bet the odds are not only drastically higher, they are not skewed in your favor. Say it turns into a Mexican standoff. An absolute stroke of luck just happened and the police arrived. By delaying them, you, on your lonesome, just made every other person in that bank a hostage.
You want to play the hero and end up endangering every single person in the place. I refuse to speak for you, but if my wife and children were in that bank, I certainly would not be rushing forward to shake your hand. Much better odds of my going to jail for trying to knock your teeth down your throat for putting MY family in harm's way because your ego stepped up to the plate.
I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with you over the issue of guns in your own residence. Have however many you want. It makes no difference to me. I don't know you, or all but the tiniest fraction of this state population well enough to entrust my family's safety to your judgment call on a spur of the moment decision.
That's not meant to insult you, in any way, shape or form. I'm being blunt and honest about my thoughts on the concept.
I don't have a CC permit. I don't carry and I don't have plans to carry concealed. I'm not too worried about my neighbors carrying concealed. I'm also not too concerned about running into criminals. That may change, down the road.
I don't think your imagined bank robber scenario sounds very plausible. That's not meant to insult you or raise your ire.
I'm content to wait to see what actually comes of this CC experiment in KS, rather than to speculate.
This is the kind of response I was wanting to get. Thank you and, in regards to your stance, fair enough.
In reference to your attempted snide comment about my weekend warrior comment, I give you the exact wording of the Second Amendment.
"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
Note the word 'militia'.
As stated on dictionary.com:
1. a body of citizens enrolled for military service, and called out periodically for drill but serving full time only in emergencies.
2. a body of citizen soldiers as distinguished from professional soldiers.
3. all able-bodied males considered by law eligible for military service.
4. a body of citizens organized in a paramilitary group and typically regarding themselves as defenders of individual rights against the presumed interference of the federal government.
That is every definition approved by Merriam Webster. I could quote the Oxford Dictionary, but I think you get the general drift.
A militia is not a standing army, in any sense of the word. The National Guard is also not a standing army, although it does answer to the same rules when the units are called to active duty. The term 'weekend warrior' derives from members of the National Guard only being active regularly on weekends.
If you insist on using a strict interpretation of the Constitution, then by all means, use ALL the words, not just the ones that fit your agenda at the moment. It's kind of like the cut-and-paste job done with the Bible these days to suit various organizations. I find it highly offensive that no one truly gives a whit about the actual intent of the Second Amendment and only want to read the words.
Do these two expansions on my two terms expand your understanding for my opinion on conceal and carry, as a concept? In truth, what I expect to have happen is you to skim through, find something that jumps out at you like a Jack-in-the-box and latch onto it, disregarding anything and everything else stated. I'd like to be pleasantly surprised, but sadly I don't honestly expect to be.
Frankly, words mean nothing in the end. I don't worship the constitution. I don't think most people give it a first or second though. We have natural rights, within our society, and they are messy. Life will always be messy and wet with blood. We will all pay the price of living. We will all pay the price of loving. We will all pay the price of believing. We will also pay the price of being different, if we care enough to pay that price. If you love this messed up society, you're free to call it a grand experiment and add your soul to the beaker of our chemists. Remember, though, that there is no winning or losing for those inhabiting this place. There is only life, death and the aftermath. Participate while you can, or feel like it's a good idea. I appreciate you and your snide rebuttal.
I've heard that 90% of statistics are made up on the spot.
$150 is a large fee?
I think the 90% paranoid ones are those without a permit.
Yes, the people who are scared are the ones who don't need to be armed 24/7...makes perfect sense.
Being paranoid about the imaginary dangers of their CC neighbors IS PARANOIA.
As usual, this is a case of "My paranoia is better than your paranoia." syndrome in a public playground.
LOL here we go again! Always pushing this paranoid thing! Come up with something else if your truly against this. 64,000 in Kansas alone must have a valid argument don't you think?
50 States support Concealed Carry now, so skull where are you going to go to get away from those crazy gun toting fools? I hear North Korea is a no gun area.
England is a no gun area too, with 1/40th the gun violence we have here...what's your point? Just because lots of people support it doesn't make it a great idea. Millions gave there lives to protect slavery. Was that for the good of society?
Simple solution for you. Since you're afraid of guns, don't get one.
That won't really protect me from an accident will it? Although it probably will, because I'd still be more likely to shoot myself with my own gun, maybe I should get mine out and drive around with it...
