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On First to ‘worst’: Lowly TCU stuns Jayhawks


Richard Heckler 5 years, 3 months ago

Hey coach you cannot blame KU. You picked the players. Get over it.

windjammer 5 years, 3 months ago

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phoggyjay 5 years, 3 months ago

Where does Bill Self blame KU, merrill?

Richard Heckler 5 years, 3 months ago

“It’s the worst team Kansas has ever put on the floor since Dr. Naismith was here,” Self said

beerdrinkingfool 5 years, 3 months ago

glad we lost, now our ego will be in check and we will now put all into a win .

webmocker 5 years, 3 months ago

That is exactly what some people were saying after the Oklahoma State game.

leftylucky 5 years, 3 months ago

The curse of KU endowment and Rock chalk park.

jonas_opines 5 years, 3 months ago

This reminded me of the first half against the team we played after our first loss to Michigan State, but this time around there was no click and reversion to normal in the second half. I watched and couldn't see much but a head thing. Once the basket showed itself to be smaller for us, they just lost all of their confidence completely, tightened up, and it just fed off itself. I'd almost think Self would be better off giving the whole team a day off to clear their heads, have a team meeting without him maybe to talk about everything, and then move forward with a blank slate, season-starts-now mentality.

This is the same team that walked into Ohio State's gym and beat them. How they went from that to last night is pretty inexplicable, but the pieces are there still to win the rest of the games in our regular season if they just relax and get their heads screwed on straight. But that was, really, the worst performance I'd Ever seen a Kansas team give. Something like that can knock the wheels off an entire season if you let it.

Eric Ryan 5 years, 3 months ago

I'm going to put KU's offense on a milk carton. I think I last saw it in December, and that's long enough to warrant a search party.

Bill_T 5 years, 3 months ago

Perhaps coach Self should spend less time doing interviews wherein he extolls how brilliant he is as a coach and spend more time coaching the team.

just saying ...

Topple 5 years, 3 months ago

Doing interviews is part of his job.

Robert Holmes 5 years, 3 months ago

Just saying what? That Coach Self doesn't have the guys practice and spends his every waking moment doing interviews and boasts about himself only? You can't even laugh at how ridiculous the comment sounds.

BigAl 5 years, 3 months ago

I have never heard Bill Self "extoll how brilliant he is as a coach". Never. Ever.

irvan moore 5 years, 3 months ago

i think there's a lot of basketball left to play and i'm pretty sure we're gonna be on top at the end, best coach in the country

engagedecoy 5 years, 3 months ago

I see some punctuation errors and a few funky sounding sentences. Good job, LJWorld.

Steve Stucky 5 years, 3 months ago

North Carolina melt down, then Kentucky. Is it our turn?

Topple 5 years, 3 months ago

You forgot to include UCLA. Where have they been since the 2008 tournament?

Biscayne 5 years, 3 months ago

FREE STATE girls basketball team plays better than that!

Matthew Herbert 5 years, 3 months ago

To me, the low point of yesterday's game came with about one minute left to go in the game when a TCU player shot an airball at the free throw line. In all my years watching high school/college basketball I've never seen that happen at the free throw line. I'm embarassed for that kid, but mostly, I'm embarassed that the KU Jayhawks LOST to a team who pulled off that miraculous feat.

Tracy Rogers 5 years, 3 months ago

If you've never seen an airball at the free throw line you haven't seen very many games. That happens a lot more often than you think.

sinkorswim 5 years, 3 months ago

Hang in there, Jayhawks!! Great coach, great players...it'll all come back together. Go get the next one. Rock Chalk!! :-)

Jim Fisher 5 years, 3 months ago

There are a couple of previous coaches that would have pulled the starting five early in the first half. There is ready to play talent on that overfull bench, and there are some just happy to be there. One of my few criticisms of Coach: his rotation is too small . He owes no minutes to non-productive players, and there are guys sitting that want and need game exrerience. Why have those numbers if they can't contribute? Beyond the obvious of course. Starting Ellis was not the roster change anyone expected. Someone needs to lace his meals with some gunpowder.

jonas_opines 5 years, 3 months ago

Ellis had started to show improvement, all of which seemed to vanish last night. But damn, this was a like a whole-game depiction of all our potential flaws, all at once and drawn to an extreme caricature of what they even are typically. It's like they just felt doomed after 5 minutes when Nothing was going in, and so it just kept going.

