June 19, 2013 |
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Government growing at breakneck speed. "Nanny state whiners" are the biggest nannies. Nationally, many in the republican party have begun to see that this radical right wing splinter group of republicans are the problem but we still produce them by the cattle car load in Kansas.
i think i've figured it out. if there are fewer jobs at lower pay and fewer rights with more government control of lives than in Mexico, the aliens will move away. it's a kolbach finesse.
Next stop for all of us---Mexico?
If men could get pregnant, Kansas abortion laws would look very different right now.
The extreme right seems to feel the need to lie about pretty much everything. Could it be because the truth would show them up for the scared, sad little inadequate men that they are? Laws are the only way they can control women.
And make no mistake, this is about controlling women. Just like rape is. It's all about control.
"The extreme right seems to feel the need to lie about pretty much everything. "
Are they really lying, or are they just that ignorant?
The two are not mutually exclusive.
They're lying and they persist in their ignorance.
They are lying. That there is a lack of substantive research supporting a link between breast cancer and abortion has been pointed out to them numerous times.
err .. Brownbackistan!
Sadly, the Republican war on women is alive and well in Kansas. Ladies need to quit voting like their redneck husbands.
Not saying I'm for or against this bill, but shouldn't you realize before 22 weeks that you're pregnant?
There are lots of reasons beyond your understanding and that is the problem. Let the people in the situation , who understand their situation, make their decision. People who can't figure out why another person might make the choice they make should not be making that choice for them. Over simplification and ignorance does't justify the idiocy of this bigoted legislature.
Not if you're a barely pubescent child and pregnant by incest. Not if you're developmentally disabled and were raped by a caregiver in a group home. Such cases may be rare, but they do happen.
Case in point, a 11 year old in Texas just found out she was 7 months pregnant by a neighbor.
Yes. You are missing the fact that this type of thinking attempts to legalize oppressing women in Kansas by giving the sperm of criminals higher legal status than the women who are violated.
So where would you draw the line? Or would you?
Each female should get to draw her own line.
Seems to me a lot of people could save themselves from the abortion delimma by getting a tubal ligation or vasectomy after having a kid or two. Why keep going to the Dr. and pharmacy for years? Why keep exposing your body to drugs? Why live with such risk and inconvienence?
Why keep going to Blockbuster Video to get a movie and return the movie and get a movie and return the movie when you can sign up with Netflix one time and be done?
Seems to me that it's none of your business how they decide on family planning matters.
Chootspa, it was a suggestion for some people to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies. Tubal ligations and vasectomies are reversable. These are merely options. Your response makes no sense to me given that this ENTIRE ARTICLE is about an aspect of family planning matters.
Are there still Blockbusters in Kansas?
What about the people who choose to never have children? Doctors refuse to perform sterilization procedures on the childless/childfree as a matter of routine, despite the fact that their patients can leave the office and buy guns, booze, lottery tickets, and vote. Sometimes, exposing ourselves to drugs is the smaller "inconvenience."
I about had a heart attack this morning. When I woke up my watch was running backwards! On the drive to work, I crossed the state line and my watch immediately started running clockwise again. This is gettin' kinda' scary!
Wow! That's a long commute, all the way to Colorado.
In 31 states in this country, rapists can sue for custody and/or visitation of the fruits of their assault. Kansas is one of those states. Given that Mr. Kinzer and his gyno gang want women forced into bearing such children, does he have any plans of introducing legislation to at least cut off the parental rights of convicted sex offenders?
Every time I think about this my blood boils. Lance Kinzer; championing rapists, child abusers and sex offenders since 2004!
She should have shut her body down!
An appropriate move would be for all doctors to refuse to practice in the state of Kansas where Nanny State Republicans like Kinzer and Edwards can order them to pass along untrue information. Republicans: follow your own campaign promises and get out of our lives!
I recently read an article where that is, in truth, happening. ACOG and the AMA are up in arms about the way that, not just Kansas, but other states as well, are intruding into exam rooms and passing laws that force doctors to lie to patients. Kansas further blackened it's eye with the nation's physicians when the legislature came so close to forcing the medical school to lose it's accreditation. This isn't the way to recruit doctors OR medical students.
Yeah, if she didn't, she must have enjoyed it.
This was in reply to osur 351. Don't know how it got down here.
I did mean that,tongue in cheek to the idiots who passed the bill!
As was mine. Being snarky is about the only thing that keeps me sane in this worst of times.
I read somewhere that if men could get pregnant, there'd be a clinic on every corner and birth control would come in 10 flavors....
I have had it with these morons in the state house.
Why not try to figure out how to get a title out in less than two months and get a license renewed in under two hours.