Wonder if he uses this same logic in order to enforce support for both gay marriage and abortions. Don't like them, don't have one. Good to see you're on our side.
Logic will get you nowhere lol!
Afraid a gay person might get careless and accidentally marry you?
Every time this topic comes up, yes. We have paranoid CC people and we have paranoid anti-gun people posting the same things, over and over.
Welcome to ljworld
And some of us that enjoy mocking both sides. Isn't the Internet a grand, glorious place for entertainment? LOL
You people forget that Kansas is an open carry state. That means you do not need a permit to carry. Beside it is easier to carry a handgun than a cop. Plus cops don't carry to protect you, they carry for there own protection.
Have a good day and stay cool.
Actually, cops take an oath to serve and protect...enjoy your rhetoric.
Actually, the courts have repeatedly ruled that the police have no duty to protect the general public...enjoy your rhetoric.
I'll see your probably and raise you an improbability.
As has been stated before, most non gun carriers do not expect or even WANT CC holders to come to their aid. That's the part that scares people... those that think they can protect the world with their one gun. meanwhile, in the same situation, the police are trying to figure out who is the bad guy.
Admitting your paranoia is the first step in defeating it.
Don't be scared until it is time to quail without recourse.
Here is what I don't understand and maybe you can clarify it for me. You are afraid of CC holders but the "others" with guns don't worry you. You say "nuts are nuts". Have you considered that the nuts, may be "the others"? Evidently you have no CC holders as friends. Could it be that you have no friends? No one to assist you except the police in uniform that are sworn to preform their duty.
Cops may take a oath, but the SCOTUS has said they do not have to protect you.. If No Guns Allowed works so well, I think you to talk to the parents @ Sandy Hook Elementary & see if they agree with you.. Have a good day & stay cool.
Actually most of the parents at Sandy Hook do agree (it's in one of those "blue" states. Maybe because they realize that more than 850 die because of gun accidents every year. 33 people die every day because of gun violence.
How many died at Sandy Hook? That's less than the average day.
Yeah, compare that to the 35,000+ people killed in car accidents. 20,000 per year of those gun deaths are suicide. And some guy who happened to be in the Aurora movie theater doesn't count as a gun fact source.
How does a CC licensed person determine who is the 'bad guy' and who is another CC 'good guy'? With an increase in licenses, it's only a natural supposition to assume that were such a self defense incident to occur, there would be a higher chance of more than one CC licensed person being present.
Unless you were present at the start of the 'festivities', so to speak, and especially if all involved had pistols and not rifles or shotguns, how would you, personally, tell the difference?
If you arrive late you don't participate unless the bullets are directed toward you or a family member before the shooter knows if you have a gun or not. Then it's called self defense. That is the purpose of the permit.
Right – and it always works exactly like it's supposed to. That must be why we see stories about accidental shootings (often children) every freaking day.
Somehow, I don't think that a C&C license would inspire me to go check out the gun play. When I hear gun shots, I generally try to leave the general vicinity, not slip in closer for a better look. There are people paid by my taxes and yours to charge in and deal with the situation. They even give them radios to call more people with guns and radios, just in case one guy with a gun and radio isn't enough.
I honestly fail to see the logic, but then again, I put a lot more faith in people that are trained, rigorously, to deal with criminals, in terms of guns, than I have in the guy that took an 8 hour course. Once. Because that is all Kansas requires for the C&C license.
Would you trust a plumber that took an 8 hour course once?
So, you just let them kill everybody else?
I thought one of the main reasons to have more people with guns is that it will make us all safer, and that they'd be the heroes stopping those mass shooters.
No defense of others in your plan?
Jafs, quit baiting CC holders so you can ridicule their answer. It won't matter what they say, you will riddlecule as you just did with the comment above.
A criminal will not know whether YOU have a gun and will use it to defend yourself; therefore, having tens of thousands of CC permit holders in the state functions as a deterrent to crime.
Again, you assume things always work like you believe they should work. Nobody's supposed to cause a collision, either, but they happen every day.
Again, you assume that things work like you believe they will work.
Nobody is supposed to cause a collision, but SOME (sometimes deluded) souls cause a "collision" every day.
Are you happy to accept all of the collisions, with no regrets or means of stopping them? Are you more afraid of your neighbors' than your neighboring criminals' evil intent?
"Again, I would not use mine to protect strangers."
So you'd gladly stand around if someone had a child held at gunpoint? Was driving past a schoolyard, when your child is home sick, and witnessed someone start shooting?