Our soft play is a problem, and our home-loss to OSU was a real result of our problems as a team, but I can't help but look at this game, mostly, as a terrible anomaly.

Richard Benson 5 years, 3 months ago

If KU started three guys, Kevin Young should be one of them.

William Weissbeck 5 years, 3 months ago

I used to say the same thing about Roy - it's an inflexible offensive scheme. You can't play to a "hot hand" or exploit mismatches. Withey simply didn't take enough shots, and it's possible they couldn't have stopped him. (He shouldn't have cut his hair, either). Notice how we have had our guard defense exploited the last two games? Our offensive scheme tends not to do that. Liked the full court pressure. Never understood why teams with superior athletic talent don't do it all the time. Duke is the exception - they contest every in bound pass after made baskets.

introversion 5 years, 3 months ago

I love our team and I love our coach, however I find it a little troublesome that there are no quotes from him on his own shortcomings. He's part of the team too... If the team fails, that means that every individual who makes up the team fails. He can't just take credit when things go well and then spread it around when things go otherwise.

karmaking 5 years, 3 months ago

Some day in the near future when the suicide watch is lifted, jayhawk nation should realize life holds a few other worthy focuses. Maybe the play of 7 minority, out-of-state teenage adolescents shouldn't have such a profound effect on their lives, mood and morale. Try geting a hobby, or maybe work on the attitude. Just saying....

karmaking 5 years, 3 months ago

worse yet, you are in kansas, dorothy!

jayhawklawrence 5 years, 3 months ago

They were not inspired to play. In fact, they looked mentally exhausted.

I believe these guys will figure things out and when they do it will be about why they want to put on that jersey. I don't care if they win a championship as long as they can walk out of this University and know they have no regrets.

The game may make a lot of money but it is still only a game. Using this game to become the best that you can be with a bunch of guys you will remember for the rest of your life is real.

conlawgrad 5 years, 3 months ago

Where has Releford gone? I'm so confused as to why he doesn't shoot anymore. When he is shooting, he's most likely making shots yet we don't get it to him and he doesn't shoot it when he does have it. I think Releford is the key to this team along with Young and Withey.

Kent Noble 5 years, 3 months ago

I have never witnessed a worse loss in a Kansas uniform. It's not Bill Selfs fault, this team plays bad all the way around. Are defense and offense is terrible. If noticed we don't know where we are on the floor. Were really good about throwing the ball to the other team. Our best defensive player scored one point and Green scored 20 plus points. Jeff Withey to slow getting back on defense from the top of the key. There is no weak side help. EJ has not a clue what he's doing. Kevin Young can't make a basket right under neath the basket and he is 6'8. McLamore stands around waiting on the three ball. Nobody is moving without the ball. How many backdoor alley oops have seen lately. Nobody is crashing the boards for put back on the offensive end. I'm sure Bill Self taught these kids better than that. He deserves to say what he says about the herendous play. I'm sorry but are whole team looks like a beginning YMCA Youthball team right now. Coach Self can't get one on the floor during the game and walk these kids through the offense and defense. They need to wakeup and realize they aren't that good and just need to stay with the fundamentals and get back to the bascis of mental toughness!!!

blindrabbit 5 years, 3 months ago

Since attending my first KU basketball game in 1950 with my grandfather in Hoch Auditorium, I have never seen such a poor excuse as I observed last night in Ft. Worth. Poor coaching, poor execution, poor play selection, no floor leadership, lackadaisical/lackluster enthusiasm all with a team composed of 4 starting Seniors and a basketfull of supposed All-Americans. Understand the situation with EJ playing out of position and perhaps injured, but why continue to use hime in this role with a bench full of recruited point guards. How a team can go from decent play a couple of weeks ago to this disjointed mess falls on Bill Self's shoulders to fix.