Once you get that solved you can go back to vagina regulation. Idiots
And I thought all these right-wing zealots were against more government intrusion into our lives. I can just imagine that if these restrictions were being foisted on women by The Progressives, the Right -wing T-Baggers would call it a form of American Sharia Law.
this is not news. the only reason browny got elected was to end abortions of any kind in Kansas. I am only surprised it has taken this long. oh yeah. browny has been pretty busy attempting, and probably succeeding, to totally wreck the state of Kansas.
Actually, it's because he had moderate Republicans in the legislature stopping him. After the "Day of the Long Knives" in the Republican Primary last year, when Koch fueled cash bankrolled a Tea Party candidate to go up against every moderate Republican in the state, Charlie and David managed to buy Kansas for themselves.
Every anti-abortion proposal that was introduced into the state legislature last year was stopped in the moderate controlled Senate. Every one of those same proposals and MORE were reintroduced this year with every expectation they will pass.
Welcome to the Teataliban.
This isn't about men controlling women. Its about conservative lawmakers (men and women) imposing their wrong moral and social beliefs on and attempting to control all of us (men and women). This anti-choice legislation is just part of a much larger agenda that includes anti-union, anti-environment, anti-sustainability, anti-homosexual, anti-education, and, of course, pro-gun legislation.
It's about everything you listed, SnakeFist, and about men controlling women. Even women can advocate policies to control women.
Let's cut to the chase here: House Bill 2253's real world impact on female citizens capable of bearing children is that Republican conservatives condone rape, incest and child abuse. This bill, if enacted into law, compels female citizens who've been sexually assaulted to have babies they never intended or planned to have.
Every female voter in the state of Kansas should go to the polls next election and throw these fascist pig Republican conservatives out of the statehouse and into the nearest gutter.
"The Kansas House on Tuesday rejected a provision that would exempt victims of rape, incest or child sexual abuse from restrictions on abortions."
Thus assuring a quick smackdown in the courts.
Don't be so quick to assume that, Keith. Roe only guarantees the life and health of the mother. The only "rape" exception is that Federal funds may be used to pay for it.
Has Kansas State Government gotten out of your life lately?......Or just gotten totally out of control ?!
These are re-publican legislators who now feel fit, by their own pronouncements, to render bogus medical opinions as if they have any credentials to issue any medical opinions of any sorts at all .
Trust me, they would "get it", if it were their own daughter who was raped..... and the rapist secured visitation rights thru the states court systems and laws that they have made !!!
Being Hypocrites and Sociopaths by nature, they'd have a daughter who was raped or was consensually pregnant, into an abortion performing state, in no time at all, for an abortion !
A young woman or adult woman raped by a relative or not should have the choice to decide an abortion and it should be covered under medical insurance. However, if a young woman or adult woman chooses to be careless and choose to have an abortion then no it should not be covered under medical insurance. There is enough education about birth control in this country for woman to know how to protect themselves from getting pregnant. Of course there is always that 1% accident that happens. But if women keep cranking out babies with no forethought of the consequences on society we are going to be in a boat load of trouble with over population.
So what you are saying is that you are pro-choice, just pro YOUR choice and not HER choice. I get it.
You are assuming that birth control is a whole lot more effective than it actually is. Male condoms have a 15% failure rate--that is, 15 out of 100 women who use condoms as a method of birth control during asingle year will end up pregnant. Spermicidal foam has a failure rate of 29%. Diaphrams and cervical caps have a failure rate between 16% and 32%, depending upon whether they are paired with a spermicidal cream. Birth control pills have a failure rate of 8%. Only IUDs and implants have a failure rate of 1%. See:
Multiply the annual failure rate by the number of years that women are fertile--on average, from age 13 to age 51, so 38 years. Subtract the number of years that women choose to be pregnant--2, maybe.
So, sunshine, you need to reassess you contention that only irresponsible women would be getting pregnant regularly. Even when women use birth control, there are going to be huge numbers of unplanned pregnancies. Medical insurance--and public policy--must provide women with ways to deal with them.
Of course, sunshine, if you don't like "women...cranking out babies with no forethought of the consequences on society," you should be 100% in favor of medical insurance covering the cost of abortions.
Or..100% pro keeping it I the man's pants.
Sunshine, Of course this bill prevents much of the information prepared by responsible organizations like planned parenthood from being distributed while requiring doctors to provide information that is false or unproven.
Why don't WE the PEOPLE put it on the ballot and vote either position?? If the politicians won't REPRESENT the people, why in the hell are they still in office...it's not their call, they represent US!
The problem is people vote party lines, or who is the most charismatic, or because they look great in a suit,or whatever. They are supposed to represent US! Are we that stupid that we have to be lead by the nose, that we aren't smart enough to decide ourselves...wake up people before it's too late!