Such an inspiring example of humanity.
So because you don't want to write, or can't be bothered with it, you just won't do it.
Good to know for future reference.
You are doing the same thing as jafs, ridleculing CC holders replys no matter what they say. Grow up!
I wouldn't ridicule if it wasn't needed. I am honestly not all that concerned about their precious feelings, and would say the exact same things to their faces that I post on this forum. I was raised to be honest and speak my mind, not slouch and hide int eh shadows hoping that someone might read my mind instead.
No, I don't think a gun makes you safer.
I have yet to be answered on how a holstered weapon, be it under your arm, on your hip, at the small of your back, in the top of your boot, or hanging from a lock of hair on the side of your head protects you from the handful of punks that just walked up with one, or more, drawn weapons pointed directly at you.
How does that protect the people you are with? It doesn't. It's a salve to the conscience, encouraging you to feel more secure and confident in your surroundings, and is no more useful than a socks on a rooster.
I don't care how many guns you want to protect your home. That is all fine and dandy with me, as long as they are properly stored if my child comes over for a visit. Beyond that sole factor, I could care less if you put a gatling gun by your backdoor and sleep with an RPG beside your bed.
And just for the record, in no way do I believe Pheps. At least not in regards to actually owning a firearm and possessing a C&C license. Callous and self centered I'll buy. The rest... not so much.
Many of us carried concealed before it was legal, for our own protection. At least now we're afforded what many of us believe was already our right to begin with.
Oh. So you were a lawbreaker who would not be eligible to get a CC license if you had been caught. That makes us feel safer.
How much Koch money do you get for trying to keep us all tied up in these most wickedly ridiculous knots of intercourse, in a Kochian dream of keeping the designated riffraff and rabble down on the farm and without any recourse beyond the cheaper purchases down desperation road.
NOT another thread of "My paranoia is better than your paranoia!"
This is getting old.
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
I uphold my Oath.
Really? You are a member of a militia?
No, I fought for the real military. I almost died defending these Rights. And I think your question show a small amount of childishness.
dont want a gun; dont need a gun.
)if it ever came to that, I think an 8 hour course is NOT enough.)
more power to those who think they do... just be smart and safe about it...
Agreed. Education and personal responsibility are the most important factors when owning any form of weapon. If you choose to own, and legally carry a firearm, please be smart about it. Someone flipping you off in traffic is not a valid reason to use a weapon. That's why I don't believe in demonizing all gun owners based on the actions of unstable people.
A broken record, a mountain of guns, a pile of nonsense, instructed by Luntz
One things for sure...you better have a heck of a drone fleet if you ever plan on invading this country. The amount of weapons cache's and ammo here per capita will never be matched (or surpassed) by any foreign nation while any of us are alive.
I'm not naive to think any of this crap is changing but I do hope everyone realizes that our police carry guns b/c EVERYONE else has one. No need to carry at all if there aren't any other guns to worry about. But keep enjoying all of that rabid hunting you do with your automatic and military grade weaponry...
The genies are out of the bottle and out of their minds. Enjoy your raving at the all encompassing lunacy.
Would you trust Sam Brownback, if he had a CCW license, carried a firearm, and somehow found himself in a situation that necessitated him drawing his weapon and using it? Not some dark back alley, either. Let's say at a gas station. 2 'bad guys', 2 teenagers out driving around that stopped for munchies and drinkables, the clerk, and your significant other, just so you had some skin in the game, so to speak.
Why or why wouldn't you trust him with his firearm, especially if all he did was meet the minimum requirements as set out in Kansas law.
I wouldn't trust Sham Brownback with anything. All he has is what a pen is, his Dick Cheney position and his minions. He acts as if he can create billions of god's children and end lowercase god references with dark forces. He would never need to pull any trigger, as his backers have things covered with the bullets of their gold. He is beyond the pale and within the dirt, specious fealty and reality of our times. He does things according to the book of hoods granted royalty. He does not belong in any conversation, as he does not converse. He is under the royal orders of greed and dishonesty.
And though he would be acquitted of any grievous offences, he will never spill blood with his own hand. He will spill it with his complicit acceptance of belief and/or the nature of his buying into our demise...and its acceptance of slavery.
Our states have become an entitled realm of confusion within such specific acceptances of one death, imprisonment, "detainment", or intervention over another...one that does not believe in anything beyond the glory of the Sham I Am scam and his master's plan.
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