trinity 5 years, 3 months ago

Two words-drug testing. I wish I were kidding. I meant to say-what else could possibly be causing this sluggish, lackadaisical play?? :(

caljhk 5 years, 3 months ago

West Virginia exposed the flaw in Self's offense so now everyone overplays the pass to the wing and our coach cannot seem to figure out that backdoor cuts to the basket will stop the overplay on the wing. . I cannot understand why KU players get so rattled when they are forced out of their comfort zone. Every other great program in the country does that automatically Coach needs to watch a few Duke and North Carolina games from the early 1990's. Dean and Coach K would have adjusted within minutes. I agree, too many magazine articles and interviews, hard to deliver when there is so much BS.

Gregory Newman 5 years, 3 months ago

im glad someone has been seeing what I've seen for years

Uhlrick_Hetfield_III 5 years, 3 months ago

II can remember when Roy would pull the whole starting 5 and put in his walk ons to get some energy going. It usually seemed to work.

BigAl 5 years, 3 months ago

And I can remember when Roy would NEVER call a time-out and end up losing games. Cost Kansas a Championship or two.

Fred Whitehead Jr. 5 years, 3 months ago

"First to worst"........"Lowly TCU"....says it all. KU is not "First"/ TCU is not "worst"

You so not know these things until the end of the season.

Which points out the main problem with this damned rating business.

The media says they are "Number one" and they get to thinking this. They get to thinking that TCU is a cakewalk, and they get their butts kicked. There is alesson to be learned here.

"First" and "Worst" is a bunch of crap. ANYONE can take hyou down at any given time.

Welcome to the real world.

CHEEZIT 5 years, 3 months ago

Checked the standings. Yep we are still in 1st!!!

William Weissbeck 5 years, 3 months ago

Look, it's clear that the team has issues and has some talent deficiencies. We aren't going to send 6 guys from this team to the NBA (like UK). We plan on coaching and mental toughness (and a good system) to overcome these (like Butler). I've watched this came for too long. I wonder why more teams don't adopt a Duke style offense - it works every year so long as they can hit just a modicum of 3's. Or why not the Michigan State defense - it works every year no matter the personnel. Roy's teams (the same at NC) and Bill's require a great deal of coaching, practice and team unity. Looks great when it works. Looks hopeless when a necessary cog is missing/misfiring. You can say this for Duke. Even when they lose, they never look bad. It's just their shots don't go in, but they always get the shots they want.

2002 5 years, 3 months ago

Hey genius, how did that brilliant Duke offense work in the game they lost by 27? It is common to have a dry stretch during a season and anyone that has followed this team must know that the PG position was weak this year.

William Weissbeck 5 years, 3 months ago

Curry went something like 1 for 10 from 3. As I said, they never look bad. Their shots just don't fall. But they always get the shots they want. Duke's weakness is that sometimes they depend too much on playing the head game. If their shots don't fall and the other team doesn't buy into the head games - Duke is mortal. But Duke never, ever struggles to get their shots. Coach K seems never to tell a player to stop shooting, even when they should be just tossing it up to the rim for one of the Plumlees.

jonas_opines 5 years, 3 months ago

We missed a ton of wide open looks from 3 last night.

Brian Conrad 5 years, 3 months ago

Miami killed Duke.. Duke will loose 3 times this year by 20+ get off the site Vitale

msezdsit 5 years, 3 months ago

While losing 2 in a row at kansas is rare, it doesn't mean the end. These guys only have to win the last 6 games and nothing else will be remembered. They will get it worked out. Even if they don't win the 10th straight big 12 title getting together for the last 6 is likely.