Women's control over their own bodies should not be a matter to be decided by majority vote of the electorate of the state of Kansas. Women are smart enough to decide for themselves, each one of them, whether an abortion is appropriate in her individual circumstances.
Not that any one will pay attention to this posting but for all the women out there who have used or do use an IUD or coil this applies to you.
As you would in theory be liable under this law. The coil of course is designed to stop a fertilized egg from implanting in/on the uterus. Thus it follows that women who use a coil would not want to travel in or live in Kansas for fear of prosecution.
I am particularly interested to hear from someone who supports this law and who uses an IUD
I neither support this law nor use an IUD, but that is an interesting thought. Transvaginal ultrasounds for all women in or passing through Kansas to discover if they have an IUD.
I've no doubt that outlawing birth control will be the next thing on their agenda. Which is why we need to vote these extremists out in the next election.
So women are just cranking out babies - men play no part in this. Maybe the man should take some responsibility also - and stop insurance companies from paying for viagra. What a sexist message you just posted.
It sounds like Lance Kinzer does not know what an ectopic pregnancy is. It also sounds like he has never heard of a molar pregnancy.
It also doesn't sound like Lance Kinzer believes that fetuses can die in utero.
the Guns Over People (or Gonads Over People) party doesn't like women, except for those that say "Yes,' even when unable to speak, passed out on the floor, being banged by all those men that heard some woman say; "Yes, Yes. Take my rights, men. I'm only a woman and I don't know what to do without all you big brave men telling me...."
Plus, bonus, all those extra mouths to feed the GMO food that Koch Brothers will produce. And all that sales tax to replace the Koch lovers income tax. Really a plan. That doctor's aren't trusted by the Koch GOP is a good thing. Yup. Means faster deaths among them.
Beg to differ with you, The Tea-bagging GOP does in fact love women, just not the kind you and I would care to associate with. The party has a collection of "highly intellectual' ??? dolts from it's "Binders of Women" program that the Party has embraced over the past few years. I submit the "prime" examples: Sharron Angle, Michelle Bachman, Marsha Blackburn, Jan Brewer, Lynn Jenkins, Sarah Palin and Christine O'Donnell. " God bless all, each and every one" C.Dickens
I should ask my physician friends if anyone has ever done a study on the effects of botox on fertility and/or brain cells. (There's a photo of Callista Gingrich burned into my brain that not even mind bleach and electroshock therapy will get rid of.) Then again, most of those women are past childbearing and couldn't give a flip for the women who aren't. Or else they're women like Karen Santorum; ok with having a "medically induced miscarriage" among themselves but by god that's a privilege reserved for them and their cohort and don't think those puny little masses should even THINK they are equal to their betters.
So no one reading this thread has used an IUD, my point not well made perhaps, is that their legislation is in many ways unenforceable.
The normal way that to deal with these points is to smile and ignore them as they get in the way.
My next question is will the law mean no more over flights of Kansas by air lines.
The GOP needs to think more about where it is going rather than how it feels on the way there.
I'm sure there are plenty of women that have or are using IUDs reading this thread. They just aren't willing to throw their lady parts out on the table for you to examine.
And no, I will NOT "smile and ignore them as they get in the way". This isn't a classroom of preschoolers, it's the state legislature and, at risk of a Godwin, "smiling and ignoring them" is the path to Nazism. They are bullies, plain and simple, and I WILL speak out against bullies.
Not as far-fetched as one might think. Anyone remember Vern Miller? Googled him and couldn't come up with verification, but I do remember a story that he boarded a commercial airliner and arrested people for drinking when they were flying over Kansas.
On motion of Rep. Wilson to amend HB 2253, the motion did not prevail.
On roll call, the vote was: Yeas 31; Nays 90; Present but not voting: 0; Absent or not voting: 4.
Yeas: Ballard, Bollier, Bridges, Burroughs, Carlin, Clayton, Davis, Dillmore, Finney, Frownfelter, Henderson, Hill, Houston, Kuether, Lane, Lusk, Menghini, Perry, Rooker, Ruiz, Sloan, Sloop, Tietze, Trimmer, Victors, Ward, Weigel, Whipple, Wilson, Winn, Wolfe Moore.
Nays: Alcala, Alford, Barker, Becker, Bideau, Boldra, Bradford, Bruchman, Brunk, Couture-Lovelady, Campbell, Carlson, Carpenter, Cassidy, Christmann, Claeys, Concannon, Corbet, Crum, DeGraaf, Dierks, Doll, Dove, Edmonds, Edwards, Esau, Ewy, Finch, Gandhi, Garber, Goico, Gonzalez, Grant, Grosserode, Hawkins, Hedke, Henry, Hermanson, Hibbard, Highland, Hildabrand, Hineman, Hoffman, Houser, Howell, Huebert, Hutton, Jennings, Johnson, Jones, Kahrs, Kelley, Kelly, Kinzer, Lunn, Macheers, Mast, McPherson, Meier, Meigs, Merrick, Montgomery, Moxley, O'Brien, Pauls, Peck, Petty, Phillips, Powell, Proehl, Read, Rhoades, Rothlisberg, Rubin, Ryckman Jr., Ryckman Sr., Schroeder, Schwab, Schwartz, Seiwert, Shultz, Siegfreid, Suellentrop, Sutton, Swanson, Thimesch, Todd, Vickrey, Waymaster, Weber.
Present but not voting: None.
Absent or not voting: Kleeb, Osterman, Peterson, Sawyer.
Thank you. I appreciate this.
And there she blows, people! The entire bill passed the House!
According to the FBI website, 84,767 forcible rapes were reported in 2010.
Most rapes are not reported. It is unknown how many cases of incest or child abuse result in pregnancies.
In Kansas you can be the victim of a rapist and then the victim of the government.
Who would you consider more evil?
The rapist who cannot control his urges or the politicians who exploit the victim?
This bill is just more proof of what GOP thinks of women. They should simply be kept pregnant, barefoot, in the kitchen and keep their mouths shut.
I am not sure how you fight against people like Rush Limbaugh, who spreads lies and disinformation across America every single day and is treated like a great American patriot.
He can call an innocent young woman a slut and get praised for it.
We are at a low point as a society when we honor these kind of people.
This is also the current state of our Kansas government. They will sacrifice anyone to score political points at the Koch mansion.
I think the extreme right wins in part because they scream louder and manipulate the lowest common denominator. Those who are more moderate in beliefs and the way they live are at a disadvantage because they try to persuade with reason rather than fear and phobia.
I believe we are battling sociopaths and if you have studied their personality make-up, you know they are really impossible to deal with in a healthy manner. Also, they are empowered by the current environment. When their behavior is condemned by society, they aren't so likely to be so open about it. However, they are still dangerous, they just go underground---remember the John Birch Society? We thought it had gone away, but it just raised it's ugly head under other names but the same people.
I'm not saying we should use their tactics, but we should never underestimate their power and influence. I never thought I would be fighting the women's rights battle again, but here we are. Apparently we will have to keep fighting forever and never become complacent.
HB 2253, AN ACT concerning abortion; relating to the funding of abortion services; relating to prenatally and postnatally diagnosed conditions; relating to restrictions on late-term abortions; relating to the woman's-right-to-know act; amending K.S.A. 2012 Supp. 40-2246, 65-6701, 65-6703, 65-6709, 65-6710, 76-3308, 79-32,117, 79-32,138, 79-32,182b, 79-32,195, 79-32,261 and 79-3606 and repealing the existing sections, was considered on final action.
On roll call, the vote was: Yeas 92; Nays 31; Present but not voting: 0; Absent or not voting: 2.
Yeas: Alcala, Alford, Barker, Becker, Bideau, Boldra, Bradford, Bruchman, Brunk, Couture-Lovelady, Campbell, Carlson, Carpenter, Cassidy, Christmann, Claeys, Concannon, Corbet, Crum, DeGraaf, Dierks, Doll, Dove, Edmonds, Edwards, Esau, Ewy, Finch, Gandhi, Garber, Goico, Gonzalez, Grant, Grosserode, Hawkins, Hedke, Henry, Hermanson, Hibbard, Highland, Hildabrand, Hineman, Hoffman, Houser, Howell, Huebert, Hutton, Jennings, Johnson, Jones, Kahrs, Kelley, Kelly, Kinzer, Kleeb, Lunn, Macheers, Mast, McPherson, Meier, Meigs, Merrick, Montgomery, Moxley, O'Brien, Pauls, Peck, Peterson, Petty, Phillips, Powell, Proehl, Read, Rhoades, Rothlisberg, Rubin, Ryckman Jr., Ryckman Sr., Schroeder, Schwab, Schwartz, Seiwert, Shultz, Siegfreid, Suellentrop, Sutton, Swanson, Thimesch, Todd, Vickrey, Waymaster, Weber.
Nays: Ballard, Bollier, Bridges, Burroughs, Carlin, Clayton, Davis, Dillmore, Finney, Frownfelter, Henderson, Hill, Houston, Kuether, Lane, Lusk, Menghini, Perry, Rooker, Ruiz, Sloan, Sloop, Tietze, Trimmer, Victors, Ward, Weigel, Whipple, Wilson, Winn, Wolfe Moore.
Absent or not voting: Osterman, Sawyer.
The bill passed, as amended.
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