Hey guys, it stings a little but it really doesn't matter, just get back to work. Just as it was with sherron and taylor, we will either win or loose with Johnson. We don't have a better option and my bets are on Elijah being a winner. He was fabulous last year in the final 6 as a 2 gaurd and he is struggling with the point but I'm betting on him and so is Self!!! 2 games doesn't qualify the crybaby's on this forum. Get some posh puffs and blow your nose and grow up.

Alexander Smith 5 years, 3 months ago

LOL..this is so freaking funny. I am soo happy they got owned.

They deserve the loss for how big their egos have gotten.

KU gives these players the royal treatment and the players treat other students and staff like CRAP because they are B-Ball players. I know a student who basically DOES all of the homework for one of the players and was told that SHE had to do it. Hell, this poor student got pulled out of her plans to go to the book store and bring a players books to the gym because the POOR B-Player could not find the B-Store himself even though one of his clases was two blocks down.

Funny thing is, at the end of the semester the shrink wrap never left the books. KU does not give a crap about these kids, they use them to make millions upon millions and after 4 years. send them of with one of the worst educations ever.

Now many other schools follow the same model... its sad. I asked a recruiter for a major company out of NYC if they had two applicants with degrees and equal skill, one from a BIG 10 and the other BIG 12. He flat out said BIG 10..not that he is from a BIG 10 its that the BIG 10 puts out better quality students because they focus on quality education rather then pumping all their money into sports.

KEEP losing KU so you can fire that OVER PAID idiot of a coach. NO ONE at college level should be paid like him while students struggle and suffer...no wait. this is Kansas.. they do't give a damn about quality education.

colreader 5 years, 3 months ago

Film study: TCU game replay today (Thurs) @ noon CST on ESPNU.

who_said_it 5 years, 3 months ago

I would love to see KU run the floor more often, especially with our athletes. We've shown these last two games that our half-court offense is sub-par at best and predictable. But I guess that would all start with nutting up and boxing out / rebounding on the defensive end.

Gregory Newman 5 years, 3 months ago

I've been saying it all the time the guards need to punch on the gas and shoot mid-range 7-14. Its all about shooting in space uncontested. The opposing teams guards do it to them. I'm sick of these stupid drives all the way to the basket then to throw the ball away or stupid floaters. Also all of the guards bend at the back instead of bending at the knees. That makes for poor defense and cannot speed away from defenders.

That is why they can't get away from double teams and their bodys are all twisted up to get rid of the ball. There is also good coaching from the visitors bench. it ain't just the players fault. There are 5 coaches that played guard in college that is on that bench and Travis Ford and Fred Hoiberg was much better players than all of them.

Self always has several good pieces that makes it appear that he can coach but he and that bench of coaches are guard destroyers. That is why Marcus Smart went to OSU along with several other 5 star guards in the past 4-5 years. I whole-heartedly believe in whipping the ball around but when you see an open area on the floor mid-range punch on the gas to a spot then stop-pop-bang.

Plus no opposing coach is just going to allow Withey to beat them so they will double him. The only way to free Withey is the dribble drive to mid-range shooting in space uncontested. They choke them down then its lob city to all the Bigs.

If any one notices EJ, REL and Thorpe blows by their opponent then forces passes to Withey that are not there when they could pull-up and take the short uncontested jumper and not that silly floater or a bad pass throwing backwards not having a clue of where any of there teammates are. Or those pedestrian dribble drives under the basket to throw a bad cross court pass out of bounds.

EJ plays as if he doesn't want any responsibilty he just wants to shoot 3's. Now some of you BS worshipers are angry at me? But go down to Lawrence High and ask coach Dirk Wedd who was the original #23 that he played with that had a 40 inch vertical at 5-9 that shot the lights out at mid-range in 68-69 season. If you don't want to do that then go watch the guards of the KU 88 championship. If not that stay miserable.

BigAl 5 years, 3 months ago

Apparently you missed HCBS winning a National Championship in '08 and a return to the National Championship game last year. But you act as if folks should listen to you? Are you serious? And why would anyone care what Dirk Wedd says about KU basketball? Or someone he played with in 68-69? No sir, I will take my chances with Bill Self any day. He is one of the very best coaches in the country. I think Tyshawn Taylor and Mario Chalmers would argue your point about BS being a "guard destroyer". I think Brady Morningstar and Tyrell Reed would tell you that he built them into outstanding Division 1 guards and he definitely did not destroy them.

Gregory Newman 5 years, 3 months ago

Are you serious? Chalmer was saved by his dad and Taylor is still garbage and he can't get off the bench in Brooklyn. That 08 team was stacked but if UCLA doesn't lose 3 to the NBA KU does not win that Championship PERIOD. Morningstar and Tyrell PLEASE!!!! You thought they were good? BS made them designated 3 pointers. They both were good ball-handlers but under a Caliperi their game would have elevated. Brady at times when he took the initiative he had a great mid-range jumper but no BS wanted him to be just a facilitator. Tyrell was bullet fast he just never punched on the gas and I personally don't think if he did no one in the nation could guard him. If you could comprehend BS gets allot of pieces that makes it appear that he can coach but I understand that BS is your GOD. You don't have a clue. So continue to suffer thats your best chance.

Matthew Herbert 5 years, 3 months ago

"Taylor can't get off the bench in Brooklyn." He's "garbage".

Oh, that's right - he's in Brooklyn playing PROFESSIONAL basketball. Sitting the bench for a professional basketball team is more than 98% of college basketball point guards ever achieve. So, Taylor's riding the bench proves that perhaps instead of being in the top 1% of all players in the country, he might only be in the top 2%. I suppose you know more about basketball than the professional team that scouted and drafted him though. My mistake.

centrist1 5 years, 3 months ago

KU basketball players have been going down hill in the last 3 games something is wrong inside the team.......... maybe they need to do some serious drug testing on the players.... they have been acting and playing like they are on something........

BigAl 5 years, 3 months ago

Again, another poster that has already forgotten that Bill Self won a National Championship in '08 and was in the Championship Game last year. Right now, during ANOTHER rebuilding year, he is sitting at 19-3. The flat out ignorance demonstrated by some folks on this forum absolutely amaze me.

jonas_opines 5 years, 3 months ago

He thinks Andrew White should be our new point guard, starting yesterday.

Regardless, I think there is a tiny bit of truth. I think that Self tried to embarrass the guys, Johnson in particular, to make them angry, and this isn't really one of our teams that ultimately gets that angry. Instead, they lost confidence. That was kind of what I saw last night, was a team with Loser stuck in their minds, and it tightened them up, and hurt everything that they did. It was the same thing after the MSU game, against Chatanooga, for the first half. They played horrible. That game after half they had kind of a snap, and then they cruised by everybody they played for a solid month. Didn't happen this time around. Which is problematic, because if we were going to snap into our ability and style of play, the best team on our slate was the one that we played last night. It's sure as hell not going to get any easier for a while to come.

Matthew Herbert 5 years, 3 months ago

agreed. Coach Self lost at home for the 2nd time in 103 games. That's over 98% w/l record at home. Go out and find me ANY other coach with those numbers.

hip_gma 5 years, 3 months ago

Good Lord people. This isn't the end of the world. We're so spoiled, thinking we will and should win every game. I'm sure you have your "A game" every single day at work.

Liberty275 5 years, 3 months ago

Maybe this is a hint why they won't play WSU.

Don Whiteley 5 years, 3 months ago

Just puts KU where they've belonged all year...in the second 10 or lower.

handlon 5 years, 3 months ago

What's the problem at the top Larryville? A little bad Karma for BS?

Gregory Newman 5 years, 3 months ago

you will win that bet i will leave you alone

Richard Heckler 5 years, 3 months ago

It's only a basketball game and all will work out. Coach and the team have been asleep at the wheel these last two games.

The alarm went off = all are awake now. Let's get on with it.

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